I would think if Spicy Run was a good location that the Perfect family that owns Perfect North would’ve bought that instead of Timberline in Davis, WV.  Timberline is still 4-5 hours from all major Ohio population centers. 

Aspen and Vail tend to attract lots of snobs.  I prefer to go to more unpretentious ski areas.  Utah is great.  Most of the ski resorts are less than an hour from Salt Lake City.  And Delta is (or was pre-Covid) flying non-stop from CLE to SLC.

Spicy Run could've pulled a Boyne Mountain and make it a full-on resort if it wanted to and it'd be as popular as, say, Mad River Mountain.

6 hours ago, audidave said:

I would think if Spicy Run was a good location that the Perfect family that owns Perfect North would’ve bought that instead of Timberline in Davis, WV.  Timberline is still 4-5 hours from all major Ohio population centers. 

Timberline is close to Pittsburgh. Plus it was a fully developed resort. Spicy Run was only around for 10 years or less. It was undercapitalized and was unable to finish the long term development before running out of funding. It likely did not make sense to keep Spicy Run operating even with new ownership given the capital cost to do so and do it right.

^Pittsburgh has many options for ski resorts already. 7Springs is the main one people go to. Nearby to that is Hidden Valley also owned by 7Springs. If they want to go to ski over 1000 vertical they can ski at blue knob under 2 hours away. Timberline is over 3hrs away from Pittsburgh.  

7 minutes ago, audidave said:

^Pittsburgh has many options for ski resorts already. 7Springs is the main one people go to. Nearby to that is Hidden Valley also owned by 7Springs. If they want to go to ski over 1000 vertical they can ski at blue knob under 2 hours away. Timberline is over 3hrs away from Pittsburgh.  

But again, Timberline was a fully built out resort whereas Spicy Run was just getting started. Plus 15 years ago, the Perfect family finances were probably different than they are today. 

On 2/15/2021 at 9:08 AM, David said:

Isn't Aspen like 200 miles away from Denver? It's definitely in the middle of nowhere. I was watching a video yesterday about how skiing isn't nearly as popular as it used to be in the 80s. It was a baby boomer sport. Millennials enjoy it but can't afford it since all their money goes to student loan interest. 

 

Aspen has its own little airport if money is no object and you want to fly in (looks like mostly through Denver) to avoid a ~4 hour road trip.

16 minutes ago, DarkandStormy said:

 

Aspen has its own little airport if money is no object and you want to fly in (looks like mostly through Denver) to avoid a ~4 hour road trip.

And if safety is no object 😬 Apparently it's the most dangerous airport in the U.S. Although you're probably still more likely to die in a skiing accident or driving from Denver. That's funny... airports to service remote towns of 7k people.

I flew into Aspen for a wedding in summer 2019. The price was right and it saved me hours of driving from Denver. I was also able to take the free bus to my hotel, so I didn't have to rent a car. Overall it saved me money

Yeah, Aspen probably has the best public transportation in America, on a per capita basis. Buses everywhere. There's six just in this picture. Seven if you count that shuttle.

 

Edited February 16, 20214 yr by David

20 minutes ago, ryanlammi said:

I flew into Aspen for a wedding in summer 2019. The price was right and it saved me hours of driving from Denver. I was also able to take the free bus to my hotel, so I didn't have to rent a car. Overall it saved me money

The majority of those towns have the free shuttles which are nice. I know Keystone/Breck have shuttles and same with Winter Park to take the locals around. It makes sense given the fact that you do not need to have people at the resort find parking and such. 

I really like the Tahoe areas, especially North Tahoe because you can fly into Reno, take a cab or the casino shuttle over to a Casino where you can stay rather cheaply. You can get a discount ticket at the Casino and they offer a shuttle bus to the ski resort for the day and back. You get done at the end of the day and can choose many options for dinner and if lady luck is on your side you can pay for your trip at the craps table

The only problem with Tahoe is skiing in "Sierra Cement". 

