Nowhere close to being saturated.  There are still insanely long waits at all of the restaurants.

Yeah, when a restaurant has a two hour wait on a typical Wednesday evening, the need for far more supply is there. There are a lot, sure, but there are also a lot of people who live within close proximity and frequent these places, tens of thousands of workers nearby who go out after work (something this city hasn't seen much of until recent  years), and then anyone who comes down from other neighborhoods which is increasing as time goes by.

 

Taft's Ale House is a prime example. If the market was saturated an establishment of this scale would often feel empty since there wouldn't be enough demand for it. I've been twice, both on weekdays, and it was packed. The second time we had to wait for a table of four to open up. This weekend the amount of people spilling out onto the sidewalk made Race Street suddenly feel infinitely more alive.

 

The source of all these people is the constant influx of residents and workers into OTR which isn't slowing down at all. In fact the rate at which new projects are being announced is bigger than ever. In a handful of months we had something like 200 million dollars worth of projects announced that will bring hundreds of new residents and tens of thousands of square feet of office space to OTR. Even if just ten percent of these people in these new spaces go out on a given night that's still going to be an extra 200+ people every night, or enough to fill 3-5 OTR bars/restaurants. Things are just getting started. It's very likely that one day, maybe ten or so years from now, you will be able to bar hop from Central Parkway and Vine all the way up to the five way intersection at Vine and McMicken. And it's going to be glorious.

Nowhere close to being saturated.  There are still insanely long waits at all of the restaurants.

 

Especially considering that many of the new developments in OTR will contain office space. All those workers need places to go for lunch and a happy hour after work. OTR can easily support 2x the current number of bars and restaurants with the just the current number of residents and visitors. As long as they continue to be high quality, I have no problem with the continued explosion of new places in OTR.

One thing to remember about all the places in OTR is that while there are a great number of them, their seating capacity is in most cases very limited.  Taft is obviously very large, and The Mercer, Zula, and Kaze seem pretty sizable to me.  Everything else is pretty darn small.  I don't know how to do an apples-to-apples comparison, but it sure feels like you could fit The Eagle, Salazar, Pontiac, Quan Hapa, and Bakersfield inside, say, Yard House. 

^Best method is to look at their fire capacity. Most places try to maximize seating so that number, displayed by the entry of every venue, will give you a general idea of the capacity of a restaurant or bar.

 

I think your estimate seems fairly accurate. Yard House is gigantic. And that's the benefit of the small places in OTR. They don't need many people to fill them and to therefore operate profitably. It's a lot harder for a gigantic place to feel full or do proper business during slow periods because there just might not be enough demand to fill the place yet they still have to pay the same rent, higher utilities, etc.

One thing to remember about all the places in OTR is that while there are a great number of them, their seating capacity is in most cases very limited.  Taft is obviously very large, and The Mercer, Zula, and Kaze seem pretty sizable to me.  Everything else is pretty darn small.  I don't know how to do an apples-to-apples comparison, but it sure feels like you could fit The Eagle, Salazar, Pontiac, Quan Hapa, and Bakersfield inside, say, Yard House. 

 

Not only that, but when the owners of these restaurants have the ability to expand, they usually opt to open a second restaurant rather than expanding their first one. When the owners of Senate got the retail space right next door, they could have easily expanded Senate's dining room, but instead they opened Abigail Street. Bakersfield could have expanded into the old Lavomatic space, but they opened Kruger's instead. So it makes it sound like OTR has all of these new places opening up, but each one might only hold 50 diners at a time.

Yes I don't think there will be any issues with over saturation.  I have gone down to OTR 3 times in the last 2 months for dinner with my girlfriend and all waits are over 3 hours at every single restaurant.  All 3 times we went back to Mt. Lookout for Sushi.  Not that we weren't willing to wait, but we were starving and we weren't drinking those nights so we didn't want to stick around and drink.

 

Some restaurants will come and go but I think easily you can add many more.  Once the Streetcar is running look out, demand will be even greater.

