5 hours ago, coneflower said:

“The Haslams have already made substantial moves toward Brook Park, so it’s going to be difficult to undo what they’ve done so far and the costs associated with it,” he said. “But if the city and the county are able to offer enough, probably the Browns and the Haslams could undo what has happened.”

 

Land swap with the post office and build the stadium there.

35 minutes ago, Luke_S said:

 

Land swap with the post office and build the stadium there.

Honestly, I thought that was the play when the Haslams first started their pursuit of the Brook Park land. A USPS relocation there would fit perfectly with the light industrial remake of that district and offers great road and air connections for the Post Office (I guess there’s no mail trains anymore).

 

No reason it can’t still be. 

 

Edited January 22Jan 22 by brtshrcegr

Trumps Federal cuts to everything guarantees that a renovated downtown stadium is inevitable. He’s going to destroy the state budget in so many ways. No state money, no county money, no sin tax money, no CLE money.

Sounds like an interstate relocation is inevitable instead. Local can't fund a $461 million renovation in these conditions. 

10 hours ago, marty15 said:

Trumps Federal cuts to everything guarantees that a renovated downtown stadium is inevitable. He’s going to destroy the state budget in so many ways. No state money, no county money, no sin tax money, no CLE money.

Can you point me to where it specifically says this is all going to happen in terms of the no state, county or Cleveland money?

16 minutes ago, TDi said:

Can you point me to where it specifically says this is all going to happen in terms of the no state, county or Cleveland money?

 

Budgets from the state down to the city are going to be trying to backfill gaps left by the federal grants that will at least be delayed. I haven't seen it explicitly stated anywhere that city, county, or state funding wont be available, but its safe to assume that budget cuts will be a direct result of the revocation of federal grants. 

11 hours ago, TBideon said:

Sounds like an interstate relocation is inevitable instead. Local can't fund a $461 million renovation in these conditions. 

 

Why? All local governments are going to be in the same position meaning they wont be any more likely to provide the funds to lure the Browns away.

I gotta be honest, regardless of local difficulties in specific markets and bending cities over a barrell to push leverage in funding, I don't see any relocation in the NFL for a while yet. The NFL wants stability, they don't want to go through the whole LA thing again which has had its fair share of problems, whether its the Rams and the league being sued or the Chargers or Raiders struggling to build fanbases. They don't want owners fighting over market share and at each other's throats. Even if some big private money from Austin or something offers a team a palace of a stadium, theres so many intricate factors which mean something like that is probably not going to happen. Theres more chance of expansion than relocation at this juncture IMO.

Those are good points, and I can see how uncertainty and instability would generally favor the incumbent city.

 

But there are so many moving parts. It's basically February 2025. Jimmy still wants a dome in his lifetime and control of adjacent property. Neither happens downtown. 

 

Both he and the city/county are in cross litgations that could take years for resolution. I'd love to see what the Jones Day bill is already. Early five figures? Mid?

 

Browns stadium currently needs tens of millions of dollars in deferred repairs/maintenance, a waste of money for only 24ish home games and a few pre-seasons before the lease expires in early 2028. 

 

A new stadium takes three years to build. Highway/utiliies improvements are an enormous and costly process that haven't even been addressed. Could a new stadium in Brookpark even be permitted without those expansions? I feel that process takes years from concept to ribbon cutting.

 

If these issues are unresolved in 2028, the team will have to play somewhere.  I highly doubt the parties work out some year-to-year lameduck arrangement. Didn't work with the A's, won't here. What's done needs to be done.

 

Plus, San Antonio, Toronto or London have access to funds and incentives beyond NEO's economic realities.

 

I don't see how this ends well for Cleveland Browns fans.

 

Edited January 29Jan 29 by TBideon

2 hours ago, Luke_S said:

 

Budgets from the state down to the city are going to be trying to backfill gaps left by the federal grants that will at least be delayed. I haven't seen it explicitly stated anywhere that city, county, or state funding wont be available, but its safe to assume that budget cuts will be a direct result of the revocation of federal grants. 

