Nobody Cares Whether You 'Believe' in the Separation of Church and State. That's the Law, Champ.

Ohio Senate candidate Josh Mandel spewed nonsense about The Founders, probably hoping for an article like this one.

By Jack Holmes

Jan 28, 2022

 

Looking around the Republican farm system, it's hard not to feel an escalating sense of doom for this ball club and the league they play in. Unfortunately, the rest of us are stuck in Major League Batsh*t with these people, a competition in desperate need of a relegation system. Politico enlivened this Friday with a report on an internecine MAGA dispute out of Tennessee, in which the batting champ got himself in hot water with other luminaries of the movement. Apparently, Madison Cawthorn and Candace Owens and Matt Gaetz and Marjorie Taylor Greene are unhappy that Donald Trump backed Morgan Ortagus, whom he once plucked from Fox News to serve as a spokesperson for the State Department, over Robby Starbuck, a MAGA social-media influencer, for a congressional endorsement. Donald Trump Jr. and Dan Scavino are also reportedly mad at Daddy, though not in public, and have you ever heard a list of such abysmally low-quality people exercising this kind of influence over one of our two major political parties? Whoever wins, this country loses.

 

Speaking of which, there's the Ohio Senate primary. J.D. Vance, the venture-capitalist everyman backed by $10 million from a technovampire planting nice little seeds all over our politics, has had to play second fiddle to a more shameless and relentless MAGA devotee in Josh Mandel. This is Mandel's third attempt at becoming a senator from Ohio, and it's not hard to see why the first two campaigns came up short. The guy has Stephen Miller vibes. But in today's Republican Party, he appears to be the frontrunner for the nomination, to the extent that he engaged in what looked like a general-election debate against a prospective Democratic opponent, Morgan Harper, before the primary races have been decided. (Congressman Tim Ryan is also running competitively in the Democratic primary.) On Thursday evening, Mandel at one point suggested that Obama orchestrated a George Soros-funded invasion of Haitians. People in the audience laughed loudly.

 

But we'll leave aside the now-standard immigration hysteria and engage with one piece of Mandel's reactionary exhibition in particular. We have returned, yet again, to the issue of church and state. The issue that will not die, from the corporate Christian push of the 1930s to the online message boards of Web 1.0, the issue that Mandel probably raised in the hopes of generating articles like this one that he can point to as evidence that the Woke Mob is out to Silence him.

 

https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/a38924592/josh-mandel-separation-of-church-and-state-constitution/

 

One phony down, four to go. (Well maybe Gibbons is genuinely that dumb, but the other three are only behaving that way because they think it’ll get them elected. And based on counterpoint Matt Dolan’s polling, they’re probably right. Ugh.)

 

And to Moreno I say ha. Imagine wasting that much money and selling your soul to finish fifth to those clowns. (Or is it sixth?)
 

 

Completely disturbing commentary on the current state of the R party, but simultaneously hilarious 

Trump Fixated on ‘F**king Weird’ Senate Candidate and His Sex Life

 

https://www.thedailybeast.com/trump-fixated-on-ohio-senate-candidate-josh-mandels-sex-life?ref=scroll

(link NSFW)

 

Important to note that, at least as far as I know, none of the JM sex-life gossip he is spewing has been corroborated in any meaningful way. 
 

He’s right on the charisma-free part. 
 

“There are a few key reasons why the twice-impeached former president hasn’t yet endorsed Mandel or anybody else in that race. One reason for the hold-up is that Trump—who has long been addicted to dishing tabloid-style gossip and dirt—has for months told people close to him that he thinks Mandel is a charisma-free weirdo and dork, according to three sources who’ve spoken to Trump about Mandel and the Ohio contest since last year.”

 

Trump's right about that!

https://www.cleveland.com/news/2022/02/rob-portman-endorses-jane-timken-in-ohio-republican-us-senate-primary.html

 

Hate that Portman chose Timken over Dolan.  This probably ends Dolan's chances.  Any idea why Portman chose an avid Trump supporter who at one moment supports Anthony Gonzalez then at the next calls on him to resign. 

It's disconcerting that people who obviously have the resources and insights into such things (Timken, Portman, Vance, Thiel, etc.) have concluded the Trump agenda is the winning strategy in Ohio. 

 

Timken might be the lowest energy politician I've ever seen in this ad.

1 hour ago, DarkandStormy said:

 

Timken might be the lowest energy politician I've ever seen in this ad.

 I love that she's hitting below the belt (literally).  

Hopefully Tim Ryan proves more than "adequate" and can keep her Trump Führerprinzip policies out of Ohio.  Democrats need to show up in droves.   

