Is the High Line in NYC policed all day and do they face any issues with "unsafe activity"? Genuinely curious as I don't know. If done right I could see this turned into a High Line-type development that's open say 8-8, resurfaced deck and foliage.

There is a nominal police presence.

 

It's very safe. Strength in numbers is a big advantage no matter where you are.

 

 

1 hour ago, Geowizical said:

Is the High Line in NYC policed all day and do they face any issues with "unsafe activity"? Genuinely curious as I don't know. If done right I could see this turned into a High Line-type development that's open say 8-8, resurfaced deck and foliage.

Hardly comparable.  It is out in the open rather than semi underground like the bridge and it winds through a densely populated residential and commercial area.  Not at all isolated.  You have windows of multi-million dollar condos feet from the walk way.  Moreover it is regularly packed with people.  I have never felt unsafe on it and I would imagine neither would a female walking alone.

It didn't all used to be a highly populated neighborhood. It was the old Meatpacking District and very scary, even in daytime. High Line helped turn it around. So might a Low Line in Cleveland do lots for that part of the Flats.

 

So different than what it used to be like.....

 

Still a little rough in places

 

 

 

But for the most part, it's completely different than what I remember from the 80s....

 

4 minutes ago, KJP said:

It didn't all used to be a highly populated neighborhood. It was the old Meatpacking District and very scary, even in daytime. High Line helped turn it around. So might a Low Line in Cleveland do lots for that part of the Flats.

My thoughts exactly! This plus Irishtown Bend... staying optimistic 😃

Edited November 17, 2024Nov 17 by Geowizical

I do think this low line concept could help the West Bank of the Flats and near west side generally. That said--this is a half mile long bridge partially covered and over water. It doesn't matter how much more developed this area gets, it will always feel somewhat isolated in non peak hours. I think emptying it and closing it at sundown is a good idea, and probably necessary for this project to be successful.

 

I'm also a little skeptical that this walk will ever be better than just going down through the flats, particularly since we are adding or improving parks throughout the walk, but it will basically immediately be better than going over the top of the bridge, which is awful. More enjoyable walk options is always better though, but I'd almost always go through Canal Basin Park and Irishtown Bend if I have a few minutes to spare... 

This would never happen, but is the lower level strong enough to support cars and trucks? It'd be cool if they redirected traffic down below and make the upper level a park, like a continuation of Irishtown, linking to Public Square.

4 hours ago, Htsguy said:

Hardly comparable.  It is out in the open rather than semi underground like the bridge and it winds through a densely populated residential and commercial area.  Not at all isolated.  You have windows of multi-million dollar condos feet from the walk way.  Moreover it is regularly packed with people.  I have never felt unsafe on it and I would imagine neither would a female walking alone.

My perception too was very safe and peaceful Pre-Covid when we visitied regularly (except the weekend tourist throngs can be annoying on the winding narrow paths).  NYC street-level that's another subject 😀  and yes they do close the stairs/elevator entrances at night https://www.thehighline.org/visit/.  So would not be an issue here if our bridge deck was actualized.

Edited November 18, 2024Nov 18 by Willo

is it possible to have the midway go thru the square and re-dig out the streetcar ramps or has that ship sailed?

I have a genius idea: Why not put a choo-choo in it and run people from downtown to the new collision bend park?

How about we use it for a street car again!!!?!! 

 

Worst case, have it run from public square to 25th st.

Option 2: Have it run from public square, down Detroit, to the West Blvd-Cudell Station.

Option 3: Run it from the West Blvd-Cudell Station, go across the bridge and connect to CUT by the Stokes tower

Dream scenario: Have it run from the West Blvd-Cudell Station, through public square and down Euclid to the UC stop. (if we're feeling spunky: have it run East down Euclid to where it intersects with Superior, then have a street car run West on Superior back to public square)

 

It would be terrible to turn it into a park and completely lose the option for a street car now, or in the future. We're growing and building like never before in my life, a street care in a prime location like 25th and Detroit would be huge! Also, with the new trains that have been ordered, running a line like that and connecting to the current infrastructure seems totally possible.

