May 5, 20223 yr 1 hour ago, Htsguy said: I still don't understand the top part. They decided to put a smaller copy of their building on top of their building. Or maybe they decided to put a larger copy of their building under their building. Either way, what's not to get? We certainly wouldn't want it all to look like one building, instead of two buildings stacked on top of each other, which would be boring and logical. Now if they'd just get an even smaller copy to put on top of that and then put a trench coat on all of it, we could pretend we were getting another skyscraper.
May 6, 20223 yr I honestly love this. As already mentioned, Cleveland desperately could use some more color in its skyline, and I’m personally a big fan of the greens/blues/glass used here. It’s fresh, it’s modern, it’s…different. Which is good!! I also really love how the existing building elements will be incorporated into the new design, as well as integrating other Art Deco features. All in all I think this latest iteration is the best yet. Time to get it built!!
May 6, 20223 yr It's still hard for me to picture how the design will look in real life, but it's at least fine. For the next few months, though, I'm a little less interested in worrying about top-notch design and a little more interested in getting projects financed and underway before we get hit by 2008-Two: Office Market Collapse Boogaloo.
May 6, 20223 yr It still seems to look a bit cartoonish, but maybe it just due to the quality of the rendering.
May 6, 20223 yr I actually think this version is going to look great on the skyline - they’ve toned down the yellows and lime green and it should look sharp and modern. Cleveland is starting to take on a much more modern look when you think about the new taller buildings of the last 15-20 years - E&Y. SW, Lumen, Hilton - a year or so from now the city will be looking better than ever.
May 6, 20223 yr 5 hours ago, w28th said: ^Nice Josh Fenderman reference... One of Hollywood’s toppest young stars (although I preferred Goober Patrol).
May 7, 20223 yr Someone pointed out recently in an U.O. thread that Paris is mostly beige, and this was a thoughtful observation. 'Same with Rome. While most of the momumental bldgs in DC are white marble, the rest of the place is grey, beige, and brown too, And, you know what? None of those towns is an eyesore or a bore. I don't mind green, but if your building is going to be an interesting, wild or even a wierd color, the building should be #$@! great. Our green tower, should not be some boring slab of medicroty. - Even great color does not solve the problem of bland design. This building as proposed is a bore. It will be a green bore, but hey, Cleveland seems prepared to settle. Edited May 7, 20223 yr by ExPatClevGuy
May 7, 20223 yr ^ I'm not so sure about that. Is the design/color scheme amazing? No...but I wouldn't call it boring either. I think it looks pretty good actually. Certainly much better than those 1970's modern square blocks that we have scattered about the E. 9th St. area. On the whole I think the bar has been raised for urban design in Cleveland over the past few decades. And I like a lot of the pending products as well. Sure, there's still some fails but I think we're doing much better than before.
May 7, 20223 yr In isolation it's so-so kind of 70s office building color, but when you insert something like this into the urban environment it's cool, different and adds to things. Like I said before, I might not like it (in isolation) but as more stuff gets built and things get built around it, I think we'll appreciate the different style. The more diversity we get in buildings the better!
May 7, 20223 yr Author New Bridgeworks design wins support By Ken Prendergast / May 7, 2022 Plans for building an apartment-hotel tower called Bridgeworks at the west end of the Detroit-Superior Bridge appear to be back on track after the development team made some design changes. Those changes allowed the project to win unanimous support yesterday from the Ohio City Design-Review Committee. The same committee last month sent the project back to the drawing board. MORE: https://neo-trans.blog/2022/05/07/new-bridgeworks-design-wins-support/ "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
May 7, 20223 yr Pretty disappointing that their financing isn’t nailed down. Hopefully that’s not a problem.
May 7, 20223 yr 3 minutes ago, LlamaLawyer said: Pretty disappointing that their financing isn’t nailed down. Hopefully that’s not a problem. I hope not either but the developers seem very determined to get this thing moving.
May 7, 20223 yr On 5/6/2022 at 10:48 PM, marty15 said: We complain about the brown and gray buildings. What colors will we be happy with? Bronze might look good, at least in this case. I think it would blend in better with the neighboring church building. Edited May 8, 20223 yr by LibertyBlvd
May 7, 20223 yr Author 11 minutes ago, LlamaLawyer said: Pretty disappointing that their financing isn’t nailed down. Hopefully that’s not a problem. Financing isn't the problem. Inability to nail down a construction management contract for more than six months is. It's a common problem for all developments right now. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
May 10, 20223 yr Ugly colors. I wish they would go back to the original two-tone brick construction. The new design looks cheap.
May 10, 20223 yr I'm surprised no one else has commented on this. That one-story facade facing the Detroit-Superior bridge is lower than the roadway -- nice that they're incorporating some historic detail references, but from the roadway are you just going to see the modern glass? Why not build up to the street/bridge level? And who wants to hang out on a patio next to a busy roadway?
