8 hours ago, surfohio said:

 

I have no studies or reports but my wife was a teacher in Cleveland for years. Children from a destructive or unsupportive home environment are nearly impossible to properly educate. Sadly such a large number of students fit that description in the city that it creates a disruptive atmosphere where ensuring good conduct requires an inordinate amount of time and energy. It is heartbreaking to witness so many kids who have no real shot at a normal life. 

 

The only solution I can think of is to provide boarding schools where the student environment is safe and conducive to learning. I'm not sure how that could even be done without a controversial and massive change in the district, not to mention the cost considerations. 

This is just a gut feel, but it seems like programs funded with the goal of creating a stable home life would be a good thing to fund then. More jobs close to people who can work them, better public transit, easier access to food and healthcare, etc. etc.

3 minutes ago, ogibbigo said:

Ive often contemplated the benefits of having a m-f boarding school environment for the inner city youth to combat the same issues you speak of and i have witnessed. Unfortunately politically I think it has a snowballs chance in hell of coming to fruition, but I agree it is truly the next step in instituting constructive change.

Have any other cities (large or small) implemented a publicly funded option like this in the US? I think it's more prevalent in other countries, but I honestly have no idea how common it is.

 

Edit

Looks like there are very few public boarding schools in the US according to this website, and most are targeted at a subset of the population like the blind and deaf: https://boardingschools.us/public-boarding-schools/

Edited October 29, 20204 yr by dastler

15 hours ago, dastler said:

A common trope on the Cleveland subreddit is that the Cleveland school district sucks, and that the only options are to send the kids to private school or to move to the burbs. Looking at Ohio's report card here: https://www.cleveland.com/news/g66l-2019/09/999687f12c8117/ohio-school-districts-ranked-1-to-608-by-report-cards-performance-index.html CMSD ranks out at one of the worst in the state.

 

My question is, what can be done to improve the school district? Are there any studies on suggestions for what can be done? Trying to find some more objective numbers, using this source: https://www.niche.com/k12/d/cleveland-municipal-school-district-oh/ it looks our teacher to student ratio is lower and the expenses per student are higher than the national average. Is throwing more money at the problem a solution? Paying teachers more to attract better teachers? What about funding for extra-curriculars?

 

I'm curious what others here think the solution might be, ideally with studies or reports to back up their claims.

 

Multiple studies have shown that test scores reflect a school district's wealth and are not predictors of future success.  And yet those school report cards drive the population away from poor schools and the state punishes those poorer-population, lower-test-score schools with LESS state funding, increasing the have-have not divide.  (Also note that some of the state report card data is "massaged" to give a better "apples to apples" comparison between schools, but while the state admits this the formula is not public.)  The Ohio Supreme Court has ruled several times that the state's funding system is unconstitutional because it is too heavily weighted to local property taxes. There is a bill in the Ohio legislature to address it, but it's been going nowhere for six years and it won't be an issue until it impacts more than just the poorer districts. 

 

Short of boarding schools (and further increased cost -- a LOT more adult supervision would be needed -- so much so that I don't see that ever happening), some improvements would include: further reducing class sizes, better programs to address bad behavior without punishment, extended day care/supervision so that kids aren't home alone unsupervised (check out Open Doors Academy for an excellent after-school program), and a lot more wraparound services to support both the kids and their parents.   All of that costs, a lot.  (But in my opinion it's cheaper for society in the long run.)

 

All of that is an uphill battle, however, because rural state conservatives control the legislature, and they don't think that a high poverty public school should cost 2-3x the average of what the state spends to educate most kids. 

