8 hours ago, JaceTheAce41 said:

Any new news on the 3C route?

IIRC at their last board meeting in November, From AAO's website, the ORDC staff stated that the study is likely to be complete in May, with the CLE-TOL being complete in July.

Edited January 13Jan 13 by Dev

Brightline was good here in Miami, but they’ve basically pushed locals out. Commuters do not use it as much as when it opened because they got rid of commuter benefits. It has essentially turned into tourists only. Not sure how different their other areas would be in the country. 

On 1/22/2025 at 2:58 PM, jjames0408 said:

Brightline was good here in Miami, but they’ve basically pushed locals out. Commuters do not use it as much as when it opened because they got rid of commuter benefits. It has essentially turned into tourists only. Not sure how different their other areas would be in the country. 

That was a capacity issue. Once they extended to Orlando the non-commuters started squeezing out the other passengers doing shorter trips.
They just got awarded a federal grant to increase the size of their consist from 5 cars to 7 to help bring that back. They just announced a new version of the old commuter pass until they get those in. Separately, they are also working with the local governments to have a dedicated commuter service.

Edited January 25Jan 25 by Dev

On 1/22/2025 at 2:58 PM, jjames0408 said:

Brightline was good here in Miami, but they’ve basically pushed locals out. Commuters do not use it as much as when it opened because they got rid of commuter benefits. It has essentially turned into tourists only. Not sure how different their other areas would be in the country. 

Brightline was never intended to be a commuter service. It was always aimed at the intercity traveler, be they tourists or not. That is especially the case since the W Palm Beach-Orlando segment was completed.

Per Amtrak's FY23 Ohio Fact sheet, Amtrak spent $48,364,754 on goods and services in Ohio in FY23 (Oct 2022 - Sept 2023), with direct spending in 30 communities all around the state:

 

11 hours ago, Boomerang_Brian said:

Per Amtrak's FY23 Ohio Fact sheet, Amtrak spent $48,364,754 on goods and services in Ohio in FY23 (Oct 2022 - Sept 2023), with direct spending in 30 communities all around the state:

 

What does Amtrak buy from Youngstown? At $11 million, it's far and away the biggest recipient.

5 hours ago, neony said:

What does Amtrak buy from Youngstown? At $11 million, it's far and away the biggest recipient.

 

Maybe 10-15 years ago, there was another huge Amtrak contract (for some reason I think it was a $40+ million job) that came out of the Youngstown area which I believe was for sandblasting and painting a bridge on the Northeast Corridor.

 

BTW, typically the largest Ohio Amtrak contractor was Cleveland Track Material which made specialty track switches and related materials. They got their raw steel shipped from Ukraine.

3 hours ago, KJP said:

 

Maybe 10-15 years ago, there was another huge Amtrak contract (for some reason I think it was a $40+ million job) that came out of the Youngstown area which I believe was for sandblasting and painting a bridge on the Northeast Corridor.

 

BTW, typically the largest Ohio Amtrak contractor was Cleveland Track Material which made specialty track switches and related materials. They got their raw steel shipped from Ukraine.

The Youngstown spend has also been significant in other years - for reference, here is the FY22 Amtrak Ohio spend (state total $31M) - Youngstown was also one of the top recipients that year, at $4.36M. Middletown, Dayton, and Westerville were also big spend locations. Hopefully we'll get FY24 details in March.

 

https://ohiochannel.org/collections/ohio-house-transportation-committee

 

I'm not sure if anyone else saw the All Aboard Ohio conversation during the House Transportation Committee yesterday, it starts at about 36:30. 

 

It was mostly about getting Ohio to rejoin MIPRC, the Midwest Interstate Passenger Rail Commission. The committee seemed to all agree we should. 

 

The most interesting part to me though starts at around 42:45, when Republican rep Jack Daniels, who is not along any of the proposed Amtrak lines, gives his brief comments. He says a decade ago he and others thought any passenger rail in Ohio was DOA. They saw no point in having trains, especially trains that took longer than driving. But he says that where we are now post covid and how mobile work and technology has become, they absolutely see the case for a 3.5 hour train ride that is a 2 hour drive because it allows the trip to be productive vs driving. Maybe that train could already be closer to 2 hours if they hadn't shot it down in the first place... He also talked about the importance of connecting with the rest of the Midwest. 

 

I know everyone on here already thought this and knew of the potential, but the fact that we have house Republicans catching up to these ideas now makes me cautiously optimistic that we may have some momentum slowly building. 

13 minutes ago, PlanCleveland said:

https://ohiochannel.org/collections/ohio-house-transportation-committee

 

I'm not sure if anyone else saw the All Aboard Ohio conversation during the House Transportation Committee yesterday, it starts at about 36:30. 

