Dave's looks to new market

Posted by Zachary Lewis October 22, 2007 18:09PM

Categories: Economic development

 

Wal-Mart may have the lock on low prices, but it doesn't necessarily speak the language of its customers.

 

That, at least, is what Dave's Markets is counting on as it braces for life in the shadow of a retail behemoth notorious for putting smaller merchants out of business.

 

More at cleveland.com

http://blog.cleveland.com/business/2007/10/daves_looks_to_new_market.html

^ Terrific innovation.

That is very cool. Good for them and the Latino community.

Humm.... the way this article is written it could be condescending to Latinos.  I hope the staff and environment are not as stereotypical as I interpreted this article.  I don't want to come across negative, I'm just indifferent to the article.

 

We tried to do it in a way that wouldn't be offensive to our [non-Hispanic] customers," Saltzman said.

 

But the differences aren't hard to spot. Signs are in Spanish as well as English. Employees wear badges reading "Yo Hablo Espanol" ("I speak Spanish"). Even the background music is Spanish.

 

I bet you a million bucks they'll play generic Nortenos or rancheros type of "Spanish" music. Instead of saying,"Even the background music is Spanish" they should have said "we'll play Latin Music".  Its' written as if all the people in the community don't speak or understand English. 

 

I would like to know if the Management of this Dave's is Latino and are members of the local community.

 

I'm having a "clvlndr" moment.  LOL  :wink:

^ You haven't even seen the walking burrito that's going to be outside the store.

^ You haven't even seen the walking burrito that's going to be outside the store.

 

Great...a Mexican spin!  ugh!

Instead of saying,"Even the background music is Spanish" they should have said "we'll play Latin Music".  

 

I dont think the "even the backround music is Spanish" is a quote from Saltzman.  I think that is the PD reporter.

Instead of saying,"Even the background music is Spanish" they should have said "we'll play Latin Music".  

 

I dont think the "even the backround music is Spanish" is a quote from Saltzman.  I think that is the PD reporter.

 

Exactly my point.  Why have a "non latino" write a suppoded feel good/community article and not know what they are talking about and did no research to make sure they "words" they used were interpreted properly.

 

I was talking to my cousin about this and she was like, why didn't they mention hours; the types of foods from the different regions of Latin America they will be offering.

 

In addition, Goat is more of a West Indian/Caribbean thing than Latin/Carribean thing by a large majority.

Have you written the PD to complain about their lack of diversity and the reflection thereof in this article?!?

 

ZING!

Have you written the PD to complain about their lack of diversity and the reflection thereof in this article?!?

 

ZING!

 

boo...you know I have!  And I wrote in Spanish to prove my point.

Well:

 

"Then there's the food itself. Plantains are available in the produce department, and at the deli, the takeout list includes red beans and rice. Goya products line entire aisles, not just a couple of shelves. There's goat in the meat area."  (I've seen goat at a number of PR restaurants)

 

As for the music, saying it is Spanish could mean a number of things.  It could mean that the music itself comes from Spain, but most likely, it means that the music features Spanish lyrics- especially given the context, which indicated that the store was going out of its way to include the Spanish language.  It's an inelegant way of phrasing it, but my god, you're being touchy about minor stuff here, man.

 

And are you seriously suggesting that only a Latino should cover this story because it contains Latino related material?  Would the same apply to African Americans?  Chinese?  Laotians from the village of Ban Na Inh Noi?  WASP's?  I didn't see this as an "ethnic community" article, anyways, so much as a "local business adapting to major national competition invading its market" article.

And are you seriously suggesting that only a Latino should cover this story because it contains Latino related material?  Would the same apply to African Americans?  Chinese?  Laotians from the village of Ban Na Inh Noi?  WASP's?  I didn't see this as an "ethnic community" article, anyways, so much as a "local business adapting to major national competition invading its market" article.

 

Yes, because the major point of the article is gain support from the community this store is located in.  I do think in this instance it should be a person of the community.

Really? Why? I don't agree. I don't see why a Hispanic person needs to cover a Hispanic community related story.

 

 

Really? Why? I don't agree. I don't see why a Hispanic person needs to cover a Hispanic community related story.

 

 

 

I know this is going to cause a rankle, but you and X wouldn't.

I'm with X, I think you're overreacting and read the article with a tortilla on your shoulder. You're making this a tempest in a teacup.

Hahaha .. word. I mean, if it's a community newsletter, it's one thing. But we're talking about a city newspaper. And city newspapers can't relegate their reporters based on their skin color. That's ridiculous, in my opinion.

