December 22, 20204 yr If they were left vacant, it might not take them long to get completely destroyed by scrappers and squatters.
December 22, 20204 yr 5 hours ago, Pugu said: Great article, as always, KJP, thanks! Let's hope all of that gets built--would be so great for Hough. This part in bold stood out to me: "Behind it, on East 90th, Apri Development proposes a second phase that could offer 118 apartments divided among three new buildings with parking behind them. Five residences are proposed to be demolished. Three of them, all built in 2007, are vacant and in the city's land bank." Plenty of old, vacant units in Hough---but these are new--2007--why are they vacant? Just the economy? Crappy quality? As I commented on these in another thread, its just such an unfortunate waste. New houses built in a central city neighborhood, and they couldn't even last long enough to begin generating property taxes. Given the timing, I'm guessing the previous owners fell prey to the mortgage crisis, and then as someone above stated scrappers would have gotten to them quickly. That kind of cheap construction just doesn't strike me as worth saving if its going to be a full gut rehab. Not like a 1930s house that was originally built to last.
December 29, 20204 yr What's weird about those three newer infill houses is that, according to the County Auditor's site, they've been owned by the land bank since 2007. The builder (Cleveland New Construction Limited Partnership IV) transferred them directly to the city land bank. Sounds like they may have been a rent-to-own situation that never made it to the "own" part? I'm very confused about this one. They definitely had residents at some point, though.
January 9, 20214 yr Personally I can’t stand suburban housing in urban neighborhoods. And from the article it looks like there is more to come. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cleveland.com/realestate-news/2021/01/westlake-homebuilder-plans-100-houses-for-clevelands-hough-neighborhood.html%3foutputType=amp
January 9, 20214 yr 22 minutes ago, Watertiger1962 said: Personally I can’t stand suburban housing in urban neighborhoods. And from the article it looks like there is more to come. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cleveland.com/realestate-news/2021/01/westlake-homebuilder-plans-100-houses-for-clevelands-hough-neighborhood.html%3foutputType=amp Couldn’t agree more. Urban neighborhoods should not mimic the suburbs. They should be densely populated where all needs can be met in a 15 minute walk from home. Homes like this only encourage more vehicles and isolation.
January 9, 20214 yr Author So much amazing work being done to turn E 66th into a significant stretch of Hough. So many great and appropriate development proposals for the area (Frontline, WRJ, CLE Foundation, Library). And now they wanna put up 100 low density, garage fronted houses that don't fit in the neighborhood.
January 9, 20214 yr More coming! 😉 "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
January 9, 20214 yr Could not read the article but I got nervous this morning when I read the headline with the term "Westlake builder". Given the above posts I can see my trepidation was justified. Is this something design review and the Planning Commission can turn around in a hurry (does it have to go to Landmark? Those picky snots could turn things around in a heart beat)? Will they decide to forgo criticism given the potential investment in a neighborhood that sorely needs it? Edited January 9, 20214 yr by Htsguy
January 9, 20214 yr Today's Hough is a VERY eclectic mix and is peppered with suburban-style houses already. Working with individual lots, the developer proposes scattering a hundred more "suburbans" in the large E59-E71/Chester-Superior grid. Assuming he gets them all built, I don't think the visual difference will be noticeable, although the population growth (400?) will be. Remember: It's the Year of the Snake
January 9, 20214 yr I'm actually totally fine with this. Neighborhoods in the city each have A different feel and attract a different niche market.
