I remember reading a year or more ago about Carter Dawson losing development control of the site, but on the banks website it still looks like they are in charge. Did they pay for an extension or is the website just wrong? I know some on this site speculated that 3CDC or other local players would take control of parcels but did I miss something or is Carter still in control? 

No, Carter is not involved. There is currently no master developer which is probably why the website hasn't been updated. What's funny is that 3CDC was originally going to be the master developer of The Banks before they shifted gears and decided to focus on OTR. There were rumors that 3CDC would take over The Banks but they have a lot going on right now with their other big projects, I'm not sure it would really make sense for them to take on The Banks as well.

So what is the status on the empty lots at the Banks? Is there just no demand for development there? Or is the city actively avoiding doing anything with them?

1 hour ago, seaswan said:

So what is the status on the empty lots at the Banks? Is there just no demand for development there? Or is the city actively avoiding doing anything with them?

 

I have to imagine some of their energy is being spent on locking down the banks concert venue first...the ferris wheel situation sort of highlights how the city doesn't want Northern KY to, "win" attractions...

 

I also feel that the empty pad for the speculation office tower that was never built for the block of phase 1 (where the corner store is next to that baseball kid mutual) is still something of a concern that it's been almost, what, 5-6 years and it's still has no prospective tenants?

 

IMO, they should scrap the office tenant concept and just build a mixed use retail/residential component and create an entertainment center (botique movie theater, retail, maybe a food hall?) with residential units above.

 

It sort of fits the entertainment theme that the banks sort of has going for it at the moment anyways...

 

I feel like after those 2 objectives get wrapped there will be more fuel to get started on the future banks phases. 

 

 

Edited July 21, 20195 yr by troeros

14 hours ago, troeros said:

 

I have to imagine some of their energy is being spent on locking down the banks concert venue first...the ferris wheel situation sort of highlights how the city doesn't want Northern KY to, "win" attractions...

 

I also feel that the empty pad for the speculation office tower that was never built for the block of phase 1 (where the corner store is next to that baseball kid mutual) is still something of a concern that it's been almost, what, 5-6 years and it's still has no prospective tenants?

 

IMO, they should scrap the office tenant concept and just build a mixed use retail/residential component and create an entertainment center (botique movie theater, retail, maybe a food hall?) with residential units above.

 

It sort of fits the entertainment theme that the banks sort of has going for it at the moment anyways...

 

I feel like after those 2 objectives get wrapped there will be more fuel to get started on the future banks phases. 

 

 

Yeah..I've been wondering about that office pad, its been empty ridiculously long. 

 

Its just a shame to me, because after Reds games, and on weekends, The Banks are totally packed, and I would love to see the area filled out. 

Edited July 22, 20195 yr by seaswan

Sad to see the shooting last night at the banks in front of tastes of Belgium. 

 

The banks has been such a good facilitator for suburban tourists from West Chester and mason (that are still hesitant with otr)..it just sucks they have to witness the terror and screams of horror from the violence.

 

Crap like this makes people afraid and makes them isolated in suburbia and the violence is what kills cities. 

22 minutes ago, troeros said:

Sad to see the shooting last night at the banks in front of tastes of Belgium. 

 

The banks has been such a good facilitator for suburban tourists from West Chester and mason (that are still hesitant with otr)..it just sucks they have to witness the terror and screams of horror from the violence.

 

Crap like this makes people afraid and makes them isolated in suburbia and the violence is what kills cities. 

 

A terrible tragedy, but this happened at 3am on a Sunday night/Monday morning... how many “suburban tourists from West Chester and mason” really had to “witness the terror and screams of horror from the violence”? 

5 minutes ago, thebillshark said:

 

A terrible tragedy, but this happened at 3am on a Sunday night/Monday morning... how many “suburban tourists from West Chester and mason” really had to “witness the terror and screams of horror from the violence”? 

 

I mean the bars close at 2:30am most people still linger till 3am to catch their Ubers...then there is the AC Rooftop Hotel guests and the Airbnb guests at the banks..

