Mentally harmful?  Hatred?  Give me a break, I said nothing of the sort.  Are our expectations for the project too low?  I believe so yes.  Getting students excited isn't a worthy metric, because anything is better than the nothing that's there now, but that's just too low a standard to hold ourselves to.  Does it even live up to the limited expectations we have for it?  Maybe, maybe not, but based on what I've seen of the construction and renderings so far I'm not particularly confident.  Do I think we need to hold buildings, their architects, developers, and clients to a higher standard of community engagement and civic responsibility?  Absolutely!  Does that make this a reprehensible and irredeemable project that damages the psyche of all who gaze upon it?  Not at all, but it could definitely be a lot better, and I explained some of the reasons why above.  This is based on hundreds, thousands of years of design history that was thrown in the garbage by our grandparents' generation for no good reason, and we're a poorer society because of that. 

I believe so yes.  Getting students excited isn't a worthy metric, because anything is better than the nothing that's there now, but that's just too low a standard to hold ourselves to.

 

Agreed completely here.  Again a building poorly built but with amenities that are much needed by the student community is better than nothing but we should aim higher.

 

Wholtone: I guess I keep coming back to the design I see in Chicago its not consistently good (there are a ton of duds) but its still a level above what's being thrown up in Cincinnati.  Its not just luxury condos too, even the student housing around UIC looks more like old buildings even if its been made with newer construction materials.  It helps that Chicago pioneered modernism and even its older vernacular is plainer than Cincinnati's in general, but at the same time I could see those buildings fitting in fine in Cincy too.

 

For instance this building gasp, doesn't have a blank wall against the side street (in cincy it would and it would have vinyl in totally inappropriate places):  http://goo.gl/maps/EOTVk

 

 

Now that last example was a condo building in a up and coming neighborhood, what about something like student housing?  Well by UIC while the whole process to get there was a bit suspect (lots of Mayor Daley using his dictatorial power to pretty much destroy a historic marketplace that once was there) the student housing at least is a step above what's going in at UC:

 

http://goo.gl/maps/nIEZG

 

 

Now I totally understand we are living in a different era than the 1870s, but that doesn't mean we should have lazy design because of that.  Even the student housing example shows places that aren't gigantic superblocks they are broken into smaller chunks, they interact with the corner, and there isn't clumsy proportioning at the very least its something that a non architect like me would find acceptable in among Cincinnati's vernacular architecture.

 

If you use the argument of well Chicago has way higher property values, that is true, but Chicago also has a messy political system that will drive costs up and way higher taxes/wages.  Unions are way more powerful, the politics way more corrupt and bureaucratic.  In the end these buildings by UIC are student housing that rents for around 1000/mo and as I recall the stuff by UC is for about the same price which is obscene by Cincinnati standards, so given that revenue stream combined with a lot of costs that are lower, shouldn't the end product be just as high a quality?

 

I really feel that it rests on the designers and the developers who are their clients.  Chicago is a major center for design/architecture though that's the only thing that makes sense to me IMO.

 

I guess to drive it home even more, and I know some will critique me on this, I live in an apartment that has wood floors and granite countertops.  Well at least it looks like it does, but they both aren't real.  My landlord is an artist, and she designed it so that there are vinyl floors with a design that looks pretty good (nothing compared to what was done in the Victorian era, but it still makes a good impression - I thought it was wood on very first glance before stepping on it).  The countertops simply are a covering that is granite, but below that its cheap particle board.  You can do good design without breaking the bank and that's what I'd like to see more of in Cincinnati.

U Square's retail is almost entirely leased and most of the tenants are already open. Jake Mecklenborg posted photos of the development, including some of his own aerial photos, on UrbanCincy: http://www.urbancincy.com/2013/05/photos-u-square-at-the-loop-almost-entirely-leased/

Not everybody is happy with new Clifton Heights developments.

http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20130803/NEWS10/308030019/Some-Clifton-Heights-fear-urban-canyon-?nclick_check=1

Old Schoolers have a lot of trouble getting with the times.

^The problem is one form of mediocrity has replaced another. 

I'm glad people are finally starting to complain....

Friars, Scheil, Chrisys Lenhartdts all closed, and sometimes or even often the building is obsolete and renovation won't work.

The stuff that was torn down, where U Square now sits, was crap. Fast food joints, UDF, a couple of other junky buildings.

 

Short Vine is next up on the chopping block.

