June 10, 20232 yr 37 minutes ago, LibertyBlvd said: Sounds good. We are all excited about SHW and CC currently going up, but Cleveland has been lagging behind many other cities as far as new construction downtown. I realize there is an abundance of vacant office space which is one of the reasons. Hopefully many of those parking lots in the downtown core will soon be developed. Everytime I think we are out of office space to convert then something happens (pandemic) and tons more office space comes on the market. We seemed to be turning the corner to new construction as both CC and SHW were in the works pre pandemic. I'd guess a few more years of conversions before it's new build or nothing.
June 10, 20232 yr How many of these developments are going to require a TMUD? When will we know the submission of the next round of TMUD applicants?
June 11, 20232 yr Author 5 hours ago, nokoeeee said: How many of these developments are going to require a TMUD? When will we know the submission of the next round of TMUD applicants? Last year, the state began accepting applications for the TMUD program on May 20 with a deadline of July 8 and revealed which applications it received July 28. The award winners were announced Sept. 22. As lucrative as the TMUD program is, it's "only" $80 million divided among Ohio's largest metro areas. Last fall, Greater Cleveland alone won $80 million in federal New Market tax credits for development projects. Combined, both programs can be very potent in helping downtown development projects move forward. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
June 11, 20232 yr Author On 6/10/2023 at 6:43 AM, KJP said: A dozen high-rises in the works downtown By Ken Prendergast / June 10, 2023 Last week, NEOtrans wrote about three high-rises in a single development — the first phase of Bedrock’s riverfront site — that could see construction start by this time next year. But that is by no means the only downtown high-rise development in the works. NEOtrans is aware of a dozen potential high-rise projects of 10 stories or more in various stages of development, not including those already under construction downtown. This inventory includes only potential new-construction high-rises that could see a groundbreaking in the next couple of years, not major renovation projects like The Centennial, redevelopment of the Rose Building and others. MORE: https://neo-trans.blog/2023/06/10/a-dozen-high-rises-in-the-works-downtown/ And of course it's the second-to-last post on the page... "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
June 15, 20231 yr There’s something new going in The Statler. The long vacant storefront space next to the coffee shop. Fairly large build out. Anyone have the scoop? The north side of Euclid is filling up.
June 15, 20231 yr Development Adjacent - Cleveland just released the results of their Property Inventory there's a TON of awesome data contained in it: https://storymaps.arcgis.com/stories/943f26c946994574a8d5f05cecf10a59.
June 15, 20231 yr 13 minutes ago, marty15 said: There’s something new going in The Statler. The long vacant storefront space next to the coffee shop. Fairly large build out. Anyone have the scoop? The north side of Euclid is filling up. It looked like the makings of a beauty salon (maybe spa?) w/chairs and mirrors I saw when I walked by yesterday.
June 16, 20231 yr Litt's write up on the local form-based code efforts When is the last time I-71 turned a profit?
June 17, 20231 yr Litt's write up on the local form-based code efforts Really wish we could retroactively apply this to properties, the damage that has been done to our city’s experience will unfortunately continue to live on. Glad we won’t see more of it but still will drive me nuts when I see developments following the previous form. Still have no idea how that was ever the code
June 22, 20231 yr Author Seen among today's building permit applications. Not too much detail yet so the imagination fills in the void.... Lou's House of Love 12203 Castlewood AVE, Cleveland "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
June 23, 20231 yr Not necessarily a development but I couldn't think of where to put it. Although I like that they are offering free concerts every Wednesday downtown I can't help but feel they are doing this to compete with Wade Oval Wednesdays. https://www.cleveland19.com/2023/06/22/clevelands-public-square-center-downtown-revitalization-effort/Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
June 23, 20231 yr 3 hours ago, MyPhoneDead said: Not necessarily a development but I couldn't think of where to put it. Although I like that they are offering free concerts every Wednesday downtown I can't help but feel they are doing this to compete with Wade Oval Wednesdays. https://www.cleveland19.com/2023/06/22/clevelands-public-square-center-downtown-revitalization-effort/ Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk It’s weird that they’re doing it on Wednesdays, but there has always been public programming and music down there (although maybe not well advertised). I used to DJ down there about once a month on Saturday mornings for the first couple years it was open.
June 23, 20231 yr It’s weird that they’re doing it on Wednesdays, but there has always been public programming and music down there (although maybe not well advertised). I used to DJ down there about once a month on Saturday mornings for the first couple years it was open. 6 other days to choose from and you choose the day that's already taken by similar programming. So If I wanted to support I now have to choose between the two. Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
June 23, 20231 yr Wow, such pessimism going on here. I think this is a great thing, especially for downtown residents living nearby that would prefer somewhere much closer to them than Wade Oval. I think the two can coexist without a hitch and I'm surprised to see negativity about something new and fun in the heart of downtown.