15 minutes ago, Foraker said:

 

Multiple studies have shown that test scores reflect a school district's wealth and are not predictors of future success.  And yet those school report cards drive the population away from poor schools and the state punishes those poorer-population, lower-test-score schools with LESS state funding, increasing the have-have not divide.  (Also note that some of the state report card data is "massaged" to give a better "apples to apples" comparison between schools, but while the state admits this the formula is not public.)  The Ohio Supreme Court has ruled several times that the state's funding system is unconstitutional because it is too heavily weighted to local property taxes. There is a bill in the Ohio legislature to address it, but it's been going nowhere for six years and it won't be an issue until it impacts more than just the poorer districts. 

 

Short of boarding schools (and further increased cost -- a LOT more adult supervision would be needed -- so much so that I don't see that ever happening), some improvements would include: further reducing class sizes, better programs to address bad behavior without punishment, extended day care/supervision so that kids aren't home alone unsupervised (check out Open Doors Academy for an excellent after-school program), and a lot more wraparound services to support both the kids and their parents.   All of that costs, a lot.  (But in my opinion it's cheaper for society in the long run.)

 

All of that is an uphill battle, however, because rural state conservatives control the legislature, and they don't think that a high poverty public school should cost 2-3x the average of what the state spends to educate most kids. 

Is additional school funding something that the mayor can directly control? This is one argument against the tax abatement policies we currently have in place, but most of that revenue is basically deferred. According to the study released by the city the schools should be getting an additional $0.5-2M every year for the next 15 years or so.

 

I just looked at the CMSD budget though, and that extra revenue is basically a pittance when compared with the total budget of $1B. I'm shocked by the size of the spending though... where is the $404M of local revenue coming from when property taxes collected by the city were only $37.9M in 2019?

18 minutes ago, dastler said:

Is additional school funding something that the mayor can directly control? This is one argument against the tax abatement policies we currently have in place, but most of that revenue is basically deferred. According to the study released by the city the schools should be getting an additional $0.5-2M every year for the next 15 years or so.

 

I just looked at the CMSD budget though, and that extra revenue is basically a pittance when compared with the total budget of $1B. I'm shocked by the size of the spending though... where is the $404M of local revenue coming from when property taxes collected by the city were only $37.9M in 2019?

The collection of property taxes by the school district is wholly separate from the City’s. The school district is a separate political entity even though it is under mayoral control (unique to Cleveland).

2 hours ago, dastler said:

I just looked at the CMSD budget though, and that extra revenue is basically a pittance when compared with the total budget of $1B. I'm shocked by the size of the spending though... where is the $404M of local revenue coming from when property taxes collected by the city were only $37.9M in 2019?

 

 

In Cleveland a dollar of residential property tax goes 18 cents to the city, 18.8 cents to the county, and 63.2 cents to the school district.  Of course, the schools have other sources of income as well. Then, too, the city's share is often abated, reducing it's actual portion, and the school's share isn't.

 

Distribution data from the tax abatement study on the city's website:

https://clevelandohio.gov/sites/default/files/forms_publications/ReinvestmentFund_Report-ClevelandTaxAbatements-July2020.pdf

While the aggregate of the Cleveland schools may not be great, that does not mean they are all terrible. Remember with the transformation plan, we have numerous specialty/honors schools (ex School of Arts), and then remaining "normal" schools. There is a very start divide between the two. There are schools in CMSD (elementary through HS) which rate as high or higher than the top suburban schools. You have to apply/test to get into these schools though. The problem is shown in the "normal" schools, which unfortunately have become warehouses for underperforming students and those with special needs. These are the schools with the bad state report cards, which then pull down the district averages. Point is, high quality education can absolutely be found in the city public schools, and its unfair to drag them (and the teachers) down.

