From the Lumen thread...

 

2 hours ago, w28th said:

From the 8th floor of the Caxton...

 

 

I used my awesome iPad photoshop skills to add the Geis condo tower to the Lumen picture @w28th posted. I think it will actually be several stories taller than this. 

 

LOL!  I really hate having to sit on this story because it's a cool project, one that was forced to the surface by the geotech drilling rig making an appearance a couple weeks ago. But I hope you will find the wait was worth it.

9 hours ago, KJP said:

LOL!  I really hate having to sit on this story because it's a cool project, one that was forced to the surface by the geotech drilling rig making an appearance a couple weeks ago. But I hope you will find the wait was worth it.

You do a great job with always giving us exciting and fun information!  I check this site a couple times a day to see what new cool stuff there is..  i am normally not disappointed!

2 hours ago, KJP said:

Sorry, no red building visible on Prospect except for a few levels of parking deck. Basically trading the old deck for a new deck.

 

But let's stay focused on the new shiny building at left, at least in this thread. ?

 

Moving this back to the Geis condo tower thread - @KJP, wouldn’t  the relevant rules require a parking deck facing Prospect to have street level retail and a liner building above  (presumably condos or apartments) along Prospect? I figured that would have to be 4 or 5 stories. (Which I guess still wouldn’t be visible from TT over the county parking garage, but at least it would be nice for Prospect.)

 

10 minutes ago, Boomerang_Brian said:

 

Moving this back to the Geis condo tower thread - @KJP, wouldn’t  the relevant rules require a parking deck facing Prospect to have street level retail and a liner building above  (presumably condos or apartments) along Prospect? I figured that would have to be 4 or 5 stories. (Which I guess still wouldn’t be visible from TT over the county parking garage, but at least it would be nice for Prospect.)

 

 

Maybe, but not that I've heard.

This project will extend the skyline south the way the Lumen will extend the skyline east. Two of the most important and vibrant streets in Cleveland!

41 minutes ago, Terdolph said:

The most important part of the skyline to fill is the W3rd lots.

Ideally that location should be reserved for a corporate skyscraper facing the square. 

KJP  -   When are you going to get the OK to do the Geis Condo Tower Blog?.

1 hour ago, simplythis said:

KJP  -   When are you going to get the OK to do the Geis Condo Tower Blog?.

 

Soon. I may have another project for the blog to-do list. ?

On 6/25/2019 at 10:50 PM, KJP said:

LOL!  I really hate having to sit on this story because it's a cool project, one that was forced to the surface by the geotech drilling rig making an appearance a couple weeks ago. But I hope you will find the wait was worth it.

 

Just tell us this please:  how many stories?

Just now, Pugu said:

 

Just tell us this please:  how many stories?

 

It will take me only one blog story to describe it. ?

 

I could get it done in a full day, in military time.

^ Got it, thanks!  I would have hoped for taller, but as I've been dying for condos, I'll happily take it and its still a respectable height.

1 hour ago, KJP said:

 

It will take me only one blog story to describe it. ?

 

I could get it done in a full day, in military time.

 

WHAT ARE YOU TRYING TO SAY!!? ?

^i think he was saying 24 stories. (24 hrs--military time)

1 minute ago, Pugu said:

^i think he was saying 24 stories. (24 hrs--military time)

Great Scott, I hope that's true!

 

Assuming 24 stories, and a generous average ceiling height of 12 ft per floor, that's already 288 ft, so let's pray they add in 12 more feet at least ?

Military time goes quick @KJP, believe me. ?

@KJP Any news on this project?

6 minutes ago, NR said:

@KJP Any news on this project?

I was meaning to post something on this project last week after Geis made their presentation to Design Review for the Avenue District condo project and I forgot.

 

I believe it was at Design Review that Conrad Geis responded to a question about the height of the Avenue District Building (I think a panel member was questioning why it did not line up with the current building) and his response was something like they were self financing and could not go any higher than the building presented or it would not make economic sense (I guess he was referring to the untested condo market downtown and the risk that entailed but this is just speculation on my part).

 

With this as background I was wonder how such thinking will affect the proposed (yet still unannounced) condo at the Spaghetti House site.  There is speculation in this thread of a building approaching 20 stories or more.  Are there factors relating to this project which make it different from Avenue District in the Geis thought process?

 

3 minutes ago, Htsguy said:

I was meaning to post something on this project last week after Geis made their presentation to Design Review for the Avenue District condo project and I forgot.

 

I believe it was at Design Review that Conrad Geis responded to a question about the height of the Avenue District Building (I think a panel member was questioning why it did not line up with the current building) and his response was something like they were self financing and could not go any higher than the building presented or it would not make economic sense (I guess he was referring to the untested condo market downtown and the risk that entailed but this is just speculation on my part).

