January 11, 20205 yr 22 minutes ago, htsfan said: I have to say, I tend to agree. It's kind of a hot mess, and looks like it belongs in Vegas or Miami Beach. I'm all for mixing it up and inserting contemporary design on Euclid, but this just seems like it's trying to incorporate too many different concepts, with the end result looking jumbled. Here's hoping it gets refined through design review. And I appreciate that others may have a different point of view. Why can’t we have something that looks like Vegas or Miami Beach?
January 11, 20205 yr 18 minutes ago, inlovewithCLE said: Edited January 11, 20205 yr by Nickel Plate RR Mistake
January 11, 20205 yr 9 minutes ago, inlovewithCLE said: Why can’t we have something that looks like Vegas or Miami Beach? I just prefer a cleaner aesthetic, like many of the newer buildings along the Highline in NYC; think Zaha Hadid. Just seems more sophisticated than this design, which IMO looks like some of the trashy Vegas and Miami Beach architecture of the late 90s and 2000s. Just my opinion.
January 11, 20205 yr Author My delayed contribution...... FRIDAY, JANUARY 10, 2020 Another residential tower continues Euclid Avenue's boom The Michigan-based chain of City Club Apartments has acquired enough capital to move forward with a proposed 23-story apartment tower at 720 Euclid Ave. in downtown Cleveland. It would be the third new-construction apartment tower to rise on Euclid Avenue downtown since 2018. Based on preliminary, conceptual designs submitted to the City Planning Commission for approval Jan. 16, the new tower would measure about 250,000 square feet and offer 310 apartments over a two-level retail/lobby base. Proposed retail includes a restaurant and a doggy day care business. At this early stage of planning, the high-rise would offer 180 studios, 78 one-bedroom apartments, 42 two-bedroom apartments and 10 three-bedroom apartments. Prices for those units are not yet available. Based on the per-square-foot construction costs of the other two apartment towers built recently -- the 29-story Beacon and the 34-story Lumen -- the construction cost of the City Club Apartments could be less than $85 million. MORE: https://neo-trans.blogspot.com/2020/01/another-residential-tower-continues.html Edited January 12, 20205 yr by KJP "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
January 11, 20205 yr I see from the renderings that the northeast corner of the 668 building has some kind of colorful mural that appears to mimic the colorful City Club design. Since the owners of the new building don't have a financial interest in the 668 building I assume no mural will be painted and that the one in the rendering is just for show. I like the idea of a mural on that wall I wonder if the developer will work with 668 to install one. Or will that wall remain plain as it is now? One can hope for the former.
January 12, 20205 yr I'm excited to see another residential highrise, and won't complain if it's built exactly as pictured since Cleveland doesn't have anything like it. But it looks like every highrise built in Nashville, Austin, Minneapolis, or wherever. Dime a dozen crap.
January 12, 20205 yr KJP---as always, great article. Question regarding, "...City Club Apartments was able to keep construction costs low by not having to purchase any land or build any parking for the new building. That likely trimmed $10 million to $15 million from the tower's development costs. Instead, Holtzman worked out a deal with the property's current owner David Goldberg to not only build on the Goldberg site but to also dedicate parking spaces to City Club Apartments residents in a six-story, 540-space garage. That parking deck is mostly full during the day but mostly empty at night. The new apartment building would be connected to the existing garage with a new, enclosed walkway....." Since no land purchase was made, does this mean City Club is renting the land from David Goldberg? Or zero rent and Goldberg gets a percentage of the profits? You said "worked out a deal"---just curious as to what the arrangement was.
January 12, 20205 yr 4 hours ago, htsfan said: I just prefer a cleaner aesthetic, like many of the newer buildings along the Highline in NYC; think Zaha Hadid. Just seems more sophisticated than this design, which IMO looks like some of the trashy Vegas and Miami Beach architecture of the late 90s and 2000s. Just my opinion. I love the late Zaha Hadid (3rd bldg on left on Biscayne Blvd., in Miami), but this design doesn't have her organic aesthetic, nor her level of sophistication. https://photos.app.goo.gl/Xq4cgKxBgxM3XtGA8 While certainly unique, I have to agree with "Paul in Cleveland," I'm just not sold on this design for this particular location. Edited January 12, 20205 yr by Frmr CLEder
January 12, 20205 yr Author 33 minutes ago, Pugu said: Since no land purchase was made, does this mean City Club is renting the land from David Goldberg? Or zero rent and Goldberg gets a percentage of the profits? You said "worked out a deal"---just curious as to what the arrangement was. According to Jordyn's article, it doesn't sound like it's nailed down yet.... "Goldberg declined to discuss a potential sale price. He noted that a land lease, rather than a sale, is also a possibility." https://www.cleveland.com/business/2020/01/new-apartment-tower-planned-on-euclid-avenue-parking-lot.html "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
January 13, 20205 yr The development is great and I think a little quirkiness can be good to mix things up. But something about the way this building interacts (or rather doesn't at all) with its neighbors is a little off-putting. I think the biggest thing for me is the wing at the top. That seems the most out of place, had me looking for palm trees in the rendering
January 13, 20205 yr Did they list the height anywhere? Also I tried to find it and failed - what’s the height of the City Club? That would help gauge it.
