I call bullshit.  Bengals fans aren't loyal?  We had to sit through 14 years of bullshit, yet here we are.

 

And Pittsburgh #21?  Their fans travel to away games more than any other franchise.

 

VIEW THE RANKINGS

Methodology

---

From American City Business Journals:

 

Cleveland is No. 1 in rankings of NFL fan loyalty

Bizjournals - September 4, 2006

by G. Scott Thomas

 

The Cleveland Browns stumbled to a 6-10 record last year, their third straight losing season. Browns Stadium was sold out for every game. The Kansas City Chiefs entered the season with high hopes, but missed the playoffs for the second year in a row. Arrowhead Stadium was sold out for every game.

 

http://www.bizjournals.com/edit_special/43.html

 

whatever

I will give Cleveland credit on that one.  The Browns suck yet they think they are going to the playoffs every year (though those saying so are slowly diminishing). 

 

Though I agree the Bengals and Steelers fans should be given much more credit than deserved.  Hell, the 1990's Bengals and yet I'm STILL a fan?  That's dedication.

I thought that the article would focus on the Browns Backers. They are probably the number one reason to support a claim that the Browns have the most loyal fans.

 

The Browns Backers are the largest ex-pat fan group in the NFL. With 252 chapters throughout the world and over 48,000 members. 

The numbers don't lie. 

 

http://www.bizjournals.com/edit_special/43.html#l

 

The Browns fans continue to pack the stadium (99.8% full), while Bengals (89.4%) and Steelers (94.9%) don't show the same level of committment. 

 

Just face it...the old stereotype is bieng born out in the numbers.  Browns fans are hardcore and Bengals fans are fairweather.  Nowhere is it more true than here in the battleground city of C-bus. 

Just face it...the old stereotype is bieng born out in the numbers.  Browns fans are hardcore and Bengals fans are fairweather.  Nowhere is it more true than here in the battleground city of C-bus. 

 

Uh...no.  In Columbus, you have native Columbusites (who yes, are typically more Bengals fans) and Northeast Ohio transplants (or people with NEO family backgrounds) who are the Browns fans.  The media outlets of Columbus are essentially ex-Clevelanders who moved to Columbus via Ohio State only to have Indians/Browns coverage.

 

Thanks God for NBC4 (though the news sucks).

^A bit of topic, but I had heard while I was at UD that the split between Bengals/Browns fans in Dayton (and I always assumed Columbus would be similar) has a lot to do with age.  Older football fans tend to be Browns fans, while younger fans tend to be Bengals fans.  It was explained to me that this has to do with the fact that many older fans were Browns fans before the Bengals were founded and have never switched allegiances.  Newer fans grew up with the Bengals.  Is this true, any thoughts?  Can anyone confirm?

That's a theory, certainly, and in UD's case there are also many NEO transplants (due to GM/Delphi factory jobs, government, etc) to bring their Browns allegiance.  Interestingly, Dayton and Columbus both have a large number of Steelers fans as well.  But the majority of Dayton is still heavily Bengals territory.

When did the Bengals come into existense?

I guess its safe to say that the Texans have higher fan loyalty than the Bengals & Steelers.  I mean they have been around for a while to actually see how their fans react to prolonged losing stints, bad weather, etc.

 

I also call Bullshit.

When did the Bengals come into existense?

 

The present-day Bengals were established in 1968.  Though there was a previous Cincinnati Bengals team from 1937 to 1942.

I will give Cleveland credit on that one.  The Browns suck yet they think they are going to the playoffs every year (though those saying so are slowly diminishing). 

 

Though I agree the Bengals and Steelers fans should be given much more credit than deserved.  Hell, the 1990's Bengals and yet I'm STILL a fan?  That's dedication.

 

Sure you were.  Only thing Bengal fans were rooting for in the 1990s was for Paul Brown to rise from his grave and take the Bengals from his family and put in the care of someone who would make them a winner.

 

They're still the cheepest franchise in the AFC, if not all the NFL.  Mike Brown didn't discovered some long lost book from his dad to turn this team into winners overnight.

Well, really, we were all rooting for a winning season.

 

You know, like present day Browns fans.

