I don't think anyone would oppose those approaches, but the poison is so deeply rooted in generational hood culture, I don't know if they'd be effective. Deindustrialization and Johnson's War on Crime/Poverty have sabotaged black families more than those ideas could repair them.

 

I was watching clips of the Wattstax concert. God, could you imagine a comparable event today and its consequences. It's been a rough 60 years.

When l read about these kind of things happening or the car doing doughnuts around a fire in Playhouse Square my heart sinks. Those of us who love cities and vibrant urban spaces are so discouraged when they happen. 

 

The reasons behind that kind of activity are so complex it's almost impossible to see a remedy. I don't want to lose hope, l'll continue to love cities and follow them but, man, it's hard sometimes.

That type of conscience-less, animalistic behavior causes people who want their children to grow up in safe communities to move out of cities, which only perpetuates racism, isolationism and economic conditions that lead to that behavior.

50 minutes ago, cadmen said:

When l read about these kind of things happening or the car doing doughnuts around a fire in Playhouse Square my heart sinks. Those of us who love cities and vibrant urban spaces are so discouraged when they happen. 

 

The reasons behind that kind of activity are so complex it's almost impossible to see a remedy. I don't want to lose hope, l'll continue to love cities and follow them but, man, it's hard sometimes.

 

This stuff happens everywhere....   Well at least everywhere kids decide to congregate with a reasonable level of comfort knowing that police won't be able to respond fast enough to catch them in the act.  I was in Anaheim a couple years ago and a big group of teenagers shut down intersections right outside of Disney doing these kinds of stunts.     More beat cops would definitely help.   You don't hear about kids doing this in Independence or Lakewood because the cops would be all over them in 30 seconds and they know it.  

 

 

1 hour ago, cadmen said:

When l read about these kind of things happening or the car doing doughnuts around a fire in Playhouse Square my heart sinks. Those of us who love cities and vibrant urban spaces are so discouraged when they happen. 

 

The reasons behind that kind of activity are so complex it's almost impossible to see a remedy. I don't want to lose hope, l'll continue to love cities and follow them but, man, it's hard sometimes.

 

Yup, I live in Playhouse Square and heard it go down. It lasted quit a long time (ridiculously so) and I also heard they went on a rampage through residential sections of Ohio City. It really is a disgrace and frankly embarrassing as a resident of Cleveland. 

 

1 hour ago, Cleburger said:

You don't hear about kids doing this in Independence or Lakewood because the cops would be all over them in 30 seconds and they know it.  

 

Yup, I've been looking at houses to purchase on the near west side but this kind of thing just makes me want to head to Lakewood instead. And I lived in core urban Chicago neighborhoods for the better part of 20 years so not exactly a stranger to "city life."  

 

1 hour ago, Rustbelter said:

 

Yup, I live in Playhouse Square and heard it go down. It lasted quit a long time (ridiculously so) and I also heard they went on a rampage through residential sections of Ohio City. It really is a disgrace and frankly embarrassing as a resident of Cleveland. 

 

 

Yup, I've been looking at houses to purchase on the near west side but this kind of thing just makes me want to head to Lakewood instead. And I lived in core urban Chicago neighborhoods for the better part of 20 years so not exactly a stranger to "city life."  

 

There's plenty of crime in Lakewood that happens. It just doesn't get reported the same way as crime in Cleveland does because it doesn't fit the "cities are dangerous, suburbs are safe" narrative the news likes to portray.

1 hour ago, TDi said:

There's plenty of crime in Lakewood that happens. It just doesn't get reported the same way as crime in Cleveland does because it doesn't fit the "cities are dangerous, suburbs are safe" narrative the news likes to portray.

I live in Lakewood and respectfully disagree

Yup, Lakewood's crime stats do not paint it in bad light at all and I have zero reason to believe crime would be somehow under-counted. My experience on the ground there also tells me that it's a safe urban environment. And while Lakewood is technically a suburb, in form & function it's no different than most Cleveland city neighborhoods. So not exactly like the "suburbs" people are talking about when contrasting them to the city. 

