I can't understand why there hasn't been any news about these buildings, either, esp. since FEB Phase II is moving forward...

My concern is that the owners of these buildings/lots see the development happening around them but instead of rehabbing or building themselves, they hold out for a really high price to sell the properties.  No one wants them at that price, so the buildings sit there - a dead area in the middle of what could be a much more lively neighborhood.

My concern is that the owners of these buildings/lots see the development happening around them but instead of rehabbing or building themselves, they hold out for a really high price to sell the properties.  No one wants them at that price, so the buildings sit there - a dead area in the middle of what could be a much more lively neighborhood.

 

So typical of many property owners who have as much vision or sense of civic responsibility as a mobster. In fact, I've come across many who have criminal records. They couldn't give a sh*t about anything but themselves.

My concern is that the owners of these buildings/lots see the development happening around them but instead of rehabbing or building themselves, they hold out for a really high price to sell the properties.  No one wants them at that price, so the buildings sit there - a dead area in the middle of what could be a much more lively neighborhood.

 

So typical of many property owners who have as much vision or sense of civic responsibility as a mobster. In fact, I've come across many who have criminal records. They couldn't give a sh*t about anything but themselves.

 

If the city would be more pro-active and threaten to Take these properties from these people they will let the free market continue to work against Downtown. eminent Domain is a Legal method for seizing land for the greater good, why aren't we doing it for these property that owner are negligent in their responsibilities?

It doesn't have to be eminent domain, it could be as simple as taxing at much higher assessed value

It doesn't have to be eminent domain, it could be as simple as taxing at much higher assessed value

 

And that would be up to the county, not the city. But is heightening the assessed value a political tool that the county department would ever entertain? I doubt it.

My concern is that the owners of these buildings/lots see the development happening around them but instead of rehabbing or building themselves, they hold out for a really high price to sell the properties.  No one wants them at that price, so the buildings sit there - a dead area in the middle of what could be a much more lively neighborhood.

 

So typical of many property owners who have as much vision or sense of civic responsibility as a mobster. In fact, I've come across many who have criminal records. They couldn't give a sh*t about anything but themselves.

 

If the city would be more pro-active and threaten to Take these properties from these people they will let the free market continue to work against Downtown. eminent Domain is a Legal method for seizing land for the greater good, why aren't we doing it for these property that owner are negligent in their responsibilities?

 

You've got to be kidding me. 

 

If someone is meeting all the requirements of the building codes, but is otherwise holding on to properties for investment purposes, you're advocating seizing them for what the City believes them to be worth?

 

That's not asking for blight and associated problems, that's planning on them.

It doesn't have to be eminent domain, it could be as simple as taxing at much higher assessed value

 

I'm not sure that's legal.  It's certainly something that would be open to all sorts of abuse.

Won't the assessment go up just because of the near by development?

Off of this sounds like what Mike White pulled off to bring down the main stretch of Old River Rd.... 

 

Clubs and restaurants that had been operating for years were suddenly raided by electrical and building inspectors and shut down--with no chance to remedy the code violations.

Off of this sounds like what Mike White pulled off to bring down the main stretch of Old River Rd.... 

 

Clubs and restaurants that had been operating for years were suddenly raided by electrical and building inspectors and shut down--with no chance to remedy the code violations.

 

Yeah, there was that.  It sure helped maintain the boom down there, didn't it?  I very much doubt that the consequences were intended, but they were what they were.

It doesn't have to be eminent domain, it could be as simple as taxing at much higher assessed value

 

I'm not sure that's legal.  It's certainly something that would be open to all sorts of abuse.

 

It's not legal. Taxes cannot be selectively punitive.

 

And eminent domain can only be used if its to achieve a public purpose. A property experiencing worsening blight without imminent resolution can be a justification for eminent domain, but it also carries significant legal and demolition expenses for the city (ie: hundreds of thousands of dollars per property) and thus is only pursued as an option of last resort.

More, more columns...  Start of a parking ramp.

 

 

"This image is currently unavailable"  How do I see the image?

"This image is currently unavailable"  How do I see the image?

 

You're not allowed to see it. Only the cool kids can see it.

"This image is currently unavailable"  How do I see the image?

 

You're not allowed to see it. Only the cool kids can see it.

 

I had a feeling... :oops:

 

"This image is currently unavailable"  How do I see the image?

 

That's weird.  I can't find the picture on flickr anymore, but I still see it here.  I'm trying it again here: 

 

Developer breaks ground on second phase of flats east, adding office building to mix

 

Flats East Development LLC, the partners behind the multi-phase Flats East development, have broken ground on Phase II. The project is expected to be complete in time for residents, visitors and office workers to enjoy the 1,200-foot riverfront boardwalk by summer of 2015. The ambitious project contains a few surprises, including a new office building that's been added to the mix.

