Interesting....

 

MEDIA ADVISORY

 

CLEVELAND - Today, U.S. Attorney Rebecca C. Lutzko, along with federal and local partners, will hold a press conference to discuss the latest results of an ongoing, two-year investigation into an organized crime network operating in the Northern District of Ohio.

 

Who:                   Remarks:

U.S. Attorney Rebecca C. Lutzko for the Northern District of Ohio

Deputy Assistant Attorney General David Rody, U.S. Department of Justice

Special Agent in Charge Greg Nelsen, FBI-Cleveland Division

 

Attending:

David Jaffe, Chief, Violent Crime and Racketeering Section, U.S. Department of Justice

Dorothy Todd, Chief, Cleveland Division of Police

Anne Murphy, Assistant Chief Deputy Marshal, U.S. Marshals Service-Cleveland

Thomas J. Gergye, Assistant Special Agent in Charge, DEA-Cleveland District Office

John G. Smerglia, Assistant Special Agent in Charge, ATF-Columbus Field Division

 

 

When:                 Wednesday, December 4, 2024, at 1 p.m.

                        Media set up: 12:15 p.m.

Where:               U.S. Attorney’s Office, 801 W. Superior Ave., 8th Floor, Cleveland, OH

 

###

25 minutes ago, KJP said:

Interesting....

 

MEDIA ADVISORY

 

CLEVELAND - Today, U.S. Attorney Rebecca C. Lutzko, along with federal and local partners, will hold a press conference to discuss the latest results of an ongoing, two-year investigation into an organized crime network operating in the Northern District of Ohio.

 

Who:                   Remarks:

U.S. Attorney Rebecca C. Lutzko for the Northern District of Ohio

Deputy Assistant Attorney General David Rody, U.S. Department of Justice

Special Agent in Charge Greg Nelsen, FBI-Cleveland Division

 

Attending:

David Jaffe, Chief, Violent Crime and Racketeering Section, U.S. Department of Justice

Dorothy Todd, Chief, Cleveland Division of Police

Anne Murphy, Assistant Chief Deputy Marshal, U.S. Marshals Service-Cleveland

Thomas J. Gergye, Assistant Special Agent in Charge, DEA-Cleveland District Office

John G. Smerglia, Assistant Special Agent in Charge, ATF-Columbus Field Division

 

 

When:                 Wednesday, December 4, 2024, at 1 p.m.

                        Media set up: 12:15 p.m.

Where:               U.S. Attorney’s Office, 801 W. Superior Ave., 8th Floor, Cleveland, OH

 

###

 

I have heard rumors of NEO businesses with ties to the Mexican Cartels.

 

Most notably, the steel plant in Lorain, which I got this rumor from straight from the mouth of a high ranking employee (at the time) of the Lorain Mayor's office.

 

I heard the same about a few businesses on the east side of Cleveland acting as fronts, but this was from a less reliable source.

24 minutes ago, Zagapi said:

 

I have heard rumors of NEO businesses with ties to the Mexican Cartels.

 

Most notably, the steel plant in Lorain, which I got this rumor from straight from the mouth of a high ranking employee (at the time) of the Lorain Mayor's office.

 

I heard the same about a few businesses on the east side of Cleveland acting as fronts, but this was from a less reliable source.

 

Real life Ozark...in Lorain.   I guess that checks out!  :) 

Just now, Cleburger said:

 

Real life Ozark...in Lorain.   I guess that checks out!  :) 

 

I've heard the same and that was my first thought then.

On 12/2/2024 at 10:48 AM, YABO713 said:

 

A couple of my wife's friends are already talking about how "abhorrent the racial profiling" was at the event. Her one friend said, and I quote "it ruined the event for me..."

 

Apparently they're not alone. I'm no longer on Facebook but I've heard it's been a hot bed of equivocating the police's sensible actions with Stop and Frisk

 

This sort of pearl clutching virtue signaling keeps the federal overseers "employed" and the line officers hamstrung.

55 minutes ago, E Rocc said:

 

This sort of pearl clutching virtue signaling keeps the federal overseers "employed" and the line officers hamstrung.

I'm just going to say it. Even though stop and frisk was unconstitutional, it sure as hell made NYC a safe place to be. And that's not to say I found NYC to be dangerous. But you would not be having many guns on kids downtown if stop and frisk was in Cleveland

9 minutes ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said:

I'm just going to say it. Even though stop and frisk was unconstitutional, it sure as hell made NYC a safe place to be. And that's not to say I found NYC to be dangerous. But you would not be having many guns on kids downtown if stop and frisk was in Cleveland

 

Why just downtown?  And why just kids?  Make every man, woman and child susceptible to a pullover and thorough patdown anytime, anyplace.  Install checkpoints along major roads and at the entrances to public places.  Mass deputizarion of civilians to work the many, many, checkpoints that society needs to ensure safety everywhere.  Only then will we be truly safe from the scary people.

