4 hours ago, Chas Wiederhold said:

If anyone else on UO sat through the same Jerry Larson History of Architecture lectures at DAAP that I did...

 

Oh yes, 'nuff said.  

See Urban Sites’ plans for former Fifth Third office building

 

Urban Sites has started transforming 530 Walnut, the office building it purchased last fall from Fifth Third Bancorp, putting its distinct twist to the property.

 

More below:

https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2021/01/26/see-urban-sites-plans-for-former-53-office-build.html

 

On 1/25/2021 at 12:28 PM, troeros said:

Does anyone have a rendering of what this building used to look like before the remodel of the exterior?

This is the closest photo that I could find though the height of the building looks much shorter than what’s in the picture despite the fact the county has the Chong listed as being built in 1865 so I’m wondering if these buildings were reduced in height at some point

It seems so odd to take that amount of floors off of a building though. Sometime you hear about 1-2 floors coming off due to the top stories being wood with the lower ones being brick or block -- like if a storm ripped off the wooden floors or a fire happened. Or when church steeples rot.

25 minutes ago, GCrites80s said:

It seems so odd to take that amount of floors off of a building though. Sometime you hear about 1-2 floors coming off due to the top stories being wood with the lower ones being brick or block -- like if a storm ripped off the wooden floors or a fire happened. Or when church steeples rot.

Earlier in the thread there are photos of the backs of the building which would indicate the age is probably close to what the county has. The Chong Looks like it may have lost one or two stories. I guess I’ll have to wait and see once more of the façade is revealed and we have a better understanding of what windows are hidden behind. But something definitely looks off

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1 hour ago, preservationrestoration said:

This is the closest photo that I could find though the height of the building looks much shorter than what’s in the picture despite the fact the county has the Chong listed as being built in 1865 so I’m wondering if these buildings were reduced in height at some point

 

 

Nice find! For reference this photo is from 08/15/1923

So it's made up of two buildings with their top two floors lopped off.  The little two-story building at Morand Alley also used to be six stories tall as well.  So my guess would be a fire.  Some research into The Robert Mitchell Furniture Company (Mitchell's in @preservationrestoration's photo) might turn up something.  

 

Edited January 27, 20214 yr by jjakucyk

Man this is weird though. So they closed off the street to the north and built those buildings next to it after 1923? There's still one of those narrow Cincinnati alleys with curbs there now.

Oh I see, the building at the corner in the 1923 picture is at Race and 7th, not Race and Lhommedieu (?) Alley.

3 minutes ago, GCrites80s said:

Oh I see, the building at the corner in the 1923 picture is at Race and 7th, not Race and Lhommedieu (?) Alley.

 

Yes.  When Macy's was built (or possibly earlier) they rerouted College around it.  Lhommedieu Alley still exists but only between Race and what used to be Roote Alley.  College now comes in from 7th where a building used to be and then occupies the location of Roote Alley until it angles to the southeast.  Borden Alley is now Morand. 

I am wondering if Newberry altered the building? I suspected fire as well seeing how many floors were removed

 

I found this ad from 1936

 

https://search-proquest-com.research.cincinnatilibrary.org/historical-newspapers/august-9-1936-page-14-98/docview/1882297121/se-2?accountid=39387

^A good ol' Five and Dime

post-dates the Newberry ad but here is a 1939 story of a fire

 

https://search-proquest-com.research.cincinnatilibrary.org/historical-newspapers/december-26-1939-page-1-14/docview/1882579722/se-2?accountid=39387

 

 

Yeah that fire looks pretty minor and doesn't seem to be much more than a smoke event.  

 

The JJ Newberry ad is intriguing because they would move to the corner of 6th and Race only 14 years later in 1950. I wonder if that could mean The Chong's facade was done after Newberry moved to the corner.  The details of the two buildings are quite similar, and just looking at The Chong facade I would've guessed it was from the 1940s or 1950s rather than 1930s (although the canopy is rather Art Deco-ish).  It's difficult to tell because the upper floor windows look more mid-century.  There could be many layers of intervention.  Chopping off the floors, Newberry's remodel, and adding the new facade don't all have to be concurrent events.  

It's weird today to think that Kroger would move into such an old building but it happened all the time in the old days.

8 minutes ago, jjakucyk said:

There could be many layers of intervention.  Chopping off the floors, Newberry's remodel, and adding the new facade don't all have to be concurrent events.  

 right. here is my last find on this. Found an interesting ad for the Butler Bros that has the store layout and actually lists the building contractors

 

 

^Ah yes, the bargain basement.  It was like a bargain bin but bigger and below the surface of the earth.  Those old stores would go out of their way to not fix up the basement in order to give it a mystique. 

