May 24, 20223 yr 18 minutes ago, KJP said: Guardians suitor, real estate may not happen By Ken Prendergast / May 23, 2022 According to sources, there is a reason why NEOtrans first started hearing a lot about Bedrock-HBSE joint development near the Gateway sports complex, and then heard nothing. That void was filled by new activity surrounding Bedrock Real Estate’s interest in the riverfront below Tower City Center instead. MORE: https://neo-trans.blog/2022/05/23/guardians-suitor-real-estate-may-not-happen/ This is not good news, I still hope it goes thru. I feel like i got left at the altar for a new fling (Chelsea, Broncos)
May 24, 20223 yr 26 minutes ago, simplythis said: This is not good news, I still hope it goes thru. I feel like i got left at the altar for a new fling (Chelsea, Broncos) I don't know ...having a Guardians owner that is part owner of three or four (or more) other major sports franchises never appealed to me as a fan. Is this a selfish viewpoint on my part? Someone smarter, please point out the fallacy in my thinking.
May 24, 20223 yr 13 hours ago, DO_Summers said: I don't know ...having a Guardians owner that is part owner of three or four (or more) other major sports franchises never appealed to me as a fan. Is this a selfish viewpoint on my part? Someone smarter, please point out the fallacy in my thinking. I don't think there's anything fallacious about your thinking, but if I was to look on the bright side, I'd say it's a good thing to have one's favorite sports team owned by someone (or some company) with a diversified asset base. The era of "family owned" sports teams like the Dolans/Guardians (or the Mike Brown/Cincinnati Bengals) scenario where said family is heavily dependent on the team's cash flow from a personal wealth/income standpoint is coming to a rapid close. Granted, a small market baseball team is always going to fade into the background of an ownership portfolio containing, say, NFL and/or EPL franchises, but at least you'd avoid the low lows that us 'Dians fans experienced in 2017-21, where the team payroll fell off a cliff from about $130M/season to about $50M. It used to be that "out of town" owners produced an ominous gulp amongst fans in smaller markets like CLE/PIT/CIN. But I'm not sure that's the case anymore. For all the faults of folks like Dan Gilbert and Jimmy Haslam, they have not skimped on building up the value of the Cavs and Browns, respectively. Meanwhile, it was "hometown" owner Art Modell of Waite Hill that moved the crown jewel of the Cleveland sports scene to Baltimore because he had all his eggs in the Browns/Municipal Stadium basket and was basically bankrupted by 1995.
May 24, 20223 yr No, no, no, no no. If HBSE is no longer interested in buying the baseball team that is very bad news. From the description of the principle 's behind the company I viewed then as a white knight coming to our rescue. And not just a white knight but a perfect white knight. Dolan has no money or at least no money to invest in the team or in the area surrounding the ballpark. HBSE are a company with expertise in real estate AND entertainment. They have plenty of money. They can inject that money into the team payroll. They can build a ballpark village and fill it with new residences AND new entertainment facilities on a grand scale. Combined with Bedrock's plans for the adjacent land along the river the land around the ballpark and the arena would be injected with life we haven't seen in downtown in quite awhile. If HBSE pulls out I think it will be a major blow. When Dolan does finally find a new partner to sell to I'm sure, other than being able to inject some cash into the team, they will have neither the interest nor the expertise to develop the area around the ballpark in the fashion that HBSE can. This is a very disappointing turn of events if true.
May 24, 20223 yr i dk what dolan thinks? that they will get any better partner? it must have been the deal itself as these folks are obviously big sports fans and seem more than capable partners and future owners. maybe they can still work it out. otherwise, it's a shame as it would seem to delay ballpark village developments.
