August 11, 200816 yr I doubt that relocating the port is so crucial. In this *new* plan, the port construction will not even *start* until 2020, anyway. This is not at all well-conceived. From the article by Krouse: The port anticipates reaching an agreement with the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers by August 2009 on building a new dike, with construction to begin in 2012. Work on the port, which would be built atop the dike, would not begin until 2020.
August 12, 200816 yr I doubt that relocating the port is so crucial. In this *new* plan, the port construction will not even *start* until 2020, anyway. This is not at all well-conceived. I couldn't disagree more. There isn't a more energy-efficient mode for hauling cargo than waterborne shipping. And Cleveland is incredibly lucky to be on an international, navigable waterway but its dock facilities haven't been significantly updated since before the Great Depression. In a world of ever-increasing petroleum prices, Cleveland MUST have modern water port facilities or the city will sacrifice its economic advantage. We cannot afford to pretend we are a landlocked city. As for the timeline: this is likely a $500 million project. It might be even end up being a $1 billion project. And projects that big don't happen overnight. Or even in five years. There are large public works projects in every city that have taken 20 to 50 years before they happened. Some still haven't happened yet they are considered "still alive." Welcome to the world of public works projects. It's where patience is a virtue, delays and cost-overruns are unfortunately normal, and the clock is measured almost in geologic time! "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
August 12, 200816 yr I doubt if the Cleveland port needs more capacity. Appearances suggest that the port is used at less than capacity--large areas of the port is made available for parking at the Browns games. I would like to know otherwise if there is a study showing that the port is past its capacity.
August 12, 200816 yr I doubt if the Cleveland port needs more capacity. Appearances suggest that the port is used at less than capacity--large areas of the port is made available for parking at the Browns games. I would like to know otherwise if there is a study showing that the port is past its capacity. Is this more of a capacity or efficiency issue at the current site?
August 13, 200816 yr Which current site? That's probably what Boreal isn't understanding. The Cleveland port doesn't just operate on its docks north of the Warehouse District, but also on the city-owned docks north of Browns Stadium and the county, port, city and railroad owned land on Whiskey Island. The scattering of all these docking locations is very inefficient and also expensive to maintain, especially when it comes to dredging to ensure a minimum 28-foot water depth. All of this is magnified when such poorly and inefficiently utilized land for port facilities has a greater value as developable properties. So consolidate the port facilities and then utilize the port's economic development powers to incentivize the reuse of the former port-used properties. To me, it seems a no-brainer. But I guess not everyone agrees. That's OK, because the port authority is pressing ahead anyway. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
August 13, 200816 yr exactly. it looks like they found the right spot and have the right plan so hopefully they can move forward on "the big move" sooner than later.
August 18, 200816 yr Which current site? That's probably what Boreal isn't understanding. The Cleveland port doesn't just operate on its docks north of the Warehouse District, but also on the city-owned docks north of Browns Stadium and the county, port, city and railroad owned land on Whiskey Island. The scattering of all these docking locations is very inefficient and also expensive to maintain, especially when it comes to dredging to ensure a minimum 28-foot water depth. All of this is magnified when such poorly and inefficiently utilized land for port facilities has a greater value as developable properties. So consolidate the port facilities and then utilize the port's economic development powers to incentivize the reuse of the former port-used properties. ... For all of the articles that I have read about the Port Authority wanting to move to Whiskey Island, 55th Street, or other locations, I have never heard the imperitive to consolidate three locations for efficiency and dredging. You are probably correct, though. What this project really offers is a long period while river bed dredging spoils are dumped at 55th Street, then a period to build the port on the new land. Sometime long after year 2020, the port can be moved and then the other port locations could be redeveloped. The developer(s) who so covet the site by Cleveland Browns Stadium will probably be retired or expired by then. Public input to this port move has been notably lacking. One super-brain at the Port Authority does not "have all of the answers". I could think of a lot of other things that the city of Cleveland should concentrate on.
