it was tough to keep the focus on what the charrette was meant to be focused on at times due to those wondering off onto subjects that the charrette was never meant to tackle.

 

Maybe it was just the session groups I was in, but I didn't hear a single person who was against the casino nor did I hear people go too far off topic from the architecture and surrounding area design.  The problem as I saw it was the enormity of what was trying to be accomplished with people from varied backgrounds and the very short time allotted to discuss the concerns.  For example, in our one sub-group after overhead we had less than an hour to discuss as well as create designs around the topic of neighborhood concerns (included access, noise/light, safety, a possible casino district connected to the neighborhood, parking and much, much more).  While some ideas were flushed out many were just mentioned and forgotten.

While some ideas were flushed out many were just mentioned and forgotten.

John had mentioned to me that there were hang ups on trying to place hiring requirements (which can't be done by the charrette), plus an ongoing crime discussion (which can't be solved by the charrette). You may be right that I am hearing info coming out of particular groups and not the whole. Never the less, he seemed frustrated at some who saw it more as an opportunity to debate whether there should or should not be a casino rather than moving towards offering specific ideas to help shape what is now inevitable.

Man, you just gotta love those people hijacking an event designed to give people the opportunity to improve their community  :roll:.  I'm so glad I wasn't in one of those groups.  Those group leaders must have had the patience of Job.

Man, you just gotta love those people hijacking an event designed to give people the opportunity to improve their community

The same thing happened with 3CDC and oddly enough, it sounds like some of the very same people.  All people who are now singing 3CDC praises and are off to look for the next villain.

Well, I guess all I'm saying is that it sounds like this charrette didn't have a strong goal, in the form of deliverables to a client. Were there deliverables? Was the client clearly defined? "The community" is not clearly defined. A one-time open community event on any topic is destined to bring out the drum-beaters.

 

I say this purely out of empathy. In all the charrettes I've ever worked on, 90% of my time was spent keeping people on task. Several times I've had to give people an ultimatum to focus, or leave, because they hijack the process.

Any news on this yet?

Can we get a webcam up and running?

Can we get a webcam up and running?

 

Maybe on top of a flagpole or something?

^How about the pedestrian bridge over Gilbert Avenue?!?

Just a thought...and it may have been brought up in the meetings....was there anytalk of having a "green roof" on the casino.  Three things, reduce the runoff from the current pavement farm down there now, provide a much better view from above, and provide great PR for the casino and city (I am sure there would be some govt incentive as well).  Not really quite sure how they work, but I saw an example on the new PNC bank branch on Ridge Road and it look really nice from above with the grass and small shrubs. 

 

Was this in the discussion at all during the open forum with Rock Ventures?

Green roofs are a very interesting idea, but the jury is still out on their usefulness.  They certainly have a lot of benefits, in that they reduce runoff, add insulation to the building, protect the roof membrane, reduce the urban heat island effect, and can be cool (i.e. neat) to look at. 

 

There are many practical issues that make their net worth dubious at best though.  In order to get enough depth in the soil to grow anything worthwhile, you have to beef up the roof structure, which adds cost.  While the roof membrane may well last longer than if it's exposed, when it comes time to replace it you have a monumental task of earth moving to deal with.  You can't just shovel the dirt over to one side, because that could collapse the roof.  Needless to say it's a logistical problem.  Also, being on a roof without enough soil for shade trees, you're basically limited to growing herbaceous (non-woody) plants.  They have to be very drought tolerant too, since there's going to be little if any shade from trees, and no supplementary moisture, unless you plan to water the thing, which is a whole other can of worms.  If the roof isn't easily accessible (and it really should be, so people can walk around on small footpaths and enjoy it) then it becomes a sort of scrubby weed patch.  It's a really tough thing to do. 

