July 23, 200717 yr Let's start a Prison District! ah yes, if there is some big money interests somehow involved I can imagine where this would be...perhaps in a school yard in a ward near me? Musky do not feel bad about NIMBY'ing this. Looking at the well being of the rehab residents- I would be concerned about placing too many of these in inner city neighborhoods. the temptation for relapse is huge. I have a step down program near me and I know it is hard for the residents given all the drug activity in the vicinity. It is a constant fight to keep the dealers off the street. I say it should go in a community with little drug activity and good public transport and job oppurtunity...westgate transit area or Beachwood perhaps? Every community can handle an "unpopular" business here and there. Stack them all in one place and you gotta an issue! Besides those suburban people come to the city to enjoy our many amenities...why not share in some of the social obligations of the region? PS does it bother anyone that the prison population is going up and is all we see is more cirme?
July 24, 200717 yr E Rocc: Ok Read your response tomorrow and ask yourself: "Self... why?" "Why are all the "customers" living only in the city, when many of the jobs are located outside said city?" "Why... self?" I've commented on this in other threads. I'm sure it's convenient to blame "sprawl", but the fact is as long as there have been cities, the poorest people have tended to live in the higher density portions of same. The jobs being located outside the city? That's something new. One can call it "business sprawl", which isn't inaccurate. But except for retail businesses, the forces driving it are very different from those driving "residential sprawl". First of all, there's still jobs inside the city. Even though there are a lot of empty industrial sites, there's still a lot of occupied ones. But why are the empty ones leaving? In a word: CERCLA. Or "brownfields", if one prefers. Businesses have been closing down and opening for decades. In the past, there were advantages to moving into an existing industrial building, or expanding into an adjoining one that has closed down. The building exists, it has gas, high voltage electric, sufficient water and phone lines, etc. It has road access and perhaps even railroad frontage. All these things mean less cost and less headache for the buyer. Now, there's the potential of inheriting liability for some defunct companies environmental mess. Evaluation of same costs money, and cleanup can cost a fortune. It can bankrupt a business very quickly. It's simply cheaper and safer to build on a greenfield. This of course sucks for people living in the city, particularly those who don't have cars. But its an economic decision, quite often an obvious one, that the business has to make. There's a certain amount of irony here, regarding industrial sprawl. It does, to a degree, promote residential sprawl. But the true irony: CERCLA came about largely because of Love Canal. Love Canal happened not because Hooker Chemical was negligent, but because the Niagara Falls Board of Education insisted on taking their "dump" and not only building a school on it, but selling the balance of the land to developers. PS does it bother anyone that the prison population is going up and is all we see is more crime? The culprit there (pun intended) is mandatory minimums for non-violent (usually drug) crimes.
July 24, 200717 yr peabody99: I don't feel bad about it at all. And it is easy this time since there are large amounts of equity issues that come to play in this. (Damn Krumholz and his social equity. He must have brainwashed me. Stupid bleeding heart liberals.) E Rocc: Great. I'm glad you slept on that. You were able to completely not respond to anything I said. No problem. I probably did not make myself clear.
July 24, 200717 yr Don't know if this is the most appropriate place for this, but it seemed most relevant here, where people have been most adamant about Jackson being more vocal. From the PD: Cleveland's mayor prefers working where it's quiet Quiet, please! Mayor at work Tuesday, July 24, 2007 Mark Naymik, Plain Dealer Columnist Cleveland Mayor Frank Jackson has a PR problem. Eighteen months into his first term, pun dits, some busi ness leaders and citizens - if those who call talk-radio shows are to be believed - ac cuse him of being invisible. They de mand to know what he is doing as the city struggles to keep people, jobs and peace within its borders. There is great irony in such complaints, because a big part of Jackson's appeal to voters and community leaders in 2005 was his aversion to publicity. He easily swept out Mayor Jane Campbell, who was criticized for being as ubiquitous as a weather forecaster on the nightly news ... ... More info at http://www.cleveland.com/news/naymik/index.ssf?/base/opinion-0/1185266339130890.xml&coll=2&thispage=1
July 24, 200717 yr peabody99: E Rocc: Great. I'm glad you slept on that. You were able to completely not respond to anything I said. No problem. I probably did not make myself clear. Maybe I didn't. Let's simplify. "Why are all the "customers" living only in the city, when many of the jobs are located outside said city?" Didn't say "only", but I daresay more of them are, even on a population weighted basis. Locating social services type locations in places like Solon or Strongsville would not only be more expensive than the city or inner ring suburbs, it would also be more inconvenient for the clients, aka "customers". The jobs (and I assume you mean that literally) are often outside the city because when businesses (particularly industrial ones) move out, federal law provides disincentives for reoccupation by new/relocating companies. The gut reaction was "why are they only talking about Cleveland locations?". My point was that it's not a case of "let's dump the LULU in the poor neighborhood so the more affluent people don't have to deal with it", but there are very real reasons for locating it there. Perhaps that's why the local officials are campaigning for it.
