It's time for a statewide rally on rail. Who'd have expected that Kasich's very first action is to firmly and stubbornly wage battle against trains? He is so wrong, and so unwilling to listen to any other viewpoints, that we need to make those viewpoints louder. We need a big Statehouse rally, without the usual suspects. We need Republicans. We need mayors, especially Republican mayors. We need economic development directors. We need Chambers of Commerce. And we need students. Lots of college students. Thousands of college students. We need the state's future job-creators saying Ohio can't create jobs for the future without transportation options.

 

 

We need to make passenger rail Kasich's "Obamacare." We need to define him by his ignorance of this issue and his intransigence in the face of differing viewpoints.

 

 

Right on!  :clap:

 

Kasich needs to get off his "bus" and on the train. 

Right on.  There needs to be a huge, loud public push back against Kasich and this decision.  If he's going to try to kill it, lets make it as hard as possible.  Like any politician, he'll soften his stance if he feels hes gonna get into a big mess over this with lots of negative press focused on him.  How can we get organized with lots and lots of people?

Right on.  There needs to be a huge, loud public push back against Kasich and this decision.  If he's going to try to kill it, lets make it as hard as possible.  Like any politician, he'll soften his stance if he feels hes gonna get into a big mess over this with lots of negative press focused on him.  How can we get organized with lots and lots of people?

 

As KJP posted earlier...

 

Don't just get mad -- get involved!

 

Join All Aboard Ohio and get your friends and families to join at:

http://allaboardohio.org/join-us/

 

Also, please sign the online petition at:

http://ohio.hsrus.org/?page_id=2

 

Please see our Facebook pages at:

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Linking-Ohio/181838151266

http://www.facebook.com/pages/All-Aboard-Ohio-The-Official-Page/131908532861

 

And don't forget....there are other organizations that support passenger rail here in Ohio:

 

The Sierra Club (Ohio Chapter)          http://ohiosierraclub.org/

Policy Matters Ohio                        http://www.policymattersohio.org/

Environmental Law & Policy Center    http://elpc.org/

Ohio Environmental Council              http://www.theoec.org/

I noticed gas prices hitting $2.99 on the westside on Cincy this morning.  Perhaps we may get some help from the oil companies if this continues.  I'm in, if we are going to march on C-bus!!!

Have the rally in early January when students are on break and I would go.

Will be happy to head to the State House!! Count me in!

 

  Ok, as a break from politics for the moment, I was just thinking about a way to get 3-C trains into Cincinnati.

 

    We all know that the Mill Creek valley tracks leading to Cincinnati Union Terminal are all congested with freight trains. There is some talk of building a fourth main, but it will not be cheap. The idea of bringing trains to Union Terminal is very popular, though in my humble opinion it isn't very practical. Union Terminal is simply too far from downtown to walk.

 

    So, what are the alternatives? Terminate the line in Sharonville? Near Lunken Airport? At a new station near Bond Hill?

 

    I like Jake's idea of using the former CH&D on the west side of the Mill Creek Valley. Although it doesn't go to Union Terminal, it has an easy potential connection to the Riverfront Transit Center. The CH&D was of course part of a line from Cincinnati to Toledo, but it has been cut off at Northside. The southernmost part is now operated at the Cincinnati Industrial Track, but it is very lightly used. How to get around the abandoned section hasn't been worked out, but how nice would it be to get all the way to the Transit Center!

 

    There is still the question of whether the Transit Center will accomodate a passenger train. I've heard it argued both ways - that it can, and it can't. It was designed to accomodate light rail. It seems to me that the issue is emissions rather than geometry. I still don't know how the 3-C operation is supposed to turn the train around - or if it is going to change directions, but I wonder if it could back into the transit center and avoid the emissions issue?

 

    Cincinnati Union Terminal used to have a long concourse that has been demolished to make more room for frieght trains. Only one, or maybe two, of the passenger tracks are still in use by Amtrak.

 

    So, here's a wild and crazy idea to make everyone happy:

 

    Use the former CH&D tracks on the west side of the Mill Creek to gain access to the Transit Center. Also, build a new stop on the west side of the Mill Creek with a long, covered pedestrian bridge over the rail yard to Cincinnati Union Terminal. Build a moving sidewalk, airport style, if deemed necessary.  Use both Union Terminal AND the Transit Center.  :-D

 

 

 

   

 

 

 

   

I will also come up for a pro-rail rally. He needs to see how many young people care about this issue.

