True. Two more things...

 

1. I never knew that garage had color-coded interiors.

 

2. Nice juxtaposition in the photo. One structure going up; another one coming down.

 

So I thought there needed to be a development planned for a site before a structure could be demolished.  Does that not apply in this situation?

 

Edited November 14, 20231 yr by LibertyBlvd

43 minutes ago, GISguy said:

 

Love these! Gonna have to take a walk over to see it. 

52 minutes ago, LibertyBlvd said:

So I thought there needed to be a development planned for a site before a structure could be demolished.  Does that not apply in this situation?

 

 

Not sure how that works with a parking garage that's been closed and falling apart for years. I've heard horror stories about that garage, I don't think we're losing much.

 

I'd be much more upset about losing the Herold/Goldfish Outdoors block of buildings.

58 minutes ago, LibertyBlvd said:

So I thought there needed to be a development planned for a site before a structure could be demolished.  Does that not apply in this situation?

 

 

Not if it's damaged to the point of being dangerous.

1 hour ago, LibertyBlvd said:

So I thought there needed to be a development planned for a site before a structure could be demolished.  Does that not apply in this situation?

 

 

You can have an interim surface parking lot while a development plan is being developed. There's a deadline when the property owner has to come back to the city with a building plan. But as you can tell from the former New York Spaghetti House on East 9th that was razed in eight years ago, the city doesn't exactly hold the property owner to account.

We're still waiting for that development on the site of the NY Spaghetti House. 

Talked to the crew today, there's a few more days of demo and then a couple/few weeks of clearing out all the debris left. 

 

Said the garage was anchored to the hotel wall and it was a PITA but for the most part it's been a standard job. I've got a set of photos brewing, I'll post all of them once it's completely down.

What’s the chances of bedrock doing something with this lot sooner than later. Dan is not in the parking lot business like someone stated. Seeing how he’s having a field day in Detroit and Cleveland as his personal playground I find it hard to believe he leaves it like that especially in front of his trophy glass Arena.

6 minutes ago, Ray45a said:

What’s the chances of bedrock doing something with this lot sooner than later. Dan is not in the parking lot business like someone stated. Seeing how he’s having a field day in Detroit and Cleveland as his personal playground I find it hard to believe he leaves it like that especially in front of his trophy glass Arena.

This question has come up in the past, and the consensus of those allegedly in the know is that there is not much chance of anything being done in the short term as Gilbert is going to focus on the river.

I think the title of this thread needs to be changed.  How about Gateway kinda sorta maybe someday some type of project?  The thread started with excitement around he Guardians minority owner’s efforts in other cities, and potential collaboration with Gilbert on….something.   But it’s been mostly a whole lotta speculation that there might be a project at some point in the future.  Who really knows, though?

Bedrock seems to think it can take on multiple big projects at the same time, as it did and is doing in Detroit. They apparently are trying to do the same here with the riverfront and possibly another project in downtown Cleveland (I hope to be able to confirm it). That "other" project isn't Gateway, or at least not that I've heard. There is movement here (as noted with the Guardians' two big property buys), but is likely to be very slow and probably won't see anything happen unless and until David Blitzer becomes majority owner of the Guardians in five years. In megaproject duration, that's not a very long time and I suspect planning work will happening behind the scenes, once the Guardians take title to the Gateway East Garage.

From Kevin defranco on twitter 

Addition by subtraction

Can they turn it into a public space / park in the meantime and plant some trees like the nice maturing ones shown in the image above?

1 hour ago, Clefan14 said:

Can they turn it into a public space / park in the meantime and plant some trees like the nice maturing ones shown in the image above?

Why do that when they can make lots of money on a very exciting asphalt lot.

Maybe we can shame Cliffs into building a new HQ on the site.

Or Progressive 

4 hours ago, Clefan14 said:

Can they turn it into a public space / park in the meantime and plant some trees like the nice maturing ones shown in the image above?

 

Not without everybody crying bloody murder when they eventually go to develop it.

