http://columbus.bizjournals.com/columbus/stories/2006/04/24/daily22.html 

 

Franklin County approves ethanol station budget

Business First of Columbus - 2:37 PM EDT Wednesday

 

Franklin County Commissioners will build an ethanol refueling facility for its government fleet as a way to combat rising gas prices.

 

The county's 400-vehicle fleet consumes about 32,000 gallons of gas each month, with the average bulk price of gas at $2.57 a gallon earlier this month. As of March 31, the county had spent more than $256,000 on gas for its vehicles.

 

More at link above:

 

http://www.eere.energy.gov/afdc/infrastructure/e85_stations.cgi

 

 

 

Circleville Oil Company - Pacific Pride

310 W Mount Street

Circleville

Public - card key at all times

 

NASA - Glenn Research Center

21000 Brookpark Road

Cleveland

Private - government only

 

Wright Patterson Air Force Base Station

Area C, Building 60

Dayton

Private - government only

 

Wright Patterson Air Force Base Station

Area B, Building 304

Dayton

Private - government only

 

Speedway #1041

3760 Main Street

Hilliard

Public - see hours

 

Sterling Convenience Store

1470 West Alexis

Toledo

Public - see hours

 

The Marathon Mart

1058 West Old Lincolnway

Wooster

Public - see hours

 

Marathon

304 West River Street

Antwerp

PLANNED - not yet accessible

 

Marathon

202 West South Street

Saint Mary's

PLANNED - not yet accessible

 

 

Sadly there are no E85 Gas Stations in the Cincinnati region.  Does anyone have any news of future E85 pumps opening up in your area?

Even though my car does not take E-85 fuel, it's sad that the only Dayton locations are at WPAFB.

 

FWIW, one can also log onto http://www.e85fuel.com/ for more information, including E-85 stations in other states.

I think the one in St. Marys is now open. 

From Business First of Columbus, 7/6/06:

 

Central Ohio Kroger to open ethanol station

Business First of Columbus - 11:21 AM EDT Thursday

 

Kroger Co.'s first ethanol-based fuel pump in Ohio is set to open next month in Columbus.

 

General Motors Corp. and Kroger are collaborating to increase the use of ethanol-based fuel in Ohio and the companies announced Thursday a plan to add several new E85 ethanol fueling sites in the state. The first pump will be installed at a Kroger gas station on Broad Street south of Gahanna.

 

More at:

 

http://www.bizjournals.com/columbus/stories/2006/07/03/daily16.html?from_rss=1

 

^ The previous article doesn't mention it in detail, but the location of this first Columbus E85 station will be the Kroger at 7000 E Broad St.

As a member of the E-85 coalition for the last couple of years, I can tell you that Kroger is launching E-85 in Cincinnati at the end of this year and into 2007. Also, Meijer is also rolling out E-85. Major oil companies are also rolling out E-85, BP and others. You can run E-85 in any vehicle, the only difference between flexfuel and regular cars are the fuel lines and tanks are metal and slightly different engine timing upon recognizing E-85. Regular gas and E-85 can be mixed. I ran E-85 in my Honda before moving to Ohio and just ran regular most of the time, and adding in E-85. Didn't hurt my car the 105 octane made a noticeable difference in performance.

E-85 can run in any car? What is the price of it?

David I would not run E-85 in your car unless you get verification from the manufacturer.  I have been looking at replacing my current vehicle and I hope to purchase a vehicle hat is E-85 capable although it isn't make or break. 

 

Curious what the new 2007 Saturn Aura looks like in person.  They recently announced that they are coming out with a "Greenline" version which is GM's weak attempt at hybrid, I still haven't confirmed if that car will support E-85 fuels or not.

I don't know driving out west last year when you go through Iowa and Nebraska, most of their pumps are high levels of ethanol i think 10 %, I ran it in my Honda civic with out any problems, it actually increased our gas millage for a stretch of the trip. the gas it self was cheaper then regular unleaded if i remember correctly buy about 15c.

^ That's really strange that you think it increased your gas mileage.  All of the studies show that it drastically decreases mileage.  Ethanol has a heating value of about 60% of gasoline.  That just means there's less energy per gallon.

 

I just think all of this ethanol talk is misguided at best.  It's being driven by the lobbyists and pork loving politicians in congress.  The energy returned on energy invested is marginal at best (maybe even negative), and there are some ethical considerations for putting something in your fuel tank that could feed a village for a few days.

