Speaking of graft...

 

 

4 hours ago, TBideon said:

White has about as much credibility as Nate Gray and Jimmy Dimora. He might be remembered fondly since Cleveland was considered the Comeback City during his reign, but he was as much a criminal as those other scumbags.

People do tend to forget that under White's first term in office, the city was still riding the momentum from Voinovich's ten years as mayor (1980-1989).  The city won the All-American City (not Comeback City) award 5 times.  The first was in 1949.  The last time was 1993.  Cleveland won it three time under Voinovich:  1982, 1984 and 1986.    Once White started his second term, the momentum slowed and he started to alienate his backers.  By the time of his third term, the alienation was complete.  The city was heading into a massive financial mess and the books were unable to be audited.  The city's financial department was a revolving door of staffers.  With virtually no backers and a massive financial mess building, that is why he headed off to Newcomerstown to raise alpacas.  He did come back to the city after he left office to answer questions about the city's financial situation.

 

People need to remember the other, not good things he did to Cleveland. 

 

The All-American City award coming three times in the 1980's was also a testimonial for what Voinovich did in getting Cleveland out of the mess left behind by Kucinich's two years as mayor in 1978 and 1979. 

Bibb is trying to win and it appears that White will be campaigning for him.  Do not underestimate how good White is as a communicator (watching the press conference, White can still talk circles around any of the candidates including Mayor Jackson's Kelly endorsement) and how well he will connect with east side voters.  Regardless of what one thinks of White, I view this is a significant win for Bibb.  Much more significant than Mary Rose Ockar.  

Edited August 18, 20213 yr by newyorker

How it should be done:

 

 

 

2 minutes ago, Boomerang_Brian said:

How it should be done:

 

 

 

 

It is noble, however if he's elected, he needs to figure out what happens when you actually try to call one of those numbers and get service.  

I have immense respect for everything Chrostowski has accomplished with EDWINS. That said, between this endorsement of Dennis! and pushing back hard on rerouting Shaker Blvd around Shaker Square, he clearly has some blind spots. 
 

 

17 minutes ago, Boomerang_Brian said:

I have immense respect for everything Chrostowski has accomplished with EDWINS. That said, between this endorsement of Dennis! and pushing back hard on rerouting Shaker Blvd around Shaker Square, he clearly has some blind spots. 
 

 

So, Chrostowski feels that Kucinich deserves a second chance?  What has he done in the 41+ years of leaving the mayor's office indicates he has earned a second chance?  He has done nothing of substance in any of the government positions that he occupied since then.  In his sixteen years in Congress, including two years when any piece of Democratic-backed legislation piece of legislation, funding or program had clear sailing through both sides of Congress to be signed into law, he introduced NOTHING.  How much benefit did Cleveland or the area receive by the naming of two fairly minor buildings and granting an honorary citizenship to somebody who lived two centuries ago? Those were the three pieces of legislation that his record stands on for those sixteen years.

 

Maybe he can hold regular meetings in a diner to discuss the problems facing the city.  He could always fire the police chief on live television.  Or, perhaps he can reach out to the space aliens for assistance in solving the city's woes. 

He might sue the city's cafeteria if he breaks another tooth on an olive pit.

On 8/18/2021 at 9:16 PM, Cleburger said:

 

It is noble, however if he's elected, he needs to figure out what happens when you actually try to call one of those numbers and get service.  

 

So much this.

 

Dennis is great at symbolism like this as well.   Substance?   Not so much.

Kevin Kelley stopped by my apartment for a meet and greet on Wednesday. I was impressed with his answers, and seemed very knowledgeable on every subject that came up. He also was far more interested in making changes and departing from the previous administration than Jackson's endorsement would suggest. Overall, my biggest impression was that of competence. 

14 hours ago, LifeLongClevelander said:

So, Chrostowski feels that Kucinich deserves a second chance?  What has he done in the 41+ years of leaving the mayor's office indicates he has earned a second chance?  He has done nothing of substance in any of the government positions that he occupied since then.  In his sixteen years in Congress, including two years when any piece of Democratic-backed legislation piece of legislation, funding or program had clear sailing through both sides of Congress to be signed into law, he introduced NOTHING.  How much benefit did Cleveland or the area receive by the naming of two fairly minor buildings and granting an honorary citizenship to somebody who lived two centuries ago? Those were the three pieces of legislation that his record stands on for those sixteen years.

