August 10, 20213 yr I’m glad they are real brick but they sure look like prefabricated panels. I’m just sayin’. I didn’t see any stockpiles of bricks around. It’s all an education to me seeing how these buildings get built. I love it. Build baby build! Edited August 10, 20213 yr by Silent Matt
August 10, 20213 yr Author 4 hours ago, mack34 said: I watched them do it. There were brick stacks You need more hobbies. 😉 "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
August 10, 20213 yr 34 minutes ago, KJP said: You need more hobbies. 😉 I was eating at Avo while they were doing the brickwork lol
August 10, 20213 yr Author Thanks again to @tykapsfor his assistance in helping me find the ID of one of the new restaurants! TUESDAY, AUGUST 10, 2021 Ohio City's INTRO is just the beginning When Harbor Bay Real Estate Advisors held a topping-off ceremony July 28 for its $145 million INTRO development, it wasn't signifying the peak of something. It was signifying the start of something even bigger. More than the final form of the mixed-use development is coming together on the southeast corner of Lorain Avenue and West 25th Street in Cleveland's Ohio City neighborhood. The tenants and end-users of the 350,000-square-foot development are also coming together. And Harbor Bay's own businesses are going to be the largest commercial end-users. MORE: https://neo-trans.blogspot.com/2021/08/ohio-citys-intro-is-just-beginning.html "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
August 10, 20213 yr Dan Whalen and Harbor Bay continue to impress me. Loved Intro before, love it even more now! That’s 150 more jobs than I expected that this project would create.
August 10, 20213 yr I'm having a hard time identifying their other self-operated "restaurants, event centers and other properties." Anyone else concerned by the developer retaining leasable space for its own use and proprietary concepts? This seems to signal an inability to attract quality tenants. I'm hoping the owner/occupancy will provide proof of viability to follow-on operators. These high-profile spaces would greatly benefit from the support/accountability that nationally licensed brands provide in terms of third-party standards for operations, management and financial resources.
August 10, 20213 yr ^ That was my immediate take too. A developer filling their own building with their own business’ is cool, but I’m hoping there’s much more it than that. It’s not a perfect analogy, but I can’t help thinking of Crop taking all the restaurant spaces at FEB, over-stretching and going bang within the year. My hovercraft is full of eels
August 10, 20213 yr It might be that they are not comfortable with Cleveland’s level of management or level of service for bars and restaurants. Do they want to work with the Georges? What other organizations are even interested? Most of Ohio City scene was self built by breweries. Tremont is a bunch of small independents. A winking lizard or paninis would not be the feel they might want. I can see bringing a more downtown Chicago flair in whatever that might entail They can save money by buying all the restaurant management software for use at all the restaurants as well as staffing and cross training. Disney, Cedar point, cruise ships all handle their own restaurants and bars. Why not a fancy new apartment building in Cleveland.
August 10, 20213 yr 49 minutes ago, grayfields said: I'm having a hard time identifying their other self-operated "restaurants, event centers and other properties." Anyone else concerned by the developer retaining leasable space for its own use and proprietary concepts? This seems to signal an inability to attract quality tenants. I'm hoping the owner/occupancy will provide proof of viability to follow-on operators. These high-profile spaces would greatly benefit from the support/accountability that nationally licensed brands provide in terms of third-party standards for operations, management and financial resources. Intro would greatly benefit from chains? Interesting.... Edited August 10, 20213 yr by Clefan98
August 10, 20213 yr 14 minutes ago, audidave said: Disney, Cedar point, cruise ships all handle their own restaurants and bars. Why not a fancy new apartment building in Cleveland. I'm curious how Harbor Bay compares to those operators. Can anyone identify what concepts they operate themselves? 6 minutes ago, Clefan98 said: Intro would greatly benefit from chains? Interesting.... It's not the first time that's been suggested, and I wouldn't doubt they solicited chains (there's a Target in their East Lansing development). If not chains, someone other than themselves operating a majority of the ground floor retail (there's Barrio, Jolly Pumpkin, local coffee chain in East Lansing too) would reflect favorably on project/neighborhood and validate funding decisions supporting other projects in the pipeline. But maybe I'm just not aware of Harbor Bay's storefront operations and they are the Disney of mixed use developments.
