December 8, 20222 yr 53 minutes ago, tj111 said: Also it turns what would be a beautiful park / river / downtown vista when coming down Detroit into a giant billboard / ugly building. Well yes, but IIRC one of the offers to the Georges was to allow them to keep the billboard since they claim it is one of the most valuable locations for a billboard in Ohio. If that's what it takes to get this park done, so be it, the park would still be transformative for the area. But obviously the Georges are not good faith actors and they turned that offer down (it involved another billboard along 480 too FWIW...). Port of Cleveland lays groundwork for eminent domain at Irishtown Bend MICHELLE JARBOE September 09, 2021 03:13 PM Quote Tony George described the corner as a prime development site, topped off by "one of the more profitable billboards in Northeast Ohio." During the port's board meeting, he said that nobody has ever made a formal offer to buy the property. Quote A draft memorandum of understanding obtained by Crain's outlines a city proposal to give the Georges a new billboard site along Interstate 480 in Warrensville Heights, along with an easement to erect a new billboard on the West 25th parcel once the building is razed. That proposal describes a trade, in which the Georges would donate their property to an affiliate of West Creek Conservancy, the Irishtown Bend project partner holding land on the hillside. Asked about the document, Tony George said "that's not what I want. That's what they want. That's not an offer." https://www.crainscleveland.com/real-estate/port-cleveland-lays-groundwork-eminent-domain-irishtown-bend Edited December 8, 20222 yr by Luke_S Link to story added
December 8, 20222 yr Why in the world would the port authority not have bought this property right away, when they knew they needed it? Couldn't they have averted this whole mess? The George's are definitely being sleazy, but the port authority bears part of the blame in my opinion for not having some foresight.
December 8, 20222 yr 37 minutes ago, Milkshake1 said: Why in the world would the port authority not have bought this property right away, when they knew they needed it? Couldn't they have averted this whole mess? The George's are definitely being sleazy, but the port authority bears part of the blame in my opinion for not having some foresight. They tried... They offered the Georges $360k for the site. Property records show the Georges purchased to parcel for $248,300 in 2018, but that excludes the billboard cost of $851,800. In 2020 CMSD valued the market value of the land and building at $350k. https://www.crainscleveland.com/real-estate/port-cleveland-offer-georges-360000-contested-corner-above-irishtown-bend So the Georges could have come out with a $100k gain on the sale of the land and building and retained the billboard, which is what they say they value.
December 8, 20222 yr is that really what billboards are worth?! I always thought they were dirt cheap to own lol. I don't know what you can charge advertisers for billboard ads but that has to be quite a long ROI timeline at that price.
December 9, 20222 yr 21 hours ago, Luke_S said: They tried... They offered the Georges $360k for the site. Property records show the Georges purchased to parcel for $248,300 in 2018, but that excludes the billboard cost of $851,800. In 2020 CMSD valued the market value of the land and building at $350k. https://www.crainscleveland.com/real-estate/port-cleveland-offer-georges-360000-contested-corner-above-irishtown-bend So the Georges could have come out with a $100k gain on the sale of the land and building and retained the billboard, which is what they say they value. The county (or port authority?) had the chance to buy the property in 2018 when the Georges did. If you go way upthread you'll see discussion of that, and it's definitely true someone was asleep at the switch when the property came up for sale. Doesn't change the fact that what the Georges are doing is just the tackiest way to make money. Legal, but gross and no one should feel bad for calling them out for this shameless money grab at the public's expense.
December 9, 20222 yr Complaining about the Georges on Urban Ohio doesn't do any good. If you're upset about their behavior vis-a-vis Irishtown bend distribute pamphlets or talk to people outside of Townhall. That might put some pressure on the Georges to do get rid of the property. Complaining about them on this site has been done plenty and will accomplish nothing. (As per usual if you're going to protest, be smart, try to persuade, stick to one topic, and don't be annoying)
December 9, 20222 yr 59 minutes ago, Ethan said: Complaining about the Georges on Urban Ohio doesn't do any good. If you're upset about their behavior vis-a-vis Irishtown bend distribute pamphlets or talk to people outside of Townhall. That might put some pressure on the Georges to do get rid of the property. Complaining about them on this site has been done plenty and will accomplish nothing. (As per usual if you're going to protest, be smart, try to persuade, stick to one topic, and don't be annoying) think they would let us rent out a nice big message on that billboard about it??
