Cyclists attacked on West Side

Donna Miller

(Cleveland) Plain Dealer

September 8, 2009

 

Police are looking for several boys who assaulted two men riding their bicycles on the West Side.

 

A 39-year-old man was cycling near Bridge Avenue and West 50th Street About 7:15 p.m. Monday when a teen stepped into his path and punched him in the mouth ...

 

... More at http://www.cleveland.com/newslogs/plaindealer/index.ssf?/mtlogs/cleve_plaindealer/archives/2006_09.html#180951

From the 9/7/06 PD:

 

 

Cleveland mourns

Thousands say goodbye at Cathedral Mass

Thursday, September 07, 2006

Gabriel Baird and John P. Coyne

Plain Dealer Reporters

 

After the bells of St. John Cathedral tolled and almost 3,000 police officers lined the street to honor Detective Jonathan "A.J." Schroeder, an eerie quiet overtook a downtown city block as seven of the officer's closest friends carried his flag-draped coffin up the church steps.

 

The pipes and drums had finished "Amazing Grace," and his family had drawn close to his widow, Amy. Their 10-month-old son, Eric, rested in his grandfather's arms.

 

...

 

To reach these Plain Dealer reporters:

[email protected], 216-999-4141

[email protected], 216-999-4845

 

http://www.cleveland.com/news/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/cuyahoga/1157618646248150.xml&coll=2

 

From the 9/10/06 PD:

 

 

Santiago case needed SWAT unit, some say

Teams often handle arrests of suspects who may be violent

Sunday, September 10, 2006

Gabriel Baird

Plain Dealer Reporter

 

Cleveland police could have carried out the arrest of a rape suspect without Detective Jonathan "A.J." Schroeder's death if the SWAT unit had been called to help, union officials say.

 

SWAT - Special Weapons and Tactics - officers wear heavier body armor that offers better protection, said Steve Loomis, president of the Cleveland Police Patrolmen's Association.

 

...

 

To reach this Plain Dealer reporter:

[email protected], 216-999-4141

 

http://www.cleveland.com/news/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/cuyahoga/1157877331115830.xml&coll=2

 

Detroit Shoreway will make the news again after last night's botched robbery at Edgewater Delicatessen (W. 87 and Lake). One clerk was killed, another seriously wounded. This is the same Deli that someone else was killed 1-2 years ago in a robbery. This is just a few blocks from the double artist shooting on Detroit in August, just around the corner from the murder of a 20 year old the week of 8-10-06, and just a mile or two from where the officer was recently killed in Cudell. It's kinda hard to accept this area as the next Tremont or Ohio City with all this escalated violence taking place. I think we need to tackle the crime before just dropping a gentrification bomb on the neighborhood. Just a small snapshot of the area in discussion.. based on my own data (which is probably missing a few of the homicides this year), look how many murders happened in this part of Cleveland just in 2006:

 

<img src="http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y180/bizbizjohn/nearwest.jpg">

Here's some early coverage; the West Side just can't seem to catch a break. Ugh.

 

One clerk killed, another wounded in robbery of Cleveland deli

Monday, September 18, 2006

Thomas J. Quinn and Janet Okoben

Plain Dealer Reporters

 

Two men held up a West Side delicatessen Sunday evening, fatally shooting one clerk and wounding another, police said.

 

The robbery was reported about 8 p.m. at the Edgewater Delicatessen on Lake Avenue at West 87th Street.

 

The victims, both men, were rushed to Lakewood Hospital. One of the men was shot in the abdomen, the other in a leg. The clerk with the more serious wound died about an hour later.

 

The names of the victims were not immediately available.

 

The robbers, both males, fled in a car, said Sgt. Daniel Fay, a Cleveland police spokesman.

 

Neighbors said the delicatessen owner, whose name was not available, learned about the shootings when he arrived at the store about two hours later to close up.

 

Neighbors recalled another shooting at the store 16 months ago.

 

Saleem Muqdady, 28, a store clerk, was fatally shot in the neck during a daylight robbery on May 8, 2005.

