6 minutes ago, Oxford19 said:

...and yet no a beep from all the feminists, progressives, or other assorted SJWs about banning or boycotting SNL this weekend as Meek Mill performs.  

 

It's interesting.

 

he must not be #metoo enough for anyone to care

Just now, freefourur said:

 

 

I barely know who Meek Mill is and have no idea who is performing on SNL nor do I care. Great whataboutism tough.

You, being a pro-feminist and anti-toxic masculinity advocate, would not care for him.  Given what seems to be your otherwise social advocacy, you should care.  If not, then you really need to be eliminated from the feminist and toxic masculinity discussion.

it's odd to me that people have their boxers in a bunch because Gillette is asking men to be better role models and the response is to ban rap music.  The Gillette ad is literally asking people to take personal responsibility and it seems that the more conservative folks here have a problem with it. Maybe some conservatives who think that they believe in personal responsibility should have some introspection about whether they really believe it.

Edited January 24, 20196 yr by freefourur

1 minute ago, Oxford19 said:

You, being a pro-feminist and anti-toxic masculinity advocate, would not care for him.  Given what seems to be your otherwise social advocacy, you should care.  If not, then you really need to be eliminated from the feminist and toxic masculinity discussion.

 

I don't listen to him and don't care about him.  I don;t support bans or censorship or artistic expression of any kind. 

Just now, tklg said:

 

he must not be #metoo enough for anyone to care

Exactly, but given this guy's lyrics and behavior, what could it be about him that isn't attracting negative attention considering his promotion of toxic masculinity behavior?

 

 

Edited January 24, 20196 yr by Oxford19

2 minutes ago, Oxford19 said:

Exactly, but given this guy's lyrics and behavior, what could it be about him that isn't attracting negative attention considering his promotion of toxic masculinity behavior?

 

 

Rap music receives a lot of criticism about its toxic masculinity.  I have only stated this about 6 or 7 times now.  Perhaps it will sink in at some point.

we still seem to be hyper focused on rap music but not rock-n-roll or bro country.  Interesting.

Just now, freefourur said:

it's odd to me that people have their boxers in a bunch because Gillette is asking men to be better role models and the response is too ban rap music.  The Gillette ad is literally asking people to take personal responsibility and it seems that the more conservative folks here have a problem with it. Maybe some conservatives who think that they believe in personal responsibility should have some introspection about whether they really believe it.

It's also odd to me that some people get their boxers in a bunch because the misogynistic lyrics in rap music came into the discussion.  I know this is gonna set off some folks but where is the parental responsibility in letting their kids listen to music like rap?  I mean Gillette has an adult male breaking up two little guys fighting; since when didn't this happen btw.  

 

Let Gillette enter the social responsibility forum, who cares.

3 minutes ago, freefourur said:

it's odd to me that people have their boxers in a bunch because Gillette is asking men to be better role models and the response is too ban rap music.  The Gillette ad is literally asking people to take personal responsibility and it seems that the more conservative folks here have a problem with it. Maybe some conservatives who think that they believe in personal responsibility should have some introspection about whether they really believe it.

 

Personally, I'm most annoyed by the call out culture associated with these identity politics, I'm more up to date on how to best display speech in public games.  I don't really give a shit what a Gillette ad is doing and don't really understand why someone felt the need to create a thread around an identity politics buzz word and start a bunch of unnecessary outrage.

 

But hey, life would just be boring if we weren't distracted by some unnecessary outrage, so let the party continue!  Can't say I haven't been munching my own popcorn through this thread.

 

8 minutes ago, Oxford19 said:

you should care.  If not, then you really need to be eliminated from the feminist and toxic masculinity discussion.

 

"CARE ABOUT THIS ONE NOT REALLY ALL THAT FAMOUS RAPPER OR BE ELIMINATED FROM THIS DISCUSSION" is such a weird take.

Just now, freefourur said:

we still seem to be hyper focused on rap music but not rock-n-roll or bro country.  Interesting.

Hyper focused? Not really it's just when you have regular lyrics about ''f***ing hoes, beating and degrading women, criminal activity etc. it may come to mind first in a topic related to taming toxic masculinity.  

 

Bring in Rock n Roll, country, whatever else you got.

 

Just now, Oxford19 said:

Hyper focused? Not really it's just when you have regular lyrics about ''f***ing hoes, beating and degrading women, criminal activity etc. it may come to mind first in a topic related to taming toxic masculinity.  