  ... I still don't know how the 3-C operation is supposed to turn the train around - or if it is going to change directions, but I wonder if it could back into the transit center and avoid the emissions issue? ...

 

Quite a lot of modern passenger equipment is bi-directional, with a power unit on each end. It doesn't have to be turned. I suppose that the emissions issue might be addressed by using the "trailing" power unit upon arrival to push the train into the station, stopping with the power unit outside.

 

Amtrak and commuter operations, especially in the Chicago area, already operate a lot of trains as push-pull. There's a locomotive only on one end, usually the end away from the Union Station headhouse, and a rear car with a control cab where the crew operates the inbound train. The some of the popular Hiawatha Service trainsets between Chicago and Milwaukee have a locomotive on one end and a "neutered" obsolete-generation locomotive, retaining its cab controls but without an engine and converted to a baggage car, on the other. They call those "cabbage cars," for cab-and-baggage car. The photo below shows one of those.

 

So, here's a wild and crazy idea to make everyone happy:

 

Use the former CH&D tracks on the west side of the Mill Creek to gain access to the Transit Center. Also, build a new stop on the west side of the Mill Creek with a long, covered pedestrian bridge over the rail yard to Cincinnati Union Terminal. Build a moving sidewalk, airport style, if deemed necessary. Use both Union Terminal AND the Transit Center. :-D

 

 

That's not such a crazy idea. The city recommended the Longworth/Crosset site after the engineering department conducted an alternatives analysis in 2004. The best west to reach that site was the former B&O line on the west side of the Mill Creek valley then turning east toward the B&O's old Longworth Hall warehouse. I posted here some renderings of my own recently about this concept.

 

While the old B&O gets you past Queensgate, it doesn't get you north of Queensgate. That line was abandoned in the late 1960s when B&O traffic was consolidated onto the former New York Central (then Penn Central/Chessie System, then Conrail/CSX, now NS/CSX) through Queensgate. So most of the old B&O right of way has been acquired for other uses (including expansion of the Spring Grove Cemetery) between the I-74 crossing of the valley and NA Junction (where the old Winton Place depot was located near St. Bernard). North of here, the former B&O was never abandoned and remains busy. So a fourth main is still needed from I-74 northward.

 

And 3C trains are likely either run push-pull (a locomotive at one end of the train, but locomotive controls at both ends of the train) or be self-propelled rail cars so no reverse moves are needed. Here's some push-pull trains in action at 79 mph in the 44 miles between Salt Lake City and Ogden (note the section around the 2:00 mark). The route is being doubled in length to 88 miles. Trains already run half-hourly off-peak and every 15 minutes during rush hours carrying an average of 5,100 riders per weekday (up 15% over 2009)....

 

 

Or this 90+ mile RailRunner regional rail route between Albuquerque and Santa Fe with a dozen daily round trips carrying an average of 3,800 riders per weekday (down 18% over 2009)....

 

 

Or, note the Amtrak Downeaster (Boston-Portland, with state support from Maine, NH and Mass via the Northern New England Passenger Rail Authority) which has de-motored older F40 locomotives on one end (in this example, the lead) with a P42 powered locomotive on the other end. On the Downeaster, the F40s serve as control cab cars (they control the powered P42 locomotive on the other end when the train is in push mode) with the worn-out F40 diesel engine removed and a baggage compartment in its place. Railroaders are creative namecallers, so these F40s are dubbed "cabbage" cars. You can tell the train is in push mode when the train goes by....

 

Discussing political action in favor of passenger rail - I wonder if it needs to broadened beyond just Kasich. We just swept in a bunch of new GOPers into the House and Senate. Getting a few them to see our side would be just as valuable - and many of them won in swing districts might have a more open ear than the new gov.

^Appropriate allegory, Scrabble - not only single-handedly (-clawedly?) destroying rail, but in the process demonstrating at least indifference to his effect upon established infrastructure and urban centers.

 

KJP - I'm not sure I understand the membership structure. I'm a student, so obviously I would pay the $26 "OnTrack" level. What is the $20 for the Annual Meeting fees though?