 

I think people also need to remember that there is a tourism factor as well.  My friends and I just returned from St. Louis for a bachelor party and we were downtown.  They have a new area called Ballpark Village around the new Busch Stadium.  Probably similar to The Banks but it is on a much bigger scale, with an atrium like opening and bars throughout on the inside.  Things like the Banks and Ballpark Village draw in people from all over the region and beyond.  I am not certain what the tourism numbers are like for Cincinnati but with the completion of new hotels, continued construction of new bars and restaurants, big companies moving downtown like GE, the numbers should continue to rise.  With tourism rising and the number of permanent residents rising, I don't think it will hit a saturation point at any time soon.

Eli's at the market has been the biggest disappointment.  Virtually 0 signage, they always look closed, and they are carryout only. 

Eli's at the market has been the biggest disappointment.  Virtually 0 signage, they always look closed, and they are carryout only.

 

Last I remembered they had a picnic table set up inside. Me and my buddies were allowed to eat inside, but I guess there other locations has waiters that bring it out to you?

 

That said it's only 1 picnic table, and the other 2 outside are usually occupied...

I think comparing the total seating capacity of all OTR restaurants versus, say, the Smith-Edwards interchange might find that there are significantly fewer seats in the supposedly red-hot OTR restaurant scene than there are within sight of several suburban exit ramps.   

I think comparing the total seating capacity of all OTR restaurants versus, say, the Smith-Edwards interchange might find that there are significantly fewer seats in the supposedly red-hot OTR restaurant scene than there are within sight of several suburban exit ramps.   

 

Yeah, good point. Think about how many restaurants there are within a 10 minute drive of the Fields Ertel interchange on I-71. All of OTR is probably a fraction of that.

My guess is they're carry-out only so they could avoid having a bathroom for patrons.  While the "lobby" looks pretty big and empty, once you cram in an accessible bathroom there's not much space left for ordering and dining.  It is kind of an annoying catch-22, but I'm not surprised they went this way.

Eli's at the market has been the biggest disappointment.  Virtually 0 signage, they always look closed, and they are carryout only. 

 

+1.  At the very least, you think they could install a sign announcing who and what they are.  I think Eli got a little arrogant and just assumed he would be wildly successful wherever he opened up shop.  I found it odd that 3CDC backed out of their deal with him to open a spot on Vine St, but after seeing how the operation is run at Findlay, I think they might have been smart.  Eli's has good BBQ, but good only gets you so far.  The location out in the East End has some inside seating and the record collection/player to create a little bit of ambiance.  They also have all the picnic tables and given the location by the river, it feels like you're at a family BBQ but with strangers when you go.  The Findlay Market location obviously doesn't have these assets available, but it has the potential to create a unique and memorable experience as well, but it largely falls completely flat.  I hope they up their game and soon.  I thought their opening would be a real watershed moment for the Findlay Market area, but so far that has not been the case.

I heard Elias pulled out of the 3CDC building on Vine. He said that he didn't want to rush into something IIRC

What's pretty awesome about this OTR restaurant scene is its creating an environment that's much more like a bigger city on a small scale where many small restaurants are being opened with unique concepts as opposed to larger restaurants with more bland concepts are opening.  Its really cool and allowing for a real "food scene" to open up in Cincinnati - its small scale now, but the growth potential is astronomical as is the effect on local tastes.

 

At its end game such a foodie scene turns into this (West Loop pretty much being OTR scaled up to Chicago):

 

http://chicago.eater.com/2015/4/15/8393037/au-cheval-burger-week-the-hot-dish#4716834

I am still holding out for OTR to feature, "fine dining" restaurants and steakhouses in the future as well.

 

I imagine it will take many mores year of redevelopment for a person like, say, Jeff Ruby to open up a upscale top dining steak house in OTR.

 

Which isn't an issue, because the current selection is more than fine. But the fact that most of the restaurants don't take reservations, and include 2-3+ hours average waiting times is ridiculous. I understand why they do it, but it's still frustrating. Especially since there's nothing to really do in OTR, besides walk around the block a few times to pass the time.

 

And I know there a few resturaunts in OTR that do take reservations, but even then you have to reserve quite a time in advance. So it would definitely be nice to have a fine dining place in OTR, especially the view of the old historic buildings is so much more attractive than a parking lot.

I am still holding out for OTR to feature, "fine dining" restaurants and steakhouses in the future as well.

 

I imagine it will take many mores year of redevelopment for a person like, say, Jeff Ruby to open up a upscale top dining steak house in OTR.