I have to keep this blog post permanently bookmarked there were amazing 2nd empire townhouses amongst others - see for yourself: http://m.facebook.com/l.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fcincinnatimonocle.blogspot.com%2F2012%2F01%2Fphotos-of-calhoun-st-and-mcmillan-st-in.html&h=zAQFPeVW-&s=1

 

I would place the blame for U Square's poor quality on UC, which agreed to rent the new building's office space. That is what allowed the development, which was stalled for years, to finally move forward. Instead of getting something like the original proposal, with underground parking garages, we got the cheapest possible development with massive above-ground garages and low-quality finishes.

 

Why didn't UC insist on better quality construction when they signed letters of intent to lease the space? Probably because they were fed up with waiting and just wanted something--anything--built.

Despite its quality (or lack thereof), I do have to say that the development has brought a lot of life to the area that wasn't there. People have begun moving in to the apartments and when I went by on Saturday night at around 2:30 a.m. there were large amounts of people out and about which was nice to see. Having some late night options in the development is making it a much more 24 hour spot which I feel was needed somewhere by campus. So architecture/quality/design aside, I do like what it has done for the neighborhood. Plus people now drive slower on Calhoun which is a positive for pedestrians like me. The additional stop light and two (is that right?) additional crosswalks helps pedestrianize the area.

Despite its quality (or lack thereof), I do have to say that the development has brought a lot of life to the area that wasn't there. People have begun moving in to the apartments and when I went by on Saturday night at around 2:30 a.m. there were large amounts of people out and about which was nice to see. Having some late night options in the development is making it a much more 24 hour spot which I feel was needed somewhere by campus. So architecture/quality/design aside, I do like what it has done for the neighborhood. Plus people now drive slower on Calhoun which is a positive for pedestrians like me. The additional stop light and two (is that right?) additional crosswalks helps pedestrianize the area.

 

The way I feel about U Square is similar to how I feel about The Banks Phase I. The architecture is not good. But the new businesses and residents bring a lot of vibrancy to the area. For many of the residents, it might be their first time living in an urban area, and these types of development could very well be the gateway for them to check out the city's other urban areas that actually do have character and history. That said, we should be insisting on higher quality for future projects.

The greater good is there with projects like U Square and the Banks.  Urban development and financing is more complex in Cincinnati than most cities because a)the City is poor, b) the architectural heritage of a Queen city that has residents spoiled and c) the tragic demographic reality that keeps the city at large stagnant.  The City is struggling to build a three-mile transit loop downtown.  Cincinnati has to crawl before it walks.

It's been recognized by some urbanist and architectural commentators that we as a society have managed to figure out how to do decent urbanism again, which really isn't particularly difficult when you think about it.  That said, the architectural world still has some catching up to do to get the quality of building design and construction up to par.  In the end, I'd rather have mediocre urban than mediocre suburban, and with the exception of a handful of buildings, much of that corridor had devolved into a pretty crappy suburban typology. 

Despite its quality (or lack thereof), I do have to say that the development has brought a lot of life to the area that wasn't there. People have begun moving in to the apartments and when I went by on Saturday night at around 2:30 a.m. there were large amounts of people out and about which was nice to see. Having some late night options in the development is making it a much more 24 hour spot which I feel was needed somewhere by campus. So architecture/quality/design aside, I do like what it has done for the neighborhood. Plus people now drive slower on Calhoun which is a positive for pedestrians like me. The additional stop light and two (is that right?) additional crosswalks helps pedestrianize the area.

 

Glad to read this. When I was at UC in the 80's there were waiting lines to get into bars. All of that really changed after the drinking age

was increased to 21. I stopped into the Keystone for a beer 2 Sunday's ago. Can't wait for the first football game in less than a month,

Sat. 31st @noon Vs. Purdue. Clifton / Heights should be rocking.

^Yeah the bars seem to be doing well. Plus Brass Tap has still yet to open. This stretch is turning into a late night entertainment spot which will be nice when I want to go out for a short amount of time with friends after studio but don't want to have to go down to Arlin's (which is a good 35 minute walk back to my house from there) like is typical at the moment.

Today is the last day for Big Al's (formerly Spicy Pickle). I overheard the owner was talking to a customer, saying they were closing because business was bad and they couldn't compete with all of the new restaurants at U Square. There is probably some truth to that. However I don't think it was a coincidence that they closed a few weeks after the Arby's in the same building closed. I would suspect that the owners of that building either have a new tenant in mind or want to sell the building. And if they sell it, you can probably expect it to meet the same fate as the Goetz House, the Friar's Club, and other historic buildings in Clifton Heights.

The building was built in 1949.

 

Also, I've heard Arby's moved out because of a horrible rat problem

Also- the more I think about it that's complete crap. USquare only has one restaurant open and it's Been open for a month. Unless he did a market study that said he needs to close he has no idea how it will impact his business.

