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With this financial success, do you think that private, profitable passenger rail is on the horizon in the next few decades?

 

I know a lot of rail advocates are probably against or at least skeptical of privatization, but that's because privatization as it's come to be known in recent years is little more than a government handout to jail companies, parking meter companies, the turnpike etc. But if passenger rail becomes truly profitable, without subsidy, the BS political opposition starts to go away as rail stops being thought of as some kind of "liberal big government program" and big money steps in to invest in profitable rail projects. And hopefully then rail infrastructure then would start to actually grow instead of always fighting just to survive.

 

Why shouldn't rail be profitable? It's far more efficient than cars or planes, and, absent of those subsidies to cars and planes, efficiency should equal profitability. I am watching the All Aboard Florida project with excitement and anticipation.

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Most rail advocates I know are very pro-privatization -- they just don't trust most of the private operators who bit off more than they could chew and ended up failing. Few realize how difficult it is to run a successful passenger rail operation. Furthermore, to simply assume a private company can show up with a passenger train and run it shows great ignorance on the huge disparity in public policies addressing each mode of transportation....

 

As long as the competition is subsidized, rail must be subsidized in some way in order for it to compete. Railroads run trains on their own privately owned and financed infrastructure, over which publicly subsidized passenger rail services operate. Congress gave Amtrak a unique, eminent domain-like power which gives it access to any rail corridor it wants, so long as the owner is justly compensated. Yet even Amtrak must seek the permission of the owner of a railroad right of way to use it. The railroad owner can tell any non-Amtrak company desiring to use its right of way to go pound salt without reason.

 

Highways and aviation are the inverse of this infrastructure/operator paradigm -- all roads and aviation infrastructure is government owned, open-access. Why? Because they grew up in the New Deal era which sought to rein in the power of closed-access, monopolistic businesses like the railroads.

 

So you want to run a passenger train?

 

If you're an entrepreneur and want to run a passenger train for profit, you'd be advised to buy your own railroad at $1 million to $5 million per mile or build your own at $25 million to $50 million per mile. If you're lucky enough to find a freight railroad willing to accommodate your passenger train (most of the fastest/best-conditioned railroad corridors are also the busiest with freight), they will surely require you to hold the railroad harmless in at least two ways: 1) provide at least $500 million of liability insurance coverage. And 2) make sure your passenger train(s) will not delay their freight trains. That means building passing sidings, second main tracks over dozens of miles, crossovers between main tracks, and Positive Train Control (now a federal requirement for all passenger routes). A 1-mile passing siding on a flat terrain with no bridges will cost you $7 million to $10 million. Crossover tracks cost $2 million at each location. Positive Train Control will cost you $250,000 to $500,000 per mile, plus the cost of equipping all of the freight railroad's locomotive so they can interact with it.

 

You can always lease second-hand passenger rail cars and locomotives, but you'd probably have to fix them up first. There is no train store where you can buy off the shelf. Rehabbing train cars to meet FRA specs will cost you several hundred thousand dollars per rail car or locomotive. A train of 4-5 cars and a locomotive will probably run you anywhere from $200,000 to $1 million per year in lease payments.

 

Each station that's ADA compliant will cost you anywhere from $500,000 to $1 million -- closer to the latter. If you can't rent space from a railroad maintenance and train inspection facility, be prepared to spend $15 million for your own.

 

So...... How is All Aboard Florida able to do it? Because they are part of a multi-faceted conglomerate called Florida East Coast Industries which, among other things, already owns a rail corridor. And it owns a wide variety of real estate (hotels, resorts, condo high-rises, office towers, shopping plazas, etc.) and that's where their money is coming from for this passenger rail service linking Orlando and Miami. FEC/AAF is investing in the passenger rail service to boost the value of its real estate holdings around proposed rail stations, to attract private financing to develop those properties, and to use the profits from those developments to retire the financing not only for the new building but for the passenger rail investments which are substantial -- more than $1 billion -- even though FEC/AAF already owns most of rail corridors involved.