August 18, 200816 yr The port authority DID have several public hearings. Did you miss them? And the city of Cleveland is concentrating on lots of other things, as they must always do. The port is concentrating on the port. Pretty remarkable, eh? "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
September 6, 200816 yr Opponents debate Cleveland port's move to E. 55th St. Posted by Tom Breckenridge September 05, 2008 17:55PM Categories: Breaking News, Economic development An update Friday on the Cleveland port's plan to move east boiled into a debate over whether it will be a boon or bane for the city's moribund lakefront. http://blog.cleveland.com/business/2008/09/opponents_debate_cleveland_por.html
September 6, 200816 yr 2020 and 1 billion dollars, Wont happen Another pipe dream! Welcome and thanks for the glowing prediction.
September 6, 200816 yr 2020 and 1 billion dollars, Wont happen Another pipe dream! Welcome and thanks for the glowing prediction. Its not a prediction,its knowledge.
September 6, 200816 yr Would you care to share some details - such as your area of expertise, maybe some insider knowledge of port operations? clevelandskyscrapers.com Cleveland Skyscrapers on Instagram
September 7, 200816 yr You see, MayDay, when someone says it's knowledge, it means he experienced it first-hand. He actually is a 20-year-old student at Cleveland-Case Western State College in 2020 who is aware of the fate of the newly relocated port. So in a lull between studying the 10th year of the Sarah Palin presidency and the secession of Northern Ohio, Michigan, Pennsylvania and New York to become Ontario-South, he read the archived posts at UrbanOhio. He was amazed that we were so optimistic about the future that he posted a message and backdated it for Sept. 6, 2008 to set us foolhardy archaics straight. Thanks, mkrpan. Do you also give horoscopes and tomorrow's lottery numbers, too? Now that would be valuable knowledge..... "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
September 8, 200816 yr 2020 and 1 billion dollars, Wont happen Another pipe dream! Welcome and thanks for the glowing prediction. Its not a prediction,its knowledge. You aren't taken seriously here unless you can back up your rumors. This is not Cleveland.com. If you have something constructive to add to the conversation, we'd love to hear it.
September 8, 200816 yr The port has to go somewhere. The Lakefront Plan that envisioned the new port location build to the west of the river would upset fans of Wendy Park and the marina that's located nearby on THAT side. I don't know what else to say, aside from the fact that the Shoreway should tunnel the 2,000-3,000 feet from just east of MLK to E. 72nd. I don't know if it is geologically possible but that would turn Gordon/Rockefeller parks into a true asset, and provide more than enough land for marinas and park space displaced by a new port.
September 8, 200816 yr ^Stop thinking so freely and intelligently with transportation. That's not welcome here in ohio. :lol:
October 7, 200816 yr Cleveland-Cuyahoga County Port seeks tenants By JAY MILLER 1:05 pm, October 7, 2008 The Cleveland-Cuyahoga County Port Authority is looking to lease some underused warehouse space to one or more manufacturers. ... http://www.crainscleveland.com/article/20081007/FREE/810079966/1004/newsletter01
October 7, 200816 yr Something doesn't sound right here. The Port needs so much more space, allegedly, yet the space it currently does have is underused. Then why the hell can't they sell the property to a developer who can jump start the Lakefront Plan?
October 7, 200816 yr It needs more space for some activities (namely transloading bulk materials), it needs to get out of the way of downtown development and it needs a steady revenue stream from underutilized properties it owns to support existing and future operations and capital investments. You get revenue streams from wherever you can. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
October 7, 200816 yr We discussed the topic of the Port relocation in Krumholz's class last week, and he said that the 88 acre Dike 14 was planned for when he was city planner. That was over THIRTY years ago, and Dike 14 just recently was filled. That puts into context how long 200+ acres for the Port will take to fill. This is an extremely long term plan by the Port, and will be done in phases. I expected for the whole thing to be done in 20 years, but that ain't gonna happen.
October 7, 200816 yr You're assuming the confined disposal facility will be filled exclusively by lake/river dredgings. Port officials have also expressed interest in using a new type of material called Rubber Soil made from recycled concrete and tires. See my article at: http://www.urbanohio.com/forum2/index.php/topic,2591.msg70057.html#msg70057 "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
October 8, 200816 yr Dike 14 was field years ago. Because the area at Hopkins (Dike # ?) was not ready, the Corp made adjustments to place more fill on 14.
