November 26, 201212 yr It says 35,000 square feet which will be the floor level retail. Although it would've been nice to have a tower here, it sounds like this will be a massive building. Although not necessarily tall it will still make the whole area feel way more urban than it currently does. One level of retail, five of garage, and four for Dunnhumby (which are supposedly going to be quite tall levels) could easily put this entire block at 120-150 feet tall depending on floor heights. That's still pretty significant. And Gensler does good work so it'll more than likely be of a quality we can all appreciate.
November 26, 201212 yr There really should be a push for 2 levels of retail/commercial. There is a huge difference between street presence/vitality/that lively 'feeling' when retail is on the first two floors compared to only the first floor - especially when the second floor is a parking garage. If we're not going to get 2 floors, lets hope for at least 18-20 foot first floor heights.
November 26, 201212 yr Converting the offices at 580 will be vastly cheaper than constructing a brand-new building. That said, a new tower at Fountain Square West above Macy's will cost less than if it were a brand-new building on a vacant site, as the excavation and foundation work (huge $$$) are already complete. I'd speculate that these two projects are a big reason Dunnhumby decided not to include a residential component at 5th and Race. New information states there was not "enough" room at the Dunnhumby site anymore. As they needed more space. That argument makes no sense. Not "enough" room? How is there not enough room above the 4-story structure they want to build? I understand they need more space than originally thought, but it looks like their new plans expand horizontally, not vertically. Dumb.
November 26, 201212 yr Incidentally the original 5th& Race tower was taller than this and it had 2 levels of retail.
November 26, 201212 yr Incidentally the original 5th& Race tower was taller than this and it had 2 levels of retail. And it was home to a skywalk-level sports bar (can't remember the name) that was always packed. But that building was nothing short of hideous.
November 26, 201212 yr Converting the offices at 580 will be vastly cheaper than constructing a brand-new building. That said, a new tower at Fountain Square West above Macy's will cost less than if it were a brand-new building on a vacant site, as the excavation and foundation work (huge $$$) are already complete. I'd speculate that these two projects are a big reason Dunnhumby decided not to include a residential component at 5th and Race. New information states there was not "enough" room at the Dunnhumby site anymore. As they needed more space. That argument makes no sense. Not "enough" room? How is there not enough room above the 4-story structure they want to build? I understand they need more space than originally thought, but it looks like their new plans expand horizontally, not vertically. Dumb. I agree. However, originally the floor plate probably did not take up the whole site. Now since they are expanding there is no "room" to have a stand alone apartment tower (which is key). It has always been a requirement to add floors later on if needed. With an apartment tower on top there would be no way to do so. So once the plans called for taking up the whole site it is impossible to have a stand alone apartment building. We have to remember this is Dunnhumby's building not 3CDC's.
November 27, 201212 yr There really should be a push for 2 levels of retail/commercial. There is a huge difference between street presence/vitality/that lively 'feeling' when retail is on the first two floors compared to only the first floor - especially when the second floor is a parking garage. If we're not going to get 2 floors, lets hope for at least 18-20 foot first floor heights. I have been told the first floor retail will be around 18-20 feet. Then you will have 3-4 stories of parking, then 4 stories of office. Disappointing, but I've been assured it's going to look amazing.
November 27, 201212 yr >But that building was nothing short of hideous. It was pretty awful. It looked to me like it was built with the expectation that it wouldn't be there for more than 30 years, kind of like that weird thing at the SW corner of 5th & Elm that the skywalk passes through. I think the club Lunar was on the first floor.
November 27, 201212 yr Enquirer catches up: Dunnhumby growth puts dent in Downtown residence plans No apartments at Fifth & Race, but another developer might build them a block away Consumer research company dunnhumbyUSA has outgrown its planned Downtown headquarters before construction has even started, causing developers of the proposed tower at Fifth and Race to scrap plans for 200 apartments there. “The residential piece of the development is out,” dunnhumby spokeswoman Ann Keeling said Monday. “After considerable due diligence, it was determined that the space needed by dunnhumby’s new HQ would need to increase, making the residential aspect no longer feasible.” The high-profile space at Fifth and Race, long a surface parking lot, will still include 35,000 square feet of commercial space and a 1,000-space garage in addition to 280,000 square feet of office space, she said. Cont "It's just fate, as usual, keeping its bargain and screwing us in the fine print..." - John Crichton
November 28, 201212 yr They dropped the residential component because they didn't want to be involved with residential, didn't think the residential tower would be financed, didn't want to compete with the other residential conversions happening downtown, or some similar reason. The "We needed more space" line is pure marketing, trying to put a positive spin on it. And you know this... how? If dunnhumby didn't want to be involved with residential, then why did residential even come up in the first place when the initial discussions about the building came up? It seems to me like the "oh hey we're expanding faster than we thought and actually need to take up the whole site" explanation makes considerably more sense. It just seems fairly obvious that "we need more space" is spin to draw attention away from the fact that they're dropping the residential component. (And it worked, judging from the Business Courier's headline: "DunnhumbyUSA needs more room, residential out at new HQ".) I'm not saying I have any insight into the exact reason why the residential component was dropped, but mostly likely 3CDC was pushing for it hard and Dunnhumby just didn't want any part of it. Do you honestly believe that Dunnhumby just realized how fast they were expanding?
