The US Bank Arena is garbage. Hardly any club seats. What's the price of an NBA ticket? I think Cincinniati could draw 18k a game, but i think that's too small for NBA standards.

 

Actually if you do some digging and look at capacities for NBA arenas....you will see that US Bank Arena is on the smaller end of the scale, but it is right on line with other markets of Cincy's size (Milwaukee).

 

It is the lack of luxury suites that kills US Bank Arena not the capacity.  You make your money on the suites and boxes...not everyday tickets.

I heard that the Seattle SuperSonics was bought by some Oklahoma City business men and are moving the team down there? Is this correct and if so, when?

 

U.S. Bank Arena wouldn't work well for an NBA team. No boxes and the ones they do have are too high up.  Any hopes for a new arena would be in Butler, Warren, maybe Montgomery Counties. With 5/3 Arena being redone/torn down in the next 5-10 years, that could also be a possibility.

I guess people like Michael Jordan and Jay-Z invest in those franchises to lose money.

 

For the most part, yes. People buy sports franchises because they want to own a sports franchise, not because they are hoping to make money.

 

Must explain why people buy sport franchises at 100 million dollars and sell them at 200 million dollars

Charlotte is NOT going anywhere either.  Charlotte is home to the bobcats now.

No one willingly loses millions of dollars, that's asinine. Rich businessmen are not going to invest in a team for the "coolness factor" of owning one.

With 5/3 Arena being redone/torn down in the next 5-10 years, that could also be a possibility.

 

My sources at UC have informed me that the university has hired an architect to design a new arena for the Bearcats....possibly in the area immediatley east/southeast of the current 5/3 Arena.  Now this wouldn't be happening too soon, because the athletic department does have some other priorities before a new arena (renovation of Nippert Field press box area, Armory Fieldhouse renovations).

 

This is just some food for thought....initial requests for the new arena were: increased seating capacity (15,000 or so), improved sightlines/student seating arangement, and greatly improved/increased number of luxury suites/boxes.

^ We may have similar sources! With Sander Hall (mainly closed) containing some DAAP classes and the African American Studies, both easily relocated to other buildings, this site would be perfect because it is close enough to the old arena and the area where 5/3 sits could be redeveloped as part of the new arena.

Awesome. I'd like to see a rendering of the new facility.

I guess people like Michael Jordan and Jay-Z invest in those franchises to lose money.

 

For the most part, yes. People buy sports franchises because they want to own a sports franchise, not because they are hoping to make money.

 

Must explain why people buy sport franchises at 100 million dollars and sell them at 200 million dollars

 

And aside from someone holding the team for 50 plus years, can you cite an occurance of this?

 

I have re-read what I said, and what I meant was that pro sports teams rarely if ever maximize profit. However, with the exception of the NFL, whose revenue figures are harder to get a hold of and are inflated by monster tv contracts; a sizeable chunk of pro sports franchises, turn little or no profit. Many lose money. No body would buy a pro sports franchise hoping to make money, unless they were hoping to tank the team and not field a winner. There will always be exceptions.

From what I heard the site where Dabney, French and Sanders stands will be the location of the new College of Applied Science. They plan to bring that college to the main campus and sell there property in Walnut Hills.

I guess people like Michael Jordan and Jay-Z invest in those franchises to lose money.

 

For the most part, yes. People buy sports franchises because they want to own a sports franchise, not because they are hoping to make money.

 

Must explain why people buy sport franchises at 100 million dollars and sell them at 200 million dollars

 

And aside from someone holding the team for 50 plus years, can you cite an occurance of this?

 

I have re-read what I said, and what I meant was that pro sports teams rarely if ever maximize profit. However, with the exception of the NFL, whose revenue figures are harder to get a hold of and are inflated by monster tv contracts; a sizeable chunk of pro sports franchises, turn little or no profit. Many lose money. No body would buy a pro sports franchise hoping to make money, unless they were hoping to tank the team and not field a winner. There will always be exceptions.

Perhaps those figures are hard to get because no profit = justification of taxpayers financing their stadiums? The reason people invest money is because they anticipate a return on their investment. No one does it to see it go down the drain. If they are that stupid then I'd like to know how they managed to acquire their wealth in the first place. I've read somewhere the same thing C-Dawg cited about broadcasting revenues being split between all teams. Baseball doesn't bring as much revenue but the salary caps are probably about half of what basketball and football are despite the fact that there are way more games in a season.

