February 13, 20187 yr WCPO speculates that The Banks is struggling to compete with Cincinnati's up-and-coming real neighborhoods: https://www.wcpo.com/news/insider/are-city-neighborhoods-beating-the-banks-some-say-yes-but-the-banks-is-a-neighborhood-too?page=2 Again, I think the big problem with The Banks (which I probably posted here 10 years ago) is the master developer issue and the development of entire blocks at once. They need to subdivide what remains and auction off those lots -- diversify building types AND ownership.
February 13, 20187 yr I brought up this issue the other day in the Cleveland Lakefront thread when we were discussing what kind of development should happen there. I think preexisting neighborhoods with aged buildings and more organic growth are just going to be more interesting than these planned city type things. The Banks is nice, it's probably great for visitors, Smale Riverfront Park is great, but this story should be a caution to any city looking to develop a 'prime' area to not overdo it.
February 13, 20187 yr WCPO speculates that The Banks is struggling to compete with Cincinnati's up-and-coming real neighborhoods: https://www.wcpo.com/news/insider/are-city-neighborhoods-beating-the-banks-some-say-yes-but-the-banks-is-a-neighborhood-too?page=2 Again, I think the big problem with The Banks (which I probably posted here 10 years ago) is the master developer issue and the development of entire blocks at once. They need to subdivide what remains and auction off those lots -- diversify building types AND ownership. The "real neighborhood" thing is true, but I also think there is a limited number of people that will choose to live in the CBD or OTR when they can get the same square footage in a more up-and-coming walkable neighborhood like Pleasant Ridge for 1/2 or 1/3 of the cost. I think that we need a rising tide to lift all boats, and bring the property values of the other NBDs up a bit, before we see the revitalization of the urban core reach its maximum potential.
February 13, 20187 yr It's weird, buying a place in Pleasant Ridge can be expensive but renting there is cheap. There's several neighborhoods in Cincinnati like that.
February 13, 20187 yr I have two colleagues that live in Radius at the Banks. Seems they are struggling to rent the building out and realizing the prices are too high. The leasing company is trying to meet one on one with tenants to reduce rents to keep tenants in the building. However it isnt working and alot of tenants leave after six months. Could be a sign of more to come.
March 14, 20187 yr Went to Toby's Kieth's last night for opening weekend and it was indeed packed by 11:30. It's quite a large space and essentially feels like a sports bar with a live music stage. No cover, but drinks were on the more expensive side for Cincinnati ($4 for a domestic bottle) The mix of people was straight-up weird. Lots of UC kids, YPs and even some hipsters, and then much of what I imagine the real target audience is for this place if you get my drift... While this is not really my kind of place, I can guarantee that most of the people in there last night were from the suburbs and came into the city just to check it out. More people coming into the city to see the real progress happening, the Banks especially, is definitely a good thing. I'd like to ask you a few questions about this place. Did you love the bar? Did you love the grill?
March 21, 20187 yr This whole idea is a horrible waste of space. Here are the 3 groups looking to build an entertainment venue at the Banks: SLIDESHOW By Tom Demeropolis – Senior Staff Reporter, Cincinnati Business Courier Three groups submitted plans to develop an entertainment venue and event center at the Banks in downtown Cincinnati. The three teams that responded to a request for qualifications from the Joint Banks Steering Committee were a partnership between Live Nation Entertainment Inc. and Ark Group, the Cincinnati Symphony Orchestra and Promowest Productions Inc. The submissions range in capacity from 2,500 to 6,000 and in scope from about $17 million to more than $66 million. https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2018/03/21/here-are-the-3-groups-looking-to-build-an.html
March 22, 20187 yr Yeah... https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2018/03/21/here-are-the-3-groups-looking-to-build-an.html "You don't just walk into a bar and mix it up by calling a girl fat" - buildingcincinnati speaking about new forumers
March 22, 20187 yr Why bother developing the rest of The Banks as a mix of retail, office space, and residential when you can just toss up a giant indoor-outdoor music venue that takes up all of the remaining space?