 

Which isn't an issue, because the current selection is more than fine. But the fact that most of the restaurants don't take reservations, and include 2-3+ hours average waiting times is ridiculous. I understand why they do it, but it's still frustrating. Especially since there's nothing to really do in OTR, besides walk around the block a few times to pass the time.

 

And I know there a few resturaunts in OTR that do take reservations, but even then you have to reserve quite a time in advance. So it would definitely be nice to have a fine dining place in OTR, especially the view of the old historic buildings is so much more attractive than a parking lot.

 

I kind of Consider Salzar - http://salazarcincinnati.com/ and The Mercer http://www.themercerotr.com/ to pretty much already fit that mold.

I kind of Consider Salzar - http://salazarcincinnati.com/ and The Mercer http://www.themercerotr.com/ to pretty much already fit that mold.

 

The fine dining part, yes. Not the steakhouse part though.

 

I'm referring to fine dining steak houses that you'll see in the suburbs like Eddie Merlots, Tony's, Carlo and Johnny, etc. I know these are generally LARGE restaurants, and pricey as well. I had a friend who came down from chicago, and really wanted to check out OTR. He's a big carnivore type of guy, but when he found out there were no steakhouses in OTR, he thought it was a huge shame since the atmosphere in OTR was perfect for it.

 

The customers are there. Most people who eat at OTR are generally middle class, to upper class wealthy suburbans anyways.

 

I'm guessing it's maybe a square footage issue? Most of the resturaunts in OTR are fairly small...and places like Carlo and Johnny, Eddie Merlots, and Tony's are fairly large buildings with seating for well over 60+

I think it's an atmosphere problem honestly. Look at most of the places in OTR. They're active, loud, energetic places generally. People at the bar, standing around with drinks until they have an available table, communal seating, etc. Not steakhouse type places. I think OTR COULD support a steakhouse, but I think they're better suited for Downtown honestly. Which is where they already exist.

I kind of Consider Salzar - http://salazarcincinnati.com/ and The Mercer http://www.themercerotr.com/ to pretty much already fit that mold.

 

The fine dining part, yes. Not the steakhouse part though.

 

You might not have to wait too long. I happen to know that a very popular local restaurant group is considering an upscale steakhouse on Vine Street.

Interesting. Any comment on location on Vine? I can think of one specific space that's yet unfinished that could definitely house a pretty swanky joint like a steakhouse.

I can't give an address, but I can say it may be underground...

I can't give an address, but I can say it may be underground...

 

You can't possibly be suggesting that there will be a Steak House in one of the underground tunnels...unless underground refers to something else.

Then we're speaking of the same space haha. That would honestly be a perfect fit for that space.

 

There's a sub basement under Cintrifuse that is indeed one of the lagering tunnels.

Correct me if I'm wrong but this should be the current list of new resturaunts/bars coming in OTR in Spring/Summer 2015...

 

Low Spark-Bar-15 W. 14th Street

 

16 Bit Retro Arcade-Bar-1331 Walnut St. in the first floor of Mercer Commons

 

ZBGB Zula Gourmet Burger and Bar-Resturaunt/Bar-1438 Race St.

 

Picnic and Pantry-Carryout/Self Service-1400 Republic Street

 

Nation-Resturaunt/Bar-

 

 

If I'm missing any let me know

 

 

 

It never fails to amaze me how resilient the development of downtown/OTR seems to be to saturation. People keep coming out of the woodwork.

 

I just got back in to town on Saturday after a red-eye flight from Portland. After sleeping for about 7 hours, my girlfriend and I decided to head downtown to Taft's Ale House for dinner since neither of us had a chance to go yet. I'll also note that it was an absolute perfect night weather-wise.

 

We got down there around 10 PM and headed up to the second floor of Taft, where we were told they were no-longer serving food. Bummer. No worries, as we decided to just hit up one of the tried-and-true establishments. As we were walking south from Taft's on Race, I was amazed at how many people were out and about on the street. There's been some pretty good renovations around Taft and on the streetcar line over the last year or so, but still, a heavy crowd.

