I'm not familiar with the history on this.  Is it common for universities to generate their own electricity?  It just seems odd to me that they weren't buying power from Duke all along.

^

Don't they use the steam generated for heating buildings as well?

Has anyone seen the properties above the Niehoff Studios on the corner of Vine and Daniels.  Those are some nice spots.  I like the Steak & Lemonade spot on the street reminds me a lot of the seedy but good places that I frequent in the Chi and in Queens.

Uptown rebuilding seen

Short Vine and Vine St. would link up

BY LISA BERNARD-KUHN | [email protected]

 

 

CORRYVILLE - A major renovation to University Plaza to allow Vine Street to connect to Short Vine could begin as early as 2009. The Kroger store there would be demolished and rebuilt.

 

That's if all goes as desired by the Uptown Consortium, which is leading a redevelopment effort of Short Vine in Corryville.

 

http://news.enquirer.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080314/BIZ01/803140350/1076/BIZ

Keep on rollin'

Keep on rollin'

 

woooo! glad to see an update on this one! hopefully towne will stick to the reputation and get this done right!

 

does this mean renderings in the next month?

See, this is what I love to hear..multiple big projects happening at once.  There's an ungodly amount of potential once the streetcars are in and connecting uptown to downtown.  When I lived in Cambridge, MA for an internship...it was great because I could walk to Mass. Ave and either go to Harvard Sq or downtwon Boston.  I see downtown Cincy and Uptown virtually capable of the same awesomeness.  Whatever happened to that cool skyloop proposal?

^Everyone knows urban planners start out in six figures and they don't even have to work hard.

 

Don't show your staggering ignorance *too* much.

It's good that Corryville is being fixed up.  Once we can clear out the drug hangout at the park, people can walk down there without being afraid.  Everyone knows what park I'm talking about;)  Does the Corryville Rec even own that?

I do think that CRC maintains that park.  I've played a pickup game or two there.  I didn't feel threatened.

 

About the design:  I'm not really digging the plaza-type intersections that are in the plan.  I'd like to just see a proper realignment of Vine, re-densified urban space, and not make it so obvious that this is all the work of one supreme developer/architecture firm.  It needs to *feel* like a neighborhood, not like an urban lifestyle center.

I just moved the discussion about the Corryville nightclub and its patrons over to this thread...

 

http://www.urbanohio.com/forum2/index.php/topic,5879.0.html

And here are the last batch of juicy renderings that I have on these projects.  These are the most recent renderings (7/22/08) for the University Plaza area (Kroger site).  Not at all what most had in mind, but it sounds like the Corryville Community Council is getting panicky and Kroger is sensing that.  As a result you are seeing the quality of this project diminish quickly.

 

1. Overall Masterplan

 

2. Elevations for the Kroger building

 

3. Elevations for the Walgreens building

 

4.

 

5.

 

6.

 

7.

 

8.

 

9.

 

Sorry about the small size of some of these images.  If you would like I can email the pdf documents that are better quality.

wtf?! you ain't kidding about the diminishing quality

so have they scrapped the plan to connect vine and short vine? 

 

and of all the movie poster's to choose from, the bucket list? haha

 

however, this has to be one of the most overdue projects in the city so thank goodness they are finally stepping it up.  hopefully it can be a first step in changing the perception of the UC area

Nice suface lot....Build a garage instead

Total crap.

I wonder if having the new Kroger will completely change the types of people that go there.  Sad to say but ghetto people make the surrounding place ghetto.  So, if this is cleaned up, I'm sure the people will change.  Kind of interesting.  Where's the nearest ghetto Kroger they all could go to? the one on Warsaw is being completely redone.  Looks like they're s%it out of luck.

Ahhhh,  Ashalt everywhere!!

Here is what I don't understand.  Kroger could still allow for Short Vine to connect through to Taft without losing any precious parking spaces.  Walgreens could also be reoriented so that it is built right up the 1 or 2 streets without sacrificing their beloved drive-thru or abundant parking.

 

I have noted my slight changes to the site plan.  These changes would be EXTREMELY easy to implement without having much impact on the tenants or customers, but it would make a MAJOR difference in the end product for the community.

 

How about an INDOOR streetcar stop?  I am talking INSIDE KROGERS, that would rule! 

There is an elevation issue with the current rendering that wouldn't allow short vine to be extended even if the store was moved back, and I doubt they want a street running through the parking lot. This is basically the same layout as there is currently and it hasn't been helping anybody. New only stays new for awhile, good design makes things work continually.