20 minutes ago, X said:

 

Why just downtown?  And why just kids?  Make every man, woman and child susceptible to a pullover and thorough patdown anytime, anyplace.  Install checkpoints along major roads and at the entrances to public places.  Mass deputizarion of civilians to work the many, many, checkpoints that society needs to ensure safety everywhere.  Only then will we be truly safe from the scary people.

Why just downtown and kids? Dude have you been living under a rock for the last few years? Or do you just choose to be ignorant on the complete spike in shootings, robberies, carjackings and burglaries occurring downtown, ohio city, Tremont (name whatever area of Cleveland that had a glimmer of hope rebounding after decades of continued population flight from crime) that are being committed by a disproportionate amount of juveniles. I can't even convince my friends in Willoughby to get dinner at Luca's anymore because of the uncontrolled debauchery that is going on in this city. 

And I already said it's unconstitutional because of the inevitable racial profiling lawsuit. 

8 minutes ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said:

 I can't even convince my friends in Willoughby to get dinner at Luca's anymore because of the uncontrolled debauchery that is going on in this city. 

 

 

Better Italian food on the Hill LOL.    Last I checked things are still more or less under control there.   :)

Random idea I had the other day that I mentioned in the Euclid group.    Are traffic lights in the city and/or inner ring flexible enough that the ones without in-pavement sensors can cycle more quickly at low traffic times, especially overnight?   Seems like long lights might facilitate crimes of opportunity.

I'm not diminishing crime or saying anyone should accept it, but the Northeast Ohio impulse to flee the minute something bad happens only makes things worse. 

 

I know I shouldn't but I can't help reading comments on Facebook and you'd think the only place safe to hang out is under a rock in an empty field somewhere in Ashtabula County.

 

That doesn't take away the responsibility of cities to go after crime and make people feel safe, of course.

38 minutes ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said:

Why just downtown and kids? Dude have you been living under a rock for the last few years? Or do you just choose to be ignorant on the complete spike in shootings, robberies, carjackings and burglaries occurring downtown, ohio city, Tremont (name whatever area of Cleveland that had a glimmer of hope rebounding after decades of continued population flight from crime) that are being committed by a disproportionate amount of juveniles. I can't even convince my friends in Willoughby to get dinner at Luca's anymore because of the uncontrolled debauchery that is going on in this city. 

And I already said it's unconstitutional because of the inevitable racial profiling lawsuit. 

 

Great that you recognize that fact.  But why then pine for unconstitutional infringements upon people's civil rights?  Is it just that  your nostalgia is based on the assumption that you and yours won't be put up against a wall for a good ball-cupping on your big night out?

44 minutes ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said:

I can't even convince my friends in Willoughby to get dinner at Luca's anymore because of the uncontrolled debauchery that is going on in this city. 

 

They're right: I get stabbed every time I walk outside in the city. I got shot 13 times just now on lunch break and I was robbed at least 3 times walking to my bus after the snow game last week. 

 

If all your friends do is watch local news I wouldn't blame them for this outlook - they make money reporting off terrible news.

Edited December 4, 2024Dec 4 by GISguy

Problem, among many others, is there are a lot of crime realities that will never be properly addressed due to racial implications, and so many cities are stuck in holding patterns silently hoping for demographic changes, which in turn would lower crime rates, improve schools, etc.

 

What can you do. 

 

 

So many crimes are being committed by young juveniles.  Carjackings by some juveniles that aren't even old enough to drive.  What is happening to them if/when they are caught?  Apparently, nothing of any significance.  Until that changes, nothing will change.

7 minutes ago, LibertyBlvd said:

So many crimes are being committed by young juveniles.  Carjackings by some juveniles that aren't even old enough to drive.  What is happening to them if/when they are caught?  Apparently, nothing of any significance.  Until that changes, nothing will change.

 

If all the people angry about the next President were just as upset by the weakness of the juvenile justice system - something might change... I'll admit I'm a "one strike and you're out" (and "stop and frisk me, please, if it means you're able to then stop and frisk the ones who really need stopping and frisking" kind of guy - but, seriously... So many reports indicate multiple, multiple offenses in the past of many of the young getting caught. That should never be allowed to happen.  

 

 

35 minutes ago, X said:

 

Great that you recognize that fact.  But why then pine for unconstitutional infringements upon people's civil rights?  Is it just that  your nostalgia is based on the assumption that you and yours won't be put up against a wall for a good ball-cupping on your big night out?

