May 15, 201213 yr Or a twofer ... Attract migrating populations that are disproportionately more likely to have children / multigenerational migration? It would be interesting to see if international migration patterns match up to larger household sizes. My guess, anectdotally, is that it probably differs by native culture but that in-migration of international households probably has more "bang for its buck" than does domestic in-migration, all things being equal. If the sole/main goal is population stabilization/increases, I would think this is where you put the focus of your marketing focus.
May 18, 201213 yr I'm not sure that the highest educated foreign in-migration will provide the kind of population stimulus that other groups of foreign migrants mights (or internal migrants from certain places).
May 28, 201213 yr I've talked some about foreign-born population, and did the numbers for the 3 largest counties, but not for the 7 largest metro counties, nor did I include 2010. So here they are. Foreign-born population by county, 1950-2010, total and % of population. Cuyahoga County Total 1950: 183,833 1960: 146,720 1970: 138,633 1980: 98,608 1990: 77,701 2000: 88,700 2010: 89,609 % of Population 1950: 13.2% 1960: 8.9% 1970: 8.1% 1980: 6.6% 1990: 5.5% 2000: 6.4% 2010: 7.0% Franklin County Total 1950: 13,046 1960: 15,426 1970: 17,882 1980: 22,080 1990: 31,542 2000: 64,253 2010: 103,544 % of Population 1950: 2.6% 1960: 2.3% 1970: 2.1% 1980: 2.5% 1990: 3.3% 2000: 6.0% 2010: 8.9% Hamilton County Total 1950: 25.654 1960: 25,790 1970: 22,658 1980: 20,590 1990: 21,636 2000: 28,441 2010: 36,909 % of Population 1950: 3.5% 1960: 3.0% 1970: 2.5% 1980: 2.4% 1990: 2.5% 2000: 3.4% 2010: 4.6% Lucas County Total 1950: 22,604 1960: 22,652 1970: 15,103 1980: 13,153 1990: 12,312 2000: 14,442 2010: 16,347 % of Population 1950: 5.7% 1960: 5.0% 1970: 3.1% 1980: 2.8% 1990: 2.7% 2000: 3.2% 2010: 3.7% Mahoning County Total 1950: 29,774 1960: 24,055 1970: 16,936 1980: 11,867 1990: 7,441 2000: 6,061 2010: 7,404 % of Population 1950: 11.6% 1960: 8.0% 1970: 5.6% 1980: 4.1% 1990: 2.8% 2000: 2.4% 2010: 3.1% Montgomery County Total 1950: 10,558 1960: 10,795 1970: 10,714 1980: 11,148 1990: 11,094 2000: 13,795 2010: 17,660 % of Population 1950: 2.6% 1960: 2.0% 1970: 1.8% 1980: 1.9% 1990: 1.9% 2000: 2.5% 2010: 3.3% Summit County Total 1950: 28,606 1960: 24,269 1970: 22,379 1980: 17,180 1990: 14,860 2000: 17,709 2010: 22,755 % of Population 1950: 7.0% 1960: 4.7% 1970: 4.0% 1980: 3.3% 1990: 2.9% 2000: 3.3% 2010: 4.2%
May 29, 201213 yr Cincinnati, Columbus & Dayton add population from 7/10-7/11 Cincinnati added 5,623 residents Columbus 17,800 Dayton 3,250 http://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2012/05/29/cincinnati-among-three-ohio-metros.html
May 29, 201213 yr At this rate, Cleveland's MSA will completely disappear by the year 2295..... around the same time Columbus will reach twice the population of any other Ohio MSA..... and The USS Enterprise NCC-1701-B will be embarking on its first missions.
May 29, 201213 yr On a more serious note- I'm shocked at the fact that of Ohio's 13 metros only three are growing. And more shocked that I found almost no other States in that bad of shape. I obviously knew the vast majority of Cities would be declining but assumed most of the metros would be stagnant or barely growing as opposed to declining. Scary!