 

It impressed me more as the night went on because everywhere we went, you name the place, it was packed. All the restaurants and bars on Vine were bursting at the seams (we eventually settled down at Abigail St). Same story on Main St as we walked there later. Same story again as we went to meet up with some friends on Walnut St by Aronoff. We've barely scratched the surface of nice weather and already the city feels so alive.

 

I have often wondered the same thing about saturation. But each time I wonder, I look around and realize there are few signs that anyone is getting stretched thin by the development. There's plenty of room for growth.

 

Also, my totally uneducated prediction for 2015: The Year of Race. I think we'll be hearing about far more projects up and down that entire corridor. Especially near-north of Tafts and near the new dunnhumby Center.

I like your prediction and agree with it. And not just because that means my condo across from Taft's will go up in value haha.

 

Race Street offers a nice mix of the business corridor at some spots and the more residential corridor in others. It's a nice mix that has been really pleasant to live with.

 

This weekend was insane in terms of how many people were out and about. Friday and Saturday were packed with people.

It looks like the crack bar at 1132 Race may have closed a couple of weeks ago as well.  If it has truly closed and someone buys up and rehabs the property there it would greatly enhance the Race Street corridor all the way down to Central Parkway *fingers crossed*.

I don't think 1132 is closed. I'm pretty sure it was open about a week ago. It usually closes in the evening.

 

And the owner is pretty adamant about staying open and not selling.

I kind of Consider Salzar - http://salazarcincinnati.com/ and The Mercer http://www.themercerotr.com/ to pretty much already fit that mold.

 

The fine dining part, yes. Not the steakhouse part though.

 

I'm referring to fine dining steak houses that you'll see in the suburbs like Eddie Merlots, Tony's, Carlo and Johnny, etc. I know these are generally LARGE restaurants, and pricey as well. I had a friend who came down from chicago, and really wanted to check out OTR. He's a big carnivore type of guy, but when he found out there were no steakhouses in OTR, he thought it was a huge shame since the atmosphere in OTR was perfect for it.

 

The customers are there. Most people who eat at OTR are generally middle class, to upper class wealthy suburbans anyways.

 

I'm guessing it's maybe a square footage issue? Most of the resturaunts in OTR are fairly small...and places like Carlo and Johnny, Eddie Merlots, and Tony's are fairly large buildings with seating for well over 60+

 

You have to remember, too, that within a mile of OTR (really less for most of them) there are steakhouses as good (or really, IMO, better than) as the ones you are mentioning.  Downtown has Jeff Ruby's, Prime 47, Morton's, Ruth Chris, and Jimmy G's already. 

^ Thanks - much appreciated.

 

I'm getting a little further out of my element here. I'm not a designer. I've just noticed more of it, along with other things like vinyl composition tile (think checkerboard pattern flooring in lots of different colors), and painted glass for backsplashes and other surfaces. And you can readily buy interesting stuff like ribbed metal edging for Formica countertops. Whereas 5 years ago I think if you'd asked, I'd have wondered if Formica was still making laminates. The tie in with the other elements I was mentioning is that they're all relatively cheap and - maybe it isn't the right word - overvalued.

 

But that's just me and it's just a guess. Personally I like it and think potential renters would too; my wife disagrees!

 

Jim, did you look into the state historic tax credits?  For fun I filled out the application's self-score sheet using the information you've provided and it looks like your project would score somewhere in the 55-60 point out of 100 range assuming you have all financing in place.  I have no idea what the threshold is for winners since the respective scores of winning projects aren't listed in news releases.  The scoring metric gives overwhelming favor to these factors:

 

1. completely vacant properties

2. proof of 100% financing in place

3. the larger the vacant building, the better.  Only 1 point awarded for buildings under 10,000 sq feet vs 10 points for 120,000 sq feet. 

4. Poorest Ohio counties that have received the fewest historic tax credits in previous award routnds

 

So a huge building in a poor rural county (how many of these are there?) is a shoo-in for getting the credits.  3CDC has increased its odds for getting the credits by creating large buildings from various individual buildings ala Parvis and Westfallen.  But the nature of the program generally favors established real estate professionals with deep pockets over first-time rehabbers.  For example, single-family homes are not eligible for the program at all.  So it's great for companies redeveloping SCPA or the Baldwin Building but the little guy is going to struggle. 

