Hey guys- some great info on these forums that has helped me a lot

 

I'm going to be starting at the Clinic and am looking to buy a place- Price isn't necessarily an issue up to 300k assuming it's a sound real estate investment- I'll be staying for 6 years

 

 

I've narrowed it down to the following areas but don't have much in depth "insider" knowledge:

Cleveland Heights- New construction across from Severance Circle= Bluestone- I really liked these ones but my concerns are the following:  the neighborhood and safety; also these are the priciest of what I'm looking at and I don't have a lot of confidence in the housing market, so I'm thinking maybe buy into something a little less expensive

Shaker Heights- New construction near Shaker Square= Avalon Lofts- Seems like a really cool place once it'll all be done, and the surrounding area seems nice- Again my concerns are: safety and the surrounding neighborhood as well as the market forecast

 

From these 2 I have more faith in the Shaker market

 

Lakewood- This is where I'm leaning now because I found a lot of really nicely priced condos in highrises along the Gold Coast as well as close to the Rocky River border- Plus just driving around town I was really feeling the vibe I got; The areas around where I'm looking didn't seem that safety would be a real issue

The one issue where I do feel Lakewood has the advantage (from an outsiders perspective) is the housing stability- mainly bc it is a lower risk investment at these prices and with the Lake views I'm hoping that at the very least I break even, whereas in Shaker/Cleveland I feel theres a real chance I could be in a messy situation down the road..

 

My potential concerns with Lakewood would be the commute- I would prob be heading to work really early (6-6:30ish) so I don't think that would be a problem... How is Chester Ave in the morning? MLK? The afternoon commute I could avoid most days just by studying a little bit extra at the Clinic to let rush hour die down- plus I would rather commute 20 minutes on the highway (lakewood) vs 12-15 on local roads (Shaker- is this accurate?)

 

I'd appreciate anybodys thoughts- especially on the safety issues for the specific areas (gold coast/shaker square/severance circle) and opinions/experience about the housing market + forecast

 

Also if there are any other areas that you guys think I would like- (urban feel with suburban convenience- safe areas- commute up to 20 if highway, 15 if not)

 

Thanks

Major,

 

If you are interested in housing appreciation, I think that you are missing out by not considering Cleveland. For example, a couple of units at Stonebridge appreciate about 25-30% percent in just one year. With the Lakewood high rises, I think that those don't sell like they used to because many of those prospective buyers are now looking at other options downtown or close to downtown.  Also, don't forget abou the tax abatement in Cleveland that will give you a lot more buying power (or it will lower your monthly payment greatly).

 

Also, when it comes to new construction in Shaker and Cleveland Hts, they usually sell decently. Its the older properties that are slower sellers.

 

Lastly, you need to give us some better guidance. It appears that you are looking for maintenance free living. Does nightlife interest you? In regards to safety, it appears that you may be worrying a bit too much about the regions that you'll selected. You'll going to get a lot for your money with $300,000. Do you have to spend that much? You might be able to get something very nice with 200k. How many bedrooms are you looking for? Have you looked at Shaker Square in Cleveland? There are some great bargains in an area with fantastic amenities. Lastly, have you read all of the other relocation threads?

 

By the way, what type of residency is going to keep you for 6 years? Is there a fellowship involved as well?

hi major.  welcome and just for a reference on safety, what city and neighborhood do you currently live.  so we can give you some comparisons.

 

the Avalon Station development is entirely in Shaker Hts, not on/near Shaker Square.  You can get to shaker square via the blue line train in about 5-7 minutes or drive.

 

The new developments at severance are really nice.  

 

Both Cleveland heights and Shaker hts are very safe.  Have you considered looking at Shaker Square proper?  Shaker Square is a 5/10 bus ride from the Clinic, with service every 10 minutes.

 

Just so you don't get confused, Shaker Square (and its sub neighborhoods, buckeye and larchmere) is a neighborhood in Cleveland.  Shaker Square borders the suburbs of Shaker Hts and to some degree Cleveland Heights.

Major,

 

Where are you coming from? It can help us in understanding your point of reference. NYC or small town Tenneessee--it helps put things into perspective.  Otherwise, congrats on your Clinic appointment. Hope your saving up on your sleep for the next few years.

Hi Major and Welcome to Cleveland.

 

As suggested above you might want to let us know where you are coming from so we can obtain a better idea of what you like.

