I don't think it was structural at all.  It was all about limiting the height of the building in order to a)not block the views of existing or future 3rd St. towers and b)not compete for big-time tenants with existing or future 3rd St. towers.  In fact height limits themselves have nothing whatsoever to do with aesthetics and instead are instituted by governments at the directive of any city's major players in order to dictate where corporate headquarters can be built. 

Interesting. If that's the case I wonder how hard (if even possible) it would be to persuade those in power to allow the height limit to be pushed upwards for the potential office buildings. As much as I'd love to see third street's parking lots/garages developed as towers, I think some height diversity within the Banks would be equally beneficial to the final product of the entire development in terms of its integration into the fabric of Downtown.

I don't think it was structural at all.  It was all about limiting the height of the building in order to a)not block the views of existing or future 3rd St. towers and b)not compete for big-time tenants with existing or future 3rd St. towers.  In fact height limits themselves have nothing whatsoever to do with aesthetics and instead are instituted by governments at the directive of any city's major players in order to dictate where corporate headquarters can be built. 

 

This is exactly what happened.  Third St. started complaining and Castellini came out, with much sarcasm for the whiners, and said that he would lower the buildings by six stories.

Not to kick someone while their down, but I wonder if there are any Detroit companies looking to get out.  I'm sure I'm stating the obvious but I think Cincy/Downtown needs to lure some companies in from outside the region rather than just getting some that are relocating from within.

If Vantiv is considering moving to a bigger space, the city should be working on a deal to bring them downtown ASAP.  If they need more space than the Banks can offer there are plenty of other options in the CBD. 

Vantiv left Madisonville for Mason when they were spun off. I've heard they want a suburban office space with large open floor plates.

^This isn't surprising. Companies that require larger, open floor plates just aren't going to be interested in the Downtown market. It's unfortunate as that much square footage could bring a really nice building to Downtown, but it's unlikely that we'll be seeing a lot of suburban companies clamoring to get into the Downtown market, at least for a while. Further down the road when momentum downtown has really changed the name of the game and more and more young people are pushing for urban living, this could change. But for now I'd imagine drawing new companies from competing downtown markets would work better in getting these office towers built. Or companies already downtown looking to expand.

Vantiv left Madisonville for Mason when they were spun off. I've heard they want a suburban office space with large open floor plates.

 

Vantiv is located in the Governor's Hill office park, which is a revolving door of tenants.  They took P&G's ops building when they consolidated that department downtown a few years ago.  My guess is that they move into one of the 8 or so other buildings in the office park before they move somewhere else. 

I've been hearing more talk about the lawschool at the Banks again from some people I would consider relatively in the know on these things.  Would be very interesting if the Law School signed a 5 year lease with the Banks while they fundraised, demolished their old buidling and built a new one.  Would give the Banks the financing they need to get the building off the ground (having a large tenant signed in a for a multi year lease). 

I've been hearing more talk about the lawschool at the Banks again from some people I would consider relatively in the know on these things.  Would be very interesting if the Law School signed a 5 year lease with the Banks while they fundraised, demolished their old buidling and built a new one.  Would give the Banks the financing they need to get the building off the ground (having a large tenant signed in a for a multi year lease). 

 

Lou Bil was very much against taking the law school of campus last time I talked to him (albeit that was several years ago. My suggestion was old SCPA which would have been perfect)

^This isn't surprising. Companies that require larger, open floor plates just aren't going to be interested in the Downtown market. It's unfortunate as that much square footage could bring a really nice building to Downtown, but it's unlikely that we'll be seeing a lot of suburban companies clamoring to get into the Downtown market, at least for a while. Further down the road when momentum downtown has really changed the name of the game and more and more young people are pushing for urban living, this could change. But for now I'd imagine drawing new companies from competing downtown markets would work better in getting these office towers built. Or companies already downtown looking to expand.