 

The deli is about a mile from where Cleveland Detective Jonathan "A.J." Schroeder was fatally shot Aug. 30 while trying to arrest a rape and burglary suspect. The neighborhood also was the scene of several other recent homicides.

^ that Deli is bad news. and no, we cannot seem to catch a break

It's kinda hard to accept this area as the next Tremont or Ohio City with all this escalated violence taking place. I think we need to tackle the crime before just dropping a gentrification bomb on the neighborhood.

 

I agree. Those funky orchard park homes off (W.44th?) are almost all on the resale market now. This is actually OC but the rougher section...lots of stuff goes on around there and it is hardly gentrified by any stretch of the imagination. A 250,000 home does not make it gentrified, there is a little more to the formula including some stabilization of crime.

All heaven has broken loose in my neighborhood.

 

Ay dios mio!

does anyone have the updated murder numbers for this year?

^I heard that Philadelphia is seeing the same surge that Cleveland is seeing. Any word on the national murder rate?

it just seems like the PD should put this fact in the article.  "this is cleveland's 87th murder of the year - X more/less than last year, the least/most since X, etc.).  with the population apparently still declining, cleveland should expect and demand the murder rate decrease as well. 

 

i understand that murder rates are complicated and may move up and down independent of other factors, but how about sharing the information. 

I hope I don't sound like another wack job whose just looking to start a fight, but my patience is really coming to an end.  I live on Lake Avenue and West Boulevard, I walk to the West Blvd. Rapid Station, I bike downtown, and live only a few blocks from this Deli.  On Sunday I was riding my bike home from the Tremont Arts Festival when a couple of kids threw a basketball at me at 75th and Franklin (the same block where the CSU professors/artists were killed).  They managed only to hit my tire and I kept riding, but I just kept fuming more and more on the way home.  I seriously wanted to stab three 14-year-old kids.  What is this saying about the current situation?

 

We're reaching a boiling point in this area.  I've always been someone who tried to understand the situation rather than be reactionary towards it and even I am starting to look for a fight.  What happens next time...someone throws a baseball at someone in a car?  What if that person snaps and decides three less ghetto thugs is what the world needs?

 

Do we need the Cleveland Boondock Saints?  Someone please tell me there has to be a better way before I am the one who gets a baseball thrown at my car.

Personally, I'm at the point where if three idiots meet their fate by being stupid, it's thinning of the herd. I normally don't advocate violence but dear god - don't their parents teach them that ANYONE could be toting a gun? If their parents gave more of a sh!t about them when they are alive rather than dead (after being in a situation), I think half of the problems would be solved. God knows if you had taken them out, we'd be seeing relatives on the news saying "they were good kids!".  Well, had they been more attentive parents they would be GOOD and ALIVE.

 

/rant

 

Honestly though, I think your best bet (and I'm not a cyclist so I could be wrong) is to take Detroit to West 69th/Father Caruso or wherever that tunnel is to Edgewater Park and get home via the park. It's sad that the area is in such dire straits but honestly - it's like the person they interviewed on Fox 8 said to Frank Jackson and Jay Westbrook, "how many more people have to die before they get off their asses and do something that actually has impact?". I'd like to think that won't be necessary but tell me this - does Frank Jackson strike you as someone who is tough on crime? There's a place for his quiet demeanor and this isn't it. 

"how many more people have to die before they get off their asses and do something that actually has impact?"

 

Its this type of grandstanding that irritates me. What was Jackson supposed to do? Go inside the home before they served the warrant and tell the man nicely to put down his gun?

Well I have to wonder - if this spike in violence was happening in Central, would there would be press conferences concerning new policing initiatives, with the mayor denouncing the recent events, etc.? No one's asking him or Westbrook to don flak jackets and accompany the SWAT team but the least they could do is be a little more visible in addressing the problem. I don't think that's asking for too much, and I still say the interviewee has a point. 

I don't expect them to don flak jackets either or go on some sorta anti-thug rampage, but I just see a slippery slope approaching that can go two ways, both of which can end very very badly for the entire city.