 

 

 

 

You can re-edit it jmicha[/member]. I just moved it to the non-3CDC thread.

Jake you have an interesting idea of fun [emoji12]

 

We submitted for the current round. The building self scores a 72+ and last round the small projects category needed a 68 to win. This round is the biggest yet so it will be more competitive.

 

I am not certain that single family is excluded. There is a special category where they give out 2-3 million for projects requesting less than 250K. I thought those could be single family.

 

Some might not know that the state credits are given to you in the year after your rehab is done and certified. So if you certified for 50K in credits and you owed $5K in Ohio taxes they'll send you a check for $45K. That's right! No wonder the program is getting more popular.

The information on the website FAQ might be out-of-date regarding the eligibility of single-families.  I printed out the round 14 paperwork but didn't look through it in detail.  So we're in year 7 of the program but many of those were deep recession years when cash and financing were hard to find, and if you had either, there were even bigger deals in every direction with a much faster payback. 

 

So are you going to go ahead with construction or are you waiting to see if you won the award?

It never fails to amaze me how resilient the development of downtown/OTR seems to be to saturation. People keep coming out of the woodwork.

 

I just got back in to town on Saturday after a red-eye flight from Portland. After sleeping for about 7 hours, my girlfriend and I decided to head downtown to Taft's Ale House for dinner since neither of us had a chance to go yet. I'll also note that it was an absolute perfect night weather-wise.

 

We got down there around 10 PM and headed up to the second floor of Taft, where we were told they were no-longer serving food. Bummer. No worries, as we decided to just hit up one of the tried-and-true establishments. As we were walking south from Taft's on Race, I was amazed at how many people were out and about on the street. There's been some pretty good renovations around Taft and on the streetcar line over the last year or so, but still, a heavy crowd.

 

It impressed me more as the night went on because everywhere we went, you name the place, it was packed. All the restaurants and bars on Vine were bursting at the seams (we eventually settled down at Abigail St). Same story on Main St as we walked there later. Same story again as we went to meet up with some friends on Walnut St by Aronoff. We've barely scratched the surface of nice weather and already the city feels so alive.

 

I have often wondered the same thing about saturation. But each time I wonder, I look around and realize there are few signs that anyone is getting stretched thin by the development. There's plenty of room for growth.

 

Also, my totally uneducated prediction for 2015: The Year of Race. I think we'll be hearing about far more projects up and down that entire corridor. Especially near-north of Tafts and near the new dunnhumby Center.

 

I have thought a lot about this as well and I think there are two things going on here: One, they aren't adding housing units as fast as they could to meet demand. (Some back-of-the-napkin math shows that if the center city absorbed just 5% of Greater Cincinnati growth every year, that's still 650 people a year, and 3CDC has only developed about 500 units TOTAL since 2004. This doesn't even consider existing Cincinnatians looking to move downtown.) Two: All of these new restaurants and businesses are small. Example: Senate has about 14 tables. A PF Changs has up to 75. This is a comparison of the extremes, but it still gives some perspective on the numbers.

 

It looks like the crack bar at 1132 Race may have closed a couple of weeks ago as well.  If it has truly closed and someone buys up and rehabs the property there it would greatly enhance the Race Street corridor all the way down to Central Parkway *fingers crossed*.

A freind of mine was in 1132 two weeks ago and a woman started cursing at the owner, calling him all kinds of nasty names. He replied that he's 82, and for 50 years he gives them a warm place at 5am in the winter, works hard everyday, and for what!?!?. He threw down his dish towel and said "I'm done". And the next day he didn't open.  And he hasn't been back since.

 

But see his brother retired in the 90's and died a week later. Carl believes if he retires, he dies. So ....he may reopen.

 

But notice the drug dealing continues on the north side of 12th day and night, bar or no bar...

Does anyone know when the Ziegler park renovation is supposed to take place? On 3CDC website, it says 2015, but I don't think they've really shared much detail on when it's supposed to take place and what exactly they plan on doing.....

 

Apparently the entire refurbishment of that park will cost 25 million, which seems incredibly alot for that small space, so I'm really curious what there plans are? Will it just be for the park, or will it be for the surrounding area of Ziegler park as well..otherwise 25 million for that small area just seems insane.