January 13, 20205 yr 58 minutes ago, cle_guy90 said: what’s the height of the City Club? That would help gauge it. 184 feet.
January 13, 20205 yr Too bad it’s not going all the way up against 668 to obscure that ridiculous parapet/cornice detail
January 13, 20205 yr I think the stupid Hollywood movie lot parapet thing happened because there was supposed to be a rebuilt floor up there to match the rebuilt facade, but the extra floor didn't get built for some reason or another.
January 13, 20205 yr On 1/11/2020 at 2:32 PM, ExPatClevGuy said: The illustration of this exciting new tower with a related reference to the Hippodrome on the marquee sent me snooping across the web to learn more. There's so much content out there about it too. - Jon Phillip Sousa performed there often, also Fanny Brice, Babe Ruth, Isadora Duncan, Anna Pavlova, Will Rogers; Enrico Caruso, Sarah Bernhardt, W. C. Fields, Al Jolson, John McCormack... The auditorium had two balconies with elevators, and seating for 3,548. They all played the Hipp! Sousa insisted on performing in Cleveland each time he passed through with his band. The dining room shown in the historic image below was a part of the Hippodrome lobby. Needless to say, the tower above the Hippodrome was not short on contemporary decoration of that era, so I'm reluctant to shun the now contemporary elements on this long-awaited replacement. * The only change I might prefer would be that the parking entrance to the right of the new tower be designed to appear integral to the building. Perhaps as if under some sort of (transom?) or other defining element. Such might make it appear inclusive to the building and not leave an open gap between the new City Club tower and 668. As it appears now, the space will simply look like an open alley. (I really do hate the way the props supporting the front parapet of 668 are so visible, they make the otherwise elegant 668 look like a cheap movie prop.) The Hippodrome marquee seems to imply a laneway of sorts, but didn't see anything to that effect in the ground-floor plan a couple pages back. Anyone know what the intent is here?
January 16, 20205 yr Author "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
January 16, 20205 yr Very nice looking project here! I hope somewhere in this building, they pay homage to the hippodrome,.. maybe a wall somewhere that public has access to, with some nice photos and a placard stating its significance.
January 16, 20205 yr On 1/11/2020 at 5:02 PM, lockdog said: https://www.crainscleveland.com/real-estate/new-apartment-tower-surfaces-near-clevelands-city-club-building in the words of the immortal james brown.... "whatsin ever you do.... it's got to be funky.." Along with the Beacon, two funky buildings in Cleveland , oh my! Can we handle it? Better than another boring building.
January 16, 20205 yr On 1/13/2020 at 12:56 AM, w28th said: Too bad it’s not going all the way up against 668 to obscure that ridiculous parapet/cornice detail Its those ugly as* beams on the roof that props the fake edifice up that makes the building look so cheap that needs to be obscured by this new building. I think from most angles it will, but not entirely ... except for some of the residents of this new building. Edited January 16, 20205 yr by shack
January 16, 20205 yr https://www.cleveland.com/business/2020/01/downtown-design-review-committee-gives-ok-to-planned-city-club-apartments-with-conditions.html Some very interesting information in here. Looks like they beat the flats in terms of providing the city with micro apartments. Target income range is $45,000-$65000 and target demographic is young urban professionals. Feel like this will fill up quickly as I believe there is a need for it! Edited January 17, 20205 yr by cle_guy90
January 16, 20205 yr 15 minutes ago, cle_guy90 said: https://www.cleveland.com/business/2020/01/downtown-design-review-committee-gives-ok-to-planned-city-club-apartments-with-conditions.html Some very interesting information in here. Looks like it beat the flats in terms of providing the city with the micro apartments. Target income range is $45,000-$65000 for young urban professionals. Feel like this will fill up quickly as I believe there is a need for it! More of this type of development please!! I know a lot of people in that target demographic / income range who would love to live downtown but currently cannot afford many of the available units. This would help boost even more younger people into the city, and help fill a much needed gap in downtown residential price points.