 

With 5/3 Arena being redone/torn down in the next 5-10 years, that could also be a possibility.

 

My sources at UC have informed me that the university has hired an architect to design a new arena for the Bearcats....possibly in the area immediatley east/southeast of the current 5/3 Arena.  Now this wouldn't be happening too soon, because the athletic department does have some other priorities before a new arena (renovation of Nippert Field press box area, Armory Fieldhouse renovations).

 

This is just some food for thought....initial requests for the new arena were: increased seating capacity (15,000 or so), improved sightlines/student seating arangement, and greatly improved/increased number of luxury suites/boxes.

 

i know that we have the same sources rando...but, do you think that the recent budget crisis at UC would hinder this project being started? or would this be a project (like the other athletic facilities) that would be paid for out of the athletic budget . i.e. Lindner....Rando...i think we need to do some digging and see if they have an updaded UC master plan that has this arena / OCAS area redesigned. I remember last year i had heard that they were in the process of revising the master plan to look toward the future now that Mainstreet/ Varsity village are completed...

Gund made a killing off the Cavs and he only owned them for 15-20 years.

Likewise with Jacobs and the Indians. Get a shitty franchise, build a new arena/stadium, turn teams fortunes around, sell it at it's peak. You don't need 50 years to do that.

i know that we have the same sources rando...but, do you think that the recent budget crisis at UC would hinder this project being started? or would this be a project (like the other athletic facilities) that would be paid for out of the athletic budget . i.e. Lindner

 

I think that without a doubt, this project would have to be paid for privately without money from the university.  It is obvious that the university cannot afford to fund any major projects at this time, but their is a very wealthy community in Cincinnati that has pony'ed up significant money for these types of things before (Linder, Aronoff, etc).

 

On another note, I dont think that the university wants to sit back and watch all of the events in the city go to Cintas Center when they were previously at the Shoe (graduations, boxing, concerts, whatever else).  Nearly every event in the city is held at the Cintas Center and UC is losing out.  On top of all this, the current arena is directly affected the attendance numbers for Bearcat Bball.  The Shoe sucks for viewing Bball, and athletic department needs the Bball team to be the cash cow for the rest of the sports.

 

I would think that this project will get done...but it will have to be with private money.  I also wouldnt expect it to be more than 5 years down the road.

I guess people like Michael Jordan and Jay-Z invest in those franchises to lose money.

 

For the most part, yes. People buy sports franchises because they want to own a sports franchise, not because they are hoping to make money.

 

Must explain why people buy sport franchises at 100 million dollars and sell them at 200 million dollars

 

And aside from someone holding the team for 50 plus years, can you cite an occurance of this?

 

I have re-read what I said, and what I meant was that pro sports teams rarely if ever maximize profit. However, with the exception of the NFL, whose revenue figures are harder to get a hold of and are inflated by monster tv contracts; a sizeable chunk of pro sports franchises, turn little or no profit. Many lose money. No body would buy a pro sports franchise hoping to make money, unless they were hoping to tank the team and not field a winner. There will always be exceptions.

Perhaps those figures are hard to get because no profit = justification of taxpayers financing their stadiums? The reason people invest money is because they anticipate a return on their investment. No one does it to see it go down the drain. If they are that stupid then I'd like to know how they managed to acquire their wealth in the first place. I've read somewhere the same thing C-Dawg cited about broadcasting revenues being split between all teams. Baseball doesn't bring as much revenue but the salary caps are probably about half of what basketball and football are despite the fact that there are way more games in a season.

 

 

Seriously, anyone buying a pro sports franchise thinking of it as an "investment" is crazy. There are much better things to place your money into if you want to turn a long-term profit. 

 

In 2003, half of all MLB teams lost money. MLB, by the way, has no salary cap.  Also, MLB does split money from national contracts up among teams (ie ESPN, Fox SAturday games and post-season games), but that is the extent of the sharing. The broadcasts you see on regional FSN stations are not split.  The Cleveland Indians get no part of the money the Reds bring in from FSN Ohio. Many teams (such as the NY Yankees) have started launching their own networks to broadcast games on, so they can generate more revenue and control more of the advertising money.

 

In the NBA, it is about a third losing money, and a few who turned a miniscule profit.

 

Most NHL teams, pre-lockout, lost money.

 

Sports stadiums are also poor ways to spend money, and that is why very few owners are willing to finance them with out help.  Sports stadiums are great for downtown neighborhoods, but the idea that they generate millions of dollars for a city is bunk.

Baseball may not have salary caps, I just know that they are paid significantly less than basketball and football. I agree that stadiums are complete crap for a city's vitality. I won't shoot that already dead horse any more though.

From what I heard the site where Dabney, French and Sanders stands will be the location of the new College of Applied Science. They plan to bring that college to the main campus and sell there property in Walnut Hills.

 

With all the recent additions and renovations to French Hall, I can't imagine them tearing that down---it is more likely it would be used for OCAS as is.  As for Dabney, I can't see it closing in the near future the demand for housing is too high and Dabney Hall has become the place to live since it is right next door to the new Rec Center.

 

I suspect the campus master plan is being altered.  President Zimpher has declared that no new construction projects will occur for awhile.

 

Dabney Hall has become the place to live since it is right next door to the new Rec Center.

 

Thats hilarious....Dabney is a total shithole compared to the rest of the dorm options!  As for French Hall....it is too far south for a new arena site, I would think for that area to work they would also have to tear up the new dorms along Jefferson Ave.  The site would be more like the:  Dabney, Daniels, Sander, open area.  That particular area would work with the university's comprehensive plan and would seem to be a better locale for an arena than the current site.

 

As for the housing situation...that is the major holdup.  The university cannot afford to lose anymore student housing; however, the university architect made it clear that the university has plans to demo the Alumni Center (offices now in new Linder Center) to make room for more student housing in that area.  I would also hope that they would start building the student housing, that is slated to replace the 3 towers, start sooner rather than later.  Build the new as they demo the old.  This could ease the situation.

Dabney really is not close to the new rec center. The entrance is all the way under the new dorms. Its closer than the rest, but not by much, or at least not enough for people to be clamouring to get in the space. With the housing crunch they messed up demolishing Sawyer. Out of 35,000 only 3,000-4,000 stay on campus. They need housing fast. Moreso than an NBA arena.

^In defense of UC...they are completely tied with a very limited amount of land...therefore a lot of new student housing is not directly affiliated with the university (University Park Apts, McMillan Manor, surrounding neighborhood housing rehabs, etc).  There are a lot more 3-4,000 living on/around campus....its just that the numbers are a little deceiving.

 

and yes the arena can wait...but in respect to this topic, we'll have our fun!

Dabney sucks! I moved out of Daniels in June. It was fun and it is better than the new dorms because people always have their doors open and its easier to meet people. Now, Daniels needs some help, but I don't think it needs to be torn down right away. I like the Alumni site for future housing, maybe similar to Turner? As far as the remaining two ugly sisters, more dorms would be great there too. UC charges a ton to live on campus, but they sell out each school year, so its stupid that they don't continue building them.

www.newsrecord.org/media/storage/paper693/news/2007/11/05/Sports/Column.Monday.Morning.Qb-3077279.shtml]NBA Basketball in Cincinnati, just what city needs[/url]

BY DAVID HARDING | UC NEWS RECORD

November 5, 2007

 

CINCINNATI - Growing up an hour south of Cleveland in Canton, Ohio, I have always been a huge NBA fan. Since I was three years old, I went to Cleveland Cavaliers basketball games every year.

 

But as I moved to Cincinnati three years ago, I noticed a void in the town's sporting landscape. The sport that I have always loved is nonexistent in the Queen City.

 

 

^ Hey, I was at that Jazz-Celtics game.

 

Well, if we did get the SuperSonics to relocate to Cincinnati, and I'm sure that won't happen (and do we really need to build another huge arena for another private sports team?) we'd have to change the name "SuperSonics" to something less lame.

I'd like to go back to the Royals!

 

I think if Memphis can support it, then Cincinnati can.