 

Also, I was very impressed myself in seeing the news of how far they have increased the graduation rate - from 52.2% in 2011, the year before the transformation plan, to a district record of 80.1% for the class of 2019. They have also closed the racial gap, with black students graduating at a rate of 80.9%. 

https://www.clevelandmetroschools.org/site/default.aspx?PageType=3&DomainID=255&ModuleInstanceID=1887&ViewID=6446EE88-D30C-497E-9316-3F8874B3E108&RenderLoc=0&FlexDataID=31269&PageID=1027

 

On 10/29/2020 at 4:28 PM, PoshSteve said:

While the aggregate of the Cleveland schools may not be great, that does not mean they are all terrible. Remember with the transformation plan, we have numerous specialty/honors schools (ex School of Arts), and then remaining "normal" schools. There is a very start divide between the two. There are schools in CMSD (elementary through HS) which rate as high or higher than the top suburban schools. You have to apply/test to get into these schools though. The problem is shown in the "normal" schools, which unfortunately have become warehouses for underperforming students and those with special needs. These are the schools with the bad state report cards, which then pull down the district averages. Point is, high quality education can absolutely be found in the city public schools, and its unfair to drag them (and the teachers) down.

 

Also, I was very impressed myself in seeing the news of how far they have increased the graduation rate - from 52.2% in 2011, the year before the transformation plan, to a district record of 80.1% for the class of 2019. They have also closed the racial gap, with black students graduating at a rate of 80.9%. 

https://www.clevelandmetroschools.org/site/default.aspx?PageType=3&DomainID=255&ModuleInstanceID=1887&ViewID=6446EE88-D30C-497E-9316-3F8874B3E108&RenderLoc=0&FlexDataID=31269&PageID=1027

There are plenty of K-8 Regular k-8 schools that provide a great education. My child goes to Campus International and it’s a great school with really intelligent kids. Our neighbor’s child goes to Near West, another really good school.

^ I imagine a lot of the kids are "really intelligent" at all of the schools in the district. Some just have better circumstances than others.

Edited October 31, 20204 yr by metrocity

This really makes no sense.  Cleveland teachers are fighting going back into the classroom to teach there citing health and safety concerns.  But they are going to be alone in the classroom, with no students initially.   I'm sure none of them are leaving their homes, and staying out of restaurants, bars and shops as well 🙄

 

Cleveland Teachers Union votes to remain with remote learning in spite of district mandating return

 

 

CLEVELAND — The Cleveland Teachers Union voted to remain with remote learning on Thursday night, in spite of the district saying hybrid learning will begin on March 8.

Cleveland Metropolitan School District CEO Eric Gordon mandated that all teachers are to return to their assigned work sites on Monday to teach remotely.

No students are scheduled to report in-person on Monday and all classes are scheduled to continue virtually.

 

https://www.news5cleveland.com/cleveland teachers union votes to remain with remote learning in spite of district mandating return?fbclid=IwAR0gkMIb2lBZaKHVzBXjp6PvncsDWUsaYbj5L2LtKKoMleQ0O1v5vaMK9-s

While there are some questionable charter schools in Cleveland, there are also many terrific private schools that kids can get into tuition-free. In fact, we live in Lakewood but my son goes to school in Cleveland. He tested in to Menlo Park Academy at West 53rd and Walworth Avenue (old Joseph & Feiss factory) which is tuition-free and also offers free transportation to kids from wherever they live including as far away as Strongsville. And Menlo offers free lunches to qualifying families and even ships them to families whose kids are learning from home during the pandemic. Our son never did remote learning as Menlo offered an in-school learning lab for parents who wanted their kids to learn in school with their friends. I am so grateful we had this experience because Lakewood schools were closed for much of the pandemic. Lakewood just started to reopen schools about a month ago but only for a few days a week.

 

^ Lakewood schools have been on a hybrid model since January and will be 5 days a week starting 3/15. 

54 minutes ago, Cleburger said:

This really makes no sense.  Cleveland teachers are fighting going back into the classroom to teach there citing health and safety concerns.  But they are going to be alone in the classroom, with no students initially.   I'm sure none of them are leaving their homes, and staying out of restaurants, bars and shops as well 🙄

 

Cleveland Teachers Union votes to remain with remote learning in spite of district mandating return

 

 

CLEVELAND — The Cleveland Teachers Union voted to remain with remote learning on Thursday night, in spite of the district saying hybrid learning will begin on March 8.