 

Neville,

 

Although the Annual Meeting is past, I can offer this bit of possible insight into meeting fees in general.

 

Often there's a cost for the meeting venue, plus transportation or stipends for guest speakers who come from a distance. I don't know of any passenger rail advocacy groups that have a revenue stream to cover those expenses. There's another aspect, too, and I've seen its effectiveness at Midwest High Speed Rail meetings as well, and can contrast those with the free (= free-for-all) meetings that I've attended in Indiana. The fees aren't so high as to deter people with a serious interest and possibly some professional expertise in rail operations and the expansion and enhancement of passenger service, but they effectively discourage attendance by the notoriously cheap guys in the hickory-stripe overalls and engineers caps emblazoned with souvenir patches, who will try to flaunt their self-presumed superior wisdom and present their long-winded narratives of experiences ten-times-more-fabulous-than-yours (aka foamers). Fees are a disincentive, too, for the folks who want to put everthing into the context of "when my granddaddy was a conductor on the C-and-O."

 

 

 

Hahaha, thanks for that.

 

I'm liking Eighth & State's idea.

 

Also, dmerkow has a good point. Do we know who will be on the new Controlling Board?

 

Hahaha, thanks for that.

 

I'm liking Eighth & State's idea.

 

Also, dmerkow has a good point. Do we know who will be on the new Controlling Board?

 

Controlling Board members won't change until the new General Assembly takes their seats....but the GOP will now have the majority vote.

^ Right, but do we know the individuals? Those will be the people to focus extra attention on, if we follow dmerkow's advice:

Discussing political action in favor of passenger rail - I wonder if it needs to broadened beyond just Kasich. We just swept in a bunch of new GOPers into the House and Senate. Getting a few them to see our side would be just as valuable - and many of them won in swing districts might have a more open ear than the new gov.

 

Personally, it's that important to me that I would consider leaving. Having good public transit available is an essential element of where I choose to live.

 

I hope you are not still considering leaving!

 

I hope you are not still considering leaving!

 

Aw, that's so sweet of you!

Not sure, but this may fit better on another thread.

 

http://www.journal-news.com/news/hamilton-news/cities-curb-rail-projects-after-kasich-promises-to-kill-3c-train-plan-997571.html

Cities curb rail projects after Kasich promises to kill 3C train plan

 

By Cornelius Frolik, Staff Writer Updated 8:44 AM Monday, November 8, 2010

 

After Ohio was awarded $400 million in federal stimulus money to develop a commuter rail system connecting Cincinnati, Columbus and Cleveland, officials in Dayton and Riverside began plans for rail stations and developments they hoped would revitalize whole neighborhoods.

 

But now that Gov.-elect John Kasich has promised to kill the rail plan, it’s back to the drawing board.

In today's Crain's Cleveland Business, Carol Caruso, senior vice president of the Greater Cleveland Partnership, is quoted as saying that the GCP is likely to support Kasich's plans to drop the 3-C project (though they would advocate for an east-west lakeshore route connecting Cleveland to Chicago, and also a Cleveland-Youngstown-Pittsburgh route.)

 

What a shame that they don't see the economic development possibilities of 3-C.

 

http://www.crainscleveland.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20101108/SUB1/311089977

In today's Crain's Cleveland Business, Carol Caruso, senior vice president of the Greater Cleveland Partnership, is quoted as saying that the GCP is likely to support Kasich's plans to drop the 3-C project (though they would advocate for an east-west lakeshore route connecting Cleveland to Chicago, and also a Cleveland-Youngstown-Pittsburgh route.)

 

What a shame that they don't see the economic development possibilities of 3-C.

 

http://www.crainscleveland.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20101108/SUB1/311089977

 

God forbid they should stand up and fight for something that can help bring more people and development dollars into Downtown Cleveland. How gutless.

I know I'm preaching to the choir on this, but I've been arguing with a few conservatives about the 3C plan.  These conservatives take the Henry Ford approach to transportation infrastructure.  People should have access to whatever transportation method they like, as long as it requires an automobile.