 

FEC/AAF is one of the few railroads who have such a broad vision beyond their own tracks that would even entertain such a venture. Most railroads are myopic. They see their purpose as merely running freight trains or, at most, providing an intermodal freight transportation service. They lack a wider vision to recognize they are in the business of all transportation, or wider still, of providing value to private, public and civic shareholders by all legal means.

 

Ironically, Amtrak is one of the few railroads coming to a similar realization as has FEC/AAF -- that their station-area properties can be a huge source of revenue to them and can be a source of sustaining passenger rail services in terms of travel revenue and real estate value-capture revenue. However Amtrak has limited this awareness to properties it already owns in the Northeast and in Chicago -- not to potential new property acquisitions.

"In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck

Thanks for the write-up, lots of interesting info.

 

Funny AAF/Amtrak are coming to a 'realization' that was around 100+ years ago when places like Atlantic City were developed. Buy up the beachfront real estate, build a railroad to get people there, profit. Hopefully they can set examples for their more shortsighted peers.

  • Author

Thanks for the write-up, lots of interesting info.

 

Funny AAF/Amtrak are coming to a 'realization' that was around 100+ years ago when places like Atlantic City were developed. Buy up the beachfront real estate, build a railroad to get people there, profit. Hopefully they can set examples for their more shortsighted peers.

 

The electric streetcars and interurban railways were set up in the same way. They were one component of a three-headed trust -- transportation, electric utility and real estate development. The transportation and the electric utility infrastructure was built first and the real estate development followed. But progressives and rural interests in the 1910s and 1920s became angered that they couldn't get electricity to the rural poor while farmers complained that rural roads were in awful condition and left them beholded to railroads. Private interests couldn't make a go of toll roads and government funding for roads was virtually nil. All those joined forces with automakers looking to expand from simply being playthings of the rich. So the trust-busters in the 1930s went after the three-headed trusts and got the Supreme Court to break them up as anti-competitive. The electric utilities went their own way -- First Energy traces its roots to the Northern Ohio Traction & Light, an interurban railway and utility that linked Cleveland, Akron, Canton and New Philadelphia with branches to Kent, Ravenna and Warren as well as to Barberton. Transportation assets were bought by bus companies including Yellow Coach, Greyhound or National City Lines but a few streetcar systems were sold to municipalities like Cleveland or Shaker Heights. Many real estate operations folded in the Great Depression.

 

I would love it if major real estate development firms joined forces with transportation companies (railroad, airline, etc) and rail industry manufacturers and suppliers (Ohio has more than any other Midwest state) to acquire rights of way or partner with a track-owning freight railroad like CSX or NS (the latter is more likely) or perhaps a regional/shortline railroad to undertake a value-capture financed passenger rail initiative. Ironically, Cleveland-based Forest City Enterprises reportedly approached a few Midwest congressmen a year ago to get the federal Railroad Rehabilitation and Improvement Financing program, authorized at $35 billion, expanded in its use so it could fund rail-based public transit projects like subways and light-rail -- not just freight and passenger railroad projects. The RRIF program (http://www.fra.dot.gov/Page/P0128) awards loans, not grants. So it requires a revenue stream large enough to not only sustain the passenger service but also to retire the debt necessary to build it. That works only when there's a real estate component to it. In fact All Aboard Florida was interested in applying for a RRIF loan if it could not get one through the private debt market. RRIF loans are incredibly complicated -- the amount of paperwork in the application and the lengthly environmental review process makes only the most desperate or environmentally benign projects worth going through the headache of it.

"In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck

The process for RRIF loans is apparently too complicated for All Aboard Florida, which has now shifted to Public Activity Bonds (PAB's). NIMBY's also made the loans a talking point, saying tax dollars were going to support the private railroad.

 

KJP is right in that as long as every other mode is subsidized, passenger rail will have to have some sort of relief. He is also right to say that most rail supporters would welcome private interests in the rail passenger field. 

