i just noticed this on http://www.urbanrail.net/am/clev/cleveland.htm

 

In November 1999 an extension from Cleveland Hopkins Airport to Berea was approved by the Greater Cleveland Regional Transit Authority. This southern extension will require the rebuilding of the Airport terminus of the subway. The new station will be elevated between air terminal and parking lot. The new line will run parallel to the Norfolk Southern rail tracks to the new terminus called Bagley Road. Construction will not start before 2004.

 

this was approved by GCRTA but never happened?  :-(

If I recall, Berea -- mayor, citizens, turned NIMBY and RTA yanked it.  With Joe Calabrese at RTA's helm, it wouldn't have happened anyway.

The project was altered so that it would have the following features:

 

+ Red Line terminates at Airport on elevation structure and station, located in a new, multi-level retail area between the short-term parking deck and the main terminal entrance. This retail/station complex would be outside the secured areas of the airport for persons picking up or dropping off passengers. The elevation station would allow for future extensions of the Red Line beyond the airport grounds.

 

+ Subway station and routing would remain in place, and used by a rail transit shuttle to the rental car facilities off Rocky River Drive. The route would have it follow the current Red Line routing to a point just north of the Brookpark Rapid station where a line would branch off, rise up and curve westward over I-71. An east-west right of way was preserved for this alignment in the vicinity of Rocky River Drive. The reason for this airport-rental car rail line is that the existing shuttle buses are clogging up the airport grounds, and the ridership exceeds that of the Shaker rapid.

 

The reason why this was put on hold was due to the airport's long-range masterplan, which would relocated the main terminal to where the IX Center now stands. While RTA supported the rail transit project (I know you hate Calabrese, clvlndr, but give the guy a break once in a while OK?), airport officials said it wouldn't make sense to make the investment if the terminal is moved in the next 15-20 years. That's why the project got put on the back burner -- but the project isn't dead. Just in case airport officials change their mind, this plan is still considered active.

I know you hate Calabrese, clvlndr, but give the guy a break once in a while OK?

 

KJP, please don't or attempt to limit what I say or profess what I think.  I don't "hate" Calabrese, KJP, b/c obviously I don't know him, personally.  What I don't like is anyone who helms one of Cleveland's most important services for growth; smart-growth -- transit -- who seems either incompetent, indifferent or outright hostile to best utilizing that services to the city's advantages.   From transit leaders to political leaders to sports owners -- who, after all are public stewards even though, technically private owners, we in this town have been cursed by too many 'leaders' who are more interested in the trappings of leadership more than using their leadership to shape positive change.  But we curse ourselves because we too often know the score but give these guys a bye; let them get away with it without a peep often because we wear a ‘victim’ mentality – so many have ‘done it to us’-- we’re so damn ‘afraid’ of the even greater destruction they may reap (like Modell hijacking the Browns; Ratner shutting down Tower City or Calabrese, … well, there’s not a lot more destruction Joe can do outside that he’s already done).  Look at how that cheapass/jackass Paul Dolan has come in and ruined one of the most reputable MLB teams in the league, all in the space of a few years… And I’m fucking sick ‘n tired of it.  And our political leaders: like Jane, now Frank, just go along to get along… We need an asshole like Mike White to shake things up; but we’re content with choirboys (and girls), and that’s why we remain in the fix we’re in… And it's a shame, b/c this town has so much going for it; so muc potential, but we'll never get over the hump to real greatness b/c of the Calabreses; Dolans, Ratners, PB Lewises so on and so forth...

 

Status quo = death in Cleveland...

 

While I recognize your particular sensitive posture as a transit reporter, advocate (and doer) in muting your criticism to maintain professional relationships to people like Joe, I am not so limited and will continue speak my displeasure, esp toward Calabrese, when I think he deserves it – and btw, I have on occasion complimented the man – as I did upon his rerouting more long distance WS buses into Triskett, and his simplification of the fare system with the all-day pass.   I have no personal ax to grind (I care most about Cleveland) can see both sides, KJP, it’s just that Joe most often doesn’t allow for that opportunity.