 

I'm not sure that filling the urban core of Cincinnati will change the mindset of corporate decision makers very much.  The expressways of London and Paris, among other global cities, are lined with suburban office space that could be mistaken for Sharonville.  I've seen ten Banks/U-Square looking projects in European capitals for every one that I've seen in Ohio.  The responsibility of a company is to the shareholder or the ownership group, not the urban enthusiast, and that theology is in full gear nowadays.

 

I think DT Cincinnati will experience a boom in the next 20 years, and companies will still be trying their hardest to get tax breaks and free parking from the City of Mason.  Regional rail could even hurt the DT office market because those corporations that already want a lease in an office park can sell their suburban locales to the public as physically connected to downtown, minus the traffic.

I've been hearing more talk about the lawschool at the Banks again from some people I would consider relatively in the know on these things.  Would be very interesting if the Law School signed a 5 year lease with the Banks while they fundraised, demolished their old buidling and built a new one.  Would give the Banks the financing they need to get the building off the ground (having a large tenant signed in a for a multi year lease). 

 

Difficult for a developer to put up a building like this with only a 5 year lease, usually they need 10 year commitment. If UC paid for the TI's

then a 5 year deal might happen. Other buildings would make more sense and be more cost effective.

PICTURES!!! 

 

New Roundabout:

 

 

 

New stoplights and continental crosswalk on Mehring Way:

 

 

New Ohio River Trail and connector from Sawyer Point to Smale Riverfront Park:

 

 

 

 

New Pete Rose Bridge and Plaza:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Many thanks for the visual updates, ProkNo5--stage-after-stage, The Banks just continues in "forward-motion"!  :clap: 

The plaza is an improvement, but what the heck are they going to program down there? (if anything)

Thanks for the pics ProkNo5. I am disappointed in the generic concrete pavement. They use so many nice materials in the park, but skimp on the paving. I especially think the Ohio River Trail should be a bit more visually interesting and not just look like a boring sidewalk.

^Agreed.  Can we not get any street trees along Merhing Way? It feels so open and exposed currently.

^There are spots for them in the sidewalk where they have the temporary paving until they install them. I just don't know what is taking so long. The entire stretch should have street trees on both sides. It does indeed feel way too open and exposed at the moment.

Does anyone know if this is the first instance of those sharktooth yield symbols painted in Cincinnati streets? (I don't know the proper name for them.) In Europe they're used without accompanying yield signs -- the signs aren't necessary as people are used to them. Makes for a much nicer environment without sign clutter.

The dorky streetlight in the middle of that traffic circle is the absolute last thing I expected to be there.  Less likely than:

^There are spots for them in the sidewalk where they have the temporary paving until they install them. I just don't know what is taking so long. The entire stretch should have street trees on both sides. It does indeed feel way too open and exposed at the moment.

 

Pretty sure they won't put them in until spring. Planting new trees in summer is usually not the best idea.

 

Definitely hate all the concrete.

 

Here are the details of the Banks Phase II

Erin Caproni Digital Producer- Cincinnati Business Courier

 

Phase IIA of the Banks project in downtown Cincinnati will include a nine-story apartment building with about 305 apartments and 21,000 square feet of retail space on the block between Rosa Parks Drive, Race Street, Freedom Way and Second Street.

 

According to a statement released today, construction on the latest phase is expected to begin in December and be completed in fall 2015. The Courier recently reported Phase II is expected to cost $67 million.

 

http://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2013/08/05/here-are-the-details-of-the-banks.html

I wish they would bring back the original street names to the grid. Having to look up Rosa Parks Drive on a map - just use Vine Street and have the honorary designation "Rosa Parks" underneath as has been done in front of Music Hall. That said, this is a pretty solid block of a building. Looking forward to this!

Is a nine-story apartment structure really going to take 20 months to complete?  Even 18 months is too long.

^Keep in mind they need to finish the top level of the parking garage which will support that building too.  Not sure if they are including that in the timeline.  That may be what they start in December.  I'm sure that will take several months to complete which will add to the ultimate completion date.

Obviously there is a ton of demand for apartments in this area, since they have 300 apartments that won't be ready until 2015 100% leased.  So why not just get to work on the other phases and finish the Banks?  If they are able to sell out so quickly, why not keep going?  I would really like to the see the section South of West Freedom Way completed soon.