 

It was mostly about getting Ohio to rejoin MIPRC, the Midwest Interstate Passenger Rail Commission. The committee seemed to all agree we should. 

 

The most interesting part to me though starts at around 42:45, when Republican rep Jack Daniels, who is not along any of the proposed Amtrak lines, gives his brief comments. He says a decade ago he and others thought any passenger rail in Ohio was DOA. They saw no point in having trains, especially trains that took longer than driving. But he says that where we are now post covid and how mobile work and technology has become, they absolutely see the case for a 3.5 hour train ride that is a 2 hour drive because it allows the trip to be productive vs driving. Maybe that train could already be closer to 2 hours if they hadn't shot it down in the first place... He also talked about the importance of connecting with the rest of the Midwest. 

 

I know everyone on here already thought this and knew of the potential, but the fact that we have house Republicans catching up to these ideas now makes me cautiously optimistic that we may have some momentum slowly building. 

That's good to hear. If the train can equal or beat door to door drive time, it will do quite well. Air service is non factor, since there are no direct flights in the 3CD Corridor. Passengers are mostly routed via Chicago and that takes about as long as driving. Bus service is dying as well. We need trains!

25 minutes ago, PlanCleveland said:

https://ohiochannel.org/collections/ohio-house-transportation-committee

 

I'm not sure if anyone else saw the All Aboard Ohio conversation during the House Transportation Committee yesterday, it starts at about 36:30. 

 

It was mostly about getting Ohio to rejoin MIPRC, the Midwest Interstate Passenger Rail Commission. The committee seemed to all agree we should. 

 

The most interesting part to me though starts at around 42:45, when Republican rep Jack Daniels, who is not along any of the proposed Amtrak lines, gives his brief comments. He says a decade ago he and others thought any passenger rail in Ohio was DOA. They saw no point in having trains, especially trains that took longer than driving. But he says that where we are now post covid and how mobile work and technology has become, they absolutely see the case for a 3.5 hour train ride that is a 2 hour drive because it allows the trip to be productive vs driving. Maybe that train could already be closer to 2 hours if they hadn't shot it down in the first place... He also talked about the importance of connecting with the rest of the Midwest. 

 

I know everyone on here already thought this and knew of the potential, but the fact that we have house Republicans catching up to these ideas now makes me cautiously optimistic that we may have some momentum slowly building. 

 

Most state politicians drive a TON so they should have gotten it a long time ago. 

22 minutes ago, neony said:

That's good to hear. If the train can equal or beat door to door drive time, it will do quite well. Air service is non factor, since there are no direct flights in the 3CD Corridor. Passengers are mostly routed via Chicago and that takes about as long as driving. Bus service is dying as well. We need trains!

I take Amtrak to/from Buffalo quite often and, if everything is running on time, it's actually quite competitive since there is only one quick intermediate stop in Erie PA.   Cleveland do Buffalo is typically right around 3 hours, and the reverse is around 3:20.    I can drive in slightly less as long as their is no traffic, weather, police, etc.    But not that much less. 

1 hour ago, PlanCleveland said:

https://ohiochannel.org/collections/ohio-house-transportation-committee

 

I'm not sure if anyone else saw the All Aboard Ohio conversation during the House Transportation Committee yesterday, it starts at about 36:30. 

 

It was mostly about getting Ohio to rejoin MIPRC, the Midwest Interstate Passenger Rail Commission. The committee seemed to all agree we should. 

 

The most interesting part to me though starts at around 42:45, when Republican rep Jack Daniels, who is not along any of the proposed Amtrak lines, gives his brief comments. He says a decade ago he and others thought any passenger rail in Ohio was DOA. They saw no point in having trains, especially trains that took longer than driving. But he says that where we are now post covid and how mobile work and technology has become, they absolutely see the case for a 3.5 hour train ride that is a 2 hour drive because it allows the trip to be productive vs driving. Maybe that train could already be closer to 2 hours if they hadn't shot it down in the first place... He also talked about the importance of connecting with the rest of the Midwest. 

 

I know everyone on here already thought this and knew of the potential, but the fact that we have house Republicans catching up to these ideas now makes me cautiously optimistic that we may have some momentum slowly building. 

It’s great to hear the bipartisan support - this has been one of our main drivers at AAO. We know that Republican leadership has to be bought in on passenger rail in Ohio or it won’t happen. We (AAO) will be doing a big push at the statehouse via individual meetings with legislators in a couple weeks. If anyone would be willing to volunteer to do research on the legislators to help us prepare for those meetings, please let me know!

 

35 minutes ago, Cleburger said:

I take Amtrak to/from Buffalo quite often and, if everything is running on time, it's actually quite competitive since there is only one quick intermediate stop in Erie PA.   Cleveland do Buffalo is typically right around 3 hours, and the reverse is around 3:20.    I can drive in slightly less as long as their is no traffic, weather, police, etc.    But not that much less. 