 

With this as background I was wonder how such thinking will affect the proposed (yet still unannounced) condo at the Spaghetti House site.  There is speculation in this thread of a building approaching 20 stories or more.  Are there factors relating to this project which make it different from Avenue District in the Geis thought process?

 

 

I had the exact same thought/concern!

26 minutes ago, Htsguy said:

I was meaning to post something on this project last week after Geis made their presentation to Design Review for the Avenue District condo project and I forgot.

 

I believe it was at Design Review that Conrad Geis responded to a question about the height of the Avenue District Building (I think a panel member was questioning why it did not line up with the current building) and his response was something like they were self financing and could not go any higher than the building presented or it would not make economic sense (I guess he was referring to the untested condo market downtown and the risk that entailed but this is just speculation on my part).

 

With this as background I was wonder how such thinking will affect the proposed (yet still unannounced) condo at the Spaghetti House site.  There is speculation in this thread of a building approaching 20 stories or more.  Are there factors relating to this project which make it different from Avenue District in the Geis thought process?

 

I think if the Avenue condos sell fast, then this project will be on the fast track. So fingers crossed the demand is there for the Avenue project.

8 minutes ago, WindyBuckeye said:

I think if the Avenue condos sell fast, then this project will be on the fast track. So fingers crossed the demand is there for the Avenue project.

 

Bingo. The Avenue condos are a test of the market. If it passes with flying colors, expect rapid movement with the tower.

Ugh...I saw @KJP wrote a post in this thread and excitingly clicked on it hoping for a juicy new blog post. Rooting for The Avenue condos even more now.

Where is the condo for Avenue District? I just looked at that thread and they all look like like (low-rise) townhomes.

1 minute ago, Pugu said:

Where is the condo for Avenue District? I just looked at that thread and they all look like like (low-rise) townhomes.

 

Wrong thread. This isn't the Avenue District. It about a proposed condo tower on Geis-owned land at East 9th and Bolivar.

^I know. But above you said, 

 

"Bingo. The Avenue condos are a test of the market. If it passes with flying colors, expect rapid movement with the [9th/Bolivar] tower."

 

what are you referring to?

 

23 hours ago, KJP said:

 

Bingo. The Avenue condos are a test of the market. If it passes with flying colors, expect rapid movement with the tower.

 

Dumb question—when I look at the low-rise Avenue condos, they look a bit...  bland and unappealing. Assuming (or hoping) a Spaghetti tower is quite a bit glitzier than Avenue II, will this market test really be a reasonable test?

 

i.e., can’t Avenue II fail but a condo tower still succeed because they’re entirely different products with different buyers? Or is the condo market such that a condo is a condo?

7 minutes ago, Clevecane said:

 

Dumb question—when I look at the low-rise Avenue condos, they look a bit...  bland and unappealing. Assuming (or hoping) a Spaghetti tower is quite a bit glitzier than Avenue II, will this market test really be a reasonable test?

 

i.e., can’t Avenue II fail but a condo tower still succeed because they’re entirely different products with different buyers? Or is the condo market such that a condo is a condo?

Same thoughts. And two entirely different locations.

I wonder if a Supertall, similar to the one's along Central Park South in Manhattan, with a condo/floor, could fit into that space?

9 minutes ago, Clevecane said:

 

Dumb question—when I look at the low-rise Avenue condos, they look a bit...  bland and unappealing. Assuming (or hoping) a Spaghetti tower is quite a bit glitzier than Avenue II, will this market test really be a reasonable test?

 

i.e., can’t Avenue II fail but a condo tower still succeed because they’re entirely different products with different buyers? Or is the condo market such that a condo is a condo?

Good question

Tell GEIS to partner with DIVVY homes. People can rent these condos after Divvy buys them til the occupant is ready to buy. They currently only operate in Cleveland and Atlanta. Wonder if they’d be interested in something like this.

 

Divvy rundown: ⬇️

https://www.housingwire.com/articles/42368-meet-divvy-startup-aims-to-revolutionize-rent-to-own

Edited September 14, 20195 yr by marty15

Not sure about condos due to the need to cover maintenance costs, but otherwise it could be a great idea, provided they meet their commitments to the potential buyer(s). A reliable vendor could certainly help renters-to-own and avoid the 2008 housing crisis that hit Cleveland and other cities so hard.

On 9/13/2019 at 11:18 AM, WindyBuckeye said:

I think if the Avenue condos sell fast, then this project will be on the fast track. So fingers crossed the demand is there for the Avenue project.

They should sell pretty fast with all the articles I've read over the years about the pent up demand for FOR SALE RESIDENTAL in DOWNTOWN.  And that some of the empty nesters moving DOWNTOWN really perfer that over renting!  Not to mention the 30's & 40's years olds who would also like to build up some equity too!

 

And that Columbus and Cincinnati are both having good luck with their Condos Downtown!!