 

Maybe he can hold regular meetings in a diner to discuss the problems facing the city.  He could always fire the police chief on live television.  Or, perhaps he can reach out to the space aliens for assistance in solving the city's woes. 

 

I've said for awhile that Dennis was in his wheelhouse as a minority party Congressman.  He could make noise, posture, and not have to worry about anything except constituent service, which he excelled at.   

His strength is a lot of people not remembering how things were when he ran the show, or recalling it selectively.  Put it this way, the man set the stage for a decade of an openly Republican mayor.

On 8/18/2021 at 12:54 PM, KJP said:

Speaking of graft...

 

 

"“Mr. Jones, maybe what you need to do is ensure you know what time council starts so you won’t miss half of the council doing Zoom,” Reed said, a reference to Jones’ low attendance at council meetings – second-lowest of all members – which are currently held remotely.

 

“Well, Zack, you should be careful where you go my friend,” Jones responded."

Is Jones going to get dirty??  

1 minute ago, E Rocc said:

"“Mr. Jones, maybe what you need to do is ensure you know what time council starts so you won’t miss half of the council doing Zoom,” Reed said, a reference to Jones’ low attendance at council meetings – second-lowest of all members – which are currently held remotely.

 

“Well, Zack, you should be careful where you go my friend,” Jones responded."

Is Jones going to get dirty??  

Hasn’t he already? I suppose he could go dirtier. It sounded more like an idle threat to me.
 

And I thought Zack’s calling him out on missing council meetings was absolutely on point. 

 

16 hours ago, LifeLongClevelander said:

So, Chrostowski feels that Kucinich deserves a second chance?  What has he done in the 41+ years of leaving the mayor's office indicates he has earned a second chance?  He has done nothing of substance in any of the government positions that he occupied since then. 

 

Of course, the older someone is, the more there is to critique about his/her life and work.  Kucinich saved Muny Light.  No question about that. No way in Hell Bibb or Basheer would risk everything for one cause, especially against such formidable odds--when all of the corporate structure of the city was against you. What has Jones done? or Sandra Williams or Bibb? Perhaps looking at the 7 candidates, Chrostowski feels that though Kucinich may not have done much in Congress--though he did stand against the Patriot Act and the invasion of Iraq (which had nothing to do with 9/11)---he is still better than the likes of Bibb or Zack Reed or Basheer. I think Bibb would be an absolute disaster as mayor--he doesn't really get it--and he would make earnest attempts at things and get steamrolled by private interests. He would hurt the city far more than help anything. Bibb can see and talk about the problems of the city, but won't be able to implement smart or lasting changes. He doesn't really understand how the city works--especially compared to Jones, Kelley, Kucinich, and Zach Reed. Bibb is on the absolute bottom of my list, right below DiBello and Basheer. I haven't decided yet who I'm voting for--but my top three are Kucinich, Kelley, and Williams--not necessarily in that order.

Edited August 20, 20213 yr by Pugu

1 hour ago, Boomerang_Brian said:

Hasn’t he already? I suppose he could go dirtier. It sounded more like an idle threat to me.
 

And I thought Zack’s calling him out on missing council meetings was absolutely on point. 

 

 

Unless I missed something this year, he could get dirtier.   But I suspect it splashes on him if it does.

Edited August 20, 20213 yr by E Rocc

I think Basheer Jones is a pretty good debater overall, but the attack on Zack Reed about what he got done in his Ward rings hollow to me. 

 

Anyone could get lots of development done in Ward 7. Other than Downtown itself, Wards 6 and 7 are going to get the most investment from a jobs/industrial perspective. Ward 2 is an entirely different animal, it's far away from downtown and more suburban in character. It's apples to oranges.

 

It's a snappy political line though that could work well on voters who don't follow urban development as closely as we do. 