Amtrak from Chicago to Cleveland on the Floridian / Capital Limited is scheduled for six hours, which is definitely drive-time competitive. (For some reason Lakeshore Limited is scheduled for closer to seven hours - not sure why on that difference, but even that travel time is ok.) The only drawback is departure/arrival times in CLE. 

6 hours ago, GCrites said:

 

Most state politicians drive a TON so they should have gotten it a long time ago. 

 

So do state employees using the state motor pool. Fifteen years ago I had gotten some insider info on the costs, practices, etc of the state motor pool. From that, I found that the state could achieve a significant budget offset by reducing its use of the pool and use trains instead for official state travel in the 3C Corridor. That reduction was estimated to be up to $10 million per year. The 3C operating subsidy was estimated at $17 million per year. And it would be something that everyone could use. That budget offset plus the state sales tax revenue from additional travel, the state income tax revenues from new jobs, and the reduced wear-and-tear on Ohio roadways would result in a first-year direct benefit to the state's budget of $14 million, rising to $31.5 million in the fifth year of 3C service while the inflation-adjusted state subsidy would drop as more travelers became familiar with the rail service. In other words, the 3C trains would save the state budget more than $10 million per year in 2010 dollars.

 

I posted the report here: https://neo-trans.blog/wp-content/uploads/2025/02/3C-fiscal-impact-FINAL.pdf

And the appendices here: https://neo-trans.blog/wp-content/uploads/2025/02/3C-fiscal-impact-appendices.pdf

This is HUGE news! It's something we've never gotten before. AAO's predecessor, the Ohio Association of Railroad Passengers, was a member of the Ohio Chamber of Commerce for years and tried to get their support for passenger rail legislation. Most of the time, they were apathetic. When they finally took a position, they opposed it. So OARP dropped its membership in OCC. This is a major turnaround. I smell Brightline lurking in the background.
 

 

 

On 2/14/2025 at 9:52 AM, KJP said:

This is HUGE news! It's something we've never gotten before. AAO's predecessor, the Ohio Association of Railroad Passengers, was a member of the Ohio Chamber of Commerce for years and tried to get their support for passenger rail legislation. Most of the time, they were apathetic. When they finally took a position, they opposed it. So OARP dropped its membership in OCC. This is a major turnaround. I smell Brightline lurking in the background.
 

 

 

This IS a big breakthrough. The 3CD is such a no-brainer and should have happened decades ago. Here's hoping.

If Brightline intended to serve this corridor, how would they do it, infrastructure-wise?  Would the route be on existing trackage only, or would there be new development?

1 hour ago, urb-a-saurus said:

If Brightline intended to serve this corridor, how would they do it, infrastructure-wise?  Would the route be on existing trackage only, or would there be new development?

Brightline has done both models - original Florida was on existing freight rail infrastructure, Florida’s Orlando extension was new track in existing right of way, and LA-Vegas is new rail right of way (mostly in the highway median).

 

But let’s be clear - projections for 3C&D with mostly 79 mph service will probably be in the 400-600k annual passengers range. Brightline has previously implied they are only interested in routes of 1M+ annual ridership. I’m still having a hard time imagining a scenario where a private for-profit operator will be interested in 3C&D - it will need to be state subsidized. Now the subsidy COULD be funded by station-area TIFs doing value capture on the increased value. I think this would be an innovative way to fund rail, especially in the political climate of Ohio. 

^ Yeah the only route in Ohio Brightline has ever shown any real interest in is a Y shaped Chicago, Cleveland, Detroit line. Personally I'd rather have them build that line anyway. 

 

If a private carrier did decide to take the plunge on the 3C+D I would hope they'd lay new track. The Median of I-71 has space for much of the route (though definitely not the whole way). They utilized a highway median for Brightline West, we'll see if it pays off for them, but it should theoretically speed things up. 

 

Edit: maybe they could do utilize a combination, use existing freight tracks near and through urban areas to minimize right of way acquisition, and then transition to new tracks in the I-71 median to increase speed and minimize delays. 

I think if the 3CD is done at all, it will eventually be a blended corridor, with some joint running on freight RR tracks, acquired ROW (Burt-Columbus), running on Interstate ROW (I-70 Columbus-Springfield), abandoned RR ROW (Erie Lackawanna Springfield-Dayton). Speeds could range from 79-90-110-125 mph for a possible 4 hour running time or less. This would be fast enough to equal or beat auto door to door times and might cost around $5 billion. It might also start off entirely on freight RR tracks.

 

I-71 between Cleveland and Columbus is generally too hilly for passenger trains and misses midpoints. It also bypasses Dayton.

 

Just my thoughts...