 

Also, as noted, the Avalon Lofts are not on Shaker Square, which is about 1 1/2 mile away, but in Shaker Hts. in the Van Aken -Lee neighborhood.  Both Shaker Hts and Cleveland Hts are safe areas (you really seem to emphasize this in your post as  you mention it a number to times...it got to be somewhat curious).  You will face petty larceny and the like but very little in the way of violent crimes.  You can walk the streets of both cities in the dead of night with comfort.  Will I am not a  west sider I am pretty confident the Gold Coast is very safe as well.

 

Hard to judge appreciation as many factors go into it.  You should be advised however that housing appreciation in Cleveland in general is lower than many parts of the nation so don't expect to make a killing.  My advice to you is that you should focus on other factors when considering where you want to live for 6 years and invest you $$$ in other vehicles if that is a big issue with you.  On the plus side you get much more bang for your buck in Cleveland.  I live in a relatively new townhouse development in Cleveland Hts (about five years old...by the way...going back to the appreciate issue...a couple of buyers who bought them new recently sold and in three years the market appreciation was about 5% for both units) and one of my neighbors just sold her house due to a transfer to Chicago.  She said to duplicate her well appointed three story Cleveland Hts towhouse in the Lincoln Park neighborhood of Chicago was going to cost her double what paid for her house here

 

The Gold Coast is great if being by the lake is important to you.  However, I really don't think many of the units in the high rises right on the lake are that special and are beginning to show their age (they were built in the mid 60s...I am not a real estate expert but I doubt the appreciation on those units are that great, especially since there are so many of them and they are pretty generic).  As far as travel is concern, while part of your trip would be on the freeway, you would still have to take surface streets to get to the Clinic.  I imagine the trip will take at a minimum 20-25 minutes from the Gold Coast depending how far down the line you are.

 

You seem to have a preference for newer construction so I think Avalon Station is a good choice as your ride to the Clinic would only be about 10 minutes and you would be right on the rapid line for trips downtown.  You also might want to check at a new condo development which is going up in  the heart of the Cedar Lee neighborhood of Cleveland Hts (it use to be called Domain on Lee...don't know if that is still the case) although occupancy will not be possible for more than a couple of years.  Don't know much about Blue Stone but it does look nice and the construction appears to be quality.  Again safety is not an issue there.

thanks for the replies- I appreciate the input

 

For some background I'm coming from suburban Long Island and I have extensive experience in NYC (although I've never actually lived there)...and by NYC I mean Manhattan..

 

what I'm looking for is an area thats not dead...where I can come home from work and with the (limited) free time I have be able to go to a bookstore/coffee shop and read for a bit..or go to the park for a jog...and follow that up with a quick stop at the killer sandwich shop...and as far as partying/clubbing- I'm not that much of a partyer anymore, more occasional- I much rather prefer eating out at a nice restaurant, or spending the weekend walking around maybe shopping or just checkin out the sights

 

 

I guess I exaggerated my safety concerns a little bit- I like to think I'm pretty street smart, and I'm not that small of a guy  :wink:

 

What I was more paranoid about was little things-like being able to park my car without worrying about it, or running out at night to grab something at Heinen's without having to look over my shoulder, etc..

 

I'm probably leaning Lakewood vs Shaker Heights-

 

What I meant about my perception of Lakewood appreciation was that it seems I can get a pretty solid renovated 2 br/2ba highrise condo for 120k-180k with a lake view...It just seems to me that a property like that won't end up depreciating and at the very least stabilize so that I break relatively even

 

As far as Avalon goes- the units I would want are priced at about 230-240 so that is def reasonable- my perception of the Shaker outlook is that it has the best potential to appreciate...would it end up being about 12-15 min? (bc I HATE stop and go traffic)

 

The Cleveland Heights property is the priciest and also the least attractive area imo- at least until u get to coventry/murray hill

 

I did consider downtown, but I just think it would end up being a hassle for me ( I'd like visiting downtown, but not living)

 

One area in Cleveland that you should look into is the area around W. 65th between Detroit and the lakeshore.  My brother bought a place there about 10 years ago and it was very safe then.  There is a whole lot of development about to happen there (check out the gordon Sq. thread http://www.urbanohio.com/forum2/index.php?topic=2873.0) and if you want real-estate appriciation, IMHO, this is the area that will just explode.