 

Bring in Rock n Roll, country, whatever else you got.

 

As I will now say for about the 10th time, rap receives plenty of criticism and I agree that it deserves. I'm not sure what you are arguing at this point.

Just now, tklg said:

 

Personally, I'm most annoyed by the call out culture associated with these identity politics, I'm more up to date on how to best display speech in public games.  I don't really give a shit what a Gillette ad is doing and don't really understand why someone felt the need to create a thread around an identity politics buzz word and start a bunch of unnecessary outrage.

 

But hey, life would just be boring if we weren't distracted by some unnecessary outrage, so let the party continue!  Can't say I haven't been munching my own popcorn through this thread.

 

Victim and identity politics is so interesting, bizarre, and scary...looks like the Covington Catholic kids thread has simmered down a bit given the whole thing was a set-up by AWOL veteran native american Nathan WhateverNameHeIsNow...

 

So, for now, the open-ended and vague toxic masculinity thread is still up and running strong.  

 

Being new here in UO, I'm getting the sense that if one is not on script all the time, there are ramifications.

 

I just found UO as I recently boomeranged back to my hometown until summer...hoping to make it permanent ?.

Edited January 24, 20196 yr by Oxford19

Just now, freefourur said:

As I will now say for about the 10th time, rap receives plenty of criticism and I agree that it deserves. I'm not sure what you are arguing at this point.

Well, maybe not throwing out ''being hyper focused'' in responses and otherwise ignoring posts related to a topic you don't like would make a great start :).

 

Changing the culture of toxic masculinity requires changing or eliminating lots of the components of our toxic culture.

Edited January 24, 20196 yr by Oxford19

1 minute ago, Oxford19 said:

Well, maybe not throwing out ''being hyper focused'' in responses and otherwise ignoring posts related to a topic you don't like would make a great start :).

 

yes, you are are hyper focused on rap music after being told at least 10 times that it receives lots of criticism and the criticism is justified.  So I ask again, what are you arguing at this point.

 

I have not been ignoring at all. You might notice that I've engaged with you about rap music for many posts now.

Just now, freefourur said:

 

yes, you are are hyper focused on rap music after being told at least 10 times that it receives lots of criticism and the criticism is justified.  So I ask again, what are you arguing at this point.

 

I have not been ignoring at all. You might notice that I've engaged with you about rap music for many posts now.

You don't need to engage if it's upsetting you.

1 hour ago, Oxford19 said:

We have young kids listening to this vile, hateful, and violent stuff.  Don't be so quick to dismiss that ''no one listening to rap music thinks it's acceptable'' to commit criminal acts when you're allowing young kids to have access to this.

haha the Covington Catholic thread didn't just die down, it was locked because the already tumultuous topic devolved into bickering and name-calling. The same thing is happening here, and the thread can be locked if it gets too unruly.

Just now, Oxford19 said:

You don't need to engage if it's upsetting you.

 

I am not the one that is crying about a razor commercial. And I agree about the rap music.  Perhaps this is projection on your part.

Just now, ryanlammi said:

haha the Covington Catholic thread didn't just die down, it was locked because the already tumultuous topic devolved into bickering and name-calling. The same thing is happening here, and the thread can be locked if it gets too unruly.

"Unruly''?  I haven't called anyone names nor have I bickered. Please advise the guilty party/ies of this as well.

Just now, freefourur said:

 

I am not the one that is crying about a razor commercial. And I agree about the rap music.  Perhaps this is projection on your part.

I didn't even know about this razor commercial until this thread.

Just now, Oxford19 said:

"Unruly''?  I haven't called anyone names nor have I bickered. Please advise the guilty party/ies of this as well.

That's for the mods to decide.

I will take this as my sign to bow out of the thread lest I cause any problems with the mods.

5 minutes ago, Oxford19 said:

ignoring posts related to a topic you don't like would make a great start ?

 

3 minutes ago, freefourur said:

 So I ask again, what are you arguing at this point.

 

2 minutes ago, Oxford19 said:

You don't need to engage if it's upsetting you.

 

 

Just now, DarkandStormy said:

Point is...?

 

 

Just now, ryanlammi said:

haha the Covington Catholic thread didn't just die down, it was locked because the already tumultuous topic devolved into bickering and name-calling. The same thing is happening here, and the thread can be locked if it gets too unruly.

I see that, in fact, the Covington Catholic thread was shut down.  Wow. 