Edited February 16Feb 16 by neony

8 hours ago, neony said:

I think if the 3CD is done at all, it will eventually be a blended corridor, with some joint running on freight RR tracks, acquired ROW (Burt-Columbus), running on Interstate ROW (I-70 Columbus-Springfield), abandoned RR ROW (Erie Lackawanna Springfield-Dayton). Speeds could range from 79-90-110-125 mph for a possible 4 hour running time or less. This would be fast enough to equal or beat auto door to door times and might cost around $5 billion. It might also start off entirely on freight RR tracks.

 

I-71 between Cleveland and Columbus is generally too hilly for passenger trains and misses midpoints. It also bypasses Dayton.

 

Just my thoughts...

 

Build either the Lakefront Bypass in Cleveland or return to Union Terminal.

 

Then add a 90-110 mph passenger-only main with passing sidings from Berea to Galion with a flyover at Greenwich.

 

Acquire the Galion-Columbus CSX Burt Line and upgrade it to 110 mph.

 

Build 125 mph high-speed track in the wonderfully wide I-70 median Columbus-Enon (west of Springfield).

 

Continue at 110-125 mph on the former Erie RR ROW, then....

 

I would consolidate through freight traffic (minus local service) between Dayton and Winton Place (near Cincinnati) on the double-tracked NS line. That means grade-separating the CSX and NS junctions in and near Hamilton, likely with a passenger rail flyover through Hamilton. Most of this could be operated at 90-110 mph.

 

South of Winton Place into a downtown Cincinnati riverfront station, I would build a dedicated, double-tracked passenger line around the west side of Queensgate Yard.

^I wonder if ODOT plans to "third lane" I-70, where the rail would go, or is there enough room with a third lane?

Edited February 16Feb 16 by urb-a-saurus

What I do know is that if rail infrastructure is in highway medians it is eligible for highway dollars.

4 hours ago, KJP said:

 

Build either the Lakefront Bypass in Cleveland or return to Union Terminal.

 

Then add a 90-110 mph passenger-only main with passing sidings from Berea to Galion with a flyover at Greenwich.

 

Acquire the Galion-Columbus CSX Burt Line and upgrade it to 110 mph.

 

Build 125 mph high-speed track in the wonderfully wide I-70 median Columbus-Enon (west of Springfield).

 

Continue at 110-125 mph on the former Erie RR ROW, then....

 

I would consolidate through freight traffic (minus local service) between Dayton and Winton Place (near Cincinnati) on the double-tracked NS line. That means grade-separating the CSX and NS junctions in and near Hamilton, likely with a passenger rail flyover through Hamilton. Most of this could be operated at 90-110 mph.

 

South of Winton Place into a downtown Cincinnati riverfront station, I would build a dedicated, double-tracked passenger line around the west side of Queensgate Yard.

The Galion-Columbus "Burt" is tantalizing - only one curve of any significance at the north end and the rest is arrow straight with only a very gentle curve north of Delaware. Eliminate the grade crossings and cruise at 125 mph.

2 hours ago, urb-a-saurus said:

^I wonder if ODOT plans to "third lane" I-70, where the rail would go, or is there enough room with a third lane?

 

I-70 already is three lanes in each direction all the way from I-270 to I-75. The last section of two lanes per side was expanded in 2022 on the south side of Springfield. According to Google Earth the median width ranges from 30 feet where there are breakdown lanes on both sides of the highway to 50 feet where the breakdown lanes are only on the outer lanes of the highway. Even 28 feet is enough for a two-track-wide railroad with concrete barriers between the railroad and the highway's breakdown lanes.

 

Crossovers between the eastbound and westbound lanes exist every 10,000 to 30,000 feet. But there are interchanges where police can reverse directions. In the three long stretches where there are no interchanges, the rail line could descend to allow crossovers or a highway interchange or two could be added be it for public use or for safety forces only.

 

The I-70 median exists from just east of I-270 to Enon (how convenient!). While it would be great if the median continued several miles east of I-270 to where the highway runs next to CSX's Scottslawn Sub, the new rail could run along the north side of I-70 where the right of way has at least 75 feet of grassy berm for those three miles. 

Next week's agenda and meeting packet were uploaded to ORDC's website. The director's report has a small update on the CID projects:

 

Quote

Work continues on the two awarded corridors. The FRA has accepted the gap analysis for the 3C&D corridor and the gap analysis for the Cleveland-Toledo-Detroit corridor will be submitted shortly. Once staff has a draft final scope, schedule and budget for Step 2 of the Corridor ID process, those documents will be shared with the Commission.

 

Additionally, their budget update shows that they have or will pay HDR Engineering $997,460 for their work on the 2 projects. The remainder can be carried over into Step 2 of the program, but that is only $2,540.