 

Hmm, I guess I can speak for the Gold Coast, although I'm renting a $625 apartment across the street from all of the towers. This is a very nice place to live; it's quiet and lively at the same time. With the density, the streets aren't "dead," even when it gets cold in the winter. The summer is the best, of course. I typically walk west during the week toward Lakewood Park and snoop out the big houses. During the weekends, I go to Edgewater Park, which would be a convenient bike ride or rollerblade trip away for you. During the summer, this a great, diverse place to be.

 

As far as crime goes, there's nothing happening here that would alarm you. Real estate? I'm pretty sure any of the desirable neighborhoods in Cleveland, Lakewood or Shaker, etc. are going to appreciate over six years. I'm not a real estate agent, though, so maybe someone can speak to this.

 

The one thing that's a pain about Lakewood, and it makes no sense because this city is so dense, is the retail options stink for some essential stuff like books, clothes, etc. Frankly, Tremont is getting my attention for possible relocation next year because it feels more "well-rounded," although it's not as dense and technically "safe" as Lakewood. Don't know if that helps!

 

There are so many great things to see and experience here. It'll be fun!

Major, the more information you share the better we can help you, let me say there is no BETTER COMMUNITY on the net to obtain information about OHIO than URBAN OHIO.  We're going to give it to you straight and realistic.

 

Where on Long Island, there are many of us here that a) live in NYC b) relocated to Cleveland from NYC or c) live in both places.

 

Based on what you said, the Coventry or Cedar-Fairmont areas of Cleveland Heights or Shaker Square sound like neighborhoods you might like.  Living in Cleveland Heights or Shaker Heights (where I grew up) is similar to Huntington, Brentwood, Deerpark or Bergen County New Jersey. Some portions of Cleveland Heights & Shaker Heights rival the Hamptons. Shaker Square puts you in the mind of Forest Hills in Queens or Park Slope/Cobble Hill (sans brownstones) in Brooklyn.

 

Clevelands tax abatement is a lovely thing and if you bought in Shaker Square (where I and several others here do) you could find a great home for 230k.  In my complex you could get close to 2100 sq. for 180k.  The shaker lakes is adjacent to Shaker Square and splits cleveland heights and shaker heights.

 

The Cedar-Fairmont, Little Italy and Shaker Square areas would put you very very close to the Clinic.

 

I would suggest looking in the photo threads and searching for Shaker Square and Cleveland Heights.

thanks for the responses-

 

hmm...so Shaker square is different- what complexes are out there? are they relatively new? I'm looking for a condo suite that is pretty modern- do any of the other areas u mentioned meet those criteria? I was REALLY feeling the drive down Fairmount Blvd, but it seemed like mostly stand alone houses

 

 

just to clarify on the appreciation front: I realize that Cleveland isn't a real estate mecca, and I'm not necessarily looking to find the next hidden gem

 

But I also don't want to end up in a mess down the road...I'd much rather prefer stable property values (which it would seem lakewood would be)

 

so basically I'm more worried about avoiding potential "risks" rather than finding potential "rewards"

^^ Good thoughts. I thought I read that all Cleveland real estate was "going up." I think any half-way decent hood wouldn't implode on you. I guess you would want to stay away from the ones with excessive foreclosures? This is outside my knowledge base!

thanks for the responses-

 

hmm...so Shaker square is different- what complexes are out there? are they relatively new? I'm looking for a condo suite that is pretty modern- do any of the other areas u mentioned meet those criteria? I was REALLY feeling the drive down Fairmount Blvd, but it seemed like mostly stand alone houses

 

 

just to clarify on the appreciation front: I realize that Cleveland isn't a real estate mecca, and I'm not necessarily looking to find the next hidden gem

 

But I also don't want to end up in a mess down the road...I'd much rather prefer stable property values (which it would seem lakewood would be)

 

so basically I'm more worried about avoiding potential "risks" rather than finding potential "rewards"

 

HELLO.....Is this thing on?  Please check the photo threads.

 

The majority of Shaker Squares buildings are pre war, think Central Park West, Gramercy Park, Tudor City, Riverside Drive or Brooklyn Heights.  However, there are new developments in the area as well.  look at this thread:  http://www.urbanohio.com/forum2/index.php?topic=12121.0

 

If you do a search for condos in area code 44120 you'll see some very nice properties, new and old.  My cousin lives in the same complex I do, and his place appreciated about 9% over the year.