June 23, 20231 yr 11 minutes ago, GREGinPARMA said: Wow, such pessimism going on here. I think this is a great thing, especially for downtown residents living nearby that would prefer somewhere much closer to them than Wade Oval. I think the two can coexist without a hitch and I'm surprised to see negativity about something new and fun in the heart of downtown. Ya. Exactly. Wednesday is by far the busiest day for office population. It's pretty much a normal rush house.
June 23, 20231 yr It’s a city, aren’t there supposed to be a ton of people that can help support both?
June 23, 20231 yr I think the most important thing in this article is that the buyer of Nela park has no plans for demolitions, and instead seems to prefer a preservationist approach. Thank goodness! It's a beautiful campus. Not too much detail otherwise. https://www.crainscleveland.com/real-estate/phoenix-investors-sees-mixed-use-future-nela-park
June 23, 20231 yr I got a chance to voice my opinion this evening on what I think should happen to the lower level of the Detroit-Superior bridge. My grand idea is to put car/truck traffic on the lower level, opening the whole upper level to pedestrians/bikes. And you’d still have room on the lower outside lanes for pedestrians/bikes. The grade rise on both approaches would make it pretty easy to accomplish cutting into. IMO. Chris didn’t dismiss it. i like to dream 🙃
June 24, 20231 yr ^ Nice idea! QQ. Can you get into the bridge from the downtown side, or only W25th? The website suggests only the latter, but that seems like a real pain to people like us who live downtown. My hovercraft is full of eels
June 24, 20231 yr Author 3 hours ago, marty15 said: I got a chance to voice my opinion this evening on what I think should happen to the lower level of the Detroit-Superior bridge. My grand idea is to put car/truck traffic on the lower level, opening the whole upper level to pedestrians/bikes. And you’d still have room on the lower outside lanes for pedestrians/bikes. The grade rise on both approaches would make it pretty easy to accomplish cutting into. IMO. Chris didn’t dismiss it. i like to dream 🙃 The width of the old track spaces is too narrow for the safe operation of cars at the east and west ends of the bridge. This was actually tried in the 1950s after the streetcars and tracks were removed. But it was halted after cars kept hitting the support posts for the roadway above. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
June 24, 20231 yr 2 hours ago, KJP said: The width of the old track spaces is too narrow for the safe operation of cars at the east and west ends of the bridge. This was actually tried in the 1950s after the streetcars and tracks were removed. But it was halted after cars kept hitting the support posts for the roadway above. The cut in would bypass that issue. I’m not proposing they remake the original end to end path. And unlike the original lines that bypassed West 9th and West 25th, these would all happen within the bridge, so the intersections and traffic flow are unaffected.
June 24, 20231 yr Author This wider trio of passages of double track are only available in the middle and you have to get to them. The east and west ends have narrow track approaches with structural supports right up against the six track spaces. You cannot remove the structural supports. Again, they tried putting cars only on the lower deck in the 1950s and there were too many crashes with cars hitting the support structures. And they only tried allowing cars down there. They couldn't even run trucks or buses on the subway deck because of the narrow lateral clearances at the east and west ends. So they filled in the old track ramps. Let's learn from history. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
June 24, 20231 yr 1 hour ago, KJP said: This wider trio of passages of double track are only available in the middle and you have to get to them. The east and west ends have narrow track approaches with structural supports right up against the six track spaces. You cannot remove the structural supports. Again, they tried putting cars only on the lower deck in the 1950s and there were too many crashes with cars hitting the support structures. And they only tried allowing cars down there. They couldn't even run trucks or buses on the subway deck because of the narrow lateral clearances at the east and west ends. So they filled in the old track ramps. Let's learn from history. Not trying to repeat history. The ramps into the bridge would be over top of the old approaches and support structures.