57 minutes ago, cadmen said:

Or Progressive 

We won’t need that space until wfh dies so maybe 10-15 years

Edited November 23, 20231 yr by BoomerangCleRes

11 minutes ago, BoomerangCleRes said:

We won’t need that space until wfh dies so maybe 10-15 years

WFH is not going away.  Companies that have embraced it have do so because they think their employees (current and future want this flexibility).  However, that doesn't mean that companies will need new or different space.  For example, if you can work from home or on a hybrid work schedule, do/will companies want or need suburban office campuses - or is a centrally located office more attractive.  Only time will tell - but, for this reason, Progressive shouldn't immediately be discounted.

10 hours ago, Ray45a said:

From Kevin defranco on twitter 

Any chance this lot could be used for a Justice Center courthouse tower??

Well guys...thanks for taking my comment seriously but l was being facieous. Oh I would like nothing better than somehow, someway getting Progressive to move downtown but unfortunately in no way do l expect them to do that. 

50 minutes ago, Chazz Michael Michaels said:

Any chance this lot could be used for a Justice Center courthouse tower??

 

The Gateway property owner, Prospect Avenue Acquisition (aka Bedrock), did not submit a proposal to the county. In contrast, Sherwin-Williams' old HQ property owner Sapphire Acquisition (also aka Bedrock), did submit a proposal. That's the only property Bedrock bought under the Sapphire name. Bedrock used the DBA Savoy Acquisitions to acquire SHW's Breen R&D center on Canal Road.

 

I keep hearing rumors that Bedrock may not put up a skyscraper (30+ stories) on the Gateway megaproject site. I expect they'll move some or all of Gateway East Parking's spaces to this site and construct an entertainment complex around it. It may include a residential/hotel building. If so, that may be the only "tower" built. But I doubt it will be much taller than 20-25 stories. Above that is when a residential/hotel building gets heavy enough to require caissons.

38 minutes ago, KJP said:

 

The Gateway property owner, Prospect Avenue Acquisition (aka Bedrock), did not submit a proposal to the county. In contrast, Sherwin-Williams' old HQ property owner Sapphire Acquisition (also aka Bedrock), did submit a proposal. That's the only property Bedrock bought under the Sapphire name. Bedrock used the DBA Savoy Acquisitions to acquire SHW's Breen R&D center on Canal Road.

 

I keep hearing rumors that Bedrock may not put up a skyscraper (30+ stories) on the Gateway megaproject site. I expect they'll move some or all of Gateway East Parking's spaces to this site and construct an entertainment complex around it. It may include a residential/hotel building. If so, that may be the only "tower" built. But I doubt it will be much taller than 20-25 stories. Above that is when a residential/hotel building gets heavy enough to require caissons.

Some much opportunity for development - even if not supertall structures.

Lots of potential and excitement - unlike what I felt about the city in some time.

did the city require the parking garage to come down?  

Was it recently in service for parking?

It was closed in Fall 2022 after an inspection. I don't know who inspected it.

 

https://neo-trans.blog/2023/06/21/seeds-sprouts-xxix-csu-to-start-arena-plans-downtown-garage-demo-olde-cedars-replacement/

I know we all love skyscrapers but developing this area with mid to low rise buildings would be equally as exciting. 

45 minutes ago, mrclifton88 said:

I know we all love skyscrapers but developing this area with mid to low rise buildings would be equally as exciting. 

Absolutely.

 

This would be the perfect spot to reintroduce low to mid-rise density. 

I wish Bedrock would have considered these sites for the cavs practice facility.  It would seem the perfect fit right next to the Fieldhouse. I could see the practice facility built on top of a multilevel garage along with the Cleveland  Clinic sports medicine building. The garage could be wrapped with retail and available spaces. Maybe a laneway running through the two buildings. I am not that crazy about the south flats area for that development. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

This is just the beginning of our ballpark village. Like Ken said, I would not expect a supertall here. But I can't wait to see/feel this area in five years.

I bet that in the near future the AT&T / Daily Planet building gets developed.

14 minutes ago, sky said:

I bet that in the near future the AT&T / Daily Planet building gets developed.

I really hope so. Hands down my favorite building downtown. 

A while back, there was a proposal to convert part of AT&T building to a hotel.  Apparently, it never happened.

On 11/23/2023 at 6:12 AM, Clefan14 said:

Can they turn it into a public space / park in the meantime and plant some trees like the nice maturing ones shown in the image above?