^

I am going to take a wild guess and say financing is a major reason why. Also,  the developer may not want to over extend itself, like many did pre- bubble. Developers and banks are much more conservative these days.

Does anyone know if this is the first instance of those sharktooth yield symbols painted in Cincinnati streets? (I don't know the proper name for them.) In Europe they're used without accompanying yield signs -- the signs aren't necessary as people are used to them. Makes for a much nicer environment without sign clutter.

 

They were also used in the old configuration. Can't say I've seen them anywhere else in the city though.

 

I wish they would bring back the original street names to the grid. Having to look up Rosa Parks Drive on a map - just use Vine Street and have the honorary designation "Rosa Parks" underneath as has been done in front of Music Hall.

 

Couldn't agree more! These 1-2 block stretches are ridiculous. And who knows, perhaps One River Plaza would become a reality if it's address wasn't associated to Pete Rose?  :wink:

Does anyone know if this is the first instance of those sharktooth yield symbols painted in Cincinnati streets? (I don't know the proper name for them.) In Europe they're used without accompanying yield signs -- the signs aren't necessary as people are used to them. Makes for a much nicer environment without sign clutter.

 

They were also used in the old configuration. Can't say I've seen them anywhere else in the city though.

 

 

The round-a-bout in Eden Park has them.

I wish they would bring back the original street names to the grid. Having to look up Rosa Parks Drive on a map - just use Vine Street and have the honorary designation "Rosa Parks" underneath as has been done in front of Music Hall. That said, this is a pretty solid block of a building. Looking forward to this!

 

Seriously.  Can we get a petition together or something?  It's really confusing. 

I'd sign that. I still have no clue what street is what down there. The existing system of street names is good and easy to follow and should just continue into the Banks.

Someone really should start a petition. NYC has commemorative street names all over the city, they are just in addition to the numbered streets rather than a replacement. I believe that is how most cities do it.

 

Also, there should be a 1st Street and possibly a Front Street somewhere down there.

Obviously there is a ton of demand for apartments in this area, since they have 300 apartments that won't be ready until 2015 100% leased.  So why not just get to work on the other phases and finish the Banks?  If they are able to sell out so quickly, why not keep going?  I would really like to the see the section South of West Freedom Way completed soon.

 

The article was referring to the existing 300 apartments built in Phase 1 being 100% leased, not the 300 additional apartments coming with Phase 2.  Leasing won't even begin on Phase 2 until the final stages of construction.

Rename Freedom Way...Pearl Street. 

Rename Freedom Way...Pearl Street. 

 

Freedom Way is the only street name down there that I kind of like, but it needs a historical maker or something to explain its significance. Most people seem to think its just an Amurican sounding "yeehaw Freedom" street name. Few people realize the connection between Freedow Way and Liberty Street.  Liberty St is named that because it was the northern border of the city during the Civil War. At the time there was legalized bounty hunting on slaves in the city of Cincinnati. So slaves gained their "Freedom" when they crossed the Roebling Bridge, but didn't gain their "Liberty" until they crossed Liberty Street into the North Liberties (the are now referred to as e Brewery District).

 

Still, I think it would make more sense to call it First St, and change Mehring Way to Front Street.

Did know that much history about it.  I figured it was relevant to NURFC but also felt that it's a little trite and Amurrican as you say. 

 

Wasn't PRW Second Street?

 

Remember the odd old streets on the riverfront:  Bengal Drive, Produce Drive?

 

I'd go for First Street too. Mehring Way is named after a police officer, correct?  I'd be for going back to Front and making Mehring honorary.

 

Renaming streets seems anti-preservation to me in just about any form. 

 

 

Yes, Pete Rose Way was Second St.  It was renamed in or about 1986.  There was never a First St. 

 

I have never liked "Freedom Way".

I'll sign the petition.  It's annoying as hell.  Freedom Way (the only one I can remember), Joe Nuxhall Way, Pete Rose Way, Rosa Parks, etc..Stick with the original names, there are other ways to memorialize them. 