May 30, 201213 yr On a more serious note- I'm shocked at the fact that of Ohio's 13 metros only three are growing. And more shocked that I found almost no other States in that bad of shape. I obviously knew the vast majority of Cities would be declining but assumed most of the metros would be stagnant or barely growing as opposed to declining. Scary! Everyone wants to live in a desert. Everyone eats McDonald's. Everyone drinks Bud Light. Everyone shops at Wal-Mart. Everyone watches Jersey Shore. Nothing surprises me in America anymore.
May 30, 201213 yr On a more serious note- I'm shocked at the fact that of Ohio's 13 metros only three are growing. And more shocked that I found almost no other States in that bad of shape. I obviously knew the vast majority of Cities would be declining but assumed most of the metros would be stagnant or barely growing as opposed to declining. Scary! Everyone wants to live in a dessert. Everyone eats McDonald's. Everyone drinks Bud Light. Everyone shops at Wal-Mart. Everyone watches Jersey Shore. Nothing surprises me in America anymore. If I could live in a dessert, it would pumpkin pie with whipped cream and a little pumpkin ice cream on the side.
May 30, 201213 yr ^ I'm trying to decide which dessert I want to live in: chocolate mousse, cheesecake, or pumpkin pie.
May 30, 201213 yr On a more serious note- I'm shocked at the fact that of Ohio's 13 metros only three are growing. And more shocked that I found almost no other States in that bad of shape. I obviously knew the vast majority of Cities would be declining but assumed most of the metros would be stagnant or barely growing as opposed to declining. Scary! Everyone wants to live in a dessert. Everyone eats McDonald's. Everyone drinks Bud Light. Everyone shops at Wal-Mart. Everyone watches Jersey Shore. Nothing surprises me in America anymore. If I could live in a dessert, it would pumpkin pie with whipped cream and a little pumpkin ice cream on the side. Haha, whoops.
May 30, 201213 yr On a more serious note- I'm shocked at the fact that of Ohio's 13 metros only three are growing. And more shocked that I found almost no other States in that bad of shape. I obviously knew the vast majority of Cities would be declining but assumed most of the metros would be stagnant or barely growing as opposed to declining. Scary! Everyone wants to live in a desert. Everyone eats McDonald's. Everyone drinks Bud Light. Everyone shops at Wal-Mart. Everyone watches Jersey Shore. Nothing surprises me in America anymore. ....NO...NO...NO.........
May 30, 201213 yr I like McDonald's breakfast--good if you are on the want the runs. There... fixed that for you...
May 30, 201213 yr These figures should surprise no one. Years of physical decline compounded by the foreclosure crisis have left Ohio's cities difficult to market. And as the city goes, so goes the metro. All of the problems we talk about here-- lack of transit, anti-density policies, rampant demolition-- remain largely unchecked, and shrinkage is the inevitable result. I think it will take a solid decade of improvement before we see any indication of a corner being turned.
May 30, 201213 yr Correct on your first sentence. Correct on your second sentence. Correct on your third sentence. 3 for 3. However, take a look at the large gains made by numerous metros with "anti-density policies" and relative "lack of transit"...... and putting aside the fact that your conspiracy theory of "anti-density policies" is a point of contention...... I don't think there is a strong connection between anything you are constantly complaining about and the loss of population in the inner city core. I also am not in the camp, at least for the City I know (Cleveland), that loss of population is a bad thing. I would need some more context on exactly who we are losing, why they are moving away, and to where. Not really relevant to the numbers above, but I happen to think positively about the long-term effects of the shift of low income families from Cleveland proper to the post-war, blue collar former middle class suburbs on the south side (which in turn may cause those areas to decline). It may not look good from a pure population statistics view, but it is a burden lifted off the City which has too many low-income families vs. more stable households..... and, like you implied, what's good for the City is good for the metro.