20 hours ago, scg80 said:

This would never happen, but is the lower level strong enough to support cars and trucks? It'd be cool if they redirected traffic down below and make the upper level a park, like a continuation of Irishtown, linking to Public Square.

 

After getting rid of the streetcar tracks on each side, they briefly allowed cars below. Unfortunately the wells (where streetcars would come out) have been filled in and utilities have taken up that space. Sidenote, with security, there's some major telecom/electricity infrastructure underneath the bridge.

 

https://storymaps.arcgis.com/stories/e4fb0afa7f6547e8b014475c72623c81#ref-n-x8DY1X

2 hours ago, NR said:

How about we use it for a street car again!!!?!! 

 

Worst case, have it run from public square to 25th st.

Option 2: Have it run from public square, down Detroit, to the West Blvd-Cudell Station.

Option 3: Run it from the West Blvd-Cudell Station, go across the bridge and connect to CUT by the Stokes tower

Dream scenario: Have it run from the West Blvd-Cudell Station, through public square and down Euclid to the UC stop. (if we're feeling spunky: have it run East down Euclid to where it intersects with Superior, then have a street car run West on Superior back to public square)

 

It would be terrible to turn it into a park and completely lose the option for a street car now, or in the future. We're growing and building like never before in my life, a street care in a prime location like 25th and Detroit would be huge! Also, with the new trains that have been ordered, running a line like that and connecting to the current infrastructure seems totally possible.

Yeah, that's what I meant. 

2 hours ago, NR said:

How about we use it for a street car again!!!?!! 

 

Worst case, have it run from public square to 25th st.

Option 2: Have it run from public square, down Detroit, to the West Blvd-Cudell Station.

Option 3: Run it from the West Blvd-Cudell Station, go across the bridge and connect to CUT by the Stokes tower

Dream scenario: Have it run from the West Blvd-Cudell Station, through public square and down Euclid to the UC stop. (if we're feeling spunky: have it run East down Euclid to where it intersects with Superior, then have a street car run West on Superior back to public square)

 

It would be terrible to turn it into a park and completely lose the option for a street car now, or in the future. We're growing and building like never before in my life, a street care in a prime location like 25th and Detroit would be huge! Also, with the new trains that have been ordered, running a line like that and connecting to the current infrastructure seems totally possible.

 

How about Option 4: light rail from downtown to Lakewood?

 

Edited November 18, 2024Nov 18 by sonisharri

1 minute ago, sonisharri said:

 

How about Option 4: light rail from downtown to Lakewood?

Just get it started. Branch off on West 25th and run to the zoo. Then, continue the trunk to Lakewood.

Obviously I would take any of the options in a heartbeat but if we can be picky I'm not sure how much use there would be for it to go all the way out to Lakewood.  But I always thought having one that looped over to 65th and back down Lorain would be heavily used.

I put this idea from part of my map in this thread. 

 

This was more about the 2 streetcar lines, but would have the main Lakewood line joining the red line tracks at Cudell. 

 

This set up would also allow for an E55 to Gold Coast set up. Very versatile, especially if the Downtown loop was built and the Healthline was upgraded to rail. 

 

 

Edit: it would be about 13 miles of rail to build, but with the gold coast to E55 line, there would be 3 lines for a total of just over 24 miles. 

Edited November 19, 2024Nov 19 by PlanCleveland
Added detail

On 10/18/2024 at 10:07 AM, MVH said:

Does this also figure into why Cleveland didn't do the smart thing and rehabilitate the old Police Headquarters, with all its city owned property, and instead collaborated with the George family on purchasing the Art Craft building? That decision will come out in the wash eventually.

 

 

 

I was not specific about the "old Police Headquarters." What I meant was the OLD Police Headquarters on Payne Ave at E 19th with the awesome Eagle columns.

 

This land and the entire lot to the west is and was already owned by Cleveland. If anybody has any information about the status of that building, I'd love to hear it. Seems that it is built very well. It's currently used by the police for radio functions?

