Engaging? Hell, they were the ones who began the whole debacle by poking at the competitor across the street and ranting on their wall.

They removed all referencing posts to that, and mine. That's a big no-no in social marketing/media...

 

Within the first few weeks of getting a Facebook page, my girlfriend asked via their Wall if they got their meat locally. It was deleted within an hour. We ended up going to the restaurant anyways. We asked our server we were told all meat came from Eckerlin. Why would they not want to promote this fact?

 

Maybe it's because we can head over to Findlay Market and find out much less we could be pay for an all-beef hotdog...

Their "Korean" hot-dog, while it sells for $10, costs only $1.50 to make...

That's what it all comes back to.. you're just still angry about the "racist" hot dog, Sherman!

 

Anyways, on street dining like they had is an excellent urban feature, and Cincinnati should make an effort to make it easier for restaurants to have it.  It’s difficult now because of an abundance of narrow sidewalks, but a variance issued here or there would be fine by me.

:D

They recently completed some new streetscaping in Ft. Thomas, near the fort itself, and in front of some of the restaurants they bumped out the curb to provide enough room for some sidewalk dining.  That eliminates one or two parking spaces, but leaves enough room to put some buffer planting boxes or some such between the tables and the road.  It seems like a nice solution.

I don't understand why you find that offensive Sherman.  I don't get offended when someone calls me an American, and if I went overseas and saw a cheeseburger on the menu named "The American" I would also not be offended.

Their "Korean" hot-dog, while it sells for $10, costs only $1.50 to make

They could give you an itemized bill at the end of your diner that looks like

 

Hot Dog -1.50

Rent-1.00

Insurance-.50

Build out-4.00

Carrying cost on working cap loan-3.00

 

Total-10.00

Tip____________

 

So really he almost lost money on selling you that hot dog.

 

Randy, it was a joke. Good god.

 

Re Michael: I could see that, but that would mean that every other hot dog stand and venue would be charging inflated prices. It would be like opening a bar on Main Street and selling $6 OTR's or $10 Bourbon Barrel Ales (which one downtown location did for a short while -- not sure where that went), and saying it is because of the costs of renovation, cost of living, et. al. I think that increased competition on all price points, such as the opening of the diner, would help drive down prices elsewhere (Lavomatic, Senate) and increase affordability.

hehe.  the sherman, randy feud continues.  and i sit back and watch.  :evil:

Re Michael: I could see that, but that would mean that every other hot dog stand and venue would be charging inflated prices. It would be like opening a bar on Main Street and selling $6 OTR's or $10 Bourbon Barrel Ales (which one downtown location did for a short while -- not sure where that went), and saying it is because of the costs of renovation, cost of living, et. al. I think that increased competition on all price points, such as the opening of the diner, would help drive down prices elsewhere (Lavomatic, Senate) and increase affordability.

 

I don't believe hot dog carts have build out costs or carrying costs on working cap loans to deal with, but I could be wrong.  I would also assume the rent is very different.

 

In Denver I paid $4.50 for hot dogs from Biker Jim's Dogs.  It's a gourmet hot dog cart in downtown Denver.  So he's still charging $4.50 for his dogs even though he lacks the aforementioned costs.

 

With that said, I don't pretend for a second to know what Senate's business model is, so I'll leave that to them.  So far the prices don't seem to be keeping people away.

If you think $10 for a hot dog "is a bit much," folks need to go to the Shake Shack in New York for a reality check.

I shouldn't have been specific to hot dog venues, but restaurants in general. Selling a cheap item at very high prices, and justifying it via high rent costs and so forth, is not a sustainable long-term business policy. At some point, the price points will become trade-offs once competition arrives, and thus the price points will need to be lowered.

 

Lavomatic used to charge far higher prices for some of their menu items, but after their menu was redesigned, many of the price points were lowered. I am not sure if that is because Senate was opening across the street, or if they switched to cheaper food products, or realized they were not going to simply survive. Remember that they eliminated their lunch dining at one point -- a bad sign.

 

I'll be looking forward to the diner opening on 12th and seeing what that does to the other restaurants.

I went to Papaya Dog down the block from my office in NYC for lunch yesterday, had two dogs, fries, and a soda for $5.

 

What exactly is on the Korean Dog anyways?

Kimichi, braised short rib, and some other shit worth more than $1.50.

 

I wouldn't exactly compare Papaya Dog (or any of the Papayas) to the Senate.  It's like me comparing Crown on Fulton and Marcy to Montgomery Inn.  Same basic shit, different quality.