 

And as of this spring, all gasoline in the US has either 10 or 15% ethanol as an additive.  This replaced MTBE due to it's harmful effects on groundwater supplies.  I wouldn't compare E15 with E85 and would definitely check with your auto manufacturer.

I think I read that we can't even produce Ethanol at the rate of total fuel consumption; it's just too much.

I don't know driving out west last year when you go through Iowa and Nebraska, most of their pumps are high levels of ethanol i think 10 %, I ran it in my Honda civic with out any problems, it actually increased our gas millage for a stretch of the trip. the gas it self was cheaper then regular unleaded if i remember correctly buy about 15c.

 

I have news for you, almost all Ohio gas stations already use 10% ethanol.  E-85 is 85% ethanol which is a big difference.

I don't know driving out west last year when you go through Iowa and Nebraska, most of their pumps are high levels of ethanol i think 10 %, I ran it in my Honda civic with out any problems, it actually increased our gas millage for a stretch of the trip. the gas it self was cheaper then regular unleaded if i remember correctly buy about 15c.

 

I have news for you, almost all Ohio gas stations already use 10% ethanol.  E-85 is 85% ethanol which is a big difference.

 

I'm trying to remember what the % was I know It was defiantly higher then anything available in Ohio, but i don't think it was 85%, but based on memory it was cheaper (probably because of location) And I'm 90% positive we got better gas millage.

I guess because of the new regulations in place this dosnt matter much, but it must have been e10 based from this article i found.

 

http://www.e85fuel.com/news/041404_fyi.htm

 

More motorists may soon be trying ethanol-blended fuel - not because of their concerns about the environment, but because of concerns over their wallets.

 

 

Ethanol industry leaders say the recent sharp rise in gasoline prices could prove to be a boon for ethanol-blend gasoline, which is as much as 5-cents-per-gallon cheaper than regular gas at pumps around the Midwest.

 

 

"It's true that the economy of ethanol makes it more attractive to consumers financially than straight gasoline," said Ron Lamberty, market development director of the American Coalition for Ethanol in Sioux Falls, South Dakota.  "If there's an upside to higher gas prices, I guess that's it."

 

In the competitive market around Omaha, some gas stations offer E-10 gas - 90 percent gasoline blended with 10 percent ethanol - at prices 4 cents a gallon cheaper than regular.

 

 

One of those is the Fantasy's station in Papillion, where a gallon of E-10 sold Monday for $1.64, compared with $1.68 for a gallon of regular blend gas.

One reason for getting better gas mileage using a E10/E15 blend is because it will "clean" your engine, unlike MTBE.  While I lived in Iowa, it was very common to see 89 (10% ethanol) octane cheaper than 87 octane. This is because of a government subsidy for ethanol.

 

I will tell you, the only difference between a regular car and a flexfuel one is the fuel system. I do not recommend running E-85 all the time in a regular car, however, once in a while will not hurt it.

So what does E-85 do to a standard fuel system?  Rot the lines?

^ i know that all the flex fuel vehicles have an additional sensor to change engine timing or something when E85 is used.  Also, fuel line components are different.  don't know why. 

 

if E85 does indeed cause this "damage" to regular vehicles over time, it would be nice to have a different level...E10 is fine for everyone.  What about E50?  this would have an significant impact, but maybe not hurt non modified fuel systems?

E-85 will eat through the rubber fuel lines of regular cars. Flexfuel cars have steel lines and the additional sensor. Thats it! Thats why it is so sad that automobile makers are so slow to produce these vehicles until now.

Brewmaster, does the heat value directly correlate to the output of energy? If Ethanol produces 40 percent less energy, and it's only 5 percent cheaper at the pump, then I really don't see how it's viable.

Brewmaster, does the heat value directly correlate to the output of energy? If Ethanol produces 40 percent less energy, and it's only 5 percent cheaper at the pump, then I really don't see how it's viable.

I had to do some cipherin' to answer your question.  I looked that heating value up in a text, and found more info on the wiki site for E85...

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E85

Although E85 contains only 72% of the energy on a gallon for gallon basis compared to gasoline, experimenters have seen slightly better fuel mileage than the 28% this difference in energy content implies. For example, recent tests by the National Renewable Energy Lab on fleet vehicles owned by the state of Ohio showed about a 25% reduction in mpg [2] (see table on pg 5) comparing E85 operation to reformulated gasoline in the same flexible fuel vehicle. Results compared against a gasoline-only vehicle were essentially the same, about a 25% reduction in volumetric fuel economy with E85

 

I'm guessing the 15% gasoline in E85 closes the gap in energy difference from 60% to the 72% that is referrence here.