March 22, 20187 yr Why bother developing the rest of The Banks as a mix of retail, office space, and residential when you can just toss up a giant indoor-outdoor music venue that takes up all of the remaining space? I think if put in the right location (south of PBS?) this space could be a positive contributor to The Banks, but putting it next to the most recently completed phase would be a big mistake. Just because it may be the easiest to do (at this time) does not make it the best. They need more office users and residents.
March 22, 20187 yr The CSO rendering appears, I think, to be in the spot originally talked about south west of paul brown stadium. I don't think the Promowest location is terrible. It looks to only be taking up one plot of land that was planned to be developed. Lot 10 was planned for retail/office/residential but lot 23 is planned to be part of the park. Live Nations rendering is definitely on lot 24 and in no way should this music venue go there.
March 22, 20187 yr The Promowest version looks like it would stay south of Theodore Berry Way and the carousel. If this venue stays to the south of the newly completed parking garage in the Lots 10 and 23, I think this could be a win. We already have a huge park down there, and the park doesn't need to be north of Mehring anyway.
March 22, 20187 yr Yeah, I can come to terms with Lot 23 and (a portion of) Lot 10 being used for this. Lot 23 wasn't going to be developed anyway, so that's not a loss since we have so much park space as it is. Lot 10 would be nice to be a large building but I think having a major entrance to a concert venue from the corner could actually be a good way to activate that side of Smale, so I think it could work. I just would want to make sure that the boundaries given to this development are tight and that mixed use development properly fills the rest of The Banks as planned.
March 22, 20187 yr Promowest has a similar concert venue right next to Heinz field in Pittsburgh. They always have live music going on before Steelers games so it's basically just another place fans go to eat and drink if they can't/don't want to tailgate. I imagine they do the same for big Pirates games as well. I know CSO is the local group but I hope Promowest wins this bid. I think they will do the best job as they have the most experience in running these exact type of venues.
March 22, 20187 yr Sheesh, why not just tear down and rebuild US Bank Arena instead? This venue is going to hold like 2,000 people inside and then an open standing area outside. It's nothing like US Bank Arena
March 22, 20187 yr If the proposal for Lot 24 is chosen I hope they force them to put rent-able space along Freedom Way. This way there can be bars and restaurants along there activating the block opposite Taste of Belgium and Pies and Pints when concerts and events are not happening. Otherwise the block is just going to be dead like it already is without development.
March 22, 20187 yr I know CSO is the local group but I hope Promowest wins this bid. I think they will do the best job as they have the most experience in running these exact type of venues. ^This. They have venues exactly like this in Pittsburgh and Columbus and will bring in the best music. Livenation brings in pretty mediocre/bad acts to their venues in Cincy, and CSO/Memi already has Riverbend/PNC so this feels like it would be redundant. I have driven to Columbus multiple times to go to Express Live/The Basement because they bring in better quality acts that we don't currently get in Cincinnati.
March 22, 20187 yr I know CSO is the local group but I hope Promowest wins this bid. I think they will do the best job as they have the most experience in running these exact type of venues. ^This. They have venues exactly like this in Pittsburgh and Columbus and will bring in the best music. Livenation brings in pretty mediocre/bad acts to their venues in Cincy, and CSO/Memi already has Riverbend/PNC so this feels like it would be redundant. I have driven to Columbus multiple times to go to Express Live/The Basement because they bring in better quality acts that we don't currently get in Cincinnati. Yeah with Promowest they could group Cincy/CBUS/Pitt together for tours and not one off shows like CSO would likely do and I think the end result would be much better with Promo. I hope we do not pull a "Cincinnati" and stay local just because and get a mediocre product because of it.
March 22, 20187 yr The CSO rendering appears, I think, to be in the spot originally talked about south west of paul brown stadium. ^do you mean south EAST of Paul Brown? None of the CSO rendering suggest they're looking at a site *west* of the stadium.