2 hours ago, DarkandStormy said:

 

Timken might be the lowest energy politician I've ever seen in this ad.

DJ’s response nailed it:

 

 

Israel was founded in 1948.

 

Not sure what Harper and Mandel think they're accomplishing here.

1 hour ago, DarkandStormy said:

 

Not sure what Harper and Mandel think they're accomplishing here.

 

Mandel gets to play to his base and Harper gets media attention that she could never possibly get otherwise. It's all just playing the game.

"'I told the story earlier about being at a town hall, the bar and restaurant down the street, where I told folks, "I'm going to date Morgan Harper. She's like AOC only smarter." After hearing that answer I actually think she's like AOC only dumber,.."

 

Got a feeling the Ratners will be sending another open letter (hey, it's only been ten years since the last). If Bruce had any balls, he'd openly disown his scumbag son too. 

On 2/18/2022 at 10:08 AM, DarkandStormy said:

 

Timken might be the lowest energy politician I've ever seen in this ad.

Still at a loss of how Portman could endorse this.

31 minutes ago, cle_guy90 said:

Still at a loss of how Portman could endorse this.

Because he is a political  prostitute? Just throw them all away, somewhere off the planet.

2 hours ago, Toddguy said:

Because he is a political  prostitute? Just throw them all away, somewhere off the planet.

I guess the text of the race is: emasculation. 

Edited February 23, 20223 yr by westerninterloper

3 hours ago, cle_guy90 said:

Still at a loss of how Portman could endorse this.

Because she her and Dolan are the most reasonable in the group. Just because she has to cut an ad pandering to the Trump base to win does not put her in the same vein as mandel or Gibbons. 

31 minutes ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

Because she her and Dolan are the most reasonable in the group. Just because she has to cut an ad pandering to the Trump base to win does not put her in the same vein as mandel or Gibbons. 

So, you are admitting the base is a now a bunch of lunatics and in order to keep them on board, you have to pander to the lowest point possible. Makes me feel REALLY better about the "reasonable" wing of the Republican Party, smh.

 

Quit trying to rationalize and defend this stuff. ... unless it's really what you want. If so, just admit it. Same goes for Portman, DeWine or any other "reasonable" Republican. I'll leave Kasich out because he is one of the few who kept to his "conservative" morals. Which in this day in age makes him a leftist radical RINO within that party.

Just now, Rando Sinclair said:

So, you are admitting the base is a now a bunch of lunatics and in order to keep them on board, you have to pander to the lowest point possible. Makes me feel REALLY better about the "reasonable" wing of the Republican Party, smh.

 

Quit trying to rationalize and defend this stuff. ... unless it's really what you want. If so, just admit it. Same goes for Portman, DeWine or any other "reasonable" Republican. I'll leave Kasich out because he is one of the few who kept to his "conservative" morals. Which in this day in age makes him a leftist radical RINO within that party.

Not trying to rationalize. Portman was a great senator and served Ohio well. I wish we had him for another term. Timken and Dolan are reasonable figures too. But when each party has to cater to their lunatic fringes you see this. I am sure their are many dems that have to cater to their lunatic fringes given the social media reach of buffoons like aoc. It does not do rational dems any favors in those cases too

6 minutes ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

Not trying to rationalize. Portman was a great senator and served Ohio well. I wish we had him for another term. Timken and Dolan are reasonable figures too. But when each party has to cater to their lunatic fringes you see this. I am sure their are many dems that have to cater to their lunatic fringes given the social media reach of buffoons like aoc. It does not do rational dems any favors in those cases too

Ohio used to be a state where sticking to your morals (whether Dem or Republican) gave you the best shot. Not anymore. It's the college football, NASCAR, Ricky Bobby "if you not first you're last" mindset now on the right. Funny that Sherrod Brown, who has always been knocked as a liberal leftist with a Commie wife even before MAGA took over the GOP, never had to pander to the "left fringe" to win a primary in what is a becoming a political cesspool of a state. He's been running (and winning) on the same platform for about 30 years.

 

Ironically, Brown and Trump (who all these GOP candidates are trying to emulate) somehow share a lot of the same voters. Makes no sense, other than these GOP candidates (whether reasonable or not) either have no backbone, or the majority of the GOP is now what you described as the fringe of that party.

6 minutes ago, Rando Sinclair said:

Ohio used to be a state where sticking to your morals (whether Dem or Republican) gave you the best shot. Not anymore. It's the college football, NASCAR, Ricky Bobby "if you not first you're last" mindset now on the right. Funny that Sherrod Brown, who has always been knocked as a liberal leftist with a Commie wife even before MAGA took over the GOP, never had to pander to the "left fringe" to win a primary in what is a becoming a political cesspool of a state. He's been running (and winning) on the same platform for about 30 years.