Kimichi, braised short rib, and some other sh!t worth more than $1.50.

 

I wouldn't exactly compare Papaya Dog (or any of the Papayas) to the Senate.  It's like me comparing Crown on Fulton and Marcy to Montgomery Inn.  Same basic sh!t, different quality.

 

Sometimes I find it's less about different quality than it is about different atmosphere.  Papaya Dog doesn't exactly make that case either though...

 

On a side note I have a gallon jug of kimchi, some pork belly, and a Korean girlfriend at home, I know what I'm doing for dinner.

If you think $10 for a hot dog "is a bit much," folks need to go to the Shake Shack in New York for a reality check.

 

I don't really consider anything NYC related to be "reality."

On a side note I have a gallon jug of kimchi, some pork belly, and a Korean girlfriend at home, I know what I'm doing for dinner.

 

LOL!!! I think I'm offended. :D

^Try Europe, Buenos Aires, Sao Paulo, Japan, Australia, Toronto, or even Dubai then LOL!

Kimichi, braised short rib, and some other sh!t worth more than $1.50.

 

$1.50 when you account for how much they put on. I cooked a dog, sourced the ingredients from my mum (sans the bun), and calculated the cost. Kimchi isn't all that expensive -- especially for the mild version that they use. That particular dog uses kimchi, braised short rib, pickled cucumber, brioche bun.

And you think short rib is cheap?!?!  I WISH I could get short rib for $1.50 itself!

What does sourcing ingredients from your mom mean?

That sounds porno-ish.  Much like the "doing the Korean girlfriend" thing with kimichi.

 

I ain't trustin' a damn ingredient from anybody unless it's from a Jungle.

 

You aren't eating an entire pound of short rib there. That's around $3 at our local butcher.

 

@Randy: She's Korean and when we went grocery shopping in Columbus a few weeks ago, we went over the ingredients and I got the prices down for what is used for this particular dog. I purchased whatever we didn't have at home, used what they had used, and cooked it on a grill. Considering how much they had put on my dog (which actually wasn't that much), I estimated it to cost no more than $1.50. The pickled cucumber is super cheap, kimchi isn't expensive, and the bun -- which I couldn't find since I didn't find any open French bakeries (and didn't want to drive all over the city for it) wouldn't add $8.50 to the price.

If you don't think you are getting food and service commensurate with the price at a given establishment, the proper recourse is to not return to the establishment -- not go online and bash their business model or criticize the establishment and the sustainability of their business. 

 

I suspect from the amazing business the Senate has been doing since it opened nearly 6 months ago, a lot of people disagree with your assessment of the relative costs and benefits of eating there.

 

Why don't we move on now...

*ahem*

http://urbanup.net/index.php?q=blog&id=139

I just want Hot Doggin' It on Montgomery Road in Fields Ertel to open a downtown location!  Cheap, good Chicago style hot dogs.

We are going there for lunch tomorrow. You should travel up with us -- carpool!

On a completely different subject, does anyone know when the Mercer Commons construction will begin? 

I hate to be a Debbie Downer but maybe this Korean porno hot dog conversation could be continued in the Restaurants thread?

 

Or maybe Senate needs its own thread. Lord.

I hate to be a Debbie Downer but maybe this Korean porno hot dog conversation could be continued in the Restaurants thread?

 

Or maybe Senate needs its own thread. Lord.

 

I don't see why we don't just make a Korean porno hot dog thread?

I just want Hot Doggin' It on Montgomery Road in Fields Ertel to open a downtown location! Cheap, good Chicago style hot dogs.

 

They wouldn't happen to have italian beef sandwiches as well, would they?

I've been wondering about Mercer as well.  There really hasn't been any news on it that I am aware of other than the preservation grants last December and the loose renderings that came out in April.  I also would have thought the Cincinnati Color Building would be underway by now.

I believe construction on Mercer is scheduled to start in the spring and finish in the spring of 2012.

Good to see 3CDC working on Race and 14th now.  Both Saenger Hall (east side) and the west side of the street.  Saenger is a pretty large project.  Also the Lackman Bar has had people working there for a while.  The bar is beiong constructed.

 

Also was a sign guy measuring windows next to Senate for something...pizza place is going into the old Lucky Step....Tavola Mangia or something like that. Used to do pizza nights at Take the cake.

 

those are your gateway Q tidbits of the day.

I just want Hot Doggin' It on Montgomery Road in Fields Ertel to open a downtown location! Cheap, good Chicago style hot dogs.