 

If only you used that passion to dig up more data to formulate new ways to convince people to act. Instead, you spend that passion on discussing why certain people don't share your intuitions.

Quite the contrary, KJP; you don't know what I do... I use my considerable political, business connections in this town in ways that are not on the front page... or urbanohio.com.

hmm ok so back to the red line discussion, please?

 

are there any diagrams and maps of what was planned.  i do remember hearing that Berea was worried about "congestion" as well

It took some searching, but I found the Southwest Corridor report and made JPG graphics out of the following. Sorry for the low resolution, but the source document was sent to me low-res....

 

 

 

 

 

Estimate capital costs/alternatives

 

Fixed Guideway APM Alt1  $357.0m

Fixed Guideway APM Alt2  $414.4m

Fixed Guideway Rail Alt1    $231.0m

Fixed Guideway Rail Alt2    $268.6m

Fixed Guideway Rail Alt3    $ 89.1m

BRT Alt1                        $111.6m

BRT Alt2                        $139.9m

BRT Alt2 Option A&B        $207.7m

TSM                            $ 18.5m

 

Rumblings that the project may be resurrected:

 

 

 

 

http://www.cleveland.com/newssun/news/index.ssf?/base/news-0/123740693218810.xml&coll=4

Overpass is bridge to the future'

Thursday, March 19, 2009

By Jaime Anton [email protected]

The News Sun

 

BEREAThe Front Street overpass could be a bridge of possibilities for the north end of town.

 

Imagine driving north over a finished railroad overpass and heading straight into a Crocker Park style shopping district, where streets are lined with mixed use commercial and office space complete with townhouse and apartment style living above.

 

Mayor Cyril Kleem said this is but a glimpse of what Berea's north end could be...

 

 

Rumblings that the project may be resurrected:

 

 

 

 

http://www.cleveland.com/newssun/news/index.ssf?/base/news-0/123740693218810.xml&coll=4

Overpass is bridge to the future'

Thursday, March 19, 2009

By Jaime Anton [email protected]

The News Sun

 

No I can't imagine (the need for) more substandard & redundant retail in the area.  ::)  ::)  ::)

I'm slow today... Is that sarcasm? 

 

What's there now is probably the ugliest strip in the entire city with a bunch of unattractive single-use buildings and fast food joints set back from the street.  I'd much rather have what is being proposed... and the red line and/or Ohio Hub stop to boot.

 

 

I'm slow today... Is that sarcasm? 

 

What's there now is probably the ugliest strip in the entire city with a bunch of unattractive single-use buildings and fast food joints set back from the street.  I'd much rather have what is being proposed... and the red line and/or Ohio Hub stop to boot.

 

 

 

Nope it was the truth.  The region is already over saturated with generic and redundant retail.  How many Gaps do we need.  It's not like Fendi or an exclusive (not price but new to the area) retailer would open up shop there.

 

As UO's number one shopper, I can't see the need for another mall or lifestyle center.

As UO's number one shopper, I can't see the need for another mall or lifestyle center.

 

I can't, either. This is getting really annoying.

Well, then what would you two suggest in place of the ugliness that's there now? 

 

Besides, they are talking mixed use... commercia/office, residential, retail... that is to say "new urbanism" type development.  Isn't that one of the things that UO'ers like? 

 

 

Well, what would you suggest in place of the ugliness that's there now? 

 

Besides, they are talking mixed use... that is to say "new urbanism" type development.  Isn't that one of the things that UO'ers like? 

 

You got "new urbanism" out of "....heading straight into a Crocker Park style shopping district"?

...." where streets are lined with mixed use commercial and office space complete with townhouse and apartment style living above"

 

"Crocker-park style" doesn't automatically mean an all single-private-entity owned mall-substitute like Crocker Park.  So, you can't make that assumption either.  I'll find out at the public meeting next week...

 

And again, how about explaining what you'd like to see instead of just saying no??

