Starting a new thread here for this development.  The site is located at Rt 21 and Miller Road, approximately 100 acres on the former Veterans Affairs hospital.  The facility has been vacant for at least 10 years now, I think.  Brecksville finally got title to the property from the federal government and is doing a phased development agreement with DiGeronimo Companies (family behind Independence Excavating, Precision Environmental, and a development partner in Pinecrest as well as others).

 

Rumors of the I-77 interchange becoming a full interchange (currently can only get on/off from North) soon.  Not sure what the tenant mix will be but I'm hearing the focus is corporate office, with R&D.

 

Brecksville downtown will have a challenge on their hands to attract/retain legitimate retailers as long as this is development is a competing interest.

 

https://www.cleveland.com/brecksville/index.ssf/2018/11/redevelopment_of_former_brecks.html

https://www.cleveland.com/business/2020/02/brecksville-talking-to-two-large-firms-about-building-offices-labs-in-valor-acres.html

1 hour ago, skiwest said:

https://www.cleveland.com/business/2020/02/brecksville-talking-to-two-large-firms-about-building-offices-labs-in-valor-acres.html

Can't wait to hear what companies Brecksville cannibalizes from Cleveland or other area suburbs. This Valor Acres development is just another example of how sprawl has not slowed down in this region, it's still steaming ahead. Why do these outer ring suburbs feel the need to develop every square inch of natural land for major corporations to move there, when they do just fine with a majority residential tax base? 

supposed to be a press release coming out today from Brecksville with more news on the VA, SW, and perhaps the incentives & TIF package they need to move ahead on

1 hour ago, gottaplan said:

supposed to be a press release coming out today from Brecksville with more news on the VA, SW, and perhaps the incentives & TIF package they need to move ahead on

 

Didn't Brecksville have a public meeting on this last night or did I misunderstand something.

1 hour ago, freefourur said:

 

Didn't Brecksville have a public meeting on this last night or did I misunderstand something.

There was a council meeting.  They initiated legislation on TIF, development agreement with SW, incentive package.  

If only sleepy Frank could move as fast as Brecksville... 

11 minutes ago, RE Developer In Training said:

If only sleepy Frank could move as fast as Brecksville... 

 

Or if Cleveland could elect a mayor like Jerry Hruby.....

19 hours ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said:

Can't wait to hear what companies Brecksville cannibalizes from Cleveland or other area suburbs. This Valor Acres development is just another example of how sprawl has not slowed down in this region, it's still steaming ahead. Why do these outer ring suburbs feel the need to develop every square inch of natural land for major corporations to move there, when they do just fine with a majority residential tax base? 

 

Valor Acres once had 1,000 jobs, which moved to Cleveland.  Was that "cannibalizing"?

 

In any case, why is it assumed those two companies are strictly local?   Two names that come to mind are Parker Hannifin and Eaton.  They have R&D centers spread out all over the world.

https://www.cleveland.com/business/2020/02/brecksville-incentives-for-sherwin-williams-rd-project-could-be-worth-100-million-plus.html

 

100 Million Dollars?!

19 minutes ago, RE Developer In Training said:

https://www.cleveland.com/business/2020/02/brecksville-incentives-for-sherwin-williams-rd-project-could-be-worth-100-million-plus.html

 

100 Million Dollars?!

like, for real. My thoughts exactly when I saw the article. 

 

It seems nothing could really compete with that, no matter how obsessed the CEO was with having a nearby R&D center. As they say, money talks/there's no bigger motivator than $$, etc. etc.

 

Sorry, commenting while reading, but I wasn't here for Progressive's move to Mayfield - is this a similar situation at all? Just seems like a bizarre amount, especially when it comes to just shifting jobs WITHIN the same county, how is this crap allowed?

 

OKAY, last edit, I swear. But how can we give a ridiculous amount of tax breaks and then promise 77 interchange upgrades, and Miller Rd. widening? They could've just been in Cleveland where the infrastructure is nearly already there? Even though Brecksville is promising these breaks, the county and state are on the hook for a LOT.

Edited February 19, 20205 yr by GISguy

4 hours ago, E Rocc said:

 

Valor Acres once had 1,000 jobs, which moved to Cleveland.  Was that "cannibalizing"?

 

 

 

No, that was correcting a previous mistake.

43 minutes ago, GISguy said:

like, for real. My thoughts exactly when I saw the article. 

 

It seems nothing could really compete with that, no matter how obsessed the CEO was with having a nearby R&D center. As they say, money talks/there's no bigger motivator than $$, etc. etc.

 

Sorry, commenting while reading, but I wasn't here for Progressive's move to Mayfield - is this a similar situation at all? Just seems like a bizarre amount, especially when it comes to just shifting jobs WITHIN the same county, how is this crap allowed?