August 10, 20213 yr Thanks @KJP and @tykaps for the latest article. Dan Whalen's words and actions as of late have had an air of reverence for Cleveland and have been a breath of fresh air. As the building has risen, it has had a commanding street presence yet yielded to the West Side Market tower with its respectful massing. The news that Harbor Bay intends to not open a ramshackle construction office but establish a proper home in INTRO for future operations in the CLE market with aspirations of 150 staff bodes well for the Cleveland market having future contributions to our urban fabric from a first-class, quality firm who gets things done. Some firms finance an apartment building, sell it off immediately, and reinvest and leverage (literally) the capital for their next big project, but holding and growing a portfolio signals that a firm is going long on themselves if they're not holding out of mediocrity (see also: Scranton-Averell). I like @audidave's reference to operators such as Cedar Fair Entertainment, cruise lines, etc. Those tend to be insular developments, but walled gardens nonetheless; I don't get the sense that Harbor Bay is quite that standoffish. Love the mention of the Christkindl Holiday Market (really feels like Night Market!) as an example of public programming - spaces like Church and State with their whimsical slide really feel much more inviting than say...a service alley on Frankfort Ave. Can't wait to see what Harbor Bay brings over time. Edited August 10, 20213 yr by infrafreak
August 11, 20213 yr Author Big Red coming down... "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
August 11, 20213 yr 2 hours ago, KJP said: Big Red coming down... Here’s hoping Big Red’s hiatus is a brief one.
August 12, 20213 yr On 8/10/2021 at 12:03 PM, KJP said: Thanks again to @tykapsfor his assistance in helping me find the ID of one of the new restaurants! TUESDAY, AUGUST 10, 2021 Ohio City's INTRO is just the beginning When Harbor Bay Real Estate Advisors held a topping-off ceremony July 28 for its $145 million INTRO development, it wasn't signifying the peak of something. It was signifying the start of something even bigger. More than the final form of the mixed-use development is coming together on the southeast corner of Lorain Avenue and West 25th Street in Cleveland's Ohio City neighborhood. The tenants and end-users of the 350,000-square-foot development are also coming together. And Harbor Bay's own businesses are going to be the largest commercial end-users. MORE: https://neo-trans.blogspot.com/2021/08/ohio-citys-intro-is-just-beginning.html Another GREAT ARTICLE! THANKS KEN and TYKAPS! Great to hear about the long term office plans and the hiring of 150 more people! But a question about their 30,000 sq. ft. office in the INTRO building, that would take almost a complete floor of the building. Will it be in the 1st or 2nd apartment building, since its taking up so much room? Obviously they are here for the long term! And Its always nice to have another quality company planting roots in Cleveland!
August 20, 20213 yr it's a shame, but i can understand their waiting a bit to maybe try again with the office phase two building. i hope that works out because new office space in that prime site would be an excellent driver for ohio city/tremont. otherwise, glad to hear they are also thinking about just making it more residential if need be. i get the feeling that they are not going to sit on it a long time. wanting to be a gathering place for the area makes this project especially kind of remind me of the philly northern liberties piazza developments, and that is a very good thing.
August 20, 20213 yr Author 23 minutes ago, mrnyc said: it's a shame, but i can understand their waiting a bit to maybe try again with the office phase two building. i hope that works out because new office space in that prime site would be an excellent driver for ohio city/tremont. otherwise, glad to hear they are also thinking about just making it more residential if need be. i get the feeling that they are not going to sit on it a long time. wanting to be a gathering place for the area makes this project especially kind of remind me of the philly northern liberties piazza developments, and that is a very good thing. It won't be office.... https://neo-trans.blogspot.com/2021/08/ohio-citys-intro-is-just-beginning.html "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
August 21, 20213 yr Author A couple more buildings in the 10+ story range in that area would look real nice! 😉 "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
August 21, 20213 yr 7 hours ago, KJP said: A couple more buildings in the 10+ story range in that area would look real nice! 😉 I like it when there is a smiley winking after your comments . 👍
September 7, 20213 yr Just drove by yesterday and it looks great! Now if the city could repave the street and trim the weeds crawling all over the curbs, sidewalks and bridges it would really come together. The lack of basic maintenance is such an issue and probably only one that can be solved via incremental manpower funded by a business district association but it should be made a priority in areas like this.