...." where streets are lined with mixed use commercial and office space complete with townhouse and apartment style living above"

 

"Crocker-park style" doesn't automatically mean an all single-private-entity owned mall-substitute like Crocker Park.  So, you can't make that assumption either.  I'll find out at the public meeting next week...

 

And again, how about explaining what you'd like to see instead of just saying no??

 

You have valid points, but my reaction is based of what was written.  If that is not what they want to build, they should have omitted the "crocker park" comments. 

 

I cannot comment on what is there.  I don't know what's currently there as I don't visit the Westside 'burbs.

 

I'll await your update.

I guess that's what makes me bristle. The whole lifestyle center thing has become quite a cliche, in my opinion. When will it stop?? When every suburb has one?

 

I guess if it's done well, it could be a positive thing. I'm all for New Urbanism. I'm not, however, for fad shopping centers. And that's what this sounds like. If it were truly New Urbanism, I think this would have to be on a grander scale to pique my interest.

Trust me... it's quite ugly.  If it's true new urbanism, then it's the right idea, IMHO. 

 

I live in Berea, so I know the area well.  My sense is the following:

 

1...that developers look for a different demographic for Crocker Parks and Legacy Villages than what is in that area.  They tend to be built in upper middle class/wealthy areas.  Berea/Brook Park's demographic is different than Westlake/Avon and Beachwood.  There is a lot of middle and working class in the area. 

 

2...Overall, the area is too small for a Crocker Park/Legacy Village type project, plus there are some well-established businesses and light industry in the area that Berea needs to retain.  So, it would make more sense that they would just change the zoning in the area encourage different development.

 

3... the reporter just used "Crocker Park style" as a generic descriptor because papers are written at an 8th grade level and most people wouldn't know what "new urbanism" means. 

 

In any event, I'll report back next week....

If I read the article correctly, this is the area they are discussing:

 

http://tinyurl.com/c2d6l4  Hit the street view for a better look around.

 

It's currently occupied by various fast food franchises, gas station, car washes, a Ford dealer, and an empty former GM dealership.  It would be a nice redevelopment gateway to Berea's downtown from the airport/IX neighborhood.  Now there's nothing to entice anyone south from those areas into what is a very nice downtown and college area.

 

What happens to the little isolated area between the sets of tracks with an overpass?  There appears to be no other way to access it.

Is the proposal for an extension north of the airport (where all that vacant land sits around Cleveland Parkway, which is what the proposals that KJP shared with us makes it seem like) or is it south of the airport around the beginning of Front St (near the end of the Berea Freeway)?

 

Andrew0816:  I don't know.  This is the first I've seen of this projects "resurrection" (it's really only a 'mention' at this stage).  So, I think it's too preliminary to know for sure.  There is a public meeting next Tuesday.  I'll update everyone afterward.

 

Thanks buckeye1 for the street view.  Now everyone can see how ugly it is.  It's kind of a narrow area.  And with a main thoroughfare like Front Street right in the middle, I don't see how a true Legacy Village type place would work there. 

If I read the article correctly, this is the area they are discussing:

 

http://tinyurl.com/c2d6l4  Hit the street view for a better look around.

 

It's currently occupied by various fast food franchises, gas station, car washes, a Ford dealer, and an empty former GM dealership.  It would be a nice redevelopment gateway to Berea's downtown from the airport/IX neighborhood.  Now there's nothing to entice anyone south from those areas into what is a very nice downtown and college area.

 

What happens to the little isolated area between the sets of tracks with an overpass?  There appears to be no other way to access it.

 

Yikes!  Thats pretty ugly.

 

 

Told ya!  :-D  That's an area you just want to drive through and stop only if necessary (like if there's a train), except all the potholes make you go really slow. There are only four things I do on that street... get gas, wash my car, go to NAPA, or go to Berea Hardware (Although there is a Nuevo Acapulco restaurant there, but I like the mexican food at Maya on Bagley better...)

Gildone - Thanks. I have driven through the area when I went to visit friends at BW and it is pretty ugly.