 

OKAY, last edit, I swear. But how can we give a ridiculous amount of tax breaks and then promise 77 interchange upgrades, and Miller Rd. widening? They could've just been in Cleveland where the infrastructure is nearly already there? Even though Brecksville is promising these breaks, the county and state are on the hook for a LOT.

It's allowed because this region and county refuse to regionalize, with a mentality of my fiefdom suburb over the other here in NEO. It's absolutely mind boggling this continues in Cuyahoga county where supposedly "Greater Cleveland" is all for itself, with a stagnant population. It's a waste of money, redundant resources and duplicated services. "But hey, screw Cleveland and Warrensville Heights, my suburb Brecksville is doing great!"

46 minutes ago, GISguy said:

like, for real. My thoughts exactly when I saw the article. 

 

It seems nothing could really compete with that, no matter how obsessed the CEO was with having a nearby R&D center. As they say, money talks/there's no bigger motivator than $$, etc. etc.

 

Sorry, commenting while reading, but I wasn't here for Progressive's move to Mayfield - is this a similar situation at all? Just seems like a bizarre amount, especially when it comes to just shifting jobs WITHIN the same county, how is this crap allowed?

 

OKAY, last edit, I swear. But how can we give a ridiculous amount of tax breaks and then promise 77 interchange upgrades, and Miller Rd. widening? They could've just been in Cleveland where the infrastructure is nearly already there? Even though Brecksville is promising these breaks, the county and state are on the hook for a LOT.

We can give a ridciulous amount of tax breaks and continue spending further money on interstate (as if it's still the mid 20th century) because this region has an obsession with suburbanization and sprawl. I will never understand how this mentality started and has not reversed like other areas of the country, but people here just think it's a natural part of life to live on a half acre to an acre lot of land, have a ten lane wide freeway commute, and move from suburb to suburb. The leadership in Cuyahoga County, and frankly the state of Ohio, seems to have left Cleveland in the past decades ago, where we need to keep building out further and further into the suburbs. It's really no wonder why companies outside the region never consider moving here. 

12 minutes ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said:

We can give a ridciulous amount of tax breaks and continue spending further money on interstate (as if it's still the mid 20th century) because this region has an obsession with suburbanization and sprawl. I will never understand how this mentality started and has not reversed like other areas of the country, but people here just think it's a natural part of life to live on a half acre to an acre lot of land, have a ten lane wide freeway commute, and move from suburb to suburb. The leadership in Cuyahoga County, and frankly the state of Ohio, seems to have left Cleveland in the past decades ago, where we need to keep building out further and further into the suburbs. It's really no wonder why companies outside the region never consider moving here. 

Have you ever been to Atlanta, Dalaas, LA, Chicago, Detroit, or just about every other major city in the country? 

 

This isn't a Cleveland thing.

9 minutes ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said:

It's allowed because this region and county refuse to regionalize, with a mentality of my fiefdom suburb over the other here in NEO. It's absolutely mind boggling this continues in Cuyahoga county where supposedly "Greater Cleveland" is all for itself, with a stagnant population. It's a waste of money, redundant resources and duplicated services. "But hey, screw Cleveland and Warrensville Heights, my suburb Brecksville is doing great!"

 

Well, I'm not going to sit here and say Dustin is wrong about this, because he's not. The lack of a regional front has damaged NEO far greater than any deficient air service. If you want to fix some deep rooted local issues, start the regionalization conversation yesterday.

3 minutes ago, Mov2Ohio said:

Have you ever been to Atlanta, Dalaas, LA, Chicago, Detroit, or just about every other major city in the country? 

 

This isn't a Cleveland thing.

 

It's more of thing here

 

4 minutes ago, Mov2Ohio said:

Have you ever been to Atlanta, Dalaas, LA, Chicago, Detroit, or just about every other major city in the country? 

 

This isn't a Cleveland thing.

The only city you mentioned that has the same predicament as Cleveland is Detroit, which has tons and tons of corporations located outside the city proper. For Atlanta, Dallas, LA, Chicago, either the major companies moved back to those cities into the city proper, or they were able to regionalize so that the center city wasn't left behind.

1 hour ago, GISguy said:

like, for real. My thoughts exactly when I saw the article. 

 

It seems nothing could really compete with that, no matter how obsessed the CEO was with having a nearby R&D center. As they say, money talks/there's no bigger motivator than $$, etc. etc.

 

Sorry, commenting while reading, but I wasn't here for Progressive's move to Mayfield - is this a similar situation at all? Just seems like a bizarre amount, especially when it comes to just shifting jobs WITHIN the same county, how is this crap allowed?