I'm with X, I think you're overreacting and read the article with a tortilla on your shoulder. You're making this a tempest in a teacup.

 

A tortilla?  How dare you insult me with a ethnic comment like that!  You can't even see whats on my shoulders, shawty!  :whip:

 

Again, as I stated earlier, that is how I interpreted the article.

Yeah. Well. Get over it. :-D :-D

"A tortilla?  How dare you insult me with a ethnic comment like that!"

 

Easily - ask ColDayMan. Would it be better if I said "disko"?

Yeah. Well. Get over it. :-D :-D

 Hush Gringo!  Don't make me call my the Platanos on you! :wink:

Are we done kids?

 

I am deleting any more irrelevant posts after mine.

Has anyone checked out the new Sherwin Williams store on Chagrin Blvd, across from Shaker Town Center. I went on their opening day back in September and it was really nice. I wonder if they'll make it a chain.

^ Sherwin Williams already has a chain of stores, and has had them for a while.

^ Sherwin Williams already has a chain of stores, and has had them for a while.

 

Let me clarify.

 

This is Sherwin Williams' new Idea center concept, not a typical store.

 

you can read more here: http://www.shakeronline.com/media/pdfs/calendar/calendar_962007144951SherwinWmsreopen2007.pdf

Not sure if this falls under retail, as it's more precisely a service, but it appears that the old Giant Eagle on Detroit Ave in Lakewood is going to become an Urban Active (previously Gold's) Gym, possibly with some condos and small retail. 

 

http://blog.cleveland.com/business/2007/11/urban_active_replaces_golds_gy.html

 

It appears a pocket gym also upped in the Superior corridor (at probably E. 25th-ish) ... although it might be an equipment store. I'll look at it more closely the next time I'm by. 

Cry me a river... as if the city or Forest City Enterprises is obligated to be their babysitters. From cleveland.com:

 

Students, activists to protest at Tower City

Posted by Donna J. Miller November 02, 2007 11:47AM

Categories: FYI

Black On Black Crime, Survivors/Victims of Tragedy and Cleveland school students will speak outside Tower City at 3:15 today about the new policy that keeps teens out of the building when not accompanied by a parent or guardian.

 

The activists are calling the rally the National Blackout Day Movement. :roll:

 

From cleveland.com

http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2007/11/_black_on_black_crime.html

 

 

 

If there was a focus on creating a quality home life for these teenagers by "Black on Black Crime" there wouldn't be the need to ban guardianless kids.  These groups are always so quick to ignore the core problems in lue of making headlines for their own personal gain.

Granted, Tower City has a right to set its own operational standards, and granted, this probably isn't a gigantic civil rights issue, but I would imagine that only a small portion of students in Tower City actually create any disturbance of note or commit any petty crimes. So, if the decision to ban teenagers from the center is based primarily on the actions of a relatively small sub-group of the banned demographic, and if an unspoken rationale is that large groups of teenagers (many of whom are African American), make customers uncomfortable (many of whom are middle-class, white suburbanites), then more power to them for calling the issue out.

 

And even if we don't agree with the stance of the group, I'm personally excited to see everyday people, particularly any teenagers engaged in this effort, participating in civic affairs. Frankly, I wish more people would articulate issues that are important to them, even if they seem silly to others.

Cue Beastie Boys:

 

"YOU'VE GOTTA FIGHT", DUNH DUNH, "FOR YOUR RIGHT", DUNH DUNH, "TO LOOOOOIT-ER!"

"I would imagine that only a small portion of students in Tower City actually create any disturbance of note or commit any petty crimes."

 

Not that I disagree with all of your post, but out of curiosity - have you ever worked in Tower City? I try to be diplomatic and I truly try to give people the benefit of the doubt but ummmm...  :|

wait, what does this unsupervised minor have to do with being black?

 

I thought it had more to do with being a f-ing parent?

So typical. What a surprise. They're making it a racial thing. Man .. people really need to drop that card already. Not everything is a racial issue.

So typical. What a surprise. They're making it a racial thing. Man .. people really need to drop that card already. Not everything is a racial issue.

 

As if those things don't happen here in NYC.  It's not a Cleveland thing.

 

My question is, why is the ban only in place to 2:30 PM.  What is the last period of the School day?  I know that schools get out at varied times but that particular time seems weird.  Also, how are they going to attracted teens to work at the mall during the holidays?

 

 

"Also, how are they going to attracted teens to work at the mall during the holidays?"

 

As they've said ad nauseum - employees who are in their teens will get ID badges.