May 11, 20223 yr Bridgeworks on Landmarks May 12th agenda but listed under concept and not certificate of appropriateness so I guess they will have to come back again. Curious whether this is the required process for Landmarks or whether the developers made a conscious decision to submit the new design conceptually (after all the previous design was approved) to get feedback. Seems like it will slow things down if they are actually that anxious to get things moving.
May 11, 20223 yr 1 hour ago, Htsguy said: Bridgeworks on Landmarks May 12th agenda but listed under concept and not certificate of appropriateness so I guess they will have to come back again. Curious whether this is the required process for Landmarks or whether the developers made a conscious decision to submit the new design conceptually (after all the previous design was approved) to get feedback. Seems like it will slow things down if they are actually that anxious to get things moving. It's a standard process. It has been over a year since the original project had been approved and there are enough changes to the plan that it needs to start over. It still needs to go back to local design review for final approval before returning to the Commission. Nothing out of the ordinary.
May 12, 20223 yr Author Despite a light agenda and non-controversial items on it, the Landmarks meeting is still underway more than 3.5 hours in, so the chair Julie Trott who is managing the meeting had to leave prior to a vote on the demolition sought for Bridgeworks. When she left the meeting, there was no longer a quorum for the board to take a vote. The developer said it can't move forward on any further design refinement for the site until they know the demolition is approved. And the developer can't get loan financing without entitlements approved by the city. The next Landmarks agenda in two weeks is pretty full so it may not be considered until June. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
May 12, 20223 yr 6 minutes ago, KJP said: Despite a light agenda and non-controversial items on it, the Landmarks meeting is still underway 3.5 hours in, so the chair Julie Trott who is managing the meeting had to leave prior to a vote on the demolition sought for Bridgeworks. When she left the meeting, there was no longer a quorum for the board to take a vote. See you next meeting.... This is embarrassing. Put people on the committee that are committed to showing up.
May 12, 20223 yr 15 minutes ago, KJP said: Despite a light agenda and non-controversial items on it, the Landmarks meeting is still underway more than 3.5 hours in, so the chair Julie Trott who is managing the meeting had to leave prior to a vote on the demolition sought for Bridgeworks. When she left the meeting, there was no longer a quorum for the board to take a vote. The developer said it can't move forward on any further design refinement for the site until they know the demolition is approved. And the developer can't get loan financing without entitlements approved by the city. The next Landmarks agenda in two weeks is pretty full so it may not be considered until June. Did they really need to yak about the Ohio City Burrito window for as long as they did?
May 12, 20223 yr 29 minutes ago, Htsguy said: Did they really need to yak about the Ohio City Burrito window for as long as they did? It's the chair's responsibility to keep things moving; apparently Ms. Trott isn't up to the task. This is where Bibb's Chief of Staff invites Trott in for a conversation. Remember: It's the Year of the Snake
May 12, 20223 yr 50 minutes ago, freefourur said: This is embarrassing. Put people on the committee that are committed to showing up. This is the kind of behavior that makes me suspect that a duffel bag full of money is the current standard for getting things done.
May 12, 20223 yr 50 minutes ago, Dougal said: It's the chair's responsibility to keep things moving; apparently Ms. Trott isn't up to the task. This is where Bibb's Chief of Staff invites Trott in for a conversation. Things would have also moved faster if Councilman McCormick did not keep repeating the same points (practically using the same exact words) five times or more. I've noticed watching council committee meetings that he has a habit of doing that. It was driving me nuts.
May 12, 20223 yr Author 17 minutes ago, CleveFan said: No meeting should be 3.5 hours. Ever. Especially one with such a light agenda. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
May 12, 20223 yr A good note from their comments though.. they’ll do metal covering on the facade of the garage because church and state “has been a nightmare”
May 13, 20223 yr I guess Ms. Julie was hot to trot on out of there. Then again, does it really take three and a half hours to get through a light schedule? Something appears wrong here. People need their say but if the note about McCormick repeating his talking points over and over is an indication of how these meetings go no wonder it seems like they spin their wheels too much. The whole thing about these Boards has me somewhat confused. Do they get bogged down in the minutia? Are the members experts in anything other than "connections" and do they even have any expertise in city planning? I don't know, it just seems like there is a lot of dithering going on and not a lot of understanding of what needs to get done. Maybe its just our government in action and that's the way it is. Then again, can't they tighten things up just a bit?
May 13, 20223 yr ^After years on this board, it is clear to me that financing is the culprit most of the time. Not just securing it but the lawyers and bankers finalizing the paper work so everybody feels secure and all possible negative contingencies are addressed. Really this is not a local problem but something that occurs nationwide, although on different levels. I will say that some of the capital stacks put together for Cleveland projects seem so complex (and as a result extra time consuming) that they should case studies at Harvard Business School.