 

There is also an unusual step being asked of the board for the grade crossing elimination program. They have 4 projects that have been awarded funds by the FRA, two of which have passenger rail impacts and another that would also positively impact 3C+D, however they are concerned the money made not be disbursed to them by the Feds. So staff is asking the board to pass resolutions applying more state funds so those projects could still move forward in the event the Federal grants are rescinded. The Ohio program has already allocated $13.6 million to the 4 projects, with the FRA awarding them another $81 million. This would backfill almost all of those funds.

 

They will also be confirming the contract with AECOM for the Cincinnati Congestion Mitigation Plan. They write that they got 4 responses to the bid but they went with AECOM due to past positive reviews. They also stated that the company's project manager is "very familiar with the southwest Ohio rail network," which of course he does given their recent work for Oxford and Hamilton.

 

Finally, there is also a minor update about the work on the state's rail plan:

 

Quote

Work on the Rail Plan continues. Rail Commission staff are reviewing the various drafts that incorporate more than 2000 responses from our public outreach. Thank you to all the Commissioners who have commented on the goals and objectives documents. Staff will be reviewing those comments under Old Business during the March meeting.

 

Passenger Rail Funds Dropped from State Budget

 

Advocates are sounding the alarm after Ohio House Republicans yesterday revealed an updated budget proposal that does not include the small amount of funding requested to support passenger rail in the state.

 

All Aboard Ohio sent out an email yesterday evening calling the proposal “a major step backward for Ohio’s passenger rail future,” and directed readers to contact their legislators.

 

The group, which advocates for improved and expanded passenger rail in Ohio, had been lobbying legislators in recent weeks for two things – funding to rejoin the Midwest Interstate Passenger Rail Commission (MIPRC), and a relatively small increase in funding for the Ohio Rail Development Commission (ORDC).

 

The House’s version of the operating budget does not include allocations for either one.

 

More below:

https://columbusunderground.com/passenger-rail-funds-dropped-from-state-budget-bw1/

 

3 hours ago, ColDayMan said:

Passenger Rail Funds Dropped from State Budget

 

Advocates are sounding the alarm after Ohio House Republicans yesterday revealed an updated budget proposal that does not include the small amount of funding requested to support passenger rail in the state.

 

All Aboard Ohio sent out an email yesterday evening calling the proposal “a major step backward for Ohio’s passenger rail future,” and directed readers to contact their legislators.

 

The group, which advocates for improved and expanded passenger rail in Ohio, had been lobbying legislators in recent weeks for two things – funding to rejoin the Midwest Interstate Passenger Rail Commission (MIPRC), and a relatively small increase in funding for the Ohio Rail Development Commission (ORDC).

 

The House’s version of the operating budget does not include allocations for either one.

 

More below:

https://columbusunderground.com/passenger-rail-funds-dropped-from-state-budget-bw1/

 

Good job Ohio! Taking the state to the very bottom as quickly as possible 

22 minutes ago, VintageLife said:

Good job Ohio! Taking the state to the very bottom as quickly as possible 

After proposing to transfer $ 1 Billion plus to the Haslams from the State treasury and sticking taxpayers with the bond debt service tab for 30 years, the cupboards are empty for schools and transit.  Let's see what the Ohio Senate does and then DeWine is on the most important clock of his way too long political career.

25 minutes ago, Willo said:

After proposing to transfer $ 1 Billion plus to the Haslams from the State treasury and sticking taxpayers with the bond debt service tab for 30 years, the cupboards are empty for schools and transit.  Let's see what the Ohio Senate does and then DeWine is on the most important clock of his way too long political career.

He will sign whatever they put in front of him. He is spineless and worthless. He keeps spouting word vomit about wanting to do so much for kids, but I’m sure he will sign the cuts to the libraries also. 

11 hours ago, VintageLife said:

Good job Ohio! Taking the state to the very bottom as quickly as possible 

 

10 hours ago, Willo said:

After proposing to transfer $ 1 Billion plus to the Haslams from the State treasury and sticking taxpayers with the bond debt service tab for 30 years, the cupboards are empty for schools and transit.  Let's see what the Ohio Senate does and then DeWine is on the most important clock of his way too long political career.

Let’s clarify - the budget is NOT finalized yet and there is still an opportunity to get these key rail funding requests in. AAO volunteers contacted more than half of the State Reps today - quite a few Republican Reps were mad that the rail funding hadn’t been included and are trying to get it back in. Channel your rage - The more people who contact their legislators, the more likely it is to happen. Please send an email or leave a voicemail for your state Rep (and state senator) tonight. The AAO web page has instructions on what to ask for and how to get your Rep’s contact info:

 

https://www.allaboardohio.org/advocacy?utm_campaign=25bd3636-c2f5-4600-afcd-d631c9847455&utm_source=so&utm_medium=mail&cid=29badbb7-a563-44f3-91c4-2b3a2dc4a9d1

I called or emailed at least a dozen State Reps today and even heard back from several - it’s easy to leave a message (especially at night when you know it’s going straight to voicemail).  I want to emphasize that I personally had never done anything like this (contacting electeds) until recently when I got more involved in AAO. 