I know people like defending Lakewood but living there you still need to be worried about all the same types of crime you do in the city that you normally don't in other suburbs. All the neighborhood crime maps show this as well. But like I said anytime anything happens you only would know about it if you are on Lakewood Reddit or the Lakewood community fb page. 

4 hours ago, TDi said:

There's plenty of crime in Lakewood that happens. It just doesn't get reported the same way as crime in Cleveland does because it doesn't fit the "cities are dangerous, suburbs are safe" narrative the news likes to portray.

 

I don't completely believe this.   Furthermore, we could do an experiment and call 911 for police in Lakewood, then Cleveland.  Lakewood will be there in 35 seconds with 7 cars, Cleveland will be an hour with one car and a cop that could care less.... 

5 hours ago, TDi said:

There's plenty of crime in Lakewood that happens. It just doesn't get reported the same way as crime in Cleveland does because it doesn't fit the "cities are dangerous, suburbs are safe" narrative the news likes to portray.

Please dude. Lakewood cops would be on this BS like white on rice. 

Remember a few years ago with the ATVs terrorizing residents on Clifton? No Cleveland Cops to be found. It was all Lakewood and RR cops putting the work in. This city could not care less about these fools. But like they say, people vote with their feet. 

3 hours ago, Rustbelter said:

Yup, Lakewood's crime stats do not paint it in bad light at all and I have zero reason to believe crime would be somehow under-counted. My experience on the ground there also tells me that it's a safe urban environment. And while Lakewood is technically a suburb, in form & function it's no different than most Cleveland city neighborhoods. So not exactly like the "suburbs" people are talking about when contrasting them to the city. 

Besides density, Lakewood and Cleveland neighborhoods are nothing alike whatsoever. Mainly because of the residents who live in Lakewood compared to Cleveland. 

1 hour ago, Cleburger said:

 

I don't completely believe this.   Furthermore, we could do an experiment and call 911 for police in Lakewood, then Cleveland.  Lakewood will be there in 35 seconds with 7 cars, Cleveland will be an hour with one car and a cop that could care less.... 

There was literally a video last summer of these kind of fools joy riding down Euclid by PS with 2 cops literally just standing there not doing sh**. Hell even Euclid cops would be on this BS immediately. We had a couple kids breaking into cars 1 year, a cop was on the street within 5 minutes. My brother still in Euclid has seen a cop car patrolling his area nightly the last 3 nights since those recent shootings. Suburban cops actually give a damn. What the hell are Cleveland cops doing. 

On 5/26/2024 at 8:25 PM, mrnyc said:

 

the club shooting incident posted just below your comment is a perfect example of what i’m talking about. you are of course right it would be felt over time, but imagine if there were organized crackdowns on bad bars by city and state liquor agencies, plus more job training, drug rehab, block parties, movies, daybreaker morning dj dance parties, bowling, rec centers, regular family activities and events to encourage keeping families together, etc., etc. — it would discourage young men hanging out in bars. even one or two not there that chaotic night might have made all the difference.

 

 

Beg to differ, the ones that won't be there are the better ones.  The ones causing all the trouble won't be interested in those sorts of activities and will still be in the bars.   You can have a volatile situation even with only a few people in the bar.    Been there...

 

Long term the above might work, but you really need to focus on juveniles.  By the time guys are even old enough to be in bars, the hard core bad ones' ways are set.   Assertive police activity is needed to keep them more or less in line.  The Giuliani approach may not be the only way to make it happen, but it worked and I can't think of another.

 

Individual bars can minimize the problems for themselves a few ways.   The main one is not staying open until state mandated closing time.   Effective security and an enforced banned list helps.   Things can be done with the liquor availability and music as well.  TouchTunes can be filtered, DJs can be advised to lower the energy level when neccesary.