Well it looks like the layout will still be better.  You have to realize that the reason people don't like it isn't because of the layout, it's because 90% of the stores there are ghetto and the landlords don't give a shit about the places.  When is the last time you've seen the Kroger floors or property cleaned?

Didn't they originally propose to have parking on the roof?

Didn't they originally propose to have parking on the roof?

 

thats the most absurd thing i've ever heard

 

Well it looks like the layout will still be better. You have to realize that the reason people don't like it isn't because of the layout, it's because 90% of the stores there are ghetto and the landlords don't give a shit about the places. When is the last time you've seen the Kroger floors or property cleaned?

 

i agree with you that the upkeep definitely leaves something to be desired but the place does have a shitty layout

Didn't they originally propose to have parking on the roof?

 

thats the most absurd thing i've ever heard

 

 

Why is this absurd?  I have been to other urban areas that have parking on top of the grocery store.  It seems like smart land use to me.

I agree...rooftop parking or parking underneath the store would be the best land use for this site.  I find it funny that Kroger said they are hesitant because of the extra costs incurred for escalators.  I surely hope they don't take this kind of logic when they approach their location at The Banks.  Then again, they shouldn't take this approach to any urban location...they should build what is appropriate for the area.

 

I really just don't understand why the Corryville Community Council feels like they have no leverage.  They almost are giving up a fight before it has even started...is there no community pride left in Corryville?  Hell even Price Hill still stands up and fights for a better end product (even if they don't get their way).

The current lot is rarely full anyway. A lot of people walk there or take cabs.

This is basically the same layout as there is currently and it hasn't been helping anybody. New only stays new for awhile, good design makes things work continually.

 

I could not have said it better myself. These latest renderings are garbage. I wish they could think about long term functionality and not getting things done in the fastest, cheapest way.

Didn't they originally propose to have parking on the roof?

 

thats the most absurd thing i've ever heard

 

The IGA on Ludlow has parking underneath the building.

Didn't they originally propose to have parking on the roof?

 

thats the most absurd thing i've ever heard

 

 

Why is this absurd?  I have been to other urban areas that have parking on top of the grocery store.  It seems like smart land use to me.

 

I guess the image it brings to my head just seems a bit tacky and i'm used to pushing around a grocery cart on one level.  but if elevators in grocery stores are whats going to be new, then i guess i'll get used to it.  But i still think it would look a bit odd having cars on the roof of a grocery store, or any store at that matter.  I can totally agree with underground parking.

Elevators have actually been quickly surpassed by large scale escalators (for both shopper and cart) and/or parallel escalators (separate one for both shopper and cart).

 

As for rooftop parking, the Toys 'R' Us in Western Hills has rooftop parking.  In this streetview you can see the ramp leading to the rooftop parking spaces (spaces that nobody ever uses due to lack of parking demand).  A similar thing could easily be done for the Kroger location being discussed here.

The Jai Lai (now Buckeye Hall of Fame Cafe) has rooftop parking.

Elevators have actually been quickly surpassed by large scale escalators (for both shopper and cart) and/or parallel escalators (separate one for both shopper and cart).

 

As for rooftop parking, the Toys 'R' Us in Western Hills has rooftop parking.  In this streetview you can see the ramp leading to the rooftop parking spaces (spaces that nobody ever uses due to lack of parking demand).  A similar thing could easily be done for the Kroger location being discussed here.

 

nice find, looks like maybe the walls extend up to hide the cars?  if thats the case then I don't think it would look dumb

Elevators have actually been quickly surpassed by large scale escalators (for both shopper and cart) and/or parallel escalators (separate one for both shopper and cart).

 

As for rooftop parking, the Toys 'R' Us in Western Hills has rooftop parking. In this streetview you can see the ramp leading to the rooftop parking spaces (spaces that nobody ever uses due to lack of parking demand). A similar thing could easily be done for the Kroger location being discussed here.

 

nice find, looks like maybe the walls extend up to hide the cars? if thats the case then I don't think it would look dumb

 

 

Yea, you can't really see the cars and it is a good urban practice.  Less land wasted on surface lots

Probably few people involved in the planning process are aware that Vine and Auburn and their respective streetcar lines used to converge in a triangle at Corry St. and then split just south of where MLK is now with one line continuing on Vine and another heading across today's EPA property to Jefferson. 