^^^I mentioned upthread that there's a rumor circulating the neighborhood that the building has a rat infestation in the basement.  It's what allowed Arby's to break their lease.  Big Al's has been trying to close for over a year because the owner is having some health issues.  She used the situation as an opportunity to close.  I don't see the building surviving, however there are no plans to close the computer store... (methinks they have alternate revenue streams.)

^ I've heard it was just leaky ceilings/walls and the owner of the building didn't want to fix them so Arby's used that as an excuse to break their lease.  Hopefully that's just typical neglect and not the basis for an excuse to tear the building down...

I've yet to get to the St. Clair but I've been to Keystone and Lime so far. Keystone is good, not that I was expecting anything different since I am quite fond of their mac and cheese and quesadillas. The shade canopies outside are nice as is the entire seating area for Keystone and St. Clair. Lime's seating area is also pretty nice. And big. People seem to be taking advantage of these outdoor areas already which is nice.

 

Speaking of which, that little patch of grass has actually proven me wrong. I was extremely skeptical of people actually using it once they moved in. But I've seen it used for many things so already. Sun bathing, juggling, throwing a frisbee, people playing with their dogs, some guys tossing a football, people eating yogurt, etc. It is getting far more usage than I would have ever expected which is good.

 

As for what else is open so far for anyone who can't get up to that area much, Firehouse Subs, Rue 21, Body Central, Altar'd State, Chase Bank, some Cincy apparel store I can't recall the name of, Dibella's, Keystone, St. Clair, Lime, Mr. Hanton's Handwiches, Waffle House, and Orange Leaf are all open with The Brass Tap currently building out its space. I think that's everything that is open so far.

 

Also, there are retractable bollards at both ends of the street that cuts through the development. Are they planning on holding events there where they can raise them and close off the street? I thought it was interesting when I saw them up before the road opened and now just waiting to be raised to close off the street.

Well with the "opening" yesterday, I thought I'd insert a blog post with some pictures from 2005 that was obliterated in the meltdown.

 

USquare, University of Cincinnati in 2005

 

FEBRUARY 8, 2011 1 COMMENT

These photos were never really intended for publishing, just for our own documentation purposes here at PE.  We presumed they would provide a nice record of regress/progress in the neighborhood should we have one of our common fits of nostalgia years later.  They do.

 

 

MORE:

 

http://particularlyeverything.com/2011/02/08/university-of-cincinnati-calhoun-and-mcmillan-in-2005/

Does anybody know what's happening along Vine Street where the proposed office building will go? I got back from New York Wednesday and noticed some digging and such happening.

That's construction for the new Uptown Transit District. It will be a nice, lit bus shelter with real time bus info and some streetscaping.

 

Also, Starbucks put their new sign up on the building next to St Clair. They are scheduled to close the store on McMillan September 24th and reopen at the new store on the 27th.

Oh nice, I didn't realize that's where that was going. That whole intersection needs a lot of help.

That sucks about the Starbucks. I wish the city would have put in a clause that they couldn't poach from the rest of the business district/

I work at that Starbucks. It is going to be a huge improvement for our store. Plus, it makes more sense for the corporate store to be at USquare and more independent stores to be over by Hughes. Starbucks moving is not going to kill off that area. There's already a Gilpins and Smiling Moose moving in over there.

U Square @ the Loop celebrates its grand opening: SLIDESHOW

Erin Caproni Digital Producer- Cincinnati Business Courier

 

 

The official grand opening of U Square @ the Loop was marked with a ribbon cutting on Thursday afternoon.

 

The project’s co-developers, Towne Properties and Al Neyer Inc., hosted the event that included officials from the University of Cincinnati, the city of Cincinnati and other community partners.

 

http://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2013/08/23/u-square-the-loop-celebrates-its.html

^ It looks pretty good, if you look past the crapitecture. The open area is cool, but could be reconceived with a fountain or something. It needs something to draw people into the open space. Anyway, I think the development will be successful. I'd be happy to see the parking garage replaced eventually, and of course the Shell station needs to go ASAP. Still, this is a big step up...aside from the demolition of row houses to make room for the development.

 

Caveats, caveats, caveats...but it will bring life to the area that's been missing for years. Definitely makes UC a more attractive place to go to school.

and of course the Shell station needs to go ASAP.

 

Why?

It's a break in the streetwall, an eyesore, and an auto-oriented business in what is attempting to be reclaimed as a pedestrian district.

If you take out that shell, it will piss everyone off big-time.  Nobody wants to go to that ghetto gas station downtown.  The Shell in Clifton makes a fortune and everyone gets gas there.