January 9, 20214 yr 11 hours ago, Growth Mindset said: Couldn’t agree more. Urban neighborhoods should not mimic the suburbs. They should be densely populated where all needs can be met in a 15 minute walk from home. Homes like this only encourage more vehicles and isolation. I don’t know if it’s possible to vehemently disagree with this any more than I already do. The fact of the matter is people like housing like this, whether you like it or not. And the city of Cleveland is big enough to have every neighborhood be different, every neighborhood offer something for someone. “Suburban” style houses were built in Hough to begin with because the residents WANTED them there. The early history of Hough was one of wealth and the actual people who live there today wanted the neighborhood to be restored to the prestige it used to have. Furthermore, many of the people living in these homes are people who would be in the eastern suburbs if this housing style didn’t exist. You’d rather have them not be here at all vs living in housing that you don’t like? And if you want to get the black middle class back in Cleveland (which we should), you can forget it if you don’t have housing like this. There can at least be one neighborhood that gives people that kind of lifestyle that they want within the city limits. It ain’t gonna kill you to have that
January 9, 20214 yr 1 hour ago, freefourur said: I'm actually totally fine with this. Neighborhoods in the city each have A different feel and attract a different niche market. EXACTLY
January 10, 20214 yr If we were running out of land in Cleveland, I'd be a lot pickier about what got built on the remaining lots. I'm just happy that there seem to be enough families who want to live in Cleveland now that someone could propose building 100 suburban style houses. You could drop multiple sub-divisions into the empty land around the east side and we'd barely notice there is so much open space. Density is what makes cities go, but even the mostly densely populated cities in the US have large areas with more suburban feeling single family homes. There are plenty of parts of Philadelphia and New York City that are like that, even though most people think of the very dense parts of those cities. Density also follows people. If hundreds of new families move into Glenville, more dense city things are likely to follow because there will be the population to support them.
January 10, 20214 yr Suburban style or not, let's not pretend that these are going to bring Hough back to it's glory days of being some of Cleveland's finest housing. These look like junk- and junk from the 70's at that. I can't imagine they're going to last long.
January 10, 20214 yr 3 hours ago, freefourur said: I'm actually totally fine with this. Neighborhoods in the city each have A different feel and attract a different niche market. And by building these sections of lower density tract homes, it will encourage density in the already walkable areas, rather than providing cheap land for a developer to smash 5 townhomes onto a lot not close to anything.
January 10, 20214 yr If we were running out of land in Cleveland, I'd be a lot pickier about what got built on the remaining lots. I'm just happy that there seem to be enough families who want to live in Cleveland now that someone could propose building 100 suburban style houses. You could drop multiple sub-divisions into the empty land around the east side and we'd barely notice there is so much open space. Density is what makes cities go, but even the mostly densely populated cities in the US have large areas with more suburban feeling single family homes. There are plenty of parts of Philadelphia and New York City that are like that, even though most people think of the very dense parts of those cities. Density also follows people. If hundreds of new families move into Glenville, more dense city things are likely to follow because there will be the population to support them.Glenville is actually building pretty dense housing. These new homes while they have driveways are packed pretty tight together. Not to mention the apartments going up/being planned. I feel that hough has a fear of density due to how bad conditions were from people being packed so closely together pre to early post hough riots. Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk
January 10, 20214 yr ^The suburban McMansions were built at the time in an effort to bring back the black middle class by Fannie Lewis. I don’t think there’s a fear or aversion to dense housing in the neighborhood because it still exists, depending on what street you’re on. Some of the side streets close to Rockerfeller Park are relatively intact and still dense.
January 10, 20214 yr 32 minutes ago, MyPhoneDead said: Glenville is actually building pretty dense housing. These new homes while they have driveways are packed pretty tight together. Not to mention the apartments going up/being planned. I feel that hough has a fear of density due to how bad conditions were from people being packed so closely together pre to early post hough riots. Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk I meant Hough in my comment. Not sure why my hands typed Glenville. You are right that Glenville is already pretty dense, and will only get more so with all of the planned developments.
January 10, 20214 yr Author 2 hours ago, gg707 said: If we were running out of land in Cleveland, I'd be a lot pickier about what got built on the remaining lots. I'm just happy that there seem to be enough families who want to live in Cleveland now that someone could propose building 100 suburban style houses. You could drop multiple sub-divisions into the empty land around the east side and we'd barely notice there is so much open space. Density is what makes cities go, but even the mostly densely populated cities in the US have large areas with more suburban feeling single family homes. There are plenty of parts of Philadelphia and New York City that are like that, even though most people think of the very dense parts of those cities. Density also follows people. If hundreds of new families move into Glenville, more dense city things are likely to follow because there will be the population to support them. Those sub-divisions would last and take up land and set a precedent for the neighborhood for decades. Sure there's enough land now, but imagine if Ohio City and Tremont had spent the last 30 years building up houses designed like this.