I'm more worried about cuts than I am a delay. The only thing I can find on what will actually be cut is anything related to DEI, Green Deal and foreign aid.  I wouldn't think anything related to Cleveland development would fall into any of those categories.

3 minutes ago, TDi said:

I'm more worried about cuts than I am a delay. The only thing I can find on what will actually be cut is anything related to DEI, Green Deal and foreign aid.  I wouldn't think anything related to Cleveland development would fall into any of those categories.

I hope you’re right, but I’m very worried about the money that was recently awarded for the lakefront project. It was a result of Biden’s infrastructure legislation, which Trump will do everything to destroy.  Mostly out of jealousy that he was never able to accomplish anything when it came to infrastructure during his first administration.

Right, as @Htsguy said I think all infrastructure money is under "strategic review" since, in the eyes of the current administration it was "Green New Deal Infrastructure". Also the Medicaid funding freezes hurts state budgets, and as the state adjusts their budgets to fill those gaps that will presumably trickle down to county and city governments as well. 

City files new request with the courts. https://fox8.com/news/i-team/city-files-new-request-to-throw-out-browns-lawsuit-over-move-i-team/

Ohio AG asks courts to dismiss Brown's lawsuit  https://fox8.com/news/i-team/state-calls-on-court-to-dismiss-browns-lawsuit-against-cleveland-i-team/

I must be reading this wrong. AG Yost an l are never on the same page. Not siding with HSG blows my mind.

Stadium Showdown. https://www.cleveland19.com/2025/03/07/stadium-showdown-episode-1-look-brewing-legal-battle/

HSG says lakefront stadium is short term solution. https://www.cleveland19.com/2025/03/13/haslam-sports-group-says-stadium-lakefront-would-be-short-term-solve/

Are there no journalists worth a f*ck or with the guts in this town to call out the complete fake news bulls**t that is constantly peddled about all these extra events they claim they will get in the dome? The scary thing is there are hordes of braindead morons on social media who truly believe this.

^ They finally said something I agree with. 

 

“We believe [moving to Brookpark] has the benefit of freeing up valuable lakefront property in Downtown Cleveland,” Tywang said. “Our stadium is currently used 10,12 times a year and it’s a big footprint. It’s 25 acres of prime lakefront real estate and the more we looked at it, again we do not think that is the highest and best use.”

2 hours ago, Ethan said:

^ They finally said something I agree with. 

 

“We believe [moving to Brookpark] has the benefit of freeing up valuable lakefront property in Downtown Cleveland,” Tywang said. “Our stadium is currently used 10,12 times a year and it’s a big footprint. It’s 25 acres of prime lakefront real estate and the more we looked at it, again we do not think that is the highest and best use.”

That may be true but it has been the only reason many of us ever went to downtown or that part of the lakefront over the years. This goes back to years before RRHF or GLSC existed.   

 

Removing the stadium also removes those active days and any other concert or use for 60,000 plus visitors to the downtown area. To me that is a major loss

“It’s a 15 to 20 year solve without a solve for capital repairs."

 

15 to 20 years from now the stadium would be 41-46 years old, that would be much more justifiable to request a better stadium and gives time for Burke to open up. 

20 hours ago, dave2017 said:

That may be true but it has been the only reason many of us ever went to downtown or that part of the lakefront over the years. This goes back to years before RRHF or GLSC existed.   

 

Removing the stadium also removes those active days and any other concert or use for 60,000 plus visitors to the downtown area. To me that is a major loss

Sure, and replaced with nothing or surface parking lots it would be a major loss! That said, you could basically fit every establishment on the East Bank of the flats into the area currently devoted to the stadium. It's a lot of land with a lot of potential! I'd love to see the downtown lakefront vision expanded to include the land currently occupied by the stadium. With the stadium out of the way you could add several 7 over 1s, maybe a museum, a tower or two, etc, lots of possibilities! Basically any layout will get more annual usage/activity than the stadium. 