 

Ironically, Brown and Trump (who all these GOP candidates are trying to emulate) somehow share a lot of the same voters. Makes no sense, other than these GOP candidates (whether reasonable or not) either have no backbone, or the majority of the GOP is now what you described as the fringe of that party.

I dont get the loyalty to Trump. I think someone needs to stand up and pretty much come out and say he is a loser, which he is. He is no longer in power and only commands control because people let him.  

 

 

1 minute ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

I dont get the loyalty to Trump. I think someone needs to stand up and pretty much come out and say he is a loser, which he is. He is no longer in power and only commands control because people let him.  

 

 

Exactly, to be transparent I'm a Dem (left leaning socially though more toward the middle fiscally, so understand how that is a bit of a contradiction), but I just do not get the Trump loyalty either. He has the party (and his followers) fooled. It's crazy how much I have defended Kasich the last couple years to so-called Republicans.

 

It's really up to people like you, if you really are a middle-of-the ground "reasonable" Republican to take that stand against MAGA and take the party back, not let it be run to the ground only to defend it by saying "you have to cater to the base."

3 minutes ago, Rando Sinclair said:

I have defended Kasich the last couple years to so-called Republicans.

I liked Kasich back in 2016 but from what I have heard personally he is a bit of a self serving jerk as a person. (but really so are most pols). I respect that he stuck to his guns back in 2016, but I do feel he should have faded away in teh background and preserved his voice. I think he should have backed down and not necessarily supported Trump, but backed off the rhetoric over his 4 years and saved a chance to emerge in the future with his ideas. Unfortunately, he ruined his chances.

 

8 minutes ago, Rando Sinclair said:

not let it be run to the ground only to defend it by saying "you have to cater to the base."

You have to cater to the base in the primary, after that you run to the middle and govern toward the middle. We hope. I think there are two types of candidates who are running on the MAGA platform. You have those like Gibbons who truly believe it and then the insincere ones like Timken who are just doing it because the focus group polling said she needed too. 

I used to feel ok about  Vance until he decided to hold a rally with MTG. 

31 minutes ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

I dont get the loyalty to Trump. I think someone needs to stand up and pretty much come out and say he is a loser, which he is. He is no longer in power and only commands control because people let him.  

 

 

 

Hey, this is right!  Too bad the "moderate wing" of the GOP is full of spineless people that say stuff like:

 

12 minutes ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

I respect that he stuck to his guns back in 2016, but I do feel he should have faded away in teh background and preserved his voice. I think he should have backed down and not necessarily supported Trump, but backed off the rhetoric over his 4 years and saved a chance to emerge in the future with his ideas. Unfortunately, he ruined his chances.

 

...and...

 

1 hour ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

Not trying to rationalize. Portman was a great senator and served Ohio well. I wish we had him for another term. Timken and Dolan are reasonable figures too. But when each party has to cater to their lunatic fringes you see this. I am sure their are many dems that have to cater to their lunatic fringes given the social media reach of buffoons like aoc. It does not do rational dems any favors in those cases too

 

Brutus has met the enemy, and it is him.

10 hours ago, Rando Sinclair said:

It's really up to people like you, if you really are a middle-of-the ground "reasonable" Republican to take that stand against MAGA and take the party back, not let it be run to the ground only to defend it by saying "you have to cater to the base."

But let's face it. the moderate wing or the independents or "middle" do not vote in primaries, which is why candidates have to tack hard to their left of right. Not to pick on you but for example, you described yourself above as fiscally conservative but socially liberal. You sound a bit like a Tim Ryan type of guy. But hypothetically, lets assume you have a Senate race where you have Bernie Sanders running on the Dem noimination against say a Dennis Kucincich and you have Kasich (whom you said you liked) running against Mandel and Renacci. Would you, as a moderate Democrat, be inclined to vote in the Republican primary to help push Kasich or would you be more aloof to what is happening on the GOP side and only wait until the candidate is settled to then support Kasich over say Bernie Sanders in a Senate race?

 

Because that is the problem running to the middle in the primary, you need to draw the independent support or the moderate side of the other party to make up for the base that feels alienated by the RINO or DINO. 

This is embarrassing. One of these guys will likely be our next US senator 😳

 

 

"This is so great. We really need a senator that's going to get right in the face of those weak liberals."

-Ohio Republican voter 

I'm NOT enthused by him, but seeing this I'm donating some money to Tim Ryan.   I hope the turnout is there to at least put him close. 