November 13, 200816 yr I have a point for discussion/question. Hasn't the port authority been touting themselves as this agent for change by funding/loaning funds for important development projects. With all these projects now being shelved, for the indeterminate future, isn't this their prime opportunity to come in and "save the day". The breuer tower project said they were looking at union backed funding, why can't some fancy funding come from the port authority?
November 26, 200816 yr A citizens committee reported this week that it has collected 500-plus signatures on a petition to preserve the state-run marina and lakefront parkland that would be displaced by the planned 200-acre port at East 55th. There needs to be another petition signed to fast-track the move of the port to the East 55th area. This is not the time for a NIMBY minority to halt progress for a regional majority. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
November 26, 200816 yr A citizens committee reported this week that it has collected 500-plus signatures on a petition to preserve the state-run marina and lakefront parkland that would be displaced by the planned 200-acre port at East 55th. There needs to be another petition signed to fast-track the move of the port to the East 55th area. This is not the time for a NIMBY minority to halt progress for a regional majority. Isn't part of the relocation plan to replace the marina on the lakefront? I mean, if that's the case, I wish these people would stop whining.
November 26, 200816 yr The only people that have any reason to cry foul about the relocation of the port are the occupants at Quay 55.
November 26, 200816 yr The only people that have any reason to cry foul about the relocation of the port are the occupants at Quay 55. Considering that there isn't much public stuff around the current port, I have no idea as to how loud it is. Does it make a lot of noise? If it doesn't, I think it would actually be fun to live next door and watch all the action.
November 26, 200816 yr The Sierra Club and League of Women Voters are also opposing the move of the port to East 55th, even though Dike 14 is a manmade area of land. A more open-minded view is from: http://www.clevelandwaterfrontcoalition.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=56:port-authority-relocation-plans&catid=41:summer-2008 "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
November 26, 200816 yr This seems like a good pick up for Cleveland. No matter your personal opinion of Charlotte, you've gotta respect the magnitude of their growth and it seems that this guy was intimately involved with that. Cleveland port hires former Charlotte real estate manager http://blog.cleveland.com/business/2008/11/cleveland_port_hires_former_ch.html Posted by Teresa Dixon Murray/Plain Dealer Reporter November 26, 2008 09:48AM Categories: Breaking News, Economic development A top real estate manager for the city of Charlotte, N.C., will lead the Cleveland port's efforts to assemble land for job-creating projects. ...
November 26, 200816 yr The only people that have any reason to cry foul about the relocation of the port are the occupants at Quay 55. Considering that there isn't much public stuff around the current port, I have no idea as to how loud it is. Does it make a lot of noise? If it doesn't, I think it would actually be fun to live next door and watch all the action. Me too. I hope that after the port moves, there will still be boats navigating up the Cuyahoga. That is really fun to watch.
November 26, 200816 yr The Sierra Club and League of Women Voters are also opposing the move of the port to East 55th, even though Dike 14 is a manmade area of land. ...What does Dike 14 have to do with it? The port is not planning to move to Dike 14: Dike 14 is east of the breakwall and adjoins the ODNR property at the old "Nike missile site". The LWV objected to this port relocation because the Port Authority is trying to circumvent Ohio laws about processes and public input. ___\|/___\|/___\|/___\|/___ Sailors will no longer be able to sail east to west behind the breakwall. The prevailing winds here are from the west. It will take a ridiculous number of tacks to to sail up that narrow passage into a headwind. Sailboats will have to cross in front of power boats and commercial vessels. Power boaters can be less knowledgeable about rules and seamanship than sailors and have no appreciation for what a sailboat skipper has to do to maneuver. I see trouble on the way.
November 26, 200816 yr What does Dike 14 have to do with it? The port is not planning to move to Dike 14: Dike 14 is east of the breakwall and adjoins the ODNR property at the old "Nike missile site". Ask the Sierra Club and the Ohio Environmental Council. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
December 8, 200816 yr From Crain's... http://www.crainscleveland.com/article/20081208/FREE/812089967/1022 Jackson makes waves at Cleveland-Cuyahoga County Port Authority By JAY MILLER 10:19 am, December 8, 2008 Cleveland Mayor Frank Jackson has decided to change the complexion of the Cleveland-Cuyahoga County Port Authority with a decision not to reappoint attorney Michael Wager to the agency’s board of directors. Mr. Wager is currently serving as the board’s chairman.
