i remember hearing about a major called "industiral archaelogoy" it intrigued me.......

This meeting was not what I had hoped, however it is a sign that things are still on track.  Seems like it could be a while before we have any concrete answers, and detailed drawings and plans wont come until Christmas.  Here are two takes on the meeting...

---

from, Morning Journal (2-17-05)

Minor changes made in plan for quarries site

 

AMHERST TOWNSHIP -- The plan to transform the Cleveland Quarries site into a $1 billion, 970-acre leisure destination underwent minor alterations that were the topic last night of a meeting between local government officials and residents.

 

With slight tweaking in its original plan, 20 additional acres in Brownhelm Township will be added to the project and slightly fewer acres will be used in Amherst Township.

 

 

from, Chronicle Telegram (2-17-05)

Yeah, I was there as well and not very much went on besides zoning discussion.  But, I was able to see all the concept pictures that they had, which are lookin real nice.  A place like that could definately get national attention and add some good jobs to the area.  Plus I also got to revisit my old middle school which was kinda cool. 

 

It looks like things are still in progress, like you said.

Looks like the total cost of 1 billion may be a little low......

 

(important part is highlighted)

County gets spot in Forbes

Commissioners spend nearly $11,000 on ads

 

ELYRIA — When the April issue of Forbes magazine arrives in mailboxes in Ohio, Kentucky and Indiana, business leaders will be able to check out Lorain County’s business climate and see if it matches their own needs.

A spread on Lorain County containing photos and a story will reach 50,000 subscribers and 250,000 readers, said Community Development Director Ronald Twining. It is advertising of a sort because it will cost the county $10,900.

All three county commissioners were interviewed Wednesday in a conference call by a reporter.

“When Forbes calls, you return the call,” joked Commissioner Ted Kalo.

Actually, the reporter, Fred Anderson, works for EMI Network of Cincinnati, which contracts with Forbes to provide material published in the magazine for a fee.

Twining said the feature will appear in a section about business opportunities in Northeast Ohio. Twining said the Forbes representatives called the county and the county agreed almost immediately to take part.

“We were delighted that out of all the economic development departments, they chose us,” Twining said. “We’re guessing we’re going to get 20 to 50 (business) people calling asking for information.”

Kalo said they told the reporter about all the new projects planned for Lorain County, including a proposed $100 million Indian casino in Lorain, the $1.2- to $1.5-billion quarries project in South Amherst and a soccer school in Lorain.....

 

http://chronicletelegram.com/Daily%20Pages/Front/Html/Head4.html

^great idea to do some important nuts&bolts old fashioned print advertising^

 

you cannot be a player in a world market if no one knows you are there!

 

as far as quarry resorts and casinos, i would not hold my breath on those as of yet.

 

did this get posted? i cant remember, but i just came across it. cleveland's ecocity folks had a take on this potential project:

 

January 28, 2005

 

Regional review for mega-development proposals?

 

Attendees at last night's Smart Growth Coalition meeting learned about a $1 billion, 970 acre development proposal in northern Lorain County.

 

British-based Trans European Securities LLP wants to create a resort destination with a world-class golf course, ski slopes, an equestrian center and a year-round aquatic center with a retractable roof, plus 750,000 square feet of mixed-use retail, a 50,000-square-foot conference center, approximately 5 million square feet of office and commercial facilities.

 

The schematics supplied by the company also show plans to build housing for 5,000 families, as well as construct its own schools and churches, and provide its own emergency services.

 

If it comes to pass, a project of this scale could warp the entire region's growth and travel patterns (though this is only a fraction of the size, think of what Walt Disney World did to transportation and development demand in a swampy rural area of central Florida). 

 

But since there's no forum for review of regional-scale development propsals, key decisions about the region's development would in this case be made only by a handful of Lorain county and township officials. 

 

EcoCity thinks NOACA should explore ways of subjecting proposals of such massive scope to a truly regional review process.

 

 

 

 

 

 

yea I posted that about 2 weeks ago..

 

That is a pretty interesting take on it.. comparing it to Disney World and all.

