3 hours ago, LlamaLawyer said:

I'd also be cool with *not* building the Great Value Burj Khalifa here in Cleveland. Last time I checked there's not exactly a shortage of buildable urban land. How about a nice, normal ballpark village of walkable and mixed-use midrise buildings.

Exactly, take the apartment tower out and this is perfect. 

9 hours ago, ASP1984 said:

 

Most phallic site plan I've seen in my life.

 

You read my mind!

As silly as that building looks it’s kinda like how the Terminal Tower probably looked after it was completed in 1927…a giant tower in the middle of not much else.

No pic, but Bobby George’s tantrum-reward electronic billboards are going up on top of the Harry Buffalo on E4th. I’m pleased to report that they are amusingly small. 

From the Ohio Tax credit announcement.

 

^ now that's awesome news.

 

re the okc plan, and lol mega tower aside, while i like the idea of the glitzy fun buildings around the tower, it looks like they are all self contained and i absolutely do not like that kind of thing for the clev. no streetlife killing, everybody stay inside all the time type mega developments plz. the current gateway plans and visions are just fine thank you very much. 👍🤞

1 hour ago, freethink said:

From the Ohio Tax credit announcement.

 

Wonderful. This place *should* be a legit tourist attraction. 
Hopefully, it bodes well for the future of the rest of the block too. 

1 hour ago, freethink said:

From the Ohio Tax credit announcement.

 

This is incredible news. Though, knowing our local developers, the rest of that strip will get demolished for a parking lot. 

This should be fairly easy to re-create and turn it into a satellite exhibit of the RRHOF. Perhaps record store relics of the past?

 

Record Rendezvous building among historic renovation awards

By Ken Prendergast / December 21, 2023

 

An historic building in Downtown Cleveland that housed Record Rendezvous, where the term "rock and roll" was reportedly first used to describe the genre, was awarded tax credits to aid in its restoration. It was among dozens of historic buildings across the state that were awarded credits today by the Ohio Department of Development.

 

MORE:
https://neo-trans.blog/2023/12/21/record-rendezvous-building-among-historic-renovation-awards/

 

2 hours ago, Barneyboy said:

This should be fairly easy to re-create and turn it into a satellite exhibit of the RRHOF. Perhaps record store relics of the past?

Are they recreating it or just having a random commercial tenant occupy it?

8 minutes ago, cle_guy90 said:

Are they recreating it or just having a random commercial tenant occupy it?

My reading of the news reports is that the owner doesn't actually have a tenant.  Just trying to position the building with much needed renovation in order to make it marketable.  The above was just aspirational on the part of @Barneyboy and it is a fantastic idea.

Edited December 22, 20231 yr by Htsguy

With vinyl making a resurgence, do we think Record Rendezvous could as well? RRHF should back it

1 hour ago, dave2017 said:

With vinyl making a resurgence, do we think Record Rendezvous could as well? RRHF should back it

The Rock Hall should, as well as Cleveland's world-renown record manufacturer, Gotta Groove, based right on Superior. 

 

https://www.gottagrooverecords.com

From the article the two flanking buildings are not mentioned. Doesn't it seem reasonable that if the center is rehabbed at some point the outer two will be also? 

 

None of them are all that big so unless they haven't deteriorated too much from lack of maintenance let's hope it won't be too long before we have more good news here.

LOTS of dump trucks on Prospect lined up to go into the parking garage pit, must be the big move to get everything out before filling it in? No other day has been this busy over there (and the site is mostly dirt from what I can see).

They are, indeed, filling in the parking garage - that first day was crazy, it's been much more relaxed these past few days

 

 

Can you dig it?

A bomb in this thread? Whooo boy!!!!!

1 hour ago, KJP said:

Can you dig it?

Booker T?

Bedrock to prep Downtown’s ‘Rock Block’

By Ken Prendergast / June 16, 2025

Site preparations for a significant new development called the “Rock Block” are sought in the Gateway District of Downtown Cleveland. But the permit application outlining the proposed preparations offers more questions than it provides answers as to what may rise here and when. There are some answers and, of course, rumors.