June 24, 20231 yr Author 14 minutes ago, marty15 said: Not trying to repeat history. The ramps into the bridge would be over top of the old approaches and support structures. Where? And how can that be structurally possible? "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
June 24, 20231 yr How about running a streetcar on the old track space? I suppose it would only be able to go from one end of the bridge to the other, but it might be a unique touristy thing. And if they want to get adventurous, perhaps a streetcar/trolley/rail museum could be added. I believe several from the old Trolleyville USA are currently being stored near Chippewa Lake. Maybe a few of them could be obtained. Edited June 26, 20231 yr by LibertyBlvd
June 24, 20231 yr 1 hour ago, LibertyBlvd said: How about running a streetcar on the old track space? I suppose to would only be able to go from one end of the bridge to the other, but it might be a unique touristy thing. It would probably be fairly popular, for Cleveland (on a riders per mile basis). Not all rail has to be suburban park-and-rides Edit: even though the 26/26A already serves the route, a short-distance train just going back and forth could probably have much more frequent headways and be competitive with walking/biking across. Edited June 24, 20231 yr by sonisharri
June 24, 20231 yr 3 hours ago, LibertyBlvd said: How about running a streetcar on the old track space? I suppose to would only be able to go from one end of the bridge to the other, but it might be a unique touristy thing. “Touristy things” are not good use of transit dollars. That said, if it was connected to Tower City AND it was a first phase of extending the Blue or Green Line over the river I would be extremely supportive. And I’m really hoping whatever they do on the lower deck they keep two Right-of-ways reserved for future potential rail use. In my more recent rail crayons, I’ve been thinking have this route as part of a St Clair subway routing. Route: lower level of Detroit / Superior bridge w stations at both ends, then north under West 6th, then east under St Clair (under or over convention center), surfacing somewhere east of East 9th and running in dedicated right of way as far as we can make it go. I’d have a pedestrian tunnel to connect from the West 9th station to Tower City for connections to the Red Line and other TC transit. Also that station would serve as a transfer point to the Waterfront Line station under the bridge, thus including elevators to get people from river level to downtown street level. It would be tremendous for connecting all the government buildings along Lakeside to the transit system and would encourage high rise development along the bluff on the east side of downtown. (This proposal would be lower priority than the UC Blue Line reroute/extension proposal and also lower than the Huron/Euclid downtown subway proposal, but they would all complement each other nicely.) @marty15 - I’d much rather bike and/or walk over the lower protected deck than the upper unprotected deck. When is the last time I-71 turned a profit?
June 24, 20231 yr 4 hours ago, LibertyBlvd said: How about running a streetcar on the old track space? I suppose to would only be able to go from one end of the bridge to the other, but it might be a unique touristy thing. I never really thought about it, but I like the idea. A people mover tram that shuttles people over the river. Similar purpose as a sky tram or fernicular, a short mode of public transport that overcomes a challenging geographical feature. Could be a catalyst for future extensions too.
June 25, 20231 yr 13 hours ago, KJP said: They couldn't even run trucks or buses on the subway deck because of the narrow lateral clearances at the east and west ends. Not only trucks, but hundreds of 10 axle semi dump trucks that use that bridge every day. The DS bridge and Huron road structure above Tower City take a beating!
June 25, 20231 yr I've got to finish up and post it over on the transit ideas thread, but what if the lower level was reactivated as a subway track (along with Hope Memorial Bridge, the lower level was originally designed for that). The new line would run W38th/Detroit, W25th/Detroit, Settler's Landing, Tower City, Gateway Plaza, Duck Island, Ohio City, Lorain/Fulton. Not a ton of extra digging/engineering needed. It would connect the two high schools to downtown, make Gateway easily accessible from across the river, and could be eventually expanded down both Lorain and Detroit/Clifton.
June 25, 20231 yr Author @originaljbw I proposed something like that to RTA 20 years ago when you could legally use existing infrastructure as a local contribution to leverage a fixed guideway federal grant (like what St Louis did in leveraging and repurposing it's old freight tunnels under downtown and the Eads Bridge). Unfortunately, Ron Tober was on the way out and Joe Calabrese was on the way in. That was the end of that. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
June 25, 20231 yr I hate to say it but I've given up on getting any kind of rail transit here. It costs WAY too much per mile (it shouldn't but it does in modern America) and there just isn't the political support. At the rate funding is going we'll be lucky to hang on to what we have. I had a visitor in from Boston last week. I suggested we take the train from West 117th to Little Italy. Riding in we were forced to get off at Tower City because of some reason l never did get an answer too. Forced to take the bus down Euclid and man is that street a mishmash of repaired concrete. Newish road. What a joke.
June 25, 20231 yr Author I responded here "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
June 25, 20231 yr 18 hours ago, cadmen said: I hate to say it but I've given up on getting any kind of rail transit here. It costs WAY too much per mile (it shouldn't but it does in modern America) and there just isn't the political support. At the rate funding is going we'll be lucky to hang on to what we have. I had a visitor in from Boston last week. I suggested we take the train from West 117th to Little Italy. Riding in we were forced to get off at Tower City because of some reason l never did get an answer too. Forced to take the bus down Euclid and man is that street a mishmash of repaired concrete. Newish road. What a joke. Sadly, you’re probably right. Cable cars (Cedar Point style) traversing inside the bridge on a loop would be cool. I can’t imagine that would be overly expensive.