I'm not sure @AsDustinFoxWouldSay is advocating for stop and frisk, merely pointing out that it was successful. Protecting civil liberties is pretty much always in tension with preventing crime. It's perfectly reasonable to acknowledge stop and frisk worked while still opposing it on civil liberties grounds. Bukele's programs in El Salvador have been miraculously successful, and probably a good trade in that instance, but they also completely trampled the civil liberties of many accused criminals. Alternatively, as my highschool history teacher liked to say Saddam Hussein never had a crime problem. It's a trade off. 

Here's the press release. But some of those nicknames......

 

Department of Justice

REBECCA C. LUTZKO
UNITED STATES ATTORNEY FOR THE NORTHERN DISTRICT OF OHIO

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE

 

18 Ohio Gang Members and Associates Charged in Second Superseding Indictment

 Charges Include RICO Conspiracy, Murder, Kidnapping, Assault, Firearms Violations, and Drug Trafficking

 

CLEVELAND – The U.S. Attorney’s Office for the Northern District of Ohio today unsealed a second superseding indictment against 18 members and associates of a Cleveland-based, violent street gang known as the Fully Blooded Felons or “FBF.” The defendants charged are alleged to have committed numerous federal crimes, including Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organizations (RICO) conspiracy, murder in aid of racketeering, kidnapping in aid of racketeering, assault in aid of racketeering, firearms violations, conspiracy, and drug trafficking. The investigation that led to this second superseding indictment took place throughout the last two years, with the initial indictment issued on Dec. 20, 2023, followed by a superseding indictment on April 4, 2024.

 

According to court documents, members of FBF have engaged in criminal activity for more than a decade in Ohio, since approximately 2012. The gang was primarily based on the east side of Cleveland, but also established strongholds in Akron, Youngstown, and other areas. The scope and reach of the gang’s alleged criminal operations included attempts to infiltrate the Ohio prison system.

 

Federal and local law enforcement agents and officers apprehended individuals in a series of coordinated arrests. They seized several controlled substances, including cocaine, methamphetamine, and more than 400 grams of fentanyl. They also confiscated 15 illegally possessed firearms throughout the investigation.

 

“The superseding indictment alleges that these 18 defendants were leaders, members, or associates of the Fully Blooded Felons, a violent gang that — for more than a decade — made money and controlled territory in Northern Ohio through murder, arson, robbery, drug trafficking, and firearms possession,” said Principal Deputy Assistant Attorney General Nicole M. Argentieri, head of the Justice Department’s Criminal Division. “Violence and other gang activities make communities less safe for all of their residents. Addressing violent crime — including through the arrests announced today — is one of the Criminal Division’s highest priorities. I am proud of the outstanding work done by our Violent Crime and Racketeering Section, in partnership with our federal, state, and local partners, to make our communities safer places to live by targeting the most violent offenders on our streets.”

 

“As the indictment alleges, the Fully Blooded Felons styled themselves after a Mafia crime family, terrorizing Cleveland’s streets and operating an open-air illegal drug market in the Cedar Central neighborhood for years. I commend the valiant efforts of our brave law enforcement partners who have worked diligently to win back our streets and protect our community by taking down these bad actors,” said U.S. Attorney Rebecca Lutzko for the Northern District of Ohio. “The USAO will aggressively continue to pursue—through RICO prosecutions and other federal charges—violent criminals who seek to secure territory, power, and money by ruthlessly harming others, peddling poisons, and creating an atmosphere of fear. Members of FBF or other violent gangs in this District who have yet to be caught should think twice before continuing to engage in such illegal and destructive behavior.”

 

“For several years, these individuals committed a homicide, armed robberies, and unlawfully imported and distributed fentanyl and other dangerous opioids throughout the community, said FBI Cleveland Special Agent in Charge Greg Nelsen. “The Fully Blooded Felons, a subset of the Heartless Felons criminal network, has been identified as Cleveland’s most significant gang threat and their reign of terror is over thanks to the collaborative efforts of FBI and the Safe Streets Gang Task Force. We will not waver in our mission to investigate, disrupt, and dismantle gangs not only in the larger cities across America, but also right here in northern Ohio.”

 

During the investigation, law enforcement officials uncovered the defendants’ patterns of racketeering activity, which included their establishment of an organizational structure for their criminal enterprise involving gang membership hierarchy, titles, and rules. The FBF’s framework was allegedly created by its highest-ranking member, Raven Mullins, who held the self-proclaimed position of “Godfather.” The gang structure included a “Commission” made up of a member subgroup known as “Commissioners.” Together, they maintained the enterprise’s organization through physical discipline and by determining which illicit means they would pursue to generate income. To accomplish their goal of promoting and enhancing their criminal enterprise and its members’ and associates’ activities, and preserving and protecting their territories, FBF members and associates conspired to commit and did commit a murder, assaults, robberies, and drug trafficking.