 

I'd rather see the roof support an array of solar panels.  A lot of people poo poo solar because of its inconsistent generating capacity, and that is a valid concern in some respects.  However, they also ignore that when power is needed the most is also when solar is the most productive, i.e. hot sunny summer days for air conditioning.  Any large building like a casino or office building is what's called "internally dominated" in that they have a demand for air conditioning most of the year due to their large internal volume and relatively small exterior envelope.  The heat from people, computers, lights, and other equipment keep the place warm even in the middle of winter, so the cooling load in the summer time is quite large.  Big buildings have demand metering on their electricity, so they get charged extra based on peak power draw, and solar panels maybe combined with some green roofing would do a lot to mitigate that. 

 

Actually, I always thought solar cells would be good to build over parking lots.  Talk about a heat island, and it would shade your car so it's not baking in the sun at 150º, it would keep snow off in the winter too.  Maybe some day. 

Green roofing and green design in general was a major point that came out of the Charrette.

You

Green roofs are a very interesting idea, but the jury is still out on their usefulness. They certainly have a lot of benefits, in that they reduce runoff, add insulation to the building, protect the roof membrane, reduce the urban heat island effect, and can be cool (i.e. neat) to look at.

 

There are many practical issues that make their net worth dubious at best though. In order to get enough depth in the soil to grow anything worthwhile, you have to beef up the roof structure, which adds cost. While the roof membrane may well last longer than if it's exposed, when it comes time to replace it you have a monumental task of earth moving to deal with. You can't just shovel the dirt over to one side, because that could collapse the roof. Needless to say it's a logistical problem. Also, being on a roof without enough soil for shade trees, you're basically limited to growing herbaceous (non-woody) plants. They have to be very drought tolerant too, since there's going to be little if any shade from trees, and no supplementary moisture, unless you plan to water the thing, which is a whole other can of worms. If the roof isn't easily accessible (and it really should be, so people can walk around on small footpaths and enjoy it) then it becomes a sort of scrubby weed patch. It's a really tough thing to do.

 

I'd rather see the roof support an array of solar panels. A lot of people poo poo solar because of its inconsistent generating capacity, and that is a valid concern in some respects. However, they also ignore that when power is needed the most is also when solar is the most productive, i.e. hot sunny summer days for air conditioning. Any large building like a casino or office building is what's called "internally dominated" in that they have a demand for air conditioning most of the year due to their large internal volume and relatively small exterior envelope. The heat from people, computers, lights, and other equipment keep the place warm even in the middle of winter, so the cooling load in the summer time is quite large. Big buildings have demand metering on their electricity, so they get charged extra based on peak power draw, and solar panels maybe combined with some green roofing would do a lot to mitigate that.

 

Actually, I always thought solar cells would be good to build over parking lots. Talk about a heat island, and it would shade your car so it's not baking in the sun at 150º, it would keep snow off in the winter too. Maybe some day.

 

What about green roof modular planting panels that could be removed in sequence to get at the membrane.

 

It always seems to me that most urban surface parking lot owners are named Vinnie and are laundering their brother's dirty money. And suburban ones are usually attached to commercial properties who's owners answer to a REIT or a national chain, and trading up-front capital loss for a long-term gain isn't their idea of a fun day in the office.

 

What if we put the panels on the cars themselves, and you could plug them into your parking space for a discount or waiver of your parking fee? Or for a coupon to the store? Or even a utility credit?

Great answer!

 

Green roofs are a very interesting idea, but the jury is still out on their usefulness. They certainly have a lot of benefits, in that they reduce runoff, add insulation to the building, protect the roof membrane, reduce the urban heat island effect, and can be cool (i.e. neat) to look at.

 

There are many practical issues that make their net worth dubious at best though. In order to get enough depth in the soil to grow anything worthwhile, you have to beef up the roof structure, which adds cost. While the roof membrane may well last longer than if it's exposed, when it comes time to replace it you have a monumental task of earth moving to deal with. You can't just shovel the dirt over to one side, because that could collapse the roof. Needless to say it's a logistical problem. Also, being on a roof without enough soil for shade trees, you're basically limited to growing herbaceous (non-woody) plants. They have to be very drought tolerant too, since there's going to be little if any shade from trees, and no supplementary moisture, unless you plan to water the thing, which is a whole other can of worms. If the roof isn't easily accessible (and it really should be, so people can walk around on small footpaths and enjoy it) then it becomes a sort of scrubby weed patch. It's a really tough thing to do.