But notice the drug dealing continues on the north side of 12th day and night, bar or no bar...

 

That bar has been a focal point for drug dealing in the area for decades, so the area isn't likely to get cleaned up for at least a little while.  Certainly if a more responsible owner rehabs the building, puts in better lighting and doesn't cater to criminals it would make the area less comfortable for the dealers.  The crime could also be decreased on the north side of the street if Urban Sites were to get some tenants for the empty storefronts and/or puts up some cameras.

Does anyone know when the Ziegler park renovation is supposed to take place? On 3CDC website, it says 2015, but I don't think they've really shared much detail on when it's supposed to take place and what exactly they plan on doing.....

 

Apparently the entire refurbishment of that park will cost 25 million, which seems incredibly alot for that small space, so I'm really curious what there plans are? Will it just be for the park, or will it be for the surrounding area of Ziegler park as well..otherwise 25 million for that small area just seems insane.

 

Last I heard there were plans to include building an underground garage at Cutter playground (next to old-SCPA to-be Alumni Lofts apartments), redevelop Ziegler Park and build new construction in the lots along Sycamore and 14th. That's why the price tag is so high.

The garage that would take part of Cutter is privately owned though and specifically for Alumni Lofts. The rest of the park isn't being touched according to all the recent public meetings. Is it possible the underground garage (if that's truly happening) is somewhere else? Like under Ziegler?

 

I love the idea of moving the Peaslee Center into a new home that's integrated into new construction on all those lots just north of Ziegler. That could be a pretty pivotal connection point between OTR and Pendleton which are extremely separated by a lifeless Sycamore as it is right now.

The garage that would take part of Cutter is privately owned though and specifically for Alumni Lofts. The rest of the park isn't being touched according to all the recent public meetings. Is it possible the underground garage (if that's truly happening) is somewhere else? Like under Ziegler?

 

I love the idea of moving the Peaslee Center into a new home that's integrated into new construction on all those lots just north of Ziegler. That could be a pretty pivotal connection point between OTR and Pendleton which are extremely separated by a lifeless Sycamore as it is right now.

 

Two separate ideas. If 3CDC decides to build an underground garage below Cutter Playground to serve the surrounding area, that would eliminate the need to build the 2-story parking deck for just residents.

Interesting. I had no idea that was even on the table. Based on their announced budget of $25 million it sounds like they might be leaning that direction then.

 

I'm nervous that means no mature trees will survive which would be an unfortunate (though necessary) side effect of this. But an underground garage would serve that area nicely and free up a lot of open land for redevelopment.

I believe the underground garage will depend on if tax credits are received for the project.

For example, single-family homes are not eligible for the program at all.  So it's great for companies redeveloping SCPA or the Baldwin Building but the little guy is going to struggle.

 

The State's requirements are that the property must be "income producing"... so a single family home could only work if owned by an LLC and rented out. I don't remember seeing any projects of this type win in previous rounds, presumably because they're at a disadvantage due to the scoring rubric which favors projects with more economic impact (which makes sense, since the State is trying use the program to drive economic development).

The garage that would take part of Cutter is privately owned though and specifically for Alumni Lofts. The rest of the park isn't being touched according to all the recent public meetings. Is it possible the underground garage (if that's truly happening) is somewhere else? Like under Ziegler?

 

I love the idea of moving the Peaslee Center into a new home that's integrated into new construction on all those lots just north of Ziegler. That could be a pretty pivotal connection point between OTR and Pendleton which are extremely separated by a lifeless Sycamore as it is right now.

 

Two separate ideas. If 3CDC decides to build an underground garage below Cutter Playground to serve the surrounding area, that would eliminate the need to build the 2-story parking deck for just residents.

 

Concepts are here:

 

http://www.3cdc.org/files/2013/02/OTR-Work-Group-4.15.14-NXPowerLite.pdf Page 27 and up

 

(edited)

For example, single-family homes are not eligible for the program at all.  So it's great for companies redeveloping SCPA or the Baldwin Building but the little guy is going to struggle.

 

The State's requirements are that the property must be "income producing"... so a single family home could only work if owned by an LLC and rented out. I don't remember seeing any projects of this type win in previous rounds, presumably because they're at a disadvantage due to the scoring rubric which favors projects with more economic impact (which makes sense, since the State is trying use the program to drive economic development).