 

This just pushes the problems elsewhere, though.   The IDGAF crowd does like to spend money, so someone is going to cater to them, at least short term.

 

 

Edited May 28, 20241 yr by E Rocc

11 hours ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said:

There was literally a video last summer of these kind of fools joy riding down Euclid by PS with 2 cops literally just standing there not doing sh**. Hell even Euclid cops would be on this BS immediately. We had a couple kids breaking into cars 1 year, a cop was on the street within 5 minutes. My brother still in Euclid has seen a cop car patrolling his area nightly the last 3 nights since those recent shootings. Suburban cops actually give a damn. What the hell are Cleveland cops doing. 

 

I've told the story of watching EPD (+) chase a van near my house that had stolen an ATM.  It looked like the invasion of Poland.  There was one CPD unit buzzing around the periphery (this was the height of the do not chase policy).  

 

If I was told that I wasn't allowed to do things that I knew were necessary to effectively do my job, and I gave the proverbial airborne fornicant, I'd likely look elsewhere.

sure, the shooting probably still would have happened, but the point is to decrease the hardhead drunken idgaf crowd to a trickle. it does take time, but also some of those kinds of offerings can have immediate effects because not all your idgaf crowd on any particular night are always and persistently hardcore. there are always a few irregulars on the fence involved who are regretting being there now. so any fewer people present on a bad night means less problems.

 

regardless, the point was merely adding relatively expensive to taxpayers beat cops does nothing for these incidents. it takes wider and more coordinated approach, with a bright spot being its less expensive to do.

2 hours ago, mrnyc said:

sure, the shooting probably still would have happened, but the point is to decrease the hardhead drunken idgaf crowd to a trickle. it does take time, but also some of those kinds of offerings can have immediate effects because not all your idgaf crowd on any particular night are always and persistently hardcore. there are always a few irregulars on the fence involved who are regretting being there now. so any fewer people present on a bad night means less problems.

 

regardless, the point was merely adding relatively expensive to taxpayers beat cops does nothing for these incidents. it takes wider and more coordinated approach, with a bright spot being its less expensive to do.

 

I hear you on the last part, but short term it's the only solution likely to work.  As for that crowd, they don't always show up hardcore, but it just takes a couple of them, or even one.

 

A bar fight will cause a lot of people to leave, but the ones left behind are about ten times more likely to commence another one.

8 hours ago, E Rocc said:

 

I've told the story of watching EPD (+) chase a van near my house that had stolen an ATM.  It looked like the invasion of Poland.  There was one CPD unit buzzing around the periphery (this was the height of the do not chase policy).

 

This same PD responsible for initiating a chase that ended up in the death of an innocent mother.

 

 

I live in Old Brooklyn and Parma routinely chases into the city putting me (and my neighbors) at risk. Police chases aren't good. They're especially bad when idiot kids are being chased around streets the initiating PD aren't familiar with. 

 

@Ethan this is just in Old Brooklyn (in the 6-8 months):

https://www.wkyc.com/article/news/crime/parma-police-pursuit-ends-crash-cleveland-2-hospital-critical-condition/95-677409a8-0e44-41d6-8928-bf1d1f957ad8

 

https://www.cleveland19.com/2023/11/10/people-living-old-brooklyn-voice-concerns-over-another-crash-ending-police-chase/

 

https://www.cleveland19.com/2023/11/24/parma-police-pursuit-ends-crash-clevelands-old-brooklyn-neighborhood/

 

https://www.news5cleveland.com/news/local-news/we-follow-through/fourth-parma-pursuit-into-old-brooklyn-captured-on-camera-driver-hits-van-in-traffic

 

https://www.news5cleveland.com/news/local-news/oh-cuyahoga/car-crashes-after-parma-police-chase

 

https://www.wkyc.com/article/news/local/cleveland/cleveland-police-chase-leads-to-crash/95-83879dae-d1f6-4a18-974e-a9f21b1023dd

 

These are all streets I routinely bike/walk on all hours of the day. This isn't acceptable.