July 24, 200717 yr Cleveland's mayor prefers working where it's quiet Quiet, please! Mayor at work Tuesday, July 24, 2007 Mark Naymik Plain Dealer Columnist Cleveland Mayor Frank Jackson has a PR problem. Eighteen months into his first term, pun dits, some busi ness leaders and citizens - if those who call talk-ra dio shows are to be believed - ac cuse him of being invisible. They de mand to know what he is doing as the city struggles to keep people, jobs and peace within its borders. There is great irony in such complaints, because a big part of Jackson's appeal to voters and community leaders in 2005 was his aversion to publicity. ... Naymik is The Plain Dealer's politics reporter. To reach Mark Naymik www.cleveland.com
July 26, 200717 yr Cleveland bar owner tapes police warning Thursday, July 26, 2007 Jesse Tinsley and Gabriel Baird Plain Dealer Reporters In a secretly recorded video, a Cleveland police sergeant threatened to unleash the city's wrath on a downtown bar owner in an expletive-laced tirade, calling the night club's patrons pigeons and rats. Sgt. Terry Shoulders, head of the 3rd District vice unit, delivered this stern warning to Spy Bar owner Raj K. Singh early July 6, the day after a shooting in a parking lot near the bar. Four people were shot. One died. ... www.cleveland.com
July 26, 200717 yr I find this story curious. Maybe I'm not getting the big picture... After four people get shot in front of a certain club, the next day a cop goes down there and loses his cool. They act like this is some form of corruption. It sounds like an officer who is frustrated and angry. If they are violating rules, why shouldn't he threaten them with investigation? It's not like he's a mob cop looking for a cut of liquor sales.
July 26, 200717 yr ^I really appreciated it how channel 19 made the spy bar owner the victim, describing spy bar as an established bar with a "diverse clientèle". Have we heard anything else on their liquor license revocation? ~ps, did anyone catch the footage of some perp getting cuffed in front of Mayor Jackson's home? he does exist!
July 26, 200717 yr ^I really appreciated it how channel 19 made the spy bar owner the victim, describing spy bar as an established bar with a "diverse clientèle". Have we heard anything else on their liquor license revocation? ~ps, did anyone catch the footage of some perp getting cuffed in front of Mayor Jackson's home? he does exist! I wonder if Frank will write this guy and his parents a letter? :| Overcrowding? Find somewhere for the kid and put the perp and his/her parents in jail! How stupid could this kid be to run through the Mayors yard?! What a dumba$$. This makes no damn sense! I wonder if the Mr. Jackson will now be more vocal and visible when it comes to addressing the crime problem in our city?
August 4, 200717 yr pd: Cleveland police could rely more on 1-man patrols Mayor looks at plan to boost police coverage Saturday, August 04, 2007 Susan Vinella and Gabriel Baird Plain Dealer Reporters Mayor Frank Jackson might order more one-man police patrols to increase the number of cars and officers on Cleveland's streets. Police Chief Michael McGrath is studying the idea and is expected to report to Public Safety Director Martin Flask by Aug. 15, a spokesman for the chief said Wednesday. City Council members and residents have expressed growing concern and frustration about crime and safety problems in their neighborhoods. Councilman Mike Polensek recently received widespread support for sending a scathing letter to a drug sales suspect. ... [email protected], 216-999-5010, [email protected], 216.999.4141
August 4, 200717 yr About eighty murders too late, but I'm glad something is being done. That's what I've been saying all along, increase the police presents on Cleveland's streets.