 

My scariest flight experience ever was flying into Reno during a snowstorm.  The landing was aborted. We went back up and were circling for what seemed like an eternity as the plane was shaking like a leaf.  While circling, the pilot forgot to turn off the intercom while asking the tower how bad the wind shears were.  On the second approach, the girl sitting next to me was in the crash position with her fingernails digging into my leg.  Fortunately, we landed safely.

 

Edited February 17, 20214 yr by skiwest

7 minutes ago, skiwest said:

The only problem with Tahoe is skiing in "Sierra Cement". 

 

My scariest flight experience ever was flying into Reno during a snowstorm.  The landing was aborted. We went back up and were circling for what seemed like an eternity as the plane was shaking like a leaf.  While circling, the pilot forget to turn off the intercom while asking the tower how bad the wind shears were.  The girl sitting next to me was in the crash position with her fingernails digging into my leg.  

I freak out from the smallest amount of turbulence. The only thing that could make that story more terrifying is if you flew Spirit Airlines.

On 2/15/2021 at 3:56 PM, Brutus_buckeye said:

Timberline is close to Pittsburgh. Plus it was a fully developed resort. Spicy Run was only around for 10 years or less. It was undercapitalized and was unable to finish the long term development before running out of funding. It likely did not make sense to keep Spicy Run operating even with new ownership given the capital cost to do so and do it right.

Timberline is an absolute gem, too. Some of the best skiing within a 6 hour drive of Columbus. 1000' vertical, really good terrain and a 2 mile run. So glad to see the Perfect's fixed it up.

49 minutes ago, Gino27 said:

Timberline is an absolute gem, too. Some of the best skiing within a 6 hour drive of Columbus. 1000' vertical, really good terrain and a 2 mile run. So glad to see the Perfect's fixed it up.

How does Timberline compare to Seven Springs, Snowshoe or Holiday Valley if you have experience at either of those places? How does it compare to Canaan Valley if you have been there too?

 

We have a pass to Perfect North so it may be worth a long weekend trip to Timberline next year. 

Another resort that is 5-6hrs of Ohio that has 1200ft of vertical is Bristol Mountain in the finger lakes in NY. Half the driving distance to Vermont.  They have a couple of high speed quads. 

18 hours ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

How does Timberline compare to Seven Springs, Snowshoe or Holiday Valley if you have experience at either of those places? How does it compare to Canaan Valley if you have been there too?

 

We have a pass to Perfect North so it may be worth a long weekend trip to Timberline next year. 

I haven't been to Timberline since the big renovation. The terrain is way better than Canaan valley and pretty similar to Holiday Valley. I've yet to go to Seven Springs or Snowshoe, but I'd imagine they have nicer amenities. Timberline usually has the best prices though.

9 minutes ago, Gino27 said:

I haven't been to Timberline since the big renovation. The terrain is way better than Canaan valley and pretty similar to Holiday Valley. I've yet to go to Seven Springs or Snowshoe, but I'd imagine they have nicer amenities. Timberline usually has the best prices though.

Snoeshoe and Holiday Valley have longer runs and more runs than 7 Springs. About 1/2 the terrain at 7 Springs is an 800 ft vertical while the other half is a 400 ft vertical. There are only about 30 slopes there. 7 Springs is a good family resort though and offers a lot of other amenities outside of skiing.

21 hours ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

Snoeshoe and Holiday Valley have longer runs and more runs than 7 Springs. About 1/2 the terrain at 7 Springs is an 800 ft vertical while the other half is a 400 ft vertical. There are only about 30 slopes there. 7 Springs is a good family resort though and offers a lot of other amenities outside of skiing.

 

The longest run at HV is (off the top of my head here), about 3/4 of a mile.  You can loop from the front face to the north face at 7S and it'll take you 1.5 miles.  Of course, it's a mostly flat green.  I think 7S may have one more two more runs that are over a mile.

 

Snowshoe, I think, has fewer runs but a bit more vert.  You can get 1,500 feet if you go across the road and don't mind the blacks/double blacks.

Edited February 18, 20214 yr by DarkandStormy

2 minutes ago, DarkandStormy said:

 

The longest run at HV is (off the top of my head here), about 3/4 of a mile.  You can loop from the front face to the north face at 7S and it'll take you 1.5 miles.  Of course, it's a mostly flat green.  I think 7S may have one more two more runs that are over a mile.