 

I know crime is isolated to altercations, drug dealing, gangs, etc...but it's just a sad reality of American cities nowadays. 

 

Im originally from Europe and I miss the freedom of walking around the city center at night with no fear of crime or violence. Violence was just never a part of our culture...even if you were poor the most you would resort is to pick pocket someone on the train or the street... Never by pushing a gun in someone's face....

 

 

If you are honestly scared of walking around in Downtown Cincinnati, you are massively overreacting to a few unfortunate incidents. The average person knows that is close to a 0% chance of randomly being shot in Downtown Cincinnati while you're walking down the street, unless you are literally buying or selling drugs.

9 minutes ago, troeros said:

 

I mean the bars close at 2:30am most people still linger till 3am to catch their Ubers...then there is the AC Rooftop Hotel guests and the Airbnb guests at the banks..

 

I know crime is isolated to altercations, drug dealing, gangs, etc...but it's just a sad reality of American cities nowadays. 

 

Im originally from Europe and I miss the freedom of walking around the city center at night with no fear of crime or violence. Violence was just never a part of our culture...even if you were poor the most you would resort is to pick pocket someone on the train or the street... Never by pushing a gun in someone's face....

 

 

I don't want to spin this off topic but I think you blanket statement about crime in Europe is pretty naïve.   I have never experienced any problems while there but over the years I have had friends who were robbed at knife point in three different cities (Rome, Paris and of all place Dublin).  Pretty clear they were targeted as tourists.  Crime in every where to some degree,

 

10 minutes ago, troeros said:

 

I mean the bars close at 2:30am most people still linger till 3am to catch their Ubers...then there is the AC Rooftop Hotel guests and the Airbnb guests at the banks..

 

I know crime is isolated to altercations, drug dealing, gangs, etc...but it's just a sad reality of American cities nowadays. 

 

Im originally from Europe and I miss the freedom of walking around the city center at night with no fear of crime or violence. Violence was just never a part of our culture...even if you were poor the most you would resort is to pick pocket someone on the train or the street... Never by pushing a gun in someone's face....

 

 

 

The Upper Deck closes at 9pm on Sunday night. Yard House closes at 11. The Stretch closes at midnight. There are very, very few people left at the Banks bars at 2:30 am on a Sunday night. 

 

And despite this isolated incident, downtown Cincinnati and the Banks are overwhelmingly safe places to be. You can walk around downtown at night and be confident that you will not be a victim of a crime. This incident wasn't someone targeting strangers. 

7 minutes ago, Htsguy said:

I don't want to spin this off topic but I think you blanket statement about crime in Europe is pretty naïve.   I have never experienced any problems while there but over the years I have had friends who were robbed at knife point in three different cities (Rome, Paris and of all place Dublin).  Pretty clear they were targeted as tourists.  Crime in every where to some degree,

 

 

Very true... I grew up much of my child hood and teenage years in Amsterdam at most you would hear on average of murders is 10 - 15 in total. I think Cincy has averaged that in just the month of June alone. 

 

Even then it would be a husband who killed his wife over an affair or something domestic like that. 

 

American cities just have so many guns and just so much violence in general. It's just a shame I guess.

It's the Cincinnati media that will air this story for many days to come attempting to portray the area as a hotbed for crime just because of this one isolated incident. Which many suburbanites will take to heart and buy into it completely.

1 hour ago, troeros said:

Sad to see the shooting last night at the banks in front of tastes of Belgium. 

 

The banks has been such a good facilitator for suburban tourists from West Chester and mason (that are still hesitant with otr)..it just sucks they have to witness the terror and screams of horror from the violence.

 

Crap like this makes people afraid and makes them isolated in suburbia and the violence is what kills cities. 

 

Seriously?!?   This crap is happening in plenty of the suburbs around town

 

Florence

https://www.wcpo.com/news/local-news/boone-county/florence/person-stabbed-to-death-in-sunday-morning-fight-in-ky

West Chester

https://www.wcpo.com/news/local-news/butler-county/west-chester/more-than-2-months-later-police-to-hold-news-conference-on-west-chester-quadruple-homicide

Mason

https://www.wcpo.com/news/crime/mason/police-mom-escaped-children-still-inside-standoff-with-suspect

1 hour ago, seaswan said:

Yeah..I've been wondering about that office pad, its been empty ridiculously long. 

 

Its just a shame to me, because after Reds games, and on weekends, The Banks are totally packed, and I would love to see the area filled out. 

I've heard some buzz around that office pad lately, which made me ask the question of who the master developer was. I thought it might be Carter doing something before a control deadline, but if they are already gone this must be buzz from a new developer stepping into the situation. With all the Class B and C office space that has been converted to hotel and apartments around town, as well as the massive Chiquita space being filled, I feel like this office tower might be close to finally happening.

Edited July 22, 20195 yr by ucgrady

12 minutes ago, oakiehigh said:

 

Seriously?!?   This crap is happening in plenty of the suburbs around town

 

Florence

https://www.wcpo.com/news/local-news/boone-county/florence/person-stabbed-to-death-in-sunday-morning-fight-in-ky

West Chester

https://www.wcpo.com/news/local-news/butler-county/west-chester/more-than-2-months-later-police-to-hold-news-conference-on-west-chester-quadruple-homicide

Mason

https://www.wcpo.com/news/crime/mason/police-mom-escaped-children-still-inside-standoff-with-suspect

 

I feel like this is an apples to oranges comparison...I don't think anyone is oblivious to murders happening anywhere, even in the comfort of their suburban neighborhood.

 

But when you hear about 14 year olds being shot on the street and consistent acts of gun violence on the streets of Cincinnati it portrays a portrait of a city filled with residents who have violence, rage, and chaos.

13 minutes ago, troeros said:

 

I feel like this is an apples to oranges comparison...I don't think anyone is oblivious to murders happening anywhere, even in the comfort of their suburban neighborhood.

 

But when you hear about 14 year olds being shot on the street and consistent acts of gun violence on the streets of Cincinnati it portrays a portrait of a city filled with residents who have violence, rage, and chaos.

 

 

No offense Troeros but I think you worry way too much. This isn't anything new which has been going on for years. Very unfortunate, very very sad, no doubt about any of that. But, this isn't giong to turn people away from visiting and spending money in the city, maybe some people who hadn't been already but what is the city missing then?

A Fox 19 reporter Tweeted this about the Banks shooting:

 

Officers tell us a large group of people have been gathering along Freedom Way and Smale Park in the early morning hours. They meet through a social media app and choose a place to hang out. They have had more officers patrolling the area.

 

Any idea what that's all about? Who is having parties in the street at 3:00 AM on a Sunday night? And how do I get invited?

1 minute ago, Ram23 said:

A Fox 19 reporter Tweeted this about the Banks shooting:

 

Officers tell us a large group of people have been gathering along Freedom Way and Smale Park in the early morning hours. They meet through a social media app and choose a place to hang out. They have had more officers patrolling the area.

 

Any idea what that's all about? Who is having parties in the street at 3:00 AM on a Sunday night? And how do I get invited?

 

People that don't work/don't have parential guardians that give 2 craps about why their teenage son is out in the city at 3am on a Sunday... That's sort of how this works right?

1 hour ago, ucgrady said:

I've heard some buzz around that office pad lately, which made me ask the question of who the master developer was. I thought it might be Carter doing something before a control deadline, but if they are already gone this must be buzz from a new developer stepping into the situation. With all the Class B and C office space that has been converted to hotel and apartments around town, as well as the massive Chiquita space being filled, I feel like this office tower might be close to finally happening.

 

I have been thinking the same thing. As long as the economy stays strong for a few more years, I think we will reach the point where there is enough demand for a new Class A office building. I'm not sure what the current vacancy rates are, but they have to be going down with all of the Class B/C office buildings that are being converted to other uses.