 

Edited May 28, 20241 yr by GISguy

6 hours ago, E Rocc said:

 

I hear you on the last part, but short term it's the only solution likely to work.  As for that crowd, they don't always show up hardcore, but it just takes a couple of them, or even one.

 

A bar fight will cause a lot of people to leave, but the ones left behind are about ten times more likely to commence another one.

 

well i wish you would hear the first part. again, more beat cops would not have mattered in a bar shooting. best to try to get to those that can be gotten to and provide hope and other social alternatives to steer clear of trouble. i bet alcohol was heavily involved by that late hour, implying maybe some are habitual drunks, so imagine if there were more ways for a few of them to get off the sauce. 

On 5/27/2024 at 9:43 AM, TBideon said:

I don't think anyone would oppose those approaches, but the poison is so deeply rooted in generational hood culture, I don't know if they'd be effective. Deindustrialization and Johnson's War on Crime/Poverty have sabotaged black families more than those ideas could repair them.

 

I was watching clips of the Wattstax concert. God, could you imagine a comparable event today and its consequences. It's been a rough 60 years.

 

you are exactly right. america doesnt remember and would be shocked today to learn that african americans had the highest rates of marriage until then. you didnt get the kind of crime we see today with youth from intact families and both parents in the kid’s face every day. lets try harder to promote family and help keep families together, that drops juvenile crime better than anything.

 

btw i’m sorry for these rants, but this is my entire career. i was the jails school psychologist for youth in detention for 25yrs.. 

4 hours ago, GISguy said:

 

This same PD responsible for initiating a chase that ended up in the death of an innocent mother.

 

 

I live in Old Brooklyn and Parma routinely chases into the city putting me (and my neighbors) at risk. Police chases aren't good. They're especially bad when idiot kids are being chased around streets the initiating PD aren't familiar with. 

 

@Ethan this is just in Old Brooklyn (in the 6-8 months):

https://www.wkyc.com/article/news/crime/parma-police-pursuit-ends-crash-cleveland-2-hospital-critical-condition/95-677409a8-0e44-41d6-8928-bf1d1f957ad8

 

https://www.cleveland19.com/2023/11/10/people-living-old-brooklyn-voice-concerns-over-another-crash-ending-police-chase/

 

https://www.cleveland19.com/2023/11/24/parma-police-pursuit-ends-crash-clevelands-old-brooklyn-neighborhood/

 

https://www.news5cleveland.com/news/local-news/we-follow-through/fourth-parma-pursuit-into-old-brooklyn-captured-on-camera-driver-hits-van-in-traffic

 

https://www.news5cleveland.com/news/local-news/oh-cuyahoga/car-crashes-after-parma-police-chase

 

https://www.wkyc.com/article/news/local/cleveland/cleveland-police-chase-leads-to-crash/95-83879dae-d1f6-4a18-974e-a9f21b1023dd

 

These are all streets I routinely bike/walk on all hours of the day. This isn't acceptable.

 

AH another poster blaming the cops doing their jobs instead of these criminal jackasses who don't give a shi* about whether they kill you or not. These perps are the ones who decided to run and hit the gas pedal to 80 mph to get away from a cop after their own decision of comitting a robbery, usually with a gun stuck in an innocent person's face. Why do you think people fled to parma to get away from Cleveland proper? Because Parma cops show that they're willing to protect their citizens? The criminals know once they get into Cleveland, the Cleveland cops will call it off and they are home free, and back out the next day threatening another innocent person's life over their car or just over $20 in a wallet. 

Horrible scene. I can't believe no one here is talking about it yet!

 

 

2 hours ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said:

AH another poster blaming the cops doing their jobs instead of these criminal jackasses who don't give a shi* about whether they kill you or not. These perps are the ones who decided to run and hit the gas pedal to 80 mph to get away from a cop after their own decision of comitting a robbery, usually with a gun stuck in an innocent person's face.