^In speaking with my conservative and republican friends and even some of my more liberal friends I am shocked that they don't understand that roads, highways, bridges, and airports are all subsidized by the federal government.  Many of them have the idea that since "we all use them" and "our taxes pay for them" then it's not a big deal.  But since "no one will use the 3C.  I shouldn't have to pay for it."

 

The argument that stumps them nearly everytime is the 70/71 split construction cost numbers.  "So you're comfortable with spending $1.6 billion on ONE highway interchange in Columbus but you don't want to spend $17 million a year to connect the three largest cities in the state by passenger rail?"  Then you hit them with "have you ever driven that stretch of I-71 or I-70?"  "Then why should you have to pay for it?"

I'm afraid this is a byproduct of the Me Generation.

 

BTW, I was interviewed today by a French newspaper about 3C! The reporter's general theme was about the conservative governors coming on board and their impacts on passenger rail projects. I told him it's part of a scorched earth campaign to hurt Obama in 2012. He was also surprised to hear Ohio has the same population density as France (so are most Ohioans) and that only 40% of the TGV system is on new lines (60% is on "classic" 19th century lines). The point being is that this shows how a developed 3C rail service can serve as the foundation for a high-speed system.

KJP when that article comes out could you eventually link to it?

thanks in advance

I will if someone sends it to me. I usually don't look for articles I've appeared in because I don't like being disappointed with the coverage. There also was an ABC news article done over the weekend sometime that covered this story.

I will if someone sends it to me. I usually don't look for articles I've appeared in because I don't like being disappointed with the coverage. There also was an ABC news article done over the weekend sometime that covered this story.

 

I agree with your logic for the American press, but I'd be really interested to hear the French perspective.  Can you recall the newspaper that interviewed you?

No. He said it in a French accent and my mind hadn't adjusted to his accent when he said the name. In fact when he first introduced himself I thought he said he was from Societe Nationale des Chemins de fer Francais -- the French national railroad -- until he said "it's a French newspaper."

"Kasich to Strickland: Cancel all passenger rail contracts"

 

Gov.-elect John Kasich this afternoon sent a letter to Gov. Ted Strickland asking him to stop all work on any part of the proposed statewide passenger rail system – and cancel any contracts.

 

“I am writing to request that you immediately cancel all contracts relating to your passenger rail program in the most cost-effective manner possible, and that you spend no additional taxpayer money on this program,” Kasich wrote. “As you are aware, I am opposed to this program and will terminate it upon taking office. Given that, I am sure that you will agree that it would simply be wasteful to spend any additional money on this program.”

Lets post the full letters here. The scorched-earth campaign against Obama for 2012 is now underway in Ohio. Mission: Destroy the economy of swing-state Ohio, eliminate energy-efficient travel choices in advance of global petroleum shortages which the Pentagon says will start in 2012, then blame the president for both.

 

Copies of both letters are below.....

 

November 8, 2010

 

Ohio Governor Ted Strickland

Riffe Center, 30th Floor

77 South High Street

Columbus, OH 43215-6108

 

Dear Governor Strickland,

 

I am writing to request that you immediately cancel all contracts relating to your passenger rail program in the most cost-effective manner possible, and that you spend no additional taxpayer money on this program.

 

As you are aware, I am opposed to this program and will terminate it upon taking office. Given that, I am sure that you will agree that it would simply be wasteful to spend any additional money on this program. At a time when Ohio is facing an approximately $8 billion budget shortfall, every step should be taken to eliminate waste and prevent unnecessary spending. While there are remaining legal issues concerning the contracts themselves and the funds appropriated in execution of these contracts, in light of the fact that they allow for their termination without the state incurring their full cost, the sooner that you terminate them the more money Ohioans will save.

 

I realize that we disagree on this issue, but I am confident that you and your Administration will respect my request and take the steps that are in the best interest of Ohio taxpayers.

 

Thank you in advance for your prompt attention to this request.

 

Sincerely,

 

John Kasich

Governor-elect of Ohio

 

___________

 

Here’s the letter to Obama:

 

November 8, 2010

 

President Barack Obama

The White House

1600 Pennsylvania Avenue NW

Washington, DC 20500

 

Dear President Obama,

 

I am writing to inform you that I upon taking office as governor of Ohio on January 10, 2011, I will terminate work on Ohio’s passenger rail project, the “3C-QuickStart” program. Further, I have asked Ohio Governor Ted Strickland to immediately terminate all contracts related to Ohio’s passenger rail project which received $400 million in federal funding through the High Speed Intercity Passenger Rail Program (HSIPR).