 

 

 

What happens to the little isolated area between the sets of tracks with an overpass?  There appears to be no other way to access it.

 

That's where there is some light industry.  The project isn't quite what you'd expect.  It's not just one overpass.  It's an overpass over CSX (southern most tracks), then a section of elevated roadway with a ramp in the middle and another bridge to access the light industrial businesses between the tracks, then another section of elevated roadway and an overpass over the NS tracks (northernmost tracks).  You can kind of get an idea with the drawings here:  http://bereaohio.com/CityHall/engineering/Pub_Meeting.pdf

 

Believe it or not, it was cheaper than lowering the roadway and having underpasses under both sets of tracks.  It was originally going to be an underpass, but that would have required more land acquisition.  There was just no easy way to do this project. 

I think people are taking the Crocker Park reference a wee bit too literally.  I'd wait to see what they actually come up with before the shrieking and moaning.

Glad to see this project at revived a little bit... Obviously the original Airport Rapid builders were shortsighted w/ the stub-end subway tunnel.  But that can be modified (or abandoned, as some plans show)... IIRC, Berea's sudden NIMBY closed-mindedness really killed this worthwhile project.  Let's hope Mayor Kleem's fresh new progressive attitude wins the day.

I lived in the pre-fab Cardinal Community apartments called Tabor Ridge for three years, located at the corner of Rocky River Drive and Emerson Avenue. So I am very familiar with the area. It was a strip of auto dealerships including Steve Barry Buick, Williams Ford and Serpentini Chevrolet. The last I saw Serpentini was the only one still open but it didn't look very healthy. The other two dealerships are closed and dark. A DIY is closed there. The Penton printing plant has lost lots of jobs over the years and the restaurants in that area have suffered. Even my favorite restuarant, formerly the Pufferbelly and more recently The Station, has closed.

 

The fact that city officials are considering a high-density, mixed-use development instead of the unimaginative fallback of sprawl is a great change from the norm and a good starting position. It shows the city fathers are willing to embrace pedestrian friendly, transit-friendly development. They may not know how to describe it. Maybe they do. So go we need to find out what they want -- is it neighborhood retail or regional retail? And what percentage of the square footage would be retail? Would residential and office uses be a part of this? Would there be business incubators? A hotel or two? Conference facilities?

 

Until we know the details, let's cut these city officials some slack and instead applaud them for thinking of a high-density, transit-friendly way to redevelop an area that had seen better days. That's the kind of thinking we need more of in Northeast Ohio, not less. They're going to hear a lot less imaginative reactions from those living fossils at the Berea Town Forum who still think Berea is a farming community like Lodi or Seville. So let's applaud Berea officials.

^Most recently it was Toth Buick, but it doesn't matter because it has been closed for a few years now.  I think what was Penton Printing is now Color Matrix.  Not a printer anymore, but a blender of pigments.  The DIY has been re-habbed and is now the new location of Fosbel (relocated from about 1/2 mile away), maker of some sort of hi-tech ceramic parts.  The only restaurant left is Nuevo Acapulco, which seems to be holding its own.  There are a couple of bars too, but I've never been in any of them. Other than that, that part of front street consists of a Burger King, KFC, a self serve car wash, a towing company, a laundromat, Berea Hardware, NAPA Auto parts, a tire dealer and a few auto repair shops. 

 

 

Went to the public meeting last night.  I thought the meeting would cover the Front Street grade separation project as well as an introduction to Mayor Kleem's concepts for the north end of Front St after the project is finished.  As it turns out, it just covered the grade separation project. The project is going to take 2 1/2 years.  It will be completed in September 2011. 

 

So, I guess we'll have to wait a while to see Mayor Kleem's concepts/plan. 

 

Anyway, everyone was supportive of the project, but those who live along or off of Rocky River Drive were understandably concerned about traffic and whether or not they'll be able to get out of their driveways and side streets. 

 

The power point that ODOT gave is here:

 

http://www.dot.state.oh.us/districts/D12/Documents/03.24.09SR237Presentation.pdf