August 5, 200717 yr I say sentence the negligent parents along with the worthless scumbags (excuse me, "good kids who just got in with the wrong crowd" :roll:) From cleveland.com: Woman hit, killed by stolen car driven by 13-year-old Posted by Amanda Garrett August 04, 2007 23:33PM Categories: Breaking News A 57-year-old Brecksville woman visiting the Theater District on Saturday was killed by a 13-year-old boy driving a stolen car and fleeing Cleveland police, according to police. The car hit the woman, Virginia DiGiorgio, who was crossing the street at the intersection of East 14th Street and Prospect Avenue. More at cleveland.com http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2007/08/woman_hit_killed_by_stolen_car.html clevelandskyscrapers.com Cleveland Skyscrapers on Instagram
August 5, 200717 yr I wonder what the controversial part of Jackson's police plan is? I'm apprehensive .. lol. But something has to be done to improve the crime situation in the city, and I'm glad that they're trying whatever they can. Anyone else worried about the fact that they're switching to more single cops now?
August 5, 200717 yr Bank robberies down sharply in Cleveland area Posted by Dan X. McGraw August 05, 2007 08:31AM The number of bank robberies is down locally and statewide, but robbers are using firearms in more holdups. Thirty-five bank robberies were reported in Cuyahoga County through July 29. There were almost twice as many, 67, over the same period last year. "Bank robberies go in cycles," said Scott Wilson, an FBI spokesman. "We hope it stays." Across the state, bank robberies were down 14 percent last year. Nationally, however, bank robberies were up 5 percent, according to FBI statistics. ... www.cleveland.com
August 5, 200717 yr Anyone else worried about the fact that they're switching to more single cops now? my relatively uneducated guess is there could be more shooting of suspects (officer feeling less safe and more likely to have the finger on the trigger) and the officers (more vulnerable, no back up).
August 5, 200717 yr Anyone else worried about the fact that they're switching to more single cops now? my relatively uneducated guess is there could be more shooting of suspects (officer feeling less safe and more likely to have the finger on the trigger) and the officers (more vulnerable, no back up). ooh, i'm scared, I better start firing shots?
August 5, 200717 yr I'm not worried about this, but I can see why cops would be unhappy as this is a change they perceive could endanger their safety. In the long term, I think that we need to find a way to adequately staff our safety forces.
August 5, 200717 yr I think that criminals knowing the cops will be up and down the street will cut back on their illegal operations.
August 6, 200717 yr Anyone else worried about the fact that they're switching to more single cops now? my relatively uneducated guess is there could be more shooting of suspects (officer feeling less safe and more likely to have the finger on the trigger) and the officers (more vulnerable, no back up). I think CPD has their own academy and I wonder how much training took place as far as pulling someone over alone. It's a lot different than doing it under the watchful eye of a partner. It might even embolden some of the pull-overees that have paper out on them. In my opinion it's dangerous, though I'd defer to those who have actual training on this one....
August 6, 200717 yr it seems like they can develop a system for when backup is needed, just like other departments and the highway patrol seem to use - for example pulling someone over, and waiting for another car to arrive before approaching. also just the presence of more police cars i think will have a positive effect. i can't believe how long i can go in the city without seeing any officers at all, and then entering a suburb will see 3 or 4 cruisers in the course of 20 minutes.
August 6, 200717 yr I hear you, and I definitely agree. Something absolutely needs to be done about getting more of a police presence on the streets. I guess I was just wondering how something like cars with one officer worked in other cities in terms of police safety.
August 6, 200717 yr Looks like the fourth little maggot turned himself in. Why don't the parents have anything to say?! I say sentence them along with their little home wreckers. We need more parents to take control of their kids and more case workers to make sure that kids are being parented. Ugh! I say bring back corporal punishment in schools. Fourth Playhouse Square hit skip suspect turns himself in Posted by kturner August 05, 2007 22:43PM . On Sunday, the parents of the boys did not want to talk. Lacsmi Boikin, Dontezs mother, appeared weary when she came to the door of a house on West 58th Street. "I don't feel like talking right now," she said, and faded indoors among a handful of people at the house. Dorothy Gillis, Durraymuss mother, also had nothing to say when reached by telephone Sunday. Jennifer Johnson, Davontes mother, could not be reached. ... Plain Dealer reporter Joe Guillen contributed to this story. Categories: Breaking News, Crime http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/breaking_news/
August 6, 200717 yr I say bring back capital punishment in schools. Ummm, either you meant to say "corporal punishment" or you're about to replace me as the biggest "right winger" on these forums. :evil: Actually, I think that "reform school" needs to be brought back, particularly when kids display a pattern of predatory behavior.