At the point of a chase starting the perp is no longer directly threatening people and chasing them just increases the risk of injury and death to innocent people. With CCTV cameras and other tech these days, it shouldn't be too hard for the police to get a license plate or other identifying information about the perp. Let them think they got away, figure out who they are, then show up at their residence or job or wherever, and arrest them.

12 hours ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said:

AH another poster blaming the cops doing their jobs instead of these criminal jackasses who don't give a shi* about whether they kill you or not. These perps are the ones who decided to run and hit the gas pedal to 80 mph to get away from a cop after their own decision of comitting a robbery, usually with a gun stuck in an innocent person's face. Why do you think people fled to parma to get away from Cleveland proper? Because Parma cops show that they're willing to protect their citizens? The criminals know once they get into Cleveland, the Cleveland cops will call it off and they are home free, and back out the next day threatening another innocent person's life over their car or just over $20 in a wallet. 

 

Dude this is so tired (another poster lol, even Mr "tough on crime" Mike Polensek wants something to be done about chases in the release below). It's a big problem and of course it's it's on the people running. But there's something to be said about having restraint and not chasing if speeds are ridiculous through a residential neighborhood. Parma routinely chases down Pearl, Broadview, and State which are commercial corridors/stroads within Parma but turn into residential streets as soon as you cross into Cleveland. There are bike lanes on two of those roads. There's always a line close to the road at Honey Hut, there's people walking with strollers and folks casually going about their lives needlessly being put in danger. Don't minimize our experiences. 

 

Just because Parma feels like they need to get someone who stole $23 in groceries from Meijer doesn't justify them racing down my streets when there are cameras on every corner (and when things get real/it's a hardcore crime they request the CPD chopper and suburban drones anyways). I'm not defending the criminals but at the same time not everything requires five cars chasing after some Bush League criminals at highway speeds. 

 

It's not just me, talk to council who's just as upset. 

 

https://www.news5cleveland.com/news/local-news/we-follow-through/cleveland-councilman-wants-license-plate-readers-at-major-border-intersections-with-parma

 

https://www.clevelandcitycouncil.org/council-members-urge-safety-director-meet-suburban-police-departments-about-chase-policies

 

Here's their release (from last year!!):

 

Council Members Urge Safety Director to Meet with Suburban Police Departments About Chase Policies

Aug 28, 2023

 

Cleveland, OH (August 28, 2023) - Over the weekend, Parma police chased a vehicle up State Route 176 from Parma into Cleveland, resulting in a car crash that killed two people inside the vehicle and injured two others.

 

This most recent chase from Parma police into Cleveland is not an isolated incident. 

 

This past Thursday, Parma police chased a car up Pearl Road into Cleveland, resulting in a crash a few hundred feet from an elementary school that sent multiple people to the hospital. You can find many other examples of Parma’s repeated pattern of chase. 

 

The Parma chase is not unique. Recently, multiple suburban police department chases have ended in Cleveland crashes. The underlying issue is the recent explosion in stolen vehicles across the region and country. 

 

These incidents have reasonably raised questions among Cleveland residents about the risks they are being put at by the actions of a neighboring police department. 

 

Councilmembers Kris Harsh, Rebecca Maurer and Mike Polensek are calling for a meeting between Councilmembers, Cleveland’s Safety Director and Parma leaders, as well as other suburban communities, to discuss the interjurisdictional chase policy and steps that can be taken to ensure the safety of residents in both cities. 

 

“We know that we cannot dictate police’s discretion to pursue suspects to a neighboring city,” Councilman Harsh said, But these repeated incidents have raised many questions about pursuit policy.”  

 

“It’s time for a candid conversation about the impact of these chases on the larger community,” added Councilwoman Maurer, “This is about mutual respect and safety between our cities.” 