 

They wouldn't happen to have italian beef sandwiches as well, would they?

 

Yes, they do.

I shouldn't have been specific to hot dog venues, but restaurants in general. Selling a cheap item at very high prices, and justifying it via high rent costs and so forth, is not a sustainable long-term business policy. At some point, the price points will become trade-offs once competition arrives, and thus the price points will need to be lowered.

 

Lavomatic used to charge far higher prices for some of their menu items, but after their menu was redesigned, many of the price points were lowered. I am not sure if that is because Senate was opening across the street, or if they switched to cheaper food products, or realized they were not going to simply survive. Remember that they eliminated their lunch dining at one point -- a bad sign.

 

I'll be looking forward to the diner opening on 12th and seeing what that does to the other restaurants.

The Senate claimed 4 feet, or 50 inches, before they erased their posts off of the Facebook wall. That puts it below the recommended and above the minimum. Codes requires anything over 4 feet. From what I wrote:

 

"I assumed that you had applied for a Revocable Street Privilege for sidewalk encroachment, per Sec. 718-1-R and Sec. 723-6, and that you believed it was in compliance with Sec. 723-14. Was the fire escape that runs between the Senate and the vacant space next to it blocked? Was there any utility boxes, meters, lighting equipment and so forth in the utility strip? There are a lot of unanswered questions, which is why I believe there is more to it than just a competitor."

 

I know that their original patio space was half the width it once was, which would have provided 4 feet of space between the patio and the utility strip -- which isn't considered part of the path-of-travel. When they decided to double the size of the patio and force the users of the sidewalk to squeeze onto a utility strip, which is shared with street lights, parking meters and other obstacles, they ran afoul of the permit and it was revoked.

 

They were on Channel 12 today, and admitted that they had expanded their sidewalk past the original permit guidelines, which left less than the 5 feet minimum that the city requires. They cited other restaurants that did this, but didn't provide examples (at least online).

another example of over regulation.  accessibility is important.  yes.  but so is creating a lively urban atmosphere.  my father commented on how he wanted to go to Senate because of the outdoor seating he saw as he drove by.  He said it reminded him of Boston where he just was.  My father lives in Harrison, Ohio and is more or less a country boy at heart.  And it caught his eye. 

Be that as it may, I don't think requiring a clear sidewalk path to be maintained is "over regulation."  It's a common sense thing, but obviously if people (i.e. restaurant owners) exercised common sense in the first place, then such regulations wouldn't be needed. 

They have the outdoor dining today, just not out quite as far.  Works fine.

One of the most insightful things Christopher Hitchens ever said was, “The four most over-rated things in life are champagne, lobster, anal sex and picnics.”  I include outdoor eating under picnics.

One of the most insightful things Christopher Hitchens ever said was, The four most over-rated things in life are champagne, lobster, anal sex and picnics.  I include outdoor eating under picnics.

 

balderdash.  he's clearly never bottomed. 

...

This discussion of Senate has taken a strange turn....

One of the most insightful things Christopher Hitchens ever said was, The four most over-rated things in life are champagne, lobster, anal sex and picnics. I include outdoor eating under picnics.

 

balderdash. he's clearly never bottomed.

 

I just looked at your avatar in new and disturbing ways.

One of the most insightful things Christopher Hitchens ever said was, The four most over-rated things in life are champagne, lobster, anal sex and picnics.  I include outdoor eating under picnics.

 

balderdash.  he's clearly never bottomed. 

 

I just looked at your avatar in new and disturbing ways.

 

hehe.  and get back to me on fb fool.  i feel like i'll be seeing you soon but I can't remember. 

FYI.  3CDC's 2010 Annual Progress Report is now available on its website. 

 

http://www.3cdc.org/images/editor/2010%20Annual%20Report%20Final%20-%20website.pdf

As a new owner of the last unit available on Dandridge street, I'd like to announce that Dandridge Studio Townhomes are now completely sold out!!!

 

I look forward to seeing you guys around and discussing more about what the city is doing and what I can do to help!

 

:clap: :wave:

Congrats and enjoy. Those units had a bumpy ride. Nice to hear they're finished. Can't believe I'm going to nitpick this, but those aren't in the Gateway Quarter. ;-)

As a new owner of the last unit available on Dandridge street, I'd like to announce that Dandridge Studio Townhomes are now completely sold out!!!

 

I look forward to seeing you guys around and discussing more about what the city is doing and what I can do to help!

 

:clap: :wave:

 

Welcome!