Edited August 20, 20213 yr by mu2010

1 hour ago, Pugu said:

 

Of course, the older someone is, the more there is to critique about his/her life and work.  Kucinich saved Muny Light.  No question about that. No way in Hell Bibb or Basheer would risk everything for one cause, especially against such formidable odds--when all of the corporate structure of the city was against you. What has Jones done? or Sandra Williams or Bibb? Perhaps looking at the 7 candidates, Chrostowski feels that though Kucinich may not have done much in Congress--though he did stand against the Patriot Act and the invasion of Iraq (which had nothing to do with 9/11)---he is still better than the likes of Bibb or Zack Reed or Basheer. I think Bibb would be an absolute disaster as mayor--he doesn't really get it--and he would make earnest attempts at things and get steamrolled by private interests. He would hurt the city far more than help anything. Bibb can see and talk about the problems of the city, but won't be able to implement smart or lasting changes. He doesn't really understand how the city works--especially compared to Jones, Kelley, Kucinich, and Zach Reed. Bibb is on the absolute bottom of my list, right below DiBello and Basheer. I haven't decided yet who I'm voting for--but my top three are Kucinich, Kelley, and Williams--not necessarily in that order.

Saving Muny Light was the only thing of substance that he has done in all the years that he has been in government and that happened over 40 years ago.  Standing against the Patriot Act and Iraq invasion was just him jumping on the bandwagon.  Same thing goes with his votes in Congress--jumping on the bandwagon.  One would think that being in Congress for 16 years, especially when he was part of the overwhelming majority party, one would expect something of substance to come from him.  True major players in their party are able to bring back something, sometimes a lot, to help his constituency while in Congress.  With him, there was absolutely nothing he did. 

 

Kucinich was just one of the flock of sheep in his party and his record proves he is incapable of being a real leader.  Aside from the Muny Light issue, he was the mayor leading chaos in the city.  Being incapable of leadership is mitigated when a member of city council, state house or Congress.  It is just one voice and hopefully incompetency is out-voted by more sound thinking.  It is much different when the incompetency occupies the top executive level. 

 

A lot of good things have happened in recent years.  One bad term can bring all the progress to a halt and start unraveling things fast.  

3 minutes ago, LifeLongClevelander said:

A lot of good things have happened in recent years.  One bad term can bring all the progress to a halt and start unraveling things fast.  

 

That statement is exactly why I feel Bibb is very scary. His incompetence will do a lot of damage to the city.

 

Thanks for your statements on Kucinich--I will give them deeper thought as I look at him, Williams, and Kelley.  Who are you favoring?

16 minutes ago, Pugu said:

 

That statement is exactly why I feel Bibb is very scary. His incompetence will do a lot of damage to the city.

 

Thanks for your statements on Kucinich--I will give them deeper thought as I look at him, Williams, and Kelley.  Who are you favoring?

Keep in mind that during the Kucinich years, city services were on a fast decline.  We had some severe winters in the late 1970's and the city could not keep the streets clean.  If the city's police car fleet now was as bad as it was back then, there would be no problems with police chases.  So many of them were worn out, they could not even consider starting a chase because they would be left behind even at moderate speeds. 

 

Unfortunately, there is a parallel that is building up for Cleveland now.  It has been reported for several years that the majority of the EMS rescue squad fleet is beyond even serving in backup capacities, even though they are in front-line service here.  The average unit mileage is more than double that of other cities and Cleveland has not accelerated their replacements.  Cleveland's police department still has quite a few Ford Crown Victoria police interceptors in service and that model was last produced in 2011.  Last year, it was reported that the city had quite a few plow trucks out of service.  We have had mild winters with below average snowfalls.  Probably sooner than later, the trend will swing back to colder and snowier winters.  Will the city be able to keep up with major snowstorms, especially if they happen in quick succession?

 

It has been stated that Kucinich's plan to build up the staffing levels of the police department will drain the city's financial reserves.  How will they be able to patrol if the city cannot keep enough cruisers operational?  How will the city be able to purchase equipment to replace worn out police cars, EMS squads, fire engines and service trucks?  Where will the money come from to keep the additional police officers employed?  Will the city be able to pay its obligations or will it default once again?  This time, it won't be due to backroom dealings; this time it would be due to fiscal mismanagement.  

 

At this time, I probably favor Kelley.  Too many questions, bad past history or unknowns about the others.

On 8/18/2021 at 9:13 PM, Boomerang_Brian said:

How it should be done:

 

 

 

agreed.  That's very savvy.  Leaves a strong impression to new residents.  It's good policy and should be continued regardless who wins

On 8/20/2021 at 9:28 AM, Ethan said:

Kevin Kelley stopped by my apartment for a meet and greet on Wednesday. I was impressed with his answers, and seemed very knowledgeable on every subject that came up. He also was far more interested in making changes and departing from the previous administration than Jackson's endorsement would suggest. Overall, my biggest impression was that of competence. 

that's good to hear.  And good to see him out campaigning, getting to know residents & their concerns.  More than anything, I hope people get out & vote

I'll go on a limb and say Kucinich is being bankrolled by some special interest to achieve a specific thing or two.... should he manage to win.  There's just no other reason for him to be in the race.