January 16, 20205 yr from the article: "Concerns were raised about the building being too close to the City Club building next door; the planned four-foot balconies being too small to be usable; and the building being too short and wide." How is it too close? There's E 8 between them and bldgs should be side to side along city streets (unless there is something like E. 8 st in between). We don't need lawns or plazas between buildings. "four-foot balconies being too small" -- they're about four feet bigger than nothing. certainly 2-3 people can stand on it and look out. and depending on the depth is big enough for a small table to have breakfast or drinks on. "too short and wide." too wide? bizzare comment as that's the size of the open space. "too short"---that's interesting---i though 23 stories was okay, but would happily take a 30-story bldg, but is that the role of the design review committee? what if the developer doesn't have budget for taller? does the city then try to kill the project?
January 16, 20205 yr 26 minutes ago, Pugu said: from the article: "Concerns were raised about the building being too close to the City Club building next door; the planned four-foot balconies being too small to be usable; and the building being too short and wide." How is it too close? There's E 8 between them and bldgs should be side to side along city streets (unless there is something like E. 8 st in between). We don't need lawns or plazas between buildings. "four-foot balconies being too small" -- they're about four feet bigger than nothing. certainly 2-3 people can stand on it and look out. and depending on the depth is big enough for a small table to have breakfast or drinks on. "too short and wide." too wide? bizzare comment as that's the size of the open space. "too short"---that's interesting---i though 23 stories was okay, but would happily take a 30-story bldg, but is that the role of the design review committee? what if the developer doesn't have budget for taller? does the city then try to kill the project? Maybe they prefer “balconies” like they approved for the Langston at CSU. What is this nonsense? Here’s the garbage they sign off on. Edited January 16, 20205 yr by marty15
January 16, 20205 yr 17 minutes ago, Pugu said: from the article: "Concerns were raised about the building being too close to the City Club building next door; the planned four-foot balconies being too small to be usable; and the building being too short and wide." How is it too close? There's E 8 between them and bldgs should be side to side along city streets (unless there is something like E. 8 st in between). We don't need lawns or plazas between buildings. "four-foot balconies being too small" -- they're about four feet bigger than nothing. certainly 2-3 people can stand on it and look out. and depending on the depth is big enough for a small table to have breakfast or drinks on. "too short and wide." too wide? bizzare comment as that's the size of the open space. "too short"---that's interesting---i though 23 stories was okay, but would happily take a 30-story bldg, but is that the role of the design review committee? what if the developer doesn't have budget for taller? does the city then try to kill the project? Maybe they prefer the height of the parking lot? The concerns of design review seem capricious most of the time. They opine just to opine. Edited January 16, 20205 yr by freefourur
January 16, 20205 yr I love the idea of a design review committee in principle, but in practice our design review committee seems to always come up with off the wall stuff while ignoring serious design flaws.
January 16, 20205 yr Author Seems that their "greatest contribution" is to ensure that Cleveland has nothing but a bunch of similar-looking/similar-colored buildings. Edited January 16, 20205 yr by KJP "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
January 16, 20205 yr In all fairness, they had gotten a little bit better; there've been a few recent standouts downtown anyway (Hilton, Lumen, Beacon, Nucleus) Edited January 16, 20205 yr by Frmr CLEder
January 16, 20205 yr "Concerns were raised about the building being too close to the City Club building next door; the planned four-foot balconies being too small to be usable; and the building being too short and wide." I dont usually agree with pretty much anything they say- but wasn't expecting them to ask for more height? ? I guess I wouldn't be opposed to that. Edited January 16, 20205 yr by mrclifton88
January 17, 20205 yr Channel 19 News Update. https://www.cleveland19.com/2020/01/16/cleveland-planning-committee-approves-designs-high-rise-city-club-apartments/
January 17, 20205 yr We can have a friendly conversation about the design of the City Club Apartments - I happen to like it and think it’s a breath of fresh air for Cleveland. But aside from its design, I bet we can agree that one of the most underserved demographics downtown are those youngest apartment dwellers -just-out-of-School (or not in school), trying to get established and wanting to be in the city -not in their parents’ suburbs. They don’t need much of their own space to hang out in because they’ll be going out Living the life a lot - And they also have a little more money to spend than I did at that point. And if their new building has cool amenities, like a rooftop pool, first class doggy daycare and a funky modern vibe in a real neighborhood where they can get a nice studio or “nano” apartment - that’s gonna be a very successful formula. . The Channel 19 video did a good job of illustrating those points and how the City Club Apartments will be marketing themselves. The presence of this demographic downtown is going to have a very positive domino effect for many businesses and the general pedestrian energy at street level. This is a different group than their neighbors in the Beacon or in the Lumen, but a very important piece in continuing the narrative of Cleveland as an increasingly dynamic city. It’s an excellent strategy by the City Club Apartments and Im hoping that this project becomes a hot destination for those youngest urban professionals of every stripe. .