 

But the moral of the story remains...I would only buy E85 if the price was more than 25% below the price of regular gasoline.  For those interested in putting it in non fuel flexible vehicles, there is more info on the wiki site for you.

Brewmaster, does the heat value directly correlate to the output of energy? If Ethanol produces 40 percent less energy, and it's only 5 percent cheaper at the pump, then I really don't see how it's viable.

I had to do some cipherin' to answer your question.  I looked that heating value up in a text, and found more info on the wiki site for E85...

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E85

Although E85 contains only 72% of the energy on a gallon for gallon basis compared to gasoline, experimenters have seen slightly better fuel mileage than the 28% this difference in energy content implies. For example, recent tests by the National Renewable Energy Lab on fleet vehicles owned by the state of Ohio showed about a 25% reduction in mpg [2] (see table on pg 5) comparing E85 operation to reformulated gasoline in the same flexible fuel vehicle. Results compared against a gasoline-only vehicle were essentially the same, about a 25% reduction in volumetric fuel economy with E85

 

I'm guessing the 15% gasoline in E85 closes the gap in energy difference from 60% to the 72% that is referrence here.

 

But the moral of the story remains...I would only buy E85 if the price was more than 25% below the price of regular gasoline.  For those interested in putting it in non fuel flexible vehicles, there is more info on the wiki site for you.

 

but it depends what you are driving.. if you drive a WRX then it make some sense to switch.

 

"Fuel economy does not drop as much as might be expected in turbocharged engines based on the specific energy content of E85 compared to gasoline, in contrast to the previously-reported reduction of 23.7% reduction in a 60:40 blend of gasoline to E85 for one non-turbocharged, fuel-injected, non-FFV. The reason for this non-intuitive difference is that the turbocharged engine seems especially well-suited for operation on E85, for it in effect has a variable compression ratio capability, which is exactly what is needed to accommodate varying ethanol and gasoline ratios that occur in practice in an FFV. At light load cruise, the turbocharged engine operates as a low compression engine. Under high load and high manifold boost pressures, such as accelerating to pass or merge onto a highway, it makes full use of the higher octane of E85. It appears that due to the better ignition timing and better engine performance on a fuel of 100 octane, the driver spends less time at high throttle openings, and can cruise in a higher gear and at lower throttle openings than is possible on 100% premium gasoline. In daily commute driving, mostly highway, 100% E85 in a turbocharged car can hit fuel mileages of over 90% of the normal gasoline fuel economy. Tests indicate approximately a 5% increase in engine performance is possible by switching to E85 fuel in high performance cars"

 

edit to add this

 

Interest in E85 is high enough that there are now competitions for engine builders to develop winning combinations for both power and fuel economy on this fuel. One such competition is sponsored by the AERA Engine Builders Association.

 

It makes sense that an engine the was built specificly for gas is going to perform best with gas but what about the an engine build for E85?

All that is saying is that a turbocharged engine (or any other engine with a high compression ratio) will be able to close the gap, but not eliminate it.  There are some advantages to having 108 octane fuel because you can go to smaller engines with high compression ratios (4 cylinder turbos?).  If you were do design an engine like this from the onset, it wouldn't be capable of going to pump gas unless it were somehow smart enough to turn down the boost pressure and seriously derate the engine (in which case it would probably be more efficient to run regular gas).  Without that capability, it wouldn't be "fuel flexible" because it would ping like crazy on regular gas and seriously damage the engine.  I hope that made sense.

It is true that per volume, ethanol has less BTU than gasoline. However, the argument should not be how much energy is used to produce ethanol, but where the fuel is coming from. One, ethanol will come from AMERICAN farmers and potentially imports from Brazil. The other, Oil comes from Middle East, I don't need to explain why this is bad! Even looking at hydrogen as a fuel, it will take much more energy to split water and/or methane in order to get the hydrogen. Now this could be done on a larger scale or small scale. Larger scale is more efficient, but how do you store hydrogen in your car efficiently? Scale is less efficient, but storage is easy because you would just fill your car with water and let the car split the molecule.

 

The demand of ethanol has gone up so much this year, that ethanol prices have gone up, however, more ethanol plants are being built all over the midwest, which will reduce the price and more government subsidies will be used to promote more use of ethanol.