 

Passenger rail is not Ohio’s most pressing infrastructure concern at this time. Instead, Ohio’s existing freight rail and highway transportation infrastructure has significant upgrades needs. Therefore, I request that you make provisions for the $400 million to be used to support other vital transportation infrastructure projects in Ohio.

 

In the event that you cannot accede to my request, I ask that you take no actions to spend the funds allocated to Ohio so that these funds can go toward reducing the federal government’s $1.4 trillion deficit.

 

Thank you in advance for your attention to this request.

 

Sincerely,

 

John Kasich

Governor-elect of Ohio

After reading these letters, I don't think there is any hope of convincing Kasich to save this project.

 

In today's Crain's Cleveland Business, Carol Caruso, senior vice president of the Greater Cleveland Partnership, is quoted as saying that the GCP is likely to support Kasich's plans to drop the 3-C project (though they would advocate for an east-west lakeshore route connecting Cleveland to Chicago, and also a Cleveland-Youngstown-Pittsburgh route.)

 

What a shame that they don't see the economic development possibilities of 3-C.

 

http://www.crainscleveland.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20101108/SUB1/311089977

 

Dear Greater Cleveland Partnership, why do you support improving rail in Indiana, Pennsylvania, and New York, but not to Columbus or Cincinnati?

The tea party folks will read this:

 

"In the event that you cannot accede to my request, I ask that you take no actions to spend the funds allocated to Ohio so that these funds can go toward reducing the federal government’s $1.4 trillion deficit."

 

and blindly proclaim him as a hero.

I also wrote this in the Kasich thread:

 

Honestly, I hope that the President/Secretary of USDOT replies that Passenger Rail infrastructure is in the NATION'S top priorities, that they made it clear that the funds were for that purpose alone, that Kasich should reconsider, and if he won't, the money go to another state.

  "The Henry Ford approach to transportation infrastructure."

 

  Ha! Do you not know that Henry Ford was the owner of the Detroit, Toledo, and Ironton railroad, which ran across Ohio between its namesake cities? And that Henry Ford was personally involved in the operation of the railroad, which was said to be maintained in an excellent condition? And that Ford himself expected automobiles to be most useful in the country, where public tranportation was less available? And that Ford eventually got out of the railroad industry because he resented the heavy regulations of government?

Ok, the GM approach then.

I was at the former Cincinnati Northern depot in Lewisburg, Ohio Sunday chatting up all things rail with them that afternoon (a beautiful depot, and a restored PRR/B&O/Chessie caboose with cherry wood!) and asked them their thoughts on the 3C kill. They had no idea that Kasich was proposing to derail the proposal -- they were under the assumption that it was far along enough that it would be improbable that an incoming governor would be able to nix the idea... how wrong they will be if/when Kasich does...

:laugh:

Pro "3C" Rally in Columbus!? 

 

http://www.urbanohio.com/forum2/index.php/topic,24721.0.html

It looks like LaHood's not budging with these new governors.  I can't wait for those letters to come back to Kasich.

 

LaHood Threatens to Stop Wisconsin Rail Project

 

By Dow Jones Newswires-Wall Street Journal

Posted today at 5:19 p.m.

 

U.S. Transportation Secretary Ray LaHood told Wisconsin’s governor-elect, Scott Walker, that the federal government will take back the $810 million in stimulus funding granted to the state for a high-speed rail line between Milwaukee and Madison if Mr. Walker doesn’t soften his opposition to the project.

 

...

 

“I respect the power of governors to make decisions for their states,” Mr. LaHood wrote to Mr. Walker. “There seems to be some confusion, however, about how these high-speed rail dollars can be spent. For this reason, I would like to set the record straight: None of the money provided to Wisconsin may be used for road or highway projects, or anything other than high-speed rail. Consequently, unless you change your position, we plan to engage in an orderly transition to wind down Wisconsin’s project so that we do not waste taxpayers’ money.”

