December 5, 20213 yr Criminal investigation now opened into upper levels of Cleveland police https://fox8.com/news/i-team/criminal-investigation-now-opened-into-upper-levels-of-cleveland-police/ "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
December 12, 20213 yr Interested to know more about this. Hard to attract residents to Downtown if someone is shooting a gun in the middle of the afternoon, though it looks like they won't be shooting it mid-afternoon anymore. "CLEVELAND, Ohio (WOIO) - According to C.P.P.A President Jeff Folmer, two on-duty Cleveland police officers shot and killed a man downtown Sunday afternoon who was shooting a gun. Police got a call around 3:30 pm for a man shooting a gun at East 12th and Superior Avenue. Follmer said the officers approached the suspect and told him to put the gun down, which he complied with, but he then picked the gun back up and started shooting at officers; the officers returned fire, striking the man..." https://www.cleveland19.com/2021/12/12/shooting-downtown-cleveland-sunday-afternoon-during-browns-game/ Edited December 12, 20213 yr by Pugu
December 13, 20213 yr 3 hours ago, Pugu said: Interested to know more about this. Hard to attract residents to Downtown if someone is shooting a gun in the middle of the afternoon, though it looks like they won't be shooting it mid-afternoon anymore. "CLEVELAND, Ohio (WOIO) - According to C.P.P.A President Jeff Folmer, two on-duty Cleveland police officers shot and killed a man downtown Sunday afternoon who was shooting a gun. Police got a call around 3:30 pm for a man shooting a gun at East 12th and Superior Avenue. Follmer said the officers approached the suspect and told him to put the gun down, which he complied with, but he then picked the gun back up and started shooting at officers; the officers returned fire, striking the man..." https://www.cleveland19.com/2021/12/12/shooting-downtown-cleveland-sunday-afternoon-during-browns-game/ Would you say the same thing about Strongsville? https://www.wkyc.com/article/news/local/multiple-people-reportedly-injured-during-drive-by-shooting-in-strongsville/95-0557e516-a514-4479-b4b7-a8dc99592e5f Or how about Mentor? https://www.cleveland19.com/2021/11/05/2-shot-mentor-drive-by-shooting/ Sure, downtown has it's share of mentally ill people in possession of guns, just like suburbia.
December 13, 20213 yr 3 minutes ago, Cleburger said: Would you say the same thing about Strongsville? https://www.wkyc.com/article/news/local/multiple-people-reportedly-injured-during-drive-by-shooting-in-strongsville/95-0557e516-a514-4479-b4b7-a8dc99592e5f Or how about Mentor? https://www.cleveland19.com/2021/11/05/2-shot-mentor-drive-by-shooting/ Sure, downtown has it's share of mentally ill people in possession of guns, just like suburbia. Touchy! I don't know much about Mentor so can't comment on it. But the city of cleveland has a tough time attracting residents compared to a place like strongsville--which is deemed safer and has better schools. (I'd never live there, but many would.) So, I'd say a random gun shooting incident in Cleveland has a bigger effect on people than it would in Strongsville as in Strongsville it will be seen as a surprise, but a one-off. Yes, mentally ill people are everywhere. I didn't know the Downtown incident was a mentally ill person--it didn't say so from the story I saw. But it could well be a suicide-by-cop situation---that's what it sounds like if one starts shooting at cops who already have their guns drawn.
December 13, 20213 yr 1 minute ago, Pugu said: Touchy! I don't know much about Mentor so can't comment on it. But the city of cleveland has a tough time attracting residents compared to a place like strongsville--which is deemed safer and has better schools. (I'd never live there, but many would.) So, I'd say a random gun shooting incident in Cleveland has a bigger effect on people than it would in Strongsville as in Strongsville it will be seen as a surprise, but a one-off. There are 300 million guns in this country. People are getting shot everywhere. You are correct--it's perception by suburbanites that downtown is a shootout free-for-all, while meanwhile there are drive-bys and murder/suicides happening right outside their white picket fences.