November 28, 201212 yr They dropped the residential component because they didn't want to be involved with residential, didn't think the residential tower would be financed, didn't want to compete with the other residential conversions happening downtown, or some similar reason. The "We needed more space" line is pure marketing, trying to put a positive spin on it. And you know this... how? If dunnhumby didn't want to be involved with residential, then why did residential even come up in the first place when the initial discussions about the building came up? It seems to me like the "oh hey we're expanding faster than we thought and actually need to take up the whole site" explanation makes considerably more sense. It just seems fairly obvious that "we need more space" is spin to draw attention away from the fact that they're dropping the residential component. (And it worked, judging from the Business Courier's headline: "DunnhumbyUSA needs more room, residential out at new HQ".) I'm not saying I have any insight into the exact reason why the residential component was dropped, but mostly likely 3CDC was pushing for it hard and Dunnhumby just didn't want any part of it. Do you honestly believe that Dunnhumby just realized how fast they were expanding? I disagree only for the fact that the building size did actually get bigger from the original proposal.
December 6, 201212 yr Considering Dunnhumby signed a deal with the state saying they would hit 1000 employees by 2018, and now have said, holy crap we're gonna hit 1400 by 2014, yes, I don't think they realized how fast they were expanding. I'm worried Dunnhumby is a house of cards... A late 20-something can start at about $70,000 with 5 weeks vacation. why am I working in non-profits?!?
December 6, 201212 yr Considering Dunnhumby signed a deal with the state saying they would hit 1000 employees by 2018, and now have said, holy crap we're gonna hit 1400 by 2014, yes, I don't think they realized how fast they were expanding. TRUTH. I'm worried Dunnhumby is a house of cards... A late 20-something can start at about $70,000 with 5 weeks vacation. why am I working in non-profits?!? 5 weeks vacation - gotta love European-based companies! dunnhumby (it's not capitalized because they're so hip) is offering services to retailers and consumer product groups that they can't get anywhere else. dunnhumby is a pretty big part of why Kroger's had over 36 consecutive quarters of identical store sales growth, which is insane. dh is going to continue to grow and flourish and attract really bright, creative, driven professionals, which is why it's so great that they are committed to staying in Cincinnati. Incidentally, dunnhumby's preferred hiring method is to hire really smart and flexible people, since they figure that you can train smart and flexible people on specific skills, but it's difficult to train people to be smart and flexible. So if you feel like you have an interesting resume, it wouldn't hurt to have a look-see at their open positions.
December 6, 201212 yr 5 weeks vacation - gotta love European-based companies! My American-based company starts most positions out at 4.6 weeks of personal time. "It's just fate, as usual, keeping its bargain and screwing us in the fine print..." - John Crichton
December 6, 201212 yr Most comapnies are more like 1 week after you've worked a year, 2 weeks after 2 years, then 3 weeks after 10.
December 6, 201212 yr ^ I definitely think there's something to the fact that they're based out of London. The British work ethic is stronger than some other Western European nations (Mediterranean region in particular), but overall, having a ton of holidays or a ton of holiday time is not optional, it's standard in that part of the world.