Edited August 23, 20213 yr by gottaplan

5 minutes ago, gottaplan said:

I'll go on a limb and say Kucinich is being bankrolled by some special interest to achieve a specific thing or two.... should he manage to win.  There's just no other reason for him to be in the race.

I agree with this assessment. 

1 hour ago, gottaplan said:

I'll go on a limb and say Kucinich is being bankrolled by some special interest to achieve a specific thing or two.... should he manage to win.  There's just no other reason for him to be in the race.

Maybe he needs to be the center of attention again.  No news station gigs (local or national).  Too far removed from Congress to provide any meaningful insight (not that he had any).  Boredom.  Re-invent his legacy.

2 hours ago, gottaplan said:

I'll go on a limb and say Kucinich is being bankrolled by some special interest to achieve a specific thing or two.... should he manage to win.  There's just no other reason for him to be in the race.

 

I think it's ego.   Then again, about six years ago I thought the same about a different candidate.

1 hour ago, E Rocc said:

 

I think it's ego.   Then again, about six years ago I thought the same about a different candidate.

It is and it was. Let’s see if we’ve learned an important lesson. 

Public Square has become a great civic place and park in the city. It's also a symbolically important square in the city. It should not have buses running through it. Cleveland should have a nice central square as does countless other cities in the world. I was just listening to the second mayoral debate (recorded). Bibb just said "As mayor, I'm gonna do everything in my power to...open up the buses back to Public Square."  I assume he meant open up Public Square to buses. But more importantly, it's just another example of how clueless he really is and why he'd be horrible for the city as mayor.  Do everything in his power to destroy the great public park and space that Public Square has become?   At timestamp 1:14:54:  

 

 

Public Square was designed and intended to be a transportation hub with buses running through it.  And it doesn’t matter all THAT much what anyone locally thinks, as the federal government was quite clear that preventing buses through PS would mean that Cleveland would have to refund millions of dollars in federal funding related to the project. That decision has been made. 
 

Making buses run fast is critical to their utility. Generally speaking, we are very bad at that in this country. I support things that make buses run faster, including running them through PS. 
 

Furthermore, Bibb’s main point is the need for getting rid of the Jersey Barriers. He’s the only one advocating FOR restoring PS in this important way, and you’re on here trying to argue that’s a bad thing.  
 

Vote for whoever you want, but it is completely beyond me how anyone could listen to Bibb and to what people who have worked with him say about him, and then come to the conclusion that he would be a disaster. Especially when compared to the field that is running. Quite frankly it feels like you’re doubling down on your opinion and digging in your heels simply to be argumentative. 
 

The primary is likely to be very close for the top 4-5 finishers. I’m urging everyone who is eligible to vote in Cleveland to please vote Bibb. He is the best candidate by a mile. 

2 hours ago, Boomerang_Brian said:

He is the best candidate by a mile. 

 

Can confirm 10/10

2 hours ago, Boomerang_Brian said:

Public Square was designed and intended to be a transportation hub with buses running through it.  And it doesn’t matter all THAT much what anyone locally thinks, as the federal government was quite clear that preventing buses through PS would mean that Cleveland would have to refund millions of dollars in federal funding related to the project. That decision has been made. 
 

Making buses run fast is critical to their utility. Generally speaking, we are very bad at that in this country. I support things that make buses run faster, including running them through PS. 
 

Furthermore, Bibb’s main point is the need for getting rid of the Jersey Barriers. He’s the only one advocating FOR restoring PS in this important way, and you’re on here trying to argue that’s a bad thing.  
 

Vote for whoever you want, but it is completely beyond me how anyone could listen to Bibb and to what people who have worked with him say about him, and then come to the conclusion that he would be a disaster. Especially when compared to the field that is running. Quite frankly it feels like you’re doubling down on your opinion and digging in your heels simply to be argumentative. 
 

The primary is likely to be very close for the top 4-5 finishers. I’m urging everyone who is eligible to vote in Cleveland to please vote Bibb. He is the best candidate by a mile. 

