^I think a post or two was just moved to other threads.  Like Tilted Kilt renderings moved to Random Cleveland Developments.

^I think many of the posts were moved the the Cleveland Retail thread...and then the thread was locked.

Did we just lose two weeks of posts on this thread?

 

Your post on Tilted Kilt was moved here:

 

http://www.urbanohio.com/forum2/index.php/topic,3594.msg610788.html#msg610788

^ That makes sense.  I had a feeling this was the wrong location for the post.  Thanks.

No charge.

I noticed last weekend (when it was still "summer"), the Prospect end of the street was blocked with movable orange bollards.  Is this a new policy by MRN or was it the MVP valet attempting to limit congestion of cars (and taxis) turning into E. 4th?

East 4th needs to redo the the street section on the Euclid side. There are drainage issues and it is always wet. It looks terrible.

Yeah, but that's a cool picture. Probably the ultimate urban street wall. There's so many things right with that scene.

I've walked up there several times when it was wet and always thought it was from the store owners hosing down their walks in the morning. I never noticed it was just in the street proper until you mentioned it.

its not a street issue. i believe it stems from the hydrant which is used often.

What hydrant?

 

Its even present in google streetview. I believe its been like that almost every time ive gone there.

 

http://g.co/maps/jucmx

With that chronic moisture, I'm surprised it hasn't attracted some wildlife......

 

The door to that storefront space on East Fourth was propped open today. I got a peak inside, and it looks like it is strictly a utility storage unit for East Fourth/MRN. No signs of development going on with the interior space.

Wasn't sure where to put this but I see it as an extension of E. 4.  Maybe it's already been posted somewhere else and I'm just missing it but:

 

"More downtown Cleveland apartments planned; housing will fill 5 floors of Rosetta Center"

 

http://www.cleveland.com/business/index.ssf/2012/03/part_of_rosetta_center_office.html

 

Every time I read a piece by MJM my day gets brighter.  Thanks Michelle!!!  :clap:

Wasn't sure where to put this but I see it as an extension of E. 4.  Maybe it's already been posted somewhere else and I'm just missing it but:

 

"More downtown Cleveland apartments planned; housing will fill 5 floors of Rosetta Center"

 

http://www.cleveland.com/business/index.ssf/2012/03/part_of_rosetta_center_office.html

 

Every time I read a piece by MJM my day gets brighter.  Thanks Michelle!!!  :clap:

 

this is currently being discussed here:  Cleveland: Downtown & Vicinity Residences Discussion

Not sure if this has been mentioned-- it's nearby East 4th Street..

 

The old "Machu Pichu" restaurant space on East 8th Street seems to have a new tenant:

 

http://www.facebook.com/BlackDogKitchenandBar

Restaurant news:D snapped a pic and posted!!

Restaurant news:D snapped a pic and posted!!

^^Oops, sorry, is 'restaurant news' a thread??

yep yep...no worries!!  I started to do the same thing haha

Sushi 86 (south end of the Euclid Arcade) got a new sign installed last night.  Excuse the poor quality of the pics...

^a little weird, but OK... thanks for the update.

Here's another.

^a little weird, but OK... thanks for the update.

 

I like it.  It's "different", just what the area and city need!

^a little weird, but OK... thanks for the update.

 

I like it.  It's "different", just what the area and city need!

 

Exactly my thoughts.  I wish this city would do "different" more often.  Good for them!

Looks great!

^a little weird, but OK... thanks for the update.

What's "weird" about it?

Great sign.

^a little weird, but OK... thanks for the update.

What's "weird" about it?

 

I know a few people that don't visit urban ohio might think it "wierd" that we can go on and on discussing a sign.  I guess that's what I find interesting about this board.

OK, OK, I'll back down on this one... the underside angle makes the sign look, ah, different.  Viewed straight on, I'm sure it's cool, not to mention that Sushi 86 is aided by a greater visual presence on prospering Prospect... Wish 'em well.

Aren't there supposed to be other restaurants on Prospect? I remember seeing a story about it on News Channel 5 but I can't think of how many are opening and which type of stores. Either way Prospect should look 100 times better pretty soon.

Sushi, yes!

A long time ago, was Sushi  86 a dunkin donuts?

The Dunkin Donuts used to be on the Euclid side of the arcades.

Thanks, I couldn't place it.