Do a search for "energy returned on energy invested", or EROEI.  An example of the measure would be, if you put 1 unit of energy into bringing gasoline to market from crude, you get anywhere from 40-60 units of energy out (an EROEI = 40-60).  Studies vary for ethanol, but due to all of the fertilizing (very energy intensive), farm equipment, processing, and lower energy value, the EROEI ends up being about 1.6 for the rosiest of studies and less than 1 for the average study.  An EROEI of less than 1 means that you are actually using more energy to make it than you get out.  Where is this energy coming from?  The middle east.

 

Brazil uses sugarcane as a feedstock to produce ethanol, which is much more efficient.

 

And it really burns me that the Gov't is subsidizing ethanol for E85.  I can deal with subsidies for ethanol as a fuel additive to replace MTBE, but not for E85.  I dislike when lobbyists get so involved in the political machine that they get politicians to ignore the science.

 

And forget about Hydrogen.  It's not as simple as filling your car with water.  It's an energy carrier, not an energy source.  When someone finds a naturally occurring form of Hydrogen, then it's an energy source.  Otherwise, you're just breaking the bonds in water, and reforming the same bonds again (with the associated losses).  On top of that, I don't get that warm fuzzy feeling when I think about getting into a crash with a pressurized hydrogen canister on board.  :-o

not to get to way off topic, but why isn't military/shipping/political cost included in the total energy required to procure oil/gas. since energy can neither be created nor destroyed, it seams as if who ever wants to make an argument eather way about the cheapest energy source just has to

frame the discusion accordingly.

 

^ I was agreeing with you that ethanol doesn't have the same amount of energy as gasoline produced from oil. However, by converting more to ethanol, farm vehicles will use it and biodiesel. Electricity can be produced from coal, because the good ole USA has plenty of it.

 

I understand your feelings about subsidies for ethanol. They exist at state and federal levels. Since it is used as a replacement for MTBE and also used in E-85, fuel companies buy the subsidized ethanol to mix in both blends.

 

Now, its not considered a subsidy, but the Energy Plan passed last year gave oil companies HUGE tax benefits and cuts. Now, which is worse, I guess the argument can go either way. I would rather have ethanol subsidies than giving oil companies tax breaks in order to spur increased supply in oil and refinery capacity. Has anyone heard of a new refinery being built anywhere? How long have oil companies said that if they could get some tax cuts, we would have enough refinery capacity?

Why Wal-Mart wants to sell ethanol

 

http://money.cnn.com/2006/08/08/news/companies/pluggedin_gunther.fortune/index.htm

 

By Marc Gunther, Fortune senior writer

August 9 2006: 11:54 AM EDT

 

NEW YORK (Fortune) -- More than 5 million vehicles on U.S. roads today can run on ethanol - a renewable fuel that comes from corn - as well as gasoline. General Motors (Charts), Ford (Charts) and DaimlerChrysler (Charts) recently announced plans to double their annual production of so-called flex fuel vehicles to two million cars and trucks by 2010.

 

It's the single largest commitment to renewable fuels in the history of the auto industry - a good move for the automakers, and for the planet, too.

 

More at link above:

Ethanol, biodiesel stations open locally

Friday, September 08, 2006

 

COLUMBUS - Ethanol and biodiesel can be bought at two more gasoline stations in Ohio starting today, according to Clean Fuels Ohio. Knight Enterprises are opening pumps in Mount Gilead, on Rt. 95 off Exit 151 of I-71, and at 1303 N. Main St. in Marion.

 

They will sell E85, a blend of 85 percent ethanol and 15 percent gasoline, and B20, which is 20 percent biodiesel and 80 percent diesel.

 

The stations are among several set to open by year’s end across the state, according to Clean Fuels Ohio

 

http://www.dispatch.com/business-story.php?story=dispatch/2006/09/08/20060908-G2-10.html

 

I am curious what the cost difference will be between E85 & unleaded gas.

You'd still have to calculate it yourself since the energy density is much greater for ga$oline.

The October 2006 issue of Consumer Reports has an interesting article about E85.  It's titled "The Ethonal Myth."  They tested a flexible-fule vehicle with both gasoline and E85.  They found that gas milage went down with E85, and they criticized GM for making this technology available with cars that are known for being gas-guzzlers.  For several reasons, they concluded that E85 may only fill a small percentage of US energy needs.

 

If you have access to this issue, I recommend giving it a read. 