56 minutes ago, taestell said:

 

I have been thinking the same thing. As long as the economy stays strong for a few more years, I think we will reach the point where there is enough demand for a new Class A office building. I'm not sure what the current vacancy rates are, but they have to be going down with all of the Class B/C office buildings that are being converted to other uses.

 

I had a discussion with someone about the Phase 1B pad last week. They said the floor area was too small for most offices, since everyone wanted open floor plates, it was not as desirable. I don't agree. Always thought it could be built as spec. Put WeWork in a few floors, and make it a tower geared towards start-ups looking for the next level of growth.

From this years state of downtown

 

10.47%

Class A Office Vacancy Rate

Downtown Neighborhood, Cincinnati, OH

 

13.85%

Class B Office Vacancy Rate

Downtown Neighborhood, Cincinnati, OH

27 minutes ago, JYP said:

 

I had a discussion with someone about the Phase 1B pad last week. They said the floor area was too small for most offices, since everyone wanted open floor plates, it was not as desirable. I don't agree. Always thought it could be built as spec. Put WeWork in a few floors, and make it a tower geared towards start-ups looking for the next level of growth.

Yeah I don't get that either, you could put a tower with the same floor plate size as 5/3 Tower or Queen City Square in that location. If it's only ~10 stories you wouldn't need multiple elevator banks so you'd actually get more usable square footage than either of those towers. 

Just put another hotel on that block if it's too small for an office building.  There is still a ton of land left in the banks development if they want a bigger floor plate for an office building. 

3 hours ago, troeros said:

 

I feel like this is an apples to oranges comparison...I don't think anyone is oblivious to murders happening anywhere, even in the comfort of their suburban neighborhood.

 

But when you hear about 14 year olds being shot on the street and consistent acts of gun violence on the streets of Cincinnati it portrays a portrait of a city filled with residents who have violence, rage, and chaos.

 

Every U.S. city, Cincinnati included, was many, many times more violent from the late 1960s through just recently.  Stuff was abandoned on a huge scale.  Drug dealing and prostitution all over the place.  Trash blowing around empty streets.  Anyone who moved here recently has no concept.  

 

 

 

22 minutes ago, jmecklenborg said:

 

Every U.S. city, Cincinnati included, was many, many times more violent from the late 1960s through just recently.  Stuff was abandoned on a huge scale.  Drug dealing and prostitution all over the place.  Trash blowing around empty streets.  Anyone who moved here recently has no concept.  

 

 

 

 

From a philosophical standpoint I want to know where this rage stems from? 

 

For instance in Europe you will have poor people living in squaler and homes made from tents but they are not violent. Becoming violent is considered an act of making yourself a fool and someone who can control there temper... essentially a grown up child.

 

In america, income inequality, breeds violence...and the violence is promoted in Americas backbone and culture. But why? 

 

My thesis question: Why are we so angry? Why do we allow our character to be consumed and transformed by violence? 

 

It's very unique to America from what I've noticed.

^^^Having lived in Europe (well, London) for several years, I cannot begin to express how untrue this is

1 minute ago, Pdrome513 said:

^^^Having lived in Europe (well, London) for several years, I cannot begin to express how untrue this is

 

London is a huge outlier because of the massive influx of immigrants....

 

Many central and eastern European countries are more applicable because of the homogeneity.

 

Our school system taught us that violence is wrong and tarnishes your character and your culture.Basically not only does it embarress you because it makes you a man child who doesn't have control, but also tarnishes your country and your family name. 

 

Maybe that's where it ties from? Heritage, family, values, pride of self and pride of your motherland?

All I’m saying is if you want to know the root causes for violence in impoverished American communities, a better place to start than comparisons with European rearing modalities (which are specious, to put it lightly) might be American history itself.

Edited July 22, 20195 yr by Pdrome513

15 minutes ago, troeros said:

 

London is a huge outlier because of the massive influx of immigrants....

 

This isn't really true. The East End is notorious for being home to some of the most impoverished and violent native-born British populations. I don't know for sure, but I'd guess that the violent crime rate in London neighborhoods is not correlated to the number of immigrants. 