MORE:

https://neo-trans.blog/2025/06/16/bedrock-to-prep-downtowns-rock-block/

I've been hearing about this lot getting built up since I moved here in 2019. I am happy we may have some visible progress in the near future even if it is just foundation prep work so far

COSM perhaps?

A COSM would be great! It certainly fits the area and the size of the first building of the development...

I will say though: "a smaller version of Hudson Yards in Detroit" is nothing to scoff at, even if it is the less substantiated of the rumors. That's a nearly 700' building right they've got there in motor city

Edited Monday at 11:28 PM1 day by Geowizical

If I’m Dolan and Gilbert, I’m investing in development around the arena and ballpark right now to get ahead of Jimmyland. They can’t wait for Haslam to chip away at their visitors—they have to hit first. I think between the two teams and their investments in more amenities in Gateway they are going to be easily more attractive to tourists and regional visitors.

6 hours ago, coneflower said:

If I’m Dolan and Gilbert, I’m investing in development around the arena and ballpark right now to get ahead of Jimmyland. They can’t wait for Haslam to chip away at their visitors—they have to hit first. I think between the two teams and their investments in more amenities in Gateway they are going to be easily more attractive to tourists and regional visitors.

Maybe true, but the basis for visiting Jimmadome will always be the Browns, or what ever other events he's able to attract. Either Gilbert or Blitzer's developments will be able to attract visitors that aren't going to Cavs or Guardians games.

But you're probably right, there is a bit of competition going on between Jimbo and Gilbert. From Ken's writing mentioning the deference given by the city to Gilbert to develop his lots I can't help but think how flexible the city would have been with a Haslam development downtown. And more, if he had pursued the land swap with the post office, although slightly disconnected and smaller his developments would have benefited from the soccer stadium and whatever Gilbert and Blitzer build...

Here's to roc-KLE-us! May you arrive in our lifetimes. 😀

Finally some movement again here.

12 hours ago, Geowizical said:

A COSM would be great! It certainly fits the area and the size of the first building of the development...

I will say though: "a smaller version of Hudson Yards in Detroit" is nothing to scoff at, even if it is the less substantiated of the rumors. That's a nearly 700' building right they've got there in motor city

Ya I can't imagine the plan is to go small here, they paid almost $9 million per acre for the site. I have to imagine that's the highest price paid ever for a piece of land with no building on it in Cleveland, and maybe Ohio. A Hudson Tower type of project on this site would fit perfectly into the skyline.

Does anyone know if this could have something to do with the new traffic pattern and bike lanes on Prospect and E Huron? Those improvements seemingly came out of nowhere and work started almost immediately(which I wish happened more often), then days later this work starts.

Looking at that cutout of the land in the article can they construct a pedestrian alleyway across the parking lot that connects to the already existing walkway that connects Huron to Prospect? The new alleyway would be fronted by retail, possibly a restaurant etc. This would allow for pedestrian activity to surround the entire development and the same can be done when they build the prospect lot.

15 hours ago, snakebite said:

COSM perhaps?

It's just about perfect size for a COSM

Gilbert's group just broke ground in April on a development in downtown Detroit that includes a COSM and a Market Hall. Here's the article:

https://www.freep.com/story/money/business/2025/04/09/final-details-monroe-blocks-detorit-development/83006270007/

11 minutes ago, GREGinPARMA said:

Gilbert's group just broke ground in April on a development in downtown Detroit that includes a COSM and a Market Hall. Here's the article:

https://www.freep.com/story/money/business/2025/04/09/final-details-monroe-blocks-detorit-development/83006270007/

The two phases of these buildings is exactly what I'm talking about upthread. The difference is the street would simply be a pedestrian walkway.

Do you think that maybe - just maybe, that this is where the skyline changing hotel will be built??

Choosing to construct this on the Huron side of the street definitely raises questions. Given it's Gilbert and he also owns the Cavs I'm anticipating this to interact with, if not outright connect to, the arena. It goes without saying that hopefully this is phase one of a larger project, because E4th desperately needs closed off and expanded.