September 7, 20213 yr 5 hours ago, OldEnough said: Just drove by yesterday and it looks great! Now if the city could repave the street and trim the weeds crawling all over the curbs, sidewalks and bridges it would really come together. The lack of basic maintenance is such an issue and probably only one that can be solved via incremental manpower funded by a business district association but it should be made a priority in areas like this. Or by actually make the city employees work an honest 8 hour day.
September 8, 20213 yr 9 hours ago, OldEnough said: Just drove by yesterday and it looks great! Now if the city could repave the street and trim the weeds crawling all over the curbs, sidewalks and bridges it would really come together. The lack of basic maintenance is such an issue and probably only one that can be solved via incremental manpower funded by a business district association but it should be made a priority in areas like this. The Ohio City Market District is a Business Improvement District which just last year triple in size now covering all of West 25 from Detroit Avenue to a little south of Lorain Avenue. And it covers all of Detroit Avenue up to West 33 Street and also covers all of Lorain Avenue up to West 50 Street. They have Cleaning and Safety Ambassadors maintaining and patrolling those areas in the same way as the DCA covers the Downtown CBD. http://www.ohiocity.org/OCIC/ Edited September 8, 20213 yr by Larry1962 More details and links
September 8, 20213 yr I would like to think that they can repave the street once Intro and Waterford Bluffs are not in heavy construction- I know there has been utility work on Intro that required them to dig part of Lorain up. It is getting pretty bad as you enter / exit the bridge...
September 8, 20213 yr Author 3 minutes ago, mrclifton88 said: I would like to think that they can repave the street once Intro and Waterford Bluffs are not in heavy construction- I know there has been utility work on Intro that required them to dig part of Lorain up. It is getting pretty bad as you enter / exit the bridge... What about the next heavy construction projects? 😉 "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
September 24, 20213 yr 3 hours ago, Ethan said: wow---from this angle, such a giant structure! thanks for the photo updates.
October 5, 20213 yr Intro project in Ohio City wins major economic-development award Michelle Jarboe - Crain's Cleveland Business - Oct. 5, 2021 "On Tuesday, Oct.5, the International Economic Development Council recognized Harbor Bay and the Greater Cleveland Partnership for teamwork on the nation's tallest structure built with mass timber. Representatives of the Chicago-area real estate company and the regional chamber of commerce accepted the gold award for excellence in public-private partnerships in large communities at the council's annual conference in Nashville. ... On Tuesday, the company was in the throes of closing on the $2 million purchase of a parking lot just south of Intro. The seller is an affiliate of MRN Ltd., a local development company that plans to remake the former Voss Industries complex along West 25th as a mixed-use project. For now, the parking lot will accommodate valet parking for Intro. But Dan Whalen, the Northeast Ohio native who serves as Harbor Bay's vice president of design and development, has visions of developing it — perhaps with a tower mixing apartments and condominiums."
October 5, 20213 yr I can't recall if the parking lot acquisition to the south of Intro had been reported before or not. Regardless, this is interesting news as Harbor Bay now controls all of the east side of West 25th from Lorain to the Red Line. The lot acquired from MRN isn't too large, but once combined with the rest of their properties and vacated ROWs, it could be a nice Phase 2 for the project - "perhaps with a tower mixing apartments and condominiums." Edit - From an Aug. 10, 2021 NeoTrans/KJP article - Ohio City's INTRO is just the beginning: "Whalen confirmed recent rumors that Harbor Bay was instead considering a multi-family building for its phase two in the Market Square District instead of the office building. He wouldn't confirm or deny additional rumors that the building's height would approach the 175-foot zoning limit for this area, meaning a building possibly exceeding 15 stories."
October 5, 20213 yr 35 minutes ago, NorthShore647 said: I can't recall if the parking lot acquisition to the south of Intro had been reported before or not. Regardless, this is interesting news as Harbor Bay now controls all of the east side of West 25th from Lorain to the Red Line. The lot acquired from MRN isn't too large, but once combined with the rest of their properties and vacated ROWs, it could be a nice Phase 2 for the project - "perhaps with a tower mixing apartments and condominiums." Edit - From an Aug. 10, 2021 NeoTrans/KJP article - Ohio City's INTRO is just the beginning: "Whalen confirmed recent rumors that Harbor Bay was instead considering a multi-family building for its phase two in the Market Square District instead of the office building. He wouldn't confirm or deny additional rumors that the building's height would approach the 175-foot zoning limit for this area, meaning a building possibly exceeding 15 stories." While the multi-family aspect had been reported on, I think this is the first news of them acquiring this parking lot. The original phase 2 plans didn't involve that lot at all.