May 30, 201213 yr Correct on your first sentence. Correct on your second sentence. Correct on your third sentence. 3 for 3. How very gracious of you to point this out.
May 30, 201213 yr These figures should surprise no one. Years of physical decline compounded by the foreclosure crisis have left Ohio's cities difficult to market. And as the city goes, so goes the metro. All of the problems we talk about here-- lack of transit, anti-density policies, rampant demolition-- remain largely unchecked, and shrinkage is the inevitable result. I think it will take a solid decade of improvement before we see any indication of a corner being turned. Yep, pretty much.
May 30, 201213 yr Not sure how they come up with some of these numbers. The state is doing better economy wise than other faster growing states. Adding jobs yet the population is not increasing as fast as those other states. Do Ohio have more people working 2 or 3 jobs than those faster growing states or something?
May 30, 201213 yr ^Retirees and illegal immigrants could be a major factor because neither of those groups is likely to have any effect on the "official" jobs numbers..... the "boom" states have those in spades. Us, not so much.
May 30, 201213 yr These figures should surprise no one. Years of physical decline compounded by the foreclosure crisis have left Ohio's cities difficult to market. And as the city goes, so goes the metro. All of the problems we talk about here-- lack of transit, anti-density policies, rampant demolition-- remain largely unchecked, and shrinkage is the inevitable result. I think it will take a solid decade of improvement before we see any indication of a corner being turned. Maybe all Ohio's metros just spend too much time in the pool...
May 30, 201213 yr Not sure how they come up with some of these numbers. The state is doing better economy wise than other faster growing states. Adding jobs yet the population is not increasing as fast as those other states. Do Ohio have more people working 2 or 3 jobs than those faster growing states or something? People continue to move to places with terrible economies (California, Nevada, North Carolina) too. Conclusion: people don't bother to research where they're moving and would rather live in a state perceived as "cool" or "up and coming" rather than economically stable or where they would have far more opportunity for upward mobility. The Sun Belt is notoriously bad with this.
June 8, 201213 yr 2010 urbanized area maps are ready. http://tigerweb.geo.census.gov/tigerweb/default.htm
July 24, 201311 yr I found the population portion of the RTA budget intriguing and it gave me hope for the future.
November 22, 201311 yr Look at how many people are moving out of Ohio and the rest of the Midwest vs moving in from other states. Ever wonder why Ohio's population hasn't grown much since 1970? This is a pretty good reason why (and that we aren't fighting for the declining number of immigrants coming to America vs. to other countries like Canada)...... http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2013/11/22/chart-of-the-week-americans-on-the-move/ "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
November 24, 201311 yr Hmm, Im actually pleasantly surprised that the net loss for Ohio isnt even 3k. With the way people make it out to be I thought it would be looking more like NY...
November 24, 201311 yr according to the chart, big number of Ohioans moving to Florida, obviously baby boomers retiring. No surprise there but def skews the numbers
November 24, 201311 yr How do we know that this is really a "brain drain" anyway? My guess is that the average IQ in most southeastern states and Ohio both go up when someone moves from here to there, especially for the types of jobs they are moving for.
November 24, 201311 yr How do we know that this is really a "brain drain" anyway? My guess is that the average IQ in most southeastern states and Ohio both go up when someone moves from here to there, especially for the types of jobs they are moving for. It was the only thread covering statewide population changes and I didn't want to start a new thread. BTW, I was very surprised at the total lack of ingress of Americans into several northeastern states even though the populations of those states have grown faster than Ohio's (+6%) since 1980 -- Pennsylvania (+10%), New York (+11%), Connecticut (+16%), Massachusetts (+18%) and New Jersey (+20%). I chalk that up to a lack of new foreign immigrants coming to Ohio vs the other states. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
November 24, 201311 yr Interesting graphic, though not the easiest to use. According to it, NOBODY moved to Washington DC except from MD and VA--I find this difficult to be true.