Did the Bengals sell out during the 90s?

Clearly, no.

Just face it...the old stereotype is bieng born out in the numbers.  Browns fans are hardcore and Bengals fans are fairweather.  Nowhere is it more true than here in the battleground city of C-bus. 

 

Uh...no.  In Columbus, you have native Columbusites (who yes, are typically more Bengals fans) and Northeast Ohio transplants (or people with NEO family backgrounds) who are the Browns fans.  The media outlets of Columbus are essentially ex-Clevelanders who moved to Columbus via Ohio State only to have Indians/Browns coverage.

 

Thanks God for NBC4 (though the news sucks).

 

How soon we forget.

Columbus was always a Reds/Browns town.  Only one season did anyone pick up Indians TV coverage (while WCMH, which was originally own by the Crowsley Family and then WWTE always had the Reds broadcast).  And even when both teams were good, in the 80s, when polled, Browns fans always outnumbered Bengals fans.

It was only in the mid 90s, when the Browns went on sabatical, that the loyalties towards the other Cs teams went topsy turvy. 

That's when Mike Brown, instead of trying to make the whole state Bengals Nation with a good team, tried to move the Bengals to Cleveland.  (Of course the current crop of Cincy posters here weren't old enough (or lived elsewhere in the nation) to think to follow such city events)

 

So no, I don't believe that there are more "die-hard" Bengal fans than Browns fans in Columbus.

Just more "fair-weather" fans who used to follow the Browns before Modell committed financial suicide.

^A bit of topic, but I had heard while I was at UD that the split between Bengals/Browns fans in Dayton (and I always assumed Columbus would be similar) has a lot to do with age.  Older football fans tend to be Browns fans, while younger fans tend to be Bengals fans.  It was explained to me that this has to do with the fact that many older fans were Browns fans before the Bengals were founded and have never switched allegiances.  Newer fans grew up with the Bengals.  Is this true, any thoughts?  Can anyone confirm?

 

Also the fact there was no Browns football for half a decade also threw state loyalties for a loop. (see my post above)

Did the Bengals sell out during the 90s?

 

No, but for being as damn bad as we were getting 45-50,000 out to a game should count as getting a 100,000 in the stadium!  WE SUCKED!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Did the Bengals sell out during the 90s?

 

No, but for being as damn bad as we were getting 45-50,000 out to a game should count as getting a 100,000 in the stadium!  WE SUCKED!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

I think he was just trying to contrast that with the Browns experience.  Cleveland sells out every game no matter if they are good, bad or ugly.  And we've been ugly alot lately.

The Old Browns weren't selling out every game every season:

http://www.kenn.com/sports/football/nfl/nfl_cle_attendance.html

 

...unless seating capacity changed in the 1994 or 1995 season - which is certainly possible...

Just face it...the old stereotype is bieng born out in the numbers.  Browns fans are hardcore and Bengals fans are fairweather.  Nowhere is it more true than here in the battleground city of C-bus. 

 

Uh...no.  In Columbus, you have native Columbusites (who yes, are typically more Bengals fans) and Northeast Ohio transplants (or people with NEO family backgrounds) who are the Browns fans.  The media outlets of Columbus are essentially ex-Clevelanders who moved to Columbus via Ohio State only to have Indians/Browns coverage.

 

Thanks God for NBC4 (though the news sucks).

 

I moved to Columbus a few years ago and would've ranked the Columbus fan base like this: 1) Browns, 2) Steelers, and 3) Bengals.  Now I would rank it like this: 1) Bengals, 2) Browns, and 3) Steelers (even though there were tons of closet steeler fans to come out last year).  Just seeing this demonstrated to me how fairweather the Bengals fanbase in Columbus is (or maybe, just how fairweather Columbus NFL fans are).

The Old Browns weren't selling out every game every season:

http://www.kenn.com/sports/football/nfl/nfl_cle_attendance.html

 

...unless seating capacity changed in the 1994 or 1995 season - which is certainly possible...

 

The '95 season was probably a bad indicator.  The fans found out that Modell was moving the team.  I've got memories of fans ripping out seats from the old stadium after the final game.  They were pretty disgusted and many boycotted that season.