January 10, 20214 yr 6 minutes ago, tykaps said: Those sub-divisions would last and take up land and set a precedent for the neighborhood for decades. Sure there's enough land now, but imagine if Ohio City and Tremont had spent the last 30 years building up houses designed like this. To be clear, these aren't sub-divisions being proposed. I was being facetious about building sub-divisions around Cleveland due to the sheer amount of open space around the city. These are single family homes mixed into a neighborhood that already has lots of single family homes. The picture just looks like a house on a street, with a small garage and a person riding a bike. This isn't some McMansion they are proposing. The spot where the first group of these is going is a giant vacant lot right now. At least half (if not more) of the lots on 66th between Superior and Chester are vacant, and most of the occupied lots are single family homes of various sizes and eras, so this isn't some dramatic departure from the typical housing in the area. I'm not sure I get what you are saying about Ohio City and Tremont. Imagine if reasonably priced single family homes had been built over the past 30 years in Tremont and Ohio City? Lots of areas in Tremont and Ohio City are single family homes and many of them were built over the past 30 years. Some of the houses are ugly. Other ones aren't. The houses in Tremont and Ohio City probably seem like a better investment for those area because they were more expensive of houses. I don't think Hough has a market for $500k plus custom homes like those neighborhoods do, but that doesn't mean that builders shouldn't build moderately priced for-sale housing in Hough. There is a need for moderate priced for-sale housing and these homes seem geared at that market.
January 10, 20214 yr 2 hours ago, tykaps said: Those sub-divisions would last and take up land and set a precedent for the neighborhood for decades. Sure there's enough land now, but imagine if Ohio City and Tremont had spent the last 30 years building up houses designed like this. Hough is not Ohio City. Hough is not Tremont. And it doesn’t have to be in order to be a successful neighborhood. There are over 30 neighborhoods in the city of Cleveland. All of them don’t have to look the same.
January 10, 20214 yr I mean I do agree. Dense or not those house look like sh*t. Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk
January 10, 20214 yr Author 2 hours ago, gg707 said: To be clear, these aren't sub-divisions being proposed. I was being facetious about building sub-divisions around Cleveland due to the sheer amount of open space around the city. These are single family homes mixed into a neighborhood that already has lots of single family homes. The picture just looks like a house on a street, with a small garage and a person riding a bike. This isn't some McMansion they are proposing. The spot where the first group of these is going is a giant vacant lot right now. At least half (if not more) of the lots on 66th between Superior and Chester are vacant, and most of the occupied lots are single family homes of various sizes and eras, so this isn't some dramatic departure from the typical housing in the area. I'm not sure I get what you are saying about Ohio City and Tremont. Imagine if reasonably priced single family homes had been built over the past 30 years in Tremont and Ohio City? Lots of areas in Tremont and Ohio City are single family homes and many of them were built over the past 30 years. Some of the houses are ugly. Other ones aren't. The houses in Tremont and Ohio City probably seem like a better investment for those area because they were more expensive of houses. I don't think Hough has a market for $500k plus custom homes like those neighborhoods do, but that doesn't mean that builders shouldn't build moderately priced for-sale housing in Hough. There is a need for moderate priced for-sale housing and these homes seem geared at that market. My argument is that this style of single family home, not single family homes as a whole, doesn't belong in an urban setting. I am not arguing they need to be super fancy or expensive. I am arguing that they should be designed more like the historic urban housing stock. Garages in the back, not up against the street wall. Deep lots, not wide. Higher density of houses, not spread out and unaccommodating to a walkable community. Knez's development of single family homes in Glenville as an example seems much better scaled and more appropriate for an urban neighborhood in my opinion. There's nothing wrong with neighborhoods being different or some being entirely SFH. But that doesn't mean we should be building them like a suburb. I personally feel that has no place in the city. But we'll just have to wait and see what the planning commission does and just what the final plans will look like.
January 10, 20214 yr Exactly. It's not necessarily about the the style (personally the garage in front is, hard stop for me) but how much land these will be taking up. That I can't tell from article. Are they going to be 2-3 lots wide? Yes, there is lots of open land in that neighborhood now but to @tykapspoint that can change quickly. Build for the future is what I say.