Aren't there supposed to be other restaurants on Prospect? I remember seeing a story about it on News Channel 5 but I can't think of how many are opening and which type of stores. Either way Prospect should look 100 times better pretty soon.

 

The only other new restaurant I can think of is Nexxus coffee (and the Tilted Kilt if that counts as Prospect).

Aren't there supposed to be other restaurants on Prospect? I remember seeing a story about it on News Channel 5 but I can't think of how many are opening and which type of stores. Either way Prospect should look 100 times better pretty soon.

 

The only other new restaurant I can think of is Nexxus coffee (and the Tilted Kilt if that counts as Prospect).

I'll try to find the video and re post it

Cleveland development experiencing renewed momentum as more people move downtown

 

This is the video I was talking about I know it was posted here earlier...

 

http://www.newsnet5.com/dpp/news/local_news/cleveland_metro/Cleveland-development-experiencing-renewed-momentum-as-more-people-move-downtown

 

CLEVELAND - When Cassia Curtis recently moved from Columbus to downtown Cleveland, she fell in love with the city. She noticed right away there's a lot to do within walking distance of her downtown apartment.

In the last decade, the number of people living downtown soared from 5,000 to 11,000. Many apartments have waiting lists. New apartments are going up and older buildings are being renovated to keep up with demand.

 

"A lot of residents have said they've been looking for things to do in the evening. There's a lot of foot traffic. There's a lot of people who live downtown looking for new and exciting things to do so we're really happy about it," said Colossal Cupcakes owner Kelly Kandah.

 

"We're about to hit the threshold where downtown Cleveland is going to continue to boom and grow," added Curtis.

 

Marinucci has said that 20,000 people living downtown would truly draw more investors like retailers and major grocery stores to line up.

 

 

 

 

 

 

The crazy thing is there is so much demand, but no properties coming on line...just talk of it...let's get it moving!!!

The crazy thing is there is so much demand, but no properties coming on line...just talk of it...let's get it moving!!!

 

Doesn't a lot of it come down to rent and raising the overall average of rent across the board to bring more projects online?  If the current rates stay the same, isn't it harder for developers to come in and start construction....  I have always wondered with the demand to live in the CBD, why aren't the buildings in the financial district that sit empty be turned into residential.  The demand is there, but there are other factors that have come into play halting a lot of new projects.

I'm curious as to why downtown residential rents haven't increased faster.  East 4th Street talks about its 300+ waiting list all the time, but shouldn't in theory this number be much less?

 

If you have 300 people willing to rent an apartment on East 4th and you say, "Okay, rent is going up $50/month," some of those 300 people will drop off, but some will say, "Sure, I'll pay that."  Then you say, "Ok, but it's another $100/month."  Again, some will pass but others will say okay.  You keep doing this until there's no waiting list because everyone willing to pay the most gets a place and everyone else says, "No way I'm paying that," and the waiting list dwindles.

 

To me, bragging about a 300+ waiting list is just admitting you don't know how to properly control your inventory.

I'm curious as to why downtown residential rents haven't increased faster.  East 4th Street talks about its 300+ waiting list all the time, but shouldn't in theory this number be much less?

 

If you have 300 people willing to rent an apartment on East 4th and you say, "Okay, rent is going up $50/month," some of those 300 people will drop off, but some will say, "Sure, I'll pay that."  Then you say, "Ok, but it's another $100/month."  Again, some will pass but others will say okay.  You keep doing this until there's no waiting list because everyone willing to pay the most gets a place and everyone else says, "No way I'm paying that," and the waiting list dwindles.

 

To me, bragging about a 300+ waiting list is just admitting you don't know how to properly control your inventory.

 

You can't make a statement like that.  Just because they are downtown that doesn't mean you can just arbitrarily raise rent.  What are the amenities in the apartment?  What upgrades do units have?  What has the owner put into the building/development to warrant a $600 a year increase?  There are a lot of variables.

To me, bragging about a 300+ waiting list is just admitting you don't know how to properly control your inventory.

 

I completely agree. I too have been puzzled by this.

 

MTS, if you really think landlords need some kind of excuse beyond simple market demand to raise rents, you should try living in New York sometime.

^Doesn't MTS own a place in NYC (or did)?

To me, bragging about a 300+ waiting list is just admitting you don't know how to properly control your inventory.

 

I completely agree. I too have been puzzled by this.

 

MTS, if you really think landlords need some kind of excuse beyond simple market demand to raise rents, you should try living in New York sometime.