March 22, 20187 yr Yeah, I can come to terms with Lot 23 and (a portion of) Lot 10 being used for this. Lot 23 wasn't going to be developed anyway, so that's not a loss since we have so much park space as it is. Lot 10 would be nice to be a large building but I think having a major entrance to a concert venue from the corner could actually be a good way to activate that side of Smale, so I think it could work. I just would want to make sure that the boundaries given to this development are tight and that mixed use development properly fills the rest of The Banks as planned. That's a great way of putting it. If Lot 23 (which was going to be park space anyway) is selected as the site of the new venue, at least that doesn't mess up plans to build something else on Lot 24. I also hope they go with PromoWest since, I can tell you from first hand experience, I have nothing but positive things to say about PromoWest venues I've attended, and nothing but negative things to say about MEMI venues and festivals I've attended.
March 22, 20187 yr Promowest has a similar concert venue right next to Heinz field in Pittsburgh. They always have live music going on before Steelers games so it's basically just another place fans go to eat and drink if they can't/don't want to tailgate. I imagine they do the same for big Pirates games as well. I know CSO is the local group but I hope Promowest wins this bid. I think they will do the best job as they have the most experience in running these exact type of venues. Went to a number of Pirate games in the past. It is not used all the time and seemed like when we were there, it was a big dead space most of the time. Personally, I like the Live Nation one because it integrates better with the streetscape and urban fabric. The Pittsburgh one sits out almost like a paved over parking lot and does not really draw people to the area outside of the event. It is just there. Personally, I was very underwhelmed with the activity in downtown Pittsburgh when I was last there 2 years back. I figured there would be a lot more to it.
March 30, 20187 yr Business Courier's article about FC Cincinnati receiving state funding also mentioned that the Banks got $2 million to help fund the next phase of parking garage and Smale riverfront park. I assume this is related to the proposed music venue, but what is the next parcel to receive parking deck and riverfront park? https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2018/03/30/fc-cincinnati-lands-state-funding-for-planned.html Also who's going to the party to celebrate a DECADE OF DEVELOPMENT! http://thebankspublicpartnership.com/the-banks-decade-of-development/ Actually an interesting timeline of photos here: http://thebankspublicpartnership.com/wp-content/uploads/TheBanksDecadeofDevelopmentPhotos.pdf
April 2, 20187 yr This article says the Symphony’s proposal would be on “Lot 27”... anybody know where exactly that is? https://www.cincinnati.com/story/money/2018/03/29/50-foot-bar-giant-retractable-wall-airport-hangar-door-wall-part-design-proposed-banks-concert-venue/459096002/
April 23, 20187 yr From @AmandaSeitz1: Hmm ... @HamiltonCntyOH ... don't recall "development of public infrastructure" being on the list of reasons a public body can enter into closed session and shield discussions from public. "It's just fate, as usual, keeping its bargain and screwing us in the fine print..." - John Crichton
April 26, 20187 yr https://www.wcpo.com/news/insider/will-cincinnati-music-fans-get-an-outdoor-concert-venue-at-the-banks-maybe-not This article just further proves why CSO should not be picked. They plan to build the smallest venue with the least amount of events which would mean less parking revenue, less money spent at restaurants and less hotel stays. It would also be an indoor only venue which would be a waste of prime real estate at the banks. O and the cherry on top? They wouldn't pay property taxes and the city wouldn't get any ticket taxes since they're a nonprofit. That would be several hundred thousand dollars a year the city would not get. Live Nation has the worst location and they're asking for $37 million in public funding so they're definitely out. PromoWest should be the obvious choice. A company who would get the best acts and runs similar successful venues in similar sized cities. They're asking for no public money. They would build a bigger, indoor and outdoor venue that would make better use of the banks location. They would have more acts then CSO which would lead to more money being spent on parking and at the restaurants/hotels downtown. And the city would make roughly $350,000 per year off ticket and amusement taxes compared to the $0 from CSO. This should be a no brainer yet WCPO's sources say CSO is the rumored favorite among the idiots on the joint banks steering committee. Thankfully the committee can only make a recommendation, the ultimate decision on who to pick will come from city council and the county commission. Cranley and Nicol Investments are quoted making the case against CSO so we just have to hope smarter minds prevail here. For once don't just do the Cincinnati thing by picking a local company, make the actual smart business decision. Considering the banks is publicly owned I don't see how you can turn down an additional $300,000+ a year just so you can pick the local group.
April 26, 20187 yr From that article, this critique of the Freedom Center is pretty biting: “Successful, modern, forward-thinking venues embrace the environment outside their confines,” Nicol wrote. “The enclosed ‘fortress’ features of outdated structures like U.S. Bank Arena and the Freedom Center show how isolated and ineffective such venues tend to be when situated in a live-work-play environment." I don't totally disagree with Nicol, though I think the Freedom Center's problems have less to do with its architecture and more to do with its management and exhibits. I think the Freedom Center - even with its current physical design - could do a much better job of telling the story of the fight for freedom. Take a look at the recently opened National Memorial for Peace & Justice in Montgomery, Alabama. They write that "nothing like it exists in the country"... and that's just a sign that the Freedom Center isn't doing a good enough job of telling the story of the fight for freedom, the war that white supremacists waged on blacks, the epidemic of lynchings. The Freedom Center seems to shy away from directly addressing the evil that denied (denies) freedom to others. In the Freedom Center's mission, they explicitly say the want to focus on the courageous heroes (which is admirable in its own way) but in doing so, their exhibits fall short of fully communicating the forces of evil that freedom fighters were (are) up against: Our mission is to reveal stories of freedom’s heroes, from the era of the Underground Railroad to contemporary times, challenging and inspiring everyone to take courageous steps of freedom today. http://www.freedomcenter.org/about-us
April 26, 20187 yr https://www.wcpo.com/news/insider/will-cincinnati-music-fans-get-an-outdoor-concert-venue-at-the-banks-maybe-not This article just further proves why CSO should not be picked. They plan to build the smallest venue with the least amount of events which would mean less parking revenue, less money spent at restaurants and less hotel stays. It would also be an indoor only venue which would be a waste of prime real estate at the banks. O and the cherry on top? They wouldn't pay property taxes and the city wouldn't get any ticket taxes since they're a nonprofit. That would be several hundred thousand dollars a year the city would not get. Live Nation has the worst location and they're asking for $37 million in public funding so they're definitely out. PromoWest should be the obvious choice. A company who would get the best acts and runs similar successful venues in similar sized cities. They're asking for no public money. They would build a bigger, indoor and outdoor venue that would make better use of the banks location. They would have more acts then CSO which would lead to more money being spent on parking and at the restaurants/hotels downtown. And the city would make roughly $350,000 per year off ticket and amusement taxes compared to the $0 from CSO. This should be a no brainer yet WCPO's sources say CSO is the rumored favorite among the idiots on the joint banks steering committee. Thankfully the committee can only make a recommendation, the ultimate decision on who to pick will come from city council and the county commission. Cranley and Nicol Investments are quoted making the case against CSO so we just have to hope smarter minds prevail here. For once don't just do the Cincinnati thing by picking a local company, make the actual smart business decision. Considering the banks is publicly owned I don't see how you can turn down an additional $300,000+ a year just so you can pick the local group. That article is framed around anonymous sources that say CSO is the front runner, but then all of the quoted people talk about all the ways in which the CSO bid is not good: as a non-profit it would generate no tax revenue, they want the largest site, it would be indoors, it would have the fewest events, bring out the fewest people. It's interesting that Cranley is being pretty open about his opposition to aspects of the CSO bid. So, whoever is pushing the CSO bid hasn't been able to get him on their side yet.
