Contractor-related issues.

WKRC

 

 

 

I-74 Ramp Lights Delayed Again

 

 

http://www.local12.com/news/local/story/I-74-Ramp-Lights-Delayed-Again/Z2q45Mcep0qKInAk-Apjfw.cspx

This would seem to be one of the easiest projects for ODOT to complete successfully and they have shown that they are woefully unable to do so.  It's a few frickin' traffic signals at highway onramps.  What a joke.

New look unveiled for Ironton-Russell Bridge

By Jim Sullivan, The Tribune, August 28, 2009

 

IRONTON — With the start of construction still more than two years away, the new Ironton-Russell Bridge is already getting a facelift — at least in its design.

 

Burdened with elevating costs and the lack of stimulus monies to fund the project, the proposed design of the bridge took a 180 degree turn Thursday night when officials from the Ohio Department of Transportation unveiled its new look.

The lights are on, but currently bagged.

ODOT unveils bridge design

By Jim Sullivan, The Tribune, September 11, 2009

 

IRONTON — The public got its chance on Thursday to give its two cents on the design of the new Ironton-Russell Bridge.

 

Members of the Ohio Department of Transportation conducted a public meeting open house to hear community input on the proposed design of the bridge that is slated to be completed by 2015.

 

The information session was held from 4-7 p.m. at the ODOT Lawrence County garage on Commerce Drive in Ironton.

 

First unveiled to Ironton City Council on Aug. 27, the proposed design has the new Ironton-Russell Bridge a cable-stay bridge with two towers each rising 245 feet from the Ohio River below.

 

While becoming the fourth cable-stay bridge in the state of Ohio, the new bridge will not contain the previously proposed 515-foot single tower that would have put the new bridge in the record books as having the largest bridge tower in the United States.

 

ODOT and its designers cited costs in having to modify the design from a single tower to dual towers. In order to get the two-story tower design implemented, ODOT was forced to petition the U.S. Coast Guard for a variance based on barge clearance.

Finally after all these years!

 

http://news.cincinnati.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/AB/20091112/NEWS01/911130333/

 

I-74 ramp meters start Tuesday

 

Chances are, if you drive on Interstate 74 through the western portion of Hamilton County, you've noticed those traffic lights on the side of the highway.

 

Beginning Tuesday, they will be uncovered and in service, according to the Ohio Department of Transportation.

Where did the 3 million dollar price tag come from? I thought it cost like 300k to install.

It was $3 million. The ramp meters are more than just traffic signals -- they integrate loop detectors on the ramps and on the mainline, tied into a computerized system to determine when there is enough distance for traffic to safely merge.

Maybe it was already covered here, but was was 74 chosen for the lights? I really hardly ever drive on 74, so traffic could be terrible, but is it really worse than 75 or 71? I think the ramp meters could be really useful on 71, particularly around Kenwood, Montgomery, Smith/Edwards, Pfiefer, and Cross County.

Their is a bottleneck every morning during rush hour from the 74/75 merge back to Monfort Heights.  It will be a good test for the region, but I still have my doubts.

Lots of complaints about them already. However it's only the first day and it was raining. They do need an hov bypass lane on the ramps.

New I-74 traffic signals turned on

By Quan Truong and Jennifer Baker • [email protected] | [email protected] • November 17, 2009

http://news.cincinnati.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/AB/20091117/NEWS01/311130014/http://news.cincinnati.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/AB/20091117/NEWS01/311130014/

Any new type of traffic system like this is bound to cause delays at first, until commuters adjust to it.  However, when it backs traffic all the way up onto the feeder streets, that's just bad planning. 

I was talking to an ODOT friend and she made it clear that the point of flow control lights is to keep traffic moving on the highway.  There are certain levels of service (she had a better term) that MUST be maintained on the highways.

 

Even with the learning curve there is expected to be some backup on the side streets.  Better planning on the part of municipalities and developers will be needed to avoid backups on the on ramps in the future.

Another problem I heard about the lights is that the drivers did not use both lanes to get on the highway.  I also heard that some people did not go when they got the green light.  Apparently the light changes quickly from green to red to allow only one car. 