1 hour ago, B767PILOT said:

Do you think that maybe - just maybe, that this is where the skyline changing hotel will be built??

The skyline changing hotel is a Bedrock project, FYI. That's all I can say

3 hours ago, MyPhoneDead said:

Looking at that cutout of the land in the article can they construct a pedestrian alleyway across the parking lot that connects to the already existing walkway that connects Huron to Prospect? The new alleyway would be fronted by retail, possibly a restaurant etc. This would allow for pedestrian activity to surround the entire development and the same can be done when they build the prospect lot.

Laneway concept revived!

G

4 hours ago, PlanCleveland said:

Does anyone know if this could have something to do with the new traffic pattern and bike lanes on Prospect and E Huron? Those improvements seemingly came out of nowhere and work started almost immediately(which I wish happened more often), then days later this work starts.

you’d have to assume, in my mind this simplifies flows around this development with one ways and makes for a safer ped experience as well. That whole block is mess, I’m curious why they didn’t want to resurface the street while they were at it seems like a good time to do it, Cavs are in their offseason and this development will still take sometime unless bedrock has some ideas that would cause rework. so maybe for now goal is to get people used to the new flows for now with paint and signage

10 minutes ago, BoomerangCleRes said:

G

you’d have to assume, in my mind this simplifies flows around this development with one ways and makes for a safer ped experience as well. That whole block is mess, I’m curious why they didn’t want to resurface the street while they were at it seems like a good time to do it, Cavs are in their offseason and this development will still take sometime unless bedrock has some ideas that would cause rework. so maybe for now goal is to get people used to the new flows for now with paint and signage

The stretch of E. Prospect between E.9th and Ontario needs a good repaving as well.

add them to the list of every major surface street in cleveland that needs repair.

19 hours ago, coneflower said:

If I’m Dolan and Gilbert, I’m investing in development around the arena and ballpark right now to get ahead of Jimmyland. They can’t wait for Haslam to chip away at their visitors—they have to hit first. I think between the two teams and their investments in more amenities in Gateway they are going to be easily more attractive to tourists and regional visitors.

I think things won't come together until David Blitzer exercises his right to buy a majority stake in the Guardians, and I feel the most important thing is just to do it right as opposed to rush things in order to cancel out Brook Park. Between the two venues and all the other attractions, employment centers etc in close proximity, this has the potential to be a game changing development for the city. Its going to bridge a lot of empty lots and garages to the Downtown core. Sports anchored develops now when done right are proving to be an excellent catalyst for regeneration. A COSM location would be an excellent statement of intent however and hopefully a sign of things to come.

I am not worried that Brook Park would hurt a development like this. I am of the view that it will just be a flash in the pan if the mixed use development ever happens. There will be a novelty factor at first but that will quickly disappear once the shine wears off. Its never going to have the sustainability needed because of its isolation. I have no doubt a similar development in the Gateway would be much better placed to stand the test of time.

6 hours ago, RMB said:

It's just about perfect size for a COSM

What does COSM stand for ?

2 hours ago, dar124 said:

The stretch of E. Prospect between E.9th and Ontario needs a good repaving as well.

It was repaved in the late 2010s. But it wasn't a full rebuild from the sewers up like Euclid was in 2006-08. So a year later, you'd never know Prospect was repaved.

Anyway, this is Prospect Avenue today looking west from Huron....

21 minutes ago, ClevelandNative said:

What does COSM stand for ?

I was wondering that too...not sure what it stands for, but from what I gather from their website it's a sports/entertainment facility. Reminds me of an ESPN Zone mixed with an IMAX theater.

With the change to traffic patterns, specifically on Huron will they be closing off the right turn from Ontario onto Huron giving a bit more flexibility with that parcel for development?

If I remember correctly there was a plan for a building here at one time, is this owned by bedrock as well?

6 hours ago, Luke_S said:

With the change to traffic patterns, specifically on Huron will they be closing off the right turn from Ontario onto Huron giving a bit more flexibility with that parcel for development?

If I remember correctly there was a plan for a building here at one time, is this owned by bedrock as well?