 

As the indictment alleges, each FBF member was expected to follow a set of rules that Mullins primarily established. Mullins and the Commission disseminated these expectations to FBF members online, in text messages, and by face-to-face communications. Members were required to memorize and recite a set of rules, known as the “Fully Five,” at meetings, and they faced punishment if they answered incorrectly. Rules included following all orders issued by the Commission, pledging their loyalty to fellow members, and being respectful to the “Capos,” who were FBF members in leadership roles beneath the Commissioners. They were also expected to know and adhere to the “Fully Commandments,” another set of rules similar to the “Fully Five.”

 

Investigators discovered that gang members occupied two separate units at a local apartment complex that they used as stash-houses to facilitate drug trafficking. While executing two search warrants, law enforcement officers recovered more than 400 grams of fentanyl, cocaine, methamphetamine, and multiple firearms from these locations.

 

According to the second superseding indictment, on Sept. 12, 2023, Raven Mullins, Henry Burchett, and James Clemons, along with another unidentified individual, shot and killed a victim on the westside of Cleveland. After killing the victim, the defendants fled the scene in a stolen vehicle that was later set on fire.

 

The second superseding indictment alleges a years-long pattern of racketeering and violence, including a murder, kidnapping, assaults, and drug trafficking. The defendants and their charges are as follows:

 

·       Raven Mullins, aka Dunny, aka Dun, 35, of Cleveland, Ohio, is charged with RICO conspiracy, murder in aid of racketeering, kidnapping in aid of racketeering, assault in aid of racketeering, conspiracy to distribute controlled substances, numerous counts of possession with the intent to distribute controlled substances, possession of a firearm in furtherance of a drug trafficking crime, use of a communications facility to facilitate a felony drug offense, and being a felon in possession of a firearm.

 

·       Henry Burchett, aka Noodles, aka Noo, aka Omerta, 29, of Cleveland, Ohio, is charged with RICO conspiracy, murder in aid of racketeering, kidnapping in aid of racketeering, assault in aid of racketeering, conspiracy to distribute controlled substances, numerous counts of possession with the intent to distribute controlled substances, possession of a firearm in furtherance of a drug trafficking crime, use of a communications facility to facilitate a felony drug offense, and being a felon in possession of a firearm.

 

·       Elijah Johnson, aka Loon, 37, of Youngstown, Ohio, is charged with conspiracy to distribute controlled substances, interstate travel in aid of racketeering, and use of a communications facility to facilitate a felony drug offense.

·       Demarcus Elliott, aka Moo, aka Fast Lane, 37, of Cleveland, Ohio, is charged with RICO conspiracy, conspiracy to distribute controlled substances, and use of a communications facility to facilitate a felony drug offense.

·       Dontez Hammond, aka Donny, aka Tez, 35, of Cleveland, Ohio, is charged with RICO conspiracy, conspiracy to distribute controlled substances, and being a felon in possession of a firearm.

·       Jeffrey Lee, aka Fatty, 24, of Cleveland, Ohio, is charged with RICO conspiracy, conspiracy to distribute controlled substances, numerous counts of possession with the intent to distribute controlled substances, possession of a firearm in furtherance of a drug trafficking crime, and use of a communications facility to facilitate a felony drug offense.

·       Jerrell Jones-Ferrell, aka Ruga, 25, of Cleveland, Ohio, is charged with conspiracy to distribute controlled substances, use of a communications facility to facilitate a felony drug offense, and being a felon in possession of a firearm.

·       Devonte Johnson, aka D Nut, aka Nut, 32, of Euclid, Ohio, is charged with conspiracy to distribute controlled substances, and being a felon in possession of a firearm.

·       Jerome Williams, aka Jay, aka JT, 29, of Cleveland, Ohio, is charged with RICO conspiracy, conspiracy to distribute controlled substances, and use of a communications facility to facilitate a felony drug offense.

·       Christepher Horton, aka Cam, aka Killa, 41, of Cleveland, Ohio, is charged with RICO conspiracy, conspiracy to distribute controlled substances, possession with the intent to distribute controlled substances, and use of a communications facility to facilitate a felony drug offense.

·       Deeundra Perkins, aka Drizzy, 33, of Garfield Heights, Ohio, is charged with conspiracy to distribute controlled substances.

·       Deon Blackwell, aka White Boy, 38, of Cleveland, Ohio, is charged with conspiracy to distribute controlled substances and use of a communications facility to facilitate a felony drug offense.

·       James Clemons, aka Flock, aka Pope, aka Fully Pope Flock, 32, of Cleveland, Ohio, is charged with RICO conspiracy and murder in aid of racketeering.

·       Alex Darden, aka Lil’ Pee Wee, 23, of Cleveland, Ohio, is charged with RICO conspiracy and conspiracy to distribute controlled substances.