 

If the stadium does move to Brook Park (looking more likely) the land freed up by the current stadium is definitely a s̶o̶c̶c̶e̶r̶ silver lining. Hopefully it can be built on quickly, intelligently, and beautifully. 

Edited March 14Mar 14 by Ethan
Good catch Blimp City! Lol

https://fox8.com/news/i-team/cleveland-county-officials-still-trying-to-keep-browns-on-lakefront-i-team/

47 minutes ago, simplythis said:

https://fox8.com/news/i-team/cleveland-county-officials-still-trying-to-keep-browns-on-lakefront-i-team/

I would expect the new offer from the city and county to be both fair and competitive however I would be shocked if it is met with anything but rejection by the Haslams. They're dying on this hill.

Everyone has forgotten that the lakefront was more in use when the Cleveland Indians shared Municipal Stadium with the Cleveland Browns.  If the stadium remains on the lakefront I wish the city could negotiate with the soccer league to make the stadium multi-purpose.  Bring back the use for more than the fall season of 8-10 games.  I don't think we can afford to keep building and maintaining sports facilities at these costs

20 hours ago, Ethan said:

Sure, and replaced with nothing or surface parking lots it would be a major loss! That said, you could basically fit every establishment on the East Bank of the flats into the area currently devoted to the stadium. It's a lot of land with a lot of potential! I'd love to see the downtown lakefront vision expanded to include the land currently occupied by the stadium. With the stadium out of the way you could add several 7 over 1s, maybe a museum, a tower or two, etc, lots of possibilities! Basically any layout will get more annual usage/activity than the stadium. 

 

If the stadium does move to Brook Park (looking more likely) the land freed up by the current stadium is definitely a soccer lining. Hopefully it can be built on quickly, intelligently, and beautifully. 

@Ethan - Seems like an autocorrect, but perhaps you meant "soccer lining" rather than "silver lining" 😉

20 hours ago, Ethan said:

Sure, and replaced with nothing or surface parking lots it would be a major loss! That said, you could basically fit every establishment on the East Bank of the flats into the area currently devoted to the stadium. It's a lot of land with a lot of potential! I'd love to see the downtown lakefront vision expanded to include the land currently occupied by the stadium. With the stadium out of the way you could add several 7 over 1s, maybe a museum, a tower or two, etc, lots of possibilities! Basically any layout will get more annual usage/activity than the stadium. 

 

If the stadium does move to Brook Park (looking more likely) the land freed up by the current stadium is definitely a soccer lining. Hopefully it can be built on quickly, intelligently, and beautifully. 

 

Yes, that lS a lot of land and sure, removing the stadium gives us a blank slate. Everything you would need except for one little detail. Where does the money come from? In order to develop all of that land we are going to need a boatload of cash, not to mention a developer/leadership. Both are in short supply here.

 

That's another reason l want the Browns to stay on the lakefront. Besides just keeping growth in (downtown) rather than out (BP) building a new stadium comes with a developer (Haslam) who will then work and invest in the surrounding area.

 

Look, l'm no fan of Jimmy but if he were to stay downtown, build a stadium and develop around it he'll be my new favorite. Billionaires are a necessary evil. Without one we probably have very little development of a significant nature taking place on the lakefront for god knows how long. We have a very long list of needs in the city and very short pockets.

3 hours ago, dave2017 said:

Everyone has forgotten that the lakefront was more in use when the Cleveland Indians shared Municipal Stadium with the Cleveland Browns.  If the stadium remains on the lakefront I wish the city could negotiate with the soccer league to make the stadium multi-purpose.  Bring back the use for more than the fall season of 8-10 games.  I don't think we can afford to keep building and maintaining sports facilities at these costs

 

When St. Louis was attempting to keep the Rams with their riverfront Stadium plan, it was also designed to be flexible for soccer and smaller attended events which allowed the upper decks on each sideline if I remember being blocked out (can't readily find renderings). Atlanta is the same although indoors and obviously more glossy than anything that would ever be built here. That is something I feel should be pitched on the lakefront plan as the women's stadium idea just now seems to be more or less ignoring a men's team. I also just don't see the soccer experience being optimum at a suburban site nor in a dome; Indy tried it and it fell on its ass. It's a guaranteed 17 competitive home games (based on 2024 USL Championship format) largely through the NFL off-season and a market easily capable of drawing average attendance of five figures at the right location. I wouldn't even care if Jimmy owned the team if it was on the lakefront. I believe we shouldn't turn our nose up at minor league sports if the situation is right, maximizes use of our facilities and brings foot traffic that otherwise wouldn't be there. 

Edited March 14Mar 14 by snakebite

Chris Ronayne to address Brook Park stadium proposal today.  https://www.cleveland19.com/2025/03/19/cuyahoga-county-executive-chris-ronayne-addresses-brook-park-browns-stadium-proposal/

Hardball Chris. Rent jumps to $5 million/year in 2029, $10 for 2030, $15 for 2031, etc, if we're in limbo by next year and Jimmy starts babbling about extentions. 

 

No more $250k bulls**t. 

Edited March 19Mar 19 by TBideon

All efforts on Brook Park. One on One with Jimmy Haslam. https://fox8.com/news/i-team/i-team-1-on-1-with-browns-owner-on-new-stadium-development-project/

31 minutes ago, simplythis said:

All efforts on Brook Park. One on One with Jimmy Haslam. https://fox8.com/news/i-team/i-team-1-on-1-with-browns-owner-on-new-stadium-development-project/

Doesn't appear to have been humbled at all by the Deshaun Watson drama, the team's failings or the stadium nonsense, the flying J legal problems. He is just sounding like more of an arrogant, silver spooned, piece of work than ever.

Edited April 24Apr 24 by CLE2BAL

I’m not in favor of this but based on all the media coverage, it looks like Bibb and Ronayne played a weak hand as best they could but it’s time to start thinking about what comes next for the current site. 
 

Would the Haslams donate something to help with new lakefront development? Can they work their connections to get the federal funds already promised for the land bridge that the current Administration for sure will DOGE otherwise? 

2 hours ago, simplythis said:

All efforts on Brook Park. One on One with Jimmy Haslam. https://fox8.com/news/i-team/i-team-1-on-1-with-browns-owner-on-new-stadium-development-project/

Again no real new news from this I-team pair other than getting the HSG COO to say that State money is critical and repeated prior statements: “We’ve had conversation with the city of Cleveland,” Jenkins said. “I don’t think there is a path on renovation, those conversations are pretty much stalled.” Doesn't sound like the door is shut.  Otherwise the I-team repackage their same HSG talking point propaganda intended to instill defeatism and overwhelm support for the lakefront.  Bibb/Haslam need to step up their public campaign - surprised they have not put Roger Goodell on the record about abandoning the city again.  

 

 

 

Nice and creative way to get 17k people down there on a Thursday night in April. The stadium needs some TLC. I get the sense that the amount of routine maintenance has declined. This pic was taken about 30 min before Journey took the stage.

10 minutes ago, dski44 said:

Nice and creative way to get 17k people down there on a Thursday night in April. The stadium needs some TLC. I get the sense that the amount of routine maintenance has declined. This pic was taken about 30 min before Journey took the stage.

 

Not sure how I missed hearing about this, I first saw Journey in this approximate location almost half a century ago.   :0

 

Good job utilizing the place twice in less than a week in April.

1 hour ago, dski44 said:

Nice and creative way to get 17k people down there on a Thursday night in April. The stadium needs some TLC. I get the sense that the amount of routine maintenance has declined. This pic was taken about 30 min before Journey took the stage.

 

It's always baffled me the lack of TVs in the concourses under the stands, quite annoying when you want a drink or food during the game. Even most minor league stadiums have those!