 

Snowshoe, I think, has fewer runs but a bit more vert.  You can 1,500 feet if you go across the road and don't mind the blacks/double blacks.

You are right. Lost Boy and lost Girl at 7S are both over a mile, but they are green runs. They are still enjoyable though. 

 

I was more commenting on the vertical of those areas where I have found Snowshoe and Holiday Valley to have longer more challenging runs on the whole. 

3 minutes ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

You are right. Lost Boy and lost Girl at 7S are both over a mile, but they are green runs. They are still enjoyable though. 

 

I was more commenting on the vertical of those areas where I have found Snowshoe and Holiday Valley to have longer more challenging runs on the whole. 

 

7S does have more ramps/jumps/rails if that's your thing.  I've found 7S to be much too crowded during peak weekends for my liking so it's been a few years since I've been.

4 minutes ago, DarkandStormy said:

 

7S does have more ramps/jumps/rails if that's your thing.  I've found 7S to be much too crowded during peak weekends for my liking so it's been a few years since I've been.

Pretty much any Saturday during ski season is packed there.  

 

For me, it is a reasonable drive for a weekend and the kids love the lodge there.  Unfortunately, from Cincinnati, Holiday Valley and some of the decent NY area resorts are an extra couple hours than what they would be in NE Ohio so my quicker weekend options are more limited. 

 

When it made getting to Holiday Valley and Peak N Peak a breeze. 

I had a hard time justifying going to Boston Mills and Brandywine. SnowTrails was Ok, but that was still 90 minutes away. 

 

On a separate note, didn't there used to be a second ski area in Mansfield at one time?

Just chiming in to say I went to Holiday Valley last Friday and it was great - honestly it's the least busy I've ever seen it, no lines and they were sending empty chairs up which never happens. We ended up making food in the parking lot (camp stove, chairs, beers) to avoid indoor dining/prices but even so, dining was quiet when we had to go in the lodges. Not sure what their weekend covid capacity is (it was sold out last Saturday), but I'd definitely recommend going out for a weekday if you're able.  

 

Left Cleveland around 7A and got back here around midnight. Long day but totally worth it!

A lot of Canadians go to Holiday Valley as well. Since they are not coming across the border it has meant that Ellicottville is a bit emptier than usual.  Also there are travel restrictions for people coming from Ohio. So Clevelanders are not coming in force like they normally would.  

 

There is nothing like the North Face at 7Springs at Holiday Valley either. 

That is a massive 750 vertical of skiing on 3 very wide slopes. 

49 minutes ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

On a separate note, didn't there used to be a second ski area in Mansfield at one time?

There was a place called Clear Fork in that vicinity.  Apparently it is called Clear Fork Adventure Park now.  I don't know if skiing is still available there.

1 hour ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

On a separate note, didn't there used to be a second ski area in Mansfield at one time?

 

Yeah, Clear Fork.  It had maybe 6-7 total runs.  It's where I learned to ski as a kid lol.

 

Here's a 2015 article on it - https://www.mansfieldnewsjournal.com/story/news/local/2015/11/25/clear-fork-ski-area-open-new-name-and-offerings/76368284/

 

And the old trail maps - https://skimap.org/SkiAreas/view/275  It was basically a mini version of Mad River with a few "black" runs to the right that was all essentially one hill and then a couple of "turns" or "loops" off of the middle/left lifts (if you're at the base facing the mountain).  About the same vertical (300ish feet).

Edited February 18, 20214 yr by DarkandStormy

^ I had some friends who learned to ski there many years ago. When did it close? You sent the link from 2015, but I could not find anything else to show it is still operating. 

 

Snowtrails is obviously a bit bigger, but I always heard good things about Clear Fork (or as I always referred to it as the other place in Mansfield).

22 hours ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

^ I had some friends who learned to ski there many years ago. When did it close? You sent the link from 2015, but I could not find anything else to show it is still operating. 

 

Snowtrails is obviously a bit bigger, but I always heard good things about Clear Fork (or as I always referred to it as the other place in Mansfield).