 

OKAY, last edit, I swear. But how can we give a ridiculous amount of tax breaks and then promise 77 interchange upgrades, and Miller Rd. widening? They could've just been in Cleveland where the infrastructure is nearly already there? Even though Brecksville is promising these breaks, the county and state are on the hook for a LOT.

 

Not comparable, because Progressive moved to Mayfield in 1974 when downtown was a mess.

6 hours ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said:

The only city you mentioned that has the same predicament as Cleveland is Detroit, which has tons and tons of corporations located outside the city proper. For Atlanta, Dallas, LA, Chicago, either the major companies moved back to those cities into the city proper, or they were able to regionalize so that the center city wasn't left behind.

No.

 

Look at the fortune 500 HQs for all those regions. Some are in the inner city some are in the suburbs. Just like Cleveland. Also, non of those cities regionalized as the cities you mentioned are old central cities surrounded by rings of Suburbs. Just like Cleveland and Detroit.

8 hours ago, Clefan98 said:

 

It's more of thing here

 

That’s a really interesting set of statistics. HOWEVER, Orlando showing more downtown jobs that Cleveland? And Indy with a third more and Denver with TWICE as many?! I have to seriously question who is determining the boundaries used for “downtown” and whether it’s apples to apples across the board. While this is only anecdotal to my untrained “job counting” eye, but I say this having spent some-to-significant time in all of those cities.   

 

5 minutes ago, KJP said:

 

When you can sense desperation from your suitor...... Funny, lotsa hotels and conference spaces downtown...

^ That could have been an awesome HQ/Hotel tower with R&D one block away...sigh

Sprawl sprawl sprawl..........Lets duplicate EVERYTHING that is already in place downtown.  UGH

10 hours ago, marty15 said:

When you can sense desperation from your suitor...... Funny, lotsa hotels and conference spaces downtown...

That was my exact first thought! You want someone else to build all these things when downtown already has them. SMH...

43 minutes ago, mack34 said:

Sprawl sprawl sprawl..........Lets duplicate EVERYTHING that is already in place downtown.  UGH

 

They have it in Independence too.   ?

 

It would only increase the chances of a tech-R&D hub springing up there.   

We get it, you love sprawl and love companies leaving downtown

11 hours ago, marty15 said:

When you can sense desperation from your suitor...... Funny, lotsa hotels and conference spaces downtown...

 

I'm sure there will lots of Cleveland.com trolls living in Brecksville raging on the Cleveland incentives, but have no issue with Brecksville dropping their pants to get this development.  

 

Overall I'm fine with it--it's a net win for the region.   Let's get both sites built and move on.  

The R&D center will have ~ 680 jobs over 75 acres, that wouldn't be very good density if it were Downtown.

42 minutes ago, mtnbikefan said:

The R&D center will have ~ 680 jobs over 75 acres, that wouldn't be very good density if it were Downtown.

 

While there is a lot more going in those 75 acres (SHW is just part of Valor acres), your point still stands.  What SHW wanted in terms of lay out for its R&D simply didn't work in the heart of downtown.  The bummer is that we couldn't find another place for it in Cleveland.  At least they stayed in the county however. 

my 2 cents:

 

- SW always wanted to locate the R&D at the Brecksville location, regardless of incentives

- They wanted to locate there because it was the best option - large tract of land, ready to build on, better timeline than any other location

- Land is essentially free from DiGeronimos based on what I've heard, the incentives, while good, are less at the Brecksville location than what Cleveland offered

- The rest of the development will be built out around them, to their suiting.  Access points, green space, other tenants & amenities...  what other location offers that?

- The VA location offers N/S and E/W interstate arteries literally right out the front door on 77 and Turnpike.  There is real value to that which can't be duplicated anywhere in Cleveland

 

If the SW R&D had located elsewhere, perhaps in Cleveland proper, some other large tenant likely would've moved down there.  It's just that good of a location.

 

3 hours ago, Cleburger said:

 

I'm sure there will lots of Cleveland.com trolls living in Brecksville raging on the Cleveland incentives, but have no issue with Brecksville dropping their pants to get this development.  

 

Overall I'm fine with it--it's a net win for the region.   Let's get both sites built and move on.  

Sprawl is never a net win for the region.

37 minutes ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said:

Sprawl is never a net win for the region.

I don't disagree, but better Brecksville (a former employment center)  than moving out of the county entirely into farmland.  At least this shouldn't require any significant highway infrastructure to service it.  

16 hours ago, KJP said:

 

It's so nice having Michelle back reporting on real estate projects again!

4 hours ago, mack34 said:

We get it, you love sprawl and love companies leaving downtown

 

Love the idea of a tech-R&D hotspot potentially springing up in that area, with Lubrizol there and now SW.   