There's also the BP, although it is not as convenient to get into and out of and doesn't have the capacity. But I would wholeheartedly agree that the Shell needs to go. It's a giant hole in a pretty densely developed area.

If only they could do a truly urban gas station like you see in a few places in Copenhagen.  Then you could keep the gas station and still fix that whole end of the block.  Many of these buildings fit the overall design typology of U Square too.

 

http://goo.gl/maps/hepqG

http://goo.gl/maps/05jBw

http://goo.gl/maps/Glo9K

http://goo.gl/maps/y6CEn

BP on Jefferson, Marathon on Clifton. But, yes, jjakucyk's suggestion would be ideal to replace all 3 of those stations (Shell, BP, Marathon). And especially to replace the OTR Shell.

I used to take my co-workers to the OTR Shell so that they could cash their paychecks at the bar next door.

I finally got to see it completed this weekend, and while I have been highly critical of a lot of things surrounding the project let me get the good out of the way first:

 

* The developers made sure that U Square was mostly full first -  This is fantastic it really helps to revitalize the area right by campus and give it a really striking urbananity that was not as strong when there were a mix of local and fast food restaurants there before.  It also took forever for the University Park Apts to fill up its retail portion making this pretty darn impressive :-).  The area by the university feels like a real neighborhood again!

 

*I like a handful of features - the rooftop terrace was a nice touch as was the central square part of the development that when paired with the restaurants really gives the neighborhood a nice village square feeling.

 

Now what I don't like:

 

* Crapitecture - 'nuff said.

 

* The garages - I mean these are ugly but what annoyed me even more is on Mcmillian on the south side next to the garage is a surface parking lot, why go through the effort to put garages in and then leave a lot where their could be more urban friendly structures?  It doesn't make any sense to me unless they are going to do a future phase where that lot is developed into something else.

^That lot is where they plan on putting a hotel. Hopefully sooner rather than later.

Today is the last day for Big Al's (formerly Spicy Pickle). I overheard the owner was talking to a customer, saying they were closing because business was bad and they couldn't compete with all of the new restaurants at U Square. There is probably some truth to that. However I don't think it was a coincidence that they closed a few weeks after the Arby's in the same building closed. I would suspect that the owners of that building either have a new tenant in mind or want to sell the building. And if they sell it, you can probably expect it to meet the same fate as the Goetz House, the Friar's Club, and other historic buildings in Clifton Heights.

 

Gilpin's is about to open in the old Big Al's space. They turned that space around extremely fast. Arby's is still empty.

Another retailer coming to U Square

Smoothie King will be a part of the U Square complex.

 

Tom Demeropolis Reporter- Cincinnati Business Courier

   

Smoothie King is the latest retailer to sign a lease for space at U Square @ the Loop.

 

Steve Lund, a Smoothie King franchisee, signed a five-year lease for a little less than 1,300 square feet of space at U Square. A graduate of the University of Cincinnati, Lund has been trying to find a location for a Smoothie King for about 10 years.

 

http://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2013/09/11/another-retailer-coming-to-u-square.html

^^They are already open. They did a nice job with the space. The layout is still the same but there is more of a coffee shop vibe.

 

I hear a "burger place" might be going into the arby's space.

May have already been reported but Gilipins opened another location in the old Big Al's (nee Spicy Pickle) spot.

May have already been reported but Gilipins opened another location in the old Big Al's (nee Spicy Pickle) spot.

 

Wish all this stuff was there when I was in school, we were always bitching and moaning about not having late night hangouts - now students actually have a few places!

Brass Tap has to be opening soon, yes?

I remember hearing that BD's Mongolian Grill was going to open at U Square, but I guess they dropped out?

 

New restaurant opening soon at U Square

Tom Demeropolis Reporter- Cincinnati Business Courier

 

 

Hwy 55 Burgers Shakes & Fries is scheduled to open its second location in Greater Cincinnati next week at U Square @ the Loop.

 

The 2,200-square-foot restaurant will open Oct. 21, located on the West McMillan Street side of U Square. Dawn Hoback, the local franchisee for Hwy 55, along with her husband, Rick, said the ’50s style family restaurant offers a good price point for college students. U Square is a $78 million mixed-use development just south of the University of Cincinnati main campus.

 

 

http://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2013/10/15/new-restaurant-opening-soon-at-u-square.html

 

Highway 55 is what Johnny Rockets should be...'50's style family restaurant that actually offers good food and not total crap.

I'm excited to check it out. Diner style joints are always welcome in my book if they serve good food at a good price.