 

We keep hearing about how the city is loosing population and trying to attract young professionals  with creativity.  Alot of us live in the city and want to make the city better, this includes me.  But if all of this keeps going on I see this YP group a)abandoning the city all together or b)fighting back in a not so peaceful way.  Both of which will be disasterous.  We need Jackson and Westbrook to be the leaders in making sure that isn't going to happen and help us find the solutions so that we can all live in this city peacefully.

 

(Sorry about this rant but I've felt pretty passionatly all day)

The actions i like to see is, a) raise the income taxes and hire more police, b) have the city and county work together and/or form a county police dept.

 

what make me mad is that Jackson would have yelled has head off if this in ward 5.

 

I like to know what the crime levels are now vs. when campbell was in office, in ward 5.

Out of fairness, I don't think Jackson favors his old ward over the rest of the city. I'm not saying that he is being as vocal as he should, or that he's doing all he could to address public safety, but I think it's inaccurate to portray him as misappropriating resources toward Ward 5, to the disadvantage of other neighborhoods. If I recall correctly, his first high-profile anti-crime effort was to reign in prostitution, primarily along corridors on the West Side.

Yeah, that was great, he got rid of some hookers.  This is murder we are talking about, a lot of murders.  He needs to get his tail out here and do something, something very big, and very vocal, and all over the news.  I sent him an email, or at least to his task force, and whoever responded asked if I could give specific details about the events.  I was like are you kidding me, a cop, two artists, a local deli owner and about five other people have been killed.  You don't know about this?  Come on, open up the PD or turn on the news.  Every two seconds it's West side murder, west side killings, west side robberies.  Though so far I haven't seen a front page, first couple minutes of the news, story about the 1200 new homes and 1/2 million square feet of new retail/office space on the WEST bank of the flats coming, privately funded none the less.

Akron's had a real upswing in murders, too, and that city's mayor has been grandstanding about it, and it hasn't made a difference.

 

I don't mean to make light of it, but I think this is related to how dirty Public Square is because certain people are slobs. How do you change behavior? Maybe Guiliani will come to Cleveland.

Not to beat a dead horse.....but in the recent years....gang unit closed...vice/narcotics unit cut downsized...detective unit downsized..air unit shut down.  With this kinda crap happening, it's hard to get back to the progress that was being made.  There actually was progress being made in this city 4 or 5 years ago.  Now we have to play catch up.  The laid off cops are back...but they weren't additions...just replacements to those who left.  We need more...unit patrols, bike patrols, foot patrols...and BRING BACK THE CHOPPERS!

 

Interesting note...the two new helicopters that the city had purchased were put out of service because of "cost and cutbacks".  Instead of keeping one or two guys in the unit active to make sure the helicopters could be checked started and service as per FAA schedules and rules...they just let them sit in hanger at Aviation HS...unattended.  NOW, since they hadn't been started, serviced, or checked...one will have to be SCRAPPED and the other will have to go through 100's of thousands of dollars in fix ups in order to get it airborn again..IF it can!  Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face!  Two new state of the art choppers...wasted.  Way to go to the powers that be!

Though so far I haven't seen a front page, first couple minutes of the news, story about the 1200 new homes and 1/2 million square feet of new retail/office space on the WEST bank of the flats coming, privately funded none the less.

 

I'm sorry, but I highly doubt that Jackson is leading an Eastside conspiracy to sweep murders AND new development on the West Side under the rug. Again, I'm not saying that Jackson couldn't be doing more regarding safety issues citywide, but I think it's ridiculous to suggest he's not treating it as seriously because these actions are occurring outside of Ward 5.

 

How do you change behavior? Maybe Guiliani will come to Cleveland.

 

I'm usually in such accords with what you have to say, jamiec, but Guiliani is NO urban savior. His radical takes on welfare reform, for instance, led to new financial hardship for thousands of New Yorkers. It is hypothesized that Guiliani's efforts may have actually increased the likelihood of crime by increasing economic desperation among the poor. Check out well-reputed author Jonathan Kozol's account in Rachel and Her Children: http://www.amazon.com/Rachel-Her-Children-Homeless-Families/dp/0307345890/sr=8-1/qid=1158843142/ref=pd_bbs_1/102-3936700-3033704?ie=UTF8&s=books.