November 24, 201311 yr I read the graphic as suggesting fewer than 10,000 people moved between DC and any non-MD/VA state.
November 25, 201311 yr ^Ah, thanks, I didn't noticed the cut-off at 10,000 when I first looked at it. Thanks. That must mess with the totals, though, and thus the overall impact. For example if one state lost 7,000 on average to 10 states---that's a loss of 70,000, but it would not be reflected in the diagram at all.
November 27, 201311 yr Some population/racial distributions/locations in Cleveland-Akron...... West Cleveland/Lakewood... Wow.....That line between black folks and white folks in Cleveland / Shaker Hts is the Blue Line rapid / Van Aken Blvd. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
November 27, 201311 yr ^And also the line between some very expensive housing and some fairly middle of the road housing, correct?
November 28, 201311 yr Hmm, Im actually pleasantly surprised that the net loss for Ohio isnt even 3k. With the way people make it out to be I thought it would be looking more like NY... http://allcolumbusdata.com/?p=2065 Ohio's domestic migration problem has been improving for some time.
November 28, 201311 yr according to the chart, big number of Ohioans moving to Florida, obviously baby boomers retiring. No surprise there but def skews the numbers Florida is the #1 state for out-migration from Ohio, but it's also the #1 state for in-migration TO Ohio. I suspect this is a lot of old retirees, though it does seem like quite a few end up coming back.
November 28, 201311 yr In a few years Ohio's out-migration to Florida will be surpassed by out-migration to Cuba.
November 28, 201311 yr according to the chart, big number of Ohioans moving to Florida, obviously baby boomers retiring. No surprise there but def skews the numbers Florida is the #1 state for out-migration from Ohio, but it's also the #1 state for in-migration TO Ohio. I suspect this is a lot of old retirees, though it does seem like quite a few end up coming back. Also a lot of younger people tapping out and coming back as they found out moving to Florida didn't turn to be the cure-all hard reset they expected.
November 29, 201311 yr according to the chart, big number of Ohioans moving to Florida, obviously baby boomers retiring. No surprise there but def skews the numbers Florida is the #1 state for out-migration from Ohio, but it's also the #1 state for in-migration TO Ohio. I suspect this is a lot of old retirees, though it does seem like quite a few end up coming back. Also a lot of younger people tapping out and coming back as they found out moving to Florida didn't turn to be the cure-all hard reset they expected. Yep, this happens a lot more than people realize.
November 29, 201311 yr Hmm, Im actually pleasantly surprised that the net loss for Ohio isnt even 3k. With the way people make it out to be I thought it would be looking more like NY... http://allcolumbusdata.com/?p=2065 Ohio's domestic migration problem has been improving for some time. Could the slowing of outmigration be related to the recession? No jobs to move to (especially in the Sunbelt), and no chance to sell the house with the underwater mortgage?
November 29, 201311 yr according to the chart, big number of Ohioans moving to Florida, obviously baby boomers retiring. No surprise there but def skews the numbers Florida is the #1 state for out-migration from Ohio, but it's also the #1 state for in-migration TO Ohio. I suspect this is a lot of old retirees, though it does seem like quite a few end up coming back. Also a lot of younger people tapping out and coming back as they found out moving to Florida didn't turn to be the cure-all hard reset they expected. Yep, this happens a lot more than people realize. Except for very specific areas, Florida is a dump. And the problem is you're surrounded by thousands upon thousands of people who moved their with the same visions in their head, few of whom will ever admit that the reality is something other than what they want to imagine it is. The absolute worst are those people who feel a need to email or call you when they hear there's snow in Ohio, and tell you what the weather is there. Yeah, it's sunny and warm, but everyone's inside watching TV getting fat, just like they would have been doing here.
November 29, 201311 yr The things I love about Florida are the beaches, bays and backwaters, the everglades....the man made stuff, not so much.