30 minutes ago, Boomerang_Brian said:

 

Let’s clarify - the budget is NOT finalized yet and there is still an opportunity to get these key rail funding requests in. AAO volunteers contacted more than half off the State Reps today - quite a few Republican Reps were mad that the rail funding hadn’t been included and are trying to get it back in. Channel your rage - The more people who contact their legislators, the more likely it is to happen. Please send an email or leave a voicemail for your state Rep (and state senator) tonight. The AAO web page has instructions on what to ask for and how to get your Rep’s contact info:

 

https://www.allaboardohio.org/advocacy?utm_campaign=25bd3636-c2f5-4600-afcd-d631c9847455&utm_source=so&utm_medium=mail&cid=29badbb7-a563-44f3-91c4-2b3a2dc4a9d1

I called or emailed at least a dozen State Reps today and even heard back from several - it’s easy to leave a message (especially at night when you know it’s going straight to voicemail).  I want to emphasize that I personally had never done anything like this (contacting electeds) until recently when I got more involved in AAO. 

That’s good it’s still somewhat on the table, but after 1,000s of people spoke out against SB1 the idiots still passed it, so I have zero confidence in them doing what the constituents want. 
 

I hope I’m wrong and will happily eat crow if I am. 

8 hours ago, ColDayMan said:

Passenger Rail Funds Dropped from State Budget

 

Advocates are sounding the alarm after Ohio House Republicans yesterday revealed an updated budget proposal that does not include the small amount of funding requested to support passenger rail in the state.

 

All Aboard Ohio sent out an email yesterday evening calling the proposal “a major step backward for Ohio’s passenger rail future,” and directed readers to contact their legislators.

 

The group, which advocates for improved and expanded passenger rail in Ohio, had been lobbying legislators in recent weeks for two things – funding to rejoin the Midwest Interstate Passenger Rail Commission (MIPRC), and a relatively small increase in funding for the Ohio Rail Development Commission (ORDC).

 

The House’s version of the operating budget does not include allocations for either one.

 

More below:

https://columbusunderground.com/passenger-rail-funds-dropped-from-state-budget-bw1/

 

 

Not surprising, Republicans resent anything that would benefit the cities or urban area's.

8 hours ago, vulcana said:

Not surprising, Republicans resent anything that would benefit the cities or urban area's.

I remain convinced that rural towns / small cities with stations like Crestline and Springfield will get a MUCH larger proportional benefit (e.g. as measured by per capita GDP impact) from passenger rail than the big cities. 

 Be mad about it for a day then regroup and start again. Ohio needs a swift kick in the ass but the Ohio Democratic Party and the national party has basically written off the state. Time for some grassroots action.

On 4/2/2025 at 9:24 PM, Boomerang_Brian said:

 

Let’s clarify - the budget is NOT finalized yet and there is still an opportunity to get these key rail funding requests in. AAO volunteers contacted more than half of the State Reps today - quite a few Republican Reps were mad that the rail funding hadn’t been included and are trying to get it back in. Channel your rage - The more people who contact their legislators, the more likely it is to happen. Please send an email or leave a voicemail for your state Rep (and state senator) tonight. The AAO web page has instructions on what to ask for and how to get your Rep’s contact info:

 

https://www.allaboardohio.org/advocacy?utm_campaign=25bd3636-c2f5-4600-afcd-d631c9847455&utm_source=so&utm_medium=mail&cid=29badbb7-a563-44f3-91c4-2b3a2dc4a9d1

I called or emailed at least a dozen State Reps today and even heard back from several - it’s easy to leave a message (especially at night when you know it’s going straight to voicemail).  I want to emphasize that I personally had never done anything like this (contacting electeds) until recently when I got more involved in AAO. 

I just e-mailed my rep and senator. I am generally a fiscal conservative, but there are some projects that are worthy of government investment. 

I did as well a few days ago. I've been e-mailing politicians a lot more in the past six months for various things than I ever have lol.