 

Fairmont Blvd, is old money and is primarily single family homes until you get to the Cedar Road.  That area of cleveland heights is called "cedar-fairmont" and is nice.

I'd avoid the Bluestone property. Most Clev Heights properties..other than some of the new town homes are moving slow. There are a lot of sleazy lendors and resulting repos in the area. That said, it is not unsafe at all.  The areas north of Mayfield (which bluestone is) has even depreciated in some cases according a frd I have in the neighborhood. I also have my own horror story or trying to unload a clev heights property. If you look at realtor.com you will see the market is glutted with single family homes. I think you should check out progressiveurban.com to see some of the more urban properties. There are some really cool lofts on Larchemere near Shaker Square (name anyone?). I love that street. Yeah there is some edginess in the area, but very walkable for the most part.  I agree with your assessment of Shaker Square over Cleveland Heights for appreciation and resale.

 

When you get up over 300k in Cleveland expect the possibility of it sitting on the market a little longer. I can understand people with odd schedules-ie leaving or coming home in the middle of the night would be esp concerned with safety. Many of the urban properties have attached garages which is nice.  I agree living in Cleveland could be a smart move as urban properties are moving (unless really high end) and appreciating well.  All in all given where you are working I would start with Shaker Square and not go any further west than the gold coast-which is pushing it and probably unneeded (although recreation is great around there).  I honestly think your needs can be met near Shaker Square There are some gorgeous condos/lofts in Little Italy as well. some are real bigs $$$ though, but they seem to move when it is selling time. I think Little Italy is real safe as well.

I dont think that area of Cleveland Heights is that bad.  And sleazy realtors aren't the real problem. 

 

What areas north have depreciated, I'm under the impression that some of those homes, especially in the caldonia are are appreciating as young families/first time buyers move in.  That Rockefeller area is gorgeous.

 

Shaker Square is the most walkable and transit friendly neighborhood in Cleveland.

 

The lofts on Larchmere are called Larchmere lofts and Larchmere courts:  http://www.larchmerecourt.com/index_files/Page536.htm

^I don't think the realtors are sleazy but the lendors. The rockefellers are perhaps an exception to the rule around there. I got sadly familiar with the ins and out of CH real estate and a lot of neighborhoods are hard to move homes in. In case I wasnt clear I DO think it is safe in 99% of the  heights. I can only think of a couple streets that had safety issues. 

You might also want to look at Battery Park in the Detroit Shoreway neighborhood.

 

thanks for the responses-

 

hmm...so Shaker square is different- what complexes are out there? are they relatively new? I'm looking for a condo suite that is pretty modern- do any of the other areas u mentioned meet those criteria? I was REALLY feeling the drive down Fairmount Blvd, but it seemed like mostly stand alone houses

 

 

just to clarify on the appreciation front: I realize that Cleveland isn't a real estate mecca, and I'm not necessarily looking to find the next hidden gem

 

But I also don't want to end up in a mess down the road...I'd much rather prefer stable property values (which it would seem lakewood would be)

 

so basically I'm more worried about avoiding potential "risks" rather than finding potential "rewards"

 

yo

I'd avoid the Bluestone property. Most Clev Heights properties..other than some of the new town homes are moving slow. There are a lot of sleazy lendors and resulting repos in the area. That said, it is not unsafe at all.  The areas north of Mayfield (which bluestone is) has even depreciated in some cases according a frd I have in the neighborhood. I also have my own horror story or trying to unload a clev heights property. If you look at realtor.com you will see the market is glutted with single family homes. I think you should check out progressiveurban.com to see some of the more urban properties. There are some really cool lofts on Larchemere near Shaker Square (name anyone?). I love that street. Yeah there is some edginess in the area, but very walkable for the most part.  I agree with your assessment of Shaker Square over Cleveland Heights for appreciation and resale.

 

When you get up over 300k in Cleveland expect the possibility of it sitting on the market a little longer. I can understand people with odd schedules-ie leaving or coming home in the middle of the night would be esp concerned with safety. Many of the urban properties have attached garages which is nice.   I agree living in Cleveland could be a smart move as urban properties are moving (unless really high end) and appreciating well.  All in all given where you are working I would start with Shaker Square and not go any further west than the gold coast-which is pushing it and probably unneeded (although recreation is great around there).  I honestly think your needs can be met near Shaker Square There are some gorgeous condos/lofts in Little Italy as well. some are real bigs $$$ though, but they seem to move when it is selling time. I think Little Italy is real safe as well.