 

Looks like after the exposure of this whole thing being a set-up by AWOL Nathan, the name calling and Cincy's Catholic School not having enough black students etc. commenced...should have been shut down for being off topic.

Just now, Oxford19 said:

I see that, in fact, the Covington Catholic thread was shut down.  Wow. 

 

Looks like after the exposure of this whole thing being a set-up by AWOL Nathan, the name calling and Cincy's Catholic School not having enough black students etc. commenced...should have been shut down for being off topic...yet on topic for example of toxic masculinity.

 

4 hours ago, YABO713 said:

 

He does actually raise an interesting point in that, as far as I know, rap lyrics are much less the subject of feminist critique than antiquated lyrics. Future's new album literally references sticking digits in body parts in public... and that's arguably the cleanest track on the album. 

 

I don't know if feminists give them a pass because they think they already come from marginalized backgrounds? Or maybe they don't get a pass and I'm just not paying attention closely enough. 

 

I think you're on the right track. The politically correct crowd strictly observes a hierarchy of oppression. For them, criticism can only go up the totem pole, not down. That criticism can be offensive, prejudicial, and unfounded - but it doesn't matter. This is absurd and ridiculous on so many levels, yet it persists as a mainstream belief among the political left.

12 hours ago, Ram23 said:

 

I think you're on the right track. The politically correct crowd strictly observes a hierarchy of oppression. For them, criticism can only go up the totem pole, not down. That criticism can be offensive, prejudicial, and unfounded - but it doesn't matter. This is absurd and ridiculous on so many levels, yet it persists as a mainstream belief among the political left.

 

Feminism is popular among privileged western white people.  It doesn't get much play beyond that group and there are plenty within that group-- of both genders-- who reject it completely.  Even the womens' march participants themselves have noted how little diversity there is among them.  The last thing they need is racial conflict on their agenda.

On 1/16/2019 at 9:30 AM, freefourur said:

 

I used to be guilty of ignoring catcalling when I saw it too. I viewed it as harmless fun.  That is toxic masculinity.  I viewed the catcalling as a boys will be boys behavior.  I am learning too. 

Are you now directly on-the-spot doing something about catcalling if you witness it?  

Edited January 27, 20196 yr by Oxford19

On 1/23/2019 at 2:40 PM, ryanlammi said:

I'm sure there are countless examples of ads changing people's behavior.

And these ads were put out by municipalities and advocacy groups, not companies. I know every booze ad puts in the required drink responsibly message in as small of a time as possible, but do you think that 0.5 second low voiced guy has ever caused anyone to drink responsibly?

 

The drunk driving ads focus on the negative consequences of fines, lawsuits, jail time, and loss of driving priviledges. Also, I would put 90% of the drunk driving decline on uber and lyft. Almost every bar advertises to sign up, avoid a DUII, and get $20 off your first ride!

 

To me the Gilette ad is the same as the DARE campaign; over the top, heavy handed, exaggerating, and painting everyone with a broad brush. 

14 minutes ago, originaljbw said:

To me the Gilette ad is the same as the DARE campaign; over the top, heavy handed, exaggerating, and painting everyone with a broad brush. 

 

They literally show multiple men in the ad acting in a manner that they think is right/better (even "best" since Gillette is the best a man can get).  The narrator even says at one point that some men are already stepping up.

Interesting though that the sexual aggressive male scenes, actually all the aggressive behaviors, are white men and the ''do the right thing'' interventions are by ''men of color''. Thank you ''men of color'' for showing white males how to treat women...lol.

 

I actually don't recall a time when fighting boys were allowed by adults; male or female, would end it, and appropriately message or punish the kids involved.  Even the ''urban street'' scene of hoodied black males always has happened.  Someone steps in to help the kid fending on his own.

 

Interesting as well that this ad runs during the playing of an aggressively violent male sport.

 

We'll see what the NFL payoff is on the social messaging and politics its engaging in.

Edited February 12, 20196 yr by Oxford19

So should the epitome of toxic masculinity, VA Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax resign? 

 

Accused of sexual assault and now a separate allegation of rape has emerged from a 2nd woman.  Serious criminal charges here.

 

Can't see how Fairfax can stay in office; but leaving the white toxic masculinity Gov. and Atty Gen, both known ''blackfacers'' (non-criminal acts) may create more problems.

What is up with these guys on Facebook, usually aged 20 to maybe 30, making some bold but vague declaration about some character in their world who was making women "feel unsafe"? 