December 21, 200816 yr http://blog.cleveland.com/business/2008/12/cleveland_port_president_ready.html Cleveland port President Adam Wasserman ready to beef up cargo lines, start projects Posted by Tom Breckenridge/Plain Dealer Reporter December 21, 2008 08:04AM After two years on the job and a flurry of hires, Cleveland port President Adam Wasserman says he's ready to make the port a more powerful economic engine. Wasserman wants to beef up cargo lines at an underused port, prepare for a daunting relocation and foster multimillion-dollar projects in growth industries. ...
January 2, 200916 yr Preservation group hopes to thwart port move Posted by Tom Breckenridge/Plain Dealer Reporter January 02, 2009 09:25AM Categories: Economic development, Real Time News http://blog.cleveland.com/business/2009/01/preservation_group_hopes_to_th.html Opponents of a new site for the Cleveland port say it could hurt this park and state-run [br]marina at East 55th Street.[/size] A small but persistent band of lakefront activists is trying to build a case against the port's long-range move to East 55th Street. So far, city, county and business leaders support a proposal to move the port docks and warehouses from west of Cleveland Browns Stadium to a 200-acre peninsula, which would be built north of East 55th Street. ...
January 5, 200916 yr Why cannot they just pump the Cuyahoga River dredgings away with a slurry-transport system? In this article, they move slurry by 104,000 feet with a total dynamic head of 750 ft. http://rockproducts.com/mag/rock_slurrytransport_system_demonstrates/
January 7, 200916 yr Good question!! "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
January 9, 200916 yr Note the funding request for the port relocation below..... http://www.cleveland.com/westsidesun/news/index.ssf?/base/news-0/1231445328181590.xml&coll=4 Cleveland submits wish list of projects for federal funds Thursday, January 08, 2009 By Ken Prendergast [email protected] West Side Sun News Among $1.56 billion worth of infrastructure projects submitted by the city for federal economic stimulus funds, Mayor Frank Jackson singled out four projects as his highest priorities. ...... Jackson submitted his 66-project list Dec. 22 to President-elect Barack Obama, Gov. Ted Strickland and Ohio's Congressional Delegation. In it, he highlighted these four projects: + $350 million for construction of a new westbound Innerbelt-Central Viaduct (Interstate 90) bridge over the Cuyahoga River valley. + $50 million for repair of the slumping Riverbed Road hillside in Ohio City which threatens to close the Cuyahoga River to shipping traffic. + $300 million for the Opportunity Corridor boulevard from Interstate 490 to University Circle. + $30 million for rebuilding the West Shoreway (state Route 2) between West 25th Street and Clifton Boulevard. ......... The 10 biggest remaining infrastructure projects, in dollar terms, in the mayor's request are: + $100 million for starting passenger rail service between downtown Cleveland, Hopkins Airport, Columbus and Cincinnati. + $100 million to conduct design and engineering to complete environmental work for a statewide high-speed rail system. + $60 million for phase one of relocating the Port of Cleveland away from downtown. + $55 million divided among two requests to complete infrastructure, plazas and structured parking to restart the $500 million Flats East Bank development. + $50 million for extending Euclid Corridor-type bus rapid transit service along Buckeye Road, East 55th Street and Clifton Boulevard. + $40 million for two phases of storm sewer meter automation and upgrades citywide. + $40 million to extend the Towpath Trail from Harvard Road to Canal Basin Park downtown. + $40 million for construction of a new air traffic control tower at Hopkins International Airport. + $33 million to rehabilitate sewer lines downtown. + $30 million to upgrade several rail rapid transit stations. ........... "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
January 9, 200916 yr Port readies plan for industrial parks, transportation hub Posted by Tom Breckenridge/Plain Dealer Reporter January 09, 2009 17:13PM Categories: Economic development, Real Time News http://blog.cleveland.com/business/2009/01/port_readies_plan_for_industri.html By year's end, port leaders say they will have a plan for industrial parks and a major transportation hub on Cleveland's East side. At a Friday meeting, the Cleveland-Cuyahoga County Port Authority began to flesh out plans for the 1,000-acre international trade district it envisions along the corridor served by St. Clair and Superior avenues. The district stretches from East 18th Street to Martin Luther King Jr. Drive. Port President Adam Wasserman proposed the district as a potential warehousing and distribution hotspot because of proximity to the port's planned new home at East 55th Street. .........