  • 1 month later...
  • Author

Great shot! The pic is almost exactly in front of my house

 

 

Slightly off-topic: I wish Amtrak would finally allow pets on the train so I could go to New York and Chicago via train.

 

Amtrak is conducting a test program in Illinois to bring small pets on the trains that operate within that state. So it might expand at some point. Stay tuned!

 

Details:

http://www.amtrak.com/servlet/ContentServer?c=Page&pagename=am%2FLayout&cid=1248543529563&WT.z_va_evt=redirect&WT.z_va_topic=Policies&WT.z_va_unit=Traveling%20with%20Animals&WT.z_va_group=Misc%20Policies

"In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck

Great shot! The pic is almost exactly in front of my house

 

 

Slightly off-topic: I wish Amtrak would finally allow pets on the train so I could go to New York and Chicago via train.

 

Amtrak is conducting a test program in Illinois to bring small pets on the trains that operate within that state. So it might expand at some point. Stay tuned!

 

Details:

http://www.amtrak.com/servlet/ContentServer?c=Page&pagename=am%2FLayout&cid=1248543529563&WT.z_va_evt=redirect&WT.z_va_topic=Policies&WT.z_va_unit=Traveling%20with%20Animals&WT.z_va_group=Misc%20Policies

 

I have been following that pilot program with great interest.  It would be awesome to crate the dog and hop on for a quick trip to NYC with all the dog-friendly hotels

  • 3 weeks later...
  • Author

Two station projects of very different size....

 

January 29, 2015 7:00 AM

$12 million rehab ahead for Union Station

By Richard Wronski

Chicago Tribune

 

Amtrak will spend $12 million this year for renovation work at Chicago's Union Station, including a redesign of the facility's often-crowded concourse areas, officials will announce Thursday.

 

The station also will undergo safety improvements, better temperature controls and repairs to its facade, the Tribune has learned.

 

The latest steps in the rehabilitation of the 90-year-old iconic terminal are scheduled to be announced by Mayor Rahm Emanuel.

 

MORE:

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/breaking/ct-union-station-funding-met-20150128-story.html

 

+++++++

 

Waterloo is north of Fort Wayne and on the Chicago-Toledo-Cleveland line that splits at Cleveland and continues on to the East Coast (nice picture of the depot too):

 

Waterloo gets funding to renovate train station

By WANE Staff Reports

Published: January 29, 2015, 10:47 am  Updated: January 29, 2015, 3:26 pm

 

WATERLOO, Ind. (WANE) Starting next year, people who board an Amtrak train at the Waterloo station will have more than a “bus stop” shelter to wait in before boarding. It’s part of a ten-year community effort to replace the existing shelter and return the historic Waterloo Depot to passenger use.

 

In 2010, Waterloo received a $1,820,100 grant from the US Department of Transportation. Changes to the project nearly caused the town to lose funding. However, the project is moving forward and expected to be complete early next year.

 

The money will be used to replace the existing bus stop shelter and renovate the Waterloo Depot. There will also be a new long-term parking lot added.

 

MORE:

http://wane.com/2015/01/29/waterloo-amtrak-moves-forward-with-renovation/

"In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck

  • 3 weeks later...
  • Author

Amtrak suspends passenger rail service between Indianapolis-Charlottesville:

http://t.co/R8IYdJZl5n

 

Connecting bus service will be offered Indianapolis-Connersville-Cincinnati.