So typical. What a surprise. They're making it a racial thing. Man .. people really need to drop that card already. Not everything is a racial issue.

 

National black out day was part of a larger national campaign for blacks not to purchase anything on Friday. So I don't think they are making this a racial issue. Its more of a convienient coincidence.

 

Maybe the ban starts at 2:30 to allow kids to come in and catch the trains or get something to eat while in transit home or to school. Just a guess.

"Also, how are they going to attracted teens to work at the mall during the holidays?"

 

As they've said ad nauseum - employees who are in their teens will get ID badges.

 

I'm talking about future hires, not current employees.  Those hours could hamper teens/young adults from going to apply for a job.  They might be under the impression that they cannot get into the mall, therefore not even bothering to look at TowerCity.

"Not that I disagree with all of your post, but out of curiosity - have you ever worked in Tower City? I try to be diplomatic and I truly try to give people the benefit of the doubt but ummmm... "

 

I'm unclear with what you are saying here.  Are you implying that's it's the MAJORITY of teen-agers that ARE causing the problems at TC and therefore that the ban on teens is fully justified? 

 

I agree with 8shades that articulated protest is indeed a requirement of participatory democracy, something that we could use helluva a lot more of in this country. formal education has always lacked any meaningful curriculum on civics, but it is exactly what we need lay the foundation for healing this city/region.

 

also, regarding your comment, "as if the city or Forest City Enterprises is obligated to be their babysitters."

 

To twist your words a bit, I do believe the City/OUR CITY/Us/WE, is obligated, to some degree to babysit/befriend/tutor/watch-over, those less fortunate than ourselves. 

 

Isn't that what a civil society is all about?

"Isn't that what a civil society is all about?"

 

Do we really live in one?

I do believe the City/OUR CITY/Us/WE, is obligated, to some degree to babysit/befriend/tutor/watch-over, those less fortunate than ourselves.

 

Maybe society does but a private corporation in the business to make $$ certainly does not.

also, regarding your comment, "as if the city or Forest City Enterprises is obligated to be their babysitters."

 

To twist your words a bit, I do believe the City/OUR CITY/Us/WE, is obligated, to some degree to babysit/befriend/tutor/watch-over, those less fortunate than ourselves.

 

Isn't that what a civil society is all about?

 

Personally, I think that puts an undue burden on businesses. You shouldn't have to accommodate people that weren't taught or are ignoring social conventions, like threatening people, insulting them, swearing. How am I supposed to run a business if I have people walking around scaring everyone off? I'd like to see this ballsy move by Tower City emulated in the suburbs, too. This is a problem everywhere. Sure, a Bay Village kid isn't liable to scare you physically, but what about when they run around the library swearing and being rude. Kick their ass out!

 

When I was younger growing up in the suburbs, we also had hang outs where we were eventually banned, like the parking lot across the street where kids would smoke, trade drugs, fight; parking decks near the downtown, private stores. I got lumped in with the "bad kids," who of course were a very small number, but how is everyone else supposed to know? I know it was hard, but I eventually made it through those dark years when us kids could only enter Dairy Mart in groups of two.

Also there are lots of people who are "less fortunate" and know how to conduct themselves in a civil manner. I think it has more to do with unruly teenagers than race or those that are less fortunate.

Crain's:

 

Bombay stores taking off

 

By JOHN BOOTH

 

4:30 am, November 5, 2007

 

The Bombay Co. is closing all 300-plus of its U.S. stores, including a half-dozen in Northeast Ohio, but at least one shopping center already has new tenants lined up.

 

Legacy Village general manager Marci Gilmore said most of the 8,400 square feet occupied by Bombay and Bombay Kids will go to a couple as-yet-unidentified occupants.

 

Bombay also has stores in Canton, Fairlawn, Macedonia, Strongsville and Westlake.

"I would imagine that only a small portion of students in Tower City actually create any disturbance of note or commit any petty crimes."

 

Not that I disagree with all of your post, but out of curiosity - have you ever worked in Tower City? I try to be diplomatic and I truly try to give people the benefit of the doubt but ummmm...  :|

 

Yes. I worked in Tower City for a year or so, went to the gym there for about three years, road the Rapid every weekday for about four years and shopped there pretty frequently. Maybe I just lucked out, but I never had a bad experience with any teenager over that period of four years (with the exception of St. Patrick's Day, when the Rapid would be clogged with drunk and smoking east side Catholic School kids ... ugh). I haven't been there nearly as frequently since I moved from Shaker Square 1.5 years ago, so it may have gotten markedly worse after that. But my first-hand experience suggested that some (and I do mean some) kids were rowdy. That was all I ever saw. The problem is that this bars an entire group of people from the complex for the actions of a few. The fuller article, for instance, talks about a teenager who was removed from the Caribou coffee area while reading and drinking coffee. This kid was being quiet AND he was a paying customer. To me, that just seems overbearing. But I know other people have had different experiences and have different opinions.