August 6, 200717 yr I say bring back capital punishment in schools. Ummm, either you meant to say "corporal punishment" or you're about to replace me as the biggest "right winger" on these forums. :evil: Actually, I think that "reform school" needs to be brought back, particularly when kids display a pattern of predatory behavior. Yes...thats what i meant..sorry caffeine rush! I think the little monsters should be hung out to dry actually. That could have been any one of our grandparents. Cleveland has a ton amenties, but nobody will feel safe is this wave of crime isn't nipped in the bud. I'm not being over dramatic as crime happens in every city. We can't continue to put checks in the win column, say how great downtown or the neighborhoods are, hype project in progress or just announced project if everyday a horrible crime takes place and overshadows the positive progress happening all over the city. I'm just fed up with these non law abiding asses!
August 6, 200717 yr Half joking, but capping the innerbelt to connect downtown to these neighborhoods that these degenerates come from is looking less appealing by the day.
August 6, 200717 yr Whether you're joking or not, that's a pretty insensitive thing to say. There are more people looking for opportunities than there are those looking to come from public housing and cause trouble downtown.
August 6, 200717 yr I think that part of the problem is that there is a poverty mentality that these people/families/children have lived in for who knows how long that needs to be broken as soon as possible. This isn't true only for Cleveland; this is true for any city where poverty/crime/homelessness, etc exists. These individuals need to make the choice to change things for themselves; unfortunately, no one else can do it for them, and that's where the problem lies. If they don't make a change, though, this amorality will continue to spread to their children, and so on. Not only that, but it also has a detrimental effect to society as a whole. I think some kind of community outreach needs to be done. Policing the streets is important in keeping citizens safe, but fear of punishment might not do enough to change these people's situations. People need to be educated, and they also need to see that there are people who truly care for them and want them to succeed in life. I think once that happens somehow, then true change can occur because these problems have deep, deep roots.
August 6, 200717 yr The news stated that Mayor Jackson made a statement today (of course not appearing in person) stating that America's cities are being run over with organized crime? Does this guy even know what organized crime is? What is he referrring to- the italian mob? A bunch of young puns running around the city with guns and stealing cars is not organized crime. And the broad generalization about "American cities" and crime.. many are controlling their crime problem quite well.. all you have to look is 2 hours away in Pittsburgh to see what a difference leadership can make in what a city becomes...what a cop-out by the mayor. Seriously, is there any way we can get this guy out of office and get someone in there who will actually do something?
August 6, 200717 yr ^The drug trade and the dealers that kill each other on the streets of Cleveland are organized. This last incident was likely random, but the drug trade definitely has structure.
August 7, 200717 yr The news stated that Mayor Jackson made a statement today (of course not appearing in person) stating that America's cities are being run over with organized crime? Does this guy even know what organized crime is? What is he referrring to- the italian mob? A bunch of young puns running around the city with guns and stealing cars is not organized crime. And the broad generalization about "American cities" and crime.. many are controlling their crime problem quite well.. all you have to look is 2 hours away in Pittsburgh to see what a difference leadership can make in what a city becomes...what a cop-out by the mayor. Seriously, is there any way we can get this guy out of office and get someone in there who will actually do something? And realistically what exactly do you want him to do? How would you handle the situation? It easy to be an arm chair quarterback.
August 7, 200717 yr I agree. I think, so far, Mayor Jackson has actually been doing a good job in office. I know that there have been complaints of him not being very public and visible. But I want to judge a man on what he does, not on what he says. And I think he earnestly wants to move the city forward and make improvements where improvements need to be made.