The offices are still downtown.  Not sure what value such a location has for R&D, and last I heard space is more expensive.

1 hour ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said:

Sprawl is never a net win for the region.

 

It's not a net loss either. It's reality in every non-coastal US city and some of the coastals as well.  There's reasons.

2 hours ago, cle_guy90 said:

 

While there is a lot more going in those 75 acres (SHW is just part of Valor acres), your point still stands.  What SHW wanted in terms of lay out for its R&D simply didn't work in the heart of downtown.  The bummer is that we couldn't find another place for it in Cleveland.  At least they stayed in the county however. 

 

Valor Acres is 190 acres total with 75 of them for SW. 

https://www.cleveland.com/business/2020/02/valor-acres-home-of-proposed-sherwin-williams-rd-center-nearly-doubles-in-size-with-brecksville-land-purchase.html

1 hour ago, mtnbikefan said:

 

Valor Acres is 190 acres total with 75 of them for SW. 

https://www.cleveland.com/business/2020/02/valor-acres-home-of-proposed-sherwin-williams-rd-center-nearly-doubles-in-size-with-brecksville-land-purchase.html

I forgot that they added 87 acres to make it 190. But where do you see that it is 75 for SHW (I read the article and didn’t see it there). 75 acres seems extremely high considering that the Scranton R&D was only going to be 6 or 7 I believe.

21 minutes ago, cle_guy90 said:

I forgot that they added 87 acres to make it 190. But where do you see that it is 75 for SHW (I read the article and didn’t see it there). 75 acres seems extremely high considering that the Scranton R&D was only going to be 6 or 7 I believe.

 

It's in this article - 

https://www.cleveland.com/business/2020/02/brecksville-incentives-for-sherwin-williams-rd-project-could-be-worth-100-million-plus.html

 

"Brecksville has set aside 75 acres of the former VA site for Sherwin-Williams. The city controls the 103-acre property, which has been cleared for a mixed-use redevelopment called Valor Acres through a partnership with the DiGeronimo Companies. And officials expect to expand the broader project footprint by acquiring 88 acres immediately to the west this year."

I recall reading somewhere that SHW wanted to have enough land for future expansion of the R&D facility, and apparently there was nothing large enough in Cleveland.

1 hour ago, mtnbikefan said:

 

It's in this article - 

https://www.cleveland.com/business/2020/02/brecksville-incentives-for-sherwin-williams-rd-project-could-be-worth-100-million-plus.html

 

"Brecksville has set aside 75 acres of the former VA site for Sherwin-Williams. The city controls the 103-acre property, which has been cleared for a mixed-use redevelopment called Valor Acres through a partnership with the DiGeronimo Companies. And officials expect to expand the broader project footprint by acquiring 88 acres immediately to the west this year."

 

Thanks!  That's just crazy to me the size!! Perhaps they want it to be isolated within the develop and have several acres separating them from everyone and everything else on all sides.

There are preliminary site plans on Brecksville's website - https://www.brecksville.oh.us/Economic Development/va.html

 

Craptacular!

^ I get the business aspects of this place but, in all seriousness, who the hell is going to want to live there?

15 hours ago, mtnbikefan said:

There are preliminary site plans on Brecksville's website - https://www.brecksville.oh.us/Economic Development/va.html

 

those are old site plans.  More updated on valoracres.com website.  I think the layout along Miller showing retail/hotel/conf is fairly accurate, with a big generic box as a place holder for the SW facility

This isn't QUITE the same, but reminds me of a place I used to work in PA - Southpointe, it's more in the middle of nowhere, but still, sea of parking lots and housing for short term visitors/really dedicated employees. It was terrible (here's the 'main street'). Hopefully it's more Crocker than anything else, but from the renderings it doesn't quite look it (I know, I know, it's just a 'what if' rendering at this point...but still).

Edited August 14, 20204 yr by GISguy

There are a lot of these in almost every suburban metro area. They primarily serve corporate locations, with hotels and restaurants, that cater to the business traveler. Sounds like Valor Acres may take the same path.

2 minutes ago, Frmr CLEder said:

There are a lot of these in almost every suburban metro area. They primarily serve corporate locations, with hotels and restaurants, that cater to the business traveler. Sounds like Valor Acres may take the same path.

I think that is a pretty good development plan.  The business traveler who is in for 2 days doesn't have to drive around a lot.  I think it's a sort of a suburban office park/urbanist hybrid of sorts.

 

So it this kind of like a version of Grandview Yard in Columbus to a degree?  Not sure of the size by square footage and housing/hotel units by comparison.  Just getting that impression a bit.  Granted it sound like Grandview Yard is quite a bit closer to the core of Columbus and Nationwide downtown.

Edited February 28, 20205 yr by Gnoraa