I'd vote against naming anything First Street.  I've always though the river was "First Street." 

Banks Phase IIA expected to be finished by All Star Game

Chris Wetterich Staff reporter- Cincinnati Business Courier

 

 

The city of Cincinnati will kick in nearly $3 million for the next phase of The Banks, a project that will have a different look than the first phase and be finished by the All Star Game in 2015.

 

“It’s designed have a more modern architectural look to it and to be denser,” Assistant City Manger David Holmes told the Cincinnati City Council’s Budget and Finance Committee on Monday.

 

http://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2013/08/05/banks-phase-2a-expected-to-be-finished.html

Is Banks Phase IIA saving room for a grocery?

Phase IIA of the Banks will have up to 40,000 square feet of additional space that could become retail.

Tom Demeropolis Reporter- Cincinnati Business Courier

 

 

Even though the developers of the Banks said Phase IIA will have 21,000 square feet of retail space, this part of the development will actually have up to 40,000 square feet of additional space that could become retail.

 

Laura Swadel, vice president with Carter, part of the master development team for the Banks, said they have the ability to put a total of 60,000 square feet of retail space in Phase IIA.

 

http://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/blog/2013/08/is-banks-phase-iia-saving-room-for-a.html

Phase IIA actually looks decent, way better than the present buildings (Lager House excluded).

 

The thing that still baffles me is that they are building, again, a parking garage on top of a massive parking garage.  Once the streetcar goes in the City needs to stop lending a dime to any projects that waste above ground space on parking.  Lets hope they can convert that above ground parking space in Phase IIA asap.

Yeah that seemed a little weird to me. But I'd imagine eventually that will all be converted. With the amount of demand there is down there I can't see that staying parking one the entire development is built out.

 

The windows appear to be kind of interesting on the new building. Possibly even a little bit reminiscent of warehouse windows. It's hard to tell though from the limited, non close up renderings. Hopefully the quality is better for Phase II.

What is the plan for the block south of phase 2? It will look pretty weird to have a 14 story building on one side of the street, and a cliff leading to a sunken surface lot on the other. 

The plan is do something in a couple years when the county can afford to build more parking. The development agreement requires the city to pay for 75% of the above ground parking. Stadium lease allows teams to kick people out of garage at 6pm except for even tickets ($15). No residents can park under ground.

I learn more every year about how lousy the stadium deal was for the city :(

 

Mike Brown should be tarred and feathered out of town.

I learn more every year about how lousy the stadium deal was for the city :(

 

Mike Brown should be tarred and feathered out of town.

 

Well, it was all of Hamilton County really, but I completely agree with the tar and feathering sentiment.

I learn more every year about how lousy the stadium deal was for the city :(

 

Mike Brown should be tarred and feathered out of town.

 

Well, it was all of Hamilton County really, but I completely agree with the tar and feathering sentiment.

 

County Commishs did a bad job negotiating the deal, especially on annual maintenance costs - responsibilities, making the Bengals the

"sole" tenant, and of course it should have been a retractable roof stadium. The Colts are not the sole tenant at Lucas Oil. Indy has NCAA

Championship games, Super Bowl, Big Ten Championship football. etc.

I learn more every year about how lousy the stadium deal was for the city :(

 

Mike Brown should be tarred and feathered out of town.

 

No, the person negotiating for the county (wasn't it Bedinghaus who is now employed with the Bengals?) should be tarred and feathered.  As much as I hate Mike Brown for being a terrible owner, he did what he was supposed to do and got the best deal for him and the team.

^I've noticed that Cincinnatians don't use the word much because there are a lot of people that think the grass is always browner on the other side, but the region has a lot of corruption.  Dave Pepper, Bob Bedinghaus, Mike Allen, Joe Deters, Uncle Drunkie Luken and his soaking wet father, Chris Smitherman, Alicia Reese, Leslie Ghiz, Carl Lindner when he was alive...

 

Where would Cincinnati be without the aforementioned undercutting progressive projects for a cheap backroom payoff?