August 7, 200717 yr The news stated that Mayor Jackson made a statement today (of course not appearing in person) stating that America's cities are being run over with organized crime? Does this guy even know what organized crime is? What is he referrring to- the italian mob? A bunch of young puns running around the city with guns and stealing cars is not organized crime. And the broad generalization about "American cities" and crime.. many are controlling their crime problem quite well.. all you have to look is 2 hours away in Pittsburgh to see what a difference leadership can make in what a city becomes...what a cop-out by the mayor. Seriously, is there any way we can get this guy out of office and get someone in there who will actually do something? Person, not to pick on you, but it seems like every time I read one of your posts, you're complaining about how great Pittsburgh is compared to Cleveland. Pittsburgh and Cleveland are two different places, and while they share many of the same problems, the context isn't necessarily the same, so the solutions to those issues might also be different. Like MTS said, what are you doing to help fix the problems you see in the city? You've complained about the homeless, the drivers, the condition of the roads, the police presence, the visibility of the mayor and his response to crime in the city. These are all valid concerns, and I suspect you could do a lot to help change things around here, but the first step is to quit making vague allusions to how things are done in Pittsburgh and suggest specific solutions!
August 7, 200717 yr they're distressed? What h*ll did they expect? A person was killed, what about that woman's family? The Juvie center is tough so they have to act tough - Who made the bad decision(s) that landed the four in the Juvie center? Label them thugs - Yes its unfair Suburbs vs. Public Housing dweller - The media - the PD and Action News - have already used fun adjectives to describe the parties involved. My court of public opinion says punish them to the four and their parents to full extent of the law. at 13-14 years old, you should know better! Teen boys accused in Brecksville woman's death deny charges 4 teens deny charges in woman's death; prosecutors relay story of fatal accident Tuesday, August 07, 2007 Rachel Dissell, Joe Guillen and Gabriel Baird Plain Dealer Reporters Four teens accused of joy riding in a stolen car that struck and killed a suburban seamstress were portrayed by law enforcement as stony thugs. Prosecutors said they showed "absolutely no remorse" and joked after their arrests. But Monday, a different picture emerged of the quartet of boys with "D" names: Dontez, Durraymus, Davonta and Devonte. In Cuyahoga County Juvenile Court, they sat with slumped shoulders and solemn faces as a prosecutor described how Virginia DiGiorgio was killed Saturday evening as she walked across Prospect Avenue. ... But privately, the boys are distressed, he said. Dontez, the driver, told a social worker that he couldn't stop thinking about the sound of the car hitting DiGiorgio. ... All four boys grew up near Cleveland's Central Recreation Center, where they played sports. Dontez moved across town last winter but came back to visit. Ed "Buddy" King, who coached all four boys, said it's unfair to label them as thugs. "These kids don't deserve that," King said. ... To reach this Plain Dealer reporter: [email protected], 216-999-4121 Talk about six degrees of seperation! Cleveland theater district crash victim, owner of stolen car had met Tuesday, August 07, 2007 It's a small world. The owner of the stolen car that hit and killed Virginia DiGiorgio in Cleveland's theater district Saturday night was her acquaintance. ... - Joe Guillen www.cleveland.com
August 7, 200717 yr "Ed "Buddy" King, who coached all four boys, said it's unfair to label them as thugs. "These kids don't deserve that," King said." Let's see... they steal a car, flee from the police, mow down an innocent pedestrian... but labeling them thugs is "unfair". Way to honestly deal with problems in the community, "Buddy". Your former proteges stole a car and killed someone, yet you have the gall to suggest that "they're good kids". :roll: clevelandskyscrapers.com Cleveland Skyscrapers on Instagram
August 7, 200717 yr I don't say label them thugs, one or two them could be good (but what are using to determine "good") kids that made a very very bad decision to jump in a car with 2 other kids and then to run from the police after hitting a pedestrian. Like I said, what those kids are going thru is THEIR own fault, but the paper never presents both sides of the story evenly. My heart goes out to the deceased woman's family, those four kids need to think about the life that has been lost. Their actions have destroyed five families. Where are they damn parents?!