 

Public Square was "designed and intended" in 1796 as a bus hub?  A hub for donkey carts, maybe.  What it certainly was intended to be was a New England style town square, and a central grazing area for livestock.

3 hours ago, Boomerang_Brian said:

Furthermore, Bibb’s main point is the need for getting rid of the Jersey Barriers. He’s the only one advocating FOR restoring PS in this important way, and you’re on here trying to argue that’s a bad thing.

I know for a fact that Kevin Kelley supports this as he brought it up unbidden at a meet and greet I attended. 

 

Honestly, I would bet literally every single candidate will claim to support removing those Jersey barriers if asked, so I don't understand this point. The question is who will get it done, not which politician will endorse a universally popular idea. 

47 minutes ago, X said:

 

Public Square was "designed and intended" in 1796 as a bus hub?  A hub for donkey carts, maybe.  What it certainly was intended to be was a New England style town square, and a central grazing area for livestock.

I was talking about the recent redesign. 

5 hours ago, Clefan98 said:

 

Can confirm 10/10

11/10 for me.

4 hours ago, X said:

 

Public Square was "designed and intended" in 1796 as a bus hub?  A hub for donkey carts, maybe.  What it certainly was intended to be was a New England style town square, and a central grazing area for livestock.

Donkey and other animal-drawn carts were forms of transportation then. 

And check out this photo from 1907, where transportation certainly played a huge role in the life of the square, as it does in many European public squares (where cyclists and pedestrians walk inches from trams).    

 

 

8 hours ago, Boomerang_Brian said:

Vote for whoever you want, but it is completely beyond me how anyone could listen to Bibb and to what people who have worked with him say about him, and then come to the conclusion that he would be a disaster. Especially when compared to the field that is running. Quite frankly it feels like you’re doubling down on your opinion and digging in your heels simply to be argumentative. 
 

The primary is likely to be very close for the top 4-5 finishers. I’m urging everyone who is eligible to vote in Cleveland to please vote Bibb. He is the best candidate by a mile. 

 

I watched and/or listened to all the debates and the Nick Castelle series "After Jackson". I've listened and watched carefully and I'm very familiar with this city and how it works and its history and how things happen both in Cleveland and across the US. We all have our opinions on the best way forward with things---from shootings to minibikes to jobs to population loss to residential tax abatement policies, etc. I don't think anyone here--myself included--is an expert on crime AND education AND development AND aging AND childcare AND street maintenance AND lead..... So we make our assessments on the areas we do know and our own instincts on the others including sizing up each of the candidates as leaders, as effective leaders, as individuals, as individuals of character and ability and intent, etc.  My reading of Bibb is not positive at all. I think he is educated and well-spoken, but he utterly projects a no-confidence as being a person that would be able to be even an average mayor. Yes, mayors appoint a cabinet. But listening to Bibb talk, he won't even appoint a proper or competent cabinet. They may be educated and well-spoken, but not competent to run the city. Bibb will get steamrolled by private interests in a way the others (maybe Dibello as well) would not.

 

TBH, I'm quite surprised at all the strong support Bibb gets from members of this forum. While I get the argument that the group of seven are not something to be wowwed by, certainly Bibb is not the best of the seven--or even the second or third best.

 

For me, after watching the second debate--Sandra Williams went up a few points, Ross DiBello went down a few points, Bibb stayed at the very bottom, Basheer went down a few points, Zach Reed actually went up a few points, Kucinich dipped a few points, and Kelley went up a few points. 

 

I'd love to hear who others support and why. The primary is coming up fast!

^^^ My exact thoughts, regarding Bibb.  Though I am more concerned that he will get steamrolled by the entrenched bureaucracy than by private interests.   Both are a concern.  I see strong similarities to both Jackson and Calamity Jane, neither fills me with confidence. A dose of Sim City Syndrome in their as well.   If he was a ceremonial mayor with a strong city manager (the system I would favor), maybe.   But no.

 

Someone has to convince me to not to vote for Zach.  It may be Zach that does it, but so far he hasn’t.  I remember Dennis’s mayoralty so that’s a big no.   I trust Kelley about as far as I can throw one of the rocks they dumped over the bluff at Beulah.  I know people that grew up with Basheer….enough said.  Hasn’t he realized Eric Brewer finished last last time.  The others have made no impression.
 