Cleveland Metropolitan School District CEO Eric Gordon mandated that all teachers are to return to their assigned work sites on Monday to teach remotely.

No students are scheduled to report in-person on Monday and all classes are scheduled to continue virtually.

 

https://www.news5cleveland.com/cleveland teachers union votes to remain with remote learning in spite of district mandating return?fbclid=IwAR0gkMIb2lBZaKHVzBXjp6PvncsDWUsaYbj5L2LtKKoMleQ0O1v5vaMK9-s

I'm a big supporter of unions but the teachers union here is being unreasonable.  Cleveland students already face disparities and this will just exacerbate it. They all were offered vaccinations, theres no reason to hold out any longer. 

Never heard of the CTA until now...

 

 

 

I'm sure this will solve all the problems in Cleveland.

 

https://www.cleveland.com/news/2021/12/seven-cleveland-schools-some-named-for-slaveholders-to-be-renamed.html

21 minutes ago, LibertyBlvd said:

I'm sure this will solve all the problems in Cleveland.

 

https://www.cleveland.com/news/2021/12/seven-cleveland-schools-some-named-for-slaveholders-to-be-renamed.html

so, we can't make any changes until every problem is solved?

25 minutes ago, LibertyBlvd said:

I'm sure this will solve all the problems in Cleveland.

 

https://www.cleveland.com/news/2021/12/seven-cleveland-schools-some-named-for-slaveholders-to-be-renamed.html

I don't think anyone is arguing it will solve all the problems in Cleveland. Just this very specific problem. 

1 hour ago, Luke_S said:

I don't think anyone is arguing it will solve all the problems in Cleveland. Just this very specific problem. 

I completely disagree with removing Jefferson's name. The role he played in creating this country speaks for itself. We can't apply 21st century viewpoints to 18th century figures. Abraham Lincoln would be a white supremacist if we were to critique his viewpoints under a 21st century microscope.

19 minutes ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said:

I completely disagree with removing Jefferson's name. The role he played in creating this country speaks for itself. We can't apply 21st century viewpoints to 18th century figures. Abraham Lincoln would be a white supremacist if we were to critique his viewpoints under a 21st century microscope.

I'll agree some men in history deserve a nuanced understand to be able to recognize both their great accomplishments and terrible deeds. However, monuments and buildings rarely provide context for this nuanced discussion and I think that is the point that is often lost in these conversations. 

 

Also, removing a name from a building isn't the same this as removing the individual from the curriculum. (Not that you are suggesting it is.)

Edited December 30, 20213 yr by Luke_S

Jon Meacham, imo, has summed up this issue better than anyone I'd ever heard:

 

https://www.yahoo.com/now/historian-jon-meacham-weighs-significance-184359671.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAIyru2P6scpxQ1WXAaYqpEIlCZXfsXq-jE2P8Op-rz1DRqS2FAdFiFfQuM3ygXW_DvETrAF4ufOSev3L6FY_N_vwwc-QmFpcqosbE8vvtkO0ka2kcV1QcsNISqRZB1wKwFfNG9LHuu41I8x30gLC-ApL5fQeodX5TyvLNK7AS9DF

2 hours ago, freefourur said:

so, we can't make any changes until every problem is solved?

Just a little sarcasm.  Seems like there are more pressing problems in Cleveland and in our country right now.

 

Edited December 30, 20213 yr by LibertyBlvd

Just now, LibertyBlvd said:

Just a little sarcasm.  Seems like there are more pressing problems in Cleveland right now.

I think we can walk and chew gum at the same time. 

8 hours ago, Luke_S said:

I think we can walk and chew gum at the same time. 

Have you seen the government the last 40 years? 