The grassy strip on the north side of Huron between East 4th and Ontario is owned by the city.

Check is this indispensable tool.... https://myplace.cuyahogacounty.gov

1 hour ago, KJP said:

The grassy strip on the north side of Huron between East 4th and Ontario is owned by the city.

Check is this indispensable tool.... https://myplace.cuyahogacounty.gov

I was referring to the parcel below, but looks like it's owned by SAPPHIRE ACQUISITIONS LLC who you reported is an affiliate of Bedrock.

5 hours ago, Luke_S said:

I was referring to the parcel below, but looks like it's owned by SAPPHIRE ACQUISITIONS LLC who you reported is an affiliate of Bedrock.

They should just finish the landmark building, in the original style, no need to get cute or creative with it. Maybe add a small corner plaza and/or another entrance to the red line platform. No need for anything more clever than that. It's already a gorgeous building, just finish it.

Rant over, to actually answer your question, it's currently planned as a bus facility. Which is I suppose a good use of the space. I really hope they finish the facade though, the blank wall with giant posters isn't a good look.

25 minutes ago, Ethan said:

They should just finish the landmark building, in the original style, no need to get cute or creative with it. Maybe add a small corner plaza and/or another entrance to the red line platform. No need for anything more clever than that. It's already a gorgeous building, just finish it.

Rant over, to actually answer your question, it's currently planned as a bus facility.bwhich is I suppose a good use of the space. I really hope they finish the facade though, the blank wall with giant posters isn't a good look.

I would think they have to be planning to add windows if they want to convert the building to residential. I would hope they do it more artfully than just cutting out windows, but I'm sold by what you're describing. And sounds like it would pair very nicely with a CVSR and Amtrak station....

I actually feel a Gateway sports anchored project could be as grand as Centennial Yards in Atlanta. That area known as the Gulch next to Mercedes Benz Stadium and State Farm Arena in Downtown Atlanta was a barren area much like the surface lots and garages north of the Arena and Ballpark and that is now linking two disconnected parts of Downtown. I am absolutely confident enough that Downtown Cleveland could replicate a similar project.

Brook Park though is not going to be the Atlanta Battery IMO. Cleveland is just too small and lacks the affluence of a place like Atlanta to successfully do big projects in the suburbs like that. Even if it was the Guardians there instead of the Browns it still lacks the key numbers on paper to get behind this. We are just not in a position growth wise to add additional nodes and destinations and guarantee their success.

Edited 4 hours ago4 hr by snakebite

13 minutes ago, snakebite said:

I actually feel a Gateway sports anchored project could be as grand as Centennial Yards in Atlanta. That area known as the Gulch next to Mercedes Benz Stadium and State Farm Arena in Downtown Atlanta was a barren area much like the surface lots and garages north of the Arena and Ballpark and that is now linking two disconnected parts of Downtown. I am absolutely confident enough that Downtown Cleveland could replicate a similar project.

Brook Park though is not going to be the Atlanta Battery IMO. Cleveland is just too small and lacks the affluence of a place like Atlanta to successfully do big projects in the suburbs like that. Even if it was the Guardians there instead of the Browns it still lacks the key numbers on paper to get behind this. We are just not in a position growth wise to add additional nodes and destinations and guarantee their success.

Generally I agree, but I think suburban sporting developments succeeding is the exception more than the rule, regardless of markets. Philly and Boston come to mind for developments that basically ended up being strip malls in seas of parking. On top of that, the site is atrocious for anything more than a few transient stores in the area. I have a hard time wrapping my head around the sales pitch of apartments/condos in Brook Park that ANYONE would want to buy for anything other than bargain prices.

Getting back on topic though, the permit submission is a very strange one, but a good sign I would think. You don't usually that level of exploratory digging unless you're deep in design for something substantial to go there. The sheer amount of hidden "stuff" from the past all over the city is pretty insane sometimes, and even core drill samples fail to find everything at times, so they seem to want to really eliminate variables for whatever they have planned. I'm no civil or structural, but that screams "big" to me.