May 24, 20223 yr Well, the group that HBSE were part of didn’t get Chelsea FC https://www.theguardian.com/football/2022/may/24/premier-league-approves-chelsea-takeover-by-todd-boehly-consortium-roman-abramovich My hovercraft is full of eels
May 24, 20223 yr Author 45 minutes ago, roman totale XVII said: Well, the group that HBSE were part of didn’t get Chelsea FC https://www.theguardian.com/football/2022/may/24/premier-league-approves-chelsea-takeover-by-todd-boehly-consortium-roman-abramovich I don't think they'll get the Broncos either although they might get a minority stake. Question is, will they keep pursuing higher deals instead of the Guardians? "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
May 24, 20223 yr Any indication why they soured on the Guardians? Dolans buy in number? Meshing personalities? Maybe they decided they wanted to be in a higher profile city. Whatever the reason, I would love to know what happened to turn this around. One can hope this gets back on track. I can't imagine whenever bachelor number 2 comes calling, he will be half as attractive.
May 24, 20223 yr Author 8 minutes ago, cadmen said: Any indication why they soured on the Guardians? Dolans buy in number? Meshing personalities? Maybe they decided they wanted to be in a higher profile city. Whatever the reason, I would love to know what happened to turn this around. One can hope this gets back on track. I can't imagine whenever bachelor number 2 comes calling, he will be half as attractive. I don't think anything bad happened. The Guardians aren't a top-shelf buy. HBSE may still buy them, but when an NFL franchise (aka a printing money machine) is available for purchase, you gotta make a play for it. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
May 25, 20223 yr For what it’s worth, I’m on a Cleveland sports message board and there is a Guardians insider on there. He’s pretty legit, had the Jose Ramirez signing and a few more all the way. He said last he heard, they’re still buying in. So we will see.
May 25, 20223 yr 1 hour ago, JB said: For what it’s worth, I’m on a Cleveland sports message board and there is a Guardians insider on there. He’s pretty legit, had the Jose Ramirez signing and a few more all the way. He said last he heard, they’re still buying in. So we will see. Let’s hope so! Even with the latest news, it seems like things may be falling our way with them striking out on the Premier League and NFL.
May 25, 20223 yr 17 minutes ago, BuckeyeNative said: ...things may be falling our way with them striking out... 🥁
May 25, 20223 yr On 5/24/2022 at 4:55 PM, KJP said: I don't think anything bad happened. The Guardians aren't a top-shelf buy. HBSE may still buy them, but when an NFL franchise (aka a printing money machine) is available for purchase, you gotta make a play for it. True - but another take on The Guardians is the possible growth potential for the franchise. When you consider the response of Cleveland fans to the great teams of the 90’s and the support that Cleveland has given the Browns and Cavs - there’s reason to believe the team could become a red hot attraction once again. (I know the Indians have had a pretty impressive run under Francona - but I think not obtaining the World Series trophy in 2016 really took a toll on the fan base after so many years without a title - but that’s another story) Im their region of the country, The Guardians haven’t have a blue blood franchise to compete against in Detroit, Cincinnati or Pittsburgh for years. A pennant winning team in Cleveland could really ignite a new generation of fans throughout much of Ohio and possibly regions of PA and maybe western Indiana. And even if that premise is wishful thinking - certainly, northeast Ohio has proven its loyalty as a fan base even with teams that have been mediocre or worse. I would hope that HBSE/Bedrock might recognize the growth potential of the franchise and want to build a new baseball legacy for Cleveland. . (As well as a baseball village or exciting new real estate next to Progressive Field, of course.) And perhaps, if some of the sexier franchises become unavailable - maybe the Guardians will end up landing the bigtime owner with money that we all covet. I’ll be rooting hard for that scenario and for a boom in development around the ball park. .