·       Esmond Williams, aka Relle, 35, of Cleveland, Ohio, is charged with RICO conspiracy and conspiracy to distribute controlled substances.

·       Adrionna Null, aka Ali, 27, of Cleveland, Ohio, is charged with kidnapping in aid of racketeering and assault in aid of racketeering.

·       Myeasha West, aka Action, 31, of Lorain, Ohio, is charged with kidnapping in aid of racketeering and assault in aid of racketeering.

·       Kyla Sharie Tyler, aka Yayeo, 27, of Cleveland, Ohio, is charged with kidnapping in aid of racketeering and assault in aid of racketeering.

 

An indictment is merely an allegation. Defendants are presumed innocent and entitled to a fair trial in which it will be the government’s burden to prove guilt beyond a reasonable doubt.

 

If convicted, each defendant’s sentence will be determined by the Court after review of factors unique to the case, including each defendant’s prior criminal record, if any, their role in the offense, and the characteristics of the violation. In all cases, the sentence will not exceed the statutory maximum, and, in most cases, it will be less than the maximum.

 

This prosecution is part of an Organized Crime Drug Enforcement Task Force (OCDETF) Strike Force Initiative, which provides for the establishment of permanent multi-agency task force teams that work side-by-side in the same location. This co-located model enables agents from different agencies to collaborate on intelligence-driven, multi­-jurisdictional operations to disrupt and dismantle the most significant drug traffickers, money launderers, gangs, and transnational criminal organizations.

 

The specific mission of the OCDETF Cleveland Strike Force is to disrupt and dismantle major criminal organizations and subsidiary organizations, including criminal gangs, transnational drug cartels, racketeering organizations, and other groups engaged in illicit activities that present a threat to public safety and national security and are related to the illegal smuggling and trafficking of narcotics or other controlled substances, weapons, humans, or the illegal concealment or transfer of proceeds derived from such illicit activities in the Northern District of Ohio. The OCDETF Cleveland Strike Force is composed of agents and officers from the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI), Drug Enforcement Administration (DEA), Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms (ATF), and Explosives, Homeland Security Investigations, United States Marshals Service (USMS), U.S. Postal Inspection Service, Internal Revenue Service, and U.S. Border Patrol, along with task force officers from numerous local law enforcement agencies, including the Cleveland Division of Police. Prosecutions are led by the Office of the United States Attorney for the Northern District of Ohio.

 

This case was investigated by the FBI Cleveland Division, with assistance from the Cuyahoga County Prosecutor’s Office, the Cleveland Division of Police, USMS, the DEA, and the ATF.

 

This case is being prosecuted by Assistant United States Attorneys Paul E. Hanna and Robert F. Corts for the Northern District of Ohio, and Trial Attorneys Brian W. Lynch and Alyssa Levey-Weinstein of the Justice Department Criminal Division’s Violent Crime and Racketeering Section.

 

###

1 hour ago, LibertyBlvd said:

So many crimes are being committed by young juveniles.  Carjackings by some juveniles that aren't even old enough to drive.  What is happening to them if/when they are caught?  Apparently, nothing of any significance.  Until that changes, nothing will change.

 

Juvenile records are sealed.  That means that the records of juvenile judges are not public knowledge.   

 

The public (even victims) do not know if judges are strict or lenient.   But the friends and family of the miscreants do, and some of them vote.

BTW, whenever a gang gets taken down or substantially disrupted by law enforcement, there is almost always an uptick in violence by a new (and/or old) gang stepping up to fill the void. This could be a rough winter....

2 hours ago, KJP said:

BTW, whenever a gang gets taken down or substantially disrupted by law enforcement, there is almost always an uptick in violence by a new (and/or old) gang stepping up to fill the void. This could be a rough winter....

FWIW - Fully Blooded Felons are some DUMB MF's. I was involved with a trial involving some members my second year out of law school. I'm shocked they were out there this long - no org structure, at all, constant internal feuding, and they wear clothes and drive cars that SCREAM "I do illegal things"

12 hours ago, YABO713 said:

FWIW - Fully Blooded Felons are some DUMB MF's. I was involved with a trial involving some members my second year out of law school. I'm shocked they were out there this long - no org structure, at all, constant internal feuding, and they wear clothes and drive cars that SCREAM "I do illegal things"

 

These guys were likely lower ranks than moved up when that bunch became guests of the state.

 

Presumably they are a branch-off of HF, which seems to fight among itself even more than with their ostensible rivals LA.  There's little or no effort to do anything legit (unlike LA).

14 hours ago, KJP said:

BTW, whenever a gang gets taken down or substantially disrupted by law enforcement, there is almost always an uptick in violence by a new (and/or old) gang stepping up to fill the void. This could be a rough winter....

 

They mostly operated out of Cedar Estates in Central.