 

Based on the article, it looks like they stopped ski operations in 2014?  It said they planned to open up tubing in late 2015 (no idea if they still have it) but the fact that they didn't mention anything about lift tickets or skiing makes me think they stopped around then (and that sort of lines up with my recollection of realizing it was no longer around).  Hard to imagine they could be very profitable with how small their footprint is/was and how much snow they probably had to make.

On 2/18/2021 at 11:32 AM, GISguy said:

Just chiming in to say I went to Holiday Valley last Friday and it was great - honestly it's the least busy I've ever seen it, no lines and they were sending empty chairs up which never happens. We ended up making food in the parking lot (camp stove, chairs, beers) to avoid indoor dining/prices but even so, dining was quiet when we had to go in the lodges. Not sure what their weekend covid capacity is (it was sold out last Saturday), but I'd definitely recommend going out for a weekday if you're able.  

So it sounds like New York's travel restrictions for out-of-state visitors is not being strictly enforced, correct?

17 hours ago, skiwest said:

So it sounds like New York's travel restrictions for out-of-state visitors is not being strictly enforced, correct?

Yep, you're correct. Maybe there would've been more concerns had I stayed overnight but I didn't notice anything out of the ordinary...

On 2/17/2021 at 1:11 PM, Gino27 said:

I haven't been to Timberline since the big renovation. The terrain is way better than Canaan valley and pretty similar to Holiday Valley. I've yet to go to Seven Springs or Snowshoe, but I'd imagine they have nicer amenities. Timberline usually has the best prices though.

 

Snowshoe has about the same amount of skiable terrain (250+ acres) as Seven Springs, but you can do a 1500' vertical, which is as high as it gets south of, say, Lake Placid.  Most of the mountain does about 800 feet of vertical though.  It feels really mountain-like, because the village is at the top of the mountain, over 4800' elevation.  And the village is very much like a Western resort, because it was done by Intrawest (which is now Alterra).  

 

Both Snowshoe and Seven Springs would be significantly bigger in terms of total skiable area and amenities, but by all accounts, Timberline has awesome skiing.  Snowshoe and Timberline get about the same amount of snowfall, because of their locations/altitude (they are currently around 100" already this season in natural snowfall).  

On 2/18/2021 at 11:32 AM, GISguy said:

Just chiming in to say I went to Holiday Valley last Friday and it was great - honestly it's the least busy I've ever seen it, no lines and they were sending empty chairs up which never happens. 

Ditto for Peek'n Peak.  I went there yesterday.  Conditions were great and there were no lift lines.   The main lodge was only about 1/4 full when we stopped for a lunch break around 1:00 pm.

Brandywine, Boston Mills ski resorts to get new chairlifts for 2022-23 season

Susan Glaser - Cleveland.com - Sep. 23, 2021

 

 

"Both Brandywine and Boston Mills ski resorts are slated to get new, four-person chairlifts, but not until the 2022-23 ski season. The local investment was included in a larger announcement from Vail Resorts, which said it will spend $320 million next season across 14 properties. Boston Mills, located in Summit County’s Boston Township, will get a new four-person chairlift to replace an existing two-person lift. Brandywine, in Sagamore Hills Township, will also get a new four-person lift, which will replace a triple lift."

^For clarity, I know they are referring to the North Bowl double chair at BM and I suspect they are referring to the Champagne chair at BW. 

  I hope they do a bit of rearranging of lifts at BM with moving the triple lift from BW to get rid of the last double at BM in beginner area. 

   There were rumors last year that Vail was going to update all lifts with restraining bars on lifts.  Not sure that will happen. 

   They are knocking down the main bridge this year to get over to slopes at BW.  To access slopes the only way will be to walk over to the maintenance bridge close to shredder slope until they build a new bridge for the 2023 season. 

I wonder if they could add about 3,000 vertical feet?   😀

I know there were (actual, not theoretical) discussions about extending a run at BM by about 65 vertical feet a couple years ago. 