^I've only seen them a few times while traveling.  What you're describing doesn't surprise me.  I had no idea what the "rules" were when I first encountered them.  It's probably something that gets easier as the driver grows more familiar with the process.  Personally, the idea of sitting on an on-ramp, waiting for a signal, and quickly accelerating into highway-speed traffic makes me nervous.

This morning it did absolutely nothing. I-74 and I-75 were still slowed down when they met and there was the additional wait on the on ramp, which was almost backed up onto Spring Grove Ave.

It sounds like ODOT is still doing some tweeking with these.

^I've only seen them a few times while traveling. What you're describing doesn't surprise me. I had no idea what the "rules" were when I first encountered them. It's probably something that gets easier as the driver grows more familiar with the process. Personally, the idea of sitting on an on-ramp, waiting for a signal, and quickly accelerating into highway-speed traffic makes me nervous.

 

In Columbus we used to have several of these -- that's how it works.

Official: Ramp lights tweaked

By Jennifer Baker • [email protected] • November 18, 2009

 

http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20091118/NEWS01/311180013/Official++Ramp+lights+tweaked

 

“On Montana, everything worked great,” Smigielski said Wednesday morning.

 

She said motorists on Colerain Avenue need to realize they can use two lanes, not just one, to gain access to I-74. Drivers seem to be ignoring a second, right-hand lane, she said.

These are common place here in LA. They can be a little tricky at first, but they do seem to help control the ammount of cars getting on the freeway at one time.

The timing should be about 7 seconds. In San Diego it just seems to go red green red green, so no two cars are ever entering the highway at the same time. They also had HOV bypass lanes that does not have the lights.

I-74 Ramp Meters are exactly what Cincinnatians asked for

By Randy A. Simes, UrbanCincy | November 30, 2009

http://www.urbancincy.com/2009/11/i-74-ramp-meters-are-exactly-what.html

 

It took less than one hour for the complaints to start rolling in about the new ramp meters along Cincinnati’s Interstate 74. Morning commuters complained that the meters were actually making congestion worse and that the slow downs were pushed onto the ramps and surrounding neighborhood streets leading to the interstate.

 

What many of these commuters probably do not realize is that ramp meters actually do not reduce congestion directly. Instead they diffuse congestion and reduce conflict points for drivers by eliminating much of the lane-to-lane merging that occurs around heavy on-ramp points.

 

The idea is simple, instead of having a slew of cars come rushing onto the interstate all at once, the ramp meters spread that surge out with a managed traffic flow. But what this does do is push congestion back off of the interstate onto the ramps and surrounding streets. That is unless other indirect things take place.

 

Improved traffic flow can improve capacity issues on interstates and thus reduce congestion. Well-timed and managed traffic systems surrounding interstate on-ramps that include these meters can also help avoid bottlenecks on neighborhood streets. But ultimately ramp meters do not reduce congestion for the simple reason that they do not add capacity or reduce volume.

 

The best way to reduce congestion along I-74, or any interstate, is to build additional capacity that does not strain the existing system. What this means is that simply adding a lane or two won’t do the trick, but adding a commuter light rail line will.

 

In Atlanta, the infamous “Downtown Connector” includes both I-75 and I-85 traffic and is currently in the process of being widened AGAIN. It too includes these ramp meters to manage traffic flow. Once the widening project is completed the stretch of interstate, appropriately compared to the Ohio River of Atlanta by the Carter/Dawson development team of The Banks, will boast some 24 lanes of automobile traffic including the intricate system of parallel ramps. The interstate still suffers from daily gridlock every day even with this monstrous automobile capacity because the same system is being strained to handle additional capacity while no new capacity is added to the overall transport network.

 

In Cincinnati, I-75 is being widened in most places throughout Hamilton County to 4 or 5 driving lanes not including ramps, and will also include these ramp meters at virtually every on-ramp location. With these improvements it has been identified that this stretch of interstate through Hamilton County will go from a “D” rated highway to a, wait for it, “D” rated highway once complete.

 

We are pouring billions of dollars into these interstate improvements and seeing little to no improvements in safety or congestion. A well-integrated commuter rail system that compliments our existing interstate and road networks is a much more effective way to manage traffic congestion. Such a system would provide additional capacity and options for commuters as they move from our region’s residential sectors to our region’s job centers.

 

So when you are enjoying that rush hour commute next time try to avoid letting the stress build up inside as you sit in the frustrating stop-and-go traffic. Instead be thinking about how the Cincinnati region could have been opening the first of 7 commuter light rail lines, two streetcar networks, and a completely revamped bus system had the 2002 Metro Moves plan passed. But instead of a long-term investment and solution we are stuck with temporary fixes that are wasting our tax dollars.

 

Photos of I-74 ramp meters can be seen here:

http://www.urbancincy.com/2009/11/i-74-ramp-meters-are-exactly-what.html

It was $3 million. The ramp meters are more than just traffic signals -- they integrate loop detectors on the ramps and on the mainline, tied into a computerized system to determine when there is enough distance for traffic to safely merge.

 

The state, which is conducting a ramp meter study, has not made a decision on whether to install the devices. But transportation officials said the meters - to cost up to $350,000 - could be operating in 12-18 months.

 

Told you.

 

http://www.enquirer.com/editions/2004/06/19/loc_meters19.html

Here's an interesting alternative to salt brine.... makes me want to grab a martini glass...

 

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/us/2009/12/30/dnt.magic.salt.deicer.wane

Federal Highway Adminstration design standards for an Interstate require paved berms of about a full lane's width (I believe that's 12 feet) on each side of a directional through roadway, or four berms total. Since this is a relatively new design standard, only the newest highways (since the 1980s or so) have this feature. As older roads are reconstructed, this feature is added (though some have them added without reconstruction). And, often ODOT will widen overpasses that already need major repairs to an extra lane width to more easily accommodate widening plans for the future.

 

It may well be that ODOT will seek to widen I-74 to three lanes in the future, but it doesn't sound like that's what happening now. Check OKI's Transportation Improvement Program to see if anything like that is being considered in the next few years.

 

As an update, the full left- and right-shoulders (12 ft.) is only required if there are three or more lanes in a single direction.

 

Jumping in late (hehe), the bridge reconstruction involved adding several new girders and widening the bridge deck to accommodate three-lanes in the future. ODOT has prepped the highway for future expansion when needed.

The OH 4 bypass, which is two-lanes on a four-lane right-of-way, was constructed in 1969.

 

Big project to begin on Bypass 4

By Sue Kiesewetter, Cincinnati Enquirer, March 28, 2010

 

The long-awaited widening of the Ohio 4 Bypass will begin this summer.

 

Bid openings start Monday through the end of April for the first phases of the project, which will add a northbound and southbound lane from the road's southern intersection at Ohio 4 and moving north to near the ramps for Ohio 129.

 

Intersection improvements are also slated for the bypass' intersection with Symmes, Tylersville and Hamilton-Mason roads.

First Phase Of Bypass Project Gets Funding

By Frank Lewis, Portsmouth Daily Times, April 30, 2010

 

PIKETON — District 9 of the Ohio Department of Transportation held its Legislative Day and Transportation Roundtable Thursday at the Pike County ODOT garage.

 

At that meeting, James Brushart, District 9 deputy director, gave an overview of several projects being planned for the eight counties in the District 9 region, including the Portsmouth Bypass, the Waverly South connector and the Ironton-Russell bridge.

"Superstreet" intersection work starts

By Jennifer Baker, Cincinnati Enquirer, May 12, 2010

 

Work begins Wednesday on a “superstreet” intersection at Ohio Bypass 4 and Tylersville Road, the first of its kind to be built in the state, according to the Ohio Department of Transportation.

 

The $11 million project is being funded by the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act and is one of several superstreet intersections slated for construction along the Bypass corridor, according to ODOT officials.

This is just golden.  In order to cross the intersecting street in an automobile you have to turn right, go down another lane, then turn left, go back and turn right.  I'm glad they are making things so much easier in the 'burbs!

For OH 4 traffic, you are now going through two signals and traffic in the rear may get caught at the second light. If you are on the cross-road, you are now going through three signals, two of which you may be stopped at.

 

I wonder what the other alternatives would be. OH 4 Bypass was designed for four-lanes but not for interchanges, which is a shame. A roundabout would not be advised due to the heavy traffic load on the cross streets, and a traffic signal is not that optimal.

And you can forget about walking across that street!

Superstreets OH Bypass 4

 

Just...wow.

For OH 4 traffic, you are now going through two signals and traffic in the rear may get caught at the second light. If you are on the cross-road, you are now going through three signals, two of which you may be stopped at.

 

I wonder what the other alternatives would be. OH 4 Bypass was designed for four-lanes but not for interchanges, which is a shame. A roundabout would not be advised due to the heavy traffic load on the cross streets, and a traffic signal is not that optimal.

 

I believe the southern SR4/Bypass 4 has extra R/W for an interchange. You can see it in the field on the NW corner of the intersection. I believe the bypass was to continue to the south as a 4-lane road to I-275.

 

The proposed signals will all be 2-phase signals which are highly efficient in moving traffic. It may seem counter-intuitive, but 3 2-phase signals of a 30 sec cycle length is more efficient than a traditional 8 phase signal (left turn phase for each approach), that signal cycle could be well over 240 seconds.

I can barely see it, but you may be right. That is one tight diamond configuration.

 

I wonder if this will be the first "superstreet" in Ohio. The intersection of OH 747 and Austin Pike looks very, very similar to the "superstreet" proposed above.

Tol me it seem like more fuel will be wasted because you have to drive further just to go straight... INSANE.

Another item to note that happened about 30 years ago is the completion of I-74 connecting with I-75 in 1974. Like many other interstate highways around the country, once the interstate penetrated the city, it spread out an depopulated the part of the city into which it ran. People could now live farther out in on the west side Colerain Township, Grosbeck, Dent, etc.

 

Just imagine how extending I-74 to Wilmington N.C. from where it ends today will depopulate the east side of Cincinnati.

Another item to note that happened about 30 years ago is the completion of I-74 connecting with I-75 in 1974.  Like many other interstate highways around the country, once the interstate penetrated the city, it spread out an depopulated the part of the city into which it ran.  People could now live farther out in on the west side Colerain Township, Grosbeck, Dent, etc.

 

Just imagine how extending I-74 to Wilmington N.C. from where it ends today will depopulate the east side of Cincinnati.

 

I do not believe this will happen. It could, but Clermont County is a bastion of Appalachian culture. I speculate that suburban pioneers into Warren county had a neutral opinion of the local school districts and culture. Most established east side Cincinnatians have a negative opinion of most school districts in Clermont county.

Another item to note that happened about 30 years ago is the completion of I-74 connecting with I-75 in 1974. Like many other interstate highways around the country, once the interstate penetrated the city, it spread out an depopulated the part of the city into which it ran. People could now live farther out in on the west side Colerain Township, Grosbeck, Dent, etc.

 

Just imagine how extending I-74 to Wilmington N.C. from where it ends today will depopulate the east side of Cincinnati.

 

I do not believe this will happen. It could, but Clermont County is a bastion of Appalachian culture. I speculate that suburban pioneers into Warren county had a neutral opinion of the local school districts and culture. Most established east side Cincinnatians have a negative opinion of most school districts in Clermont county.

 

If you don't believe the groundwork for bringing I-74 through Cincinnati is being laid right now, do these three things:

 

1. Drive the Red Bank "Expressway" and notice how far back the new buildings have been sited from the current right-of-way.

 

2. Review some zoning maps to see the ghost of a grade-separated interchange footprint that city traffic engineers are trying to reserve land for at Madison Road and the Red Bank Expressway.

 

2. Get a Rand McNally Atlas and see the pieces of I-74 starting to appear on the map of North Carolina.

John,

 

Interstate 74 is not on the drawing board for either Ohio or Kentucky. OH 32, while a four-lane expressway, contains numerous at-grade intersections and would need a new connector from some point near Peebles to Portsmouth's upcoming bypass. Those at-grades would need to be eliminated, and ODOT has not programmed any money for any studies for such a thing, nor have they even considered it in about five years. Like Interstate 73's corridor along US 23, it's dead.

 

Kentucky only briefly studied an Interstate 74 corridor along the AA Highway, but this too is dead due to the extreme costs of widening a two-lane road and removing dozens upon dozens of at-grade intersections. The only item on the six-year TIP is a study to widen the AA from the Campbell County line to Maysville to four-lanes, and the initial proposals call for the keeping of the at-grade intersections, but with a new limited-access bypass of Maysville.

 

Of course, there is some 100+ miles in West Virginia, and as I've traveled and documented the highway extensively for WVDOH, the King Coal and Tulsia Highway projects are not being built to interstate standards. Instead, they are being built to West Virginia corridor highway standards: interchanges at major junctions, and at-grades with a 65 MPH speed limit and a 75 MPH design speed. The cost for just completing the highway was $1 billion in 2003; only scant miles have been completed at Prichard, Crum and near Bluefield, with some grading at Welch for the junction of the Coalfields Expressway (also a corridor highway, not Interstate 66).

 

North Carolina is upgrading existing freeways to interstate standards, but not all of it is signed for Interstate 73/74. There are many existing freeways, detonated in blue on the Rand McNally, that are substandard and have grass shoulders, for instance. Other four-lane highways are being merely upgraded to interstate standards. Check out my friend's log on the status of each segment and how it is signed; the FHWA will not allow most segments to be signed as an interstate: http://www.duke.edu/~rmalme/prog74.html

 

As for Red Bank, that was part of a once-proposed Red Bank Expressway, but that plan died 30 years ago. The new buildings are not any further back than previously; many just have surface lots in front. With Cincinnati just rebuilding the southern portion of Red Bank, in place with curbs, sidewalks and a bike path, there is no commitment for an expressway or freeway.

 

And there is no ghost of an interchange footprint at Madison and Red Bank. There is businesses developed on two corners, with a hill on one side and a deep creek on the other.

 

If Interstate 74 is to go anywhere, it will be routed on existing interstate highways. What purpose is there to route Interstate 74 on Red Bank if it just ends at an equally non-standard US 50, and we all know the expressway along the Little Miami is long dead.

^ Google "I-74" and "Cincinnati" and see what turns up. This is what the Eastern Corridor plan is really all about.

I'm well aware of it, and that's pretty much not being funded although preliminary studies may be ongoing. Any upgrade is of OH 32 east of Interstate 275, including a new interchange at Interstate 275, and interchanges in Eastgate. No new highway is being proposed in any six-year TIP or in any near future due to funding.

Another item to note that happened about 30 years ago is the completion of I-74 connecting with I-75 in 1974.  Like many other interstate highways around the country, once the interstate penetrated the city, it spread out an depopulated the part of the city into which it ran.  People could now live farther out in on the west side Colerain Township, Grosbeck, Dent, etc.

 

Just imagine how extending I-74 to Wilmington N.C. from where it ends today will depopulate the east side of Cincinnati.

 

I do not believe this will happen. It could, but Clermont County is a bastion of Appalachian culture. I speculate that suburban pioneers into Warren county had a neutral opinion of the local school districts and culture. Most established east side Cincinnatians have a negative opinion of most school districts in Clermont county.

 

If you don't believe the groundwork for bringing I-74 through Cincinnati is being laid right now, do these three things:

 

1. Drive the Red Bank "Expressway" and notice how far back the new buildings have been sited from the current right-of-way.

 

2. Review some zoning maps to see the ghost of a grade-separated interchange footprint that city traffic engineers are trying to reserve land for at Madison Road and the Red Bank Expressway.

 

2. Get a Rand McNally Atlas and see the pieces of I-74 starting to appear on the map of North Carolina.

 

Oh sorry I should have been more specific. I don't doubt the EC freeway, I doubt that it will spark the same kind of growth in Clermont or Brown that it did in Warren.

 

One example: Loveland and Milford PSD are in the same township in Clermont, but there is a lot of steering in the real estate community towards Loveland.

FTR, John, there are other interstate highway segments that are "disjointed" in the US. Interstate 88 is one of them. With Ohio, Kentucky and West Virginia NOT on board with a systematic inclusion of Interstate 74 on non-interstate-standard alignments, there is little rationale to believe that the highway will be constructed in our lifetimes.

 

I did an extensive Wikipedia article on it, including some photos I took, which include its debacle and why it's being built to corridor standards --

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interstate_74_in_West_Virginia

 

Ugh just noticed this has gone way off topic. There is an Eastern Corridor thread --

http://www.urbanohio.com/forum2/index.php/topic,2517.0.html

Inre EC:

 

The project between I-71 and US 50 on Red Bank Road will create interchanges at Madison/Duck Creek and also Erie Avenue. If you dig into the environmental documentation for the Eastern Corridor Project, its states specifically that it will NOT be an Interstate (aka no I-74); it will be a form of a modified expressway. The extra R/W that John was referring to @ Madison was in fact the old road that ran due north, connecting to old Red Bank at Duck Creek. The Red Bank 4 lane road veers slightly east to make its way to I-71. The projects are moving ahead as attested by this linked TRAC document, and attached image excerpt

 

http://www.dot.state.oh.us/trac/Documents/2010%20Draft%20TRAC%20List%20(March%2024,%202010)%20with%20Signature.pdf

 

 

(Feel free to move this to the EC thread)

 

 

 

[imghttp://www.cincinnati-transit.net/74-clip4.jpg[/img]http://http://According to wikipedia: Red is built, pink is planned

 

From Joe "Scoop" Wessels: (reprinted with pending permission from the author):

 

To most, Interstate 74 is the highway that starts in Northside and works its way northwest through rural southeastern Indiana. It’s the best way to get to Indianapolis and cheap flights.

 

From Indy, though, I-74 goes on to Davenport, Iowa, connecting to cross-country Interstate 80. That highway passes over some beautiful parts of our country and is a great drive. I’ve done it twice.

 

(Removed copyrighted text.)

 

http://www.citybeat.com/cincinnati/article-17603-extending-i-74-doesnrst-build-anything.html

 

Video:

 

Watch the film clip from 45:12-45:19.  Be sure to pause at exactly 45:19.  The I-74 extension east is visible on the long range map.

 

http://cincystreetcar.wordpress.com/2009/07/24/taken-for-a-ride-full-length-video/

Brad, that map is ages old (even has a date of 1991!). I have newspaper clippings from 2002 that show I-73/74 corridors, and more from 2007 that showed I-74 in Kentucky along the AA Highway. And the proposed alignments through say, West Virginia, are completely inaccurate as the highway in that state is not being built to interstate standards. You have a 200+ mile gap, and Jake hasn't updated that article in a very long time. Remember when there was a short-lived proposal for a toll road bypass in northern Kentucky for I-74?

 

And there is no east extension on the map at 45:19. None visible in Ohio, Kentucky or West Virginia. I can easily spot I-71, 75, 77, 79, 64, 81 and more in the vicinity of what was proposed.

 

@Mr. Sparkle, the modified expressway plan (HAM 86 461) essentially involves what was done on the southern half when it was rebuilt. Remove unnecessary entrances, consolidate entrances and exits through frontage roads, and widen the highway where needed. AFAIK, the Bells Lane - Red Bank proposal has not made its way past the preliminary study, as I could not obtain anything further from the PIO when I called her a while back on this.

Also note that while there's plenty of people out there (AASHTO for instance) who want to build a "second interstate highway system" and keep up the "happy motoring" mindset, we simply don't have the money for that.  We've built so many roads to so many places, we just don't need any more.  Doubling the amount of interstate highways and massively widening the ones we have aren't going to provide economic returns, and in fact their huge construction and maintenance costs are only going to further ruin our country's financial situation.  We've built an extensive and enviable highway system in the USA, but it's time to say "ok, it's done" and move on to other things like streetcars, passenger rail, etc.  We're having enough trouble maintaining what we have, so the idea that we can keep building more roads is simply not going to fly. 

Inre EC:

 

If you dig into the environmental documentation for the Eastern Corridor Project, its states specifically that it will NOT be an Interstate (aka no I-74); it will be a form of a modified expressway.

 

 

For now.