You might also want to look at Battery Park in the Detroit Shoreway neighborhood.

 

hmm...I searched for more info online and on these forums but I can't seem to find any availability/progress

 

I contacted through their website so maybe I'll hear back soon

 

How does this area compare to Lakewood and Shaker Heights?

 

I'll try to do a drive-by on Saturday

although I've never lived on the westside, I personally don't seen any connection or comparison to Lakewood.  Certain parts of Shaker Hts./Cleveland Hts. do have similarities to Lakewood, but I think the Heights is more upper middle class, upper class and Lakewood as middle class to upper middle class.  That's just my take.

 

Others who've lived in both cities or visited both cities more frequently might have different opinions.

Here's the web link to Battery Park, which is a new neighborhood under construction on the 13-acre site of a former Eveready Battery plant...

 

http://www.batteryparkcleveland.com/

If you're looking at Lakewood, I would definitely check out the new construction at Rockport Square, on Detroit a few blocks west of 117th.  New 2 bed 2 bath townhouses, move-in ready, in the 279k range.

www.rockportsquare.com

 

When I was looking at condos in Cleveland on realtyone.com, I came across two for sale in the Shaker Square area called Southington Manor - looked very nice for the $209k, new construction, but there's a house for sale two blocks away on E. 134th for 36k so I'll defer to one of the Shaker experts on whether or not these are worth looking at.

http://www.rysar.com/availableliving/ProjectDetail.asp?DevId=7

 

 

 

 

When I was looking at condos in Cleveland on realtyone.com, I came across two for sale in the Shaker Square area called Southington Manor - looked very nice for the $209k, new construction, but there's a house for sale two blocks away on E. 134th for 36k so I'll defer to one of the Shaker experts on whether or not these are worth looking at.

http://www.rysar.com/availableliving/ProjectDetail.asp?DevId=7

 

Thats Shaker Heights, bordering the southern most portion of the Shaker Square neighborhood.  Its a (walk) to Shaker Square but not considered "on or in the heart the square".

 

Clvlndr, your take on this project?

just to confirm (b/c the website doesn't contain specific info)- the Battery Park is between 73-76 street, by Detroit Rd?

 

I'm also planning on checking out the Larchmere lofts/townhomes this weekend

 

 

I'm also planning on checking out the Larchmere lofts/townhomes this weekend

 

Good man!!

Re: Battery Park/Detroit Shoreway

 

How is the area there safety wise? surrounding areas?

 

How are the retail options? (coffee shops/places to chill) Are they easy to access? (walkability)

 

How does the area compare to the Warehouse District (Condos that are promising- but seems like theres too much "hustle and bustle" and noise there at times/nights)

 

 

Battery Park is closest to the lake, across from Edgewater park (more or less).  Gordon Square is right there as well.  One of the coolest bars in Cleveland (IMHO) the Parkview is right there.  Also the guys who own the Treehouse (who along with Lola 10 years ago helped to put Tremont on the map) are sinking over 2million into a pub on 65th.

For a coffee shop, the Gypsy bean coffee shop is right there on the corner.

 

What is happening in that stretch of Cleveland is there are taking a highway and converting it back to a 35mph boulevard.  It is opening a lot of development possibilities and many people, the local movers, shakers and hipsters, are settling into the area.

 

If I were to move back to Cleveland, this is the area I would live in.  Anywhere north of Detroit is going to be safe and will only get safer.

Re: Battery Park/Detroit Shoreway

 

How is the area there safety wise? surrounding areas?

 

How are the retail options? (coffee shops/places to chill) Are they easy to access? (walkability)

 

How does the area compare to the Warehouse District (Condos that are promising- but seems like theres too much "hustle and bustle" and noise there at times/nights)

 

 

 

Major have you looked at any of the picture threads?

