Gotta love Wolstein's response to the defense lawyer's questioning.

During my visit to Las Vegas, I was able to drop in at the ICSC (shopping center convention) and lo and behold, I found an updated rendering for the Flats East Bank project. Of course, I had my camera with me ;-)

 

Latest and greatest:

 

Original rendering:

i like how everything else (from the original rendering) looks like a prairie.

The only change that I can see is that Shaia's property is incorporated into the design and that the building to the north of the cinema has a few more stories added to it.

The footprint of the office building within the Waterfront Line loop appears to have changed as well.  The Cinema, the attached building to its north, and the Shaia propery buildings appear to be a little further along in the design process, they seem less like generic massings than the buildings closer to the river.  Nothing in the set Mayday showed is truly consistent from one rendering to another though, so I am guessing that these are all still very loose concepts.

 

BTW, nice spy work, Mayday!

What happens in Vegas... goes on UO.

Oh and before you ask, I wasn't able to make it to Stark's booth. :-(

Wolstein still hasn't hired an architect for the project. He may go with more than one.

Avenue District West...I mean Flats East Bank looks like quite the happening place :wink:

MayDay, you didn't miss much.  Stark didn't have anything about the Warehouse District Plan at his booth.

cool rendering photo coup by mayday. not too cool that it still looks like a generic off the shelf lifestyle mall. so far. wolstein please bring the dutch back for architectural consultation.

cool rendering photo coup by mayday. not too cool that it still looks like a generic off the shelf lifestyle mall. so far. wolstein please bring the dutch back for architectural consultation.

 

most definitely. I am a little worried.

As implied in a couple of posts, this has to be basically conceptual at this point.  Wolstein mentioned in his PD article that he will be hiring a number of architects and that this has not even occurred yet.  There is still a year and half of planning before any ground breaking for actual buildings takes place (the hope is that utility work can begin this fall).

^True, but does anyone think that it will be something drastically different than what has been shown thus far?  What has been produced to this point is the will of Wolstein, and having worked with them in the past, they usually aren't willing to reinvent the wheel if they've already paid to have it produced.

 

Yes please god, bring back the Dutch, or at least a compitent architect how won't let these renderings effect what will be produced.

Well I'm sure the layout/placement of different buildings will stay the same, but the architecture can change quite easily.

Interesting comments by the judge.  If nothing else, the posturing may get both sides to agree to something more rapidly so that the project can move forward.

 

 

Judge tells Wolstein: 'Settle this case'

Posted by kturner June 07, 2007 20:27PM

 

A probate judge declared that developer Scott Wolstein "made a lot of mistakes" in trying to acquire land on the Flats' east bank and urged Wolstein and the Port Authority to settle quickly with landowners.

 

Cuyahoga County Probate Judge John Corrigan recessed an eminent-domain trial Monday after hearing testimony that at least one Flats property owner was close to an agreement to sell to the Cleveland-Cuyahoga County Port Authority before the trial began, a draft transcript shows.

 

More at

http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2007/06/judge_tells_wolstein_settle_th.html

^well, Wolstein knows now what he has to do.  He said he's willing to move forward regardless the outcome.  Now he has a blueprint from the judge... Corrigan has tipped his hand and, frankly, I think his approach is the right one in getting the settlement completed and the project moving forward with all deliberate speed.  I think Wolstein should take heed of Corrigan's sage advice.

From Crain's:

 

Settlement talks under way in Flats eminent domain trial

 

By JAY MILLER

 

2:58 pm, June 7, 2007

 

The Flats East Bank eminent domain trial recessed today as the parties negotiate a settlement.

 

Robert Stefanik, bailiff to Probate Division Judge John E. Corrigan, said this afternoon that the Wolstein Group and the Cleveland-Cuyahoga County Port Authority were negotiating a settlement with a group of hold-out property owners over land the Wolstein Group hopes to acquire to build a $230 million, mixed-use development on the east bank of the Flats.

 

  More at crainscleveland.com http://www.crainscleveland.com

 

********

 

Now I'm hearing that they've settled with all but one property owner.  Anyone else?

^No information in that regard.  The above PD article does seem to imply that George and Droe were the closest to settlement  (or at least were willing to continue to talk) and that Kassouf was still being his irrational self (you would think after 30 years he would get a clue).  So maybe those two have settled and the idiot continues to hold out.  Again, no firm information.