Across the city, war on crime is rallying cry

Cleveland residents, officials act to save neighborhoods

John P. Coyne

(Cleveland) Plain Dealer Reporter

Thursday, September 28, 2006

 

Judy Novak considers the neighborhood she lives in on Cleveland's West Side a great location -- just a mile from Lake Erie and a few blocks from the Lakewood border. But she's concerned about her safety.

 

Novak, 40, and her husband, Brian Egizii, 37, moved into the area 10 years ago. Lately, however, the neighborhood has changed ...

 

... More at http://www.cleveland.com/crime/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/cuyahoga/1159432770254700.xml&coll=2

 

 

From the 10/3/06 PD:

 

 

Cleveland to train first new police since 2002

Tuesday, October 03, 2006

Gabriel Baird

Plain Dealer Reporter

 

Cleveland police mailed letters to 59 recruits Monday inviting them to start training in the first Police Academy class since 2002.

 

Officials believe most of the candidates remain interested in the job although four years have passed since they applied for the position by taking a Civil Service test in 2001.

 

...

 

To reach this Plain Dealer reporter:

[email protected], 216-999-4141

 

http://www.cleveland.com/news/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/cuyahoga/1159864671159270.xml&coll=2

 

Jackson to revamp city safety services

Plan would eliminate 3rd Police District

Gabriel Baird

(Cleveland) Plain Dealer

Friday, October 06, 2006

 

Cleveland's safety forces are top-heavy, inefficient bureaucracies that need to be streamlined, Mayor Frank Jackson said Thursday in announcing sweeping changes to the Department of Public Safety.

 

He unveiled 53 recommendations to improve the city's Police, Fire, Emergency Medical Services, Animal Services and Corrections departments ...

 

http://www.cleveland.com/open/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/cuyahoga/1160123528197870.xml&coll=2

Here's an idea that has been brought up MANY times only to fall on deaf ears of the people that run the city...MERGE Fire and EMS...they would save money and need less people through attrition to do the job.  Cleveland is one of the few large city's in the country that still utilizes a seperate Fire and EMS service....doesn't make much sense!

Would there be a union issue with that?

 

(an aside: is it correct to say "a union" or "an union"?)

Here's an idea that has been brought up MANY times only to fall on deaf ears of the people that run the city...MERGE Fire and EMS...they would save money and need less people through attrition to do the job.  Cleveland is one of the few large city's in the country that still utilizes a seperate Fire and EMS service....doesn't make much sense!

 

How does this help, I went back in the thread, and I need some clarity.

 

If there is something to this logic, save money and expand/provide better coverage for Clevelander, I'm all ears.

 

Then I need to decide if I should start an email campaign.

Would there be a union issue with that?

 

(an aside: is it correct to say "a union" or "an union"?)

 

Good question General Wimwar, I didn't even think about union issues.  "a" union is correct

Anyone have any thoughts on the dissolution of the third district? Good or bad move? I'm far from a public safety expert, so I don't have a real strong opinion on this one. I am a little wary of losing a major police presence within a half mile of both my job and home. And if it makes me a little anxious, I wonder how it will be interpreted by naturally fearful suburbanites and exurbanites ... Perhaps they wouldn't even notice; it's not like the current headquarters has very high visibility.

 

I wonder what they would do with the 3rd district building ... a true beauty, in my opinion (at least along its Chester frontage).

^the third district building is the best part.  perhaps they can sell that to a developer and use the money to improve downtown police presence. 

 

i haven't seen the horses out at all (except for the first few weeks after the announcement that they were coming back) and what has happened to the helicopter?  i thought that was coming back as well and that they had fixed one of the choppers. 

 

i'd also want to see bike/foot police patrols downtown.  there is something about being able to snake through back alleys and tight spots to find trouble. 