14 minutes ago, Cleburger said:

I'm enthused by him, but seeing this I'm donating some money to Tim Ryan.   I hope the turnout is there to at least put him close. 

Enthused by whom?

Dolan is the only R who isn’t completely embarrassing themselves. I still wouldn’t vote for him, but that’s only policy issues, not character issues. 

 

My opinion is that Tim Ryan is the only person running for Senate who can win that I’m excited about. Episodes like this standoff are good for Ryan. 

10 minutes ago, Boomerang_Brian said:

Enthused by whom?

Dolan is the only R who isn’t completely embarrassing themselves. I still wouldn’t vote for him, but that’s only policy issues, not character issues. 

 

My opinion is that Tim Ryan is the only person running for Senate who can win that I’m excited about. Episodes like this standoff are good for Ryan. 

This was a typo on my part, which I have just edited.  It should have said I'm NOT enthused by Tim Ryan, but gave him money anyway.  

 

I'm with you anything is better than these race-to-the-bottom Trumplicans. 

On 1/10/2022 at 3:18 PM, YABO713 said:

 

It's not the Reichstag, you're right. But @E RoccI'm still proudly Conservative and I disagree. While I'd love to see every brick throwing hippy in Portland behind bars, where they belong - you have to recognize the difference in the 2. 

 

BLM spiraled out of control following a spate of police killings of black individuals. The ends of these protests were at times horrific, destroying property and lives. However, this frustration spilled from a genuine conviction that blacks are being killed at a disproportionately high rate at the hands of police. 

 

The Capitol riots were the result of a lie. A wholly unsubstantiated claim that an election was stolen, with the intent of stopping an election from being certified. 

 

Civil unrest and riots happen in democracies - despite how wrong they are. But violence as a means of overturning an election does not. There's a serious difference here at the root of both examples - and it's critical to understand that. 

 

Having said that - I will only vote for Matt Dolan out of this current field in OH GOP. For me, saying we need to overturn the last election - which Mandel, Vance, Moreno, Timken (lite) Gibbons (lite) - have all stated is disqualifying for me. 

 

I donated to Gibbons - I was let down. 

I met with Vance and had a long conversation with him about how dangerous MAGAism is for our country in November of 2019 - he is a complete morally bankrupt fraud. 

I donated to Timken - She folded to Mandel's pressure. 

Mandel is a complete and utter lunatic who will say anything to rally the furthest edges of the fringes. 

 

Matt Dolan is my only option left - and I know I'm not alone. Ohio will have two blue senators come 2022 if Mandel gets the nod. And it's all in the name of "owning the libs" rather than legislating. 

 

The irony here is Dolan is my current first choice.   That's part of why.   I'm open to Moreno.  Mandel and Timken are too trumpy.   

 

No way do I vote for a Democrat for Senate though, even though I'd seriously consider Ryan for governor against Dewine.   Not with the current crowd running the Senate Dem caucus.

On 2/22/2022 at 10:09 PM, Brutus_buckeye said:

I dont get the loyalty to Trump. I think someone needs to stand up and pretty much come out and say he is a loser, which he is. He is no longer in power and only commands control because people let him.  

 

 

 

He's basically a con man.   He did some good things as President, and some not so good things.   The former was a mix of hiring some good people (Mattis, who eventually left in frustration) and being pointed in the right direction.

The fight was embarrassing.... but I don't think Gibbobs did anything wrong, honestly. Mandel is just a GIANT clown

20 minutes ago, YABO713 said:

The fight was embarrassing.... but I don't think Gibbobs did anything wrong, honestly. Mandel is just a GIANT clown

Agreed. While I am not really a fan of Gibbons, he was acting reasonably and Mandel looked a bit unhinged. 

Dolan or bust for me at this point^

2 hours ago, YABO713 said:

Dolan or bust for me at this point^

Agreed - but I hate his radio commercials

I don’t know much about Dolan down here in Columbus, just that he has the vibe of a suburban high school assistant principal. Our local TV is inundated with GOP ads for this race - each candidate is trying to outdo each other on their love of Trump. Mandel and Gibbons are just idiots though….

On the one hand, I don’t think Dolan has a chance in the R primary. On the other hand, with everyone else fighting for the same lane, maybe there’s an opening for Dolan for something like a 35% plurality win. 

13 hours ago, Pablo said:

I don’t know much about Dolan down here in Columbus, just that he has the vibe of a suburban high school assistant principal. Our local TV is inundated with GOP ads for this race - each candidate is trying to outdo each other on their love of Trump. Mandel and Gibbons are just idiots though….