 

County Exec says Browns dome won't pan out. https://fox8.com/news/i-team/county-executive-says-browns-dome-plan-wont-pan-out-but-jimmy-haslam-disagrees/

Traffic Modifications. https://www.cleveland19.com/2025/04/25/brook-park-city-leaders-meet-with-odot-discuss-traffic-modifications-around-new-browns-site/ 

brook park thread is locked but -

The Statehouse News Bureau

Legislative researchers say tax revenue estimates for new...

This is the first publicly-released analysis from a legislative or state office of tax revenue estimates for the project from the owners of the Browns, who are seeking $600m in state-backed bonds t...

Commanders new stadium at the site of former RFK Stadium it was confirmed today is to be enclosed. Goodbye furthest east dome, we barely knew you.

it's a very important point. the competitive advantage of the dome for hosting events gets smaller with every new stadium that gets built

A second, Dewine-commissioned study just dropped, also blasting the proposal

cleveland

‘Risky’ and ‘wildly overblown:’ Ohio budget director blas...

A newly released DeWine administration memo tears into the Cleveland Browns’ economic plan for a new Brook Park stadium.

The 8 page report from the Legislative Service Commission is a nice run down of a few major issues with the information and (partial) report the Haslam's have (so far) released. Its great to see some state officials understand this. Read the report here: https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/25920639-lsc-stadium-analysis-redacted/?mode=document

From Page 7:

Non-paywalled Signal story:

https://signalcleveland.org/state-plan-to-finance-browns-stadium-risky-to-taxpayers-dewine-budget-office-says/

1 hour ago, NorthShore64 said:

The 8 page report from the Legislative Service Commission is a nice run down of a few major issues with the information and (partial) report the Haslam's have (so far) released. Its great to see some state officials understand this. Read the report here: https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/25920639-lsc-stadium-analysis-redacted/?mode=document

From Page 7:

The relocation of the crew game seemed to have been really emphasized lol, reads as if this stadium goes through they’ll continue to take economic benefits away from Columbus how dare you!

Which from a state perspective they should be in different on that, unless they explicitly bring up the state is also invested in the crew developments then that makes sense but the narrative should be they took it away from Columbus! (Which they certainly did) but that’s also how capitalism works and shouldn’t be a talking point as the state win either way.

Edited April 29Apr 29 by BoomerangCleRes

the state needs to pay the bond with an increase of tax revenue. the point is the state makes the same money on the soccer match, whether it is played in cleveland, columbus, or toledo. so poaching events from things that would already be held in ohio does not make the bond less risky

Haslam chides state memos on Brook Park stadium

By Ken Prendergast / April 28, 2025

Two memos dropped today from two branches of state government, both urging caution when considering the Haslam Sports Group’s (HSG) economic impact projections from its proposed enclosed stadium and supportive development in suburban Brook Park. But HSG shot back, calling the reports “questionable” and “inaccurate.”

MORE:

https://neo-trans.blog/2025/04/28/haslam-chides-state-memos-on-brook-park-stadium/

https://www.news5cleveland.com/sports/browns/state-agencies-flag-browns-stadium-plans-browns-say-analysis-contains-misinformation

3 hours ago, KJP said:

Haslam chides state memos on Brook Park stadium

By Ken Prendergast / April 28, 2025

Two memos dropped today from two branches of state government, both urging caution when considering the Haslam Sports Group’s (HSG) economic impact projections from its proposed enclosed stadium and supportive development in suburban Brook Park. But HSG shot back, calling the reports “questionable” and “inaccurate.”

MORE:

https://neo-trans.blog/2025/04/28/haslam-chides-state-memos-on-brook-park-stadium/

“We told DeWine this, we told legislators that. These reports are inaccurate.”

Why aren’t you willing to provide any of these details to the public Jimmy? What did you tell them? What is inaccurate?

Also…this is a horrible map. Who put this together? Why are the drive times in the table completely different than the drive times shaded in the map? Why are the stadium dots almost all in the wrong spots. My eyes hurt.

Edited April 29Apr 29 by Enginerd