 

bottom line: i'm all for less buildings and overhead (especially when it isn't a big as presence as it could be) if it means that other services will be restored or more frequently deployed. 

What's with these dirtbags? Sometimes, stuff like this just gets me so mad. I don't get what makes these teenagers want to live such horrible, bottom-feeding lives. This is why families move to Solon, etc. It, in my opinion, is unacceptable that gunfights happen anywhere, especially a school:

 

Man shot outside Heights High

The Plain Dealer

4:15 p.m.

 

Cleveland Heights - Police are looking for three young men accused of shooting an 18-year-old Bedford man after a fight in a school parking lot.

 

A arrest warrant was issued for Damar Barney, 18, of Cleveland Heights, for attempted murder and attempted robbery charges. Barney is accused of pulling a 9mm handgun on Leonard Maxwell, 18, and shooting him twice Thursday outside Cleveland Heights High School, Police Chief Martin Lentz said.

 

...

 

By Damian G. Guevara, [email protected]

 

okay...back to ME!  :)  It isn't so much a union issue rather it is a safety director, mayoral, council issue.  (Fire/EMS merger).  There have been a few consultants that the city has hired (with PUBLIC money) to look into issues in the safety services that would streamline it, and be more cost effective, and increase the level of service.  Every time the reports came back, the one thing that they all had in common was the merger.  I wonder why the city will NOT release these reports...even though our tax dollars paid for them.  I hate to say this on this forum, because it may sound "bad"...but the truth of the matter is, it is all about the hiring process.  Police and Fire have to take a civil service exam in order to go through the hiring process, EMS on the other hand is an appointed position.  This process allows EMS to hire more minorities than the other two services.  I have no problem hiring that is qualified, but when a councilman says that he "doesn't care how much money could be saved, the real issue is hiring more minorities"..that to e is NOT a good way to run a city. I could cite MANY examples of how the merger would benefit the city...but it would be very boring reading...

 

 

 

okay...back to ME!  :)  It isn't so much a union issue rather it is a safety director, mayoral, council issue.  (Fire/EMS merger).  There have been a few consultants that the city has hired (with PUBLIC money) to look into issues in the safety services that would streamline it, and be more cost effective, and increase the level of service.  Every time the reports came back, the one thing that they all had in common was the merger.  I wonder why the city will NOT release these reports...even though our tax dollars paid for them.  I hate to say this on this forum, because it may sound "bad"...but the truth of the matter is, it is all about the hiring process.  Police and Fire have to take a civil service exam in order to go through the hiring process, EMS on the other hand is an appointed position.  This process allows EMS to hire more minorities than the other two services.  I have no problem hiring that is qualified, but when a councilman says that he "doesn't care how much money could be saved, the real issue is hiring more minorities"..that to e is NOT a good way to run a city. I could cite MANY examples of how the merger would benefit the city...but it would be very boring reading...

 

Please do tell.  You're a good source of information since most, rather I do not know, how the Fire Department/EMS work.  My is a detective, so I kinda know what that is like.  Anything to make MY tax dollars work better, im all for.  and if my councilman is draggin his ass....i'll rip him a new one!

Okay....here are a few problems with the current Fire/EMS system in the city of Cleveland...

 

Let me give you a brief summary of both services. 

Fire: A little over 900 members, all trained in firefighting, rescue operations, and ALL are EMT certified with at least 150 members that are paramedic trained(higher level than EMT, which means can do advanced medical service, such as administer drugs), they work a 24 hour shift with 48 hours off, after 25 years can retire, the department has a LESS than 2% turnover rate(which means less than 2% hired leave for another job within that 25 years)  The fire department does not have ambulances, but it does have 4 heavy rescue units that run paramedic staffed and can transport patients if EMS is not available.  Heavy rescues are specialty units that have capabilities for rope rescue, water rescue, confined space rescue, auto extrication equipment, etc etc...