June 27, 20231 yr Not sure where this aught to go, but seems neat. I'm always in favor of anything that supports or celebrates our local music scene. Cleveland naming street after Bone Thugs-n-Harmony; ‘Tha Crossroads’ going to be at St. Clair Avenue and E. 99th Street intersection https://www.cleveland.com/entertainment/2023/06/cleveland-naming-street-after-bone-thugs-n-harmony-tha-crossroads-going-to-be-at-st-clair-avenue-and-e-99th-street-intersection.html
June 27, 20231 yr https://www.cleveland.com/news/2023/06/cleveland-mayor-justin-bibb-finally-explains-firing-of-economic-development-director.html
June 28, 20231 yr 6 hours ago, Ethan said: Not sure where this aught to go, but seems neat. I'm always in favor of anything that supports or celebrates our local music scene. Cleveland naming street after Bone Thugs-n-Harmony; ‘Tha Crossroads’ going to be at St. Clair Avenue and E. 99th Street intersection https://www.cleveland.com/entertainment/2023/06/cleveland-naming-street-after-bone-thugs-n-harmony-tha-crossroads-going-to-be-at-st-clair-avenue-and-e-99th-street-intersection.html In the “rock n roll capital” - It would be cool to have avenues named after all the greats in Cleveland music history - it could be fun debating who deserves an Avenue
June 28, 20231 yr I'm not sure why we stopped pursuing the Rock and Roll walk of Fame idea. Definitely would be a tourist draw. Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
June 28, 20231 yr 13 hours ago, MyPhoneDead said: I'm not sure why we stopped pursuing the Rock and Roll walk of Fame idea. Definitely would be a tourist draw. We don't do nearly enough to capitalize on the Rock Hall. It would be so easy to do. It's perplexing.
June 28, 20231 yr 2 hours ago, surfohio said: We don't do nearly enough to capitalize on the Rock Hall. It would be so easy to do. It's perplexing. Cle City Council?
June 28, 20231 yr 47 minutes ago, DHubb said: Cle City Council? Not sure if that's their area of expertise, but the members certainly could help. Maybe this would likely fall more toward the Convention and Visitors Bureau? Best results would definitely require a group effort (Metroparks, artists, Cleveland Foundation, Rock Hall for licensing issues, etc).
June 29, 20231 yr 9 hours ago, surfohio said: We don't do nearly enough to capitalize on the Rock Hall. It would be so easy to do. It's perplexing. I have to laugh because vistitors to Cleveland are practically slapped in the face with the "Rock and Roll" marketing at every turn...seriously 😄
June 29, 20231 yr 4 hours ago, metrocity said: I have to laugh because vistitors to Cleveland are practically slapped in the face with the "Rock and Roll" marketing at every turn...seriously 😄 How many billboards in CLE are there for the Rock Hall? I've been in town for three months and all I see is Tim Misny. Edited June 29, 20231 yr by surfohio
June 29, 20231 yr You see ads for the Rock Hall at the Airport, but really nowhere else. But I am officially dreaming of a Rock walk of fame on Euclid Ave. Maybe each sidewalk square can be a concrete mural of a Rock Hall member, imagine that.
June 29, 20231 yr 4 hours ago, surfohio said: How many billboards in CLE are there for the Rock Hall? I've been in town for three months and all I see is Tim Misny. Or Mr. Rooter.
June 29, 20231 yr 1 hour ago, ArtDecoSquirrel said: You see ads for the Rock Hall at the Airport, but really nowhere else. But I am officially dreaming of a Rock walk of fame on Euclid Ave. Maybe each sidewalk square can be a concrete mural of a Rock Hall member, imagine that. Why Euclid? I feel like it would make more sense to be E9th leading to the Rock Hall.
June 29, 20231 yr 1 hour ago, ArtDecoSquirrel said: You see ads for the Rock Hall at the Airport, but really nowhere else. But I am officially dreaming of a Rock walk of fame on Euclid Ave. Maybe each sidewalk square can be a concrete mural of a Rock Hall member, imagine that. This already exists on Lakeside in front of Public Auditorium. It’s not extensive and not sure of the backstory but it’s there. https://www.google.com/maps/@41.5042959,-81.6938791,3a,75y,97.95h,82.54t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s7fuZ0a55obR_tuu4-Q732w!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu clevelandskyscrapers.com Cleveland Skyscrapers on Instagram
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