"In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck

  • 2 weeks later...
  • Author

http://allaboardohio.org/2015/02/26/major-delays-cancellations-affect-ohio-trains/

 

Amtrak49-Berea-022315-GeorgeSillett-1024x685.jpg

Amtrak’s westbound Lake Shore Limted (Train 49) rolls through Berea, OH four hours behind schedule on Feb. 23, 2015. That was actually better than in the past week when its AVERAGE delay was nearly six hours! (George Sillett photo)

 

Major delays, cancellations affect Ohio trains

kjprendergast on February 26, 2015

 

At 3:17 a.m. today, Amtrak’s Lake Shore Limited (Chicago-New York City train #48) departed Chicago Union Station. In other words, it started its 960-mile journey 5 hours, 47 minutes late. The eastbound train was more than six hours down when it met and passed its daily westbound counterpart, train #49, somewhere between Sandusky and Toledo about 10 a.m. as #49 is running more than four hours late. Amazingly, that’s an improvement over its average delay of 5 hours, 57 minutes per daily train since Feb. 20! (See details below)

 

Meanwhile, rail travelers in Cincinnati and other communities along the Ohio River have had no train service at all. Their thrice-weekly Amtrak Cardinal (Chicago-New York City trains #50/51) was canceled after a CSX oil train derailed and exploded Feb. 18 in West Virginia. No replacement bus service has since been offered between Cincinnati and Charlottesville, VA. Amtrak has also canceled Chicago-Boston trains #448/449, citing severe winter weather across New England. At least Amtrak has provided substitute bus service Albany-Boston to connect with trains #48/49. But that’s hardly a convenience considering how late those trains have been.

 

How late? Since Feb. 20, these are the average delays per Ohio train that haven’t been canceled during this period…

 

+ Train #49 arriving Chicago: 5 hours, 57 minutes late

+ Train #48 arriving New York City: 4 hours, 15 minutes late

+ Train #30 arriving Washington DC: 2 hours, 44 minutes late

+ Train #29 arriving Chicago: 2 hours, 11 minutes late

 

(NOTE: daily trains #29/30 are the WB/EB Capitol Limited serving the Ohio stations of Toledo, Sandusky, Elyria, Cleveland & Alliance. Daily trains #48/49 are the EB/WB Lake Shore Limited serving the Ohio stations of Bryan, Toledo, Sandusky, Elyria & Cleveland).

 

“This is downright offensive to the traveling public,” said All Aboard Ohio Executive Director Ken Prendergast. “Amtrak President Joe Boardman must be held to account for this, starting with a personal apology to all passengers who had to endure this pathetic excuse for transportation in a civilized nation. It is clear by their poor performance that these trains are being neglected by Amtrak and its private-sector partners who own and manage the tracks. Rail transportation used to be largely indifferent to bad winter weather. Nowadays, the railroads can’t seem to get their trains through the snow and cold.”

 

Some of the reasons for the delays include those beyond Amtrak’s control, including speed restrictions as low as 25 mph on tracks owned by CSX and Norfolk Southern (NS) who fear the cold will crack their seamless welded steel rails. But other delays are Amtrak’s responsibility, namely equipment malfunctions. Locomotives have failed en-route while doors between rail cars freeze open, dropping temperatures inside for passengers and causing toilets, pipes and water tanks to freeze and rupture.

 

###

"In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck

  • Author

Kill Amtrak amendment introduced. Call or email your Congressman:

 

http://www.narprail.org/hotline--blog/late-filed-amendment-cuts-all-amtrak-funding-call-now

 

Follow-up......

 

US House of Representatives roll call #110: March 4, 2015

http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2015/roll110.xml

________

 

FOUR Ohio Reps supported the McClintock amendment to kill Amtrak

 

Rep. Steve Chabot (R, 1st district)

Rep. Jim Jordan (R, 4th district)

Rep. Bob Latta (R, 5th district)

Rep. Brad Wenstrup (R, 2nd district)

 

ELEVEN Ohio Reps opposing the McClintock amendment

 

Rep. Joyce Beatty (D, 3rd district)

Rep. Bill Johnson (R, 6th district)

Rep. Bob Gibbs (R, 7th district)

Rep. Marcy Kaptur (D, 9th district)

Rep. Mike Turner (R, 10th district)

Rep. Marcia Fudge (D, 11th district)

Rep. Pat Tiberi (R, 12th district)

Rep. Tim Ryan (D, 13th district)

Rep. David Joyce (R, 14th district)

Rep. Steve Stivers (R, 15th district)

Rep. Jim Renacci (R, 16th district)

 

ONE DID NOT VOTE:

 

Rep. John Boehner (R, 8th district)

 

###

"In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck

Wenstrup and Chabot are terrible reps. Gerrymandering sucks.