Ut oh...

^^Yeah, sorry, I was just playing with MTS.  I should have added a ;)

 

 

EDIT: just to be clear, I was going for playfully sarcastic, definitely not questioning MTS's New York knowledge.

^I'm pretty sure MTS works at a magazine stand and has fabricated his life based on the covers of the different magazines there, a-la Kaiser Soze

^My suspicions are a bit different.  He actually is Thing 1 or Thing 2 and his online persona is that of his horrible (yet fabulous) boss.

 

I think this is where I am obliged to make a comment about E. 4th street and the vacancy rate.  My question is does Maron own (or have an interest in) any space that has yet to be developed?  I agree that "no vacancy" is leaving money on the table...... but not as much as "high vacancy" would.  Our developers are trying to adjust I'm sure to this spike in demand.... and I would bet the lenders (especially due to the recessions / housing bubble) are not doing anything to speed things up.

^ I think you mean Thang 1 or Thang 2.

^^Yeah, sorry, I was just playing with MTS.  I should have added a ;)

 

 

EDIT: just to be clear, I was going for playfully sarcastic, definitely not questioning MTS's New York knowledge.

^I'm pretty sure MTS works at a magazine stand and has fabricated his life based on the covers of the different magazines there, a-la Kaiser Soze

^My suspicions are a bit different.  He actually is Thing 1 or Thing 2 and his online persona is that of his horrible (yet fabulous) boss.

 

I think this is where I am obliged to make a comment about E. 4th street and the vacancy rate.  My question is does Maron own (or have an interest in) any space that has yet to be developed?  I agree that "no vacancy" is leaving money on the table...... but not as much as "high vacancy" would.  Our developers are trying to adjust I'm sure to this spike in demand.... and I would bet the lenders (especially due to the recessions / housing bubble) are not doing anything to speed things up.

^ I think you mean Thang 1 or Thang 2.

 

All of you!

 

On the whole "Why are there waiting lists downtown" thing, I can think of four possible reasons. First, you're only typically going to see rent increases happening at the end of a tenant's lease period, lest you stir up any number of contractual battles. I would imagine that the vast majority of downtown leases have start dates of April to September, when people are most likely to be moving ... the rest of the year, you're kind of tied to whatever you're already charging. So if someone does an occupancy count in December or January, and that's the first time you realize just how tight the market is, you're not going to see rates opening up new occupancies in any large number for several months.

 

Second, it may be that the market demand is less elastic than landlords anticipate. A landlord might anticipate that adding $75 to everyone's monthly rate will open up a lot of space to wait list people. But if the vast majority of tenants are willing to stay put even with that increase, then you still have the vast majority of your wait list, and you have to wait another year before you raise rents again (see reason 1).

 

Third, the opposite might be true ... Landlords anticipate market demand is VERY elastic. They're concerned that raising rents even $75 might push out a lot of current tenants and also scare away a lot of prospective tenants. It may be that even with 96% occupancy, relatively small rents could have an oversized impact on people's desires to live downtown. If that's the case, or if you're a landlord that suspects that might be the case, you might not be all that interested in experimenting with rent rates.

 

Fourth, while demand is high, as an individual landlord, you might be wary of being the first one to raise rents in any meaningful way. DCA lists 32 apartment buildings downtown. Add in several new buildings in the works, warehouses that aren't being marketed as residential but that people live in nonetheless, a smattering of single- to four-family units on the edges of downtown and rental markets in nearby places like Ohio City and Tremont, and that's starting to look like a whole lot of competition. If you're raising your rents and no one else is, you might be scaring tenants off to other buildings ... Your 90% occupancy at a higher rate might not be as profitable as someone else's 100% at a lower rate. I would think people who own one building or a smaller number of total units would be particularly wary ... you're really waiting for someone like Maron or K&D to make the move on rents before you do.

 

Finally, I would also question how active these wait lists are ... If someone put themselves on a wait list 6 months ago, or even 2 months ago, chances are, they've entered into a year-long lease somewhere else in the meantime. Unless those wait lists for East 4th or 668 are all people who inquired within the last month or so, I'd say the stand-by line is a lot shorter than it looks. It's probably good from a marketing standpoint, but it doesn't mean that everyone's still interested ... or that they were 100% interested in the first place. If that's the case, it makes tinkering with the rents all the scarier for a landlord because your "relief" tenants aren't as plentiful as people think.