Eric Gordon stepping down as CMSD CEO at the end of the school year. He did a great job for a long time, but the extended closure / “remote learning” of CMSD during the pandemic was/is pretty disastrous. It’s really bad that Cleveland school children lost an entire year+ of school while suburban and charter schools were open in the Fall of 2020 and on. 

 

 

He really was in an impossible position, as most teachers are on a daily basis. Crappy kids, crappy parents, crappy administrators, crappy pay, crappy hours, crappy funding, crappy COVID, hated/feared by half the country, terrorized/taken for granted by big chunks of the other half.

 

God help us, what a profession. Other countries must be positively dumbfounded.

1 hour ago, TBideon said:

He really was in an impossible position, as most teachers are on a daily basis. Crappy kids, crappy parents, crappy administrators, crappy pay, crappy hours, crappy funding, crappy COVID, hated/feared by half the country, terrorized/taken for granted by big chunks of the other half.

 

God help us, what a profession. Other countries must be positively dumbfounded.

 

There's big parallels between the way the unions dominated the automotive industry in the 50s and 60s and the way they dominate public education now.   The reckoning isn't as clear cut as it was then.

Im ecstatic to see any and every remnant of the Jackson Administration fall under Bibb.

 

Bibbs affinity for Charter Schools may have been a core issue at play here however

23 hours ago, Boomerang_Brian said:

Eric Gordon stepping down as CMSD CEO at the end of the school year. He did a great job for a long time, but the extended closure / “remote learning” of CMSD during the pandemic was/is pretty disastrous. It’s really bad that Cleveland school children lost an entire year+ of school while suburban and charter schools were open in the Fall of 2020 and on. 

 

Even suburban schools were not universally open.

 

Several of my son's classmates at his Catholic K-8 school came there from suburban schools that were still not open 5 days a week in-person as of fall 2020, and in fact I think a few weren't even back to 5-day in-person schooling in fall 2021, though (this is horrible) my memory has blurred together so much that I can't even completely remember.

 

My son's school was mask-mandatory for the 2020-2021 school year and mask-optional with a strong culture in favor of masking (one of the only places where I've seen "masks recommended" actually have effect, as opposed to being interpreted as "masks no longer required, so get rid of them") for the first half or two-thirds of the 2021-2022 school year, at least into the Omicron wave.  But aside from the end of the 2019-2020 school year (i.e., March 2020 to the end of that school year), they never went fully remote.  That became a major selling point that brought new students in, even non-Catholic ones, and not just from Akron Public.  One of my son's best friends in the school is a Copley kid that we'd almost certainly never have met but for COVID.

 

It's true that the central urban public school systems were generally even slower to reopen than suburban public school systems, but I don't think it's true that "suburban and charter schools were open in the Fall of 2020 and on."

3 hours ago, Gramarye said:

 

Even suburban schools were not universally open.

 

Several of my son's classmates at his Catholic K-8 school came there from suburban schools that were still not open 5 days a week in-person as of fall 2020, and in fact I think a few weren't even back to 5-day in-person schooling in fall 2021, though (this is horrible) my memory has blurred together so much that I can't even completely remember.

 

My son's school was mask-mandatory for the 2020-2021 school year and mask-optional with a strong culture in favor of masking (one of the only places where I've seen "masks recommended" actually have effect, as opposed to being interpreted as "masks no longer required, so get rid of them") for the first half or two-thirds of the 2021-2022 school year, at least into the Omicron wave.  But aside from the end of the 2019-2020 school year (i.e., March 2020 to the end of that school year), they never went fully remote.  That became a major selling point that brought new students in, even non-Catholic ones, and not just from Akron Public.  One of my son's best friends in the school is a Copley kid that we'd almost certainly never have met but for COVID.

 

It's true that the central urban public school systems were generally even slower to reopen than suburban public school systems, but I don't think it's true that "suburban and charter schools were open in the Fall of 2020 and on."