January 10, 200916 yr Yup, this is going to be an industrial park, suburban style. Large lots, wide streets, one story warehouses. Say goodbye to one of Cleveland's most unique and intriguing urban environments. Say hello to $7/hour warehouse jobs.
January 13, 200916 yr I do have one question. With all the industrial land in the flats,why move the port to an area wear there is actually housing. They want to take a whole residential neighborhood and turn it into a industrial zone. Do tell me how much industry is between east 18th and liberty blvd.plus compare it to the flats. Kinda sad that we waste all this money moving a port
January 13, 200916 yr The area north of St. Clair, especially west of East 55th, is actually zoned industrial. And the lake only has to be filled in to create the port at East 55th. In the Flats, some 200 acres of land would have to be purchased and docks dug out. Furthermore, the river channel doesn't offer much room for ships to maneuver unless tugboats are used heavily. That increases shipping costs and puts Cleveland at a disadvantage over other ports. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
January 13, 200916 yr Furthermore, the river channel doesn't offer much room for ships to maneuver unless tugboats are used heavily. That increases shipping costs and puts Cleveland at a disadvantage over other ports. So does this mean the river won't be used for shipping purposes anymore? I find that hard to believe, no?
January 13, 200916 yr Furthermore, the river channel doesn't offer much room for ships to maneuver unless tugboats are used heavily. That increases shipping costs and puts Cleveland at a disadvantage over other ports. So does this mean the river won't be used for shipping purposes anymore? I find that hard to believe, no? ^The steel mill would still need ore delivered to it; there are several other private bulk-handlers that would require ship access as well.
January 14, 200916 yr Correct. I'm simply pointing out why a port facility on the river doesn't make sense. And unless the slumping hillside above Riverbed Road and the Cuyahoga River isn't addressed, the river won't be usable for any river traffic upstream of Columbus Road. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
February 12, 200916 yr I've been following it for a little while as one of my best friends is vying for an important job at the port and is anxious to hear what decisions are being made on a day to day basis so I got interested in it. He is in VA at the moment but really wants to return to Cleve with his family and so I've been watching the news about the port with some interest. Whether or not (or when) the port moves isn't really the issue so much as possibly the infrastructure package and if the port gets any money, my guess is that is why they are waiting on making a hiring decision.
February 21, 200916 yr Um, why put it there if the port is moving eastward? I thought we were going to extend downtown north through this area? Or are going to abandon the concept of urban planning and instead just grab anything that comes along for that area? And great comment Tim. Way to be a greater ambassador for Greater Cleveland.... ______________ http://blog.cleveland.com/business/2009/02/port_seeks_265_million_for_mak.html Port seeks $26.5 million for makeover of docks, warehouses Posted by Tom Breckenridge/Plain Dealer Reporter February 20, 2009 17:28PM Cleveland's port seeks a $26.5 million makeover of its docks and warehouses, driven by the prospect of a wind turbine manufacturing plant opening on port land. M. Torres Group, based in Pamplona, Spain, could generate up to 200 jobs over three years, partly to crank out wind turbines for the county's proposed pilot project on Lake Erie, the port's application for state money shows. Over 10 years, the company could employ up to 3,000 if it successfully taps the nation's growing market for wind turbines, the application shows. .... "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
February 21, 200916 yr I question this investment as well. But would there be land near E 55th street for them to do a similar project there and just locate this warehouse there permanently? I guess that's not something the port has rights to, but I'm wondering how much that would cost as opposed to something like this, then moving it should the port finalize its move. I also hated Hagan's comment. It's great that he's a public official.
February 21, 200916 yr Why does this even have to be on the lake? Its seems there would be hundreds of location you could put it.
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