 

I'd rather see the roof support an array of solar panels. A lot of people poo poo solar because of its inconsistent generating capacity, and that is a valid concern in some respects. However, they also ignore that when power is needed the most is also when solar is the most productive, i.e. hot sunny summer days for air conditioning. Any large building like a casino or office building is what's called "internally dominated" in that they have a demand for air conditioning most of the year due to their large internal volume and relatively small exterior envelope. The heat from people, computers, lights, and other equipment keep the place warm even in the middle of winter, so the cooling load in the summer time is quite large. Big buildings have demand metering on their electricity, so they get charged extra based on peak power draw, and solar panels maybe combined with some green roofing would do a lot to mitigate that.

 

Actually, I always thought solar cells would be good to build over parking lots. Talk about a heat island, and it would shade your car so it's not baking in the sun at 150º, it would keep snow off in the winter too. Maybe some day.

Green roofing and green design in general was a major point that came out of the Charrette.

 

Thanks for the comment...I am glad it was being addressed at the Charrette

Hey, I know a Vinnie that's Irish!

 

It always seems to me that most urban surface parking lot owners are named Vinnie and are laundering their brother's dirty money.

 

 

I'm offended by your insinuation that all parking lot owners are Italian and involved in organized crime.

although I'm not Italian, I find that a bit offensive as well. This sort of ethnic stereotyping doesn't seem to be in keeping with the spirit of inclusivity and acceptance of all groups normally found in this forum.

 

It always seems to me that most urban surface parking lot owners are named Vinnie and are laundering their brother's dirty money.

 

 

I'm offended by your insinuation that all parking lot owners are Italian and involved in organized crime.

 

Sorry, Vinnie.

Casino details emerging

 

The developers of the downtown Cincinnati casino closed Thursday on the 20-acre site, paying $35 million - or more than double the market value of $14 million.

 

Meanwhile, developer Rock Ventures also revealed other planned details for the casino, including:

 

• About four restaurants and about four to six retailers will be built along the sidewalks of Reading Road, Broadway and East Court streets.
   
  
• The casino itself will be behind the restaurants and shops.
   
  
• The main entrance to the facility will be near the corner of Reading Road and Broadway.
  

 

 

cont.

So there will be windows, at least on the ground floor.

 

I wonder if they will lease the space, or just open restaurants and shops themselves.

It sounds like things are headed in the right direction...so far.

Until they add that giant panda statue holding Hyde Park-made muffins.

Casino operator closes on Broadway Commons purchase

By Lucy May, Business Courier of Cincinnati, April 15, 2010

 

Rock Ventures LLC, on Thursday announced it has completed the purchase of the 20-acre Broadway Commons site in downtown Cincinnati where it will develop a casino.

 

Detroit-based Rock Ventures is the holding company for casino investor Dan Gilbert, who partnered with Penn National Gaming Inc. to finance a campaign for a constitutional amendment to legalize gambling in Ohio. When voters approved that amendment last November, Gilbert gained the exclusive right to develop casinos in Cincinnati and Cleveland, where he also owns an NBA franchise, the Cleveland Cavaliers.

^Well the real question is what kind of retail is good to have around a casino to begin with.  Could be interesting.  Something for younger crowds? older?

^Well the real question is what kind of retail is good to have around a casino to begin with.

 

Payday loans and check cashing?  :-P

Well, a pawn shop is opening across the street from the casino...

Broadway Commons could turn into a madhouse and I mean that in a good way;)

Anyone have any idea when we should expect some renderings? The suspense is killing me.