 

EMS:  Have roughly 300 members, most but not all, are paramedic trained, those that are not are EMT's.  EMS runs the city ambulance service, the main and only responsibility is to provide patient care and transport them to the hospital.  They work 12 hour shifts, eligible for retirement after 30 years.  The last time a study was done, the average EMS employee has an average career of 5 years with the city until they move on to a fire department or another career.  The city has the capabilities to have 21 ambulances staffed, but generally runs with less than that.

 

  Okay, now we have the background done..let me explain why I think it is silly to have two separate services.  First off, almost no major city has separate services (ie. Columbus and Cincinnati) because it is a duplication of services!  When you call 911 in Cleveland for a medical problem, more often than not, you will get a response from the Fire Department (FD) AND from EMS.  There are instances that you will get a fire truck, a FD rescue unit, and an ambulance.  With separate dispatchers from each department sending their own units, and not knowing what the other service is doing, it turns out to be overkill and a waste of resources. 

  With a merger, you could also cut down on the number of supervisors as well as the number of total employees, through attrition.  Wouldn't it make more sense to hire an employee that will be there for the entire length of their career than to have to retrain people every 5 years?  Wouldn't it make sense to have one department working together than to have two separate services that need to work hand in hand but yet are rarely on the same page and NEVER train together?  Wouldn't it make more sense for the city to budget ONE department, than to rather budget two different departments? 

  This is NOT meant to sound as a put down to EMS, because there are some very good medics working there, but if EMS stopped working tomorrow, the FD could provide medical service AND fire service to city because of the training.  ON the other hand, if the FD stopped working tomorrow, who would provide fire protection, rescue services, etc?  It just seems like a LARGE price for the city to pay in order for certain council people to be pleased with the practice of minority hiring.  I agree that people should all have a chance at a job, but this is not the way to do it.  Let's work on the schools so people will pass the entrance exams, rather than to just have a set aside city service as a safety net.  The city is doing everything it can in order to justify the separate services...from the hiring standpoint all the way to NOT letting the FD provide better service to the city.  The FD wanted to implement paramedic staffed fire trucks in order to provide a higher level of care until an ambulance arrives, it was denied by the city.  Why?  The city claims logistical reasons, they claim financial reasons, accountability reasons...the main reason, it MIGHT just show that the FD is capable of rendering medical care and that ONE service SHOULD be the way to go.  These are only a FEW reasons that there should be a merger.  If you still have doubts..check out Columbus, Cincinnati, Baltimore, NYC, Chicago, Philly, Miami, Phoenix, Boston...the list goes on!

  I know I didn't hit every point, but if any of you have questions about it, please feel free to post a question.  Also, if you think that there are questions to be answered as to WHY it hasn't happened...write your councilperson...I have, along with the mayor, the safety director, the media, etc    The funny thing is, the only answer I was given was from the media..."it is too political of a subject"...funny, POLITICAL?  It should be a safety issue!

 

 

From tehe 10/8/06 PD:

 

 

Gang law too broad, opponents say

Prosecutors using 1999 state law that critics worry is too broad

Sunday, October 08, 2006

Rachel Dissell

Plain Dealer Reporter

 

Gregory Barnes danced and stomped on a hat dropped by a rival who was on Barnes' street taunting him. The quick step was a sign of disrespect to his neighborhood nemesis.

 

The black, size 8 fitted hat with the letters "HVD" stitched on it wasn't worth much monetarily. But to the Harvard Boys, it was their symbol. And it was worth taking a life for.

 

...

 

To reach this Plain Dealer reporter:

[email protected], 216-999-4121

 

http://www.cleveland.com/news/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/cuyahoga/116029700785540.xml&coll=2

 

Treating cats like . . . dogs?

Cleveland mayor touts $1 million project to collar roving felines

Thursday, October 12, 2006

Susan Vinella

Plain Dealer Reporter

Cat owners in Cleveland, beware: Let your cats roam the neighborhood and they could wind up in the city kennel - or dead.

 

The city wants to treat stray cats the same as stray dogs: as nuisances.