 

http://www.freshwatercleveland.com/devnews/flatseastphasetwo031814.aspx

It doesn't have to be eminent domain, it could be as simple as taxing at much higher assessed value

 

I'm not sure that's legal.  It's certainly something that would be open to all sorts of abuse.

 

It's not legal. Taxes cannot be selectively punitive.

 

And eminent domain can only be used if its to achieve a public purpose. A property experiencing worsening blight without imminent resolution can be a justification for eminent domain, but it also carries significant legal and demolition expenses for the city (ie: hundreds of thousands of dollars per property) and thus is only pursued as an option of last resort.

 

All very much true.

 

I interpreted the original comment as implying that if a owner keeps their property empty while holding out for the price they desire, it should be seized, regardless of condition and/or tax status, because it is holding back the overall "plan".

 

It's difficult to overemphasize what a poor idea that would be, both ethically and in the ways it could backfire.

 

 

^But you do know, E Rocc, that the Supreme Court held a few years ago (in Kelo vs. New London, CT) that private property may be seized through ED for another private owner, so long as the second owner's use is deemed more favorable for the public good in terms of local economic development.  However, I hate this decision because it opens up a Pandora's Box even though it is a tool.  I would NOT want to use this for the East Bank buildings.  I would prefer Samsel be turned into mixed use apartments-over-retail/restaurants and would hope they could be convinced to sell, but there's actually nothing wrong with Samsel's use as it is.  It's a responsible business and, as far as I know, Samsel's an honorable public citizen.  Their building isn't blighted.  So the City has no biz EDing it away from them... The parking lot at Public Square, however is an entirely different animal all together in which case, I think ED is a viable and should be strongly considered.

^Though to fully flesh this out, several states subsequently passed "anti-Kelo" laws effectively prohibiting those types of takings, regardless of their permissibility under the US Constitution.  I know Ohio enacted a temporary moratorium, but not sure if it followed it up with an indefinite curtailment.

Let's get back to the East Bank development discussion.

My concern is that the owners of these buildings/lots see the development happening around them but instead of rehabbing or building themselves, they hold out for a really high price to sell the properties.  No one wants them at that price, so the buildings sit there - a dead area in the middle of what could be a much more lively neighborhood.

 

So typical of many property owners who have as much vision or sense of civic responsibility as a mobster. In fact, I've come across many who have criminal records. They couldn't give a sh*t about anything but themselves.

 

If the city would be more pro-active and threaten to Take these properties from these people they will let the free market continue to work against Downtown. eminent Domain is a Legal method for seizing land for the greater good, why aren't we doing it for these property that owner are negligent in their responsibilities?

 

You've got to be kidding me. 

 

If someone is meeting all the requirements of the building codes, but is otherwise holding on to properties for investment purposes, you're advocating seizing them for what the City believes them to be worth?

 

That's not asking for blight and associated problems, that's planning on them.

 

If the property are clearly being neglected like numerous other properties in downtown Cleveland, they owner should be persuaded to sell that property to someone who can take care of it and not be allowed to wait until the building is too far gone to petition the city to allow it demolition.

 

the building code is a good way to assess the condition of the property, the missing link is to find a legal way  make the property owner bring it up to code or sell it.  right now the only counter to the it's too far gone argument is to demolish the building.

Here's another recent article I discovered about what's currently happening in Phase II. A pretty good update of progress and a few tidbits of what has yet to be announced.

 

http://www.eventsincle.com/cle-1200-foot-riverfront-boardwalk-by-summer-of-2015/

Residential building now has a 2nd floor deck partially in place, this project is moving very fast

Residential building now has a 2nd floor deck partially in place, this project is moving very fast

 

Nice!  More pictures the better!!

 

I asked on FB about the construction camera and this was the response:

 

"Thanks for checking in. The construction cam will be released at the completion of Phase II. If any footage becomes available any earlier, we'll be sure to post it."

 

So it doesn't sound like they will have a live camera like they did for phase one  :-(

Wellll, I might know someone who will try to make some semi-regular photo updates once the weather improves :-)

Wellll, I might know someone who will try to make some semi-regular photo updates once the weather improves :-)

 

'Cuz someone's afraid of his tootsies getting cold...

Another cropped picture from my phone:

 

 

OR

Flickr link to today's photo:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/14014567@N08/13311749403/in/set-72157642487692745

 

OR

Flats East set:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/14014567@N08/13311749403/

Thanks for the pics.