20 minutes ago, E Rocc said:

Though I am more concerned that he will get steamrolled by the entrenched bureaucracy than by private interests.   

 

Which candidate won't?   It's been there for decades, and only strengthened by the many terms of Frank Jackson and his COO Darnell Brown.  I would trust an outsider from these people over someone who has been in council feeding the machine by placing friends and family in cush city jobs.  

1 hour ago, Pugu said:

 

 

 

For me, after watching the second debate--Sandra Williams went up a few points, Ross DiBello went down a few points, Bibb stayed at the very bottom, Basheer went down a few points, Zach Reed actually went up a few points, Kucinich dipped a few points, and Kelley went up a few points. 

 

 

 

Sandra's yes vote for the corrupt HB6 bill should be a nonstarter for anyone who still gives a damn about ethics.  Good to know you support someone being bribed by First Energy and scumbag Tony (Kristine) George.

Edited August 25, 20213 yr by Clefan98

1 hour ago, Pugu said:

.

For me, after watching the second debate--Sandra Williams went up a few points, Ross DiBello went down a few points, Bibb stayed at the very bottom, Basheer went down a few points, Zach Reed actually went up a few points, Kucinich dipped a few points, and Kelley went up a few points. 

 

This is fascinating to me, in that our reactions to ALL of the other candidates based on the debates are exactly the same. So for 6 out of 7, we made the exact same adjustments, but for the seventh we couldn’t be further apart. Thanks for taking the time to detail your others thoughts so that we could find some common ground. (Well, DiBello went down by more than a few points. I’m all for progressive politics, but it needs to also feature some pragmatism. Not seeing the latter from Ross)

40 minutes ago, Cleburger said:

 

Which candidate won't?   It's been there for decades, and only strengthened by the many terms of Frank Jackson and his COO Darnell Brown.  I would trust an outsider from these people over someone who has been in council feeding the machine by placing friends and family in cush city jobs.  

 

Kucinich may not be the best candidate, but I'd say Kucinich is the definitely the person least likely to put up with entrenched internal bureaucracy or private interests. At his age and disposition, he's not going to put up with crap.

15 hours ago, Pugu said:

Public Square has become a great civic place and park in the city. It's also a symbolically important square in the city. It should not have buses running through it. Cleveland should have a nice central square as does countless other cities in the world. I was just listening to the second mayoral debate (recorded). Bibb just said "As mayor, I'm gonna do everything in my power to...open up the buses back to Public Square."  I assume he meant open up Public Square to buses. But more importantly, it's just another example of how clueless he really is and why he'd be horrible for the city as mayor.  Do everything in his power to destroy the great public park and space that Public Square has become?  

 

 

9 hours ago, Boomerang_Brian said:

Public Square was designed and intended to be a transportation hub with buses running through it.  And it doesn’t matter all THAT much what anyone locally thinks, as the federal government was quite clear that preventing buses through PS would mean that Cleveland would have to refund millions of dollars in federal funding related to the project. That decision has been made. 
 

Making buses run fast is critical to their utility. Generally speaking, we are very bad at that in this country. I support things that make buses run faster, including running them through PS. 
 

Furthermore, Bibb’s main point is the need for getting rid of the Jersey Barriers. He’s the only one advocating FOR restoring PS in this important way, and you’re on here trying to argue that’s a bad thing.  

The whole idea of Public Square being a "transportation hub" is terribly outdated.  It just happened to be a convenient place for the substantial number of small, independent horse car, cable car (yes, Cleveland had them) and streetcar companies to come together with the four quadrants in the 1880's and 1890's.  By 1903, mergers brought the number of operations down to 2 companies and those 2 companies became unified as Cleveland Railway in 1910.  In 1920, the Cleveland Railway carried nearly 450 MILLION passengers.  In 2019, before the pandemic, RTA (covering a much larger service area) carried slightly more than 32 million passengers.  In the 1920's, the Cleveland Railway streetcar fleet was approximately 5 times the size of RTA's current bus fleet.  This doesn't even include the equipment from the five interurban companies that also shared those tracks.  Carrying that many passengers and the fixed nature of streetcar routes necessitated the ability to transfer between the various routes.  A big problem with Cleveland's current bus system is that it is merely no more than the streetcar network of over a century ago only with the routes extended.  One of the big issues with the system is that there is little in the way of extension of service.  In many cases, if one wants to go beyond Public Square, one must transfer.  There is little beyond downtown or near west side distribution.  This was something that existed over a century ago, yet has lingered into today.