23 hours ago, Zagapi said:

 

I have heard rumors of NEO businesses with ties to the Mexican Cartels.

 

Most notably, the steel plant in Lorain, which I got this rumor from straight from the mouth of a high ranking employee (at the time) of the Lorain Mayor's office.

 

I heard the same about a few businesses on the east side of Cleveland acting as fronts, but this was from a less reliable source.

Heard the same about the Canton operation from someone who worked there. When he tried to retire the SSA informed him no taxes had been paid for his entire employment period. Almost certain he’s not an isolated case.

 

Surprised nothing has happened yet.

2 hours ago, Enginerd said:

Heard the same about the Canton operation from someone who worked there. When he tried to retire the SSA informed him no taxes had been paid for his entire employment period. Almost certain he’s not an isolated case.

 

Surprised nothing has happened yet.

 

This came up when the press conference got announced, but that turned out to be more gang indictments.

2 hours ago, Enginerd said:

Heard the same about the Canton operation from someone who worked there. When he tried to retire the SSA informed him no taxes had been paid for his entire employment period. Almost certain he’s not an isolated case.

 

Surprised nothing has happened yet.

 

If we are talking about RS like I think we are, the parent company owns a plant in Mexico where 12 workers got killed in an explosion at the end of October.

The thing about the indictments that really stood out to me is that some of the guys are in their late 30s and early 40s. I don't think that is ordinary for street gang activity. 

19 hours ago, freefourur said:

The thing about the indictments that really stood out to me is that some of the guys are in their late 30s and early 40s. I don't think that is ordinary for street gang activity. 

 

It's normal for the activity but not for indictments.  Someone younger likely turned informant.

3 minutes ago, E Rocc said:

 

It's normal for the activity but not for indictments.  Someone younger likely turned informant.

that makes sense. these "older" guys are not likely doing street level activity. So either someone snitched or they were sloppy with communications.

Another shooting in the W25/Detroit area at W28 and Detroit this time. Didn't sound good for the victim when i tuned into the police scanner briefly. I believe that's the 4th separate shooting in the last 4 or 5 months in this stretch. I wonder how much longer The Quarter will be able to keep their higher price points when the typical initial neighborhood google search pops up with multiple recent homicides on the sidewalk outside. 

No one wants to admit it, but the projects north of the boulevard will never allow that area be a safe place to live. 

Quite Frankly, idk how places like Lekko, Saucy, Jukebox continue to stick around with this BS

Didn't a female get raped after a boxing class in the space next to saucy a few years ago?

Edited December 9, 2024Dec 9 by AsDustinFoxWouldSay

16 hours ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said:

No one wants to admit it, but the projects north of the boulevard will never allow that area be a safe place to live. 

Quite Frankly, idk how places like Lekko, Saucy, Jukebox continue to stick around with this BS

Didn't a female get raped after a boxing class in the space next to saucy a few years ago?

I was down there last night right around the time this was happening.  The bars were packed especially the new Royal Docks Brewing and continued to stay packed throughout the night.  Its an unfortunate reality of most major cities due to all walks of life living in them but I dont think it has the effect you are trying to portray. If you are not committing a crime or a criminal you are more than likely to not be involved in something like this and I think the people who choose to spend time in the city realize that.

18 hours ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said:

No one wants to admit it, but the projects north of the boulevard will never allow that area be a safe place to live. 

Quite Frankly, idk how places like Lekko, Saucy, Jukebox continue to stick around with this BS

Didn't a female get raped after a boxing class in the space next to saucy a few years ago?

 

I've been saying that Lakeview Terrace is a millstone around the neck of that neighborhood for some time.  I even showed Kelly where never to ever go north of the one night we found our way down to the Flats.  But politically, nothing is going to be done by the types of city governments we get.

 

^ "If you are not committing a crime or a criminal you are more than likely to not be involved in something like this and I think the people who choose to spend time in the city realize that."

 

That's true about homicide but not so true about property crimes and associated violence.

Edited December 10, 2024Dec 10 by E Rocc

The question about the reality of safety is interesting, but somewhat irrelevant, because ultimately what matters is the perception of safety. While objective numbers might be hard to gather, I'd be shocked if Lakeview Terrace isn't dragging down the perception of safety in the area, justified or not. The perception alone is enough to hold the neighborhood back. 

 

And yet all the new developments in the area, such as The Quarter, are practically full: https://www.quarterohiocity.com/availableunits.aspx?myOlePropertyId=1220975&MoveInDate=&t=0.21836458666089054&floorPlans=4504555

 

Future large investments like Irish Bend Park, Bridgeworks, and the new apartments on the old Vibrator site show the neighborhood is anything but stalled. The latest Landmark Agenda has two custom $1M+ homes going up on the few remaining vacant lots nearby - it’s clear the area is thriving despite any perceived safety concerns.