May 25, 20223 yr 27 minutes ago, CleveFan said: True - but another take on The Guardians is the possible growth potential for the franchise. When you consider the response of Cleveland fans to the great teams of the 90’s and the support that Cleveland has given the Browns and Cavs - there’s reason to believe the team could become a red hot attraction once again. (I know the Indians have had a pretty impressive run under Francona - but I think not obtaining the World Series trophy in 2016 really took a toll on the fan base after so many years without a title - but that’s another story) Im their region of the country, The Guardians haven’t have a blue blood franchise to compete against in Detroit, Cincinnati or Pittsburgh for years. A pennant winning team in Cleveland could really ignite a new generation of fans throughout much of Ohio and possibly regions of PA and maybe western Indiana. And even if that premise is wishful thinking - certainly, northeast Ohio has proven its loyalty as a fan base even with teams that have been mediocre or worse. I would hope that HBSE/Bedrock might recognize the growth potential of the franchise and want to build a new baseball legacy for Cleveland. . (As well as a baseball village or exciting new real estate next to Progressive Field, of course.) And perhaps, if some of the sexier franchises become unavailable - maybe the Guardians will end up landing the bigtime owner with money that we all covet. I’ll be rooting hard for that scenario and for a boom in development around the ball park. . Don't the Guardians have some of the best TV ratings but one of the worst TV contracts that is expiring soon? Big potential in increasing income from that alone. Bundle that with the land purchase deals the city rolled into the stadium renovations it really seems like a prime deal for a company that both owns teams and develops properties....
May 25, 20223 yr 7 minutes ago, Luke_S said: Don't the Guardians have some of the best TV ratings but one of the worst TV contracts that is expiring soon? Big potential in increasing income from that alone. Bundle that with the land purchase deals the city rolled into the stadium renovations it really seems like a prime deal for a company that both owns teams and develops properties.... Yes, the contract is pretty bad and should be up within the next year or two.
June 8, 20223 yr Denver Broncos sell for 4.65B to Walmart Heir. Josh Harris would have paid 5B if he knew that that was what it would have taken. How does this impact his Minority share purchase of the Guardians? https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10038079-nfl-rumors-76ers-josh-harris-was-willing-to-pay-5b-to-purchase-broncos
June 8, 20223 yr Author 42 minutes ago, simplythis said: Denver Broncos sell for 4.65B to Walmart Heir. Josh Harris would have paid 5B if he knew that that was what it would have taken. How does this impact his Minority share purchase of the Guardians? https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10038079-nfl-rumors-76ers-josh-harris-was-willing-to-pay-5b-to-purchase-broncos Probably strengthens it unless a prettier girl walks by... "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
June 16, 20222 yr 46 minutes ago, roman totale XVII said: Confirmed as Blitzer Awesome news! I wonder if this means Harris/HBSE will be involved as well or if it’ll just be Blitzer? We can only hope for what this means regarding the Gateway mega-project… fingers crossed!
June 16, 20222 yr Author At this point it sounds only like David Blitzer is involved... https://frontofficesports.com/cleveland-guardians-minority-shareholder-mlb-david-blitzer-owner-paul-dolan-sale/ But in the past when I've asked if Harris is involved, I was told that wherever Blitzer is, so is Harris. But as you can see from the above article, that's not always the case, especially when it came to the MLS’ Real Salt Lake purchase. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
June 16, 20222 yr Fine. Blitzer buys into the team and Harris builds the Ballpark Village. That's my plan and l'm sticking to it. Man, it's fun spending other people's money.
June 23, 20222 yr That feeling you get when you realize in the years you’ve been waiting for this lot to get developed Seattle has completed seemingly dozens of projects of a similar scale.
June 23, 20222 yr 46 minutes ago, LlamaLawyer said: Achem. Anyhow, moving on.. Yeah, but the data clearly shows we're catching up. Watch out, Seattle!
June 23, 20222 yr No need to be defensive people. Just an observation while I’m here. Growth comes with negative consequences as well but we can all appreciate a dozen or more cranes on the sky.
June 23, 20222 yr The good thing is that high quality multi-family in Cleveland is going for over $3/sf/month, even as high as $3.80/sf/month which opens up a lot more possibility for new construction, even with construction cost increases. We're looking at several high profile sites in Cleveland (and god how do I wish I could talk about them...) simply because now it potentially makes our value add most beneficial. Incoming possible recession notwithstanding, I'd imagine we'll see 5+ new residential mid/highrises in Downtown built/start in the next decade if I had to guess. Not on the levels of Seattle, Toronto, Vancouver, etc, but will make a huge impact on the cityscape. Edited June 23, 20222 yr by jmicha
June 23, 20222 yr 9 minutes ago, jmicha said: We're looking at several high profile sites in Cleveland (and god how do I wish I could talk about them...) Well your post is just simply evil. 😉
June 23, 20222 yr 3 minutes ago, Htsguy said: Well your post is just simply evil. 😉 Lol I'm sorry. There aren't technically any NDAs involved but I always like to hold off on talking about anything until they're fully made public. But now I'm seeing that's basically just teasing at this point haha.