December 9, 20222 yr 53 minutes ago, dwolfi01 said: think they would let us rent out a nice big message on that billboard about it?? Actually, they might. People who own billboards don't necessarily control the messaging on them, an advertising company does. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
December 9, 20222 yr Complaining about the Georges on Urban Ohio doesn't do any good. If you're upset about their behavior vis-a-vis Irishtown bend distribute pamphlets or talk to people outside of Townhall. That might put some pressure on the Georges to do get rid of the property. Complaining about them on this site has been done plenty and will accomplish nothing. (As per usual if you're going to protest, be smart, try to persuade, stick to one topic, and don't be annoying)Pamphlets are a great ideaSent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
January 23, 20232 yr Fight over key property in Irishtown Bend redevelopment has cost the public more than $1.6 million https://signalcleveland.org/fight-over-key-property-in-irishtown-bend-redevelopment-has-cost-the-public-more-than-1-6-million/ George's quote (through a lawyer) “The George family purchased this property in 2018 simply because they wanted to continue to contribute to the exciting and transformational development happening along W. 25th Street,” the statement read. “The Georges are not, and never have been, opposed to the Park or the Project. The George family remains hopeful that there can be a resolution that is fair to all parties and furthers the parties’ shared vision for an even more vibrant, exciting, and accessible neighborhood.”
January 23, 20232 yr Ah yes the age old way to "continue to contribute to the exciting and transformational development" by impeding said transformational development just so you can make a quick buck. Makes total sense.
January 23, 20232 yr quicker this is over the cheaper it will be I’m surprised they were more willing to sink millions of tax dollars into attorney fees instead of making a better offer
January 23, 20232 yr Sure they're not opposed to the Park as long as they can sell their little corner for many times what they paid for it. Their civic virtue is mind-blowing. Gee if l didn't know any better I'd have thought that property has been in the family for generations. Classic carpetbaggers.
January 24, 20232 yr 15 hours ago, BoomerangCleRes said: quicker this is over the cheaper it will be I’m surprised they were more willing to sink millions of tax dollars into attorney fees instead of making a better offer I'd imagine their plan is to recoup legal fees from the George family.
January 27, 20232 yr I apologize if this has already been posted elsewhere; mods feel free to remove this if that’s the case. New county executive Chris Ronayne is proposing renovating the lower level of the Veterans Memorial Bridge where street cars used to travel. The idea would be to convert it into a pedestrian/bike-only path (similar to NYC’s High Line) that would help connect Ohio City and the West Side to downtown. This could complement the eventual Irishtown Bend Park quite well since one would lead directly to the other if on foot or bike. Also, attached here is a 2011 study done by the NOACA on essentially the same idea with images on how it would co-exist with the Irishtown Bend Park. They projected it to cost $11.4m at the time, but I’d imagine the cost would be higher today.
January 27, 20232 yr 5 hours ago, BuckeyeNative said: I apologize if this has already been posted elsewhere; mods feel free to remove this if that’s the case. New county executive Chris Ronayne is proposing renovating the lower level of the Veterans Memorial Bridge where street cars used to travel. The idea would be to convert it into a pedestrian/bike-only path (similar to NYC’s High Line) that would help connect Ohio City and the West Side to downtown. This could complement the eventual Irishtown Bend Park quite well since one would lead directly to the other if on foot or bike. Also, attached here is a 2011 study done by the NOACA on essentially the same idea with images on how it would co-exist with the Irishtown Bend Park. They projected it to cost $11.4m at the time, but I’d imagine the cost would be higher today. This is exactly the right approach. Expanding options without restricting the existing options. Let people choose without being "nudged".