On 4/2/2025 at 9:24 PM, Boomerang_Brian said:

 

Let’s clarify - the budget is NOT finalized yet and there is still an opportunity to get these key rail funding requests in. AAO volunteers contacted more than half of the State Reps today - quite a few Republican Reps were mad that the rail funding hadn’t been included and are trying to get it back in. Channel your rage - The more people who contact their legislators, the more likely it is to happen. Please send an email or leave a voicemail for your state Rep (and state senator) tonight. The AAO web page has instructions on what to ask for and how to get your Rep’s contact info:

 

https://www.allaboardohio.org/advocacy?utm_campaign=25bd3636-c2f5-4600-afcd-d631c9847455&utm_source=so&utm_medium=mail&cid=29badbb7-a563-44f3-91c4-2b3a2dc4a9d1

I called or emailed at least a dozen State Reps today and even heard back from several - it’s easy to leave a message (especially at night when you know it’s going straight to voicemail).  I want to emphasize that I personally had never done anything like this (contacting electeds) until recently when I got more involved in AAO. 

Great news - MIPRC funding is in the omnibus amendment to the operating budget (with many many other things). This means that if the amendment passes, it is highly likely MIPRC funding will be in the budget and Ohio will rejoin MIPRC. Still need to get through committee, House, and the Senate, but this is a great sign. Thank you everyone who contacted their Reps. 

On 4/8/2025 at 2:19 PM, Boomerang_Brian said:

Great news - MIPRC funding is in the omnibus amendment to the operating budget (with many many other things). This means that if the amendment passes, it is highly likely MIPRC funding will be in the budget and Ohio will rejoin MIPRC. Still need to get through committee, House, and the Senate, but this is a great sign. Thank you everyone who contacted their Reps. 

The omnibus amendment including MIPRC funding passed the full House vote, and the operating budget passed in the House (along party lines). Now the budget goes to the Senate, where it probably won’t be taken up until after Easter break. The legislature doesn’t have to complete the Operating Budget  until June. With other controversial issues in the House budget, we expect conference committee (House/Senate) to negotiate details. Current feeling is it looks promising for the MIPRC funding to be included in the operating budget - we are feeling much better than last week when original budget proposal came out.

 

Thank you to everyone who contacted their Reps in support of passenger rail!

 

AAO will continue to push the Senate to increase funding for the Ohio Rail Development Commission (ORDC) in the operating budget as the negotiations continue. ORDC has committed to funding Corridor ID through its existing budget  - our thinking is that if we help get their budget increased, that reduces risk of ORDC backing out of passenger rail support later. Increasing the ORDC funding could also used for freight rail (and that’s great!)

Great coverage on the MIPRC funding from 10 TV Columbus:

https://www.10tv.com/article/news/local/ohio-passenger-rail-train/530-bcc371c5-1688-403c-97f1-7cf9351da2b6

 

Shame we couldn't get rail/transit into this big infrastructure ask. More than half is going to roads....

 

https://govmarketnews.com/ohio-voters-to-decide-on-2-5b-infrastructure-bond-package/

17 minutes ago, KJP said:

Shame we couldn't get rail/transit into this big infrastructure ask. More than half is going to roads....

 

https://govmarketnews.com/ohio-voters-to-decide-on-2-5b-infrastructure-bond-package/

I remember finding out about the Ohio Public Works Commission years ago. It's another faceless entity which steers money to roads, but we should pay closer attention to its doings and who was behind this bond issue initiative. Public transportation should have been a part of the mix. As it is, I won't vote for it.

Edited April 10Apr 10 by neony

Some years ago, I found that about 10% of Ohio's households did not own an auto and that if that percentage was subtracted from the ODOT budget at the time, the annual amount for non-highway surface transportation would have been about $750 million annually. Imagine what could have been done!

 

It would be interesting to crunch today's numbers to see what we'd get now.

 

I also didn't know anything abut the Ohio Public Works Commission until I spotted a sign for a road improvement, saying it was funded by a grant thru the OPWC. Again, we should pay much closer attention to it and start to demand that public transportation be funded thru it.

 

Here's a link:

 

https://publicworks.ohio.gov/

 

 

Edited April 10Apr 10 by neony

@Boomerang_Brian !

Does this mean Akron/Canton will be considered again for 3C+D? As someone who's family lives in the district, I'm glad Emilia Sykes is advocating and speaking out about this and grilling the director. I always thought it was a little shady they ruled out the Akron/Canton area while the comparable metro area Dayton was able to get a proposed service.

cleveland

U.S. Rep. Emilia Sykes pushes for Amtrak stop in Akron or...

Sykes questioned Ohio Rail Development Commission on exclusion of her district from proposed Amtrak line.

"Dietrich - who appeared before the committee to discuss ways to streamline federal railroad grants - told her that planners in Ohio looked at a route through Akron years ago, but it was ruled out. He said it would be reevaluated as plans for the so-called “3C&D” corridor move forward."

Edited May 9May 9 by Geowizical

27 minutes ago, Geowizical said:

@Boomerang_Brian !