 

The whole thing is the opposite of a spoiled loser kicking the ball into the woods so he can't "lose".  Instead, a bomb is dropped online if you don't 100% align yourself with the self-declared moral hero, you're as bad as the unsafer.  

 

Look at me everybody -- I DON'T MAKE WOMEN FEEL UNSAFE AND I CALL OUT THOSE WHO DO ON FACEBOOK!!!  I'm a SAFER, NOT AN UNSAFER! 

On 1/29/2019 at 5:14 PM, Oxford19 said:

 I actually don't recall a time when fighting boys were allowed by adults; male or female, would end it, and appropriately message or punish the kids involved.  Even the ''urban street'' scene of hoodied black males always has happened.  Someone steps in to help the kid fending on his own.

 

 

I was definitely brought up in an environment where fist fighting was expected and the teachers didn't care.  I was in about 15 fights from ages 10 to 17.  The time I refused to take a shower after gym class?  Got detention for that.  But did not get in trouble at all for any of the 6-7 fights I had at school or the two incidents where I traded punches at school dances. 

 

My fighting days ended as soon as I got out of the west side of Cincinnati.  It took me years of being away to realize that the combative climate that exists there isn't normal, at least not for people who ended up going to college. 

6 hours ago, jmecklenborg said:

What is up with these guys on Facebook, usually aged 20 to maybe 30, making some bold but vague declaration about some character in their world who was making women "feel unsafe"? 

 

My amateur guess is that they are alone, perhaps in part because they don't know how to converse well with women, so they are trying to compensate by putting out a bat signal that they are a "TRU FEM ALLY" without realizing the over the top declarations are likely to turn women off.

18 hours ago, Oxford19 said:

So should the epitome of toxic masculinity, VA Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax resign? 

 

Accused of sexual assault and now a separate allegation of rape has emerged from a 2nd woman.  Serious criminal charges here.

 

Can't see how Fairfax can stay in office; but leaving the white toxic masculinity Gov. and Atty Gen, both known ''blackfacers'' (non-criminal acts) may create more problems.

No, he should not resign. These are allegations, but he DESERVES due process. He DESERVES a full complete impartial investigation. He should not resign over allegations without having his chance to present a defense.

7 hours ago, jmecklenborg said:

 

I was definitely brought up in an environment where fist fighting was expected and the teachers didn't care.  I was in about 15 fights from ages 10 to 17.  The time I refused to take a shower after gym class?  Got detention for that.  But did not get in trouble at all for any of the 6-7 fights I had at school or the two incidents where I traded punches at school dances. 

 

My fighting days ended as soon as I got out of the west side of Cincinnati.  It took me years of being away to realize that the combative climate that exists there isn't normal, at least not for people who ended up going to college. 

 

Yeah, I'm more embarrassed that I was in that many fights rather than feeling tough.

11 hours ago, jmecklenborg said:

 

I was definitely brought up in an environment where fist fighting was expected and the teachers didn't care.  I was in about 15 fights from ages 10 to 17.  The time I refused to take a shower after gym class?  Got detention for that.  But did not get in trouble at all for any of the 6-7 fights I had at school or the two incidents where I traded punches at school dances. 

 

My fighting days ended as soon as I got out of the west side of Cincinnati.  It took me years of being away to realize that the combative climate that exists there isn't normal, at least not for people who ended up going to college. 

So you were just a plain old bully then or just a plain old a-hole.  A common character in every school.

 

Punishment wasn't ever severe but coming up in Cleveland Public Schools wasn't easy so one could find themselves in a fight or several throughout the school years.

 

So you were an a-hole back in school, I guess today it's called Toxic Masculinity.  It just sounds like you grew up.

 

 

Edited February 11, 20196 yr by Oxford19

Just now, Oxford19 said:

Fighting was expected and teachers didn't care?...hmm...what's the point about gym class shower and detention related to? Are you sure you were a victim of toxic masculinity and not insecurity and anger?  Sorry you didn't have any adults in your life.

 

 

 

On 1/16/2019 at 10:39 AM, jonoh81 said:

 

An opinionated, strong woman is often faced with a lot of ridicule and criticism.  The word "shrill" comes to mind.

Exactly what the Democratic Party said about Hillary Clinton in 2008...

4 hours ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

No, he should not resign. These are allegations, but he DESERVES due process. He DESERVES a full complete impartial investigation. He should not resign over allegations without having his chance to present a defense.