 

So to back up, the Corryville business district originally had two major streets -- Vine and Auburn -- funneling into it from the south and two major streets -- Vine and Jefferson -- funneling in from the north.  It had major streetcar access from Mt. Auburn and neighborhoods on the Vine hill as well as Avondale to the north and Clifton to the northwest. 

 

Now the business district has zero through traffic, buses don't even travel down it.  It's a spectacular example of city planners killing a business district.  I mean, who the hell thought the EPA superblock was a good idea?  Why couldn't the EPA have been downtown? 

 

So where should the priorities be?  Having a new Kroger and Walgreen's and no improvement to the historic business district or telling those two and their auto-oriented business models to take a hike and prioritize the reconnection of Short Vine with at the very least Vine and possibly Auburn as well?  I don't understand why people think that a large grocery store needs to be there because a big grocery store = big parking lot.  Kicking Kroger out of the area would open the door for corner grocery stores to do good business.  Millions of people in New York seem to do just fine with corner grocery stores, and as anyone knows who has lived in a corner grocery store area, they have pretty much everything in those stores and it makes you wonder what the hell they waste so much space on in supermarkets.     

There is a bunch of vacant land right by campus that would look great with a Kroger script K. Use that space for the street grid.

Discussions about the 3000 Vine Street project (Hampton Inn, Starbucks, IHOP) have been moved into their own thread.  You can find it here:

http://www.urbanohio.com/forum2/index.php/topic,17024.0.html

Under new plan, Short Vine won’t reconnect to downtown

http://cincinnati.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/stories/2008/09/29/tidbits1.html

 

Developers and neighborhood planners have given up on the idea of reconnecting Vine Street so that the city’s main traffic artery cuts through the Short Vine entertainment district near the University of Cincinnati.

 

“The idea had far more negatives than positives,” said Arn Bortz, a Towne Properties LLC principal who serves as a development consultant for the Uptown Consortium. The nonprofit, funded by UC and several hospitals, has been trying to stimulate housing and retail on Short Vine. An early idea, part of the University Village Urban Renewal Plan in 2005, was to reconfigure University Plaza to reconnect Vine Street with downtown.

^This is an absolute joke.  If you read between the lines, Kroger and Walgreens did not want the reconfiguration and so there will be no reconfiguration.  They want to build larger surburban-sized stores.  They don't get it, don't care, or both because people will shop in their stores regardless of where the road leads.  Whatever they do on Short Vine is all for naught if they don't send traffic down Short Vine.  The district has to have traffic to be successful over the long term.

The worst part about it isn't the big companies looking to screw the community (that's a given)...it's that the community so easily gave up the fight for something that would have improved their community.

What community?  I mean lets be honest here.

There is absolutely no community in Corryville.  I'd be surprised if there are five old people who have lived in Corryville for their entire lives, even one family. 

The die was cast when they built the CVS and the National City bank. Any rational system would have had Vine cutting through those properties. This unfortunate, but a new Walgreens and Kroger would improve that area immensely.

It's not a community its a nest for bad apples.  Just go to the Corryville Rec Center and hang out at that park for an hour.  You will see;)

It's not a community its a nest for bad apples. Just go to the Corryville Rec Center and hang out at that park for an hour. You will see;)

 

From the suburbs?

Far from it;)

Hey, I was at that Community Center Saturday for my son's karate class, and was thinking what a great group of people were there.

 

BTW Corryville was a solid community a few decades ago, but between UC and the hospitals they got pushed around and pushed out and many of their homes were destroyed.  The rest became rental, either subsidized or for students.

I stated it wrong.  My bad.  What I should've said is Corryville is getting better BUT, it was not a very inviting place for students and people.  That's why the west side of campus was always viewed as the nicer place to live but hey, there's a lot going on in Corryville and I'll be happy to see Kro-ghetto go! sweeeeet!

Corryville also got hit by the closures of the hospitals. It used to be a good place to live for nurses and the like and even a few doctors (residents mostly). The closure of Jewish and the shrinking of a couple of the others hurt bad. (part of the reason Short Vine declined).

^All that construction around the medical block has me confused.  Corryville's last best hope (aside from a streetcar route running all through the neighborhood) is that employees from the medical block look to live in the area.  Stetson Square has been successful because they've been able to attract medical professionals and grad students.  Corryville can only hope that demand continues to rise.