December 18, 20213 yr Per Fox 8 Cleveland news story that aired earlier this evening, the next Cleveland Police Academy had THREE applicants for its next class. The police union president cites the low pay, environment the officers have to deal with and pending change in the city's leadership as some of the causes. This does not bode well for the future.
December 18, 20213 yr 11 hours ago, LifeLongClevelander said: Per Fox 8 Cleveland news story that aired earlier this evening, the next Cleveland Police Academy had THREE applicants for its next class. The police union president cites the low pay, environment the officers have to deal with and pending change in the city's leadership as some of the causes. This does not bode well for the future. That's a skewed number. That class of three is a lateral class, still a low number number for a lateral class. They're going to be starting a class in the high 40s shortly.
December 30, 20213 yr This crap needs to stop! https://www.news5cleveland.com/news/local-news/14-year-old-arrested-for-little-italy-carjacking-shooting-that-injured-woman
December 30, 20213 yr It's almost a guarantee that teens are behind these carjacking waves today. And it's the case all over the country. Why in the hell is nothing being done about this? And is this 14 year old going to be released on probation or some BS? Because it seems like that is the case lately as well with these teens, no matter what they do.
December 30, 20213 yr 17 minutes ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said: It's almost a guarantee that teens are behind these carjacking waves today. And it's the case all over the country. Why in the hell is nothing being done about this? And is this 14 year old going to be released on probation or some BS? Because it seems like that is the case lately as well with these teens, no matter what they do. These are people that need to be separated from society, but in a manner that's safe, rehabilitative and productive; a system that doesn't destroy their lives in the way that our current system does.
December 30, 20213 yr 28 minutes ago, surfohio said: These are people that need to be separated from society, but in a manner that's safe, rehabilitative and productive; a system that doesn't destroy their lives in the way that our current system does. Probably, because according to Gallek, that kid was just released with a slap on the wrist for illegal possession or a fire arm and burglary. Clearly giving the kid who carries a gun another chance didn't work out. Who in the world would have seen this coming?
December 30, 20213 yr 18 minutes ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said: Probably, because according to Gallek, that kid was just released with a slap on the wrist for illegal possession or a fire arm and burglary. Clearly giving the kid who carries a gun another chance didn't work out. Who in the world would have seen this coming? Doesn't that always seem like what happens? The people committing crimes are repeatedly caught, then repeatedly set free to wreak havoc.
December 30, 20213 yr 2 hours ago, LibertyBlvd said: This crap needs to stop! https://www.news5cleveland.com/news/local-news/14-year-old-arrested-for-little-italy-carjacking-shooting-that-injured-woman 15 minutes ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said: Probably, because according to Gallek, that kid was just released with a slap on the wrist for illegal possession or a fire arm and burglary. Clearly giving the kid who carries a gun another chance didn't work out. Who in the world would have seen this coming? 1 hour ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said: It's almost a guarantee that teens are behind these carjacking waves today. And it's the case all over the country. Why in the hell is nothing being done about this? And is this 14 year old going to be released on probation or some BS? Because it seems like that is the case lately as well with these teens, no matter what they do. At least by initiating a chase when the stolen vehicle was sighted, the individual(s) that appear to be behind the string of carjackings in Little Italy have been caught and identified. It is extremely tragic when a pursuit causes serious injury or death to innocent people. Too many people are real quick to call out and blame the police, and that needs to stop. The ones who cause the innocent victims to suffer are the ones fleeing the police. There are many numerous times when the carjackers flee at a high rate of speed and police break off pursuit immediately. There is no guarantee that those in the fleeing vehicle will slow down and there have been quite a few incidents where there is no pursuit yet the criminals still get into a crash. All too frequently, the lack of pursuit allows more carjackings and robberies to occur. They get away and do it again. In one of the incidents in Little Italy, somebody got shot during a carjacking. The perpetrators obviously don't care who they hurt. When they fire a gun, they could just as easily cause people to die. Letting them get away and giving them hand slap punishments have been the biggest contributing factors to this violent crime wave, not the police.
December 30, 20213 yr One big problem with the juvenile justice system is that judges cannot be held accountable because the records are sealed. That means the typical voter doesn’t know who is tough or who is lenient. But the miscreants and their voting relatives and friends sure do. I can’t help thinking what I thought when the priest from Holy Rosary got assaulted awhile back. The kid is probably lucky he did this in 2021 and not 1971. Mike Trivisonno once quoted an unnamed mafioso as saying that what followed them would be worse.
December 30, 20213 yr 2 hours ago, surfohio said: These are people that need to be separated from society, but in a manner that's safe, rehabilitative and productive; a system that doesn't destroy their lives in the way that our current system does. Work/school farms downstate, especially when they start offending. It would have to be with parental consent for numerous reasons, but I suspect a lot more overwhelmed and desperate parents would assent than one might think. Sort of like boot camp, with school. Regiment them so gangs and cliques can't form. You won't save them all, but you just might save a self perpetuating core.
December 30, 20213 yr Meanwhile, back to safety news. Poor Tower City can't catch a break... "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
December 31, 20213 yr 20 hours ago, E Rocc said: One big problem with the juvenile justice system is that judges cannot be held accountable because the records are sealed. That means the typical voter doesn’t know who is tough or who is lenient. But the miscreants and their voting relatives and friends sure do. I can’t help thinking what I thought when the priest from Holy Rosary got assaulted awhile back. The kid is probably lucky he did this in 2021 and not 1971. Mike Trivisonno once quoted an unnamed mafioso as saying that what followed them would be worse. 20 hours ago, E Rocc said: Work/school farms downstate, especially when they start offending. It would have to be with parental consent for numerous reasons, but I suspect a lot more overwhelmed and desperate parents would assent than one might think. Sort of like boot camp, with school. Regiment them so gangs and cliques can't form. You won't save them all, but you just might save a self perpetuating core. A teenager--any teenager--who commits an armed robbery, carjacking, flees police in a vehicle chase, shoots or kills someone, is committing adult crimes. They know exactly what they are doing. As such, their identities need to be exposed and treated as adults. It is time to remove the protection of sealed juvenile records. Stop coddling them with hand slap punishments and loosening home confinement restrictions so they can "go back to school" (don't think that in their priorities, attending classes is anywhere but the bottom of the list) so they can just commit more crimes. Right now, their only "schooling" they receive is learning how to commit crimes and hone their techniques. They are also being used as "tools" by their adult criminal counterparts to expand their activities.
January 1, 20223 yr Earlier in the evening "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
January 1, 20223 yr @kjp I just popped on to post this. Carjacking victim was an off duty CDP officer, 27 years old as per the media.
January 1, 20223 yr May be numerous people involved? Off-duty Cleveland Police officer shot and killed in carjacking Crime Stoppers of Cuyahoga County offers up to $10,000 for information leading to the identity and prosecution of anyone involved in this murder https://www.cleveland19.com/2022/01/01/off-duty-cleveland-police-officer-shot-killed-carjacking/ "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
January 1, 20223 yr 1 hour ago, KJP said: May be numerous people involved? Off-duty Cleveland Police officer shot and killed in carjacking Crime Stoppers of Cuyahoga County offers up to $10,000 for information leading to the identity and prosecution of anyone involved in this murder https://www.cleveland19.com/2022/01/01/off-duty-cleveland-police-officer-shot-killed-carjacking/ He was an academy classmate of mine. They caught the suspect in Euclid.
January 1, 20223 yr I'm very sorry. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
January 1, 20223 yr And "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
January 1, 20223 yr 15 hours ago, KFM44107 said: He was an academy classmate of mine. They caught the suspect in Euclid. He ran to the wrong place, I've seen EPD chase. Apparently he was spotted down on Brainard by Jackson (just north of Emery). Richmond Heights PD ran him down on Lakeshore. He's from Bedford Heights and I may know who it is. Also an 18 year old woman from Garfield Heights is being changed. Sorry bout this, I figured he was someone you knew, or possibly even you.
January 1, 20223 yr What's the point of these carjackings anyway? Seems like all they do is a little joy riding and then ditch the car. I guess l don't understand the criminal mind.
January 1, 20223 yr 13 minutes ago, cadmen said: What's the point of these carjackings anyway? Seems like all they do is a little joy riding and then ditch the car. I guess l don't understand the criminal mind. Perhaps the car is used to commit other crimes and gets ditched. Thrill seeking and joyrides. Any carjacking attempt can lead to this. And if the carjackers get away, it just gives them the opportunity to repeat it again and again until caught.
January 1, 20223 yr Most of the carjackings seem to be done by young teens that aren't even old enough to drive. Maybe it is some kind of gang initiation ritual. Edited January 1, 20223 yr by LibertyBlvd
January 1, 20223 yr 32 minutes ago, cadmen said: What's the point of these carjackings anyway? Seems like all they do is a little joy riding and then ditch the car. I guess l don't understand the criminal mind. I assumed they take them to a chop shop or chop them up themselves and get money for wheels, parts, etc.
January 1, 20223 yr 1 hour ago, E Rocc said: He ran to the wrong place, I've seen EPD chase. Apparently he was spotted down on Brainard by Jackson (just north of Emery). Richmond Heights PD ran him down on Lakeshore. He's from Bedford Heights and I may know who it is. Also an 18 year old woman from Garfield Heights is being changed. Sorry bout this, I figured he was someone you knew, or possibly even you. Ya. I was at work when they caught him. We actually first found him at Shaker Square in the fourth but quickly lost him. First time I've heard the chief come over and just give us free reign to chase until the wheels fall off. How they caught the female is a good story but I'm not going discuss an open invest. Maybe at a later time.
January 1, 20223 yr 58 minutes ago, LibertyBlvd said: Most of the carjackings seem to be done by young teens that aren't even old enough to drive. Maybe it is some kind of gang initiation ritual. That was my first thought -- gang initiation ritual. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
January 2, 20223 yr On 12/31/2021 at 11:23 PM, KJP said: Earlier in the evening If a cop in Kamm's Corner, probably the "safest" neighborhood in the city proper, is killed over a GD car, how could anyone argue that Cleveland city proper is a safe place to live. We make all these excuses for why the population continues to dwindle and the violent crime is never the reason listed. And nothing is being done about it. 4 carjackings with an innocent woman being shot in Little Italy over a period of a week. A cleveland cop being killed in a senseless murder. No one is going to set up roots in the city proper when the violent felons are running around freely on parole and probation to kill people.
January 2, 20223 yr The area around Rocky River Drive and Puritas hasn't been safe for decades. In part, it goes back to the conversion of a military deployment site from WWII into a public housing complex called Riverside Park Homes. But you're overlooking a lot for the sake of sustaining a lazy narrative. Just this year, there have armed carjackings in Cleveland Heights (also involved an off-duty cop), Euclid, Lakewood, Brooklyn and Willoughby. The last two carjackers who allegedly killed officer Bartek were from Garfield Heights and Bedford Heights. And I submit Little Italy is safer than the southern part of Kamms Corners. Little Italy saw five carjackings last week. Now I realize that some have a narrative they want to to sustain, and they need to point to quick and easy examples to do so, but they aren't accurate. They're just lazy and offensive. It's not geography that causes crime. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
January 2, 20223 yr Context is often lost when sharing individual crime stories. Crime has been rising the past 2 years, but that is from historic lows. If this continues it will certainly be a larger concern, and we certainly don't want to wait to address it until it becomes a larger issue, but I think it is important to keep this in perspective, especially on this thread. https://www.cleveland.com/metro/2022/01/clevelands-homicide-total-dips-in-2021-still-second-highest-in-30-years.html That said, crime statistics don't matter to the individuals who directly experience crime and it's repercussions. Condolences to KFM44107.
January 2, 20223 yr 18 hours ago, KFM44107 said: Ya. I was at work when they caught him. We actually first found him at Shaker Square in the fourth but quickly lost him. First time I've heard the chief come over and just give us free reign to chase until the wheels fall off. How they caught the female is a good story but I'm not going discuss an open invest. Maybe at a later time. I would assume this is going to be considered "line of duty". Presumably you all are still being taught you should intervene if you see a crime being committed, even off duty. Being the intended victim and resisting would count. I was in Bedford Heights at the Horse (picking up not attending LOL) the night Joshua Miktarian was killed. I've seen firsthand how the various departments go after such people and it's how it should be. Has to be, really. Edited January 2, 20223 yr by E Rocc
January 2, 20223 yr 1 hour ago, KJP said: The area around Rocky River Drive and Puritas hasn't been safe for decades. In part, it goes back to the conversion of a military deployment site from WWII into a public housing complex called Riverside Park Homes. But you're overlooking a lot for the sake of sustaining a lazy narrative. Just this year, there have armed carjackings in Cleveland Heights (also involved an off-duty cop), Euclid, Lakewood, Brooklyn and Willoughby. The last two carjackers who allegedly killed officer Bartek were from Garfield Heights and Bedford Heights. And I submit Little Italy is safer than the southern part of Kamms Corners. Little Italy saw five carjackings last week. Now I realize that some have a narrative they want to to sustain, and they need to point to quick and easy examples to do so, but they aren't accurate. They're just lazy and offensive. It's not geography that causes crime. I would submit that the arts community allowed Little Italy to keep thriving and retain its old character once the Mafia collapsed, but it's pretty much a given the carjackings wouldn't have continued there then. It does seem like that while homicides and now initiation related crime has increased in the city and inner ring, other forms of crime have remained relatively steady. That's just an impression though, I have not seen numbers,
January 2, 20223 yr 1 hour ago, KJP said: The area around Rocky River Drive and Puritas hasn't been safe for decades. In part, it goes back to the conversion of a military deployment site from WWII into a public housing complex called Riverside Park Homes. But you're overlooking a lot for the sake of sustaining a lazy narrative. Just this year, there have armed carjackings in Cleveland Heights (also involved an off-duty cop), Euclid, Lakewood, Brooklyn and Willoughby. The last two carjackers who allegedly killed officer Bartek were from Garfield Heights and Bedford Heights. And I submit Little Italy is safer than the southern part of Kamms Corners. Little Italy saw five carjackings last week. Now I realize that some have a narrative they want to to sustain, and they need to point to quick and easy examples to do so, but they aren't accurate. They're just lazy and offensive. It's not geography that causes crime. As we've said in discussion of the Maple Heights-Bedford area other places, these things happen everywhere but they happen some places more than others. The presence of projects certainly plays a role, Lakeview Terrace's proximity to the W. 25th area is another example. But dispersing same did more harm than good in Chicago.
January 3, 20223 yr Having watched the video of the arrest of the guy who was caught in Officer Bartek's car, my guess is he had no idea what she had done.
January 6, 20223 yr I feel bad for Justin Bibb. He has a lot of work to clean up the neglect left by Frank Jackson.
January 6, 20223 yr On 1/2/2022 at 12:01 PM, E Rocc said: It does seem like that while homicides and now initiation related crime has increased in the city and inner ring, other forms of crime have remained relatively steady. That's just an impression though, I have not seen numbers, Other forms of crime have been decreasing for years, not relatively steady. Facts not opinions, here: https://clecityhall.files.wordpress.com/2021/01/yearendreport2020final.pdf
January 6, 20223 yr On 1/2/2022 at 12:01 PM, E Rocc said: It does seem like that while homicides and now initiation related crime has increased in the city Homicides were slightly down in the city for 2021: https://www.cleveland.com/metro/2022/01/clevelands-homicide-total-dips-in-2021-still-second-highest-in-30-years.html?outputType=amp While the suburbs saw a 67% increase in homicides: https://www.cleveland.com/crime/2022/01/suburban-cleveland-homicides-up-this-year-from-2020-data-shows.html?outputType=amp
January 6, 20223 yr 14 minutes ago, Clefan98 said: Other forms of crime have been decreasing for years, not relatively steady. Facts not opinions, here: https://clecityhall.files.wordpress.com/2021/01/yearendreport2020final.pdf And over all crime is down. The rise in homicides is concerning, but it is very easy to get the perception that crime is rampant and out of control when sharing one-off stories of crime without the broader context. I get that's the point of this thread, but this bigger picture doesn't come through enough. And it almost never comes through cleveland.com/PD, which could just be replace by NE Ohio Scanner twitter... It creates a really harmful narrative for the city. so, thank you for providing the added context.