 

As a side note it amazes me how much misinformation is spouted by "people" (the media) who are supposedly in the know about things in this town.  I was getting my weekly headache from the clowns on the Friday news round up on WCPN and they were "gee wiz-ing" about the Flats East Bank.  One of many mindless things stated were that people were complaining that it was all national chains in the Flats and nothing local.  I guess except Ken Stewarts, Lago, Willeyville, Crop and Flip Side (a local chain).

Thanks for the pics.

 

As a side note it amazes me how much misinformation is spouted by "people" (the media) who are supposedly in the know about things in this town.  I was getting my weekly headache from the clowns on the Friday news round up on WCPN and they were "gee wiz-ing" about the Flats East Bank.  One of many mindless things stated were that people were complaining that it was all national chains in the Flats and nothing local.  I guess except Ken Stewarts, Lago, Willeyville, Crop and Flip Side (a local chain).

 

Good point. And there were chains at the heyday as well. WCPN hasn't been the same since Dan Moulthrop left.

from @Steven_litt  (I added the text, I think it's right)

Wow. Going vertical!

That view is going to look fantastic once this project is complete.

 

And even better when that parking lot is built over

from @Steven_litt  (I added the text, I think it's right)

 

Is that Paninis moving from the WHD?

from @Steven_litt  (I added the text, I think it's right)

 

Why is there a square cut out of the surface parking lot?  You can also see it on the design layout from Reply #4972.  Any ideas?

storm water runoff retention.  Gradually flows back into a filter bed.  Same thing with the northern lot

^How certain are we of the office building's location?  ... or are we not certain yet?

^pretty damn sure

from @Steven_litt  (I added the text, I think it's right)

 

this was a great idea thx -

 

i thought where you put nightclub was supposed to be saved for an apt tower for the next phase? no?

 

from @Steven_litt  (I added the text, I think it's right)

 

this was a great idea thx -

 

i thought where you put nightclub was supposed to be saved for an apt tower for the next phase? no?

 

I kind of thought that also.  The earlier renderings did show that.

from @Steven_litt  (I added the text, I think it's right)

 

this was a great idea thx -

 

i thought where you put nightclub was supposed to be saved for an apt tower for the next phase? no?

 

 

Some of the older renders from 4/5 years ago show an apartment bldg there, but I haven't seen anything about it since then. From what I can tell the nightclubs along the river will be seasonal, outdoor bar/dance floor. I am sure if there is demand in the future those could be easily moved.

New photo added to set:  https://www.flickr.com/photos/14014567@N08/sets/72157642487692745/

 

First Floor columns finished.  Parking deck started to pour yesterday.

 

How far do these columns go into the ground?  I know at the CC hotel the caissons go 200ft deep, but this building will obviously not be anywhere near CC hotel height...

 

 

Flickr Photo Set:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/14014567@N08/sets/72157642487692745/

 

Added the picture above to my photo set.  It shows one of the cranes used to drill the columns holes in the ground for cement.  They drilled the full depth of the rig that they used, so however tall that is was the columns into the ground. 

Did a staycation this weekend at the Aloft. Pics from our 6th floor room!  :-D

 

 

How was the Aloft? 

 

Nice pics by the way!

It's crazy that it's still snowing! I can't fathom it and I've only been gone a few months. Nice progress...can't wait til there are buildings there!!

^ It's done snowing. We had a huge storm Saturday night and it's been slowly melting since. And there's no more snow in the forecast for the foreseeable future! Woo!

 

But anyway, back to the Flats East Bank.

How was the Aloft? 

 

Nice pics by the way!

 

Thanks! The Aloft was nice. Very sparse, modern decor. It's actually a lower-mid tier brand, but with a decidedly modern design aesthetic. The room was slightly small, but it worked for our needs. As a guest, you can either use the small hotel gym, or the EB gym downstairs, which is FANTASTIC. We went twice. People complain (online) about the train noise, but it didn't bother me or seem too noticeable. I will say that both nights, right after we'd climbed in bed and turned the lights off, trains went by that made the bed vibrate!! I'm not sure whether that says more about the building or the train!

Good review Paul.  That is a steel frame structure also. Hopefully the post-tension concrete structure for the apartment building reduces the vibrating from the train.  I know, I know urban living.  But still, these are high price point apartments for Cleveland.

I've stayed in NYC hotels and apartments that probably had more subway rumble (a highly frequent , 24/7-hour rumble at that!) than the NS/Aloft trains. 

 

I was over at the Aloft the other day (love their lounge and balcony) and witnessed the new apartment construction.  Even with just the pillars and small section of a 2nd level, you realize what a really small footprint FEB has, and that once (even) Phase II is completed, there will be a rather tight fit with all the clubs, offices, Phase I and the Rapid... which will be a great thing.