 

But thanks for posting that anyways.. and keep your eyes open for those little pieces of info... pretty cool stuff

 

 

Hmm..I can't see this having quite the draw of Disney World, but I'm sure it would be a pretty big hit.

 

Well, unless they make a dome over the whole thing.  That would be pretty impressive since I don't think that's ever been attempted before on a resort.  Not that I know of anyway...

 

Anyone heard anything new on this lately?

I don't think anyone is seriously comparing it to Disney World.. only in the sense that both projects had/ will have an enormous impact on the surrounding communities. 

 

I think this (Cleveland Quarries Project) will be more comparable to places like Cedar Point and other big amusement parks.  It could be the biggest resort in Ohio and maybe even the midwest.  Maybe even one of the top in the country.  Only time will tell what comes of it though, lots can change between now and opening day.

 

Looks like the next really exciting news wont come out until - Christmas time - when TESI will release a 3-D model, specific building renderings, costs, tenents, ect. 

 

In the mean time we can expect to learn things like the results of the feasability study, traffic impacts, where sewers will come from ect...

For the next week or so there are just going to be local community/county meetings, there probably wont be too much news from those. 

 

This is just an on going process right now... give it some time.

I've been resisting this thread for a while (who am I kidding? I've only been on this site for 5 days!) and I finally sat down to check it out. 

 

I think it's crazy and I think Eco City is right to question the regional ramifications of such a project!

 

I also think it sounds amazing and anything that would bring international (or at least national) attention to the region and its development potential is positive. 

 

However, I am an urban planner who must think of every last detail (whether I like it or not) and I have to think regionally and in the grand scheme of things, I think we need to manage growth more carefully.  Proposals like this would be interesting cases for variances...islands of development within a conservation framework.  I mean, what are the chances that this would be  a one-house-per-acre development five years from now if it isn't developed in this way?  Pretty good, I'd say.  There'd be a few big-boxes and some super expensive houses and the sprawl would just continue. 

 

I could go into a whole schpeal on sprawl here, but no one wants to hear it, so I'll just say that we need to proceed with caution here.  Don't bite at the money and forget that there will be a ripple effect through the entire region.  Cleveland got nervous about a Walmart...how do you think they feel about this???

UPDATED MAP:

 

copy -> paste, for smaller picture..

C:\Documents and Settings\Jon\Local Settings\Temporary Internet Files\Content.IE5\ANEV6TQ7\quarrydetailnew0mi[1].jpg

 

HEY MISTER GOOD DAY!! welcome to the topic!

 

Mister Day Man said:

 

Don't bite at the money and forget that there will be a ripple effect through the entire region.  Cleveland got nervous about a Walmart...how do you think they feel about this???

 

Obviously, this will affect the entire region, but I don't believe you can call this sprawl... There are no companies relocating from Cleveland and the 25,000 people who live in this "community" will not be comming from Cleveland.  They will be comming from across the US and the globe.  Sure there will be people who move here from Cleveland, but thats not the developer's objective.  For this to be successful it will have to draw people from all over the place.

 

In my eyes it can only bring good to NE Ohio...positive international attention, desperatly needed jobs (at least 6 or 7,000), spin off developments from Hopkins to Route 58 and Baumhart Rd. and beyond, and not to mention, a huge boost to the local schools and communities.  All this without taking anything from Cleveland.

 

Does any one think that NE Ohio would be better off without this development???

Looks like the next really exciting news wont come out until - Christmas time - when TESI will release a 3-D model, specific building renderings, costs, tenents, ect.  In the mean time we can expect to learn things like the results of the feasability study, traffic impacts, where sewers will come from ect...

 

lets not get even that far along yet. there has been no action on this at all, only speculation. the only action to date has been the purchase of a an option to but some land. buying options is nothing, esp land options. in fact less than nothing, its a write-off.

 

until someone steps forward from the shadows and actually purchases the land and sticks shovels in the ground i would not give it much creedence.