December 7, 201212 yr Is DH having the building built to accomodate additional floors to be added as needed? I would think they would build more than what they need now to allow for easy growth in the future. A while back I worked for a company that purchased two floors of a building that had a very large foot print (it was not located in Cincy or the tristate area) and they barely used up the space of just one of the floors when they first moved in. The business expanded so fast, that after 2 1/2 years they outgrew both floors and had to convert a large auditorium for large functions converted to office space and had to convert some other meeting rooms. The building was not designed to build on top of the existing floors since garage parking was built on top and the parking was partly owned by the city and the other floors of the parking were owned by another company that needed parking space for their tower next door since they didn't have parking. My point being is that they did have much more space than they thought they would need, but they were mistaken. They didn't think far enough into the future. Even with the very large foot print and square footage, they should've had much more built than what they did. I was with that company for a few years. From the time when they were a small company and took up 4 floors of a typcial office tower. There was no room in that tower to expand the way they wanted to and decided to own their own portion of a building. I personally liked the tower that they were previously in because it was tall and built up rather than out as it was much easier and quicker to get to different departments by way of elevator or stairs if I need to get some cardio (which I liked because it really does help you stay fit going up and down stairs throughout the day). But DH likes the large floor plans and that's their personal thinking and good for them, it's their space. While it would be nice if they had to start adding additional floors to the building 2 to 4 years down the road, it would make more since to add them now rather than do it later. Or even if they put many additional floors for an actual large tower, I'm sure they wouldn't have any problems getting class A office space leased at that location. Look how quickly Queen City Tower got that space leased.
December 8, 201212 yr They dropped the residential component because they didn't want to be involved with residential, didn't think the residential tower would be financed, didn't want to compete with the other residential conversions happening downtown, or some similar reason. The "We needed more space" line is pure marketing, trying to put a positive spin on it. And you know this... how? If dunnhumby didn't want to be involved with residential, then why did residential even come up in the first place when the initial discussions about the building came up? It seems to me like the "oh hey we're expanding faster than we thought and actually need to take up the whole site" explanation makes considerably more sense. It just seems fairly obvious that "we need more space" is spin to draw attention away from the fact that they're dropping the residential component. (And it worked, judging from the Business Courier's headline: "DunnhumbyUSA needs more room, residential out at new HQ".) I'm not saying I have any insight into the exact reason why the residential component was dropped, but mostly likely 3CDC was pushing for it hard and Dunnhumby just didn't want any part of it. Do you honestly believe that Dunnhumby just realized how fast they were expanding? This is what I have suspected as well. Even though they would've had absolutely nothing to do with the residential portion they just did not want to be part of a project in which residential units were a component. Not the first time I've heard of a large corporation feeling this way. As much as I would have liked to have seen apartments, it probably doesn't matter. If dunnhumby had agreed to apartments at that site, who knows if the proposals for a tower above Macy's and redevelopment of the 580 building would have happened? We probably don't need three major residential projects that close together yet. If those two both move forward and sell out, then someone will building something at one of the many surface lots downtown (or in vacant office space).
December 8, 201212 yr Most comapnies are more like 1 week after you've worked a year, 2 weeks after 2 years, then 3 weeks after 10. This is pretty much what my company was. Except that we got 2 weeks to start, which they touted as being incredibly awesome and generous, and a big reason to work for them. America is crazy.
December 8, 201212 yr The big advantage of 4~ weeks of vacation time, which companies never seem to think of, is that it forces them to cross-train everybody to cover for when others are (frequently) gone. This has two advantages: it demystifies obscure jobs around the office (this builds appreciation for some jobs and reveals those who overhype their jobs), and second it helps catch employee theft, especially accounting fraud.
December 9, 201212 yr The big advantage of 4~ weeks of vacation time, which companies never seem to think of, is that it forces them to cross-train everybody to cover for when others are (frequently) gone. This has two advantages: it demystifies obscure jobs around the office (this builds appreciation for some jobs and reveals those who overhype their jobs), and second it helps catch employee theft, especially accounting fraud. And it's easier to back fill if someone leaves.
December 19, 201212 yr Bill Rinehart from 700wlw reported on twitter that groundbreaking for this site will be January 31st.
December 19, 201212 yr Nice to have an official start date. Can't wait to see the renderings which are hopefully released sometime soon.
December 19, 201212 yr And it was home to a skywalk-level sports bar (can't remember the name) that was always packed. Was is Scully's on the Skywalk or something like that? I hear they had a hard time with the city for quite a while before closing down
December 20, 201212 yr How do we not have renderings less than 2 months away from groundbreaking? Dont those have to go through an approval process of some sort?
December 20, 201212 yr And it was home to a skywalk-level sports bar (can't remember the name) that was always packed. Was is Scully's on the Skywalk or something like that? I hear they had a hard time with the city for quite a while before closing down Yes, Scullys. I cant remember the owners name, but he HATED the city politics at the time.