April 26, 20187 yr The Freedom Center doesn't look open. Ever. When it was proposed, I recall Jim Tarbell criticizing it for that reason.
April 26, 20187 yr The Freedom Center doesn't look open. Ever. When it was proposed, I recall Jim Tarbell criticizing it for that reason. Not to mention it closes at 5 pm everyday and is closed on Sundays. So basically it isn't ever open.
April 26, 20187 yr The Freedom Center doesn't look open. Ever. When it was proposed, I recall Jim Tarbell criticizing it for that reason. Not to mention it closes at 5 pm everyday and is closed on Sundays. So basically it isn't ever open. I had no idea that it was only open 11a-5p 5 days/week (30 hours/week). Not sure what is 'normal' for a museum but as a comparison the Cincinnati Art Museum is open 39 hours/week.
April 26, 20187 yr The Freedom Center doesn't look open. Ever. When it was proposed, I recall Jim Tarbell criticizing it for that reason. Not to mention it closes at 5 pm everyday and is closed on Sundays. So basically it isn't ever open. I had no idea that it was only open 11a-5p 5 days/week (30 hours/week). Not sure what is 'normal' for a museum but as a comparison the Cincinnati Art Museum is open 39 hours/week. It seems so weird to be closed on Sunday. I work every weekday (like most people) so I basically have a six hour window each week that I could potentially go.
April 26, 20187 yr Sounds like the target demo is field trips, then. That spend $0 on parking or at the retail establishments.
April 30, 20187 yr EXCLUSIVE: Here's what's coming to the massive, shuttered Crave space at the Banks By Andy Brownfield – Reporter, Cincinnati Business Courier Apr 30, 2018, 1:54pm EDT Updated an hour ago The owners of a downtown restaurant and nightclub are taking over the former Crave space at the Banks, which has been shuttered since 2016. Peerless Culinary & Nightlife Management Group, which operates Jekyll on Fountain Square, is taking over the 8,371-square-foot space at 175 Joe Nuxhall Way that used to be occupied by Crave. Crave closed its doors in September 2016. Owners are targeting a July opening date. https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2018/04/30/exclusive-heres-whats-coming-to-the-massive.html
April 30, 20187 yr Two floors? I didn't know there was a second floor that could be used there. Hope this place does well but that is just such a giant space. From being out at the banks just last weekend though the demand is definitely there for more bars on the weekends. Every bar down there was packed Friday night and that included all the outdoor space as well. Another option to spread out the crowd will be a nice addition.
April 30, 20187 yr https://www.wcpo.com/news/insider/will-cincinnati-music-fans-get-an-outdoor-concert-venue-at-the-banks-maybe-not This article just further proves why CSO should not be picked. They plan to build the smallest venue with the least amount of events which would mean less parking revenue, less money spent at restaurants and less hotel stays. It would also be an indoor only venue which would be a waste of prime real estate at the banks. O and the cherry on top? They wouldn't pay property taxes and the city wouldn't get any ticket taxes since they're a nonprofit. That would be several hundred thousand dollars a year the city would not get. Live Nation has the worst location and they're asking for $37 million in public funding so they're definitely out. PromoWest should be the obvious choice. A company who would get the best acts and runs similar successful venues in similar sized cities. They're asking for no public money. They would build a bigger, indoor and outdoor venue that would make better use of the banks location. They would have more acts then CSO which would lead to more money being spent on parking and at the restaurants/hotels downtown. And the city would make roughly $350,000 per year off ticket and amusement taxes compared to the $0 from CSO. This should be a no brainer yet WCPO's sources say CSO is the rumored favorite among the idiots on the joint banks steering committee. Thankfully the committee can only make a recommendation, the ultimate decision on who to pick will come from city council and the county commission. Cranley and Nicol Investments are quoted making the case against CSO so we just have to hope smarter minds prevail here. For once don't just do the Cincinnati thing by picking a local company, make the actual smart business decision. Considering the banks is publicly owned I don't see how you can turn down an additional $300,000+ a year just so you can pick the local group. That article is framed around anonymous sources that say CSO is the front runner, but then all of the quoted people talk about all the ways in which the CSO bid is not good: as a non-profit it would generate no tax revenue, they want the largest site, it would be indoors, it would have the fewest events, bring out the fewest people. It's interesting that Cranley is being pretty open about his opposition to aspects of the CSO bid. So, whoever is pushing the CSO bid hasn't been able to get him on their side yet. Bill Donabedian (one of the guys who started MPMF, then went on to start Bunbury) shared a link to this story with the following quote: "The steering committee is going to steer this project right into the river if they give it to the CSO."