 

...

http://chicagobreakingbusiness.com/2010/11/lahood-tells-wisconsin-governor-elect-to-stop-opposing-rail-project.html

I believe Kasich takes office Jan. 10. That should provide some guidance on when to hold a rally. Maybe we could take a train there. Oooops. We don't have one.

"The Henry Ford approach to transportation infrastructure."

 

  Ha! Do you not know that Henry Ford was the owner of the Detroit, Toledo, and Ironton railroad, which ran across Ohio between its namesake cities? And that Henry Ford was personally involved in the operation of the railroad, which was said to be maintained in an excellent condition? And that Ford himself expected automobiles to be most useful in the country, where public tranportation was less available? And that Ford eventually got out of the railroad industry because he resented the heavy regulations of government?

 

I did not know that, but I was only making a parallel to his famous "Any color - so long as it's black." quote.

Lets post the full letters here. The scorched-earth campaign against Obama for 2012 is now underway in Ohio. Mission: Destroy the economy of swing-state Ohio, eliminate energy-efficient travel choices in advance of global petroleum shortages which the Pentagon says will start in 2012, then blame the president for both.

 

Copies of both letters are below.....

 

November 8, 2010

 

Ohio Governor Ted Strickland

Riffe Center, 30th Floor

77 South High Street

Columbus, OH 43215-6108

 

Dear Governor Strickland,

 

I am writing to request that you immediately cancel all contracts relating to your passenger rail program in the most cost-effective manner possible, and that you spend no additional taxpayer money on this program.

 

As you are aware, I am opposed to this program and will terminate it upon taking office. Given that, I am sure that you will agree that it would simply be wasteful to spend any additional money on this program. At a time when Ohio is facing an approximately $8 billion budget shortfall, every step should be taken to eliminate waste and prevent unnecessary spending. While there are remaining legal issues concerning the contracts themselves and the funds appropriated in execution of these contracts, in light of the fact that they allow for their termination without the state incurring their full cost, the sooner that you terminate them the more money Ohioans will save.

 

I realize that we disagree on this issue, but I am confident that you and your Administration will respect my request and take the steps that are in the best interest of Ohio taxpayers.

 

Thank you in advance for your prompt attention to this request.

 

Sincerely,

 

John Kasich

Governor-elect of Ohio

 

___________

 

Here’s the letter to Obama:

 

November 8, 2010

 

President Barack Obama

The White House

1600 Pennsylvania Avenue NW

Washington, DC 20500

 

Dear President Obama,

 

I am writing to inform you that I upon taking office as governor of Ohio on January 10, 2011, I will terminate work on Ohio’s passenger rail project, the “3C-QuickStart” program. Further, I have asked Ohio Governor Ted Strickland to immediately terminate all contracts related to Ohio’s passenger rail project which received $400 million in federal funding through the High Speed Intercity Passenger Rail Program (HSIPR).

 

Passenger rail is not Ohio’s most pressing infrastructure concern at this time. Instead, Ohio’s existing freight rail and highway transportation infrastructure has significant upgrades needs. Therefore, I request that you make provisions for the $400 million to be used to support other vital transportation infrastructure projects in Ohio.

 

In the event that you cannot accede to my request, I ask that you take no actions to spend the funds allocated to Ohio so that these funds can go toward reducing the federal government’s $1.4 trillion deficit.

 

Thank you in advance for your attention to this request.

 

Sincerely,

 

John Kasich

Governor-elect of Ohio

 

Did I hear right that Gov. Strickland told Kasich my three favorite answers?.... "No....no....and HELL NO" ?

http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2010/11/post_388.html

 

The article posted at the above link at 4:20 p.m. (less than 4 hours ago) has generated more comments than all but two subjects in the past week -- the Browns stunning win against the Patriots and the Nov. 2 vote on the reform of Cuyahoga County government. And, actually, many of the comments are thoughtful.

 

EDIT: Some quotes from Strickland spokeswoman Kelly Schlissberg in an e-mail she sent out to various media and other recipients....

 

"Gov. Strickland will not return Ohio’s $400 million federal grant for rail while he is governor. If the governor-elect wants to return Ohio’s federal grant money and send 16,000 jobs to another state, that will be his decision to make when he becomes governor."