The Battery Park area is interesting. Its an area that is in the midst of a tremendous transition. Currently, the retail options are pretty poor and Detroit is pretty sad looking. However, a very nice coffee shop just opened. An art movie theater will be opening next summer and other things are on the way as well. I think that the coolest thing is how Batttery Park will be linked directly into Edgewater Park once the Shoreway is turned into a boulevard. I would have bought there but there are units large enough for a growing family.

so wait-

 

they're converting the west shoreway and leaving east intact? I'd imagine a 3 mile stretch should just about take you past Browns stadium

 

I'm wondering how that would affect my commute

 

I'm checking out the area tomorrow so I should have a better idea of what Battery Park is all about

If you were to live in Battery Park, the conversion of the Shoreway into a boulevard really shouldn't cost you more than 2-3 minutes.  You'd face possibly one-two additional intersections, depending on the final design of the new boulevard and where you decide to access the Boulevard from Battery Park.  Actually, come to think of it, I'm not even sure the fastest way to the Cleveland Clinic from Battery Park would be the Shoreway.  It might be Detroit Rd. through downtown to Chester or Euclid. 

Taking the surface roads from Battery Park to The Clinic will take forever due to all the red lights, not to mention construction going on downtown. Your best bet would be to take the shoreway 'til it turns to I-90 then get off on MLK BLVD. I think there is only 2 lights once you get on MLK and obviously none on 90 versus 7 million on the surface streets.

another advantage to the Shoreway/MLK route is NO RED LIGHT/SPEED CAMERAS (Chester has 3, Carnegie has 3) - not that the city is targeting rich hospital employees at CCF/UH or anything... but you won't find any on Kinsman, Woodland, or Clark Avenues.  They know who has money to pay tickets and who doesn't.

another advantage to the Shoreway/MLK route is NO RED LIGHT/SPEED CAMERAS (Chester has 3, Carnegie has 3) - not that the city is targeting rich hospital employees at CCF/UH or anything... but you won't find any on Kinsman, Woodland, or Clark Avenues.  They know who has money to pay tickets and who doesn't.

That was uncalled for, where you live is not always an indicator of you economic status.

 

If you drive the speed limit you don't have to worry about traffic tickets.  I personally wish there were more.

 

....back on topic now....

I take it you don't drive too much?

:wink:

 

(for the record I have not rec' a ticket in years and do not endorse speeding)

It is incorrect to say that Chester and Carnegie do tend to turn into "freeways", where I have often seen disregard for speed and traffic signals....?

I take it you don't drive too much?

:wink:

 

(for the record I have not rec' a ticket in years and do not endorse speeding)

I haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaate driving!

 

I live in SS so I take the train downtown or the bus to Univ Circle.  The train to my parents house.  I only drive during bad weather or if im going out late at night or have the kids and we're going shopping.

 

 

It is incorrect to say that Chester and Carnegie do tend to turn into "freeways", where I have often seen disregard for speed and traffic signals....?

 

Yes

 

But back on topic...........

Cleveland has 29-30 camera locations - 10 of them are in Midtown or University Circle along major commuting routes to University Circle/CCF; 7 more are at on-ramps/off-ramps to interstates.  In my opinion, the city is targeting suburban commuters - but maybe these are the most dangerous intersections in Cleveland, I don't know how the city chose them - I just try to avoid them if possible.

...end of rant, thanks.

id say thats a mix of both, the most dangerous intersections in cleveland are probably the result of high traffic from commuters from the suburbs

Just drive the speed limit like you are supposed to and you won't have a problem. I think that Chester is much safer (I drive it everyday) now that there are some cameras that keep people in check. You used to have some serious red light running that caused some serious issues.

ok- I really liked Battery Park

 

but, I'll be honest- the surrounding area did make me paranoid- I never got a bad feeling from Cleveland/Shaker Heights or Lakewood about the safety of the surrounding area, but everything south of Battery Park(including the parts of Detroit that I saw) left a bad impression on me

 

Including large stretches west before Lakewood

 

It didn't help that in one of the threads on these forums, there were apparently 3 homicides within 2 blocks...and about 3-4 within a few blocks...

 

Any thoughts?

Yes, I agree with you about the stretch of Detroit between Lakewood and Battery Park. Here are my thoughts:

 

-two of the homicides were part of a strange and sad incident at a condo. A renowned artist condo owner complained about another tenant's excessive music. The guy responded by killing her and a janitor. Very sad and very scary.

-The area south of Detroit is rough, but there has been some development that's been going there in past few years. In my opinion, that area will slowly get better.

-Detroit in that area looks bad. As Battery Park gets built out, more retailers will locate on Detroit--especially with the new Art moviehouse opening up next year and the entire streetscape renovation--Detroit has some good momentum.