The Old Browns weren't selling out every game every season:

http://www.kenn.com/sports/football/nfl/nfl_cle_attendance.html

 

...unless seating capacity changed in the 1994 or 1995 season - which is certainly possible...

 

1994--no explanation

1995--they announced that they were moving to Baltimore halfway thru the season. That definitely had an effect on the attendance figures.

 

The new stadium opened in 1999. Capacity is listed at 73,000.

From April, 1998 in the Dispatch...

 

George: While visiting the Columbus area during Easter weekend, I read pen pal Brent Bair's slam on the Cleveland Browns and their extensive fan base.

As one who grew up in north-central Ohio and has lived in the Cincinnati area for the last 14 yeas, I've experienced Ohio football from several angles.

Let me assure Mr. Bair that the Browns do have the No. 1 fan base in Ohio - if not the country. Northern Ohio and central Ohio is football country, pure and simple. The Browns and the Buckeyes are legendary teams deserving of their fans' support.

Cincinnati is a nice enough city, but it is most definitely not football country. Heck, the fair-weather fans there have enough trouble supporting the Reds, let alone the Bengals.

As for the Steelers having a significant fan base in Ohio, gimme a break.

 

Pete Kurtz

Maineville, Ohio

Pete: You second what our annual readership surveys show.

 

George: Will transplanted Steelers fans ever realize they are living in Columbus and not in Pittsburgh?

It is beyond comprehension that this small contingent of Steelers fans continues to expect local television coverage of the Steelers over what the majority of central Ohioans prefer to watch on Sundays, the immensely popular Browns in 1999 or the perpetually dormant Bengals.

Besides, and unfortunately, recent Steelers games themselves have become secondary to the television overexposure of coach Bill Cowher's childlike sideline behavior. Remember Bubby Brister's mom?

So, Steelers fans, stop crying. If you're that unhappy, be reminded that I-70 east to Pittsburgh is still open.

 

Lon R. Patton, Grove City

Lon: You speak for thousands.

 

The Old Browns weren't selling out every game every season:

http://www.kenn.com/sports/football/nfl/nfl_cle_attendance.html

 

...unless seating capacity changed in the 1994 or 1995 season - which is certainly possible...

 

It's interesting that 1994 didn't have higher attendance figures.  The Browns were 11-5 that year, I believe and made it to the second round of the playoffs.  It wasn't a very flashy team however, as the defense carried the team.  Belichick couldn't have been happier in his previous incarnation with 14-10 games.  Cleveland fans generally hated Belichick.  All reasons that attendance could have been a touch lower that year.

I remember some reorganization of seating at different points, so it may well be that the 1994 season was actually at capacity, it's just that capacity was a little lower...I do remember some games being blacked out when I was a kid because they didn't sell out - that must have been some of those mid-80's seasons.  And 1994, wasn't that the year they dumped Kosar due to declining skills or some such shyte?  Or was that 1993?

I remember some reorganization of seating at different points, so it may well be that the 1994 season was actually at capacity, it's just that capacity was a little lower...I do remember some games being blacked out when I was a kid because they didn't sell out - that must have been some of those mid-80's seasons. And 1994, wasn't that the year they dumped Kosar due to declining skills or some such shyte? Or was that 1993?

 

It was one of the two. I think it was 93. Besides Model moving the team, nothing has ever riled up the browns fans like when they released Kosar.

 

what do you call bullshit on? that the browns fans are not number one? no question they are. hell, for one big thing waaay more people have bailed out of ne ohio and moved to other parts of the country than from greater cinci. so its no surprise they have the most fans ie the browns backers groups all over the place.

 

as for travel, that is cyclical. it is directly related to the team's recent fortunes. in that light, that any browns fans at all drive, get in busses or fly to see away games these days is a minor miracle of sorts in the world of fandom. hell fox has'm at 6-10 for season. sounds right to me - ugh!

 

Kosar was cut in 1993

what do you call bullshit on? that the browns fans are not number one?

 

Ya' gotta start at the top of the thread, Mr. NYC!  From grasscat:

 

I call bullshit.  Bengals fans aren't loyal?  We had to sit through 14 years of bullshit, yet here we are.