October 5, 20213 yr 21 minutes ago, tykaps said: While the multi-family aspect had been reported on, I think this is the first news of them acquiring this parking lot. The original phase 2 plans didn't involve that lot at all. Correct. The initial plans with the Office Tower had Gehring meeting West 25th north of its existing intersection with Chatham to create additional space. I threw together these diagrams last year to demonstrate the site plan alterations w/ and w/o the Office Tower component. The newly acquired parking lot is to the right / south. The Phase 1 plans being built now maintains Gehring's existing alignment to Chatham. This would have given them less developable space for a Phase 2, however the newly acquired parking lot to the south creates a ~1.2 acre lot parallel to the Red Line for their multi-family structure.
October 6, 20213 yr How much Federal Infrastructure money could happen to support a deal like this bold (and expensive) little fantasy? I wonder how closely RTA would work with a private developer to create a massively scaled TOD, selling air rights over a new rapid station, with the potential to for said development to connect Tremont (Duck Island) with Ohio City in a single action. + How badly would this murder the Red Line Greenway?
October 6, 20213 yr Author I've asked a number of developers about building over the RTA right of way and none of them say that it is financially doable in a low-rent market like Cleveland with lots of underutilized, more easily developed land. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
October 7, 20213 yr ^^LOL, maybe the State of Ohio should create a "Transit Maximization Urban Development" tax credit. What? Those initials have already been used?
October 12, 20213 yr Nice write up of the restaurants and cafe that Harbor Bay will run at INTRO: “When completed in early 2022, the nine-story apartment complex, which sits across the street from the West Side Market, will have 35,000 square feet of retail. Within that mix will be a café and two restaurants, all operated by developer Harbor Bay Real Estate Advisors. The goal of those venues, according to Dan Whalen, VP of Design and Development, is to function as amenities for both the residents of INTRO as well as those living in the surrounding neighborhood and beyond. ” Article includes renders of the restaurants. When is the last time I-71 turned a profit?
October 12, 20213 yr Author Old news.... 😉 "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
October 18, 20213 yr On 10/12/2021 at 1:17 PM, Boomerang_Brian said: Nice write up of the restaurants and cafe that Harbor Bay will run at INTRO: “When completed in early 2022, the nine-story apartment complex, which sits across the street from the West Side Market, will have 35,000 square feet of retail. Within that mix will be a café and two restaurants, all operated by developer Harbor Bay Real Estate Advisors. The goal of those venues, according to Dan Whalen, VP of Design and Development, is to function as amenities for both the residents of INTRO as well as those living in the surrounding neighborhood and beyond. ” Article includes renders of the restaurants. Thanks, a lot of details on the restaurants that I had not seen before.
October 22, 20213 yr Just a small taste of the interiors but with the wood and floor to ceiling glass very much in contrast to your typical 4 story rectangle apartment building going up all over town (or should I say all over the nation).
October 22, 20213 yr 1 hour ago, Htsguy said: Just a small taste of the interiors but with the wood and floor to ceiling glass very much in contrast to your typical 4 story rectangle apartment building going up all over town (or should I say all over the nation). That is why I am not a fan of most new build "human warehousing"! This isnt my cup of tea, but very glad to see new development going up and strengthening core neighborhoods.
October 24, 20213 yr On 10/22/2021 at 2:37 PM, MyTwoSense said: That is why I am not a fan of most new build "human warehousing"! This isnt my cup of tea, but very glad to see new development going up and strengthening core neighborhoods. Human warehousing. You should trademark that. So tru
November 10, 20213 yr The website has been recently updated with new pictures, floorplans and pricing. It also is now officially leasing for Spring 2022 - I'll be really curious how quick this fills up! While on the higher end of the local apartment price point, the amenities / location / unit features are unlike anything else currently in the Cleveland market. Looks like studios start at $1,350/month. This really is such a cool development, and I love how the unit aesthetics and designs turned out. Bring on Phase 2! https://www.introcleveland.com/ Here are a few unit pics from the site:
November 10, 20213 yr That view from the first picture is outstanding! I only have one lament and I understand reaching the 50% pre-build is a tough one but man, I want to see a few high rise condos built here with views to die for. I'll be the first in line with a down payment.
Create an account or sign in to comment