For a quick calculation, multiply the price of ethanol by 1.5.  Ethanol gets around 2/3 the mileage of regular unleaded. 

 

So...if you find gasoline for $3, E85 would need to be $2 or less to be cost effective for you. 

 

That difference is pretty eye opening when you consider that gasoline is taxed, and ethanol is heavily subsidized.  I don't have a citation, but I remember reading somewhere that that 14% of US corn grown currently goes towards making ethanol.  This displaces 1% of our petroleum consumption.  I'll let everyone else decide if ethanol is the answer to our transportation fuel problems.

Yes I am well aware of the energy loss in E85.  I am simply looking for a factual cost difference between E85 & unleaded gas.  Next time someone goes by an gas station that sells E85 in Ohio, please post the cost difference for us.

From Business First of Columbus, 9/13/06:

 

 

Sunoco adds E85 pumps at two stations

Business First of Columbus - 10:08 AM EDT Wednesday

 

Two Central Ohio gas stations are offering pumps with alternative fuels.

 

Sunoco Inc. (NYSE:SUN) stations at 6027 Route 95 in Mt. Gilead and 1303 N. Main St. in Marion began offering E85 and biodiesel blends last week.

 

E85 fuel is a blend of 85 percent ethanol and 15 percent gasoline. The fuel is a cleaner-burning alternative to regular gas, reducing greenhouse emissions.

 

More at:

 

http://www.bizjournals.com/columbus/stories/2006/09/11/daily9.html?from_rss=1

 

Ohio Rep Mike Foley (District 14 - Cleveland) has introduced legislation that would mandate one E85 pump at every service station on the ohio turnpike.

 

http://www.buckeyestateblog.com/foley_proposes_e85_fuel_pumps_across_turnpike#comment

^ If nothing else, it should be an interesting experiment to see if anyone is dumb enough to use it when it's only 20 cents cheaper than regular gasoline.

From the 9/21/06 Sun Banner Pride:

 

 

First E-85 station in area plans corn fuel festival Saturday

Thursday, September 21, 2006

By Anita M. Spacek

Sun Banner Pride

 

The first and only place in the area to purchase E-85 fuel is Town & Country Co-op, 241 S. State Road, in Medina.

 

The co-op, which is open to the public, is kicking off the introduction of E-85 with a Corn Fuel Festival from 10 a.m. to 1 p.m. Saturday.

 

More at:

http://www.cleveland.com/sun/sunbannerpride/index.ssf?/base/features-0/1158857628178520.xml&coll=3

---

 

From the 9/18/06 Marion Star:

 

 

Location, price make biofuels an option

E85, B5 offerings expected to grow

By JOHN JARVIS

The Marion Star

 

MARION - Motorists who prefer to operate their automobiles on biofuels such as E85 and biodiesel don't have to go far to find it.

 

Sunoco at 1303 N. Main St. recently became one of the first two fuel stations in Ohio where E85, an 85 percent ethanol fuel mix, and biodiesel, a soybean-based fuel, are available at one location.

 

More at:

 

http://www.marionstar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060918/NEWS01/609180312/1002/rss01

 

Mariemont Marathon gets first local E85 pump

CINCINNATI BUSINESS COURIER

September 29, 2006

 

CINCINNATI - The first local retail outlet for E85 fuel will open Monday.

 

The Mariemont Marathon on Wooster Pike will have one pump dispensing the ethanol fuel blend, according to a news release by Lykins Cos. Milford-based Lykins supplies the E85, as well as gasoline and home heating oil to commercial and residential customers in the Tri-State.

 

More at:

 

http://cincinnati.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/stories/2006/09/25/daily53.html?surround=lfn

From the 10/1/06 Lorain Morning Journal:

 

Filling up with E85

SCOT ALLYN, Morning Journal Writer

10/01/2006

 

OBERLIN -- Got an FFV? Need E85? If those acronyms are unfamiliar to you now, they won't be for long.

 

Sam Merrett, owner and manager of Full Circle Fuels, 141 S. Main St., Oberlin, started selling E85 (ethanol fuel) for FFVs (flexible fuel vehicles) a few weeks ago. While his sales are about 50 gallons a week, Merrett, 23, is confident of a better future. The station is selling E85, currently for $2.09 a gallon.