-Look for some of the homes between Detroit and Battery Park to start being bought up and being renovated.

-I really really like how Battery Park will have a street that will directly go into Edgewater Park as well as a much improved pedestrian tunnel (construction should begin in 2009). Also the Shoreway will be turned into a tree-lined boulevard with walking trails/sidewalks alongside it.

-I'd feel totally safe in Battery Park. I wouldn't feel too safe at night south of Detroit.

-on 65th just north of Detroit, there is a super cool Irish bar that will be opening up in June (well, at least I'm excited about it).

I think if you liked Battery Park trust your gut. Detroit shorway is really crazy in that it can have some high cirme areas, yet I am guessing Bat. Park will be insulated from that. I live in another urban pioneer area-the flats in a modern condo. Even though I am amidst a drug rehab center, a homeless drop in center and housing projects-in  2 years I have never had an issue or anything close to an issue-and I spend a lot of time out and about on the street (bike, walk, scooter).  The truth is I think if you are standing out more than the other residents you are LESS likely to be victimized. In fact Cleveland stats tend to reflect on poor on poor crime -tragic and unfortunate but this unlikely touch your life. the murder 3231 mentioned was really freaky b/c it was a one neighbor merely expressing concern to another. the thing is this was a pretty diverse building. basically a professional person confronting a seriously mentally ill , unemployed individual. not a typical scenario.

 

Chances are a neighborhood association/block club will quickly form to address any issues (this is what has happened in my area). Whether it is fair or not you will have more of a police presence than your more impovershed neighbors. Sure there will be the car break in, a bike that was casually left out front will be stolen  or some person will leave their garage open and be burgled. But violent crime?I am guessing no. What you will get is an awesome neighborhood-close to great restaurants, cafes,recreation, downtown, and pretty easy access to work.  I have no idea what the contruction quality and asthetics are...that would be the most important thing I would think about...the neighborhood- no major concerns. I think only good things are to come for Detroit Shoreway.

It didn't help that in one of the threads on these forums, there were apparently 3 homicides within 2 blocks...and about 3-4 within a few blocks...

 

Any thoughts?

 

These homicides also took the neighborhood by surprise. They even had a neighborhood-wide vigil in response as it took the entire neighborhood by surprise. If you look at the statistics over the past fiver years, you'll see a huge spike last year. Whether this is a developing trend or just an odd occurence, it'll take some time to figure that out.  Still, Battery Park will be insulated from this. Also, the areas just to the east and west of Battery park are already being eyed by developers to continue the residential momentum that BP is building.

thanks for the input guys-

 

I think I'm going to check out the Stonebridge condos as well- there seem to be some really reasonably priced suites available and it reminds me of the more "traditional" downtown setting

 

I've pretty much scratched Lakewood off the list bc if you take into account tax abatement/lending rebates(on some) and maintenance fees- you can prob go for a house thats 100k+ more than the Lakewood market

 

I wasn't really planning on living in downtown when I started the search but it seems theres def quality living available with relatively little risk

 

The only thing that would make me hesitant is, again the safety issue- but that's somethign I'll have to figure out for myself

how can you scream safety when you're from metro New York.  Crime can happen ANYWHERE

thanks for the input guys-

 

I think I'm going to check out the Stonebridge condos as well- there seem to be some really reasonably priced suites available and it reminds me of the more "traditional" downtown setting

 

I've pretty much scratched Lakewood off the list bc if you take into account tax abatement/lending rebates(on some) and maintenance fees- you can prob go for a house thats 100k+ more than the Lakewood market

 

I wasn't really planning on living in downtown when I started the search but it seems theres def quality living available with relatively little risk

 

The only thing that would make me hesitant is, again the safety issue- but that's somethign I'll have to figure out for myself

 

Honestly, I do kind of scratch my head when you mention that. NYC is NYC. How can you be thinking that Cleveland is more dangerous than NYC?

 

Have you looked into the Pinnacle on Lakeside in downtown? If you like modern construction with incredible lake views, this could be the place. Also, I think that its much quieter along this stretch of the Warehouse District than it would be along West 6th or West 9th. Not to mention that the Flats East Bank project will add a lot of awesome retail project to the neighborhood within two years...