Don't know if this belongs in this thread, but it has to do with the Flats East Bank...

 

A 'blue' Flats: Jackson proposes a strip club district

Tuesday, June 12, 2007Susan Vinella and Tom BreckenridgePlain Dealer Reporters

Cleveland Mayor Frank Jackson on Monday proposed the creation of an adult-entertainment district in the Flats to house up to three strip clubs, possibly including Larry Flynt's Hustler Club.

 

The district, a two-block area east of the Cuyahoga River and within a block of the proposed Canal Basin Park, would allow a move by the Hustler Club as part of a settlement with developer Scott Wolstein.

 

More at cleveland.com http://www.cleveland.com

 

Love it....and good for the Mayor for addressing the issue frankly and with a creative solution.

 

Fran Geising, the general manager of the Inman mortuary and crematory across the street, said she's also worried that a strip club district would taint the image of nearby businesses.

 

"What will people say: 'Where are you taking grandma?' 'Oh, we're taking her to the adult entertainment district for cremation,' " Geising said.

 

A crematory is the only dissenting opinion the PD could find.  Little bit of a stretch.

 

 

 

Well, a certain poster by the name of Peabody seemed a bit peeved!

 

Why do you they have to call it a "strip club district?" That's not classy!

Very good news.  As I figured, Kassouff continues to hold out. 

The vigor with which Mayor Jackson has been handling the various strip club issues is a little surprising. Not necessarily in a bad way, it's just interesting he's apparently not squeamish about the topic. That said, I think creating a "district" is pretty skeezy.

oh no, not a concentration of 'evils', what about the children!

oh no, not a concentration of 'evils', what about the children!

 

Truse "the children" can handle a strip club or two!   :wink:

 

Oh wait, you mean little kids- children as in "minors".

 

Personally, who cares what those non revenue generating, tax deductions think?!

My mama always said, ain't nothin' good happens at the strip club!!!

"We have one major concern, and that's parking," said Joseph Buscemi, owner of State Fish, a wholesale seafood company on the corner of Merwin and Center streets.

 

how is it the property owners would be concerned about parking.  there are huge swaths of parking less than two blocks away.  brand new surface level parking with a view of the river.  just the thing for strolling after a trip to the strip club and the fish distributor.

yeah, I think that the fish distributor's worries are a bit unfounded. I would venture a guess that the two establishments keep somewhat different hours.

Getting away from the strip-club discussion for a moment, has there been any renditions of the proposed pedestrian bridge(s) between the east and west banks? Where would it be located? I would think it would have to be a lift-bridge, no?

This was thrown around on the Avenue thread, but it was mentioned that large-scale retail probably isn't the best idea for the FEB and that a better connection between the east and west banks would definitely help any retail that does locate there. I agree with this. My thought is, if I recall correctly, there used to be a swing bridge that connected both sides of the flats at main ave. Could this be done in the future? Has this been discussed? It would certainly help alleviate all the traffic having to meander through the flats and cross at center st. Why not make this proposed pedestrian bridge a "full-service" vehicular/pedestrian bridge. Seems to me you could solve a number of problems doing this. Of course it would cost millions, but why not think ahead and do it right? :clap:

I seem to recall Corna saying he wanted the pedestrian bridge to be built where the old Main Avenue movable bridge was located.

I have a question which I am not sure anyone can answer for sure but here goes.  From what I can tell the trial has been put on hold after more than 3 weeks as the judge wants the parties to make another attempt at settlement.  The word on the street is that 3 of the 4 remaining property owners are close to a deal with Wolstein including the owner of the Hustler club.  But as part of the settlement with Hustler it appears that the owner wants to be able to move to this new "strip club zone" down the river.  As such the city, including the mayor and Cipermann have become involved.  However, legislation must be approved to go forward and this could take a couple of months given the committee hearings which must first take place and the slower past of things with City Council during the summer.

 

So my question is, since it appears that settlement with at least the Hustler property owner is contingent on the City approving the zoning change, which could take a while, is the Probabe Court willing to hold off on the trial mid stream for a couple of months while the parties see if this settlement contingency is realized?  Most judges I know would not mess up their docket like this.  Complicating things is that Kassouff apparently is not interested in settling so the trial has to go forward in any event even if the other 3 settle.  Just curious.