Edited September 14, 20195 yr by Larry1962
Added 30's & 40's years olds

^ Agreed, although @KJP, I think, has previously alluded to these being expensive condos. Geis probably wanting to cream off the top end of the for sale market early. 

I think Marty15 is on to something.

 

If there are developer reservations about the for sale market, the rent-to-own-option could be a method of transitioning into the for sale market. It could also provide a viable option for those whose annual income disqualifies them for a traditional mortgage. It could open up numerous opportunities for new condo development.

Edited September 14, 20195 yr by Frmr CLEder

I hope they're not serious about the Avenue being a test market for this project. The Avenue simply isn't in a very desirable location right now.  Eventually there will be more things over there, but it's pretty isolated right now.

On 9/14/2019 at 11:33 AM, Frmr CLEder said:

I wonder if a Supertall, similar to the one's along Central Park South in Manhattan, with a condo/floor, could fit into that space?

I don't remember the exact size of that Spaghetti House lot, but a thin supertall, with one or two condos/floor would be nice. Cleveland's bedrock could support it and it could become one of the first outside of NYC or CHI.

Edited September 16, 20195 yr by Frmr CLEder

On 9/16/2019 at 2:04 PM, fishface said:

I hope they're not serious about the Avenue being a test market for this project. The Avenue simply isn't in a very desirable location right now.  Eventually there will be more things over there, but it's pretty isolated right now.

 

The reason why Geis' people apparently think this is a good test area is because the Knez townhomes are selling quickly, despite it being a less than desirable location. Yet they are selling for $200-250 per square foot. Geis staff also think they can offer nicer finishes than Knez's final products. And the condos are in a slightly better location. If the condos sell, and they think they will, watch for news to come quickly for the tower.

Edited September 18, 20195 yr by KJP

On 9/16/2019 at 2:17 PM, KJP said:

 

The reason why Geis' people apparently think this is a good test area is because the Knez townhomes are selling quickly, despite it being a less than undesirable location. Yet they are selling for $200-250 per square foot. Geis staff also think they can offer nicer finishes than Knez's final products. And the condos are in a slightly better location. If the condos sell, and they think they will, watch for news to come quickly for the tower.

 

^ so what’s the price point and who wants to give me a loan? ?

 

KJP, do you know if Spaghetti House would look drastically different (I.e., taller) than Avenue? Considering the location, I would assume so... but I suppose a simple 3-5 story building would fit in the context of the Gateway area. 

Price point for the Avenue condos is in the 400s. 

 

No, the East 9th condos will not look anything like the Avenue condos. Multiply the height of the Avenue condos by at least 4.

7 hours ago, KJP said:

Price point for the Avenue condos is in the 400s. 

 

No, the East 9th condos will not look anything like the Avenue condos. Multiply the height of the Avenue condos by at least 4.

 

That would definitely be an improvement.  However, I would love to see this and all future towers be 500ft or taller.  Hopefully there's enough demand and things workout that way.

40 minutes ago, NR said:

 

That would definitely be an improvement.  However, I would love to see this and all future towers be 500ft or taller.  Hopefully there's enough demand and things workout that way.

I also would love for all the future towers to be 500'+ tall!

 

BUT given ALL THE PARKING LOTS in Downtown Cleveland that need to filled with various types of buildings, it'll take many types, sizes, and uses to recreate our DOWNTOWN the way it was so many years ago!

Sorry, I have to rewrite the article. 

Edited February 23, 20205 yr by KJP

14 hours ago, KJP said:

Sorry, I have to rewrite the article. 

It was another great article Ken, why the rewrite??

 

And what's the ETA?

 

THANKS for your hard work!!

Edited February 23, 20205 yr by Larry1962

 

28 minutes ago, KJP said:

 

That's the baseline. The question is, what other cranes could be added to this? NuCLEus? Magellan? Cliffs? Rocket Mortgage? East 9th/Bolivar? Courthouse? Others?

 

So, @KJP, you hearing something about this one?

1 hour ago, LlamaLawyer said:

 

 

So, @KJP, you hearing something about this one?

 

🙊

Cross-post from ‘Random Dev’ thread 

 

Leaving the Tribe game tonight, saw that the Geis Condo Tower site at E9th & Bolivar has some world class signage saying ‘Development Site Available’. 
I drove down Bolivar early this morning and it definitely wasn’t there then. 

Very disappointing but not surprising given the crickets we have been hearing for so long.

Disappointing...or maybe not.  Too many "maybe's", but maybe the sign is gone because the site is spoken for by a developer...maybe

Don't be disappointed. Geis will build here, just not be the developer.

34 minutes ago, KJP said:

Don't be disappointed. Geis will build here, just not be the developer.

Good!  I hope the other developer hires a decent architect.  Geis' building on E. 12th is a turd.