January 10, 20214 yr 45 minutes ago, viscomi said: Exactly. It's not necessarily about the the style (personally the garage in front is, hard stop for me) but how much land these will be taking up. That I can't tell from article. Are they going to be 2-3 lots wide? Yes, there is lots of open land in that neighborhood now but to @tykapspoint that can change quickly. Build for the future is what I say. What are the frontages there? That home looks like it could easily fit on a 60 foot frontage judging by the square footage. I know when I worked in South Euclid we fit some new build homes like that on 60 foot frontages. @PoshSteve can correct me if I'm wrong. Heck it might have been an even smaller frontage. Edit: just looked at the zoning map for SE. The frontage was 40. Edited January 10, 20214 yr by KFM44107
January 10, 20214 yr 2 hours ago, KFM44107 said: What are the frontages there? That home looks like it could easily fit on a 60 foot frontage judging by the square footage. I know when I worked in South Euclid we fit some new build homes like that on 60 foot frontages. @PoshSteve can correct me if I'm wrong. Heck it might have been an even smaller frontage. Edit: just looked at the zoning map for SE. The frontage was 40. https://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/4246-Ellison-Rd_South-Euclid_OH_44121_M37427-47169 Here is a link to the new build in question.
January 11, 20214 yr On 1/10/2021 at 4:35 AM, KFM44107 said: https://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/4246-Ellison-Rd_South-Euclid_OH_44121_M37427-47169 Here is a link to the new build in question. Good call. Those look pretty close to the rendering in the Hough article. It seems like a lot of the parcels on 66th fall in 25-40 foot frontage range. Hopefully we don't see too much parcel consolidation for these.
January 11, 20214 yr Author On 12/3/2020 at 2:27 PM, KJP said: Blow-ups of the renders.... Design has been updated slightly:
January 11, 20214 yr Author Also based on permits, the current name for the project is the "Addis View Apartments." Design change isn't perfect but definitely an improvement over the last iteration. Still wish they'd just add some more individual unit entrances along the street to better activate the space. Otherwise I'd argue that's a bit too much dead frontage along the street. Edited January 11, 20214 yr by tykaps
January 11, 20214 yr Glad to see the balconies added. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
January 14, 20214 yr Any Idea what would be good for the neighborhood at Hough and 84th? A pizza shop? Ice cream Shop? Fast Food? Take out only and drive thru, no sit down place? Housing? The little building that looked like it was a gas station but it wasn't.. Next to the old pick n pay, it survived the riots.
January 26, 20214 yr View: https://www.google.com/maps/place/1755+Crawford+Rd,+Cleveland,+OH+44106/@41.5091293,-81.6273951,3a,75y,77.53h,91.52t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sFduo7DEGK21eiBDyNXglCQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192!4m5!3m4!1s0x8830fbbdbfa992c9:0xc6bb2fdc991ebca4!8m2!3d41.509066!4d-81.626964 "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
January 26, 20214 yr On 1/14/2021 at 1:56 PM, Loves2Think said: Any Idea what would be good for the neighborhood at Hough and 84th? A pizza shop? Ice cream Shop? Fast Food? Take out only and drive thru, no sit down place? Housing? The little building that looked like it was a gas station but it wasn't.. Next to the old pick n pay, it survived the riots. someone tried to open an ice cream shop near League Park back in the TJ Dow days. Dow was against it because he said it would bring crime to the neighborhood. The dude was clueless and chased away good projects. I hope someone tries to bring back an idea like that.
January 26, 20214 yr 18 minutes ago, KJP said: View: https://www.google.com/maps/place/1755+Crawford+Rd,+Cleveland,+OH+44106/@41.5091293,-81.6273951,3a,75y,77.53h,91.52t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sFduo7DEGK21eiBDyNXglCQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192!4m5!3m4!1s0x8830fbbdbfa992c9:0xc6bb2fdc991ebca4!8m2!3d41.509066!4d-81.626964 I hope this doesn't include the middle building with the ornate facade. It looks like it could be quite beautiful with a good power wash.