Yes, the getting ever more elusive concept of Due Process.  Imagine the idea of Due Process when social media has already indicted and convicted someone.

 

Like with Kavanaugh, questioning the female is tantamount to supporting sexual abuse.  Thank God at least the Fairfax accusers are black females so we don't have to deal with the race card on the offenses, at least so far as there could be more alleged victims out there, but may still face it if Fairfax ends being forced to resign while the white male privileged toxic masculinity (that's a lot of adjectives) VA Gov and Atty Gen stay in office.

The top-3 "lawmakers" in Virginia should resign.. but to say the Governor is the epitome of toxic masculinity is idiotic, hypo-critic liberal is a better way to describe both Northam and Fairfax.. but they said they are sorry so I guess it's ok 

Edited February 11, 20196 yr by wpcc88

On 1/16/2019 at 10:39 AM, jonoh81 said:

 

An opinionated, strong woman is often faced with a lot of ridicule and criticism.  The word "shrill" comes to mind.

 

"Shrill" just means someone doesn't like the sound of a woman's voice coming though a P.A. system unless she's saying "Divine, dahhhrling"

2 hours ago, wpcc88 said:

The top-3 "lawmakers" in Virginia should resign.. but to say the Governor is the epitome of toxic masculinity is idiotic, hypo-critic liberal is a better way to describe both Northam and Fairfax.. but they said they are sorry so I guess it's ok 

Don't know who stated VA Gov was the epitome of toxic masculinity; I stated that VA Lt.Gov. Fairfax is the epitome of toxic masculinity because he is the epitome of toxic male behavior.  Sexual assault and rape pretty much top ''the epitome of'' list.

 

Fairfax is the sexual assaulter and rapist, he hasn't apologized for something he said he is innocent of.  Maybe you're thinking of VA Atty Gen, I mean there are blackfacers, blackface enablers, rapist, sexual assaulter here.

Edited February 12, 20196 yr by Oxford19

7 hours ago, Oxford19 said:

So you were just a plain old bully then or just a plain old a-hole.  A common character in every school.

 

Punishment wasn't ever severe but coming up in Cleveland Public Schools wasn't easy so one could find themselves in a fight or several throughout the school years.

 

So you were an a-hole back in school, I guess today it's called Toxic Masculinity.  It just sounds like you grew up.

 

 

 

 

No I definitely wasn't a bully.  You just got tested all of the time where I grew up and occasionally were ambushed.  It was all about basketball shoes, car stereos, motorcycles, etc.  There were also a lot of Todds.  It basically looked and worked like this:

 

 

 

 

 

Just now, jmecklenborg said:

 

 

No I definitely wasn't a bully.  You just got tested all of the time where I grew up and occasionally were ambushed.  It was all about basketball shoes, car stereos, motorcycles, etc.  There were also a lot of Todds.  It basically looked and worked like this:

Common though.  In Cleveland, besides the usual b.s. as you state, had to worry about local Italian kids wanting to kick your a*s (especially being a member of a certain ethnic group)...Murray Hill (now called Little Italy was off limits)...then working at the West Side Market in high school dealing with the Puerto Rican kids jumping your a*s, and working at Municipal Stadium contending with black kids on way to the Rapid Transit...it was tough! lol.

 

 

 

3 hours ago, jmecklenborg said:

 

 

No I definitely wasn't a bully.  You just got tested all of the time where I grew up and occasionally were ambushed.  It was all about basketball shoes, car stereos, motorcycles, etc.  There were also a lot of Todds.  It basically looked and worked like this:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In my towns it was stealing BMX bikes from each other.

11 hours ago, jmecklenborg said:

 

 

No I definitely wasn't a bully.  You just got tested all of the time where I grew up and occasionally were ambushed.  It was all about basketball shoes, car stereos, motorcycles, etc.  There were also a lot of Todds.  It basically looked and worked like this:

 

 

 

 

 

Jake, I am sure you were like the Godfather growing up keeping dead fish or horse heads in your locker to give to those who crossed you.

Couple years back I couldn't believe there were ''don't beat women'' ads running during NFL games; why would this message need to be run, who thinks it's OK to beat women?

 

Of course it was due to the NFL harboring its own ''women beating'' players.  

 

So, now CLE Browns have this woman beater poster player (why didn't GE include this in its anti-white male toxic masculinty PSA?) and that kick at the end really just says it all.  This was at the fancy "9" apartments in downtown Cleveland:

 

 

Edited February 14, 20196 yr by Oxford19