 

More at:

 

http://www.morningjournal.com/site/index.cfm?newsid=17269238&BRD=1699&PAG=461&dept_id=566374&rfi=8

 

From the 10/17/06 Toledo Blade:

 

 

Area stations with E85 ethanol remain scarce

By JULIE M. McKINNON

BLADE BUSINESS WRITER

 

Every time Meijer Inc. converts one of the pumps at a store's gas station to E85 ethanol fuel, it costs roughly $20,000.

 

That expense likely is one of the main reasons more retailers haven't added the mix of 85 percent ethanol and 15 percent gasoline, which appeared for the first time locally a year ago at the Sterling Stores LLC station on Toledo's West Alexis Road.

 

Just seven gas stations in northwest Ohio and southeast Michigan offer or will soon have E85, including the Meijer in Adrian and a Sterling on Toledo's Secor Road that is being remodeled, according to the National Ethanol Vehicle Coalition.

 

Full story at:

http://www.toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20061017/BUSINESS01/610170332/-1/BUSINESS

 

From the 10/24/06 Toledo Blade:

 

Area E85 pumps in use despite safety action

By JON CHAVEZ

BLADE BUSINESS WRITER

 

Despite the lack of a key safety rating for gas pumps that dispense E85 fuel, gas stations in northwest Ohio and southeast Michigan yesterday continued to sell the ethanol-based vehicle fuel.

 

Fire marshal offices in both states said they haven't decided whether to order operators to stop using the pumps, even though fire codes in Ohio and Michigan require the dispensers to have a safety rating.

 

More at:

http://www.toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20061024/BUSINESS01/610240387/-1/BUSINESS

 

From the 10/27/06 PD:

 

 

Filling stations pull ethanol blend

Friday, October 27, 2006

John Funk

Plain Dealer Reporter

 

The first filling station in Ohio to sell E85 has voluntarily stopped selling the blend of 85 percent ethanol and 15 percent gasoline until Underwriters Laboratories certifies the pumps used to dispense it.

 

A spokesman for Marathon Petroleum said its three Speedway stations offering E85 - one in Hilliard, outside Columbus, which has sold the fuel for several years; one in St. Paul, Minn.; and a third in Des Plaines, Ill. - will not resume selling the blend until UL develops pump standards and certifies the pumps.

 

More at:

 

http://www.cleveland.com/business/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/business/1161937835225110.xml&coll=2

 

Kroger opens first local E85 ethanol fuel pump

JOHN ECKBERG / CINCINNATI ENQUIRER

January 23, 2007

 

PHOTO: On Monday, Kroger Co. opened its first E85 ethanol fuel pump at its Finneytown location.

Associated Press file

 

CINCINNATI - The Kroger Co. opened its first E85 ethanol fuel pump in the area Monday at its Finneytown grocery, 8421 Winton Road. Also, the fuel blended from corn and refined oil will be sold at a Blanchester Kroger on Thursday with pumps coming to Kroger stores in Hyde Park and Dent before the end of winter. E85, a blend of gasoline and ethanol, is a more environmentally friendly fuel than gasoline and will be distributed at other area Kroger stores within a year, said Geoff Covert, president of the Cincinnati/Dayton Division of Kroger. In July, Ohio lawmakers authorized a $1 million grant to bring more E85 and biodiesel pumps to Ohio. Not all vehicles can use E85 safely because of the high proportion of ethanol in the blend.

 

http://news.enquirer.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070123/BIZ01/701230327/1076/BIZ

The president in the State of the union advocated reducing gasoline consumption by 20%.  Not one word was mentioned about mass transit. 

^damn...sometimes you read my mind exactly!!!  I was going to post this same observation, but I wasn't sure where it would fit.  I was also miffed by NO mention of transit what so ever!!!!  I also don't understand the LONG timelines for his rather modest domestic proposals  :wtf:

 

It would sure be nice to have some people in DC thinking about transit and pushing the envelope on the issue!!!  This president certainly won't do it...hes too concerned with clean coal and battery charged cars (what a jackbutt)!!

^ And Ethanol!  Oy!

 

I hope he's got a Plan B when faith in technological advances for cellulosic ethanol don't pan out, but based on his track record, I doubt he does. :roll:

In the paper (enquirer so beware) it said that you need 1.4 gallons of ethanol to go the same distance as one gallons of gasoline.  So at 1.65 a gallon it is actually about the same price as regular gas or maybe a little more.

Aside from the stunning silence on mass transit, it should come as no surprise that New Urbanism or Smart Growth was also totally left out. Either one would easily lower a significant amount of gas we use, nevermind using less gas or using alternative fuels.