January 6, 20223 yr 1 minute ago, Luke_S said: And over all crime is down. The rise in homicides is concerning, but it is very easy to get the perception that crime is rampant and out of control when sharing one-off stories of crime without the broader context. I get that's the point of this thread, but this bigger picture doesn't come through enough. And it almost never comes through cleveland.com/PD, which could just be replace by NE Ohio Scanner twitter... It creates a really harmful narrative for the city. so, thank you for providing the added context. You're welcome. I enjoy finding truth in numbers.
January 6, 20223 yr 10 hours ago, Luke_S said: And over all crime is down. The rise in homicides is concerning, but it is very easy to get the perception that crime is rampant and out of control when sharing one-off stories of crime without the broader context. I get that's the point of this thread, but this bigger picture doesn't come through enough. And it almost never comes through cleveland.com/PD, which could just be replace by NE Ohio Scanner twitter... It creates a really harmful narrative for the city. so, thank you for providing the added context. The other thing to keep in mind is that when homicide victims are identified, more often than not they aren't unknown to the court systems themselves. Much of the more serious crime, perhaps even most of it, is tied to gang rivalries and the drug trade. In the vast majority of even the "worst" neighborhoods, people in general who are minding their own business are relatively safe. Even (perhaps especially) if they don't look like they "belong" there. The fears of many are exaggerated in order to market news media.
January 6, 20223 yr Dunno what’s going on down by the river these last couple of days, but someone got shot up outside Stonebridge the other night and now this seemingly at FEB My hovercraft is full of eels
January 6, 20223 yr 5 hours ago, E Rocc said: The other thing to keep in mind is that when homicide victims are identified, more often than not they aren't unknown to the court systems themselves. Much of the more serious crime, perhaps even most of it, is tied to gang rivalries and the drug trade. In the vast majority of even the "worst" neighborhoods, people in general who are minding their own business are relatively safe. Even (perhaps especially) if they don't look like they "belong" there. The fears of many are exaggerated in order to market news media. The only real random crimes if you will are Aggravated robbery/GTMV and theft. If you stay away from gas stations, corner stores, and after hours spots at night, and aren't yourself a criminal, your odds of being a victim of a crime are significantly reduced.
January 6, 20223 yr 2 hours ago, roman totale XVII said: Dunno what’s going on down by the river these last couple of days, but someone got shot up outside Stonebridge the other night and now this seemingly at FEB East and West Bank have been HOT for the last 8 months. There's affiliated people in some of apartments on both the east/west side of the Flats. Also, AirBnB's are a real issue. Maybe these apartments/companies need to start checking sources of income/payments a bit better... I know with 100% certainty LaFlexico gang has a spot in Stonebridge. Str8Drop got out of jail a few months back and he's already back in– he's affiliated with LaFlexico.
January 6, 20223 yr 9 hours ago, E Rocc said: The other thing to keep in mind is that when homicide victims are identified, more often than not they aren't unknown to the court systems themselves. Much of the more serious crime, perhaps even most of it, is tied to gang rivalries and the drug trade. In the vast majority of even the "worst" neighborhoods, people in general who are minding their own business are relatively safe. Even (perhaps especially) if they don't look like they "belong" there. The fears of many are exaggerated in order to market news media. I agree with this for the most part but reality is I've been downtown and now on the west side bordering Detroit Shoreway and Ohio City for the last 7 years and this is the first year I saw guns get pulled during altercations (twice) in the Flats and downtown. It's not normal and is happening more often. We should speak up on the fact that certain places which used to feel safe(r), don't. I know people who are afraid to go out to Gordon Square at night now with all the recent carjackings. You can blame the media but the people to truly blame are the ones doing it. It is only a matter of time before an innocent person in a crowded bar gets clipped.
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