It’s a great and fun idea, but there is no clear, short term, economic incentive to turn it into public space. Unless they see public green space as an amenity associated with a future, contiguous development  

On 11/23/2023 at 7:53 PM, mrclifton88 said:

I know we all love skyscrapers but developing this area with mid to low rise buildings would be equally as exciting. 

I don’t think that mid rise is the highest and best use here and the cost per acre is probably too high to justify unless you really push rental rates. 

Definitely need a high rise there to fill the gap in the skyline.   

https://www.cleveland19.com/2023/12/05/parking-garage-huron-road-being-torn-down-prepare-whats-next/

 

"When Prospect Avenue Acquisitions bought the space, they agreed to a conditional use with the City. This means the 36 space parking lot will only be for a year. After that year, they need to show proof to the City that they are working on developing the property."

They have nothing planned for that site. It's a buy-and-hold. That could change in a year, but Bedrock is focused on the riverfront.

4 hours ago, KJP said:

They have nothing planned for that site. It's a buy-and-hold. That could change in a year, but Bedrock is focused on the riverfront.

And they'll get away with it because no one's going to ruffle the feathers of someone pumping capital into the city. 

Can we change the name of this thread to “Gateway Parking Lot project”? 
It would actually be more accurate. 

Edited December 6, 20231 yr by CleveFan

On 11/16/2023 at 2:14 PM, GISguy said:

Talked to the crew today, there's a few more days of demo and then a couple/few weeks of clearing out all the debris left. 

 

Said the garage was anchored to the hotel wall and it was a PITA but for the most part it's been a standard job. I've got a set of photos brewing, I'll post all of them once it's completely down.

 

Not as dramatic as I was hoping (sick day and thanksgiving) but here it is on a handful of dates

 

11/14

11/15

11/17

11/20

12/1

12/6

Y'all really go above and beyond when it comes to getting info/pics. It's impressive!

This is not intended to take this off topic, so no discussion about the absurdity of this tower being proposed in OKC and how it’ll never happen or how ridiculous it looks….
 

However, Phase 1 of this project is realistic and why I’m posting: Retail, Garages, Dream Hotel, 2 condo towers (everything except the 134 story apt tower) and would fit nicely into the gateway lot, really wish Gilbert could borrow this AO architecture plan. It would look amazing here.  Anyway bored and thought this project looked insane and wanted to share with you. Also next time you’re upset about surface parking look at this last pic. Imagine if stark had originally proposed this pie in the sky! 
 

https://t.co/7J01zQW2M5

 

 

Edited December 18, 20231 yr by Taller_is_better

41 minutes ago, Taller_is_better said:

This is not intended to take this off topic, so no discussion about the absurdity of this tower being proposed in OKC and how it’ll never happen or how ridiculous it looks….
 

However, Phase 1 of this project is realistic and why I’m posting: Retail, Garages, Dream Hotel, 2 condo towers (everything except the 134 story apt tower) and would fit nicely into the gateway lot, really wish Gilbert could borrow this AO architecture plan. It would look amazing here.  Anyway bored and thought this project looked insane and wanted to share with you. Also next time you’re upset about surface parking look at this last pic. Imagine if stark had originally proposed this pie in the sky! 
 

https://t.co/7J01zQW2M5

 

 

 

Most phallic site plan I've seen in my life.

 

Edited December 18, 20231 yr by ASP1984

56 minutes ago, ASP1984 said:

 

Most phallic site plan I've seen in my life.

 

I'm sure it's probably the point of it.   Some OK guys with money trying to show off for Texas.  The real project will be 1/4 of the size.  

4 minutes ago, Cleburger said:

I'm sure it's probably the point of it.   Some OK guys with money trying to show off for Texas.  The real project will be 1/4 of the size.  

 

Yeah and will probably look like this: 

 

 

I bring you: "The Chub"

 

Edited December 18, 20231 yr by ASP1984

Haven't heard anything about Dream Hotel Cleveland lately.  Their website still has Cleveland listed as a future site.  Seems like Gateway would be a better location for such a hotel instead of Midtown.

I'd also be cool with *not* building the Great Value Burj Khalifa here in Cleveland. Last time I checked there's not exactly a shortage of buildable urban land. How about a nice, normal ballpark village of walkable and mixed-use midrise buildings.