August 7, 200717 yr "kids that made a very very bad decision to jump in a car with 2 other kids" 1. None of them were old enough to have a license. 2. The car was stolen. There's very very bad decisions, and then there is plain stupidity. "What are we using to determine "good" "Police pulled over the stolen 1997 Plymouth Breeze at East 30th Street and Carnegie Avenue. The driver stopped, the four car doors opened. "They could have gotten out. They could have rolled out of the car," Naso said." clevelandskyscrapers.com Cleveland Skyscrapers on Instagram
August 7, 200717 yr "kids that made a very very bad decision to jump in a car with 2 other kids" 1. None of them were old enough to have a license. 2. The car was stolen. There's very very bad decisions, and then there is plain stupidity. "What are we using to determine "good" "Police pulled over the stolen 1997 Plymouth Breeze at East 30th Street and Carnegie Avenue. The driver stopped, the four car doors opened. "They could have gotten out. They could have rolled out of the car," Naso said." We're on the same page, which is why I'm asking "where are the damn parents/guardians of these kids?"
August 8, 200717 yr Cocaine in short supply in Cleveland Shortage seen in Cleveland, 17 other cities Wednesday, August 08, 2007Gabriel BairdPlain Dealer Reporter ... Cleveland Mayor Frank Jackson believes that the shortage in cocaine could be to blame for a spike in certain violent crimes close to home. Jackson said that federal indictments that have yanked dozens of suspected dope dealers off the streets in recent months have increased competition - and violence - in the drug trade. While he supports seizing drugs and locking up the dealers, he said it does not come without short-term side effects: increases in robberies with firearms and homicides. ... [email protected], 216-999-4141
August 8, 200717 yr The news stated that Mayor Jackson made a statement today (of course not appearing in person) stating that America's cities are being run over with organized crime? Does this guy even know what organized crime is? What is he referrring to- the italian mob? A bunch of young puns running around the city with guns and stealing cars is not organized crime. As someone who has written and published a number of articles about traditional organized crime (the American Mafia, Jewish Syndicate, Russian Mob, etc), I can tell you that none of these wield the power and fear of street gangs that dominate in America's cities (yes, even in Pittsburgh!). Older members of these gangs use minors to carry out burglaries, robberies and car thefts, then take possession of the swag and give the kids a cut of the money. Why? Because the kids will get off easy from the courts, and the older gang members use these crimes as tests to see if the kids will keep their mouths shut when confronted by authorities. If they pass the test, then they are given more serious crimes of profit to commit. Even if these kids weren't stealing the cars for older gang members, their actions were part of a gang culture that surrounds them in such pervasive ways and in so many neighborhoods. It's a domination that the old Mafia bosses could have only dreamt about. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
August 8, 200717 yr Cocaine in short supply in Cleveland Shortage seen in Cleveland, 17 other cities Finally, after billions and billions of dollars, the war on drugs is over. Mission Accomplished!
August 9, 200717 yr OK folks, tell me whatcha think about this one..... A press release that came out today about the above billboard...... Council Members demand inappropriate billboard come down WHO: Councilman Michael D. Polensek, Ward 11 Councilwoman Nina Turner, Ward 1 Councilwoman Phyllis Cleveland, Ward 5 and others WHAT: A press conference to address an inappropriate billboard advertisement for Seagram's Gin & Juice at 740 E. 185th at Hiller Ave. WHEN: Thursday, August 9, 2007 At noon WHERE: Under the billboard at 740 E. 185th at Hiller, approximately 1 mile north of I-90 WHY: "The billboard erected by Clear Channel outdoor advertising in my community is another example of the exploitation of women and this corporation's insensitivity and disrespect, specifically, for women of color," said Councilman Polensek. "To place, on a billboard, "I bring DOPE style and laughs" is absolutely inappropriate and outrageous. The message that it sends is that DOPE, which is another term for drugs, is acceptable." "As an intelligent African-American woman, I am personally appalled by the message in this billboard, which glorifies a sub-culture that emphasizes violence, disorder and disrespect," said Councilwoman Turner. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
August 9, 200717 yr I'm glad that City Council has gotten down to the serious issues! Too long our children have been steered down the wrong path by billboards promoting Dope Style & Laughs. But seriously the councilpeople appear a little clueless. If she said she brings "dope, style, and laughs", then I could see them saying that the billboard is promoting drug use. Oh well, I guess we can't expect council people to be up on the latest slang from the 80's or basic conventions of grammar in the English language.
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