January 19, 20205 yr I think the patches of dark blue, light blue, and white will make it look like it is reflecting a beautiful sunny day even when it’s actually a gray February day. I really like this design. When is the last time I-71 turned a profit?
January 19, 20205 yr A side note, due to the parking garage potentially losing parking spaces to the residents of this building, I would hope that the city relax's on the Prospect avenue parking restrictions, I think they're dumb and some of the most restrictive in the city.
January 19, 20205 yr ^Totally agree. Even on days without events at the Q/Progressive Field the restrictions seem to be in place
January 20, 20205 yr On 1/11/2020 at 11:13 AM, Frmr CLEder said: Think Casa Batllo-Gaudi, in Barcelona. https://images.app.goo.gl/kxw1tbE8xc8ncojP7 Love the design or hate it, it will definitely be iconic. I think you mean infamous.
February 7, 20205 yr Looks like my former engineering firm was doing some surveying on the Prospect side of things, not sure if it's related to this project or not, but it seems right?
February 7, 20205 yr 1 minute ago, GISguy said: Looks like my former engineering firm was doing some surveying on the Prospect side of things, not sure if it's related to this project or not, but it seems right? The City Club project is on the Euclid side, so any surveying on the Prospect side is interesting.
February 7, 20205 yr I walked around/tried to find the guys but it was prime lunch time so no dice. It's been a few years, who knows if they'd recognize me at this point lol
February 7, 20205 yr Author 12 minutes ago, GISguy said: Looks like my former engineering firm was doing some surveying on the Prospect side of things, not sure if it's related to this project or not, but it seems right? @GISguy What kind of surveying? Optical? Geotechnical? Aerial/drone? What's the name of your former employer? Feel free to PM if you prefer. Edited February 7, 20205 yr by KJP "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
February 7, 20205 yr Just pmed. Hopefully I didn't jump the gun, they were shooting optical from the old cash stop ish towards southern tier on the sidewalk. Mods, feel free to move this somewhere more appropriate
February 7, 20205 yr I know nothing has been even hinted at in any announcements, but I have to believe that if City Club Apartments are a success, then some sort of Phase II on the Prospect side is pretty much inevitable.
February 7, 20205 yr 39 minutes ago, X said: I know nothing has been even hinted at in any announcements, but I have to believe that if City Club Apartments are a success, then some sort of Phase II on the Prospect side is pretty much inevitable. With a green roof/space added to the garage.
February 8, 20205 yr 6 hours ago, X said: I know nothing has been even hinted at in any announcements, but I have to believe that if City Club Apartments are a success, then some sort of Phase II on the Prospect side is pretty much inevitable. A while before the announcement, I remember there being insider knowledge that the Prospect side was a possible Phase II posted on this forum. Edited February 8, 20205 yr by tykaps
February 21, 20205 yr https://mobile.twitter.com/mjarboe/status/1230909882477547523 Edited February 21, 20205 yr by Sapper Daddy
February 21, 20205 yr The design is growing on me. It still looks cheap, but it'll be a pop of color and quirkyness on a mostly historic street. Side note, the city is getting worse and worse about posting agendas. It seems like every month there's one or two meeting agendas that never get posted to the CPC website, or the agenda is posted without pictures. They used to be pretty good about getting them 2-3 days before the meeting. Today's meeting is over and the agenda still isn't up. The Euclid corridor design review meeting from yesterday was never posted either.
February 21, 20205 yr Nobody can convince me that purple color is tasteful on a building. But otherwise I do like the overall design.
February 21, 20205 yr It reminds be a bit of the old Dollar Bank building that used to sit on the other side of 668. I like that sort of "quirky" modernism.
February 21, 20205 yr 8 minutes ago, Htsguy said: I still don't get the random bay windows. I think it’s not so much the aesthetics you’ll see on the exterior as it is the panoramic view it’ll offer from inside.
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