I'd rather see the NHL here, but there's no way in hell with Columbus' proximity. There's something about Canadians and hockey that I'm a little jealous of living in the states ... it's just not the same with "us and hockey" though.

I'd like to go back to the Royals!

 

I think if Memphis can support it, then Cincinnati can.

 

but Memphis doesn't have a pro baseball or football team.

I'd like to go back to the Royals!

 

I think if Memphis can support it, then Cincinnati can.

 

but Memphis doesn't have a pro baseball or football team.

 

I'm aware of this! lol ... I could see that point if the 3 seasons completely overlapped each other, but they don't.

 

 

I'd like to go back to the Royals!

 

I think if Memphis can support it, then Cincinnati can.

 

They also have a major college b-ball program and I didn't think that would work at all. OSU is the best football team money can buy, but I really doubt Columbus could support an NFL team too. If a city has a major college presence, outside of the major cities, I doubt they could also support a professional team.

 

I would love to see the NBA here, but if people complain about the cost of going to Reds games, the NBA isn't cheap. Plus US Bank arena wouldn't fly in today's NBA.

 

I've gone to nearly a dozen Phoenix Suns games and they are always an event. The crowds get DT early, hitting the bars and eating. Alice Cooper's restaurant does a booming business on games days.

Its not a matter of support, They would have plenty of support. It would take a new arena. If someone would move a team here first then it would make a better case for a new arena.

 

Columbus would easily support a NFL team. If they can sell out over 105,000 every OSU game, A little NFL stadium (70,000) would be no problem. I would bet Columbus would be one of the top markets for attendance, Like every other team in Columbus.

the big difference is that osu is the largest university in the country and columbus would be a small market nfl team

the big difference is that osu is the largest university in the country and columbus would be a small market nfl team

 

Anyway, they would sell out all the games, don't think that would be a problem.

Its not a matter of support, They would have plenty of support. It would take a new arena. If someone would move a team here first then it would make a better case for a new arena.

 

Columbus would easily support a NFL team. If they can sell out over 105,000 every OSU game, A little NFL stadium (70,000) would be no problem. I would bet Columbus would be one of the top markets for attendance, Like every other team in Columbus.

Well you are comparing different pricing schemes. NFL tickets cost about 3k. it cost over 2k just to have the right to buy the seat. compare that to college which is about 15$-$50 a ticket for 6 or 7 games a year.

^I believe OSU's general public tickets (i.e. non-student) are $61 now plus $10 for parking.  And I agree with ohio1221 that the Columbus market could support a NFL team.  Of course, Columbus will not get an NFL team with Cincinnati and Cleveland having teams. 

 

Columbus would also be a likely spot for a relocated or new NBA team as well.  The Nationwide Arena holds 18,000 for a Blue Jackets hockey game.  But the arena's basketball config holds over 19,000.  All the entertainment district infrastructure (i.e. parking, restaurants etc.) is already in place to host an NBA team in Downtown Columbus.  Prior to Columbus landing the Blue Jackets there was much talk about Columbus trying to land an NBA franchise.

It's a mute point anyway. The 4 Majors say that at maximum 30-32 teams are about all the leagues can handle without talent becoming an issue and oversaturation.

^I believe OSU's general public tickets (i.e. non-student) are $61 now plus $10 for parking.  And I agree with ohio1221 that the Columbus market could support a NFL team.  Of course, Columbus will not get an NFL team with Cincinnati and Cleveland having teams. 

 

Columbus would also be a likely spot for a relocated or new NBA team as well.  The Nationwide Arena holds 18,000 for a Blue Jackets hockey game.  But the arena's basketball config holds over 19,000.  All the entertainment district infrastructure (i.e. parking, restaurants etc.) is already in place to host an NBA team in Downtown Columbus.  Prior to Columbus landing the Blue Jackets there was much talk about Columbus trying to land an NBA franchise.

 

It is mute point but . . . I still can't see the NFL in Columbus. First, Columbus would have to build a new stadium. The NFL wouldn't play in the 'shoe. That's at least a half billion. Dallas is building a new billion stadium. Second, of those 105K how many are starving college kids? ;-) But, really, Columbus would have to find nearly 70K fans that would be willing to support the NFL along with OSU? I have my doubts.