 

So, under a plan being pitched by Mayor Frank Jackson to City Council, stray cats would be trapped and taken to the city kennel. If unidentified and unclaimed for three days, they would be killed, just as stray dogs are. Cleveland would be the first city in Cuyahoga County to actively pick up stray cats. Akron began a stray cat program in 2002.

 

...

 

To reach this Plain Dealer reporter:

 

[email protected], 216-999-5010

 

 

Well JDD...You're request has been granted.   :wink:

 

We need more...unit patrols, bike patrols, foot patrols...and BRING BACK THE CHOPPERS!

 

NOW, since they hadn't been started, serviced, or checked...one will have to be SCRAPPED and the other will have to go through 100's of thousands of dollars in fix ups in order to get it airborn again..IF it can! Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face! Two new state of the art choppers...wasted. Way to go to the powers that be!

Cleveland police putting helicopter back in the air, hope 2nd one follows

Friday, October 13, 2006

Gabriel Baird

Plain Dealer Reporter

 

Cleveland police are no longer grounded.

 

The department will put one of its two helicopters back into service today. Police lost use of the crime-fighting tools in 2004 budget cuts.

 

The Aviation Unit's four pilots will spend the next two weeks zipping over the city to reacquaint themselves with flying the machines and navigating over the city, said Lt. Alan Chonko, the unit's boss.

 

...

 

To reach this Plain Dealer reporter:

 

[email protected], 216-999-4141

Well...I AM happy!  I hope that the second one will be repaired..and I DO hope the cost of $200,000 to get both choppers off the ground was an overestimation....none the less...they will be airborne! 

^ This is a real problem and has been evolving in the last decade. A lot of gentrification that took place in Tremont and Ohio City in recent years has forced the problems into neighborhoods that were once a lot safer.

^ The city really needs to address problems with delinquint youths.  Public Square / Tower City / RTA is a nightmere.  I'm no saint and use foul language, but cussing every other word at the top of your lungs is trashy, especially in a packed train.  What even worse, is the use of the "N" word more often than one would expect a Klansman to use.

^ The city really needs to address problems with delinquint youths.  Public Square / Tower City / RTA is a nightmere.  I'm no saint and use foul language, but cussing every other word at the top of your lungs is trashy, especially in a packed train.  What even worse, is the use of the "N" word more often than one would expect a Klansman to use.

 

I'm sorry, this is not a police/tower city/Cleveland issue.  This is a parenting problem, these children have no manners or home training!  As a person of color, it disgusts me when I here youth use the "n" word as a term of endearment when they have no idea what the word really means or how it was used to belittle our own people, most likely their grand parents!  This is a clear issue of lack or bad parenting!  PERIOD!

 

Isn't having a packed train is a GOOD thing?

 

If you have a problem with Public Square/Tower City/RTA, have you written or spoken to anyone?  I'm a firm believer that you can't expect anything to happen if you don't help make it happen!  Many times when things go unaddressed they are know known.

^ Indeed it's is the parents responsibility to address the root problems, but when they fail society must address the symptoms.  Clevelanders can't allow teens to destroy the city, by soley pointing to parental responsibility.

 

If you reread my post I never suggested that packed trains, by themselves were a bad thing.  It's just the fact that packed trains (becuase of the movements, conversations and other noises of more people on the train) should make it far less likely for me to hear a screaming teen on the opposite end.  Usually in crowded situation people try to act more humane and less like Bobby Knight during an Indiana Game.

 

Tower City, RTA and the Police are well aware of the problems.  Hell, Tower City must know, because of the declining quality of their retailers.

Tower City, RTA and the Police are well aware of the problems.  Hell, Tower City must know, because of the declining quality of their retailers.

 

I agree this has been an increasing problem. It appears Transit Police & CPD agree too, because it there's been an increase in their presence during the peak hours. Some days, anyway, it seems like there's an entire police brigade out there. Some days, not so much.

 

However it's still a problem during off hours as well. Whatever happened to the truancy crackdown that happened late last school year? They were forcing parents to come pick up their children and possibily pay a fine if I remember correctly, and it had a CLEAR positive effect IMO.