Edited December 10, 2024Dec 10 by Clefan98

5 hours ago, TDi said:

I was down there last night right around the time this was happening.  The bars were packed especially the new Royal Docks Brewing and continued to stay packed throughout the night.  Its an unfortunate reality of most major cities due to all walks of life living in them but I dont think it has the effect you are trying to portray. If you are not committing a crime or a criminal you are more than likely to not be involved in something like this and I think the people who choose to spend time in the city realize that.

 

Exactly. I was also in the area and can confirm the incredible energy. Places like the new Royal Docks Brewing were bustling with people enjoying the nightlife Ohio City offers. It’s a positive sign this area will remain a hub for socializing and gatherings despite isolated incidents.

 

Statistically, the likelihood of being involved in a crime as a law-abiding individual is extremely low, and the data supports the fact that cities are far safer today than in past decades.

 

6 hours ago, TDi said:

I was down there last night right around the time this was happening.  The bars were packed especially the new Royal Docks Brewing and continued to stay packed throughout the night.  Its an unfortunate reality of most major cities due to all walks of life living in them but I dont think it has the effect you are trying to portray. If you are not committing a crime or a criminal you are more than likely to not be involved in something like this and I think the people who choose to spend time in the city realize that.

Bullets don't have names on them buddy. A corner alley worker was hit by a ricochet bullet last summer by some thugs fighting in broad daylight on E4. When crap like this happens in a dense area like Detroit/W28, I doubt yuppies are going to keep spending time there

1 minute ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said:

Bullets don't have names on them buddy. A corner alley worker was hit by a ricochet bullet last summer by some thugs fighting in broad daylight on E4. When crap like this happens in a dense area like Detroit/W28, I doubt yuppies are going to keep spending time there

 

According to your own logic, E4th should be a ghost town, but it's not. In fact, businesses there are expanding.

Just now, Clefan98 said:

 

According to your own logic, E4th should be a ghost town, but it's not. In fact, businesses there are expanding.

E4 hasn't had like 4 shootings in 6 months on the same block. It's not the same. I used that as an example of people minding their own business in the city are not immunte to some POS's shooting at each other with a bunch of people around. 

6 minutes ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said:

E4 hasn't had like 4 shootings in 6 months on the same block. It's not the same. I used that as an example of people minding their own business in the city are not immunte to some POS's shooting at each other with a bunch of people around. 

 

You're right, it isn't the same. The E4th situation is actually much worse considering one of the victims was an innocent bystander, according to you.  All of the issues surrounding Lakeside happened between known parties.

2 hours ago, Clefan98 said:

 

And yet all the new developments in the area, such as The Quarter, are practically full: https://www.quarterohiocity.com/availableunits.aspx?myOlePropertyId=1220975&MoveInDate=&t=0.21836458666089054&floorPlans=4504555

 

Future large investments like Irish Bend Park, Bridgeworks, and the new apartments on the old Vibrator site show the neighborhood is anything but stalled. The latest Landmark Agenda has two custom $1M+ homes going up on the few remaining vacant lots nearby - it’s clear the area is thriving despite any perceived safety concerns.

Ya I don't think it's going to slow down the neighborhood. I mean, Short North and OTR have way more crime than Ohio City does and they haven't slowed down. I walk and bike through this area often and have never had any issues. 

 

I meant just The Quarter potentially being hurt, as 3? of the shootings have happened on the sidewalks along their properties. They're currently one of the highest price points in the Hingetown area. And if potential renters do a quick Google search on the address, they will likely see multiple news stories on recent shootings and homicides. 

Lekko Coffee is so popular I can hardly get a spot in there when I am in town.

 

But I will say I wish they could do something more beneficial with the project housing. There has to be a way to remake the place as more connected, more diverse, safer and to provide better opportunities without displacing the residents there.

 

The way that housing is practically hidden away and isolated now is just very strange. 

Sounds like there are serious quality of life issues at Lakeview Terrace beyond the crime and drugs - such as asthma from adjacent industries, lead pipes and water treatment odors. These projects should be bulldozed and either reimagine the property with new build as with Woodhill Estates - or turn it to other public uses given the known air quality issues from industry and water treatment.

 

We see there were some meetings last year but don’t know how high on CMHA’s agenda Lakeview ranks:

https://www.clevescene.com/news/rats-dirty-air-broken-faucets-lakeview-terrace-residents-wonder-when-help-will-come-41984309

https://www.clevescene.com/news/walled-off-and-plagued-by-pollution-and-truck-noise-conversations-begin-on-connecting-improving-lakeview-terrace-41557247

 

 

15 hours ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said:

Bullets don't have names on them buddy. A corner alley worker was hit by a ricochet bullet last summer by some thugs fighting in broad daylight on E4. When crap like this happens in a dense area like Detroit/W28, I doubt yuppies are going to keep spending time there

 

people are hit by stray cars exponentially more frequently. best not to leave the house at all!