May 13, 20223 yr 5 minutes ago, Htsguy said: ^After years on this board, it is clear to me that financing is the culprit most of the time. Not just securing it but the lawyers and bankers finalizing the paper work so everybody feels secure and all possible negative contingencies are addressed. Really this is not a local problem but something that occurs nationwide, although on different levels. I will say that some of the capital stacks put together for Cleveland projects seem so complex (and as a result extra time consuming) that they should case studies at Harvard Business School. I'd like to talk this but don't want to get off topic, can anyone point me towards a good spot to discuss landmarks commission?
May 13, 20223 yr Author 33 minutes ago, dastler said: I'd like to talk this but don't want to get off topic, can anyone point me towards a good spot to discuss landmarks commission? Try this: "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
May 14, 20223 yr I think this will complement the church + state development just down the street, an abstract neighborhood! Edited May 14, 20223 yr by tastybunns
May 24, 20223 yr 1 hour ago, CleveFan said: If they can complete a meeting… Fortunately it is up first.
May 26, 20223 yr 11 minutes ago, osu4brutus03 said: What time is this meeting today? It is all over. They were only up for approval of the demolition, not the final design. They have to come back in July for that. Demolition was approved with conditions but they are actually not even planning on doing the demolition until October, if everything goes smoothly.
May 26, 20223 yr Author October is when the next round of TMUD awards would likely be announced. Coincidence? "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
September 19, 20222 yr Bridgeworks' construction approval is on Thursday's Landmark agenda. Recall that demolition was already approved a few months back and at that time the principals claimed that they were going to begin demo in October. We will see. Curious if this project is a go even if they don't receive a TMUD award in the upcoming round. By the way, shouldn't the agency be announcing the awards soon?
September 19, 20222 yr Author Probably getting close. But I would be very surprised if they try to build it without the TMUD. I just don't think their numbers pencil without it. Perhaps they can get some Brownfield money and historic tax credits from the state for demolition/site prep and renovation of the subway entrances like the mid-rise housing in the Studio West 117 development in Lakewood? "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
September 19, 20222 yr I think it's a no brainer to win some TMUD credits but I thought that in round 1 as well so what do I know 😅. It's wild to me that one of two main entrance to Ohio City from downtown is flanked by two abandoned buildings on the corner. The Irishtown Bend Park and Bridgeworks would help the cohesion of Ohio City and Downtown and make it feel like two totally separate areas and more like OC being a continuation of downtown
September 19, 20222 yr Author 31 minutes ago, dwolfi01 said: I think it's a no brainer to win some TMUD credits but I thought that in round 1 as well so what do I know 😅. It's wild to me that one of two main entrance to Ohio City from downtown is flanked by two abandoned buildings on the corner. The Irishtown Bend Park and Bridgeworks would help the cohesion of Ohio City and Downtown and make it feel like two totally separate areas and more like OC being a continuation of downtown If this round is like the first round, they'll win their entire ask or nothing. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
September 19, 20222 yr 1 hour ago, Htsguy said: Bridgeworks' construction approval is on Thursday's Landmark agenda. Recall that demolition was already approved a few months back and at that time the principals claimed that they were going to begin demo in October. We will see. Curious if this project is a go even if they don't receive a TMUD award in the upcoming round. By the way, shouldn't the agency be announcing the awards soon? Is this a meeting that public opinion showing support for would be beneficial?
September 19, 20222 yr 13 minutes ago, TotalTransit said: Is this a meeting that public opinion showing support for would be beneficial? Given what has occurred in the past I doubt there will be much push back and the project will receive a certificate of appropriateness. The Landmarks chairperson has an irrational opinion regarding the height of the project but I imagine even she will vote in favor.
September 19, 20222 yr 14 minutes ago, Htsguy said: Given what has occurred in the past I doubt there will be much push back and the project will receive a certificate of appropriateness. The Landmarks chairperson has an irrational opinion regarding the height of the project but I imagine even she will vote in favor. The latest site plan that I saw has the building set back from West 25th street. I'd prefer to have it come up to the sidewalk. But otherwise this is a great project.
September 19, 20222 yr 11 minutes ago, freefourur said: The latest site plan that I saw has the building set back from West 25th street. I'd prefer to have it come up to the sidewalk. But otherwise this is a great project. Setbacks may be my single most hated municipal building restriction. Should we still make comment for that reason? Edited September 19, 20222 yr by TotalTransit
September 19, 20222 yr 1 hour ago, TotalTransit said: Setbacks may be my single most hated municipal building restriction. Should we still make comment for that reason? it's not a terrible setback. It could be worth making a comment about it. But my assumption is that the are matching the setback of the Quarter across the street. Perhaps there are plans for trails to connect Iriishtown and the existing trails.
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