^ Even though it was defeated, it's a bit unsettling that 147 congressmen/congresswomen voted for that amendment.

  • Author

 

Need a list of the Ohio delegation and how they voted. At least some of these have Facebook pages. Thanks those who voted no and give the others hell.

 

Or just click on the link of the article you just quoted. Notice its headline?

"In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck

KJP--what do you make of Boehner's non-vote?    Or am I over-thinking his need for a spray-tan appointment that day?

KJP--what do you make of Boehner's non-vote?    Or am I over-thinking his need for a spray-tan appointment that day?

 

The Speaker very rarely votes on amendments or bills.

  • Author

The Supreme Court released their opinion on the Amtrak matter a few moments ago.

http://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/14pdf/13-1080_f29g.pdf

 

It was a unanimous opinion that Amtrak is a government entity, making it able to develop and enforce performance standards against the host railroads (most of whom run only freight) represented by the American Association of Railroads.

 

Had Amtrak not prevailed, train services would have suffered worse than they already have. After the freight railroads prevailed last year in the lower court, Amtrak on-time performance sank.

"In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck

  • Author

Wednesday, March 11, 2015

New policy worries states supporting short Amtrak routes

 

INDIANAPOLIS (AP) — The leader of a coalition of states that foot most of the costs of Amtrak's short passenger routes says its members are awaiting answers from a federal agency about a new policy Indiana cited in its decision to end a line between Indianapolis and Chicago.

 

Depending on its final form, the policy being drafted by the Federal Railroad Administration could make it impossible for some states to keep their Amtrak routes running, said Patricia Quinn, who chairs the Portland, Maine-based States for Passenger Rail Coalition.

 

The Hoosier State line's last day of service is April 1, and the Indiana Department of Transportation in Friday's announcement blamed an emerging FRA policy that the state said would effectively deem Indiana a rail carrier even though it does not own any tracks or trains.

 

MORE:

http://m.gazette.com/new-policy-worries-states-supporting-short-amtrak-routes/article/feed/213024

"In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck

  • 2 weeks later...
  • Author

@AllAboardOhio

Freight trains delaying passenger trains in Canada too. Their answer? Build 100+ mph passenger-only track. Brilliant! http://t.co/TdUG0MnjOE

"In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck

  • 3 weeks later...
  • Author

Some scenes from this morning in Cleveland. Lots of activity, but left in the dark. Just missed the train from Washington DC...

CB5uTKmVEAAQhId.jpg:large

 

 

Eastbound train to Chicago...

CB5u4kOUgAA00O6.jpg:large

 

 

Westbound train to New York City and Boston...

CB5zC74UAAAA373.jpg:large

"In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck

Some scenes from this morning in Cleveland. Lots of activity, but left in the dark. Just missed the train from Washington DC...

 

Eastbound train to Chicago...

 

Westbound train to New York City and Boston...

 

?

  • Author

I do that ALL the time. What's even more strange is I rarely get lost and I'm very good with maps! :)

"In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck

  • 1 month later...

Right about where the 1943 derail that killed 79 happened.

 

The engine is where it would end up if he was going too fast, either intentionally or due to brake failure.

I can't imagine. What a mess and a tragedy.

Train reported to have been going twice the speed limit, at 100mph, when it derailed. How careless and horrible.

Train reported to have been going twice the speed limit, at 100mph, when it derailed. How careless and horrible.

 

Or something went very badly wrong with the equipment.  It seems unfathomable that a professional would go that fast through an urban area, let alone through that stretch.