 

And Pittsburgh #21?  Their fans travel to away games more than any other franchise.

 

I remember some reorganization of seating at different points, so it may well be that the 1994 season was actually at capacity, it's just that capacity was a little lower...I do remember some games being blacked out when I was a kid because they didn't sell out - that must have been some of those mid-80's seasons.  And 1994, wasn't that the year they dumped Kosar due to declining skills or some such shyte?  Or was that 1993?

 

The old stadium could technically seat up to 80,000 and did at various occasions (playoffs, all-star games).  However, many of the seats were so ridiculously bad that you couldn't actually see the field.  I think that reorganizations probably did happen at various times AKA they opened up 76-77000 tickets for sale during good seasons (1988, 1989) and only 70,000 or 71,000 in lean years.  Thus, they may have boasted sellouts in cases where some extremely crappy seats in the lower bowl were not even opened up for sale.

Two years ago, Bengals fans were hard to come by at OU.  About midway through the season last year, all of a sudden they were all over.

 

So I'd say it's accurate.

 

Steelers fans should probably be higher up, but no, Cinci is where they should be.

^WTF?  You're judging Cincinnati fans based on the whims of OU students?  Or am I taking you too literally and you're just joking?

No, you're not taking me too literally.

 

This survey is about loyalty.  Showing up when your team is winning does not make you loyal.

 

I'm from Cleveland and wouldn't consider Cavs fans to be among the most loyal.  No one went for years, as soon as the team gets good, the arena is packed night after night. 

 

Same idea with the Bengals.

^Right - but you're gauging that based on folks in Athens, not folks in Cincinnati...seems like you're missing some very key data points!

 

This survey is about loyalty.  Showing up when your team is winning does not make you loyal.

 

I'm from Cleveland and wouldn't consider Cavs fans to be among the most loyal.  No one went for years, as soon as the team gets good, the arena is packed night after night. 

 

Same idea with the Bengals.

 

Good point. I only care about the Cavaliers when they are good. On the other hand I will watch every Browns game and Indians game I can.

 

Don't even get me started on Findlay's Steeler "fans".

I agree that the Browns fans are more loyal (not as rabid as for the old Browns though).  I would like to see how they would react with 14 hopeless seasons in a row - it seems the difference is that instead of still getting 45-50,000 a game, they would probably run the owner out of town.  There is just very little data on such a long streak - maybe the St. Louis/Arizona Cardinals would be comparable.

 

I also think because there are so many Cleveland and Pittsburgh transplants, they both have a widespread fan base.  I see a lot around Cincinnati, and when I lived in Columbus I saw more.  They are probably a big reason Columbus is growing as fast as it is and has the debates over which games to show.

 

 

I would like to see how they would react with 14 hopeless seasons in a row

 

Just wait 8 more years.

what do you call bullshit on? that the browns fans are not number one?

 

Ya' gotta start at the top of the thread, Mr. NYC!  From grasscat:

 

I call bullshit.  Bengals fans aren't loyal?  We had to sit through 14 years of bullshit, yet here we are.

 

And Pittsburgh #21?  Their fans travel to away games more than any other franchise.

 

 

ok, but how funny, fourteen years? that's a blip in time to a brown's fan -- try 40+ lol!!!

 

 

Dude, the Browns have never had a stretch of futility like the Bengals have just been through.  The Bengals didn't see the post-season for fourteen frickin' years - 1991 through 2004.  Even with three years without a franchise, the longest the Browns went was seven years.  And our last football championship?  It wasn't more recent than yours...so no, don't try to pull that nonsense.

 

I agree that Browns fans are probably the most rabid, loyal group of fans out there - but come on, don't play "blip in time" with a Bengals fan.

you think thats futility? lol - please, you dont know futility! you forget the bengals have been in super bowls-plural. looking back over almost 40 superbowls, it's bupkiss for the browns, so spare me the 14 years playoff thing. i mean really now -- that is so nothing to a browns fan, its not even in the solar system of our planet of futility. besides, look at the bengals team this year, i think you can rest assured thats over and its at least a playoff team. blip!