January 27, 20232 yr 7 hours ago, BuckeyeNative said: I apologize if this has already been posted elsewhere; mods feel free to remove this if that’s the case. New county executive Chris Ronayne is proposing renovating the lower level of the Veterans Memorial Bridge where street cars used to travel. The idea would be to convert it into a pedestrian/bike-only path (similar to NYC’s High Line) that would help connect Ohio City and the West Side to downtown. This could complement the eventual Irishtown Bend Park quite well since one would lead directly to the other if on foot or bike. Also, attached here is a 2011 study done by the NOACA on essentially the same idea with images on how it would co-exist with the Irishtown Bend Park. They projected it to cost $11.4m at the time, but I’d imagine the cost would be higher today. I don't like the idea at all. Why can't they bring back street cars or keep the idea as a bike/running path?? I could see it lit up at night with real funky colors that people could enjoy from miles away.
January 27, 20232 yr I think this would be great to connect Irishtown Bend Park and the Canal Basin Park across the river via a pedestrian path. I would love to be able to run some type of a loop around there as another one of my usual running routes.
January 27, 20232 yr 2 hours ago, jbee1982 said: I don't like the idea at all. Why can't they bring back street cars or keep the idea as a bike/running path?? I could see it lit up at night with real funky colors that people could enjoy from miles away. How does a pedestrian/bike only path differ from a bike/running path? Whenever a question starts with "why can't they" the rea$on is u$ually the $ame.
January 27, 20232 yr I don't like the idea at all. Why can't they bring back street cars or keep the idea as a bike/running path?? I could see it lit up at night with real funky colors that people could enjoy from miles away. Where are the streetcars coming from? I guess you can use the order we have but where is the money coming from to lay the infrastructure? RTA is scrapping up crumbs to be able to get new trains ordered on top of having to figure out how to reconfigure the platforms to make sure it’s unified properly. You have to be realistic with these types of things and until ridership on our already existing 3/4 lines picks up substantially it doesn’t warrant a new line being added. This allows this space to be reactivated, could be quite the attraction for the region and tourists if done well and connects downtown to a major upcoming project, Irishtown Bend. I think it’s a win win. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
February 22, 20232 yr The court of appeals has scheduled oral arguments for March 28, 2023. While I hope I’m wrong, due to the multiple parties and many issues before the court, I don’t anticipate a ruling until summer or maybe even early fall.
February 22, 20232 yr Will there be any work at all done to the hillside while we wait or is it at a total standstill now until this is settled? I like that they removed all the trees and I would have hoped they could have started on some basic dirt moving to get it prepped at least but idk what can even be done until this is decided.
February 23, 20232 yr They can work around it. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
February 23, 20232 yr 1 minute ago, cadmen said: ^ Yes but will they? Part of me feels like they have to, since removing the trees makes the hillside more susceptible to erosion, but unfortunately, we aren't see any proof that anything is / will be taking place.
February 23, 20232 yr Yes l tend to agree. The dye is cast so to speak. The hillside HAS to be stabilized so that will get done. All the previous growth has been cut down so it will be impossible to just leave it like that after the stabilization takes place. Something will be done. Some kind of civic space will result. But thanks to the selfishness of the family George we will just have to wait awhile longer to see what exactly. And waiting is something we surely have experience with in this town.
March 10, 20232 yr Irishtown Bend construction could begin this summer as Port of Cleveland hires firm to oversee project "The Cleveland-Cuyahoga County Port Authority’s board approved a $3.6 million contract Thursday morning with civil engineering firm Wade Trim, Inc., to oversee the project. The port will go out to bid in April for a construction team, according to Linda Sternheimer, the agency’s director of urban planning and engagement. ... The port has warned that the unstable hillside could pose a danger to people and shipping traffic on the river. The agency has spent years raising money for the $54 million project, which will steady the hillside and turn the land into a public park. ... Meanwhile, the port and Metroparks together have spent at least $1.6 million in a lengthy court battle with businessman Tony George over a piece of land atop the hill. George and his son Bobby own a vacant building and large billboard at West 25th Street and Detroit Avenue." https://signalcleveland.org/irishtown-bend-construction-could-begin-this-summer-as-port-of-cleveland-hires-firm-to-oversee-project/
March 10, 20232 yr I like this news a lot. Move things forward and don’t let the George’s affect the momentum of this wonderful project!