 

frankly, it sounds too far fetched to be real, or at best much less than it is. i do hope it happens, but ehh until money gets spent.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Like I said, I think it would be really exciting to see this happen and I think there would be definite positives and the alternative is traditional sprawl, which is likely on this site...but I have to say that on the whole, I'm for preservation of natural spaces this far out on the fringe and concentration of growth on existing urban areas.  This is a unique development whose affects will be difficult to measure, so I'm just saying, let's be careful and thorough!

lets not get even that far along yet. there has been no action on this at all, only speculation. the only action to date has been the purchase of a an option to but some land. buying options is nothing, esp land options. in fact less than nothing, its a write-off.

 

I completely agree that this is not for sure until they start construction.  But, this company (someone) has been in constant contact with Lorain County officials for the past 11 months.  They have not done anything out of the ordinary so far, why should we be any more skeptical of this project than any other??  Yea, you can say all they have done so far is purchase an option on the land but what else could you expect of them at this point?  Deveopers dont buy the land or start construction before zoning has been approved.

 

This is going to be a long process.  Amherst and Brownhelm townships have to completely re-write their zoning regulations.  A project like this takes months, years of planning.  Give it time, and wait to see what happens, before you write it off.

from, Morning Journal (3-06-05)

From sandstone quarries to possible luxury resort

By KRISTA SCHULTZ

 

Amherst Township - Once the oldest and largest quarrying business in existence, Cleveland Quarries will now be using its natural assets and atmosphere as the stage for a proposed billion dollar leisure resort plan.

 

United Kingdom-based consortium Trans European Securities International LLP originally proposed its plan of a 970-acre leisure resort and golf course to a packed house of trustees, local government officials and residents back in late September.  The plan has slowly begun to grind forward in the months since.

 

 

For what its worth...

I saw an interview with Donald Trump this morning and he said the one real positive with the weak dollar was the amound of foreign investment into real estate in the country.  So maybe there is a feeling in Europe right now that everyone has to invest in US real estate ventures now before the dollar strengthens again.

 

 

This is going to be a long process.  Amherst and Brownhelm townships have to completely re-write their zoning regulations.  A project like this takes months, years of planning.  Give it time, and wait to see what happens, before you write it off.

 

foot dragging on something of this magnitude? you gotta be kidding, that would be foolish. they could all sit down and re-write anything that needs re-written over a weekend if they really wanted to. and then vote on it. if it were truly on the up and up they would jump on this. i admire the cautiousness at this point. personally i am not writing anything off, i just continue to be dubious.

 

Cleveland Quarries Co. traces its origins back to 1886, when Cleveland Stone Company was formed.  In 1929, the company acquired rival Ohio Quarries Co., according to a history published by the company.

 

yada, yada --- this is exactly why i continue to be dubious! yeah sure we all know the history and backstory of the local quarries. what we do not know is the history and backstory of the mysterious euros.

 

the more and more i read about trans-european i keep thinking of kraftwerk

^ yeah & that's a cool song!

 

trans....

 

 

europe....

 

 

express....

 

 

 

 

lol... thats a song?

yeah, don't dis the kraftwerk

Seriously. Don't dis' 'em. I have every Kraftwerk album, and have tried to find CDs to replace the records. Not easy to do. Now I've got the song Trans-Europe Express running through my head....

 

Steele, they were a techno band from 1970s and early 80s that made it big in Europe but we're more fringe here in the U.S. But ask any guys who were teenagers in the late 70s or early 80s and they've probably heard of Kraftwerk (doesn't matter if the teen was from the suburbs or the inner city, either. Black kids also loved Kraftwerk).

 

"bon bon bon on the Autobahn"

 

Now back to our regularly scheduled program

 

"and when I hit this special key it plays a little melody...."

 

KJP

After seeing that overhead map on the previous page, I've come to realize something.

 

When I make trips back to Amherst, (I'm now currently in Toledo) I usually take the Turnpike and get off at that exit there on Baumhart Rd.