June 23, 20222 yr 16 minutes ago, jmicha said: Lol I'm sorry. There aren't technically any NDAs involved but I always like to hold off on talking about anything until they're fully made public. But now I'm seeing that's basically just teasing at this point haha. Sounds like someone needs to go have a few beers with @KJP off in the corner at Masthead.
June 23, 20222 yr 17 minutes ago, Ineffable_Matt said: Sounds like someone needs to go have a few beers with @KJP off in the corner at Masthead. Too wide open and easy to be seen. @KJPneeds to keep his sources in the shadows. A dark, dingy corner of Spotted Owl might be a better recommendation.
June 23, 20222 yr Author 20 minutes ago, Ineffable_Matt said: Sounds like someone needs to go have a few beers with @KJP off in the corner at Masthead. Anytime @jmicha. Feel free to drop me a note in PM. It doesn't show up in work or personal emails. If you tell me where to fish, I can take it from there. 🙂 "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
June 23, 20222 yr Author I realize we want high-rise new construction, but we have to fill up the vacancies first. How many 10+ story commercial buildings downtown have been converted to residential/mixed-use since 2010? Imagine if all of these were new construction: Completed 2010-20 The 9 - 29 stories Residences at 1717 - 21 stories Standard Apartments - 21 stories Athlon - 15 stories Leader Building - 15 stories 75 Public Square - 15 stories Scofield Residences - 14 stories Terminal Tower (lower) - 12 stories Halle Building - 12 stories The Creswell - 11 stories The Garfield - 10 stories Underway/Planned Erieview Tower - 40 stories 55 Public Square - 24 stories The Centennial - 21 stories Rockefeller Building - 17 stories 45 Erieview - 16 stories Fidelity Hotel - 10 stories Imagine if all of those were new-builds. We would have had lots of construction cranes in our photos from the past decade. Now that the supply of those conversions is fading (leaving only SHW's HQ, IMG, and a few buildings under 10 stories), will we see more new construction? Edited June 23, 20222 yr by KJP Added more buildings "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
June 23, 20222 yr 6 minutes ago, KJP said: I realize we want high-rise new construction, but we have to fill up the vacancies first. How many 10+ story commercial buildings downtown have been converted to residential/mixed-use since 2010? Imagine if all of these were new construction: Completed 2010-20 The 9 - 29 stories Residences at 1717 - 21 stories Standard Apartments - 21 stories Athlon - 15 stories Leader Building - 15 stories 75 Public Square - 15 stories Scofield Residences - 14 stories Terminal Tower (lower) - 12 stories Halle Building - 12 stories The Creswell - 11 stories Underway/Planned Erieview Tower - 40 stories 55 Public Square - 24 stories The Centennial - 21 stories Rockefeller Building - 17 stories 45 Erieview - 16 stories Imagine if all of those were new-builds. We would have had lots of construction cranes in our photos from the past decade. Now that the supply of those conversions is fading (leaving only SHW's HQ, IMG, and a few buildings under 10 stories), will we see more new construction? Also City Club Apartments
June 23, 20222 yr Author 1 minute ago, osu4brutus03 said: Also City Club Apartments That's new construction. I'm listing only the conversions of existing 10+ story buildings to residential/mixed-use. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
June 23, 20222 yr 1 minute ago, osu4brutus03 said: Also City Club Apartments City Club is not a conversion. It is a new build. Read the original post again.