 

Councilman Polensek, chair of Council’s Safety Committee said, “It goes without saying we support the police attempting to apprehend the perpetrators of criminal activity. We want to make sure it’s coordinated with other police departments.

 

“This only reinforces the need to have Cleveland police helicopters available on demand so pursuits are limited.”

Edited May 29, 20241 yr by GISguy

8 hours ago, KJP said:

Horrible scene. I can't believe no one here is talking about it yet!

 

 

 

The disbelief and shock is being expressed and shared on plenty of other platforms.

7 hours ago, Henryefry said:

At the point of a chase starting the perp is no longer directly threatening people and chasing them just increases the risk of injury and death to innocent people. With CCTV cameras and other tech these days, it shouldn't be too hard for the police to get a license plate or other identifying information about the perp. Let them think they got away, figure out who they are, then show up at their residence or job or wherever, and arrest them.

 

This indirectly references why car thieves, particularly carjackers, should always be chased.  If they get away they got away clean, and they will re-offend.

 

Major or violent felonies always justify a chase.

8 hours ago, Henryefry said:

At the point of a chase starting the perp is no longer directly threatening people and chasing them just increases the risk of injury and death to innocent people. With CCTV cameras and other tech these days, it shouldn't be too hard for the police to get a license plate or other identifying information about the perp. Let them think they got away, figure out who they are, then show up at their residence or job or wherever, and arrest them.

 

 

"With CCTV cameras and other tech these days..." specifically what other tech are you referring to?  If effective "technology" were there, then there wouldn't be chases. Yes, a CCTV can capture a license plate. So what? It will show who the car is registered to (and probably the person who just had his/her car stolen), not the person driving the car who stole, carjacked, or pistolwhipped the original driver or owner. CCTV doesn't identify the driver or the other people in the car. And even if it did and police knew all the occupants in the car, that doesn't mean any of them will readily be found anywhere ("at their residence or job") so they are free to commit many more crimes.

 

I'm not saying chasing is without risk or dangers, but there is also significant risk and danger of doing nothing.

1 hour ago, E Rocc said:

 

This indirectly references why car thieves, particularly carjackers, should always be chased.  If they get away they got away clean, and they will re-offend.

 

Major or violent felonies always justify a chase.

 

The only way a chase is justified is if the accused is at immediate risk of hurting other innocent bystanders. The accused is less likely to act in a desperate manner and immediately commit another violent crime if they are not chased. It is far less dangerous to follow them via CCTV or with airborne platforms (drone, helicopter, etc). Chases only make insecure wanna-be tough guy cops feel more powerful and effective. A rational police officer knows the significant dangers to the public and to him/herself from a chase.

Police chases are counter productive unless we’re talking about a seriously dangerous criminal or terrorist. When a chase starts, a crime has already occurred. Creating a situation where people are fleeing at high rates of speed where they can go out of control and hurt more people just increases the chance for more crimes and victims. Police don’t immediately go Rambo when confronting someone who is holding hostages. They work to deescalate the situation because it decreases the chances of people getting hurt. 
 

I’m not saying the CPD is flawless or even well run, but it’s not fair to compare crime in suburbs to what is faced in Cleveland. The volume of crimes and 911 calls is much higher in Cleveland. Suburbs can respond more forcefully because they have less volume and less severe crimes to police in the first place. And I’m sure you could get any suburban police chief to go on the record and say “oh yeah, I am thankful we don’t have the same needs as CPD.” 

 

It’s completely fair to critique CPD and CLE leadership their approach to crime but to me saying “this wouldn’t happen in Lakewood or Beachwood” isn’t fair, imho. 

 

Many of those fleeing from the police are juveniles, some aren't even old enough to be driving.  99% of the time, it is a stolen vehicle.  And many of those are carjacked, which must be a traumatic experience for the victim. Even when caught, are there any significant consequences for these juveniles?  I'm guessing the answer is no.  Perhaps if those caught were to face mandatory jail time, it might be a deterrent.  If not pursued, our cities would turn into the wild west. Some may argue that has already happened.  I did ask a police officer about using drones for pursuit, but I was told they are not fast enough.   

 

Edited May 29, 20241 yr by LibertyBlvd

Their parents are totally abdicating their legal responsibility and should be punished too i.e. the Crumbleys.

 

Frankly, if the kids are living in environments where this behavior is shrugged off, condoned, even applauded, they should be removed at very early ages and put in highly monitored and reformed modern-day orphanages. Not all parents can and should parent, and we need to get the kids out of those communities before the damage is irreversible.

 

You need a license to fish but not to raise a human being; I do not understand this world.

 

3 hours ago, MayDay said:

 

The disbelief and shock is being expressed and shared on plenty of other platforms.

 

Any chance you took a look yesterday/today? I'll go by after work, but curious how it is.

 

A while back, but here's how hard CFD hit  Iglesia de Dios Pentecostal Church (formerly St. Sava) in February.

 

 

 

Edit, here's some photos from the church's facebook:

 

 

 

 

Edited May 29, 20241 yr by GISguy
Added photos

23 hours ago, mrnyc said:

 

you are exactly right. america doesnt remember and would be shocked today to learn that african americans had the highest rates of marriage until then. you didnt get the kind of crime we see today with youth from intact families and both parents in the kid’s face every day. lets try harder to promote family and help keep families together, that drops juvenile crime better than anything.

 

btw i’m sorry for these rants, but this is my entire career. i was the jails school psychologist for youth in detention for 25yrs.. 

^ this 💯 !!! 

From @NEO_scan...

CLE ~ Bldg Collapse - 733 Starkweather - St Theodosius - Dome appears to be about to collapse. CFD responding with bldg and housing @cleveland_ffs -BW

There's currently a crane on site, havent been able to get into Tremont to check it out, any updates on if it can be saved?

This is from Saturday, they removed the cross and sphere from the main dome which is the main structural concern. Snipped a photo from the neighborhood Facebook page to show the scale just of the sphere.
 

I’m not any expert but the way the domes were built, with wooden cores and copper sheeting, I’d have to think they acted like chimneys and generated incredible heat? Hard to tell if they’ll be able to salvage the dome but I’m sure they will rebuild. I’m the furthest from being a churchgoer but this was a gut punch to see in person.

Unfortunately for St. Theodosius, it doesn't have a legacy congregation like many of the historic Catholic churches in town. I hope something is done to save it. 

 

To comment on @MayDay's point... I actually am a churchgoer, and I don't think it necessarily matters when commenting on these buildings. In particular, the churches in our neighborhoods have a way of subtly recalling our better angels (even if those angels are secular), and the sense of community, pride, and purpose for which each structure was built. In particular, > 90% of Clevelanders would know and recognize St. Theodosius, and it's mere presence is an artifact of our parents, grandparents, and great-grandparents cultural heritage - and emblematic of what Eastern Europeans meant to the development of the South side. 

 

For as much as we may complain from time to time, most of us who grew up here are immensely proud of this place - and whether you're devoutly religious or an atheist, neighborhood churches have a a greater imprint on our cultural psyche than any other structures - save perhaps the steel mills. 

 

fire insurance????

o geez — its the notre dame of cleveland, at least as far as how its iconically known to locals. i didn’t think it had much of a legacy congregation anymore, but was hoping i was wrong. ugh. hopefully it can be repaired appropriately soon. 

There's a GoFundMe set up for the cathedral: https://campaigns.tithely.com/97560-st-theodosius-orthodox-cathedral/fire-restoration-campaign

 

News:

https://www.wkyc.com/article/news/local/cleveland/st-theodosius-orthodox-christian-cathedral-cleveland-police-block-off-scene/95-9c167eab-a3e6-4b44-93ec-7ef5ea02ab96

 

Ironically, here's a photo taken sometime in the 1940s showing Cleveland firefighters demonstrating their new aerial ladder truck at St. Theodosius Cathedral.  Photo courtesy of Bob Gahr.

 

I don't do social media stuff but perhaps someone who does could get the word out to a particular trio of actors that might be interested in saving the Deer Hunter Church. Between Streep, De Niro and Walken, they might be able to scrape up a donation or three.

4 hours ago, YABO713 said:

Unfortunately for St. Theodosius, it doesn't have a legacy congregation like many of the historic Catholic churches in town. I hope something is done to save it. 

 

To comment on @MayDay's point... I actually am a churchgoer, and I don't think it necessarily matters when commenting on these buildings. In particular, the churches in our neighborhoods have a way of subtly recalling our better angels (even if those angels are secular), and the sense of community, pride, and purpose for which each structure was built. In particular, > 90% of Clevelanders would know and recognize St. Theodosius, and it's mere presence is an artifact of our parents, grandparents, and great-grandparents cultural heritage - and emblematic of what Eastern Europeans meant to the development of the South side. 

 

For as much as we may complain from time to time, most of us who grew up here are immensely proud of this place - and whether you're devoutly religious or an atheist, neighborhood churches have a a greater imprint on our cultural psyche than any other structures - save perhaps the steel mills. 

 

 

I'm sure thwere will be a fund raiser.  I have given to ND de Paris and would cheerfully give to St Theodosius.

4 minutes ago, Dougal said:

 

I'm sure thwere will be a fund raiser.  I have given to ND de Paris and would cheerfully give to St Theodosius.

 

 

This was linked on their website https://campaigns.tithely.com/97560-st-theodosius-orthodox-cathedral/fire-restoration-campaign - can @KJP and the rest of us do our part to share this with our networks? The pictures show the damage, and I fear much has been lost... 

From one of the parishioners 😐

18 hours ago, YABO713 said:

 

 

This was linked on their website https://campaigns.tithely.com/97560-st-theodosius-orthodox-cathedral/fire-restoration-campaign - can @KJP and the rest of us do our part to share this with our networks? The pictures show the damage, and I fear much has been lost... 

 

My gripe about Go Fund Me is they take 3% of the donation.  The church website says donors can mail a check to St. Theodosius Orthodox Cathedral, 733 Starkweather, Cleveland 44113, which is what I will do.

36 minutes ago, Dougal said:

 

My gripe about Go Fund Me is they take 3% of the donation.  The church website says donors can mail a check to St. Theodosius Orthodox Cathedral, 733 Starkweather, Cleveland 44113, which is what I will do.

 

To note... the church's link is actually Tithely, which is different

Update, the main dome is coming down.

5 hours ago, Dougal said:

 

My gripe about Go Fund Me is they take 3% of the donation.  The church website says donors can mail a check to St. Theodosius Orthodox Cathedral, 733 Starkweather, Cleveland 44113, which is what I will do.

 

They probably should set up their own donation PayPal or Venmo, etc.   Snail mail and physical checks?    

4 hours ago, YABO713 said:

 

To note... the church's link is actually Tithely, which is different

Same fee as GoFundMe.

 

Not sure this is a crime or not just yet, as it's labeled a cyber "incident."    I did see something on Twitter about 911 dispatch having issues today as well.   For some reason Erieview Tower is also mentioned. 

 

At any rate, City employees probably won't mind a day off.. 

 

 

Cleveland City Hall closed Monday due to 'cyber incident,' city says

 

Cleveland City Hall and Erieview Tower will be closed on Monday due to a "cyber incident," according to an email received from the City of Cleveland.

Affected systems have been shut off and will remain off until the city better understands the incident, the City of Cleveland said in the email.

 

https://www.news5cleveland.com/news/local-news/cleveland-city-hall-erieview-tower-closed-monday-due-to-cyber-incident-city-says