 

So what I realized is that this resort, if they do go through with building it, will actually be

RIGHT next to the Turnpike.  If you get off at that Baumhart exit, you'd basically be right at the entrance to the resort already.  You wouldn't have to travel down any back roads or anything to get there like most other resorts/ski resorts that I've been to.

 

Not only that, but the north side of the resort would be right next to about a mile and a half stretch of Turnpike.  If the Trans-Euro company decides to make everything they proposed (indoor beach, retractable dome, world class golf resort, ski slopes, convention center, etc.) it's going to be seen by a LOT of people just travelling down the Turnpike. And a lot of people use the Turnpike to get from big midwest cities (Chicago,Detroit) to out east cities like NYC, Boston, Philly, Cleveland, whathaveyou.  And vice versa - people travelling from east to midwest. I should know since I used to work a few summers for the Turnpike.  So the resort would most likely get a large amount of attention right there.  They wouldn't even have to rely on a lot of advertising to get people there if they built it right.

 

 

So maybe the comparing it to Disney World wouldn't be so far fetched after all.  It probably wouldn't result in a huge amount of sprawl (and no movie-themed rollercoasters or things like that), but it would result in many people stopping off the Turnpike and massive business for the resort and surrounding area.  And hey, if you wanted to go on rollercoasters you could always just stop at Cedar Point or something.

just something minor i came across.....

 

http://www.ukdata.com/company-listings/details/TRANS+EUROPEAN+SECURITIES+INTERNATIONAL+LLP.html

..so does anyone want to pay the £18.00 to find out more about the "mysterious" TransEuro company?

http://www.ukdata.com/creditreports/viewCompanyDetails.do?companyId=OC308050&full=1

you'd be paying 18 pounds for the articles of incorporation.

 

But seriously, has anyone done due dilligence on this company? Hoovers has nothing on the company either....

^it's fairly obvious the one or two euro guys who came to speak "are" the company! they may or may not have big money behind them, but so far they invested in an option (for tax purposes) is all it is. unless somebody actually buys something, plans are shown and cranes go up, in the end that smells of a sprawlburbia golf course at best.

 

oh well, since they are brits maybe they will make it an old-style scottish links course with swale and hellish sand traps -- haha!

 

also, lorain county already went thru this kind of scenario in the 60's, it was called aquamarine; and in the 70's when it was called oak hills----so far this smells like more of the same thing at best.

 

anyone see the big article on how this project is the "real deal" this morning in the PD???

 

http://www.cleveland.com/lorain/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/lorain/1116840627151820.xml&coll=2

 

I can't get over how crazy this is!!!

Yeah I saw that and it talked about a Seven Star Hotel like you hear aobut in Dubai.

well i saw that and all it talked about is a golf course.

 

yes i'm still just as skeptical --- until there is some follow-thru that involves more than golf....

Yeah and the article pronounces proudly that the devlepoer has spent a whopiing 1 million dollars so far!!  wow! this whole thing is just strange.  Wish it the best though!

 

awesome news! i always had a feeling this was for real.  (s) amherst/twp will become the new tourist capital of ohio! (except for maybe cp)  :-).  Can you imagine all this and then CP AND Cleveland only 30 minutes away, what a sales pitch!

Triangle of success me thinks!........wow im cheesy.

Steele, I have a stupid question for you, what is CP? I guess I don't really know what to think of this project except that it is very strange, and can be very good for the greater Cleveland area.

lol.  no, not stupid i should have just typed it out, my apologies. CP = Cedar Point

Yeah, I still feel like this is some big billionaire coming in to sell Springfield a monorail...

i hear cleveland has some surface parking and an underdeveloped lakefront

 

i bet i already complained about this already in this post

Me too, MGD.  And also, now that I think of it, would they be able to build all they are saying for "only" $1.25 billion?  That's not alot when you consider the cost that would have to go into 7-star, 5-star, and 4-star hotels, several million square feet of retail, condos, and offices, and of course, an indoor beach.  I don't think nearly all of that could be accomplished for what they are saying.

the potential developer only says he spent a million dollars on this already. there is absolutely no proof of that yet.