January 26, 20214 yr 39 minutes ago, LlamaLawyer said: I hope this doesn't include the middle building with the ornate facade. It looks like it could be quite beautiful with a good power wash. No applications have been filed for the property next door, 1753 Crawford, since 2013 which was a commercial exterior alterations permit. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
January 26, 20214 yr Author 36 minutes ago, LlamaLawyer said: I hope this doesn't include the middle building with the ornate facade. It looks like it could be quite beautiful with a good power wash. There was another building designed with inspiration from that bank. It would go right across from E 86th St. I haven't heard anything about it in quite a while. Cool concept though. http://udltd.com/african-heritage-business-district/
January 26, 20214 yr 1 hour ago, KJP said: View: https://www.google.com/maps/place/1755+Crawford+Rd,+Cleveland,+OH+44106/@41.5091293,-81.6273951,3a,75y,77.53h,91.52t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sFduo7DEGK21eiBDyNXglCQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192!4m5!3m4!1s0x8830fbbdbfa992c9:0xc6bb2fdc991ebca4!8m2!3d41.509066!4d-81.626964 I wouldn't be so bothered by demolitions but the architectural vision that replaces many of these structures today is all too often bland, or even downright ugly if one even comes. Are we really the minority when it comes to design? Hough is imbued with a character that is so worth the investment to revitalize. I actually can't understand why the builders today all construct the same damn thing. Edited January 26, 20214 yr by FutureboyWonder
January 26, 20214 yr Author On 9/14/2020 at 11:23 AM, KJP said: There's a permit application pending for a tenant fit-out of the ground-floor retail space at the Axis on Ansel, 1750 Ansel Rd. The architectural documents attached to the permit application don't identify the tenant for the 1,094-square-foot space at the corner of Ansel and Hough, however. The applicant is the apartment building's developer, Signet Real Estate Group. The blueprints state only that the work will consist of: FIT OUT OF RESTROOM AND ELECTRICAL CLOSET FOR A PROPOSED TENANT. ALL TENANT WORK SHALL BE PERMITTED SEPARATELY FROM THIS APPLICATION AND CONTRACT DOCUMENTS. I'm a bit late in posting this, but the tenant is Fawaky Burst, a smoothie shop.
January 26, 20214 yr Fawaky Burst should be a good fit and do well there. Good smoothies and seems to be popular. He's expanding the location in South Euclid now too.
January 28, 20214 yr On 1/26/2021 at 10:57 AM, freefourur said: someone tried to open an ice cream shop near League Park back in the TJ Dow days. Dow was against it because he said it would bring crime to the neighborhood. The dude was clueless and chased away good projects. I hope someone tries to bring back an idea like that. Try to keep this quiet...There is a group trying to bring HOUGH HEIGHTS PIZZA to 8399 Hough Ave in the very near future. Basheer Jones is really trying to help this project come to light, he's young and great guy with a vision. There's little choice for hot foods on Hough between 55&105 so this should be a welcomed idea, no? I hear it's pizza, wings, beef sandwiches, and salads...cashless too Edited January 28, 20214 yr by Loves2Think
February 5, 20214 yr Author Also worth mentioning here that Signet's Axis at Ansel is about 90% full according to today's Crain's article about their upcoming Midtown development. Very impressive speed to fill it all up.
February 5, 20214 yr Author And one more Hough development: The Madame CJ Walker Business District, at the corner of Hough Ave and E86th/Crawford. According to Councilman Basheer Jones, they have letters of intent from Faith Community United Credit Union, a beauty salon, a pet store, and a funeral home. 2 or 3 retail units will be available for short term leases (6 or fewer months) to act as business incubators.
February 5, 20214 yr 1 hour ago, tykaps said: And one more Hough development: The Madame CJ Walker Business District, at the corner of Hough Ave and E86th/Crawford. Neighborhood retail, built up to the street, with the parking tucked in the rear! Somebody gets it, bravo!
February 6, 20214 yr Nice- hopefully it will attract some investment to those great historic buildings right across Crawford as well!
February 14, 20214 yr There was a buyer for this property but apparently they walked away or couldn't get financing for it. Considering the brand-new neighboring Axis on Ansel is already 90 percent leased, one would hope that this property can get a new life as a result of this auction. Some cool drone video at the link below..... https://www.loopnet.com/Listing/Vacant-Multi-Family-and-18-Acre-Land/22142025/ "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
March 15, 20214 yr Author On 12/21/2020 at 6:24 PM, KJP said: Should probably post these images of the Arpi Apartments, 1865 West 93rd, from my latest article...... https://neo-trans.blogspot.com/2020/12/health-tech-corridor-to-see-busier-2021.html Mind the crappy quality of the BOZA livestream which I took a screenshot of. The colors have changed for the Arpi development.
March 15, 20214 yr 9 minutes ago, tykaps said: Mind the crappy quality of the BOZA livestream which I took a screenshot of. The colors have changed for the Arpi development. For the upper left image I am looking more at the old pick-up than the fancy building behind it. Maybe not the best focal point?
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