Does this mean Akron/Canton will be considered again for 3C+D? As someone who's family lives in the district, I'm glad Emilia Sykes is advocating and speaking out about this and grilling the director. I always thought it was a little shady they ruled out the Akron/Canton area while the comparable metro area Dayton was able to get a proposed service.

cleveland

U.S. Rep. Emilia Sykes pushes for Amtrak stop in Akron or...

Sykes questioned Ohio Rail Development Commission on exclusion of her district from proposed Amtrak line.

"Dietrich - who appeared before the committee to discuss ways to streamline federal railroad grants - told her that planners in Ohio looked at a route through Akron years ago, but it was ruled out. He said it would be reevaluated as plans for the so-called “3C&D” corridor move forward."

Ohio Rail map

Brian and others obviously know a lot more than I do, but there just doesn't seem to be an efficient way to get from Columbus to Akron in a timeframe that doesn't scare away more potential Cleveland riders than it picks up in Akron, and a significant monetary investment to upgrade more miles of track. That isn't the case with adding Dayton to the route. With the existing track quality, I'm guessing it is significantly faster to go from Columbus to Cincinnati through Dayton on all class 4 track vs the other route which is all class 1 or 2 track.

To me, having the Detroit-Toledo-Cleveland route continue to Pittsburgh and hitting Akron makes much more sense from a ridership and money point of view. With a much smaller investment, you could add Akron, and potentially have stops in Kent and Canton, before going back through Alliance and going to Pittsburgh on the existing Amtrak route. I think running 6 Detroit to Cleveland trains a day and have them alternate between ending in Buffalo and Pittsburgh would be great, but maybe in the future.

If state leadership were serious about a statewide passenger rail network, a Columbus-Newark-Canton.... or Columbus-Mansfield-Wooster-Massillon-Canton.... line would be a realistic option with some money put into upgrading more miles of rail or outright buying them. But we're struggling to just get them to spend $25k to join MIPRC....

Edited May 9May 9 by PlanCleveland
Fixed link, typo

34 minutes ago, PlanCleveland said:

Ohio Rail map

Brian and others obviously know a lot more than I do, but there just doesn't seem to be an efficient way to get from Columbus to Akron in a timeframe that doesn't scare away a lot of potential Cleveland riders than it picks up in Akron, and a significant monetary investment to upgrade more miles of track. That isn't the case with adding Dayton to the route. With the existing track quality, I'm guessing it is significantly faster to go from Columbus to Cincinnati through Dayton on all class 4 track vs the other route which is all class 1 or 2 track.

To me, having the Detroit-Toledo-Cleveland route continue to Pittsburgh and hitting Akron makes much more sense from a ridership and money point of view. With a much smaller investment, you could add Akron, and potentially have stops in Kent and Canton, before going back through Alliance and going to Pittsburgh on the existing Amtrak route. I think running 6 Detroit to Cleveland trains a day and have them alternate between ending in Buffalo and Pittsburgh would be great, but maybe in the future.

If state leadership were serious about a statewide passenger rail network, a Columbus-Newark-Canton.... or Columbus-Mansfield-Wooster-Massillon-Canton.... line would be a realistic option with some money put into upgrading more miles of rail or outright buying them. But we're struggling to just get them to spend $25k to join MIPRC....

Totally agree - I was looking at open rail and the diversion between Cleveland and Columbus would be severe. A connection from Cleveland to Pittsburgh going through Akron makes a lot more sense also from a regionalism perspective given the closer ties between NEO and Western PA geographically, culturally, and economically.

The wording of the article is what made me think Akron was potentially back on the table for 3C+D. I'd be fine if it was included on the other Cleveland route instead. I just want it included regardless haha

44 minutes ago, Geowizical said:

Totally agree - I was looking at open rail and the diversion between Cleveland and Columbus would be severe. A connection from Cleveland to Pittsburgh going through Akron makes a lot more sense also from a regionalism perspective given the closer ties between NEO and Western PA geographically, culturally, and economically.

The wording of the article is what made me think Akron was potentially back on the table for 3C+D. I'd be fine if it was included on the other Cleveland route instead. I just want it included regardless haha

Saaaaaame. I would use a train to Akron and Canton 5-10X more than one to Columbus. But I feel like this will be left up to Cuyahoga/Summit/Stark counties to get something going. 3C+D just seems like a low risk, easy win.

6 minutes ago, PlanCleveland said:

Saaaaaame. I would use a train to Akron and Canton 5-10X more than one to Columbus.

The Akron/Canton line to Cleveland should be commuter rail, not Amtrak.

8 minutes ago, ColDayMan said:

The Akron/Canton line to Cleveland should be commuter rail, not Amtrak.

We were referring to an Amtrak line that continues on to Pittsburgh though, and most likely Toledo/Detroit on the other end.

If it doesn't continue on to anywhere else, they sure - go commuter.

Edited May 9May 9 by Geowizical