I don't think they're ready to show their hand. Releasing renderings too early can be a big gamble.

 

• About four restaurants and about four to six retailers will be built along the sidewalks of Reading Road, Broadway and East Court streets.
   
  
• The casino itself will be behind the restaurants and shops.
   
  
• The main entrance to the facility will be near the corner of Reading Road and Broadway.
  

 

 

 

 

Thank god they "get it".  Let's hope they can produce!

FYI: I was interviewed by the Business Courier of Cincinnati about the casino this week:

 

http://cincinnati.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/stories/2010/04/19/story12.html

 

I'm also appearing at a Business Courier breakfast event in a couple weeks to talk about casinos. If anyone has ideas they'd like to see delivered, send them my way or post them here.

 

^excellent interview.  agree with the gist:  we need to emphazise the things that make us fascinatingly unique among cities.  yes we have much in common with much of the midwest, but we are also different in many good ways...

I always thought that a big roundabout at Reading and Broadway would be cool.  Maybe you could put a big "bellagio" type fountain inside the roundabout.  While we were at it, we could put another big roundabout at Central Parkway and Plum to really frame Central Parkway from Plum to Broadway.

This is more like a traffic circle (the radius is really larger than it should be for a proper roundabout) but you're right.

 

 

http://homepage.mac.com/jjakucyk/portfolio/otr.html

Love the Roundabout and Fountain ideas!

Clearwater Beach, home to America's biggest roundabout, had an enormous fountain upon completion. The fountain has since been removed. You do need some visual clearance, and you don't want to put pedestrian attractors in the roundabout, they are supposed to cross at the "necks."

 

This might be too distracting for drivers, but what about doing this with a high clearance from the outside to the center of the circle:

 

Maybe we could put sharks in the fountain, that would solve the pedestrian issue. More seriously, I could see a big old-fashioned monument in the middle.

Maybe we could put sharks in the fountain, that would solve the pedestrian issue. More seriously, I could see a big old-fashioned monument in the middle.

Wouldn't that have the same problems as the fountain? Like visibility? And maybe attracting pedestrians?

Maybe we could put sharks in the fountain, that would solve the pedestrian issue. More seriously, I could see a big old-fashioned monument in the middle.

Wouldn't that have the same problems as the fountain? Like visibility? And maybe attracting pedestrians?

 

Not if the sharks had frickin' laser beams attached to their heads.

Maybe we could put sharks in the fountain, that would solve the pedestrian issue. More seriously, I could see a big old-fashioned monument in the middle.

Wouldn't that have the same problems as the fountain? Like visibility? And maybe attracting pedestrians?

 

Not if the sharks had frickin' laser beams attached to their heads.

 

Considering it's a casino, that's not outside the realm of possibility.

COAST would propose a lower-cost alternative: mutated sea bass.

Are they ill-tempered? 

Very.

You gotta talk to the cycloptic colleague

Cincinnati casino planners want to fit in with neighborhood

 

The architectural firm working on the Broadway Commons casino project describes its early concepts with words like iconic, urban edge and connectivity.

 

http://cincinnati.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/stories/2010/05/03/story1.html?b=1272859200^3271941#

Looks like May 6 we could see some concepts.

The all mighty Enquirer is finally on this one! Only 3 days behind...

 

Latest casino sketch released

What happened to respecting the character of the neighborhood? A big glass rotunda in Pendleton?

Casino developer: Most jobs will be local

Business Courier of Cincinnati - by Dan Monk Senior Staff Reporter

Thursday, May 6, 2010, 11:03am EDT

http://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/stories/2010/05/03/daily46.html

 

Backers of the Broadway Commons casino project told Cincinnati business leaders Thursday morning that more than 90 percent of the jobs created by the project will go to residents of the Cincinnati metropolitan area and developers will establish a “robust process” for hiring local contractors to build the casino.

 

Read more: Casino developer: Most jobs will be local - Business Courier of Cincinnati: