Could the Banks get a concert venue?

 

http://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2015/11/13/could-the-banks-get-a-concert-venue.html

 

I just looked at google earth and the 4,100 seat PNC Center takes up almost exactly the same size as a block at the Banks. However that doesn't take into account concourses, loading docks, parking (although I would imagine that's not an issue with the central riverfront garage) etc.

Based on the article think more along the lines of MOTR and less along the lines of "arena."

Give me a Munich Oktoberfest size tent on the space reserved for the next phase of Smale Park. Let the bands perform in the center.

Based on the article think more along the lines of MOTR and less along the lines of "arena."

 

Makes way more sense, when I read that I didn't see the word "not in there

 

This is not the major concerts, the 5,000-6,000 people, the Avett Brothers or, you know, the Counting Crows tour, the Barenaked Ladies, that kind of thing.

If this proposal reduces the amount of office space or residential units in the plan, it should be opposed by everyone.  If it replaces retail space... then it's fine

Why not build it along phase 2 of smale riverfront park?

Doesn't Tin Roof have an exclusivity clause with The Banks to not provide a live music venue? Or was that Toby Keiths?

 

And do we need another venue that isn't Tin Roof at The Banks? also, I don't see how it would cut into office space.

^ Supposedly that was TBKILTBAG and they stopped paying rent when Tin Roof opened

"Doc's on The Banks" will be opening in the Freedom Center next September:

 

The planned restaurant, Doc's on The Banks, will feature cuisine similar to a restaurant in Louisville called Doc Crow's Southern Smokehouse and Raw Bar. It will be a family-style restaurant and feature menu items such as baby back ribs, seafood and po'boys, said Michael Battle, executive vice president and provost at the Freedom Center.

 

The 12,000-square-foot restaurant will be built out from the existing North Star Cafe and feature two-level dining with a glass enclosure so diners can have river views, he said. The restaurant, which Battle said will feature an assortment of bourbon drinks, is slated to open in September.

 

"We think it's going to enhance the overall experience of The Banks too," Newsome said.

 

http://www.cincinnati.com/story/money/2015/11/18/freedom-center-ventures-out/75939426/

I'm just a little unsure about the traffic/exposure that this will have in the NURFC.  Haven't they always had a restaurant that nodoby knows about?

^ I didn't know they had a cafe in there until I read that article, and I've been in the building twice before, and walk by it at least 3 times a week. Hopefully this restaurant gets a significant amount of exterior exposure - be it outdoor seating, awnings, storefront, etc.

...I've been here 8 years and had no clue there was a restaurant in there...

The original construction built out space for a full blown restaurant in the lower level of the southeast corner.  Taste of Belgium occupied it for a little while a few years ago.  It sounds like they are adding onto it so people actually knows it exists, which will definitely help.

How is it possible that the retail space at the southwest corner of Phase 1 hasn't been filled yet? This would be the perfect spot for a coffee shop or brunch place with a nice view of the river, the Roebling Bridge, and Smale Park.

^Do you really think "a coffee shop or brunch place" could afford to lease a standalone restaurant on one of the most expensive lots in the city? 

He's referring to the corner retail space in The Banks along the lawn, not the freestanding spot out front of the Freedom Center.

I'm not talking about the standalone space by yard house. There's a retail space in the same building as Jefferson Social that faces the park.

I think they need more people down there first. That spot is in a little bit of a weird location pedestrian-wise and I don't know who would be walking down there right now for breakfast/coffee. Maybe once GE and the apartments open then there will be more foot traffic down there to justify it.

I've got to think that it's due to businesses thinking that the Banks is still, "unproven" so to speak.

 

Smaller places such as a coffee/brunch place need that constant clientele to stay afloat. I imagine there afraid of the lull when the reds and bengals aren't playing, in Jan/Feb/March and are afraid of the potential of low traffic.

 

 

I'm sure once GE opens, the Hotel opens, The Grocery store opens (which I hear is coming next summer and is a natural food store) then you'll see more spaces being filled up.

Interesting detail from Bowdeya Tweh's review of Doc Crow's:

The 12,000-square-foot, more than 400-seat restaurant will be built out from the existing North Star Cafe and feature two levels of dining with a glass enclosure so diners can have river views.

http://www.cincinnati.com/story/money/2015/11/30/review-docs-bring-scrumptious-seafood-banks/76387226/

 

That is quite large (anybody know the size/capacity of other two-level restaurants at The Banks like Ruth's Chris and Moerlein?), which means they must be constructing an addition to the building and/or making significant modifications to the existing building (since the second floor is currently windowless and used by the museum). With 12,000 sq ft spread over two levels, they will need a first floor footprint of at least 6,000 sq ft (if the second floor is smaller than the first floor, then the first floor footprint will have to be bigger, obviously).

 

For reference, here's an image showing a 6,000 sq ft footprint next to the Freedom Center. Some of the restaurant's foot print will be inside the existing building envelope, but even still, the new glass enclosure will take up a lot of the empty space between the Freedom Center and the street at Freedom Way.