Will they be high speed quads?

we have them at Alpine Valley (WI) which has similar vertical to BM/BW 

The article says they are "fixed grip" lifts, so apparently they are not high speed.   

On 9/30/2021 at 3:24 PM, YABO713 said:

I know there were (actual, not theoretical) discussions about extending a run at BM by about 65 vertical feet a couple years ago. 

That would seem to be an expensive endeavor for a minimal return. As nice as it would be, how many more people would go to BM or BW because of the longer hill? I think they pretty much have the Cleveland market already.

 

I have a friend who works for an investment company that invests in Vail Resorts and he said that the big model that Vail is pushing is to by as many small regional resorts, espeicially in the Midwest and push the Vail Pass on them which allows them to ski out at their Western resorts and gets them to a Vail resort out West instead of a competitor resort. It allows them to corner the market. The regional ski areas are designed to get people into skiing and confident to consider taking a trip out west and willing to invest in a Vail Pass, namely because of the inelasticity of skiing pricing (especially at Western resorts). It is an interesting concept but is working for them. 

 

That being said, places like BM and BW are also extremely profitable for Vail because of their lower operating costs and location closer to larger population centers to create volume. It is an interesting model, the regional resorts are more volume driven (based on local size capacity) and their Western resorts have the big profit margins.

Edited October 12, 20213 yr by Brutus_buckeye

5 hours ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

That would seem to be an expensive endeavor for a minimal return. As nice as it would be, how many more people would go to BM or BW because of the longer hill? I think they pretty much have the Cleveland market already.

 

I have a friend who works for an investment company that invests in Vail Resorts and he said that the big model that Vail is pushing is to by as many small regional resorts, espeicially in the Midwest and push the Vail Pass on them which allows them to ski out at their Western resorts and gets them to a Vail resort out West instead of a competitor resort. It allows them to corner the market. The regional ski areas are designed to get people into skiing and confident to consider taking a trip out west and willing to invest in a Vail Pass, namely because of the inelasticity of skiing pricing (especially at Western resorts). It is an interesting concept but is working for them. 

 

That being said, places like BM and BW are also extremely profitable for Vail because of their lower operating costs and location closer to larger population centers to create volume. It is an interesting model, the regional resorts are more volume driven (based on local size capacity) and their Western resorts have the big profit margins.

 

To your point - most Cleveland families who are serious about skiing make the quick trip to Holiday Valley and/or have house up there. 

On 10/12/2021 at 9:30 AM, Brutus_buckeye said:

That would seem to be an expensive endeavor for a minimal return. As nice as it would be, how many more people would go to BM or BW because of the longer hill? I think they pretty much have the Cleveland market already.

 

I have a friend who works for an investment company that invests in Vail Resorts and he said that the big model that Vail is pushing is to by as many small regional resorts, espeicially in the Midwest and push the Vail Pass on them which allows them to ski out at their Western resorts and gets them to a Vail resort out West instead of a competitor resort. It allows them to corner the market. The regional ski areas are designed to get people into skiing and confident to consider taking a trip out west and willing to invest in a Vail Pass, namely because of the inelasticity of skiing pricing (especially at Western resorts). It is an interesting concept but is working for them. 

 

That being said, places like BM and BW are also extremely profitable for Vail because of their lower operating costs and location closer to larger population centers to create volume. It is an interesting model, the regional resorts are more volume driven (based on local size capacity) and their Western resorts have the big profit margins.

 

Vail has taken a really interesting tack with their pricing this year, holding the line or making it even a little cheaper to get the EPIC pass and local passes at the Vail resorts out west.  Alterra, the other major player, raised the local prices at a fair number of places in response to record years, so they now seem to be a little more expensive.  

 

But you're right about the main idea--get them on your group's pass and then encourage them to go spend their money on a trip out west.  At that point you already have the lift ticket paid for in your season pass, and if you stay at the resort it probably goes into Vail's pocket, along with your food, etc.  It's a model that seems to be working.  