March 13, 20232 yr Probably good this density doesn’t exist anymore as it would’ve probably been victim to a mudslide by now but cool to see
March 13, 20232 yr Probably good this density doesn’t exist anymore as it would’ve probably been victim to a mudslide by now but cool to see Still makes me sad to see all of these gone. But I’m a sucker for density lol. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
March 14, 20232 yr 9 hours ago, MyPhoneDead said: Still makes me sad to see all of these gone. But I’m a sucker for density lol. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Shed no tears. My grandmother was born in The Angle and said it was the worst slum you can imagine. Remember: It's the Year of the Snake
March 14, 20232 yr 10 hours ago, Dougal said: Shed no tears. My grandmother was born in The Angle and said it was the worst slum you can imagine. Mostly tarpaper shacks, but it does look like there were a few nicer masonry structures down there.
March 14, 20232 yr Current day. Interesting to see that Carter Rd used to be railroad tracks. Such a density(and poverty)! Would be hard to prove what it once looked like without historical pictures.
March 14, 20232 yr 19 hours ago, BoomerangCleRes said: Probably good this density doesn’t exist anymore as it would’ve probably been victim to a mudslide by now but cool to see Nuts that there are homes right on the tracks.
March 14, 20232 yr 10 hours ago, Dougal said: Shed no tears. My grandmother was born in The Angle and said it was the worst slum you can imagine. My dad's paternal grandparents moved from the Angle to 61st after waves of anti-Irish violence resulted in the deaths of some loved ones. Wild that moving from 25th to 61st was considered "escaping" back then
March 14, 20232 yr 2 hours ago, YABO713 said: Nuts that there are homes right on the tracks. You can find similar scenes in lots of smaller towns to this day.
March 14, 20232 yr 52 minutes ago, X said: You can find similar scenes in lots of smaller towns to this day. I lived next door to some homes that were about this close in Lakewood! It’s certainly an experience hearing the train come by at night.
March 17, 20232 yr I can't remember if this has been here before but I don't recall seeing it.Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
March 17, 20232 yr 35 minutes ago, MyPhoneDead said: I can't remember if this has been here before but I don't recall seeing it. Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk I drive by that on a weekly basis, that’s a very recent arrival 👍 clevelandskyscrapers.com Cleveland Skyscrapers on Instagram
March 19, 20232 yr The demo was only recently approved at Landmarks Feb. 23rd meeting, so they are really hopping on this. My only hope is that the demo contractors paper work gets messed up and they accidently wander over to the George property and tear that building down as well. Edited March 19, 20232 yr by Htsguy
March 20, 20232 yr On 3/14/2023 at 12:16 PM, YABO713 said: Nuts that there are homes right on the tracks. you might wanna visit hanoi! https://www.instagram.com/reel/ClrD6OiA-tF/?igshid=YmMyMTA2M2Y=
March 20, 20232 yr Seems like the demolition is off to a bad start https://www.instagram.com/reel/CqBrwzJuz4D/?igshid=YmMyMTA2M2Y=
March 20, 20232 yr It’s not uncommon for fire departments to do training in structures slated for demolition soon. Suspect that is the case here.
March 21, 20232 yr 1 hour ago, JohnSummit said: It’s not uncommon for fire departments to do training in structures slated for demolition soon. Suspect that is the case here. Its literally on fire for the 2nd time today as I type this Edited March 21, 20232 yr by ogibbigo
March 21, 20232 yr Except that there's a bulldozer parked very close to the building. And it's a raging inferno right now. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
March 21, 20232 yr Irishtown bend news. https://www.wkyc.com/article/news/local/cleveland/demolition-cleveland-irishtown-bend-park-project-begins-this-week/95-cb8529a6-c4b9-4027-bcaa-cda86df99d52
March 21, 20232 yr Yeah drove by just now on the way home lots of fire trucks and they were actively spraying water from above from the ladder. Smelled really bad and lots of ash in the air. Timing seems rather coincidental that's it's been vacant this whole time and the week they were tearing it down it catches fire.
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