 

All in all, I'm extremely excited about this new restaurant because it will bring a lot more activity to the area. Looking at the <a href="http://doccrows.com/supper/">menu of their Louisville location</a>, they have a  range of prices for dinner entrees from $11-$28, which is similar to Moerlein. I suspect this will be very popular.

Moerlein is 15,000 square feet and has an indoor seating capacity of 500 people.

An addition of that size would be great. While I like the architecture of the Freedom Center it doesn't really engage at the street level. Bringing an addition close to the corner of Walnut & Freedom would make it feel much more urban.

EXCLUSIVE: UC considers moving academic facilities to the Banks

 

http://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2015/12/02/exclusive-uc-considers-moving-academic-facilities.html

Damn it's behind a paywall. Any way you could sum up the story for us?

Put the Law School at the Banks... build the streetcar's Uptown Connector to connect The Banks to UC's main campus... it makes too much sense.

Damn it's behind a paywall. Any way you could sum up the story for us?

 

No one officially confirmed anything, but this quote from the article is pretty telling:

 

The letter, signed by Mayor John Cranley and County commissioner Greg Hartmann, asks the state of Ohio for funding to build garages and infrastructure so the next phase of the mixed-use riverfront project can be built.

 

“[T]he University of Cincinnati has expressed interest in developing certain of its academic facilities at the Banks, which would enhance the further revitalization of Cincinnati’s riverfront,” the letter said.

Damn it's behind a paywall. Any way you could sum up the story for us?

 

"The city and the county want $37 million from the state to build 760 more garage spaces in phases 3b and 3c" and UC's just pondering the idea of moving some if it's academics to The Banks.  "Some members of Cincinnati’s legal community long have considered it ideal for UC’s law students to be near law firms and the courthouse" and UC has been promoting co-op experience in the last few years.  That's pretty much it.

Damn it's behind a paywall. Any way you could sum up the story for us?

 

You should probably get a Business Courier subscription.  Best news source by far in Cincinnati.

Nice. That would be great! Campus losing some people would be a negative, but campus is already so dense with students that it will be fine. Having more 24 hour activity at The Banks will be greatly beneficial.

 

And guess what would definitely make a campus split between Uptown and The Banks far more connected? It starts with an "S" and ends with a "treetcar."

I like that it would add some weight to connecting the streetcar to Uptown, but I would add a word of caution.  This shouldn't be designed to be UC's streetcar, for the purpose of getting law students to and from the Banks.  The streetcar routing needs to make sense for the city's transit system as a whole and not geared towards the perceived needs of any one stakeholder. If it is designed in the best interest of the entire city it will succeed and help all institutions, but if it's geared towards some preconceived specific function it may struggle to succeed even in that role.

Damn it's behind a paywall. Any way you could sum up the story for us?

 

You should probably get a Business Courier subscription.  Best news source by far in Cincinnati.

 

A discounted subscription of just $50/year is available via UrbanCincy. :)

 

Nice. That would be great! Campus losing some people would be a negative, but campus is already so dense with students that it will be fine. Having more 24 hour activity at The Banks will be greatly beneficial.

 

And guess what would definitely make a campus split between Uptown and The Banks far more connected? It starts with an "S" and ends with a "treetcar."

 

Even if it's awhile before the Uptown Connector is built, students could still use the streetcar to get between The Banks campus and the Courthouse.

 

The letter, signed by Mayor John Cranley and County commissioner Greg Hartmann, asks the state of Ohio for funding to build garages and infrastructure so the next phase of the mixed-use riverfront project can be built.

 

“[T]he University of Cincinnati has expressed interest in developing certain of its academic facilities at the Banks, which would enhance the further revitalization of Cincinnati’s riverfront,” the letter said.

 

also telling that they're asking for money for garages, not transit.  :x

Well, Cranley and Hartmann are anti-streetcar, and the governor is anti-streetcar and anti-transit, so they wouldn't be asking the state for transit funding. Plus, the garages have to be built so that the new building can be built on top. But it would be great to see Santa Ono and/or student groups pushing for a streetcar extension to campus.

Santa has stated his desire for the streetcar to come to Uptown to benefit his students and has met and discussed this with student groups who are pushing for it. I went on a date with a guy who worked with Santa and stated that the University is more or less waiting until phase 1 is open to put all their efforts into an extension. Doing so before phase 1 was complete wasn't viewed as necessary and as such they held off. Which is why they've never officially come out in support of it. But it seems like there will be a push for the Uptown extension from them in the coming years.

 

I wonder if moving to The Banks would be a part of that. "We'll build new facilities if you extend the streetcar Uptown." That's a pretty powerful bargaining chip.

Sorry if I missed and I can't link it here, but did anyone see the cincinnati.com article on this?  It stated that they are hoping to start construction on a 330 unit apartment complex on the pad directly south of the GE building in summer of 2016, with 25,000 square feet of retail space.  Things are moving along quickly now at the Banks!

If UC was planning on moving the Law School and/or graduate business classes of some sort i wonder if it would make sense if they constructed a building on the vacant office pad as a part of Phase 1? Then it wouldn't be reliant upon the state granting the $30M+ for infrastructure for Phase 3a/b (which is no sure thing)...and then UC could get started on that much sooner.

Sorry if I missed and I can't link it here, but did anyone see the cincinnati.com article on this?  It stated that they are hoping to start construction on a 330 unit apartment complex on the pad directly south of the GE building in summer of 2016, with 25,000 square feet of retail space.  Things are moving along quickly now at the Banks!

 

After reading further into that article, I wondered if that was not just a projection to try and get state capital budget funds for the garage/infrastructure. Regions have to submit their capital budget requests this month, so projects around the state are all claiming to be shovel-ready and able to move forward quickly should the state fill the last gap.

Of course the Enquirer's headline about the next phase is "The Banks seeks $37M from taxpayers" ... yeah, to build the parking garage that the next phase will set on top of.

Can't wait till the banks is built out.

 

Having the upcoming AC Hotel, and GE workers will add alot of daytime activity and vibrancy. Hopefully this will give an extra push for more retail to open up. Right now, it's really dead. Yes, there's bars, but I can't say any of them are "must visits" like Arnolds, or some of the bars in OTR.

 

And the dining options are sort of meh as well. Definitely don't have that, "restaurant row" of killer restaurant after killer restaurant like you have in OTR on Vine.

 

Honestly, would kill just to have simple retail options like a Skyline Chilli, A Starbucks, A Panera bread, maybe a fast food place as well (can't believe I'm saying this, but having a downtown urban McDonalds wouldn't be a bad thing to have at the bank.) Stuff you would commonly see in popular urban areas. That's what I really wish to see more than anything in the 2-3 years. Otherwise, there's really not much to do there.

 

 

Wow. All the commenters on the Enquirer article wanting to abandon this plan we're in the middle of executing that is proving wildly successful before we're even finished. Just like the streetcar. I wonder if these people would advise their children to drop out of college to save money after they've already completed three years of a four year degree. Not real smart.

I find it very difficult to look at Enquirer comments sections or, really, even get on Facebook in general these days. It really seems like the people that scream the loudest are the ones that hate any sort of change, are convinced that the country/state/city is headed in the wrong direction, and frankly have nothing better to do than be negative all day. In the case of this article, people are using the same old Liz Rogers jokes, calling The Banks a "boondoggle" ... it's the same crowd that has probably not even been downtown in the past decade. My favorite anecdote was from Bob Schwartz; apparently some guy was walking down Second Street right next to The Banks going on and on about how "The Banks will never get built". It's unbelievable how uneducated many life-long Cincinnatians are about their own city.

 

If you dare, here's the ultimate old man yelling at clouds.

^I've had that exact thing happen. "The Banks will never get built." I then said, "what do you think those buildings are?" to which he replied "those have always been there."

 

.......I can't with these people.

That's what happens when the majority of your population is from the suburbs. The only thing they care about is parking availability.  You can't expect them to value urban things.

 

 

They'll complain about the tax subsidies to build the parking garage, and then complain about the $6 it costs to park there.

It's important for a city to have a central area that isn't a dump and people should be okay with some subsidies for downtown and waterfront attractions.  The Banks might not be sensational but it's *way* better than the riverfront redevelopments in cities with similar physical layouts.  Memphis?  Louisville? 

Yes please FOLLOW THROUGH with the master plan. Build out the underground garages as planned to lift development out of the flood plain. If we are looking for more ROI on our taxpayer investment I suggest banning construction of further above ground parking garage structures at the Banks in favor of additional residential and office space. More residents=more income tax collected= higher return on investment.

It's important for a city to have a central area that isn't a dump and people should be okay with some subsidies for downtown and waterfront attractions.  The Banks might not be sensational but it's *way* better than the riverfront redevelopments in cities with similar physical layouts.  Memphis?  Louisville?

 

Louisville's riverfront is a mess. It's a pain to get under I-64, and there's basically only a parking lot once you get down there. And then there's that weird plaza by the Galt House that goes over the top of I-64 but only has a staircase shoved off to the side to actually get you down to river level.

Chances the phase 1 office pad site will be instead used for UC College of Law?

I really have no idea, but I could see it more in the "wedge" block between Elm and Race next to the football stadium.

 

I wouldn't want to be stuck in a library in the Phase 1 tower when everyone was outside partying before a Reds game.

 

 

I am sure i am in the minority but i think the Law school at the Banks is a bad fit.  I am all for more mixed use and making a bit less of a party district but I just can't envision a law school in that enviroment.  For better or for worse, the banks has become the primary  events/entertainment district. Open containers will only make it that much more.  Does a law school really fit in that environement? I always hoped UC would covet/develop some of the empty lots by city hall i.e. Elm and 9th area.  Some really cool undeveloped town homes, and proximity to OTR and CBD could be attractive.