April 30, 20187 yr Two floors? I didn't know there was a second floor that could be used there. Hope this place does well but that is just such a giant space. From being out at the banks just last weekend though the demand is definitely there for more bars on the weekends. Every bar down there was packed Friday night and that included all the outdoor space as well. Another option to spread out the crowd will be a nice addition. I don't think Crave used the second floor. Here's an interior shot of Crave: https://www.google.com/maps/@39.0982005,-84.5091247,2a,75y,72.92h,96.21t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sZF0VFG3TYwMAAAQDMaUj8g!2e0!7i13312!8i6656 Here's the exterior where you can see the windows on the second floor, at the corner with 2nd St: https://www.google.com/maps/@39.0981434,-84.5089175,3a,75y,270.23h,101.7t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sub866XMnRbP4X9A2Wl5Zmg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
April 30, 20187 yr EXCLUSIVE: Here's what's coming to the massive, shuttered Crave space at the Banks By Andy Brownfield – Reporter, Cincinnati Business Courier Apr 30, 2018, 1:54pm EDT Updated an hour ago The owners of a downtown restaurant and nightclub are taking over the former Crave space at the Banks, which has been shuttered since 2016. Peerless Culinary & Nightlife Management Group, which operates Jekyll on Fountain Square, is taking over the 8,371-square-foot space at 175 Joe Nuxhall Way that used to be occupied by Crave. Crave closed its doors in September 2016. Owners are targeting a July opening date. https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2018/04/30/exclusive-heres-whats-coming-to-the-massive.html It's going to be a hot mess! “All truly great thoughts are conceived while walking.” -Friedrich Nietzsche
May 1, 20187 yr Two floors? I didn't know there was a second floor that could be used there. Hope this place does well but that is just such a giant space. From being out at the banks just last weekend though the demand is definitely there for more bars on the weekends. Every bar down there was packed Friday night and that included all the outdoor space as well. Another option to spread out the crowd will be a nice addition. I don't think Crave used the second floor. Here's an interior shot of Crave: https://www.google.com/maps/@39.0982005,-84.5091247,2a,75y,72.92h,96.21t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sZF0VFG3TYwMAAAQDMaUj8g!2e0!7i13312!8i6656 Here's the exterior where you can see the windows on the second floor, at the corner with 2nd St: https://www.google.com/maps/@39.0981434,-84.5089175,3a,75y,270.23h,101.7t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sub866XMnRbP4X9A2Wl5Zmg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656 I assumed they were talking about how the space has a split level. The bar area up front was one level and then it went down like 3-4 stairs to the main restaurant space.