 

Schlissberg said the engineering contract has already been awarded and planning work is underway,  and there should be nothing to fear "from obtaining the good information that this study will provide to policy makers in the near term as well as the long term. So even if the governor-elect chooses not to support rail when he takes office, future governors or legislators with a vision for a modern Ohio will have better information as a result of this work."

Eh... would it have been dirtier politics to sign the agreement now, or after (in the happenstance) he was defeated in the election and it became a lame-duck administration?  Not saying he would have faced certain defeat, but (if he felt compelled to do it before he left office) this was the better way IMO.  At least he will be judged, for better or worse, by the voters for making this decision.

 

I'm not sure why it is "dirty politics" to exercise the authority vested in you by the voters for your appointed term. 

 

If we operate under the theory that voters give their representatives a mandate to act in their name, and that such agency is limited and subject to periodic renewal (unlike, say a monarchy where the mandate to rule is personified) then it must come to an end at some point.  There's certainly nothing to stop the voters of Wisconsin to make the terms of their office-holders expire immediately and begin immediately on certification of election.

 

If there was a natural disaster in Wisconsin during this lame-duck period and Governor Doyle refused to act under the theory that the election showed that voters no longer desired his leadership (a suspect notion in itself since he wasn't a choice on the ballot) he would be widely considered to be in dereliction of his duty.

Time for a little comic relief because this....

 

 

...just isn't enough. Laughter is the best medicine sometimes!

 

 

 

 

And Kasich's last-ditch effort to stop 3C trains...

Not sure why this is a discussion topic on the Cavs forum. But your assistance is requested here....

 

http://realcavsfans.com/showthread.php?33931-3-C-Proposed-Rail-System.-CLE-to-Cincy-in-6-1-2-hours/page4

Strickland should just sign as many contracts as possible to prevent Kasich from stopping the project.  The idea that Kasich has a mandate to kill 3C is laughable.  Even if one wants to say he does, it doesn't legally begin until January 10th, 2011.  Strickland's mandate that started on January 8th, 2007 doesn't end until then.

Strickland should just sign as many contracts as possible to prevent Kasich from stopping the project.

 

That's what he's doing, though I don't know if it includes 3-C rail. I'm sure he's doing whatever he can to create jobs. He's certainly not being the typical lame duck in the wake of this.

 

I conversed with this older guy in my evening class today, after he name dropped 3C rail out of nowhere. I asked him if he supported it too and he basically said, "Hell no, I'm glad it's out of the picture." He said, "Where's the money going to come from?" and "It would take 6 hours to get from Cincinnati to Cleveland."

 

I don't mind it taking 6 hours to get from Cincy to Cleve, especially if I don't have to drive. I told him I support it because Ohio was offered so much money for it and if we don't take money from the Federal Government, someone else sure will and it's all coming out of everyone's pockets no matter where we as a country spend it. I consider taking advantage of opportunity when it comes your way, to be a virtue. Denying ourselves this rail system just shows ungreatfulness for something that was a blessing and we'll surely deny other great opportunities with that mind set. That's why I don't have much faith in Ohioans right now.

 

Surprisingly though, he went into this whole rant about how we need to bring trolleys back. I definitely empathized with that but I didn't understand how they could make so much more sense than passenger rail. This tells me that, possibly:

 

*The social ties or trade relationships between the 3 Cs are either not strong enough or need to be emphasized and incentivized.

 

*The passenger train is stigmatized and perceived as outdated and underperforming technology.

 

Speed has always been the goal. Everything in modern society is about getting as close to real-time as possible. Fiber Optics, dual-core processors, RSS feeds, cars with unnecessarily large engines, cell phones, etc. As far as we've come, it's going to be difficult to get people to renounce speed and convenience. In that sense, I guess I can see why the streetcar idea would be more popular because it accelerates what would otherwise be the necessary slow pedestrian movement that happens to outweigh the inconvenience of using a car in dense cities. They're sort of like the moving walkways of an airport.

 

I'm all for the 3-C rail project, I just thought I'd bring that up because it seems to be issues that we need to find solutions for.

 

 

 

Regarding Kasichs letters.  The 400 million can not be re-purposed to other highway projects.  It will go back into the pot and go to the next runner up for their rail project.  He should know that.

 

Just what have you pople in Ohio done???