 

That layout doesn't have any pillars.  I don't believe it.  I remember all of the old department stores having tons of pillars.  I remember there being mirrors on most pillars.  By contrast, bit box stores have poles. 

 

I remember one of the old stores (maybe LS Ayres) having a fine china section with black mirrors.  Like there was this whole Liberace/Trump Tower section of the store. 

 

11 minutes ago, GCrites80s said:

 Kroger would move into such an old building

 

Like Trump would say, Kroger moved in on her like a bitch. 

10 minutes ago, jmecklenborg said:

^Ah yes, the bargain basement.  It was like a bargain bin but bigger and below the surface of the earth.  Those old stores would go out of their way to not fix up the basement in order to give it a mystique. 

 

 

Oh certainly. There was a Five and Dime in Woodsfield that had an epic basement. And the Downtown Columbus Lazarus (The Main Lazarus) has TWO basements that looked like subway stations.

1 minute ago, GCrites80s said:

 

Oh certainly. There was a Five and Dime in Woodsfield that had an epic basement. And the Downtown Columbus Lazarus (The Main Lazarus) has TWO basements that looked like subway stations.

 

Filine's Basement in Boston was connected directly to a subway station, as was Macy's directly across the street. 

whoops sorry, didn't realize there was another page of updates. very late to the posts!

19 hours ago, preservationrestoration said:

This is the closest photo that I could find though the height of the building looks much shorter than what’s in the picture despite the fact the county has the Chong listed as being built in 1865 so I’m wondering if these buildings were reduced in height at some point

 

This photo isn't as clear but is a bit older (dated 1890) - looking north from 6th. Jouvet's, The Cleveland Rubber Company, and some other interesting tidbits off in the distance :

 

 

 

 

Brick removal on downtown Cincinnati building reveals Victorian-era storefront

 

 

Crews dismantling the brick façade of an old retail building on Race Street uncovered a Victorian-era storefront that hasn’t been seen in 70 years.

 

The Chong Inc., the quirky retailer located at 616 Race St., Downtown, that sold a hodgepodge of urban clothing, knickknacks and age-old electronics in their original packaging and seemed to always have “store closing” signs outside, actually did close last March due to the coronavirus pandemic.

 

Cincinnati Center City Development Corp.’s OTR Holdings Inc. purchased the building last year as part of redevelopment along Race Street.

https://www.taketheday.com/Business-changing-Cincinnati/The-Chong-Inc-Facade-3cdc/i-8BQdxch
 

More recent photos of the façade removal

1 hour ago, Ram23 said:

 

This photo isn't as clear but is a bit older (dated 1890) - looking north from 6th. Jouvet's, The Cleveland Rubber Company, and some other interesting tidbits off in the distance :

 

 

 

 

 

Back when the Garfield statue was in the middle of the street.  It must have been strange after it was moved since it was visible for such a long distance. 

 

 

 

 

 

13 minutes ago, jmecklenborg said:

 

Back when the Garfield statue was in the middle of the street.  It must have been strange after it was moved since it was visible for such a long distance. 

 

 

 

 

 

Not only moved from the center of the street, but also de-BASED to a lesser pedestal.  Do you think that Cincinnatians of a century ago pissed and moaned for years on end like they do about the Tyler Davidson Fountain being moved? People can't even seem to find it now, since they tucked it away in a corner.

24 minutes ago, cincity said:

Not only moved from the center of the street, but also de-BASED to a lesser pedestal.  Do you think that Cincinnatians of a century ago pissed and moaned for years on end like they do about the Tyler Davidson Fountain being moved? People can't even seem to find it now, since they tucked it away in a corner.

 

Streetcar tracks were never built on Race St.  If so, it would have been interesting to see them deviate briefly for this sculpture. 

 

Meanwhile, traffic circles have become a fad, and with them, the temptation to put terrible sculptures in the middle of them. 

 

I wonder if anybody lived above The Chong in recent years or if it was just storage. Like, "You know where to find me. I live above THE CHONG."

59 minutes ago, GCrites80s said:

I wonder if anybody lived above The Chong in recent years or if it was just storage. Like, "You know where to find me. I live above THE CHONG."

 

It's like that urban legend that there was an apartment above Bogart's. 

Should someone notify the American Sign Museum that “The Chong Inc” might be available to add to their collection ? 

23 minutes ago, NsideProp said:

Should someone notify the American Sign Museum that “The Chong Inc” might be available to add to their collection ? 

If they don’t take it I’m sure the turf club would.