 

Now the NBA in Columbus has some legs. How new is Nationwide Arena, 4-5 years old? Does it have luxury boxes, etc? A new owner could work with that. In the Sonic's case the new owner wanted a new 300m arena Seattle. I'm not sure if it would a been all tax-payer funded. It sounds like Oklahoma City(the Sonics soon to be new home) already has a fairly new arena. The next opportunity might be the New Orleans Hornets

 

There would be a revolt in Cincy if an NBA team ask the city to built a new arena. I would be all for it. US Bank is so dated. It seems that we miss out on a lot of great concerts because of our arena. No Van Halen, Police, Bruce, Clapton, etc. All those shows skipped Cincy

US Bank is so dated. It seems that we miss out on a lot of great concerts because of our arena. No Van Halen, Police, Bruce, Clapton, etc. All those shows skipped Cincy

 

A new arena certainly wouldn't hurt but with the exception of Clapton, those shows skipped Columbus as well.

The reason it is a MOOT point, not a silent one, is that the Browns, Bengals, Cavs, Pacers, and Colts would not allow another franchise so close.  columbus is not getting the NFL or NBA.

Well, the NFL doesn't have a say in where NBA franchises go, does it?  NFL owners can move their franchises whereever they want, courtesy of (and best exemplified by) Al Davis and the Raiders.  I don't have any idea what the rules for NBA franchises are, but I'd bet it's more lenient than baseball.

Well, the NFL doesn't have a say in where NBA franchises go, does it?  NFL owners can move their franchises whereever they want, courtesy of (and best exemplified by) Al Davis and the Raiders.  I don't have any idea what the rules for NBA franchises are, but I'd bet it's more lenient than baseball.

 

True, but don't forget lots of franchises are under multi decade contracts to stay in their current city. The cavs, for instance have to stay in Cleveland for 22 more years before the contract is up.

^ How many times did the Hornets move wiith in a short period??

^One and half times. From Charlotte to New Orleans, then split time between NO and Oklahoma City post Katrina. Back now to NO full time.

 

Their success in Okla City is one reason why local businessmen went after the Sonics. NOOCH was fun to say.

bottom five mlb

 

25 Cincinnati

26 Oakland

27 Kansas City

28 Tampa Bay

29 Pittsburgh

30 Florida

bottom five nfl

 

 

27 st louis

28 Chicago

29 Pittsburgh

30 Detroit

31 Oakland

32 Indianapolis

 

I know for the time being the reality of Cincy landing any type of NBA franchise is minimal if not non-existent. But its fun to talk about anyway.

 

You never know.  If the Sonics do leave Seattle, it's possible that the NBA will do an expansion a few years down the road to replace them.  Adding only 1 team would be unusual, so if Cincy plays it's cards right, it might be able to be the other city in such an expansion.  It's a fairly unlikely scenario, but one that is at least plausible. 

 

I love your idea for resurrecting the Broadway Commons plan for an NBA arena.  I also think that Covington/Newport should be fighting for this as well.  Basketball is huge in KY, and KY has no NBA, NFL, MLB, or NHL teams.  They could put an arena near the river so it would essentially be a Cincinnati team, but they could brand it as the "Kentucky nnnnnnnn" and pull in basketball fans from around the state.  It would accomplish putting an NBA team back into the 25th largest US market and into a state that is totally overlooked by pro-sports currently.  Also, then KY could pay to build the arena this time.

bottom five mlb

 

25 Cincinnati

26 Oakland

27 Kansas City

28 Tampa Bay

29 Pittsburgh

30 Florida

 

I'm kind of surprised the Milwaukee Brewers and Chicago White Sox are not on the list.  :whip: What gives?  :?

^RIGGED!! :wink:

bottom five nfl

 

 

27 st louis

28 Chicago

29 Pittsburgh

30 Detroit

31 Oakland

32 Indianapolis

 

 

Indy is deceiving because of their small stadium.  Look at the % of capacity statistic, that gives a good idea of the team's true attendance.

As a Steelers fan myself (Shut up) I can say that Pittsburgh's placement is also due to size- it's ranked 25th.

 

It's nearly IMPOSSIBLE to get tickets.

^ They should have built a bigger stadium then. And your answer about the pirates??