May 2, 20187 yr Cranley pushes for PromoWest Banks concert venue; reveals company could partner with FC Cincinnati Cincinnati and Hamilton County should award a bid to put a concert venue at the Banks riverfront development to PromoWest Productions, Mayor John Cranley said in a letter to the Banks Joint Steering Committee one day before the panel will make its recommendation. The Columbus-based company’s bid is superior to bids led by LiveNation and the Cincinnati Symphony Orchestra because it does not ask for a taxpayer subsidy and utilizes the city’s stunning skyline by proposing an indoor/outdoor venue, Cranley said. More below: https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2018/05/01/cranley-pushes-for-promowest-banks-concert-venue.html "You don't just walk into a bar and mix it up by calling a girl fat" - buildingcincinnati speaking about new forumers
May 2, 20187 yr Were the bid proposals ever made public? The coverage has been frustrating in the lack of detail describing how/where exactly they would fit in at The Banks. The only rendering for the PromoWest seems to show it built up above the flood plain. I wish we had a few more angles to see how it fits in with the rest of the The Banks. At the corner of Elm/Mehring, there are windows showing something that would be underground, with grass above. I'm curious what that space would be used for. Would it be parking (like beneath Moerlein Lager House)? If it's parking, is PromoWest going to pay to build it and will they own it, or would the County use some of the public funds they requested from the State for building more parking infrastructure? If the parking is publicly built/owned, it's a bit odd how PromoWest's rendering seems to show the seating bowl for concerts dropping down into what presumably would be the parking garage. Or maybe I'm misinterpreting the rendering and all of PromoWest facilities would be above the garage? Also, what happens immediately to the east of the PromoWest proposal? It appears to be park-like area. Would Cincinnati Parks be responsible for building that park space?
May 2, 20187 yr Yes, but we have known from the very beginning that the county is going to pay for the entire stadium-to-stadium garage because that's what lifts The Banks out of the flood plain and allows for development to occur on top.
May 2, 20187 yr Cranley pushes for PromoWest Banks concert venue; reveals company could partner with FC Cincinnati It's a rare treat when I completely agree with something Cranley says...
May 2, 20187 yr If the County is going to fill in all of the space north of Mehring with structured parking, then there absolutely should NOT be any large parcels dedicated to green park space on top of the garages. I might be mistaken, but I thought recent master plans showed significant green space in Lot 23 without garage parking. I'm concerned by how the rendering seems to show the PromoWest facility floating in an ocean of green space. If the City/County do choose PromoWest (definitely seems like the best of the 3 proposals), they should situate the facility as close and compact against the Elm/Mehring intersection as possible, maximizing space to the north and east for other developments. Here's an image showing the remaining developable parcels:
May 2, 20187 yr Two of the three proposals are at Mehring and Elm (The PromoWest and CSO ones) however of the three the CSO proposal is the smallest. I think the CSO venue is well designed (however I have concerns seeing how they ruined MPMF) and the partnership could work out some way to modify the proposal to include outdoor. People have to remember the primary desire for a concert venue is to help support activity at the Banks during the winter months when there is nothing else going on down there and retail really struggles. Having outdoor is nice, but its a value add, not the main point. “All truly great thoughts are conceived while walking.” -Friedrich Nietzsche
May 2, 20187 yr If you're not going to use the great views of the banks why build a concert venue there? An indoor only venue could be built anywhere. Having an outdoor option is not just a value add, it adds way more people who would be coming and spending money at the banks. PromoWests is projecting it would bring 75,000 more people to events each year then CSO. And unless they change their mind you can see lot 23 is planned to be part of the park. Just like Moerlein and their green space is part of the park on the other side. I agree we don't need more green space north of Smale but it seems like that's whats going to happen. PromoWest and CSO's proposals would take up lot 18 and still leave lot 23 as green space. Only difference is that CSO's looks like it's built up against Elm whereas PromoWest's is more in the middle between lots 23 and 18 so that the fans have a view of the bridge from the outdoor space.
May 2, 20187 yr Following WCPO's Amanda Seitz, who is reporting from the Joint Banks Steering Committee meeting today. A couple of early points: "PromoWest's bid expands 2.2 acres, and cuts into park space - which is part of the rub with this bid from what I've heard. Some powerful people in this city want to preserve/add to park space at The Banks." "Meanwhile, Cincinnati Symphony Orchestra's bid is a $19M concert venue proposal -- and it takes up less space than PromoWest's bid at about .75 acres." "It's just fate, as usual, keeping its bargain and screwing us in the fine print..." - John Crichton
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