 

The space behind the building and the extra lot could have been for new construction with any parking facility, with much easier access than on the edge of a freeway on-ramp.

 

While I knew the George family didn't own the Art Craft building, I did know they owned properties adjacent, and no doubt favored its selection. I thought they had actually sold a lot for the new parking construction?

Can I speak on something? I ride down superior into downtown pretty often and even though it's a lot of construction that has built and is being built that stretch from the new CPD headquarters to the new townhomes is DEAD. 

 

We go back and forth about whether we should build retail when we already have vacancies or not include them at all and to me this stretch shows why having a commercial space is important. I don't know if creating pop up retail spaces or adding greenspace to draw residents out will help but this stretch needs a shot in the arm outside of converting buildings. This could be our version of short north in Columbus, a vibrant area that extends the Downtown activity but something has to change. Hopefully the Midway project draws people to this street.

6 minutes ago, MyPhoneDead said:

Can I speak on something? I ride down superior into downtown pretty often and even though it's a lot of construction that has built and is being built that stretch from the new CPD headquarters to the new townhomes is DEAD. 

 

We go back and forth about whether we should build retail when we already have vacancies or not include them at all and to me this stretch shows why having a commercial space is important. I don't know if creating pop up retail spaces or adding greenspace to draw residents out will help but this stretch needs a shot in the arm outside of converting buildings. This could be our version of short north in Columbus, a vibrant area that extends the Downtown activity but something has to change. Hopefully the Midway project draws people to this street.

The thing with the midway. It will draw people to the middle of the street, bypassing any retail that would be in those buildings. 

A big part of the problem is the huge street which creates a very uncomfortable dead feeling. The midway hopefully will help that - if you stand on Superior downtown where they have the tree median it already feels much better than the stretch east without it. Still going to need a lot more people in that area to make it vibrant, it has a long way to go but I do think the median will have a big impact on how it feels. 

On 11/20/2024 at 9:25 AM, MyPhoneDead said:

Can I speak on something? I ride down superior into downtown pretty often and even though it's a lot of construction that has built and is being built that stretch from the new CPD headquarters to the new townhomes is DEAD. 

 

We go back and forth about whether we should build retail when we already have vacancies or not include them at all and to me this stretch shows why having a commercial space is important. I don't know if creating pop up retail spaces or adding greenspace to draw residents out will help but this stretch needs a shot in the arm outside of converting buildings. This could be our version of short north in Columbus, a vibrant area that extends the Downtown activity but something has to change. Hopefully the Midway project draws people to this street.

 

I second this. Superior is basically one of the most major streets downtown so I don't think it's unreasonable to expect a substantial amount of retail and activity. If anything, the fact that it's so wide makes it perfect for things like food stands and outdoor dining while the midway could act as a bypass for traveling pedestrians and cyclists.

 

The only place I've ever checked out on this stretch is Green Goat, and I'm pretty certain that's all there really is to see.

The Problem is there is nobody and nothing to the north or the south to support superior ave once you pass e13.  Until the area between chester and superior is build up, the shops on superior will have to be destinations.

 

54 minutes ago, Whipjacka said:

The Problem is there is nobody and nothing to the north or the south to support superior ave once you pass e13.  Until the area between chester and superior is build up, the shops on superior will have to be destinations.

 

 

Very true. I hope this changes over time, maybe if we see some development near Greyhound, or as other parts of downtown get more built out.

There should be more activity there once the new police HQ and the former Plain Dealer building are filled.  Has Cross Country moved into their new HQ?

1 minute ago, LibertyBlvd said:

There should be more activity there once the new police HQ and the former Plain Dealer building are filled.  Has Cross Country moved into their new HQ?

Yes, they get a nice showing of the homeless doing some….let’s just say some activities in plain view.

2 hours ago, JB said:

Yes, they get a nice showing of the homeless doing some….let’s just say some activities in plain view.

We need to be honest about this. thank you. That is why homeless programming (medical and mental helath services, long-term housing, rehab and job training) should follow County Family Sercives HQ moving to the Saint Vincent campus.  The east side of downtown from the backside of Playhouse Square Allerton, Reserve Square, and the Greyhound area all the way to the burgeoning Superior Arts District have way too much of this social burden.  It needs addressed.