I'm sure we'll be hearing more about it in the days to come, but initial reports are not very positive. "Over 100" one article read.

^I know this area well.  It, and the neighborhood around it, are called "Frankford Junction" because 2 tracks split off the electrified NEC and head over a 100+ year-old bridge into South Jersey -- New Jersey Transit's diesel Atlantic City commuter line switches off there.  As you know, there's a sharp curve to the NE just after the switches; and the curve is not banked IIRC.. It would be highly foolhardy for any engineer to travel 100 mph through this area.  We'll have to wait form more hard evidence to emerge.

 

I'm surprised that an experienced engineer would be pushing the speed like this.  There might have been a medical emergency. 

I went through this exact portion of track roughly 8 hours before the crash on a SEPTA train between Philadelphia and Trenton. The Amtrak train I was planning on taking back from NYC to Philly was obviously cancelled. I didn't really realize how vital the NE Corridor is until I witnessed the strain it caused last night at Penn Station in NYC. Such a scary situation and a terrible tragedy.

I'm surprised that an experienced engineer would be pushing the speed like this.  There might have been a medical emergency. 

I heard before he worked for Amtrak he was a cashier at Target.

Seems like every other day there is a Republican led bill or amendment cutting Amtrak funding.

Seems like every other day there is a Republican led bill or amendment cutting Amtrak funding.

 

I'd love to see the north eastern states band together and find some way to fund these trains in a public/private partnerships to keep the gentlemen from Kansas and Alabama from deciding the fate of rail.

Seems like every other day there is a Republican led bill or amendment cutting Amtrak funding.

 

I'd love to see the north eastern states band together and find some way to fund these trains in a public/private partnerships to keep the gentlemen from Kansas and Alabama from deciding the fate of rail.

 

That could work, because those lines are profitable.

 

The abovementioned Congressmen are naturally going to oppose subsidizing the lines that don't serve their regions. 

Seems like every other day there is a Republican led bill or amendment cutting Amtrak funding.

 

I'd love to see the north eastern states band together and find some way to fund these trains in a public/private partnerships to keep the gentlemen from Kansas and Alabama from deciding the fate of rail.

 

That could work, because those lines are profitable.

 

The abovementioned Congressmen are naturally going to oppose subsidizing the lines that don't serve their regions. 

 

Especially since they don't support lines that DO serve their regions.

  • Author

I'd love to see the north eastern states band together and find some way to fund these trains in a public/private partnerships to keep the gentlemen from Kansas and Alabama from deciding the fate of rail.

 

The Northeast Corridor gets a lot of special treatment already by Congress and by Amtrak. The NEC is routinely exempt from many new laws which hamstring passenger rail development in other populated regions of the country, especially the Midwest. Amtrak routinely and excessively assigns NEC costs to long-distance trains using the NEC.

 

As for profitability, Amtrak achieves an above the rail profit on the NEC, but loses money below the wheel on infrastructure. It's the exact opposite on the rest of the nation's passenger rail system.

"In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck

Seems like every other day there is a Republican led bill or amendment cutting Amtrak funding.

 

I'd love to see the north eastern states band together and find some way to fund these trains in a public/private partnerships to keep the gentlemen from Kansas and Alabama from deciding the fate of rail.

 

That could work, because those lines are profitable.

 

The abovementioned Congressmen are naturally going to oppose subsidizing the lines that don't serve their regions. 

 

Especially since they don't support lines that DO serve their regions.

 

It's their constituents that don't actually. 

I'm surprised that an experienced engineer would be pushing the speed like this.  There might have been a medical emergency. 

I heard before he worked for Amtrak he was a cashier at Target.

 

There's all kinds of stories making the rounds online, about his qualifications and why he got the job.  Many of which are completely ridiculous, (he worked at Target......nine years ago....)

With the cuts to Amtrak within hours of the crash. What if Amtrak says screw it I give up. Who would take it's place?

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