November 29, 201311 yr Yeah, it's sunny and warm, but everyone's inside watching TV getting fat, just like they would have been doing here. I can't help notice that about Florida every time I go there. Everyone moves there for the weather, and then never goes outside. It's a very weird place.
November 29, 201311 yr Yeah, it's sunny and warm, but everyone's inside watching TV getting fat, just like they would have been doing here. I can't help notice that about Florida every time I go there. Everyone moves there for the weather, and then never goes outside. It's a very weird place. Having lived there for three years, that's entirely accurate. I argue that it's mostly a function of urban design. Florida just isn't very walkable and has little civic infrastructure that lends itself to just being outside recreationally, unless you're right on the beach. When you go to the small areas of walkable neighborhood like south beach, downtown Orlando, or Riverside in Jacksonville, you see people outside in abundance, unless it's very hot.
November 29, 201311 yr Hmm, Im actually pleasantly surprised that the net loss for Ohio isnt even 3k. With the way people make it out to be I thought it would be looking more like NY... http://allcolumbusdata.com/?p=2065 Ohio's domestic migration problem has been improving for some time. Could the slowing of outmigration be related to the recession? No jobs to move to (especially in the Sunbelt), and no chance to sell the house with the underwater mortgage? Doubtful, as it seems the trend began before the recession and has continued since it ended.
November 30, 201311 yr according to the chart, big number of Ohioans moving to Florida, obviously baby boomers retiring. No surprise there but def skews the numbers Florida is the #1 state for out-migration from Ohio, but it's also the #1 state for in-migration TO Ohio. I suspect this is a lot of old retirees, though it does seem like quite a few end up coming back. Also a lot of younger people tapping out and coming back as they found out moving to Florida didn't turn to be the cure-all hard reset they expected. Yep, this happens a lot more than people realize. Except for very specific areas, Florida is a dump. And the problem is you're surrounded by thousands upon thousands of people who moved their with the same visions in their head, few of whom will ever admit that the reality is something other than what they want to imagine it is. The absolute worst are those people who feel a need to email or call you when they hear there's snow in Ohio, and tell you what the weather is there. Yeah, it's sunny and warm, but everyone's inside watching TV getting fat, just like they would have been doing here. All of this is spot on. It's miserable in Florida with no job prospects. I went to UF and most graduates goals were to find a job OUTSIDE of Florida because opportunity there was so hard to come by. It's nice to visit, but give it a week and you are ready to leave again. Everything looks the same, and it is one chain after another sprawled along 10 miles of Walmarts and Targets. Leave your air conditioned house to get into your air conditioned car, and check your shoes for scorpions.
December 1, 201311 yr My parents lived in Orlando (College Park area) during the winters until they were too old to travel back and forth with the change of seasons. So they picked Ohio to live in year round. The reason was family and while they liked the College Park area, they hated how Orlando was developing with look-a-like sprawl everywhere and out of control traffic. There are some general areas of Florida I really like -- the north central part of the state with the rolling hills and orange tree orchards. In that area, the citrus smell alone is worth driving to Florida for, but you have to drive far inland to ever-shrinking areas to find "natural Florida." I remember a decade ago driving north from Orlando in search of "real Florida" and not finding until passing north of Leesburg -- an hour out of Orlando. I also like the Everglades and a few of the beach areas like Naples, Key West and South Beach -- but those are the kinds of places I could only visit. I could never live there. I could live in Orlando's College Park or in Winter Park. But those areas are so small that I would have to venture into the sprawl to find many things for basic living. I like history, and old structures, and the sense that where I am living has roots and traditions -- as well as modern architecture. I like that Ohio has this -- including the snow (although I do get tired of snow by February and March). Ohio lacks other things I like, but I can at least get my rail fix here in Cleveland. Maybe some day I'll move to a colonial town in the Northeast with lots of rail service and awesome scenery. But for now I am content with what I have. "In the souls of the people the grapes of wrath are filling and growing heavy, growing heavy for the vintage." -- John Steinbeck
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