 

The other problem with the program being that it might be slowing the pace of redevelopment of these properties since developers have to wait 6 months+ waiting for the application date and then waiting for definitive approval, and if they don't get the credits, then they might redesign the project and submit again. 

 

 

Concepts are here:

 

http://www.3cdc.org/files/2013/02/OTR-Work-Group-4.15.14-NXPowerLite.pdf Page 27 and up

(edited)

 

Well putting those basketball courts next to the 2-family that was recently renovated on 13th behind the Cogswell Building is going to hurt its value.  I'd rather live in a flight path than next to the sound of basketballs bouncing for hours on end. 

There's been an update since the link I posted in the 3cdc Annual Report: http://www.3cdc.org/files/2015/03/2014-3CDC-Annual-Report.pdf

 

"Like Washington Park, Ziegler Park – located between 13th and 14th Streets, just west of the old School for Creative & Performing Arts – has suffered from years of disinvestment and is in need of a major facelift. Revitalizing the park would greatly benefit the surrounding community and serve as a catalyst for redevelopment of the nearby business district. Recognizing this need, the City of Cincinnati, the Cincinnati Recreation Commission (CRC), the Cincinnati Park Board, and 3CDC have once again teamed up to breathe new life into this underutilized – yet promising – greenspace. 3CDC took the lead in assembling a professional design team of glaserworks, Human Nature, and Brandstetter Carroll to discuss how the park could best meet the needs of the community. Initial design ideas for renovating the park were compiled and reviewed during two community input sessions, held in February and April 2014. After hearing the community’s responses, the design teamrealized the need to reevaluate the scope of the project, specifically in regard to the parking demands of the neighborhood. Since that meeting, 3CDC and the design team have been working to find feasible, effective ways of meeting the community’s requests. A third public input session is expected to be held during the first quarter of 2015, after which the design of the proposed project will be amended again, and a final master plan and budget will be drafted."

 

Also the park is supposed to have a more active focus with pools and courts than Washington Park. 

I'm glad to hear they went back to the drawing boards...those plans were bad. Too disjointed. Having random bits here and there poking into vacant spaces instead of one solid shape is a terrible idea. It impedes the ability to create a solid development wall around the park which is a really good way of making it feel like a leftover space. It should be a large rectangle with underground parking and all vacant spaces surrounding that rectangle should be buildings. That's the only real way of making it feel like an actual center of the community and not the "well we have this space leftover...let's put some crap in it" space it is right now.

Well putting those basketball courts next to the 2-family that was recently renovated on 13th behind the Cogswell Building is going to hurt its value.  I'd rather live in a flight path than next to the sound of basketballs bouncing for hours on end.

 

Those are the existing courts, perhaps bike polo will pick back up there again.

EXCLUSIVE: Developer adds condos to major Findlay Market project

http://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2015/04/17/exclusive-developer-adds-condos-to-major-findlay.html?page=all

 

Model Group hasn’t started construction on its planned $19 million redevelopment project next to Findlay Market, but the real estate developer is making a change based on feedback from potential residents.

Instead of 35 apartments, the project will now include nine condominiums, seven of which have already been pre-sold. Bobby Maly, chief operating officer of Model Group, said the company made the decision after listening to those who want to live in the development.

While demand for condos south of Liberty Street has been extremely high, the market north of Liberty isn’t as established. Maly said adding condos to the mix is a good thing for redevelopment around Findlay Market.

“Having diverse stakeholders is what’s important for lasting revitalization,” Maly told me. “It’s a mix of good retail, eliminating bad operators and having new homeowners that helps provide anchors. It’s a big deal for long-term stability.”

The developer is currently working through the design of the project, which will encompass nearly an entire block of Race Street just east of Findlay Market in Over-the-Rhine. The new design calls for 23 apartments and nine for-sale condos. The condos will mostly be two- and three-bedroom units, with one or two one-bedroom condos.

Four of the seven buyers who have already signed up for the condos are families with children.

 

This is great news for the Findlay Market area. It's a great sign that there's so much demand for condos and families are pre-buying them already. Maly is right about the need to have diverse set of stakeholders (apartments, condos, retail, and office).