I guess this story's being picked up nationally.  From the AP, 5/24/05:

 

 

Luxury complex planned

British developer sees big potential at old quarry

The Associated Press

 

SOUTH AMHERST, Ohio - A developer plans a $1.25 billion residential, commercial and recreation complex on the grounds of long-dormant quarries that provided sandstone to landmarks around the nation for 111 years.

 

"Perhaps it takes an outsider to see the beauty that local people cannot see," Neil Pike told the (Cleveland) Plain Dealer in a telephone interview from his office in London. "People who live there literally can't see the forest for the trees. You see a quarry. We see a world-class facility."

 

Pike envisions the 1,000-acre site 35 miles southwest of Cleveland with luxury housing and hotels, office towers, restaurants, a championship golf course and a glass-enclosed former quarry converted into an all-weather beach.

 

 

http://news.enquirer.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20050524/NEWS/505240367/1092/NEWS01

 

Yeah, I've gotta agree that this is great news for the west Cleveland area.

 

However, what's with the constant skepticism?  No proof?  How much more do you want to see.  This was a page long article published in the Plain Dealer, largest newspaper in Ohio.  They wouldn't dedicate a page of space just to print half-truths and lies.

 

Also, the article did mention plans to build other things than the golf courses.

 

"luxury housing, and hotels (one of which he said would be a seven-star international rated hotel), 25-story offices, gourmet restaurants and a world-class golf course.

That, plus a quarry transformed into an all-weather beach protected by a huge dome of glass, plastic and steel."

and..

"The recreation areas, hotels and restaurants will be open to the public."

 

 

This should definately be something to see...

However, what's with the constant skepticism?  No proof?  How much more do you want to see.  This was a page long article published in the Plain Dealer, largest newspaper in Ohio.  They wouldn't dedicate a page of space just to print half-truths and lies.

 

****(stifling laughter)!!

 

tell ya what --- since nothing has happened yet i'll perk up a little when he actually buys all the land. that would be the next step, no?

 

i'll be happy when they are building something more than a golf course with a subdivision on it --- if you think that is so cool save yourself the suspense and go up north to the lake and see oak hills by lorain community hospital. the other stuff mentioned is the true key to it being a big big deal!

 

 

Yeah and please lets not make the PD a benchmark ok???  All Im saying is 1.25 from a group no one seems to know much of or track down for that matter, just seems fishy.  Ive seen similar projects dispear without a trace.

Yay!  Sprawl!  My favorite!  :)

 

I hope they build this thing.  Ohio is hurting for tourist resorts, given the size of the state.

All I'm saying is that, by now, we've seen that there's obviously been a lot of thought put into the planning of this project.  This I gather from having personally attended local meetings, and the amount of news and research gone into it.

 

Also, I have a close friend who has a family member that's been working for the quarry offices for quite some time.  From what I've been told, everything planned is going to be built.

 

True there is no absolute proof yet.  We'll have to wait 5 years to see that.

 

So until the resort is actually built, it does have the possibility of not being built or it might not be built with everything they had originally planned.  If that happens, oh well, I won't be dissapointed.  I just think it's fun to talk about in the meantime.

^jskiboarder for the record i am all for this, it would be great for the local area. i just need to see a lot more before i personally get excited, like transactions done, shovels in ground and cranes in the air. lorain co has long history of disappointments.

 

yes it is fun to talk about. you are closer to it than most of us, please keep us 100% informed when you hear stuff!

Quarry Plan has approval from 'big three'

by JASON HAWK, Amherst News-Times

 

A $1.5 billion deal has finally been set with a firm long-distance handshake.

 

Now, terraforming the defunct Cleveland Quarries with a combination golf, hotel, recreation, and high-life "Carribean-style" resort will require British investor Neil Pike to purchase 970 acres north of Route 113 before his $2 million option on the land expires in August.

 

So far, all three communities that hold portions of the land South Amherst, Amherst Township and Brownhelm -- have agreed to rezoning measures to allow Pike's firm, Trans European Securities International, to break ground as early as fall of 2006.

 

 

could somebody try to post the schematics for now!?!