This is useful information. My kids schools (Solon) were open in the Fall of 2020 with a fully remote option. 21-22 was entirely in person. Masks were mandatory for 20-21, and I think all of 21-22, and now are optional with maybe 15-20% of kids masking. Based on my experience and what I’ve read, it seemed most suburban schools were open, so it is interesting to get some counter examples. My bigger point is that in poorer districts people are even more dependent on schools, so the decision for CMSD to be closed so long was, in hindsight, a massive mistake and it is fair to criticize leaders for those decisions. Something like 8000 kids out of 35k total student population were absent for huge portions of that time period. We need massive interventions to make up for the learning loss and I’m not seeing any efforts to do so. It’s extremely concerning to think about all the negative ramifications of the school closures. 

If it sounds too good to be true ...  I always wondered about the details of this program.  The "then we sent all the money to New York" part was a special concern.

 

https://www.crainscleveland.com/education/say-yes-cleveland-faces-funding-gap-45-million-year

CMSD has found its next CEO

 

Warren Morgan named new Cleveland schools CEO

RACHEL ABBEY MCCAFFERTY 

May 09, 2023 11:02 AM

 

Quote

The Cleveland Board of Education and Cleveland Mayor Justin Bibb made the announcement at a news conference at Garrett Morgan High School the morning of Tuesday, May 9.

 

Morgan is currently the chief academic officer for the Indianapolis Public Schools, where he "oversees the academic vision, strategy, and policies of the district," an earlier news release stated.

 

He served as a network leader for Cleveland's phase 2 investment schools from July 2014 through August 2016. Morgan, who grew up in Chicago, also previously served as a White House Fellow under Presidents Obama and Trump.

https://www.crainscleveland.com/education/warren-morgan-picked-lead-cleveland-school-district

A more detailed write up on Warren Morgan, and available for those without a Crain's subscription, form Ideastream.

 

Warren Morgan will be the next Cleveland schools CEO

Ideastream Public Media | By Conor Morris

Published May 9, 2023 at 10:06 AM EDT

Updated May 9, 2023 at 12:45 PM EDT

Warren Morgan’s 100 day plan for Cleveland Schools

by Paul Rochford

 

"Cleveland Schools’ next CEO, Warren Morgan, came to his job interviews prepared. Most notably, he brought a plan for his first 100 days on the job. Now that he’s in, Signal Cleveland asked for a copy. In a series of PowerPoint slides, Morgan outlines his ideas for a district-wide listening tour and “culture audit” of each district school.

 

Morgan’s first 100 days officially begin July 1.

 

Morgan shared his leadership philosophy during his first news conference last week. It centers around what he calls the “three L’s,” listening, learning and leading. 

 

The slides structure his first 100 days into four phases, a pre-entry phase, and one for each “L.”"

 

https://signalcleveland.org/warren-morgan-100-day-plan/

Cleveland school district bringing back buses for 7th and 8th graders

by Paul Rochford

 

"This week, CMSD announced it is bringing back yellow school buses for 7th and 8th graders this school year. The return to district-provided rides was made possible by $7 million in federal COVID relief money, which allowed the district to purchase 80 new buses.

 

...

 

Prior to the purchase of the new buses, only about 220 of the district’s 300 buses were running, Eric Taylor, CMSD’s executive director of transportation, told Signal Cleveland. Of the buses that were working, many were dedicated to transporting students attending charter schools and other nonpublic schools, a responsibility that state law puts on the school district.

 

Since the 2014-15 school year, middle school students who live more than a mile from their school, with the exception of popular city-wide-draw K-8 schools such as Campus International, have been given passes to ride public transportation. High school students also have access to the passes."

 

https://signalcleveland.org/cleveland-school-district-adds-new-buses-for-7th-and-8th-graders/ 

This is fantastic news!

 

https://www.ideastream.org/education/2024-09-16/cleveland-schools-says-its-meeting-ohio-report-card-standards-for-the-first-time