13 hours ago, surfohio said:

Lekko Coffee is so popular I can hardly get a spot in there when I am in town.

 

But I will say I wish they could do something more beneficial with the project housing. There has to be a way to remake the place as more connected, more diverse, safer and to provide better opportunities without displacing the residents there.

 

The way that housing is practically hidden away and isolated now is just very strange. 

 

yeah. I've been in some of them as part of mental health outreach calls and.. phew.. not great.

42 minutes ago, Willo said:

Sounds like there are serious quality of life issues at Lakeview Terrace beyond the crime and drugs - such as asthma from adjacent industries, lead pipes and water treatment odors. These projects should be bulldozed and either reimagine the property with new build as with Woodhill Estates - or turn it to other public uses given the known air quality issues from industry and water treatment.

 

We see there were some meetings last year but don’t know how high on CMHA’s agenda Lakeview ranks:

https://www.clevescene.com/news/rats-dirty-air-broken-faucets-lakeview-terrace-residents-wonder-when-help-will-come-41984309

https://www.clevescene.com/news/walled-off-and-plagued-by-pollution-and-truck-noise-conversations-begin-on-connecting-improving-lakeview-terrace-41557247

 

 

 

They want to connect the area better to Ohio City and the Flats?   Oh yeah, that will improve the perception of safety in both.   

16 hours ago, surfohio said:

The way that housing is practically hidden away and isolated now is just very strange. 

I'm sure by design as it was constructed about the same time as the Shoreway.  

 

16 hours ago, surfohio said:

But I will say I wish they could do something more beneficial with the project housing. There has to be a way to remake the place as more connected, more diverse, safer and to provide better opportunities without displacing the residents there.

 

I'd like to see CMHA raise all the low rise buildings and keep the tower.  Then construct several new high rises around it for low/middle income familes, freeing up land for more park and retail uses.  

 

2 hours ago, E Rocc said:

 

They want to connect the area better to Ohio City and the Flats?   Oh yeah, that will improve the perception of safety in both.   

The evidence is overwhelming that mixed-income housing is FAR better for public health and safety, as well as improving upward economic mobility for the poor. Several of the concepts proposed in this thread could be implemented as mixed-income housing, which would be better for everyone. 

1 hour ago, Boomerang_Brian said:

The evidence is overwhelming that mixed-income housing is FAR better for public health and safety, as well as improving upward economic mobility for the poor. Several of the concepts proposed in this thread could be implemented as mixed-income housing, which would be better for everyone. 

 

I'll go ahead and say the quiet part out loud.

 

The problem with "mixed income" housing is it doesn't stay that way because the people who can opt out do so.  There's things that middle or upper income people consider important quality of life issues that lower income people are indifferent to.  Or sometimes even hostile.   

 

Late night noise, especially on weeknights, would be a good example.  Especially public emotional outbursts.  Loitering in front of stores or even in other public places is another that comes to mind.  

 

These are things that may not be illegal, or even malicious.  But to have a mixed income area, you need to have people who have enough income to have options.  They are unlikely to live places where they are uncomfortable.

1 hour ago, E Rocc said:

 

I'll go ahead and say the quiet part out loud.

 

The problem with "mixed income" housing is it doesn't stay that way because the people who can opt out do so.  There's things that middle or upper income people consider important quality of life issues that lower income people are indifferent to.  Or sometimes even hostile.   

 

Late night noise, especially on weeknights, would be a good example.  Especially public emotional outbursts.  Loitering in front of stores or even in other public places is another that comes to mind.  

 

These are things that may not be illegal, or even malicious.  But to have a mixed income area, you need to have people who have enough income to have options.  They are unlikely to live places where they are uncomfortable.

 

I hear you, but need to add that in my experience people often will purposefully subject themselves to the negativity if in their mind the pros outweigh the cons.

 

Like, I live in arguably the loudest, weirdest, most chaotic neighborhood on the West Coast. Every night there are loud bands, street musicians, crazy parties, drum circles, people literally playing with fire,  public drinking/drug use, dumb arguments, people getting hit by cars, crime etc. etc. There are a lot of homeless people everywhere and it is legal for them to sleep on the sidewalk, and every night, they do. Convenient parking spaces are oftentimes impossible to find and traffic for the beach makes it a chore to come and go. And yet even still, it is nearly impossible to rent here, let alone buy, as prices have absolutely gone through the roof. For any open unit there are typically hundreds of applicants. 

 

Is Ohio City, or other cool Cleveland neighborhoods enough of an attraction for people to put up with this kind of stuff?