 

Driving-wise, the Clinic is no more than 10 minutes of of traffic-free driving away.

thanks for the input guys-

 

I think I'm going to check out the Stonebridge condos as well- there seem to be some really reasonably priced suites available and it reminds me of the more "traditional" downtown setting

 

I've pretty much scratched Lakewood off the list bc if you take into account tax abatement/lending rebates(on some) and maintenance fees- you can prob go for a house thats 100k+ more than the Lakewood market

 

I wasn't really planning on living in downtown when I started the search but it seems theres def quality living available with relatively little risk

 

The only thing that would make me hesitant is, again the safety issue- but that's somethign I'll have to figure out for myself

 

www.progressiveurban.com is a great place to look for housing if you haven't already looked at it. I agree with what you say about Lakewood, there are a lot of Clevland projects that offer great tax abatement and reduce financing that make 300K units cost like 200k units.

 

Without really understanding your tasts...you might want to take a look at Franklin Lofts, Clinton Courts and Battery Park. These neighborhoods are fairly safe and offer a lot in terms of dining and parks.

well- I'm from suburban LI and my experience with city living has been Manhattan where I never felt unsafe even at 4am...

 

I guess my "fears" come from the fact that I'm not really experienced at all with the area- so I don't really know how to balance the downtown lifestyle with the specific surrounding areas- I have noticed a trend where I'll be in what I feel is a cool area, walk like 1-2 blocks and be in an area where I'd never go alone

 

In that sense- if I were to do downtown i would def prefer to be in the more traditional metro areas

 

something like in nyc- east side (20-70) or DC (Northern VA, Chinatown, etc)

 

The area by Cleveland Browns Stadium down Ontario/E9th (I think..) seems like an area where I'd say yeah its downtown, but I don't feel "unsafe"

well- I'm from suburban LI and my experience with city living has been Manhattan where I never felt unsafe even at 4am...

 

I guess my "fears" come from the fact that I'm not really experienced at all with the area- so I don't really know how to balance the downtown lifestyle with the specific surrounding areas- I have noticed a trend where I'll be in what I feel is a cool area, walk like 1-2 blocks and be in an area where I'd never go alone

 

In that sense- if I were to do downtown i would def prefer to be in the more traditional metro areas

 

something like in nyc- east side (20-70) or DC (Northern VA, Chinatown, etc)

 

The area by Cleveland Browns Stadium down Ontario/E9th (I think..) seems like an area where I'd say yeah its downtown, but I don't feel "unsafe"

 

 

Major, Cleveland is like any major city and crime can happen anywhere, just like Manhattan (which you indicated you are very familiar with) you can be on one block which is fine then walk to another which is questionable.

 

Many of the neighborhoods in Downtown Cleveland, or adjacent to  downtown are going thru a transition similar to what has taken place in Ft. Greene/Clinton Hill, Long Island City, Williamsburg, Morningside Heights, NYC or or Harlem to name a few.

 

Many of these neighborhoods are being repopulated (as downtown Cleveland has the fastest or second fastest growing downtown in the country, I forget now) with young people, people with small kids, gays/lesbians and creative people who just don't want to live in the 'burbs.

 

As these neighborhoods reinvent themselves, the people and business will definitely unite in order to take those areas to the next level.  In the next 1½-2 years these areas wont look like they do now, so please keep an open mind and put your fears about safety to rest.  That is not to say you shouldn't be aware of your surrounds and use common sense.

 

So please stop asking about the safety because you appear to be confusing the issue of "safety" with not being "familiar" with the areas and I suspect you're forming opinions about sections of the city without getting to know them.  This all leads back to what many of us have already said - - - RENT, learn the city then buy.

well, the good news is I found an area I think I would like the best...

 

the bad news is- it's W Lakeside ave and is way out of my price range

 

At this point I'm going to look into newer condos in the w 9- e 6th range and compare to Battery Park and hopefully get the ball rolling soon

well, the good news is I found an area I think I would like the best...

 

the bad news is- it's W Lakeside ave and is way out of my price range

 

Let me guess -- Pinnacle??

 

At this point I'm going to look into newer condos in the w 9- e 6th range and compare to Battery Park and hopefully get the ball rolling soon

 

I'm with My Two Sense. Rent first. Plus, there's more affordable for-sale units under construction in/near the center city that will come on the market in the next year or two. You will have any more choices soon.

 

You don't expect to find a wife whenever you go on a first date, do ya? Sample, learn, move on to the next sample. Repeat as needed.