June 23, 20222 yr 12 minutes ago, KJP said: I realize we want high-rise new construction, but we have to fill up the vacancies first. How many 10+ story commercial buildings downtown have been converted to residential/mixed-use since 2010? Imagine if all of these were new construction: Completed 2010-20 The 9 - 29 stories Residences at 1717 - 21 stories Standard Apartments - 21 stories Athlon - 15 stories Leader Building - 15 stories 75 Public Square - 15 stories Scofield Residences - 14 stories Terminal Tower (lower) - 12 stories Halle Building - 12 stories The Creswell - 11 stories Underway/Planned Erieview Tower - 40 stories 55 Public Square - 24 stories The Centennial - 21 stories Rockefeller Building - 17 stories 45 Erieview - 16 stories Imagine if all of those were new-builds. We would have had lots of construction cranes in our photos from the past decade. Now that the supply of those conversions is fading (leaving only SHW's HQ, IMG, and a few buildings under 10 stories), will we see more new construction? Also the Garfield building (11 stories) and the Baker building (11 stories) into a hotel. Edited June 23, 20222 yr by marty15
June 23, 20222 yr It is a bit discouraging that there is/was so much vacant commercial space downtown. But I assume that is the case in other cities also. Or is it? Edited June 23, 20222 yr by LibertyBlvd
June 23, 20222 yr 10 minutes ago, KJP said: I realize we want high-rise new construction, but we have to fill up the vacancies first. How many 10+ story commercial buildings downtown have been converted to residential/mixed-use since 2010? Imagine if all of these were new construction: Completed 2010-20 The 9 - 29 stories Residences at 1717 - 21 stories Standard Apartments - 21 stories Athlon - 15 stories Leader Building - 15 stories 75 Public Square - 15 stories Scofield Residences - 14 stories Terminal Tower (lower) - 12 stories Halle Building - 12 stories The Creswell - 11 stories Underway/Planned Erieview Tower - 40 stories 55 Public Square - 24 stories The Centennial - 21 stories Rockefeller Building - 17 stories 45 Erieview - 16 stories Imagine if all of those were new-builds. We would have had lots of construction cranes in our photos from the past decade. Now that the supply of those conversions is fading (leaving only SHW's HQ, IMG, and a few buildings under 10 stories), will we see more new construction? Plus a number of lower building conversions. Euclid Grand added a large number of apartments as did May Co
June 23, 20222 yr Author 3 minutes ago, marty15 said: Also the Garfield building and the Baker building into a hotel. Thanks! "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
June 23, 20222 yr 7 minutes ago, KJP said: I realize we want high-rise new construction, but we have to fill up the vacancies first. How many 10+ story commercial buildings downtown have been converted to residential/mixed-use since 2010? Imagine if all of these were new construction: Completed 2010-20 The 9 - 29 stories Residences at 1717 - 21 stories Standard Apartments - 21 stories Athlon - 15 stories Leader Building - 15 stories 75 Public Square - 15 stories Scofield Residences - 14 stories Terminal Tower (lower) - 12 stories Halle Building - 12 stories The Creswell - 11 stories Underway/Planned Erieview Tower - 40 stories 55 Public Square - 24 stories The Centennial - 21 stories Rockefeller Building - 17 stories 45 Erieview - 16 stories Imagine if all of those were new-builds. We would have had lots of construction cranes in our photos from the past decade. Now that the supply of those conversions is fading (leaving only SHW's HQ, IMG, and a few buildings under 10 stories), will we see more new construction? (Potentially) dumb question: in your opinion, how many more buildings are there downtown that could be converted to housing? Your article about the updates on the latest three conversion projects had me wondering if we’re getting to a point where new construction may be the “only” option. The only “big fish” remaining I can think of is the current Sherwin-Williams HQ in a few years. Maybe some space within the Tower City complex as well?
June 23, 20222 yr 16 minutes ago, Htsguy said: Plus a number of lower building conversions. Euclid Grand added a large number of apartments as did May Co Also the Hanna building annex (8 stories) and May Company bldg (8 stories) Edited June 23, 20222 yr by marty15
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