 

This prick deserves to be under the jail.  Had this happened in cleveland...the sensationalism would have just made cleveland to unbearable to reside in.  Crimes like this is why I don't shop at malls....er faux shaker square...I mean lifestyle centers.  :roll:

 

The Plain Dealer

www.cleveland.com

 

A jobless cook who came here in search of a restaurant job admitted today that he kidnapped a Brazilian nanny from a parking lot near Crocker Park, then raped and robbed her.

 

Curtis Soverns, 38, pleaded guilty to 11 felony counts just after noon.

 

...

 

By Jim Nichols, [email protected]

^ Indeed it's is the parents responsibility to address the root problems, but when they fail society must address the symptoms.  Clevelanders can't allow teens to destroy the city, by soley pointing to parental responsibility.

 

If you reread my post I never suggested that packed trains, by themselves were a bad thing.  It's just the fact that packed trains (becuase of the movements, conversations and other noises of more people on the train) should make it far less likely for me to hear a screaming teen on the opposite end.  Usually in crowded situation people try to act more humane and less like Bobby Knight during an Indiana Game.

 

Tower City, RTA and the Police are well aware of the problems.  Hell, Tower City must know, because of the declining quality of their retailers.

 

I have a question.  Nerd what have you done about this?  You're making these statements here, but have you emailed, written, faxed, called, IM'd anyone about the situation?

Anyone know what the stats are this year so far for homicides in Cleveland?  How does that stack up to last year this time?  How does that stack up to Columbus and Cincinnati to date?  Just curious to know....

^ Indeed it's is the parents responsibility to address the root problems, but when they fail society must address the symptoms.  Clevelanders can't allow teens to destroy the city, by soley pointing to parental responsibility.

 

If you reread my post I never suggested that packed trains, by themselves were a bad thing.  It's just the fact that packed trains (becuase of the movements, conversations and other noises of more people on the train) should make it far less likely for me to hear a screaming teen on the opposite end.  Usually in crowded situation people try to act more humane and less like Bobby Knight during an Indiana Game.

 

Tower City, RTA and the Police are well aware of the problems.  Hell, Tower City must know, because of the declining quality of their retailers.

 

I have a question.  Nerd what have you done about this?  You're making these statements here, but have you emailed, written, faxed, called, IM'd anyone about the situation?

 

Not that it affects the quality of my arguments, but I have spoken with the RTA security people about it.

^ Indeed it's is the parents responsibility to address the root problems, but when they fail society must address the symptoms.  Clevelanders can't allow teens to destroy the city, by soley pointing to parental responsibility.

 

If you reread my post I never suggested that packed trains, by themselves were a bad thing.  It's just the fact that packed trains (becuase of the movements, conversations and other noises of more people on the train) should make it far less likely for me to hear a screaming teen on the opposite end.  Usually in crowded situation people try to act more humane and less like Bobby Knight during an Indiana Game.

 

Tower City, RTA and the Police are well aware of the problems.  Hell, Tower City must know, because of the declining quality of their retailers.

 

I have a question.  Nerd what have you done about this?  You're making these statements here, but have you emailed, written, faxed, called, IM'd anyone about the situation?

 

Not that it affects the quality of my arguments, but I have spoken with the RTA security people about it.

 

No arguments.  But you made all these statements but never stated if you actively did anything.  The way it read is you were looking for someon else to do something, but not get involved.  What did RTA Security tell you?  What about TowerCity?  What about Cleveland Police?

i had heard some rumblings of laptop thefts and punchings in this area, but thought they were exagerrated.   i've also noticed that since Lola opened, there appears to be an additional (off duty i think) police officer walking e4 at night.

 

Downtown Terror: Teenage Gang Busted for Attacking Unsuspecting Businessmen

 

http://www.woio.com/global/video/popup/pop_playerLaunch.asp?clipid1=1027591&at1=News&vt1=v&h1=Downtown+Terror:+Teenage+Gang+Busted+for+Attacking+Unsuspecting+Businessmen&d1=93900&redirUrl=www.woio.com&activePane=info&LaunchPageAdTag=homepage