And then there was one:

 

All but one Flats owner settle in domain case

Friday, June 15, 2007

Tom Breckenridge

Plain Dealer Reporter

 

Developer Scott Wolstein is one property away from trying to turn a tired enclave of bars and clubs into a $230 million riverfront neighborhood on the Flats' east bank.

 

Late Thursday afternoon, a bitter eminent domain trial and months of hard-hitting negotiations bore fruit - a multimillion-dollar settlement among Wolstein, the Cleveland-Cuyahoga County Port Authority and all but one property owner.

 

More at cleveland.com http://www.cleveland.com

is kassouf ready to pay the subsequent property taxes on a parcel of land valued at 10 million?

 

I don't think so.

^you mean that those parking lots wouldn't make enough to cover the bax bill for a $10 million piece of land? ;) Does Kassouf really want the County Auditor to call his bluff? :)

^I don't think so either.  I am sure the county would love to reappraise the property at that value and keep sending him a nice fat tax bill twice a year.  I bet that Kassouf only settled on the Fagan property because his partner (Khouri) forced him.  As you can tell from this post and others I am not a big fan of the guy.

 

Thanks Musky for the post.  It answers my question.

 

Now lets start doing the site prep. and see some real designs.

Kassouf has asked $3.55 million for the land, said Steve Strnisha, a real estate development consultant to Wolstein.

 

The port appraised the site at $640,000. Kassouf lawyer Stephen O'Bryan said $3.55 million is what the port offered. Kassouf rejected it because he has an appraisal placing the value at more than $10 million, O'Bryan said.

 

This is very confusing...

 

So, Kassouf asked for $3.55 million, was offered $3.55 million and then decided he wanted more?  Or is this just written poorly?

^ I was thinking the same thing. Anyone care to clarify this please?

A blurb in the PD's restaurant row column stated that BW3 on the East Bank of the Flats closed after 15 years.  Wonder what was behind the closing.  I know the East Bank is dead but the location was a close to many apartments and a short walk from many businesses.

A blurb in the PD's restaurant row column stated that BW3 on the East Bank of the Flats closed after 15 years.  Wonder what was behind the closing.  I know the East Bank is dead but the location was a close to many apartments and a short walk from many businesses.

Here we go again.....

No, it really is - that's not an inaccurate assessment. Now, in a few years, that might not be the case.

I don't think it "dead" its in "transition".

I guess my bigger concern with bw3 closing is its specific location on River Road in as compared to the rest of the east bank.  Where the Wolstein development is going in, it really is dead and with the current demolition very uninviting in its current state.  In contrast, bw3 was a long standing business in a location that is practically minutes, if not seconds from at lease 900 residences (Bridgeview, Crittendon Court and (just had a brain fart...cannot remember the name of the building where Constantinos is located)) and hundreds more just a few minutes away.  Also it is directly down the St. Clair hill from the businesses in the Warehouse District and close to a rapid stop.  There is still lots of activity in the area but recently we have seen the closing of Arhaus, Gilly's and now BW3.  It is has been a couple of years but I use to go there often for lunch and it seemed to have a decent crowd given all the other dining options people had.  That is why I asked if there was something more behind its closing than traffic (maybe a bad lease renewal or ownership issues).  Anyone?

The Flats East Bank is dead. The West Bank's pulse is still very much active.

 

But I don't have an answer as to why the BW3 on Old River Road closed. I recall several years ago that the owner(s) of that BW3 and several other locations got into some legal hot water. I don't remember what the charge was, and then again that was several years ago. So I can't tell you why it closed now unless they had to in order to pay legal bills, settlement, etc.

Fine the east bank of the flats is dead!  :x

I bet there is going to be a full redevelopment of the east bank. Not only wolstein development. YOur looking within five years 75 percent of the buidlings will be new.

Das ist kaput (see I learned something while in Deuschtland!)

Das ist kaput (see I learned something while in Deuschtland!)

sehr gut!

My guess would be that the retail gravity of the flats is declining with the demise of the upper portion of Old River Rd.  That lack of draw is sucking down the businesses to the south of Wolstein's project.  900 residences aren't enough of a market to make up for the fact that suburbanites aren't spending their money on the East Bank anymore, and there are more convenient options for the people working up the hill, too.

Das ist kaput (see I learned something while in Deuschtland!)

 

Stari!!!