There was a point in the U.S.... maybe the 1880s... where a lot of values got "locked in" and we weren't able to move past them like the rest of the world did. Values left over from the Puritanical Midwestern farming days and the Wild West.

Just now, DEPACincy said:

 

This isn't really true. The East End is notorious for being home to some of the most impoverished and violent native-born British populations. I don't know for sure, but I'd guess that the violent crime rate in London neighborhoods is not correlated to the number of immigrants. 

 

See: Paul Di'Anno-era Iron Maiden and its glorification of East End street urchins in song.

2 hours ago, Pdrome513 said:

All I’m saying is if you want to know the root causes for violence in impoverished American communities, a better place to start than comparisons with European rearing modalities (which are specious, to put it lightly) might be American history itself.

 

And lead poisoning. 

 

I'm guessing that the music venue is moving forward?

8 hours ago, troeros said:

 

I'm guessing that the music venue is moving forward?

If I am not mistaken they approved construction of the parking garage underneath the music venue. I do not believe the music venue was part of the approval. 

The county still has to get Hilltop to move, that relocation has not been formally agreed upon...

Does MEMI still have to do fundraising for the construction costs of the music venue? Will the donors that helped with the Music Hall renovation help with this?

Edited July 25, 20195 yr by thebillshark

So this NEEDS to happen. It is a no brainer. Which of course means that it will never happen.

 

https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2019/07/24/if-not-a-music-venue-what-else-could-go-at-the.html

 

Back in the 80s Indy started building itself up as a amateur sports destination. It has led to huge convention business around that business. Tons of people go downtown because they have developed as a hub for NCAA and amateur sports. Hell, the NFL combine goes there every year for really no pertinent reason beyond longstanding history.

This could be Cincinnati's chance to get in on ground zero of this burgeoning industry and create something that would make the area a destination for people in the region and entire country.

1 minute ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

So this NEEDS to happen. It is a no brainer. Which of course means that it will never happen.

 

https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2019/07/24/if-not-a-music-venue-what-else-could-go-at-the.html

 

Back in the 80s Indy started building itself up as a amateur sports destination. It has led to huge convention business around that business. Tons of people go downtown because they have developed as a hub for NCAA and amateur sports. Hell, the NFL combine goes there every year for really no pertinent reason beyond longstanding history.

This could be Cincinnati's chance to get in on ground zero of this burgeoning industry and create something that would make the area a destination for people in the region and entire country.

 

I feel like if this were to happen, this would be better suited to by next to Hard Rock Casino, by the large empty lots next to the casino. 

 

I feel like it would probably be in Hard Rocks best interest to sponsor the venue, especially with sports/e-sports gambling slowly becoming legalized. 

 

I could see maybe a small E-Sports area with a Hard Rock Hotel built on top, connected with a enclosed bridge over the 2 venues of the casino, and the arena/hotel.  

Honestly, it does not matter the location, so long as it is downtown, but this needs to happen.

 

The benefit of the Banks is that for larger tourneys you could use PBS or GABP club levels as overflow and it is right there. You could do other things in that general area to create a hub instead of a one off space.

 

But this needs to happen somewhere given the growth in the industry.

Like the idea, but isn’t there a risk that the format or requirements of such an arena could change overnight? (I think I remember at UC that they put Ethernet ports along each table in the physics classrooms only to be rendered obsolete by WiFi not long afterwards. Guess the power outlets are still useful though) 

Also, I think the biggest concentration of these are going to be in places like Las Vegas that have a huge built-in tourism industry. This is a pretty complicated thing that sounds like a great idea, but is probably way more involved than most people realize. The constant upgrading of equipment probably requires a huge annual cost. Possibly even something that a tourism bureau would have to be involved in subsidizing. 

49 minutes ago, thebillshark said:

Like the idea, but isn’t there a risk that the format or requirements of such an arena could change overnight? (I think I remember at UC that they put Ethernet ports along each table in the physics classrooms only to be rendered obsolete by WiFi not long afterwards. Guess the power outlets are still useful though) 

 

Yeah.  Every college in the country spent huge money installing internet connections in every dorm room in 1998.  By 2002 they were obsolete.  