Dolan is running in the Anti Trump lane for sure. It may be a good strategy to try and split the vote but I do not think enough non-Trumpers will likely vote in the primary. Heck, FWIW, I rarely vote in primaries. Usually, it takes an issue like a school levy or something like that to get me to vote in a primary, but that is just me. 

 

Dolan is comes from a well heeled Cleveland family. His family owns the Tribe. He is very much an establishment type figure and tends to be a much more pragmatic figure. He came from the prosecutors office. He is the adult in the room type personality.

2 hours ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

Dolan is running in the Anti Trump lane for sure. It may be a good strategy to try and split the vote but I do not think enough non-Trumpers will likely vote in the primary. Heck, FWIW, I rarely vote in primaries. Usually, it takes an issue like a school levy or something like that to get me to vote in a primary, but that is just me. 

 

Dolan is comes from a well heeled Cleveland family. His family owns the Tribe. He is very much an establishment type figure and tends to be a much more pragmatic figure. He came from the prosecutors office. He is the adult in the room type personality.

Dolan certainly came off as the adult in last night's GOP debate. 

The thing that I find most fascinating is that even though NE Ohio tends to be a pretty liberal bastion and SW has been much more conservative but if you look at Republican politics over the last 20 years it is still dominated by NE Ohio Republicans. Husted, Larose, Renacci, Mandel, Gibbons, Dolan, are all current prominent players with NE Ohio roots. While certainly there are other Republicans from Central and SW Ohio who win office (Portman and Dewine being 2 for example) it seems that NE Ohio punches above its weight in Republican state politics. 

 

2 hours ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

Dolan is running in the Anti Trump lane for sure. It may be a good strategy to try and split the vote but I do not think enough non-Trumpers will likely vote in the primary. Heck, FWIW, I rarely vote in primaries. Usually, it takes an issue like a school levy or something like that to get me to vote in a primary, but that is just me. 

 

Dolan is comes from a well heeled Cleveland family. His family owns the Tribe. He is very much an establishment type figure and tends to be a much more pragmatic figure. He came from the prosecutors office. He is the adult in the room type personality.

Has anyone seen any Democrat rumblings to vote in the GOP primary for Dolan to try to knock the Trumpy candidates out?  

15 minutes ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

The thing that I find most fascinating is that even though NE Ohio tends to be a pretty liberal bastion and SW has been much more conservative but if you look at Republican politics over the last 20 years it is still dominated by NE Ohio Republicans. Husted, Larose, Renacci, Mandel, Gibbons, Dolan, are all current prominent players with NE Ohio roots. While certainly there are other Republicans from Central and SW Ohio who win office (Portman and Dewine being 2 for example) it seems that NE Ohio punches above its weight in Republican state politics. 

 

Husted grew up in NW Ohio and got his political start in Dayton.

56 minutes ago, Cleburger said:

Has anyone seen any Democrat rumblings to vote in the GOP primary for Dolan to try to knock the Trumpy candidates out?  

Way too important to make sure the D side is Nan Whaley and NOT John Cranley. 

7 hours ago, Cleburger said:

Has anyone seen any Democrat rumblings to vote in the GOP primary for Dolan to try to knock the Trumpy candidates out?  

That, currently, is my plan. 

On 3/22/2022 at 1:36 PM, Boomerang_Brian said:

Way too important to make sure the D side is Nan Whaley and NOT John Cranley. 

Does it even matter with the way Ohio is leaning Trumplican? 

23 minutes ago, Cleburger said:

Does it even matter with the way Ohio is leaning Trumplican? 

 

Not for the Senate.   As long as the "progressives" are perceived as being in charge nationally, the GOP nominee will reinforce said perception and barring a catastrophe of Fitzgerald proportions should win.

 

Governor is more up in the air, but this is going to be a Republican year in general.

1 hour ago, E Rocc said:

 

Not for the Senate.   As long as the "progressives" are perceived as being in charge nationally, the GOP nominee will reinforce said perception and barring a catastrophe of Fitzgerald proportions should win.

 

Governor is more up in the air, but this is going to be a Republican year in general.

Agree with that assessment but with a caveat. In my opinion, I think a tuna sandwich would win Portman's seat this year with an R behind their name. So while that bodes well for a person like Gibbons or Mandel, it does not necessarily mean that will be the same calculus when they run for re-election in 2028. If you are looking for someone who will win multiple terms in any electoral environment, I think Dolan is the best person for that. 

 

I got a Gibbons mailer yesterday and was surprised it didn't have "Tr**p*" written anywhere on it. It seemed like some of the unhinged stuff was even toned down a little bit. Trying to pivot to the general?   🤦‍♂️

 

Contrarily, Timken's mailer actually had the former guy all over it.

Edited April 3, 20223 yr by mu2010