It makes me wonder what the layout was during and after the Kroger era for that building. Did the escalators remain or were they boarded up?

What struck me walking by is how much the false front interrupted the rhythm of buildings coming down Race and, by contrast, how a restoration of the original facade could completely change the feel of that part of downtown. Also, it’s pretty neat to see this happening and then 100 yards away the modern addition being added Tetris style to the boutique hotel project on Seventh. 
 

Is there any chance whatsoever a similar thing could be done to Shillito’s at some point? Does the original facade still exist underneath the new one or is that not possible? 

Edited January 28, 20214 yr by Pdrome513

The Shillito Art Deco front is incredibly high quality. It shouldn’t be removed.  

Looking Southeast down Race St. Can really see how much taller it was. Taller than Lyric Piano building...white building.

We're also missing the fact that the small 2-story to the south of The Chong also used to be 7 stories.

4 minutes ago, JYP said:

We're also missing the fact that the small 2-story to the south of The Chong also used to be 6 stories.

 

They're all really similar to the stuff on 4th St. from McAlpin's over to Bromwell's.  

 

The one chopped down to 2 stories no doubt didn't have an elevator in it and it might have been cheaper to chop it down to two stories than install an elevator to otherwise unrentable upper floors.  

 

People still walk up to sixth floor walk-up apartments in Europe and occasionally in NYC.  I had a friend who lived in a fifth floor walk-up.  

6 minutes ago, JYP said:

We're also missing the fact that the small 2-story to the south of The Chong also used to be 6 stories.

It was actually 7 stories.  

12 minutes ago, cincity said:

It was actually 7 stories.  

Ah. Fixed it. Thanks!

29 minutes ago, JYP said:

We're also missing the fact that the small 2-story to the south of The Chong also used to be 7 stories.

 

I mentioned that the other day.  If The Chong was shortened because of a fire, it wouldn't surprise me if that building was involved, if not the originator. 

If I was the person who initially built the building I probably would want the building to be named for another tenant. It was probably built as The Ebenezer or something but people in the 2020s insist on calling it The Chong.

1 hour ago, jmecklenborg said:

 

 

People still walk up to sixth floor walk-up apartments in Europe and occasionally in NYC.  I had a friend who lived in a fifth floor walk-up.  

 

Not just NYC. Philly, Boston, Baltimore, New Jersey. I lived in a fifth floor walk-up in West Philly. They're pretty ubiquitous. It had radiator heat and no A/C of course. In the winter it would get so hot you'd have to keep your windows open. 

5 minutes ago, DEPACincy said:

 

Not just NYC. Philly, Boston, Baltimore, New Jersey. I lived in a fifth floor walk-up in West Philly. They're pretty ubiquitous. It had radiator heat and no A/C of course. In the winter it would get so hot you'd have to keep your windows open. 

 

Was that building built sometime around 1918? That heat phenomenon was instituted in response to the Spanish Flu. That way there would be air moving to vent the virus out of the building.

2 hours ago, jmecklenborg said:

 

People still walk up to sixth floor walk-up apartments in Europe and occasionally in NYC

There are a ton of 5 and 6 floor walk ups in NYC especially in Manhattan including the building I live in.

1 hour ago, GCrites80s said:

The Chong.

 

Maybe they're buying the FC stadium naming rights.  

Workers have to be careful when taking the signs off the building since they need to be transferred to the side of the stadium.

26 minutes ago, jmecklenborg said:

 

Maybe they're buying the FC stadium naming rights.  

One can honestly hope!

I looked through some old newspapers and found some tidbits. In 1947, the building was still 6 stories:

 

When Kroger leased the space in 1959, it was only four stories:

 

 

 

 

It also looks like the Kroger was a specialty/boutique store, billed as "Kroger on Race at Shillito Place." It was opened on October 18, 1960 and was designed by Raymond Loewy. According to another article, it was a test store of sorts and was one of the very first places to implement electronic checkout scanning.

 

 

The Kroger store closed after Christmas in 1969. The space was used for a few things, notably an electronics store in the 80s - which leads me to ask: were those old electronics in original boxes in the windows of The Chong only there because they were still sitting there when Chong bought the building? Did he just never bother to move them?

2 hours ago, Ram23 said:

I looked through some old newspapers and found some tidbits. In 1947, the building was still 6 stories:

 

 

 

 

It's interesting to see that comment regarding the size of the store compared to new suburban stores - when I was a kid a few of the original suburban Kroger stores were still in operation (i.e. Galbraith at Colerain, Northgate Mall, Camp Washington, etc.) and they were very small as compared to the supermarkets that came to replace them in the 1980s.