 

I find the statement "Making buses run fast is critical to their utility" is laughable concerning RTA.  They have shown no interest in making their buses "run fast".  Many of the express and flyer routes with limited stops that sped up service have been eliminated.  In quite a few cases, the system operates glorified shuttle buses with transfers that make trips take even longer.  These are decisions that show they don't care about making trips as fast as possible and has badly hurt the ridership of the system.

 

With the greatly diminished need to run through the middle of Public Square due to an operation that is minuscule compared to the past, there is nothing that says that the greatly reduced service cannot use the outer roadway to get through the square.  They can also use other streets such as St. Clair to the north or Prospect to the south.  In fact, the ability to transfer to the rail lines is far better on Prospect as compared to using the Public Square entrance of Tower City.  The Stephanie Tubbs-Jones Transit Center near CSU is vastly under-utilized facility that cost $9.3 million.  Per RTA's website:  "This transit center provides a safe and clean "airport-like" environment for RTA customers while they wait to transfer between bus services. A 2,000 square foot indoor waiting area offers a customer service area, restrooms, and a food vending area. There are state-of-the-art electronic customer information signs, both inside the waiting area and at the each of the 12 bus bays."  Sounds like RTA has a nearly perfect facility that it could use, but doesn't take advantage of its capacity.

 

Honestly, the Federal Government shouldn't have to have a say on the use of Public Square for buses.  Yes, they awarded money, but they should keep out of what should be local governing. The perimeter or nearby routes are more than adequate for the bus traffic that does use it it.  That prime spot should be unified for public green space and recreational purposes. 

38 minutes ago, Clefan98 said:

 

Sandra's yes vote for the corrupt HB6 bill should be a nonstarter for anyone who still gives a damn about ethics.  Good to know you support someone being bribed by First Energy and scumbag Tony (Kristine) George.

 

Sandra also made a profit on some OSU football tickets using campaign money back in 2013 or 2014 and pocketed the profits and got busted. That shows poor judgement to say the least and I certainly don't like that--though I'd take that behavior over drunk driving (Zack Reed) where one could actually kill innocent people.  But again, given the group we've got to choose from, Sandra is better than most--in terms of policy and approaches and credibility.

39 minutes ago, Boomerang_Brian said:

This is fascinating to me, in that our reactions to ALL of the other candidates based on the debates are exactly the same. So for 6 out of 7, we made the exact same adjustments, but for the seventh we couldn’t be further apart. Thanks for taking the time to detail your others thoughts so that we could find some common ground. (Well, DiBello went down by more than a few points. I’m all for progressive politics, but it needs to also feature some pragmatism. Not seeing the latter from Ross)

 

That IS interesting that we had the same reactions on 6 out of 7 candidates! Regarding Bibb, its hard to put the nail on it precisely, but I get a very bad vibe from him. I realize a lot of what he says about what the existing issues are makes sense from an academic perspective, but I wholeheartedly doubt he has the ability or even the right answers to truly tackle the issues that he talks about.

Plus Bibb is clearly confused by the purpose of ethics disclosures.  I'm not sure how he could misread the clear instructions (and instead defer blame to others for not explaining them to him), and believe that you're only supposed to disclose the income from the public entity necessitating the filing, which itself is public record. 

 

I know he has never actually practiced (or passed the bar), but this guy went to law school?  This gives rise to serious questions about his judgment, or maybe those positions (unpaid internships?) didn't pay him more than the $500 reporting threshold. 

 

https://www.cleveland.com/cityhall/2021/08/cleveland-mayoral-candidate-justin-bibb-underreported-income-sources-for-3-years-in-state-ethics-disclosure-filings.html  

 

Edited August 25, 20213 yr by grayfields

 

 

7 hours ago, grayfields said:

Plus Bibb is clearly confused by the purpose of ethics disclosures.  I'm not sure how he could misread the clear instructions (and instead defer blame to others for not explaining them to him), and believe that you're only supposed to disclose the income from the public entity necessitating the filing, which itself is public record. 

 

I agree--this is very shady. The logic makes absolutely no sense--especially for someone who supposedly went to law school. So he's either cognitively challenged, simply disrespectful of rules, willingly shady, or he  just lacks common sense and judgement. But whichever of the four, it certainly means he is not fit to be mayor.

 

7 hours ago, grayfields said:

I know he has never actually practiced (or passed the bar), but this guy went to law school? 

 

That is suspicious too. Did he finish law school? And if he did, maybe he not pass the bar. His website is worded very awkwardly and strangely about this. It says, "He later returned to Cleveland to undertake his J.D. and M.B.A. from Case Western Reserve University." One EARNS a JD or ATTENDS law school--one does not "undertake" a JD.  So, the English usage here is so bizarre, one cannot tell what he is saying. He--perhaps very carefully--doesn't say he obtained his JD from Case, as, if he didn't but suggested he did--could be easily be found out by CWRU itself protesting a false claim.  And if he DID get his JD at Case, why not just say so? Maybe because he failed the bar and doesn't want to be called out on that?

 

1 hour ago, Pugu said:

 

I agree--this is very shady. The logic makes absolutely no sense--especially for someone who supposedly went to law school. So he's either cognitively challenged, simply disrespectful of rules, willingly shady, or he  just lacks common sense and judgement. But whichever of the four, it certainly means he is not fit to be mayor.

Y’all are grasping at straws here…it was a form he filled out voluntarily. Do you really think he was trying to mislead people into believing he had no debts or other sources of income other than RTA? 
 

If you want to make a call on his judgment for incorrectly filling it out, then sure. But saying it’s “shady” is a bit much.

9 hours ago, LifeLongClevelander said:

 

The whole idea of Public Square being a "transportation hub" is terribly outdated.  It just happened to be a convenient place for the substantial number of small, independent horse car, cable car (yes, Cleveland had them) and streetcar companies to come together with the four quadrants in the 1880's and 1890's.

So it’s been the City’s transportation hub for 140 years?

 

We went thru all of this when PS was being redesigned. Running the busses around the square would add time, and more importantly significant costs, to an agency that really can’t afford any.

9 hours ago, Pugu said:

 

I agree--this is very shady. The logic makes absolutely no sense--especially for someone who supposedly went to law school. So he's either cognitively challenged, simply disrespectful of rules, willingly shady, or he  just lacks common sense and judgement. But whichever of the four, it certainly means he is not fit to be mayor.

 

 

That is suspicious too. Did he finish law school? And if he did, maybe he not pass the bar. His website is worded very awkwardly and strangely about this. It says, "He later returned to Cleveland to undertake his J.D. and M.B.A. from Case Western Reserve University." One EARNS a JD or ATTENDS law school--one does not "undertake" a JD.  So, the English usage here is so bizarre, one cannot tell what he is saying. He--perhaps very carefully--doesn't say he obtained his JD from Case, as, if he didn't but suggested he did--could be easily be found out by CWRU itself protesting a false claim.  And if he DID get his JD at Case, why not just say so? Maybe because he failed the bar and doesn't want to be called out on that?

 

Obvious shades of "Is Obama a citizen"? "Why won't he show his birth certificate?" And so forth and so on here. And Justin Bibb RECEIVED a JD/MBA from Case which means that he EARNED them.

 

As for whether or not he passed a state bar or practiced law, he doesn't appear licensed in Ohio -- which means he's like hundreds of thousands of other attorneys who utilize their JD's outside of law. 

 

And as for financial disclosure omissions, it's disappointing but I wouldn't consider discrediting. 

8 hours ago, Enginerd said:

Y’all are grasping at straws here…it was a form he filled out voluntarily. Do you really think he was trying to mislead people into believing he had no debts or other sources of income other than RTA? 
 

If you want to make a call on his judgment for incorrectly filling it out, then sure. But saying it’s “shady” is a bit much.

 

 

You think RTA wanted him to fill out a form so RTA knows how much RTA is paying him?  Could Bibb have really thought that?  Its obvious they wanted to know the NON-RTA money he gets. Its only accurate to list the RTA money only if that's the only money he was making. And if its an intentional misinformation and the form was voluntary he should not have filled it out at all which suggests poor judgement. Bibb seems like a smart guy, so something is definitely shady or strange (brain fart?). Maybe acute mental incapacitation But the actual cause doesn't really matter. It happened. He did it for whatever reason. Anyone who wants a clean, minimally corrupt City Hall should not be voting for this guy--for this ethics issue and for other reasons. Think of this ethics filing violation revelation as a good omen---good thing this came out before the election!