On 11/20/2024 at 8:39 AM, MVH said:

 

I was not specific about the "old Police Headquarters." What I meant was the OLD Police Headquarters on Payne Ave at E 19th with the awesome Eagle columns.

 

This land and the entire lot to the west is and was already owned by Cleveland. If anybody has any information about the status of that building, I'd love to hear it. Seems that it is built very well. It's currently used by the police for radio functions?

 

The space behind the building and the extra lot could have been for new construction with any parking facility, with much easier access than on the edge of a freeway on-ramp.

 

While I knew the George family didn't own the Art Craft building, I did know they owned properties adjacent, and no doubt favored its selection. I thought they had actually sold a lot for the new parking construction?

Formally called “Public Safety Central” 

On 11/21/2024 at 3:20 PM, JB said:

Yes, they get a nice showing of the homeless doing some….let’s just say some activities in plain view.

Wait why did I get downvoted on this one? First hand account told me the office just saw two going for it.

 

Downtown Heinen’s store to be reconfigured
By Ken Prendergast / November 23, 2024

 

Work is underway to reconfigure what many have called America’s most beautiful grocery store. The work represents the most significant renovations to the Downtown Cleveland Heinen’s store, 900 Euclid Ave., since it opened in 2015.

 

MORE: 

https://neo-trans.blog/2024/11/23/downtown-heinens-store-to-be-reconfigured/

The rotunda is such a beautiful structure.  A grocery store is probably not the best use for it.

18 minutes ago, LibertyBlvd said:

The rotunda is such a beautiful structure.  A grocery store is probably not the best use for it.

 

I feel like it was always more than that, though. The beer and wine tastings upstairs provided a food hall atmosphere. When I worked in downtown CLE my friends and co-workers would visit several times a week for lunch and after work hangouts. It was a lively and unique space.   

 

I don't even want to read Ken's article because I am sure it will depress me. 

2 hours ago, KJP said:

 

Downtown Heinen’s store to be reconfigured
By Ken Prendergast / November 23, 2024

 

Work is underway to reconfigure what many have called America’s most beautiful grocery store. The work represents the most significant renovations to the Downtown Cleveland Heinen’s store, 900 Euclid Ave., since it opened in 2015.

 

MORE: 

https://neo-trans.blog/2024/11/23/downtown-heinens-store-to-be-reconfigured/

What are the 9 amenities that are planned for the second floor?  Do they have access from inside the 9 into the rotunda?

Do you see this as a positive?

Amenities unknown. Direct access is noted in article. I don't have an opinion about it 

Apologies if I missed this discussion or if it belongs in another thread. 

 

Cleveland Planning Director Joyce Huang Leaving for Gig at Cleveland Foundation

 

Seems like bad news at first glance (big shoes to fill) but her role is newly created and seems to signal that the Cleveland Foundation is going to get more involved in financing developments. I could see them playing a role in the lakefront specifically as so much of it is supposed to be publicly accessible. 

 

Quote

Huang’s progressive planning philosophy, which rested heavily on promoting contemporary zoning and transit-friendly policies in Cleveland, had ushered in a suite of changes in recent years.

Huang will “will lead efforts to create a unified vision and direction that will elevate the Foundation as a trusted partner and catalyst for transformative change in Cleveland,” the Cleveland Foundation wrote in a statement on Wednesday.

 

For those not familiar, the Cleveland Foundation controls about $3 billion in assets and annual grants of $150 million. It puts them in a league of their own as far as Cleveland philanthropy is concerned with the Gund foundation controlling about $400 million. They also likely exceed the assets controlled by the Mandel foundation which has given $1 billion since its founding in 1953. 

 

In the near term, I’m picturing The Cleveland Foundation stepping in to fill funding gaps for Irishtown Bend or the Lorain Midway projects. 

1 hour ago, Henke said:

Apologies if I missed this discussion or if it belongs in another thread. 