So typical. What a surprise. They're making it a racial thing. Man .. people really need to drop that card already. Not everything is a racial issue.

 

Go check out the comments to this story on the PD website and tell me it's not a racial thing ... Some of the commons have thinly veiled racial undertones ... and some are just blatantly racist. Just as I believe a small number of teenagers create problems, I believe a small portion of Cleveland's population do express racial overtones regarding this issue. There are racial issues that permeate greater Cleveland. Is this the best platform for a frank discussion about race relations? Maybe not. But it is at least A platform. And it's something to which teenagers can directly relate. I still applaud their effort.

 

I'm not going to harp on it ad nauseum, but Tower City's problems have stemmed out of 20 years of retail trends, demographic shifts and conservative management choices. Turning the center into a police state (where you can't be inside the building if you're under a certain age and no one can loiter outside the building after a certain hour) is not going to address the core issues of how to successfully run a downtown mall.

guv, I get the feeling that people on this board (and in the world) need to realize that when someone says something - it's not a black-and-white decree.

 

I agree that the new policy is probably too heavy-handed and that like the kid at Caribou that 8Shades mentioned, there are going to be some good kids unjustly thrown out. Did I say that every teen that sets foot in Tower City is a h#llraising thug and should be throttled and given the heave-ho? No. Did I say that Forest City is completely correct with their approach? No. So why are you implying that I did? What I HAVE been saying for years that they've needed to actually enforce the "Code of Conduct" that's been posted, and beef up security (number of staff). If the place LOOKED like it was well-staffed and supervised, they wouldn't have had to resort to this measure. Of course, they'd have to spend a little extra to maintain that level of staffing but that's another story. What I'd like to see is Forest City making a nice donation (thanks to the numerous abatements they've received, I'm sure they could afford it) to the area rec centers and after-school programs. It'd be a nice tax write-off, and more to the point - actively support the places where the kids SHOULD be - you know, where my tax dollars go to help them?

 

As far as the comments on the cleveland.com site - those are made by anonymous morons and while they reflect some peoples' sentiments, remember - they're unmoderated, and they're on cleveland.com - need I say more?

 

As far as "obligations", I do not buy this horsesh!t notion that it is somehow my, yours, or anyone elses' obligation to mentor another human in the most basic elements of civility. Speaking as a once less-fortunate person, the one thing I *didn't* have to be taught was the simplest level of respect. No, I wasn't perfect but I sure as sh!t didn't pull crap like what I saw at Tower City. At some point, people have to take responsibility for their own actions and no amount of noblesse oblige will instill that.

^ Good points. I guess my overarching logistical question is: If Tower City lacks the security forces to properly respond to conduct codes, which would likely only require monitoring a portion of teenagers coming through the Center, how will they have the capacity to enforce a ban, which will require the same security force to monitor the ENTIRE population of teenagers (as well as some who look like teenagers but aren't)? The only advantage I can see in that strategy is it tries to preempt negative behavior before it happens. But look how well preemptive strikes worked out for us in Iraq ...

 

I like your idea about donating to after school programming. I would be a huge fan of seeing such programming occurring in one of the vacant storefronts in Tower City to expose the same workforce that sees the youth as troublemakers to young people engaged in some positive activities.

Another issue that is probably driving the teen ban is the level of theft that retailers at TC experience.  I can tell from first hand knowledge (Record Town, around '99) that theft, mostly though not entirely from teens, is a constant preoccupation, even more so than at other retailers I've worked for.  We'd catch a few thiefs every day, and nothing could be left unattended on the floor without security tags for even a minute.  Even so, we would lose quite a lot- we would find broken shucks and removed tags all the time.  I'd guess the level of theft from that age group completely wipes out any profit from dealing with them.

I know from firsthand statistics (as reported by my employer) that external theft at TC was much higher than other stores across the nation. Hell Beachwood versus TC was night and day.

 

External: grab and go, cut and carry

Internal: Me stealing magic wallets.

So typical. What a surprise. They're making it a racial thing. Man .. people really need to drop that card already. Not everything is a racial issue.

 

As if those things don't happen here in NYC.  It's not a Cleveland thing.

 

I never said it was. Although I think it's more of a problem in Cleveland than in NYC.