 

5 hours ago, ryanlammi said:

Also, I think the biggest concentration of these are going to be in places like Las Vegas that have a huge built-in tourism industry. This is a pretty complicated thing that sounds like a great idea, but is probably way more involved than most people realize. The constant upgrading of equipment probably requires a huge annual cost. Possibly even something that a tourism bureau would have to be involved in subsidizing. 

 

One year the e sports arena needs an 8k 200 ft video monitor and the next year everyone shows up with augmented reality goggles and doesn’t need it anymore. Hamilton County taxpayers beware! ?

Edited July 27, 20195 yr by thebillshark

Banks Steering Committee schedules meeting amid uncertainty

 

 

The Joint Banks Steering Committee, a panel of high-profile executives that has provided recommendations to the city of Cincinnati and Hamilton County about how to develop Cincinnati’s riverfront, has scheduled a meeting for Tuesday morning.

 

The notice only says that the meeting’s purpose is an update on progress at the Banks. Board members and their representatives did not immediately return calls seeking comment.

 

The project has been in flux lately, with progress on a music venue to be developed by Music and Event Management Inc. stalled as negotiations continue between the city, the county and riverfront landowners over where to move Hilltop Companies. The concrete company, which is located south of Paul Brown Stadium, needs to be moved so that the county can construct a new parking lot in its place so the Cincinnati Bengals can continue to have tailgating after the lot where it currently takes place becomes the music venue.

 

More below:

https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2019/07/29/banks-steering-committee-schedules-meeting-amid.html

3 hours ago, ColDayMan said:

Banks Steering Committee schedules meeting amid uncertainty

 

 

The Joint Banks Steering Committee, a panel of high-profile executives that has provided recommendations to the city of Cincinnati and Hamilton County about how to develop Cincinnati’s riverfront, has scheduled a meeting for Tuesday morning.

 

The notice only says that the meeting’s purpose is an update on progress at the Banks. Board members and their representatives did not immediately return calls seeking comment.

 

The project has been in flux lately, with progress on a music venue to be developed by Music and Event Management Inc. stalled as negotiations continue between the city, the county and riverfront landowners over where to move Hilltop Companies. The concrete company, which is located south of Paul Brown Stadium, needs to be moved so that the county can construct a new parking lot in its place so the Cincinnati Bengals can continue to have tailgating after the lot where it currently takes place becomes the music venue.

 

More below:

https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2019/07/29/banks-steering-committee-schedules-meeting-amid.html

Hopefully with the new addition of a permanent sky star and the amount of people it will bring to the banks, they are more encouraged to move forward with the new set of apartments on that empty lot across from GE.

2 hours ago, Ucgrad2015 said:

Hopefully with the new addition of a permanent sky star and the amount of people it will bring to the banks, they are more encouraged to move forward with the new set of apartments on that empty lot across from GE.

 

It might be just me but I feel like the popularity of the banks has grown in the past year 

5 minutes ago, troeros said:

 

It might be just me but I feel like the popularity of the banks has grown in the past year 

I’d say so. I feel like just a few years ago people were wondering if the Banks were even going to make it, and am pretty sure there were a few news stories about it. 

8 hours ago, Ucgrad2015 said:

I’d say so. I feel like just a few years ago people were wondering if the Banks were even going to make it, and am pretty sure there were a few news stories about it. 

 

It may have even been this year that there were articles about it.  The businesses were 'desperate' for the music venue to bring year-round business.  Which I think makes sense, the Reds are far better for The Banks than the Bengals, who only bring people down there 8 times a year.  Given we are in the middle of a decent Reds season, it may just be recency bias that we think it is more popular (year-round).

Honestly the banks may be better than otr (in the summer) in terms of entertainment, because all the bars/restaurants feel very open and airy, which is perfect for summer weather. Just my opinion though.