 

Cleveland Planning Director Joyce Huang Leaving for Gig at Cleveland Foundation

 

Seems like bad news at first glance (big shoes to fill) but her role is newly created and seems to signal that the Cleveland Foundation is going to get more involved in financing developments. I could see them playing a role in the lakefront specifically as so much of it is supposed to be publicly accessible. 

 

 

For those not familiar, the Cleveland Foundation controls about $3 billion in assets and annual grants of $150 million. It puts them in a league of their own as far as Cleveland philanthropy is concerned with the Gund foundation controlling about $400 million. They also likely exceed the assets controlled by the Mandel foundation which has given $1 billion since its founding in 1953. 

 

In the near term, I’m picturing The Cleveland Foundation stepping in to fill funding gaps for Irishtown Bend or the Lorain Midway projects. 

We seem to have a cadre of forward-thinking leaders for the first time in many decades - Bibb, Ronayne, Huang...

Wonder if she will stay on Landmarks.

On 11/23/2024 at 1:46 PM, LibertyBlvd said:

A grocery store is probably not the best use for it.

 

A private business that would limit access is probably the worst use of it, though.

 

I'll go over for lunch and the amount of people taking it in is impressive, who knows maybe they even buy something while gawking. 

 

I wonder if they'll put wine and beer into the old coffee shop on the first floor. 

Is the OSU-Siemans hookup the one that got away from CWRU/UC? 

 

https://www.crainscleveland.com/health-care/siemens-ohio-state-wexner-medical-center-launch-partnership

Huge fire at Byright (48th and Lorain)

 

Wont be surprised to see this building demoed after this. I’m hoping Imposters Theater is undamaged.

Edited December 9, 2024Dec 9 by downtownjoe

5 hours ago, downtownjoe said:

Huge fire at Byright (48th and Lorain)

 

Wont be surprised to see this building demoed after this. I’m hoping Imposters Theater is undamaged.

 

The latest news was that CFD was able to prevent the fire from reaching the theater, though they are still dealing with hot spots as of 7am Monday.

Used car dealership on Lorain? Let me guess, did the fire get to the building before creditors or the FBI could?

3 minutes ago, KJP said:

Used car dealership on Lorain? Let me guess, did the fire get to the building before creditors or the FBI could?

Are you implying this was not an accident?

42 minutes ago, KJP said:

Used car dealership on Lorain? Let me guess, did the fire get to the building before creditors or the FBI could?

2 fires within 1000 feet of each other in the last few months with this and the fire in the old funeral home on the 45 West site....

22 hours ago, PlanCleveland said:

2 fires within 1000 feet of each other in the last few months with this and the fire in the old funeral home on the 45 West site....

Have the arson investigators rule out climate change as a cause

Found this old pic from the UW ballon fiasco. Great look at the old building(s) on the parking lot/shack site. 

 

Moved discussion of the new ward map to the thread that we have for Cleveland City Council as it is obviously not development news.

On 11/22/2024 at 6:58 PM, JB said:

Wait why did I get downvoted on this one? First hand account told me the office just saw two going for it.

 

Because some people feel the need to virtue signal.

 

I'll be even more blunt, the worst behaved street people often avoid the services areas, though I do think turning the old St. Vincent campus into one is a very good idea.  At some point, police activity is always going to be needed.

 

This is part of why Peter Lewis made integral parking a show stopper vis a vis moving downtown.

On 12/9/2024 at 9:31 AM, MyPhoneDead said:

Are you implying this was not an accident?

 

From some of us (raising hand) this would be a cynical smartass comment.   From Ken with his sources, not so much.

 

NE Ohio projects get historic wins from tax credits
By Ken Prendergast / December 11, 2024

 

There were 14 Cuyahoga County historic renovation projects that won a total of $16,267,141 in Ohio Historic Preservation Tax Credits today. Most of those projects would repurpose their 50-plus-year-old buildings for new uses so they can contribute to their communities for at least another 50 years. Some of the buildings are pretty well known.

 

MORE:

https://neo-trans.blog/2024/12/11/ne-ohio-projects-get-historic-wins-from-tax-credits/