Vail is the Disney of ski resorts.

this is one of those things that you see and immediately think, it must be a misprint because it seems so ludicrous. But if a publication as well-known and respected as Travel & Leisure is going to call Painesville a "ski town," then it must be true! lol The resort in question is Alpine Valley in nearby Chesterland, but still.  I should note the writer, Rachel Chang, is from California and now lives in NY, surely part of the bicoastal elite, who has probably not even set foot in Ohio. Just a hunch. Then again she did say the top cities would "surprise" us. 🥴

 

10 Most Affordable Ski Towns to Rent In

https://www.travelandleisure.com/trip-ideas/skiing-trips/most-affordable-ski-towns-for-renters

 

"Sioux Falls, South Dakota, came in sixth with $833 average monthly rentals near Great Bear Ski Valley; Painesville, Ohio, landed in seventh with $840 rentals near Alpine Valley; Saint Ann, Missouri, in eighth with $850 rentals near Hidden Valley; Portage, Wisconsin, in ninth with $895 rentals near Cascade Mountain; and Middletown, Connecticut, in 10th with $950 rentals near Mount Southington."

Edited December 27, 20213 yr by eastvillagedon

On 10/15/2021 at 4:11 PM, LibertyBlvd said:

Vail is the Disney of ski resorts.

 

https://triblive.com/local/regional/seven-springs-sale-to-vail-resorts-seen-as-possible-boost-to-tourism/

 

Quote

The planned sale of Seven Springs Mountain Resort in Champion to a Colorado company with 37 ski resorts across 15 states and three countries has the potential to bring more tourists to the Laurel Highlands from many other locations through the buyer’s seasonal pass, a regional tourism official said.

 

The excitement about expanding the region’s tourism industry — Seven Springs already attracts skiers from the Washington, D.C., area — was generated by Pittsburgh Pirates owner Bob Nutting’s announcement Wednesday that he reached an agreement with Vail Resorts Inc. to sell Seven Springs, as well as his Hidden Valley and Laurel Mountain ski resorts. The sale for $125 million, subject to certain adjustments, should be finalized by the end of the ski season.

 

Vail Resorts is looking at Seven Springs’ market area as being as close as Pittsburgh and as far away as Washington, D.C., and Baltimore to the south and Cleveland to the northwest.

 

7 Springs was recently acquired by Vail.

june 1 last day of season at killington —

 

 

https://www.instagram.com/reel/C7wv6iBiJng/?igsh=YzZlNDlmOHlwYWhz

I have skied at all of Ohio's "ski resorts" but I never made it to Spicy Run or was ever even aware of it before this thread (grew up in NEO).

 

Does anyone remember Clear Fork just down the road from Mad River?  It was a nice little ski area with a family run feel to it and I always felt like it had some big time loyalists that would choose to ski there instead of Mad River.  Think it was pretty big with the adult club racing crowd too.  Whatever happened to it and why did it close?

4 minutes ago, tabasco said:

I have skied at all of Ohio's "ski resorts" but I never made it to Spicy Run or was ever even aware of it before this thread (grew up in NEO).

 

Does anyone remember Clear Fork just down the road from Mad River?  It was a nice little ski area with a family run feel to it and I always felt like it had some big time loyalists that would choose to ski there instead of Mad River.  Think it was pretty big with the adult club racing crowd too.  Whatever happened to it and why did it close?

 

 

looks like after 40yrs in operation clear fork closed in 2006 --

 

then was bought and reopened in 2011 --

 

then fell in debt and closed again in the spring after the 2014/2015 winter season ended --

 

 

https://www.saminfo.com/news/sam-headline-news/5845-42-clear-fork-returns-to-life

 

 

https://www.richlandsource.com/2015/05/15/clear-fork-resort-closes/

 

 

Just an FYI, if ^ that's ^ the Clear Fork being discussed, it's like 80+ miles from Mad River (Mountain).  Unless there was another Clear Fork near Union County (?).

On 9/27/2024 at 2:35 PM, ColDayMan said:

Just an FYI, if ^ that's ^ the Clear Fork being discussed, it's like 80+ miles from Mad River (Mountain).  Unless there was another Clear Fork near Union County (?).

You are correct, I meant to say Snow Trails not Mad River.  Snow Trails and the now defunct Clear Fork were very close to one another.