 

All I can say is whenever theres a Bengals game...it significantly effects the sales and traffic at our store, negatively.

you think thats futility? lol - please, you dont know futility! you forget the bengals have been in super bowls-plural. looking back over almost 40 superbowls, it's bupkiss for the browns, so spare me the 14 years playoff thing. i mean really now -- that is so nothing to a browns fan, its not even in the solar system of our planet of futility. besides, look at the bengals team this year, i think you can rest assured thats over and its at least a playoff team. blip!

 

 

Dude, what are you smoking?  Fine, let's define futility.  My definition?  An utter inability to compete.  By which measure, the Browns have never experienced a drought like the Bengals are now coming out of - 14 years, never any hope of competing.  The longest the Browns ever went without touching the post-season is half that time.

 

Another definition - time without winning a title.  Well, since the Bengals have never won a title, I think we've got ya whipped there.

 

Apparently you're saying that to come close to winning the title without actually winning it is, well, good enough.  To which I say, was being an Indians fan in November 1997 really that much more satisfying than being an Indians fan in November 1996?

 

And even if you say yes, then why?  Is it because they were a better team, more competitive?  In which case we're back to the fact that the Browns ain't never gone 14 straight years without being competitive, without having the first hope of going anywhere.  You guys don't even come in 2nd in the "push your fans away with shitty play" olympics.  Try spending 14 years without hope, then call it a blip.

 

Indians fans?  Yeah, they got it all over Bengals fans.  But the Browns?  Don't be crazy.

I would simply ask if the Browns have had 14 years in a row with a non-winning record?  And most of these seasons were over by the halfway point, but they would get hot sometimes and get close to 500.  If you at least get to the playoffs I would not consider that complete futility.  I can think of a few AFC title games the Browns were in and think as long as you sprinkle some success in you keep fans coming back. Show me a string like this and I will agree. There were 7 seasons with at least 12 losses, which is hard to do.  By the way, I am having fun with the "we sucked more theme".  Maybe all those seasons did have value:

 

1991 3-13

1992 5-11

1993 3-13

1994 3-13

1995 7-9

1996 8-8

1997 7-9

1998 3-13

1999 4-12

2000 4-12

2001 6-10

2002 2-14

2003 8-8

2004 8-8

 

 

 

 

1st half records:

 

1991: 0-8

1992: 3-5

1993: 0-8

1994: 0-8

1995: 3-5

1996: 2-6

1997: 1-7

1998: 2-6

1999: 1-7

2000: 2-6

2001: 4-4

2002: 1-7

2003: 3-5

2004: 3-5

 

 

...personally, I was a Browns fan up through when Modell moved the team, which is when I moved to Cincinnati...and I believe Browns fans are definitely the best fans there are.  But saying they've been more frustrated than Cincinnati fans?  That's just crazy.

 

All I can say is whenever theres a Bengals game...it significantly effects the sales and traffic at our store, negatively.

 

What store would that be?!?

and I believe Browns fans are definitely the best fans there are.  But saying they've been more frustrated than Cincinnati fans?  That's just crazy.

 

BTW, that statement only extends as far as the football field...obviously, Modell moving the team is just utterly beyond all comprehension...

 

^  Personally, I was dumbfounded that Modell would move with the fan base he had in Cleveland.  Like I said before they are more loyal, but I am not sure about the misery index.

On a lighter note, I couldn't help but notice the Google ad at the top of the page offering free Lee Suggs jerseys.

 

Free Lee Suggs Jersey

Represent The Cleveland Browns With A New Jersey. Act Now! 

 

Ads by Google

 

OK, I'll get right on that.

 

 

^  Personally, I was dumbfounded that Modell would move with the fan base he had in Cleveland.  Like I said before they are more loyal, but I am not sure about the misery index.

 

Well, I'm 25 and I'm not a big football fan, but it seems like the Bengals team from last year and this year is way better than the Browns have ever been during my lifetime.

 

When I was in elementary school and we played football on the playground, when kids used to throw the ball into the ground instead of to a receiver, the joke was to call it a "Bernie Kosar." And now they act like he's Joe Montana.