December 20, 201212 yr I'm not sure if there's any more approval to be had, the city gave them a tax abatement on the property, and gave 3CDC control of most of the land as part of some complicated multi-parcel lease thing (City owns garage and leases to 3CDC, 3CDC owns commercial space, and Dunnhumby owns office space). Pretty sure city is financing garage with TIF, but I'm not sure if that needs any more approval. Also, this will be the third 3CDC garage. They have kept reasonable rates & good quality service. I think in total 3CDC will have (once this and mercer commons are done) around 2300 garage spaces in DT & OTR.
December 21, 201212 yr I'm not sure if there's any more approval to be had, the city gave them a tax abatement on the property, and gave 3CDC control of most of the land as part of some complicated multi-parcel lease thing (City owns garage and leases to 3CDC, 3CDC owns commercial space, and Dunnhumby owns office space). Pretty sure city is financing garage with TIF, but I'm not sure if that needs any more approval. Also, this will be the third 3CDC garage. They have kept reasonable rates & good quality service. I think in total 3CDC will have (once this and mercer commons are done) around 2300 garage spaces in DT & OTR. Is the Fountain Square garage not owned by 3CDC?
December 21, 201212 yr Owned by City, under 40 year lease to 3CDC. 3CDC managed spaces: 1000 Dunnhumby 604 FSQ 450 Wash Park 50 12/v lot 359 mercer commons 2473 total spaces.
January 9, 201312 yr On my way to work yesterday, I noticed that there was a sign saying (in so many words) "GTFO, this parking lot is closed for Dunnhumby HQ construction starting today." Today some orange plastic fences and some orange barrels went up. Seems like things are at least moving forward.
January 9, 201312 yr Looks like 3CDC started the 5th & Race construction photos page...and their first shats are from US Bank over the top of Macy's. They must be expecting at least some mass over there. http://www.flickr.com/photos/53177138@N04/sets/72157628084415912/
January 9, 201312 yr Hard to believe the site is being fenced off and prepped and we still haven't seen what's going there yet. Where are the renderings?
January 10, 201312 yr Skywalk spanning race street set to be removed for the new Dunnhumby Building Starting January 12th.
January 10, 201312 yr I'm bracing for the shockwaves the rendering sends throughout UrbanOhio.com. Mods might want to shut this thread down as a precautionary measure.
January 11, 201312 yr ^There will be a box. It will be clad in glass. :evil: “All truly great thoughts are conceived while walking.” -Friedrich Nietzsche
January 29, 201312 yr Yep, fellas, the long-awaited "show-and-tell" time looms very near--it was scheduled for 1/31/13, was it not? Needless to say, all of us are probably holding our breath. So much expectation, so much dread...need I say more? :wtf:
January 29, 201312 yr Yeah this has been a lot of anticipation for what's just going to be a short glass office building.
January 29, 201312 yr This better be the best rendering ever. I been looking for this about a year now
January 30, 201312 yr Everyone here is going to be horribly disappointed. Everyone always is. Why do this to yourselves? :wink:
January 30, 201312 yr Everyone here is going to be horribly disappointed. Everyone always is. Why do this to yourselves? :wink: I think your going to be right
January 30, 201312 yr Listening to the streaming of today's County Commission meeting and Monzel mentioned he'd be at tomorrow's groundbreaking of a 4 story, 280,000 sq ft building with 5000 ft of parking (???) and 35,000 sq ft of retail. Was unable to "rewind" to clarify what was said. I'd also expect today's City Council meeting to have mentions of the groundbreaking. "It's just fate, as usual, keeping its bargain and screwing us in the fine print..." - John Crichton
January 30, 201312 yr Listening to the streaming of today's County Commission meeting and Monzel mentioned he'd be at tomorrow's groundbreaking of a 4 story, 280,000 sq ft building with 5000 ft of parking (???) and 35,000 sq ft of retail. Was unable to "rewind" to clarify what was said. I'd also expect today's City Council meeting to have mentions of the groundbreaking. Four stories? Bleh ... what a waste.
January 30, 201312 yr Listening to the streaming of today's County Commission meeting and Monzel mentioned he'd be at tomorrow's groundbreaking of a 4 story, 280,000 sq ft building with 5000 ft of parking (???) and 35,000 sq ft of retail. Was unable to "rewind" to clarify what was said. I'd also expect today's City Council meeting to have mentions of the groundbreaking. 4 stories? How weak for such a prime area of real estate downtown.
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